Was my behavior disrespectful?
August 19, 2012 10:52 AM Subscribe
I would like some outside opinions on an incident that occurred yesterday that is still bothering me.
I live in an apartment. My mom is visiting me from across the country. This is her first time in my apartment, and I really want her visit to go well. She is staying with me for 2 weeks. It's a small studio and so that's a lot of closeness with one person. We have a good relationship. I love her but sometimes I feel like I have to work hard to stay in her good graces because she is incredibly sensitive and can take many things personally or make things a big deal when they're not (at least in my opinion). Despite all my efforts to not offend her, I managed to do so yesterday.
We had spent the entire afternoon together shopping and having a good time. On the way home, we made plans to order pizza and watch a movie during dinner. Once we arrived home, we were having a moment of downtime in between relaxing after shopping and figuring out the pizza and the movie. We had been engaging in some idle chit-chat when my phone rang. It was a family member. At first I decided I'd call him back but my mom said, no that's fine, talk to him, I'm going to take a nap. So I thought cool, I'll just step outside, take a little walk, get some fresh air and talk on the phone while my mom naps. Then when I come back we can figure out the pizza/movie. Fun night!
I had a shorter than usual phone convo with my relative on the phone (normally I talk for hours with this particular person but we just had a short catch-up convo, about 25 minutes or so. We hadn't talked for a week so we wanted to catch up. Then I walked back home, thinking of ways I could help my mom out with some things she is working on.
When I came back to my apartment, my mom was just lying on the couch. At first I thought she was napping, but then she got up and started sitting up on my bed, reading without speaking to me. She looked incredibly depressed and was giving me the silent treatment. I asked what was wrong, since I had no idea what I could have possibly done. She said she didn't want to do pizza/a movie because she wasn't feeling well. Basically after a long display of her sulking and crying and giving me the silent treatment, she said she was upset because I took too long on the phone talking to my relative.
I was shocked. I'd only been gone for 30 minutes. She kept saying it was disrespectful, since she'd come all the way out there to visit me, and that I should have just talked for 5 minutes. I told her that she'd been napping, but she said she had no idea I was going to talk 30 minutes. She said she would have never done that to me. I told her that we'd spent the entire morning together and also were planning to spend the evening together, plus she's going to be here 2 weeks! I can't have 30 minutes to myself to talk to friends or family? But she still said it was disrespectful. Plus she was also mad/disappointed with me because of the very fact that I didn't realize it was disrespectful.
What do you guys think? I need another opinion on this. Personally, if I was visiting someone's house for 2 weeks, I totally would NOT have a problem if my host went out to talk to someone on the phone for 30 minutes while we were having some down time in between activities. I don't expect someone to spend EVERY minute with me. I understand that the person has a life and needs some time to themselves or with others.
My mom is over the incident right now and is perfectly happy again. But basically for the rest of the time she's here (about a week), I can't talk to any of my friends or family on the phone for more than 5 minutes, or have any time to myself, except when she's in the shower or at night. Don't get me wrong, I love my mom and I'm glad she's visiting. It's just hard to anticipate and meet all of her expectations.
I would love to get some more opinions on this. Do you guys think I was being disrespectful? Would you get offended if you were visiting someone's home and they took a 30-minute phone call between activities?
I live in an apartment. My mom is visiting me from across the country. This is her first time in my apartment, and I really want her visit to go well. She is staying with me for 2 weeks. It's a small studio and so that's a lot of closeness with one person. We have a good relationship. I love her but sometimes I feel like I have to work hard to stay in her good graces because she is incredibly sensitive and can take many things personally or make things a big deal when they're not (at least in my opinion). Despite all my efforts to not offend her, I managed to do so yesterday.
We had spent the entire afternoon together shopping and having a good time. On the way home, we made plans to order pizza and watch a movie during dinner. Once we arrived home, we were having a moment of downtime in between relaxing after shopping and figuring out the pizza and the movie. We had been engaging in some idle chit-chat when my phone rang. It was a family member. At first I decided I'd call him back but my mom said, no that's fine, talk to him, I'm going to take a nap. So I thought cool, I'll just step outside, take a little walk, get some fresh air and talk on the phone while my mom naps. Then when I come back we can figure out the pizza/movie. Fun night!
I had a shorter than usual phone convo with my relative on the phone (normally I talk for hours with this particular person but we just had a short catch-up convo, about 25 minutes or so. We hadn't talked for a week so we wanted to catch up. Then I walked back home, thinking of ways I could help my mom out with some things she is working on.
When I came back to my apartment, my mom was just lying on the couch. At first I thought she was napping, but then she got up and started sitting up on my bed, reading without speaking to me. She looked incredibly depressed and was giving me the silent treatment. I asked what was wrong, since I had no idea what I could have possibly done. She said she didn't want to do pizza/a movie because she wasn't feeling well. Basically after a long display of her sulking and crying and giving me the silent treatment, she said she was upset because I took too long on the phone talking to my relative.
I was shocked. I'd only been gone for 30 minutes. She kept saying it was disrespectful, since she'd come all the way out there to visit me, and that I should have just talked for 5 minutes. I told her that she'd been napping, but she said she had no idea I was going to talk 30 minutes. She said she would have never done that to me. I told her that we'd spent the entire morning together and also were planning to spend the evening together, plus she's going to be here 2 weeks! I can't have 30 minutes to myself to talk to friends or family? But she still said it was disrespectful. Plus she was also mad/disappointed with me because of the very fact that I didn't realize it was disrespectful.
What do you guys think? I need another opinion on this. Personally, if I was visiting someone's house for 2 weeks, I totally would NOT have a problem if my host went out to talk to someone on the phone for 30 minutes while we were having some down time in between activities. I don't expect someone to spend EVERY minute with me. I understand that the person has a life and needs some time to themselves or with others.
My mom is over the incident right now and is perfectly happy again. But basically for the rest of the time she's here (about a week), I can't talk to any of my friends or family on the phone for more than 5 minutes, or have any time to myself, except when she's in the shower or at night. Don't get me wrong, I love my mom and I'm glad she's visiting. It's just hard to anticipate and meet all of her expectations.
I would love to get some more opinions on this. Do you guys think I was being disrespectful? Would you get offended if you were visiting someone's home and they took a 30-minute phone call between activities?
>> I love her but sometimes I feel like I have to work hard to stay in her good graces because she is incredibly sensitive and can take many things personally or make things a big deal when they're not (at least in my opinion).
no snark intended, but did you answer your own question?
I don't think the 30 minute call was inappropriate.
But even if it was, it would have just been a single slight, and a magnamous person would overlook it.
And mom might have been tired and in a poor mood.
Next time maybe just give her a polite, small "sorry mom" and move on.
posted by thermonuclear.jive.turkey at 10:58 AM on August 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
no snark intended, but did you answer your own question?
I don't think the 30 minute call was inappropriate.
But even if it was, it would have just been a single slight, and a magnamous person would overlook it.
And mom might have been tired and in a poor mood.
Next time maybe just give her a polite, small "sorry mom" and move on.
posted by thermonuclear.jive.turkey at 10:58 AM on August 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
If the events are as you wrote, your mom is way out of line. If I say I'm going to take a nap, it means at least a half hour - ten to drop into sleepytime, 20 for the nap. She *told* you to take the call, go ahead and talk, etc.
Being overly sensitive for no good reason is a form of abuse.
posted by notsnot at 11:01 AM on August 19, 2012 [8 favorites]
Being overly sensitive for no good reason is a form of abuse.
posted by notsnot at 11:01 AM on August 19, 2012 [8 favorites]
No, of course not. Everybody needs some down time, and you have to live your life, even with visitors. But your mom will never agree. I think all you can do in a similar situation is assert your boundaries in a neutral way, or just listen to her vent with cold silent politeness, and change the subject. Just like with little kids, try to ignore the behavior to extinguish it.
posted by Malla at 11:02 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Malla at 11:02 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
All drama in this situation is copyright your mother. You didn't do anything wrong.
posted by hazyjane at 11:02 AM on August 19, 2012 [32 favorites]
posted by hazyjane at 11:02 AM on August 19, 2012 [32 favorites]
She's being childish. Try to act normal and don't take any bait, or any shit.
posted by TheRedArmy at 11:03 AM on August 19, 2012 [9 favorites]
posted by TheRedArmy at 11:03 AM on August 19, 2012 [9 favorites]
But basically for the rest of the time she's here (about a week), I can't talk to any of my friends or family on the phone for more than 5 minutes, or have any time to myself, except when she's in the shower or at night... It's just hard to anticipate and meet all of her expectations.
But now you know this expectation. Also, you don't have to bow to it but it is polite to let your guest know what the schedule you're working to. You don't have to dump all contact with the outside world but I would consider "Mom, I'm stepping out for 20 minutes to talk to Kate before we order pizza if you don't mind - take a nap or a shower or here are keys, I'll be back soon" is fine.
Would you get offended if you were visiting someone's home and they took a 30-minute phone call between activities?
It doesn't matter what any of us would feel; we're not staying with you. Is this your first real houseguest? Because one thing you will learn is that different houseguests require different levels of attention. Your mother is apparently high maintenance. People who come to my house are made 100% aware that I am totally not up for that and that they are welcome but responsible for their own entertainment, socialising, scheduling, plans, etc. That is not the houseguest you have.
posted by DarlingBri at 11:03 AM on August 19, 2012 [5 favorites]
But now you know this expectation. Also, you don't have to bow to it but it is polite to let your guest know what the schedule you're working to. You don't have to dump all contact with the outside world but I would consider "Mom, I'm stepping out for 20 minutes to talk to Kate before we order pizza if you don't mind - take a nap or a shower or here are keys, I'll be back soon" is fine.
Would you get offended if you were visiting someone's home and they took a 30-minute phone call between activities?
It doesn't matter what any of us would feel; we're not staying with you. Is this your first real houseguest? Because one thing you will learn is that different houseguests require different levels of attention. Your mother is apparently high maintenance. People who come to my house are made 100% aware that I am totally not up for that and that they are welcome but responsible for their own entertainment, socialising, scheduling, plans, etc. That is not the houseguest you have.
posted by DarlingBri at 11:03 AM on August 19, 2012 [5 favorites]
Are your parents divorced and your relative on the phone was your dad? Is it a relative with whom she has a poor relationship? These are actually possibly relevant details to understanding her level of upset, so I'm not sure why you were vague about the "relative" part.
Talk to her about it. That's the only way to understand her actual feelings/thoughts about it.
posted by so_gracefully at 11:05 AM on August 19, 2012 [7 favorites]
Talk to her about it. That's the only way to understand her actual feelings/thoughts about it.
posted by so_gracefully at 11:05 AM on August 19, 2012 [7 favorites]
You weren't rude at all -- particularly because of this point:
"At first I decided I'd call him back but my mom said, no that's fine, talk to him, I'm going to take a nap."
That's grade A passive aggression on your mom's part there. Now, YMMV, but I would approach this situation like this. The next time she pulls a switcharoo on you or makes you feel like you're not living up to her expectations, say calmly and firmly to her, "Mom, when you go out of your way to make me feel like I'm not living up to your expectations, it's unfair and immature and I won't stand for it any more. You may not guilt trip me, and you may not make me feel bad when I do things you don't like. It might be best if you went home since your behavior towards me is not motherly and I don't appreciate it."
I have a much lower tolerance for such things though so this may be a little more aggressive than you'd like.
posted by These Birds of a Feather at 11:05 AM on August 19, 2012 [14 favorites]
"At first I decided I'd call him back but my mom said, no that's fine, talk to him, I'm going to take a nap."
That's grade A passive aggression on your mom's part there. Now, YMMV, but I would approach this situation like this. The next time she pulls a switcharoo on you or makes you feel like you're not living up to her expectations, say calmly and firmly to her, "Mom, when you go out of your way to make me feel like I'm not living up to your expectations, it's unfair and immature and I won't stand for it any more. You may not guilt trip me, and you may not make me feel bad when I do things you don't like. It might be best if you went home since your behavior towards me is not motherly and I don't appreciate it."
I have a much lower tolerance for such things though so this may be a little more aggressive than you'd like.
posted by These Birds of a Feather at 11:05 AM on August 19, 2012 [14 favorites]
I'm going to agree with jsturgill -- usually with disproportionate reactions like this, there's something going on in the person's head that is making them feel more isolated/insecure than usual.
I don't think her response was fair at all. Taking 30 minutes to talk on the phone, especially when it has been granted and the other person is going to take a nap, is perfectly normal and acceptable. Perhaps the thing to do is check out how your mom is feeling generally -- give her a chance to air her feelings about relationships etc. in her life. Usually that's a release that brings people back to a rational place, and she may find the process therapeutic, see she took out her feelings on you, and apologize.
Otherwise, check it up to having an overly sensitive mother and try to forget about it.
posted by aintthattheway at 11:09 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
I don't think her response was fair at all. Taking 30 minutes to talk on the phone, especially when it has been granted and the other person is going to take a nap, is perfectly normal and acceptable. Perhaps the thing to do is check out how your mom is feeling generally -- give her a chance to air her feelings about relationships etc. in her life. Usually that's a release that brings people back to a rational place, and she may find the process therapeutic, see she took out her feelings on you, and apologize.
Otherwise, check it up to having an overly sensitive mother and try to forget about it.
posted by aintthattheway at 11:09 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Is the goal to find out who was right or to form a workable relationship with your mother?
If it's the latter, you may want to consider jsturgill advises and aks yourself why a slight you feel was minor was not so minor for your mother. Was it representative of some more habitual interactions between you two? Is there some reason why you can't say to your mother, "Mom, I'm going to talk to a friend of mine for about half an hour now. Let's hook up again then."? Is there some reason why you would take a single instance of your mother's fragility as some sort of intractable prohibition on what you can or can't do for the next two weeks?
I know it's hard -- relationships with parents are so fraught with history they can be all but impossible to navigate clearly -- but if you want to improve your relationship with your mom, it won't come from getting affirmation on who was "in the right." It can only come from understanding each other's respective contexts, motivations and positions.
posted by Catchfire at 11:10 AM on August 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
If it's the latter, you may want to consider jsturgill advises and aks yourself why a slight you feel was minor was not so minor for your mother. Was it representative of some more habitual interactions between you two? Is there some reason why you can't say to your mother, "Mom, I'm going to talk to a friend of mine for about half an hour now. Let's hook up again then."? Is there some reason why you would take a single instance of your mother's fragility as some sort of intractable prohibition on what you can or can't do for the next two weeks?
I know it's hard -- relationships with parents are so fraught with history they can be all but impossible to navigate clearly -- but if you want to improve your relationship with your mom, it won't come from getting affirmation on who was "in the right." It can only come from understanding each other's respective contexts, motivations and positions.
posted by Catchfire at 11:10 AM on August 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
It sounds like your mom just has weird moods and whimsies sometimes. You can't blame yourself. I don't like the sound of this "I can't talk to friends or family for more than 5 minutes while she's here." That's not healthy or normal. I think you kind of just have to write off your mom's moods and resulting tantrums as "Mom acting weird again" and not beat yourself up over it. You said yourself you can't predict what she's going to want and trying to tiptoe around is just going to make you crazy. And this limiting contact with everyone else is strange and unhealthy; I wouldn't do it.
posted by bleep at 11:10 AM on August 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by bleep at 11:10 AM on August 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
My mom does stuff just like this all the time (she's not speaking to me right now over a similar kind of incident), and it's because she's a brat with an untreated personality disorder.
That doesn't mean your mom has a personality disorder, or that she's a crappy person. But she IS acting like a brat. You didn't act perfectly when you took the long phone call, but you didn't do anything so egregious that it required such a melodramatic response. Deal with your mother's hissy fit, in whichever way you typically deal with bratty behavior.
posted by Coatlicue at 11:12 AM on August 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
That doesn't mean your mom has a personality disorder, or that she's a crappy person. But she IS acting like a brat. You didn't act perfectly when you took the long phone call, but you didn't do anything so egregious that it required such a melodramatic response. Deal with your mother's hissy fit, in whichever way you typically deal with bratty behavior.
posted by Coatlicue at 11:12 AM on August 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
What you did was perfectly reasonable, and your mom reacted immaturely. My only possible explanation is that she's feeling sensitive about the obvious demand on your space and time that her visit entails, and is overly wary of any indication that she's a burden. Maybe she needs extra reassurance that she's totally welcome, and also a reminder that being away from her does not mean you're trying to escape for air (even if it secretly does). Setting boundaries gently makes it harder for her to pull this again.
I know that sounds like kid gloves compared to some of the other suggested responses, but my mom does similar stuff to test us, and direct, firm reactions almost always embarrass her and escalate the situation. If you're worried about that, treat her with sensitivity for the duration, but absolutely have a talk with her about it when she's safely back home.
posted by sundaydriver at 11:13 AM on August 19, 2012
I know that sounds like kid gloves compared to some of the other suggested responses, but my mom does similar stuff to test us, and direct, firm reactions almost always embarrass her and escalate the situation. If you're worried about that, treat her with sensitivity for the duration, but absolutely have a talk with her about it when she's safely back home.
posted by sundaydriver at 11:13 AM on August 19, 2012
I strongly suspect she believes you excused yourself so you could complain about her behind her back. This doesn't excuse her behavior, which is passive aggressive and dramaphilic, but you might consider it from that angle when you judge her reaction.
posted by itstheclamsname at 11:14 AM on August 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by itstheclamsname at 11:14 AM on August 19, 2012 [4 favorites]
After reading your previous questions about your mom, it seems like this super-controlling behavior is a pattern and kind of relates to your other questions about never really knowing how to behave or what is expected of you (which is totally understandable!). I bet talking to a therapist about all this will help you feel like you're finally on solid ground when interacting with other people.
posted by bleep at 11:15 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by bleep at 11:15 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Why not call her on this? Ask why she was upset when she ok'ed it first.
Then ask her if she understands why you feel the mixed message she gave you was confusing.
posted by mazola at 11:17 AM on August 19, 2012 [5 favorites]
Then ask her if she understands why you feel the mixed message she gave you was confusing.
posted by mazola at 11:17 AM on August 19, 2012 [5 favorites]
Relative called; you weren't going to, but Mom insisted you call him back, which you did. Now she's mad because you did precisely what she told you to do? No, you did nothing rude, but her reaction is a little overboard --- although so_gracefully may have nailed it: was this relative your father/her ex-husband or some other person she isn't speaking to? The sulking is childish, but I could sort of understand if that was the case.
As for future calls the rest of this week: you handled this fine, with the intention to call back later. (But try to hold those callbacks to 15 minutes or so.)
As for future visits: this is why I'm a big fan of hotels, whether I'm the visitor or the visitee! We all need a bit of a breather from each other, especially when, as in your case, the host is living in cramped quarters. Hotels cost money, but save sanity.
posted by easily confused at 11:19 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
As for future calls the rest of this week: you handled this fine, with the intention to call back later. (But try to hold those callbacks to 15 minutes or so.)
As for future visits: this is why I'm a big fan of hotels, whether I'm the visitor or the visitee! We all need a bit of a breather from each other, especially when, as in your case, the host is living in cramped quarters. Hotels cost money, but save sanity.
posted by easily confused at 11:19 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Would you get offended if you were visiting someone's home and they took a 30-minute phone call between activities?
Offended, no, a little annoyed yes (a large part of that is that I don't feel comfortable just 'making myself at home' in other people's houses) BUT, you offered not to take the call and she said she was having a nap. If someone says they're having a nap, I wouldn't disturb them for at least 30 minutes. You knew it was a little rude to take the call when you had a guest but she said it was ok so therefore not at all rude or disrespectful.
Don't try so hard to please your mum. Be a gracious host but don't buy into the guilt trips and double talk. Take her at her word, every time she says something. If she says she feels unwell, leave her to it, don't press for the real reason. If she says its ok to do something, then do it, if she sulks afterwards, don't apologise, its her problem not yours.
She may not be able to control how she feels when you don't meet her expectations but she is 100% in control of how she expresses those expectations. If she doesn't want you to take a call, then she should says so.
posted by missmagenta at 11:29 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Offended, no, a little annoyed yes (a large part of that is that I don't feel comfortable just 'making myself at home' in other people's houses) BUT, you offered not to take the call and she said she was having a nap. If someone says they're having a nap, I wouldn't disturb them for at least 30 minutes. You knew it was a little rude to take the call when you had a guest but she said it was ok so therefore not at all rude or disrespectful.
Don't try so hard to please your mum. Be a gracious host but don't buy into the guilt trips and double talk. Take her at her word, every time she says something. If she says she feels unwell, leave her to it, don't press for the real reason. If she says its ok to do something, then do it, if she sulks afterwards, don't apologise, its her problem not yours.
She may not be able to control how she feels when you don't meet her expectations but she is 100% in control of how she expresses those expectations. If she doesn't want you to take a call, then she should says so.
posted by missmagenta at 11:29 AM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
When my father does this, it's because he's said something is OK when it's really not. Which is of course totally passive-aggressive. He also has a thing about talking to anyone else while he's around whether it is politely or not politely (i.e. blatantly ignoring him or taking long phone calls in front of him). It doesn't sound like what you did was impolite, but like a couple of people suggested above, if it was someone in the family that she has a problem with, it may have made her paranoid that you were talking to them. But she felt like she couldn't tell you not to. In any case it does sound like she felt left out, unwanted, something like that. She may need more reassurance than you can or want to provide, but that's my take on it.
posted by BibiRose at 11:31 AM on August 19, 2012
posted by BibiRose at 11:31 AM on August 19, 2012
I don't think you were being disrespectful given that she told you to go ahead, but that's not going to help you deal with your mom who expects you to guess that you should only talk a short time.
But also, yeah, when you're hosting house guests you really just don't get that much time to yourself. You might be able to arrange things for her to do by herself (museum/shopping/etc.) for about two afternoons per week, but most of the time you won't be alone. This is why people don't like house guests. Revise your expectation of alone time downward, schedule her days out without you wisely, and next time tell her that two weeks is way too long.
posted by anaelith at 11:50 AM on August 19, 2012
But also, yeah, when you're hosting house guests you really just don't get that much time to yourself. You might be able to arrange things for her to do by herself (museum/shopping/etc.) for about two afternoons per week, but most of the time you won't be alone. This is why people don't like house guests. Revise your expectation of alone time downward, schedule her days out without you wisely, and next time tell her that two weeks is way too long.
posted by anaelith at 11:50 AM on August 19, 2012
Best answer: Either she has a problem with the specific relative and was taking it out on you and being shitty or there's something else going on that's bothering her and she was taking it out on you and being shitty.
But it may be worth considering that your mother appears to have a bit of a history of doing things which are patently unreasonable and which are somehow both confrontation-avoidant and completely confrontational at the same time. Overall the picture one gets of your mother is of someone who is neurotic in the sitcom sense, to a degree that her anxiety is a known quantity to other family members. In this very question, we see an example in which you were expected essentially to read her mind and know that a half-hour would be too long, even though she had said she was going to take a nap - is this the only time she's been upset at you for not doing the actual literal opposite of what she said to do? Think hard. I bet it's not.
Not only this, but she then expressed her displeasure through a series of sulky displays designed to get you to ask her what's wrong several times before she finally capitulated and told you what was up.
The deal is: Every family has at least one person like this in it and, by roll of the dice, your mother is that person. This is one behavior in a series and I honestly don't think it's going to change. How do you think it would go if you tried to talk to her about it? Just sat her down and said, "Mom, you have a history of manipulative behavior, you're anxious about everything and you try to control me through guilt and I bet you don't even know why you're doing it. I think you should probably start considering my side of things and maybe talk to a therapist once in a while - it's not in any way healthy to leverage your entire relationship with your child into an ultimatum at all, let alone how often you do it."
I don't even know your mom and I know how that one would go.
It sucks, but if there's no way to get her to admit that her behaviors are unhealthy, you can basically deal with it or not. All you can do is set boundaries and stick by them. If she can't handle that then it's out of your hands how she takes that. Them's the breaks.
It's a roll of the dice. But if I were in your shoes, I would do this at least: The next time she threatened to end her relationship with me over any disagreement, I would tell her that she needs to either do that or don't, but that it's not something I'm willing to hear as part of a conversation anymore. It is a boundary, I am setting it. The end. I would then change the subject.
Another thing I would think about doing if I were in your shoes: People like this, when they become parents, they tend to pass a lot of this onto their children. I think that your mother runs the risk of having essentially cloned herself in the form of a nagging, doubting voice in your head that makes you second-guess yourself a lot and occasionally have flare-ups of anxiety disproportionate to the situation, and then anxiety about the anxiety.
I think that - if you have time and if your insurance covers it - maybe once every other week or so, it would be a decent idea to have a sit down and a talk with someone who can kind of draw out where these anxieties and fears come from, and help you kind of pull them out and take a good hard look at them and figure out where a good place to put them might be. I think that this would be a very good thing for you to do. I also think that if you do it, your mother might become upset about it because fundamentally she knows she's a little crazy and her paralyzing guilt over that is what's driving a lot of this, and if you're seeing a therapist she's going to assume that you're there to talk about her, so I strongly advise that you not discuss therapy with her, just tell her it's private and leave it at that. But it really would not be a bad idea to at least think about doing it.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 11:56 AM on August 19, 2012 [64 favorites]
But it may be worth considering that your mother appears to have a bit of a history of doing things which are patently unreasonable and which are somehow both confrontation-avoidant and completely confrontational at the same time. Overall the picture one gets of your mother is of someone who is neurotic in the sitcom sense, to a degree that her anxiety is a known quantity to other family members. In this very question, we see an example in which you were expected essentially to read her mind and know that a half-hour would be too long, even though she had said she was going to take a nap - is this the only time she's been upset at you for not doing the actual literal opposite of what she said to do? Think hard. I bet it's not.
Not only this, but she then expressed her displeasure through a series of sulky displays designed to get you to ask her what's wrong several times before she finally capitulated and told you what was up.
The deal is: Every family has at least one person like this in it and, by roll of the dice, your mother is that person. This is one behavior in a series and I honestly don't think it's going to change. How do you think it would go if you tried to talk to her about it? Just sat her down and said, "Mom, you have a history of manipulative behavior, you're anxious about everything and you try to control me through guilt and I bet you don't even know why you're doing it. I think you should probably start considering my side of things and maybe talk to a therapist once in a while - it's not in any way healthy to leverage your entire relationship with your child into an ultimatum at all, let alone how often you do it."
I don't even know your mom and I know how that one would go.
It sucks, but if there's no way to get her to admit that her behaviors are unhealthy, you can basically deal with it or not. All you can do is set boundaries and stick by them. If she can't handle that then it's out of your hands how she takes that. Them's the breaks.
It's a roll of the dice. But if I were in your shoes, I would do this at least: The next time she threatened to end her relationship with me over any disagreement, I would tell her that she needs to either do that or don't, but that it's not something I'm willing to hear as part of a conversation anymore. It is a boundary, I am setting it. The end. I would then change the subject.
Another thing I would think about doing if I were in your shoes: People like this, when they become parents, they tend to pass a lot of this onto their children. I think that your mother runs the risk of having essentially cloned herself in the form of a nagging, doubting voice in your head that makes you second-guess yourself a lot and occasionally have flare-ups of anxiety disproportionate to the situation, and then anxiety about the anxiety.
I think that - if you have time and if your insurance covers it - maybe once every other week or so, it would be a decent idea to have a sit down and a talk with someone who can kind of draw out where these anxieties and fears come from, and help you kind of pull them out and take a good hard look at them and figure out where a good place to put them might be. I think that this would be a very good thing for you to do. I also think that if you do it, your mother might become upset about it because fundamentally she knows she's a little crazy and her paralyzing guilt over that is what's driving a lot of this, and if you're seeing a therapist she's going to assume that you're there to talk about her, so I strongly advise that you not discuss therapy with her, just tell her it's private and leave it at that. But it really would not be a bad idea to at least think about doing it.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 11:56 AM on August 19, 2012 [64 favorites]
I would say something like:
I'm really glad you're here visiting me but we are going to be together in a contained space for two weeks. I want you to be comfortable here so I need you to understand that I am going to take you at your word when you say you're OK with something. If you tell me you're not OK with something I won't be annoyed and I will take it into consideration, but if you tell me everything's fine I am going to assume it is and act accordingly.
posted by Laura_J at 12:09 PM on August 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
I'm really glad you're here visiting me but we are going to be together in a contained space for two weeks. I want you to be comfortable here so I need you to understand that I am going to take you at your word when you say you're OK with something. If you tell me you're not OK with something I won't be annoyed and I will take it into consideration, but if you tell me everything's fine I am going to assume it is and act accordingly.
posted by Laura_J at 12:09 PM on August 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
You mom is being childish, but you're enabling her by having her stay with you in your studio for two weeks. I mean, really, (a) did you really think you could have a no-stress visit with your mom for two weeks straight? and (b) what kind of person would want to stay with her daughter in a 1 room studio for two weeks? Your mom obviously takes opportunities that allow her to not act like an independent adult, and you give her those opportunities.
E.g., why is your mom not staying with your uncle (who it sounds like lives in the same area) for part of the time? Why has your mom not arrangements to keep herself entertained without you? I assume that this is because that's not her "way" or her temperament. But you knew that and gave her the opportunity to spend two weeks dependent on you.
posted by deanc at 12:56 PM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
E.g., why is your mom not staying with your uncle (who it sounds like lives in the same area) for part of the time? Why has your mom not arrangements to keep herself entertained without you? I assume that this is because that's not her "way" or her temperament. But you knew that and gave her the opportunity to spend two weeks dependent on you.
posted by deanc at 12:56 PM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
> But basically for the rest of the time she's here (about a week), I can't talk to any of my friends or family on the phone for more than 5 minutes, or have any time to myself, except when she's in the shower or at night.
Sure you can, just be reasonable about it and let her know what to expect ("If you don't mind I'm going to take this call, Mom, I'll be about 15 minutes. There's the TV, or magazines/books are over here so you're not sitting around bored, ok?)
It's your home, you need to play the role of gracious host, not "obedient child."
posted by desuetude at 12:59 PM on August 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
Sure you can, just be reasonable about it and let her know what to expect ("If you don't mind I'm going to take this call, Mom, I'll be about 15 minutes. There's the TV, or magazines/books are over here so you're not sitting around bored, ok?)
It's your home, you need to play the role of gracious host, not "obedient child."
posted by desuetude at 12:59 PM on August 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
I have a mother that is very similar to this, except my mother also had angry outbursts and what used to be an abusive past.
You can't change this person or how they react in the future. Someone like this is going to get upset when you talk on the phone, but they’ll also get upset when you don’t talk on the phone (believe it or not). My mom used to get angry at us for hanging out with friends a lot when we were in our teens, but she’d also get mad if we spent a lot of time at the house-there was no middle ground because one day something was okay and the next day it wasn’t okay.
You are an adult and you get to decide whether or not you want to talk on the phone and how long your phone calls are. You are ALLOWING your mother to stay at your place which means that she can choose to accept that you are going to take phone calls while she's there or she can make a big deal out of it and leave. She’s an adult too. You are both on the same level playing field as adults.
Also, remove vocabulary like “I can’t” because the reality is that you can. You can take phone calls regardless of who's there. You weren’t being disrespectful considering the amount of time that your mother is staying over for.
Most people wouldn’t be offended about a phone call, let alone allowing the evening to be ruined because you chose to talk to a relative. That’s a bit too much drama in my opinion.
posted by livinglearning at 1:11 PM on August 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
You can't change this person or how they react in the future. Someone like this is going to get upset when you talk on the phone, but they’ll also get upset when you don’t talk on the phone (believe it or not). My mom used to get angry at us for hanging out with friends a lot when we were in our teens, but she’d also get mad if we spent a lot of time at the house-there was no middle ground because one day something was okay and the next day it wasn’t okay.
You are an adult and you get to decide whether or not you want to talk on the phone and how long your phone calls are. You are ALLOWING your mother to stay at your place which means that she can choose to accept that you are going to take phone calls while she's there or she can make a big deal out of it and leave. She’s an adult too. You are both on the same level playing field as adults.
Also, remove vocabulary like “I can’t” because the reality is that you can. You can take phone calls regardless of who's there. You weren’t being disrespectful considering the amount of time that your mother is staying over for.
Most people wouldn’t be offended about a phone call, let alone allowing the evening to be ruined because you chose to talk to a relative. That’s a bit too much drama in my opinion.
posted by livinglearning at 1:11 PM on August 19, 2012 [2 favorites]
This is exactly the sort of thing my mom would do.
When I dropped her off at the airport one time, I stopped on the way out to get my shoes shined. The old guy who was doing my shoes asked what brought me to the airport, I told him, mentioned in the course of the chat that she could be really difficult.
The guy looked up and said, "Aw, she just wants attention."
posted by ambient2 at 1:31 PM on August 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
When I dropped her off at the airport one time, I stopped on the way out to get my shoes shined. The old guy who was doing my shoes asked what brought me to the airport, I told him, mentioned in the course of the chat that she could be really difficult.
The guy looked up and said, "Aw, she just wants attention."
posted by ambient2 at 1:31 PM on August 19, 2012 [3 favorites]
For fuck's sake, she's an adult. And she's your mom. She should not be acting like a teenager and it is not your job to raise her from the ground up.
Next time, try this:
"Is something wrong, Mom? you look displeased."
*huff* *sigh* "NO"
"Great. For a minute there I thought you were throwing a strop because I called Uncle Jim back like you told me to. What kind of pizza do you want?"
*freezy silence*
"I'll just get anchovy and marshmallow then."
If she continues without stating a reasonable solvable problem like an adult you can just say "I am definitely not having any fun with you," and leave the room. Or as it's a studio, put your headphones on and watch *The Cuisinart Murders of Sweet Valley High* all by yourself.
posted by tel3path at 2:22 PM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
Next time, try this:
"Is something wrong, Mom? you look displeased."
*huff* *sigh* "NO"
"Great. For a minute there I thought you were throwing a strop because I called Uncle Jim back like you told me to. What kind of pizza do you want?"
*freezy silence*
"I'll just get anchovy and marshmallow then."
If she continues without stating a reasonable solvable problem like an adult you can just say "I am definitely not having any fun with you," and leave the room. Or as it's a studio, put your headphones on and watch *The Cuisinart Murders of Sweet Valley High* all by yourself.
posted by tel3path at 2:22 PM on August 19, 2012 [1 favorite]
My friend's mom is like this. She's only ever pulled it on me once, but she often does it to her kids while I'm there and DEAR LORD IT IS SO EMBARASSING TO WITNESS!
From my experience of that family, Famous Monster's advice seems pretty much spot-on.
posted by the latin mouse at 3:25 PM on August 19, 2012
From my experience of that family, Famous Monster's advice seems pretty much spot-on.
posted by the latin mouse at 3:25 PM on August 19, 2012
I think I know where you mom might be coming from. I'm not a phone person and it irritates me to no end when I'm in the middle of a nice conversation with my husband and he suddenly breaks it off to take a phone call, especially a long one. To me it's like that caller walked into the room, plopped down next to me and my husband and proceeded to talk to him for 30 minutes while they both completely disregard me and the conversation we were just in the middle of. It's just plain rude! It's taken a while, but my husband agreed that when he's talking to me and the phone rings, he will let the caller know he will call them back, or if it is important, he will keep the call very brief (no more than 2-5 minutes).
Is it possible your mother might have interpreted the situation in the same way? I think her saying she was going to have a nap was a passive aggressive way of saying "Well, if your call is so much more important than me, then I'll just leave you two alone." And what she really did is went and stewed for half an hour. So in the interest of harmony, I do think you should apologize for prioritizing another conversation over hers and in the future, I suggest telling your caller you're busy right at the moment and ask if you can call back at a better time. Then when you have some down time, ask your mom if she would mind if you step out for about half an hour to make a phone call. It's that little bit of acknowledgement that makes all the difference!
posted by platinum at 4:33 PM on August 19, 2012
Is it possible your mother might have interpreted the situation in the same way? I think her saying she was going to have a nap was a passive aggressive way of saying "Well, if your call is so much more important than me, then I'll just leave you two alone." And what she really did is went and stewed for half an hour. So in the interest of harmony, I do think you should apologize for prioritizing another conversation over hers and in the future, I suggest telling your caller you're busy right at the moment and ask if you can call back at a better time. Then when you have some down time, ask your mom if she would mind if you step out for about half an hour to make a phone call. It's that little bit of acknowledgement that makes all the difference!
posted by platinum at 4:33 PM on August 19, 2012
I don't know you or your mom, but she sounds kind of nuts. You did nothing wrong.
posted by wandering_not_lost at 12:42 AM on August 20, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by wandering_not_lost at 12:42 AM on August 20, 2012 [1 favorite]
Dis you want to be right or dis you want to make your mom feel better? I think taking a call for half an hour in these circumstances was reasonable, you think it was reasonable, but for whatever reason your mother was hurt by it. It doesn't matter whether it was reasonable for her to be hurt by this or not. There are a lot of little things that could possibly justify her hurt feelings but when it comes right down to it, she felt bad and you felt like she shouldn't feel bad. And that's not helpful and will just make her feel worse.
You can tell her you didn't realise you were doing anything wrong and so on, but ultimately I don't see the issue with apologizing for hurting her feelings without turning it into something where one of you is right and one is wrong. There's not really anything to win.
posted by Polychrome at 2:05 AM on August 20, 2012 [1 favorite]
You can tell her you didn't realise you were doing anything wrong and so on, but ultimately I don't see the issue with apologizing for hurting her feelings without turning it into something where one of you is right and one is wrong. There's not really anything to win.
posted by Polychrome at 2:05 AM on August 20, 2012 [1 favorite]
Thanks to FAMOUS MONSTER, I can tell you that you should stop most communication with your mom, as she sounds like a terrible, manipulative, irresponsible person that will keep making you crazy for the rest of your life. I mean, mad at you because of a dream she had? Mad at you because she told you to take a call even though you offered to let it go? Throw your stuff away (or otherwise dispose of some of your most prized possesions) and then act as you described?
Run. Run screaming.
posted by dozo at 11:36 AM on August 20, 2012
Run. Run screaming.
posted by dozo at 11:36 AM on August 20, 2012
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by jsturgill at 10:58 AM on August 19, 2012 [4 favorites]