Is it ok to ask out a co-worker who already has a boyfriend?
September 19, 2010 5:05 AM Subscribe
Is it ok to ask out a co-worker who already has a boyfriend?
Its a colleague I work with. We have been working together for around 2 months now and she seems like an interesting person. Up until now we only had very work-related short and curt talk but last night we went out at a group event with some other friends. The evening started normal, but as the people started leaving for home late at night we were both left to ourselves, spent 3 hours talking to each other out in the cold... We had same things to complain about, same things to cheer on! Lets just stay i had a good time.
Now here is the problem, she has a boyfriend, who is going to be away on another continent for one full year. When she told me about the one year thing, "ouch" slipped from my mouth, because i have been in long-distance and i know it often doesnt work out. She kind of agreed on it. Second, since we work together, it would be really bad if our work-relationship became awkward & weird due to an unsuccessful hook-up.
We are going to start dancing classes together, so we will have some time together but on the other hand, I am worried that i might actually fall for her big time!
Any suggestions? I know its quite creepy to wait around for her to break-up her long-distance relationship with her boyfriend or to ask her out when I know for sure that she is not "single"...
Anyone who thinks otherwise?
Its a colleague I work with. We have been working together for around 2 months now and she seems like an interesting person. Up until now we only had very work-related short and curt talk but last night we went out at a group event with some other friends. The evening started normal, but as the people started leaving for home late at night we were both left to ourselves, spent 3 hours talking to each other out in the cold... We had same things to complain about, same things to cheer on! Lets just stay i had a good time.
Now here is the problem, she has a boyfriend, who is going to be away on another continent for one full year. When she told me about the one year thing, "ouch" slipped from my mouth, because i have been in long-distance and i know it often doesnt work out. She kind of agreed on it. Second, since we work together, it would be really bad if our work-relationship became awkward & weird due to an unsuccessful hook-up.
We are going to start dancing classes together, so we will have some time together but on the other hand, I am worried that i might actually fall for her big time!
Any suggestions? I know its quite creepy to wait around for her to break-up her long-distance relationship with her boyfriend or to ask her out when I know for sure that she is not "single"...
Anyone who thinks otherwise?
No. This is bad for two reasons, and either one is enough for no.
Don't be that guy. Be the guy that asks out people who are single, or who have broken up with their long distance boyfriends.
posted by smoke at 5:10 AM on September 19, 2010 [3 favorites]
Don't be that guy. Be the guy that asks out people who are single, or who have broken up with their long distance boyfriends.
posted by smoke at 5:10 AM on September 19, 2010 [3 favorites]
No.
posted by Rendus at 5:11 AM on September 19, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by Rendus at 5:11 AM on September 19, 2010 [2 favorites]
No.
posted by The Michael The at 5:12 AM on September 19, 2010
posted by The Michael The at 5:12 AM on September 19, 2010
Not ok. REALLY not ok. She has a boyfriend regardless of where he lives, or where he's going, so she's off-limits.
It's not creepy at all to be her friend while she's still with the boyfriend. I have no idea why you'd think that. I mean, maybe it's creepy if you're sitting over in the corner, tapping your fingers together like Mr. Burns going, "Hahaha, when you break up, then you're MINNNEEEE!" but taking a class together? Not creepy.
posted by AlisonM at 5:12 AM on September 19, 2010 [7 favorites]
It's not creepy at all to be her friend while she's still with the boyfriend. I have no idea why you'd think that. I mean, maybe it's creepy if you're sitting over in the corner, tapping your fingers together like Mr. Burns going, "Hahaha, when you break up, then you're MINNNEEEE!" but taking a class together? Not creepy.
posted by AlisonM at 5:12 AM on September 19, 2010 [7 favorites]
This is a recipe for a lot of drama that I'm guessing will not go as well as you hope. If she isn't interested, you'll be the creep co-worker that tried to pull a colleague who is in a relationship. If she is interested, you'll be That Jerk that cuckolded a guy (something I'm sure you wouldn't appreciate were it you), and you'll be in a relationship with someone who had an "out of sight, out of mind" approach to her commitment. Either way, I'm not seeing Happily Ever After here. Wait it out and see if the long distance relationship dies a natural death, then decide if it's worth it to hit on a co-worker.
posted by ukdanae at 5:16 AM on September 19, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by ukdanae at 5:16 AM on September 19, 2010 [3 favorites]
She's in a relationship, so no, you can't ask her out. You can be her (sincere) friend. You can ask her out after she's told you she's not only broken up with her boyfriend, but over him as well. You can ask her out if she gives you the signals post-breakup that she's interested in you. You may even want to let her be the one to ask you out. If she's into you, she'll make some moves.
Anecdote: I once worked with a guy who very clearly and obviously had a crush on me. I was in a long term relationship. I liked him as a friend/coworker, but I wasn't interested in dating him. When that relationship was over, I was nervous about how to tell him, because I knew that he would see it as an opening to approach me. In fact, he did ask me to lunch, and I obliged, but was very cold/non-committal the entire time. I felt like a jerk about it, but really I was doing my best to let him know I wasn't interested, while keeping his friendship. We're still friends now, although he's remained very flirty.
posted by litnerd at 5:17 AM on September 19, 2010
Anecdote: I once worked with a guy who very clearly and obviously had a crush on me. I was in a long term relationship. I liked him as a friend/coworker, but I wasn't interested in dating him. When that relationship was over, I was nervous about how to tell him, because I knew that he would see it as an opening to approach me. In fact, he did ask me to lunch, and I obliged, but was very cold/non-committal the entire time. I felt like a jerk about it, but really I was doing my best to let him know I wasn't interested, while keeping his friendship. We're still friends now, although he's remained very flirty.
posted by litnerd at 5:17 AM on September 19, 2010
Double no!
posted by John Cohen at 5:20 AM on September 19, 2010
posted by John Cohen at 5:20 AM on September 19, 2010
Response by poster: Thanks folks! I knew the answer all along, but its nice to get it reinforced nevertheless! I would have hated it if someone went after my girl when I was away, lets see how the dance classes go...just have to keep my head clean thru it :)
posted by gunners at 5:23 AM on September 19, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by gunners at 5:23 AM on September 19, 2010 [3 favorites]
And about those dance classes...if you're not doing those because you have to for work (but then I'm slightly jealous at how cool your job must be), then you probably shouldn't do those, either.
No good can come from that, either.
posted by dzaz at 5:31 AM on September 19, 2010 [9 favorites]
No good can come from that, either.
posted by dzaz at 5:31 AM on September 19, 2010 [9 favorites]
On the one hand, it's really up to her what she does with her life. It's not your problem if she decides to date you and break up with her boyfriend. However, I predict nothing but heartache for you if you chase her. So don't do it. Opposite sex friends can really enrich our lives. Have fun with her but keep your head up for the girl that doesn't come with all these strings attached (boyfriend, workplace).
posted by amanda at 5:42 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by amanda at 5:42 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
I don't know. She isn't married. There was a time when people would date multiple people at once before they decided which one they wanted to be with permanently. I don't think it would be wrong for you to just ask her out. What would be wrong would be if you asked her out, she accepted and then she didn't tell him about it. Of course, whether she told him or not, it would pretty much suck to be the overseas dude, but then asking someone you're not married (or even engaged to) to to stick around and not date anyone else while you're halfway across the world for a year is a pretty big thing to ask.
posted by Jess the Mess at 5:43 AM on September 19, 2010 [9 favorites]
posted by Jess the Mess at 5:43 AM on September 19, 2010 [9 favorites]
And about those dance classes...if you're not doing those because you have to for work (but then I'm slightly jealous at how cool your job must be), then you probably shouldn't do those, either.
No good can come from that, either.
Well some good. Learning to dance is good. And really, if you can't handle dance class without falling for her big time, then work won't go much better.
posted by Lemurrhea at 5:44 AM on September 19, 2010
No good can come from that, either.
Well some good. Learning to dance is good. And really, if you can't handle dance class without falling for her big time, then work won't go much better.
posted by Lemurrhea at 5:44 AM on September 19, 2010
while the consensus is not to ask her out, i don't think it's wrong to leave the door open/ put the ball in her court and make a casual offer to hang out sometime, or go out for a coffee/drink sometime...
posted by mrmarley at 6:15 AM on September 19, 2010
posted by mrmarley at 6:15 AM on September 19, 2010
Dance classes? There's a nice safe activity for after work with the co-worker you're crushing on but who's in a tough long-distance situation for a year or so. What could possibly go wrong?
posted by fourcheesemac at 6:19 AM on September 19, 2010 [13 favorites]
posted by fourcheesemac at 6:19 AM on September 19, 2010 [13 favorites]
Response by poster: Dance classes? There's a nice safe activity for after work with the co-worker you're crushing on but who's in a tough long-distance situation for a year or so. What could possibly go wrong?
Good question, as long as I can keep my head clean thru it, and not fall for her big time, I guess. Been postponing salsa classes for a long time, so a good chance to final do it!
posted by gunners at 6:26 AM on September 19, 2010
Good question, as long as I can keep my head clean thru it, and not fall for her big time, I guess. Been postponing salsa classes for a long time, so a good chance to final do it!
posted by gunners at 6:26 AM on September 19, 2010
"Good question, as long as I can keep my head clean thru it..."
But the problem is that ultimately, you don't want to! Sounds like prolonged and inevitable heart torture for one, maybe more (it's coming, trust me). As much fun as taking dance classes with a person you're crushing on would be*, it just allows you to go that much deeper into the potential drama for the pleasure of "platonically" indulging yourself. It only gets harder each step in.
*C'mon...the outfits, the touching, sweating, music, movement, exercise 'n endorphins, the food afterwards and the walking and the talking...you know this is a Really Temptingly Bad Idea.
posted by iamkimiam at 6:32 AM on September 19, 2010 [6 favorites]
But the problem is that ultimately, you don't want to! Sounds like prolonged and inevitable heart torture for one, maybe more (it's coming, trust me). As much fun as taking dance classes with a person you're crushing on would be*, it just allows you to go that much deeper into the potential drama for the pleasure of "platonically" indulging yourself. It only gets harder each step in.
*C'mon...the outfits, the touching, sweating, music, movement, exercise 'n endorphins, the food afterwards and the walking and the talking...you know this is a Really Temptingly Bad Idea.
posted by iamkimiam at 6:32 AM on September 19, 2010 [6 favorites]
Be careful with dance classes. I took a dance class with my best friend in college so we could fulfill a PE requirement to graduate. He had a girlfriend at school. I had a long distance boyfriend. It became very difficult for us to ignore the romantic tension between us. We tried really hard to laugh it off. A few months later, we couldn't ignore it and we ended up making a mess of each of our relationships. We also got married three years later, but neither of us were respectful of our then-SOs, and I regret being a jerk to a pretty decent guy. So if you go ahead with dance classes, you'll need to be hyper aware that what you're saying and doing isn't crossing lines (assuming you want to be a good person all around and not just get the girl).
posted by Terriniski at 6:39 AM on September 19, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by Terriniski at 6:39 AM on September 19, 2010 [2 favorites]
What iamkimiam said about the dance classes. Clearly you're interested and it's going to be fairly hard not to fall for someone you like. It's not impossible, but you need to step outside your hormones and emotions for a minute and think about whether this would be a good and healthy thing for you to do.
Is it ok to ask out a co-worker who already has a boyfriend?
What are you looking, for a long term relationship or casual sexual partner?
posted by nomadicink at 6:50 AM on September 19, 2010
Is it ok to ask out a co-worker who already has a boyfriend?
What are you looking, for a long term relationship or casual sexual partner?
posted by nomadicink at 6:50 AM on September 19, 2010
Dance classes? There's a nice safe activity for after work with the co-worker you're crushing on but who's in a tough long-distance situation for a year or so. What could possibly go wrong?
Well, my immediate thought was that you could possibly place yourself strictly in the Friend category, which is where you don't necessarily want to be if things don't work out with her boyfriend.
posted by puritycontrol at 7:11 AM on September 19, 2010
Well, my immediate thought was that you could possibly place yourself strictly in the Friend category, which is where you don't necessarily want to be if things don't work out with her boyfriend.
posted by puritycontrol at 7:11 AM on September 19, 2010
At the moment, the person you're interested in is off limits. That might change, or it might not. All other things being equal, I'd say it's acceptable to tell her that you're romantically interested in her, but NOT to ask her out on a date. Make it clear to her that you're not looking for anything other than to be clear with her.
How she handles that information is up to her. She could react positively (dump her current SO and get with you), neutrally (she accepts the information, does nothing with it and it has no effect on anything) or negatively (she cuts off contact with you altogether).
However, things are not equal. You have an onus on you to work with this individual, and you're taking dance classes together. If you ask her out and she reacts neutrally, you'll have to deal with hurt feelings and rejection. If she reacts negatively, then you'll have to deal with having to work with someone who actively dislikes you. This doesn't even take into account the dance classes.
Even if she reacts positively, and dumps her SO (which would be her choice and decision - you telling her that you like her does not compel her to do anything at all), you have to face the fact that you're in a relationship with someone who behaves like that. She made the decision once to dump her SO for someone else - what is to say that she won't do that again, but to you this time? And then how are you going to handle dance classes and working together? If she does dump her SO for you, it shows that the relationship isn't that strong anyway. When someone new and interesting walks through the door, it's "bye bye SO". You might be on the receiving end of that too, some day.
Never go into a relationship without some way of getting away from the other individual if it goes sour. That might mean having different jobs, social circles, hobbies, etc. Don't shit where you eat.
posted by Solomon at 7:19 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
How she handles that information is up to her. She could react positively (dump her current SO and get with you), neutrally (she accepts the information, does nothing with it and it has no effect on anything) or negatively (she cuts off contact with you altogether).
However, things are not equal. You have an onus on you to work with this individual, and you're taking dance classes together. If you ask her out and she reacts neutrally, you'll have to deal with hurt feelings and rejection. If she reacts negatively, then you'll have to deal with having to work with someone who actively dislikes you. This doesn't even take into account the dance classes.
Even if she reacts positively, and dumps her SO (which would be her choice and decision - you telling her that you like her does not compel her to do anything at all), you have to face the fact that you're in a relationship with someone who behaves like that. She made the decision once to dump her SO for someone else - what is to say that she won't do that again, but to you this time? And then how are you going to handle dance classes and working together? If she does dump her SO for you, it shows that the relationship isn't that strong anyway. When someone new and interesting walks through the door, it's "bye bye SO". You might be on the receiving end of that too, some day.
Never go into a relationship without some way of getting away from the other individual if it goes sour. That might mean having different jobs, social circles, hobbies, etc. Don't shit where you eat.
posted by Solomon at 7:19 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
My great-uncle went dancing without his wife when they were both living in a retirement facility. He ended out getting a divorce and marrying his dance partner.
Be careful. It is totally honorable to say "you know, this is a little too much for me, especially knowing about Mr. Away From Home For Awhile. How about we find different partners/you take this class when he gets back?"
And under no circumstances make the first move with her.
posted by SMPA at 7:27 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
Be careful. It is totally honorable to say "you know, this is a little too much for me, especially knowing about Mr. Away From Home For Awhile. How about we find different partners/you take this class when he gets back?"
And under no circumstances make the first move with her.
posted by SMPA at 7:27 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
No dance classes, no asking out. If she wants to go out with you, she will break up with Mr. Overseas and make that fact clear to you, at which point you can dance, date, whatever. Keep it at friendly co-workers in the meantime. Poaching builds bad karma.
posted by jtfowl0 at 7:57 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by jtfowl0 at 7:57 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
If you appreciate her enough to be happy (potentially) just being her friend, by all means do so.
If you cannot see being OK with this..... stop all progress now.
If she starts falling for you, it may be OK, however should you get together, you will always remember that she started seeing you before ending it with him and trust will be hard to come by.
Do NOT innitiate an "upgrade".
Try to stay "Classy" and worthy of her respect and admiration.
I think that the dance class is perhaps a "classic" bad idea....
It would be really easy for you to be used, than abruptly disgarded after guilt sets in .....as they make up and grow closer together.
posted by Studiogeek at 8:07 AM on September 19, 2010
If you cannot see being OK with this..... stop all progress now.
If she starts falling for you, it may be OK, however should you get together, you will always remember that she started seeing you before ending it with him and trust will be hard to come by.
Do NOT innitiate an "upgrade".
Try to stay "Classy" and worthy of her respect and admiration.
I think that the dance class is perhaps a "classic" bad idea....
It would be really easy for you to be used, than abruptly disgarded after guilt sets in .....as they make up and grow closer together.
posted by Studiogeek at 8:07 AM on September 19, 2010
Not ok. REALLY not ok. She has a boyfriend regardless of where he lives, or where he's going, so she's off-limits.
It's not off limits to ask someone out even if they have a boyfriend (but not if they have a husband). It's absolutely okay.
However, it is a bad idea to ask out a coworker. Sometimes. And this is one of those times.
posted by KokuRyu at 8:59 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
It's not off limits to ask someone out even if they have a boyfriend (but not if they have a husband). It's absolutely okay.
However, it is a bad idea to ask out a coworker. Sometimes. And this is one of those times.
posted by KokuRyu at 8:59 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
Certainly you are allowed to ask out whomever you like. But this is a poor way to go about the relationship that you already have with her as a colleague and friendly acquaintance.
posted by desuetude at 9:44 AM on September 19, 2010
posted by desuetude at 9:44 AM on September 19, 2010
I disagree.
A boyfriend is not like a husband or fiancee (or live-in boyfriend), it is perfectly OK to ask her out, but of course you need to play it slow at first. Also, dating co-workers is ok I think, though some companies frown upon it; I mean you spend most of your life at work, it is only normal to meet people there you like.
posted by Vindaloo at 10:19 AM on September 19, 2010
A boyfriend is not like a husband or fiancee (or live-in boyfriend), it is perfectly OK to ask her out, but of course you need to play it slow at first. Also, dating co-workers is ok I think, though some companies frown upon it; I mean you spend most of your life at work, it is only normal to meet people there you like.
posted by Vindaloo at 10:19 AM on September 19, 2010
No.
Dating someone who is dating someone else is basically dating both of them. This is how karma works.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:27 AM on September 19, 2010
Dating someone who is dating someone else is basically dating both of them. This is how karma works.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:27 AM on September 19, 2010
What's with everyone drawing this clear, bright line between married couples and those "just" in an unmarried yet committed relationship? How is it ok to interfere with one but not the other? We know nothing of the state of this woman's relationship except that she has chosen to stay with her partner while he's away for a year. I don't see how OP should feel free to interfere with that simply because she didn't sign on a dotted line and wear a ring.
Respect other people's commitments and hope they do the same for you.
posted by Pomo at 10:53 AM on September 19, 2010 [5 favorites]
Respect other people's commitments and hope they do the same for you.
posted by Pomo at 10:53 AM on September 19, 2010 [5 favorites]
If you're crushing on this girl and worried about falling for her, man, do NOT take salsa classes with her!
This is a dance where you're gonna be holding each other close, moving your hips a lot, listening to passionate Latin music, and getting happy endorphins from fast physical activity and joy when you get a difficult step right.
DANGER ALERT!
posted by cadge at 11:28 AM on September 19, 2010 [2 favorites]
This is a dance where you're gonna be holding each other close, moving your hips a lot, listening to passionate Latin music, and getting happy endorphins from fast physical activity and joy when you get a difficult step right.
DANGER ALERT!
posted by cadge at 11:28 AM on September 19, 2010 [2 favorites]
You already want to date her. It's clear you've already considered stepping over boundaries that should not be crossed by asking out a girl who is in a committed relationship; it'd be smart to keep yourself out of a situation where you'll likely ignore those boundaries. Dance class is a bad idea.
posted by kirstk at 11:59 AM on September 19, 2010
posted by kirstk at 11:59 AM on September 19, 2010
Definitely no. Did she tell you that she has a boyfriend, or did someone else? Just outside of this all being an awful idea, I can say as a woman that if she brought up the I-have-a-boyfriend thing with you directly, it's a clear signal that she doesn't want you to hit on her. I have used it many times myself.
posted by you're a kitty! at 12:07 PM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by you're a kitty! at 12:07 PM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
spent 3 hours talking to each other out in the cold
There are sparks already between you guys. You are playing with fire here. So, if you keep pursuing more closeness (e.g., via salsa class), the pressure on both of you will rise. How will you react? How will she? Options include: (a) taking dramatic action to be together such as her breaking up with her boyfriend, (b) finding a way to turn off the attraction and shift into friends-mode, (c) feeling angry and misled and shifting the attraction into dislike, (d) forcing oneself to get lots of distance from the other person. The more intense the feelings, the more intense the solutions. So, whereas you could start to de-escalate things now, unnoticed -- option (d) but with low intensity -- after two months of dance classes with increasingly unbearable sexual tension, if you decide you have to stop having late night phone chats with her and stop attending dance class, it will be a dramatic cold shoulder that will feel like a break-up to you both even if you never kissed. And whereas you could really focus on dating others now -- option (b) with low intensity -- if you wait and then start forcing yourself to date others to get over her after you're already feeling fully in love, you'll feel like a fake and like you're using them, and she might be angry and/or know you're dating people you aren't into and/or lose respect for your lack of integrity.
Ultimately, either of you could take the responsibility for preventing drama and keeping both of you in a safe platonic zone. I would take that responsibility yourself, since you can only ever control yourself, so you bear final responsibility for keeping yourself safe from drama. Since it seems like the writing is on the wall about a bunch of entirely-foreseeable drama in both of your future, in your shoes, I'd take action to avoid it by rapidly deescalating and distracting myself.
posted by salvia at 1:05 PM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
There are sparks already between you guys. You are playing with fire here. So, if you keep pursuing more closeness (e.g., via salsa class), the pressure on both of you will rise. How will you react? How will she? Options include: (a) taking dramatic action to be together such as her breaking up with her boyfriend, (b) finding a way to turn off the attraction and shift into friends-mode, (c) feeling angry and misled and shifting the attraction into dislike, (d) forcing oneself to get lots of distance from the other person. The more intense the feelings, the more intense the solutions. So, whereas you could start to de-escalate things now, unnoticed -- option (d) but with low intensity -- after two months of dance classes with increasingly unbearable sexual tension, if you decide you have to stop having late night phone chats with her and stop attending dance class, it will be a dramatic cold shoulder that will feel like a break-up to you both even if you never kissed. And whereas you could really focus on dating others now -- option (b) with low intensity -- if you wait and then start forcing yourself to date others to get over her after you're already feeling fully in love, you'll feel like a fake and like you're using them, and she might be angry and/or know you're dating people you aren't into and/or lose respect for your lack of integrity.
Ultimately, either of you could take the responsibility for preventing drama and keeping both of you in a safe platonic zone. I would take that responsibility yourself, since you can only ever control yourself, so you bear final responsibility for keeping yourself safe from drama. Since it seems like the writing is on the wall about a bunch of entirely-foreseeable drama in both of your future, in your shoes, I'd take action to avoid it by rapidly deescalating and distracting myself.
posted by salvia at 1:05 PM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
Honestly, I'm not that worried about the boyfriend. Surely your coworker can make her own decisions and will choose to pursue a relationship with you if she feels that's best for her. She is not her boyfriend's property, after all, and you don't have to back off because of any moral obligation towards him.
What I'm worried about is what happens if you ask and she says no. Asking her out could affect your relationship at work in surprising and quite uncomfortable ways. You might sense that she enjoys your attention now but she could still easily feel that any proposition on your part would be way out of line. Heck, she might think that you are a sleazy predator for even insinuating something.
I might take that chance in another environment, but at work? That's just looking for trouble. Ocean, fish, plenty of.
posted by Orchestra at 1:33 PM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
What I'm worried about is what happens if you ask and she says no. Asking her out could affect your relationship at work in surprising and quite uncomfortable ways. You might sense that she enjoys your attention now but she could still easily feel that any proposition on your part would be way out of line. Heck, she might think that you are a sleazy predator for even insinuating something.
I might take that chance in another environment, but at work? That's just looking for trouble. Ocean, fish, plenty of.
posted by Orchestra at 1:33 PM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I am going to regret this, but....
First, you already had a date... 3 hours long. Shared info, good times, confidences, etc. To anyone who thinks otherwise, bite me. I am a boy.
Second... it's a co-worker. That is a helluva lot more relevant to caution than the presence (absence) of a distant boyfriend. Coworker relationships can be pretty bad when they are fokked up. At one place I worked, I vigorously discouraged it in my 200 or so underlings and had several sheriff visits to use as examples. Even when they work out, they change work dynamics in the external group and reduce effectiveness. On all days when you work, you work. On all days in a relationship, you have a random chance of a shitty day. Bad mix.
Lastly, on the BF issue... why not just ask? They may have discussed it. Here's how it sounds... "Do you mind if I ask... what are your arrangements with BF during his long absence? Are you guys OK with dating in the interim?" Beat around the bush if you want, of course, but that's for pansies, I maintain. Respond to the answer accordingly. As they say, it ain't rocket surgery, Einstein.
I'm about to catch hell for this, of course. It's metafilter, after all. I don't think playing things safe is always the best bet. Sometimes, safety is the enemy. If you want to lead a Walter Mitty life, hide behind reason all the time. What fun.
posted by FauxScot at 1:48 PM on September 19, 2010 [9 favorites]
First, you already had a date... 3 hours long. Shared info, good times, confidences, etc. To anyone who thinks otherwise, bite me. I am a boy.
Second... it's a co-worker. That is a helluva lot more relevant to caution than the presence (absence) of a distant boyfriend. Coworker relationships can be pretty bad when they are fokked up. At one place I worked, I vigorously discouraged it in my 200 or so underlings and had several sheriff visits to use as examples. Even when they work out, they change work dynamics in the external group and reduce effectiveness. On all days when you work, you work. On all days in a relationship, you have a random chance of a shitty day. Bad mix.
Lastly, on the BF issue... why not just ask? They may have discussed it. Here's how it sounds... "Do you mind if I ask... what are your arrangements with BF during his long absence? Are you guys OK with dating in the interim?" Beat around the bush if you want, of course, but that's for pansies, I maintain. Respond to the answer accordingly. As they say, it ain't rocket surgery, Einstein.
I'm about to catch hell for this, of course. It's metafilter, after all. I don't think playing things safe is always the best bet. Sometimes, safety is the enemy. If you want to lead a Walter Mitty life, hide behind reason all the time. What fun.
posted by FauxScot at 1:48 PM on September 19, 2010 [9 favorites]
First off, going out with a woman co-worker does not necessarily = dating. I go out to lunch with woman co-workers as well as men co-workers and have no fits of conscious inviting them to after work activities. It's a social thing that has nothing to do with anything sexual. I even make it clear that I have a girlfriend in case there is any confusion.
If you go with the attitude of one-on-one dancing classes or have thoughts about "falling for her big time" then you are pushing yourself into a grey area. How about inviting other co-workers to chaperone or at least to filter out the romantic notions? Nothing good will generally come from a work relationship. There are special cases of course and you'll hear about them here but for the most part, no.
posted by JJ86 at 4:22 PM on September 19, 2010
If you go with the attitude of one-on-one dancing classes or have thoughts about "falling for her big time" then you are pushing yourself into a grey area. How about inviting other co-workers to chaperone or at least to filter out the romantic notions? Nothing good will generally come from a work relationship. There are special cases of course and you'll hear about them here but for the most part, no.
posted by JJ86 at 4:22 PM on September 19, 2010
If you're crushing on this girl and worried about falling for her, man, do NOT take salsa classes with her!
Actually, the salsa classes may be the saving grace here. Often, when you crush on someone, there is no way to even get to first base except by asking them out on a date, which is a strategy with risky consequences in a workplace environment.
However, in this case, you can take salsa lessons and remain platonic. If there is chemistry, there is chemistry, and the salsa lessons give you something else to focus on other than a shared work environment.
posted by KokuRyu at 4:53 PM on September 19, 2010
Actually, the salsa classes may be the saving grace here. Often, when you crush on someone, there is no way to even get to first base except by asking them out on a date, which is a strategy with risky consequences in a workplace environment.
However, in this case, you can take salsa lessons and remain platonic. If there is chemistry, there is chemistry, and the salsa lessons give you something else to focus on other than a shared work environment.
posted by KokuRyu at 4:53 PM on September 19, 2010
The really smooth move here is to let her know that if she were single, you'd go for it in a second. Try "Ah, if only you were single. Ah well, that's how it goes, I guess". Be lighthearted and move on quickly. That puts the ball in her court.
This. But, only do this once. You are allowed one joke about how awesome it would be to date her. Joking about it every time you hang out is either icky or pathetic (or worse, both). Don't do that. Put it on the table (without putting her on the spot), and totally move on. Don't keep mentioning it, don't keep hinting, just move on.
Honestly, it sounds like she is at the least enjoying the flirtation, whether or not she is open to anything else. So if you keep things the way they are now -- dance lessons, hanging out a bit, light hearted good times -- you don't have much to lose, as far as I can see.
posted by Forktine at 5:47 PM on September 19, 2010 [3 favorites]
Salsa dancer and instructor here. Some personal anecdotal points below, that you may or may not construe as data points. But first, please don't do this - don't be that guy.
As for the salsa lessons, take what you will from this:
1. Many salsa classes rotate partners throughout so you may not even get to dance with her. Plus, you absolutely do not need a partner for salsa group classes so you don't need to do this with her!
2. Salsa is a social dance, meaning as you learn, you will inevitable start going to salsa dance events together, which wlll become more "date-like". (I'll pick you up! Wanna grab dinner before? Wow you look hot in that dress! Want to have supper? Let me drive you home!)
3. I professed that I would never date a fellow salsa dancer, and didn't for 8 years. My SO and husband to be is err, my student. Who crushed on me for 3 years. He was married when he started salsa dancing. From this, I proclaim that salsa is a persuasive "bringing people together unexpectedly" activity. You have watched Dirty Dancing right?
4. Then again, do not expect salsa dancing to be a fun "coupley" activity - I would say 70% of the couples/boy-girls that start together, end up tapering off. This is the case even when people start in same-gender groups (a couple of friends/group of friends). Why? Because very quickly, people realize they are naturally good/not good at it and will have natural passion for it or not. And you will PROBABLY find that one of you will go on to be a great salsa dancer and the other may give it up. And that is the biggest kill joy of ALL and can strain new-ish relationships.
5. Ditto all the above answers about endorphins, sweatiness, joy from learning, culminating in recipe for "oh I think I really like you" feelings due to the shared activity.
6. Having said that, she may well enjoy being spun around by other male dancers and fall for one of them instead of you. Would you be able to deal with that?
7. How cool would her boyfriend be about her taking salsa classes with male friend? I've noticed that SO's swing wildly in this camp from "completely undisturbed" to "zomg you lets a guy touch you where??" It may be worth being the better person here and asking her, "so how does BF feel about this? I don't want him to feel uncomfortable".
8. Lastly, for the sake of your enjoyment of the salsa community and if salsa is really what you want to get into, don't do this. You will become known as that guy who stole a girlfriend. OR, if it all goes pear shaped, but you both keep salsa dancing, you may have to put up with seeing her not just at work but also in your hobby scene, and it may become awkward!
My bottom line: if you want to be that person, do it anyway but don't sneak around and hide behind a guise of getting to know her better, throwing her hints and using salsa classes as a lure/method of spending time with her. Don't do it the weasly way, and try to charm the pants off her till you become irresistible compared to far away boyfriend. She is already vulnerable and lonely having him away, don't lure her - you should want her to like her for YOU, not because she needs some attention by proxy!
Tell her, up front, that you like her, but know she has a boyfriend and will not impinge on that, so hey, let's be friends. See how she responds. If she says, "oh shucks, I think you're swell but I love my SO", then for goodness sakes, just keep your relationship friendly and be honourable and respectful as co-workers and don't do the extra curricular activities.
If she wavers, then keep being nice to her and her friend, UNTIL she breaks up with her boyfriend. Any hope you have of a relationship would then start off on trustful, honourable grounds!
*I speak as someone who's salsa student and great friend professed his love for her whilst both in relationships. We both sorted our stuff out first before embarking on the love story of a lifetime. Waiting is hard, but oh so worth it for the sake of not hurting more people unnecessarily.
posted by shazzam! at 6:29 PM on September 19, 2010 [4 favorites]
As for the salsa lessons, take what you will from this:
1. Many salsa classes rotate partners throughout so you may not even get to dance with her. Plus, you absolutely do not need a partner for salsa group classes so you don't need to do this with her!
2. Salsa is a social dance, meaning as you learn, you will inevitable start going to salsa dance events together, which wlll become more "date-like". (I'll pick you up! Wanna grab dinner before? Wow you look hot in that dress! Want to have supper? Let me drive you home!)
3. I professed that I would never date a fellow salsa dancer, and didn't for 8 years. My SO and husband to be is err, my student. Who crushed on me for 3 years. He was married when he started salsa dancing. From this, I proclaim that salsa is a persuasive "bringing people together unexpectedly" activity. You have watched Dirty Dancing right?
4. Then again, do not expect salsa dancing to be a fun "coupley" activity - I would say 70% of the couples/boy-girls that start together, end up tapering off. This is the case even when people start in same-gender groups (a couple of friends/group of friends). Why? Because very quickly, people realize they are naturally good/not good at it and will have natural passion for it or not. And you will PROBABLY find that one of you will go on to be a great salsa dancer and the other may give it up. And that is the biggest kill joy of ALL and can strain new-ish relationships.
5. Ditto all the above answers about endorphins, sweatiness, joy from learning, culminating in recipe for "oh I think I really like you" feelings due to the shared activity.
6. Having said that, she may well enjoy being spun around by other male dancers and fall for one of them instead of you. Would you be able to deal with that?
7. How cool would her boyfriend be about her taking salsa classes with male friend? I've noticed that SO's swing wildly in this camp from "completely undisturbed" to "zomg you lets a guy touch you where??" It may be worth being the better person here and asking her, "so how does BF feel about this? I don't want him to feel uncomfortable".
8. Lastly, for the sake of your enjoyment of the salsa community and if salsa is really what you want to get into, don't do this. You will become known as that guy who stole a girlfriend. OR, if it all goes pear shaped, but you both keep salsa dancing, you may have to put up with seeing her not just at work but also in your hobby scene, and it may become awkward!
My bottom line: if you want to be that person, do it anyway but don't sneak around and hide behind a guise of getting to know her better, throwing her hints and using salsa classes as a lure/method of spending time with her. Don't do it the weasly way, and try to charm the pants off her till you become irresistible compared to far away boyfriend. She is already vulnerable and lonely having him away, don't lure her - you should want her to like her for YOU, not because she needs some attention by proxy!
Tell her, up front, that you like her, but know she has a boyfriend and will not impinge on that, so hey, let's be friends. See how she responds. If she says, "oh shucks, I think you're swell but I love my SO", then for goodness sakes, just keep your relationship friendly and be honourable and respectful as co-workers and don't do the extra curricular activities.
If she wavers, then keep being nice to her and her friend, UNTIL she breaks up with her boyfriend. Any hope you have of a relationship would then start off on trustful, honourable grounds!
*I speak as someone who's salsa student and great friend professed his love for her whilst both in relationships. We both sorted our stuff out first before embarking on the love story of a lifetime. Waiting is hard, but oh so worth it for the sake of not hurting more people unnecessarily.
posted by shazzam! at 6:29 PM on September 19, 2010 [4 favorites]
You have an onus on you to work with this individual, and you're taking dance classes together. If you ask her out and she reacts neutrally, you'll have to deal with hurt feelings and rejection. If she reacts negatively, then you'll have to deal with having to work with someone who actively dislikes you. This doesn't even take into account the dance classes.
This is something that you should really consider. I was in a similar situation with you and i tried my chances which didn't work out at the end. Trust me handling things are not easy when you are seeing the other person in regular basis (5 days a week?) at the office.
posted by yamamato at 3:30 AM on September 20, 2010
This is something that you should really consider. I was in a similar situation with you and i tried my chances which didn't work out at the end. Trust me handling things are not easy when you are seeing the other person in regular basis (5 days a week?) at the office.
posted by yamamato at 3:30 AM on September 20, 2010
FauxScot has it.
Your co-worker is a separate, independent human being. It's not up to you to manage her relationships for her. If you're interested, throw out a line and see what happens.
Probably, drama and disaster will ensue for all involved, but so what? Everyone here is an adult, right? If she values Mr. Long Distance more than you, she'll keep you at a distance. If not, she'll dump him, or pursue both relationships at the same time. Whatever happens, you'll all get over it. I say go for it.
posted by r_nebblesworthII at 10:19 AM on September 20, 2010
Your co-worker is a separate, independent human being. It's not up to you to manage her relationships for her. If you're interested, throw out a line and see what happens.
Probably, drama and disaster will ensue for all involved, but so what? Everyone here is an adult, right? If she values Mr. Long Distance more than you, she'll keep you at a distance. If not, she'll dump him, or pursue both relationships at the same time. Whatever happens, you'll all get over it. I say go for it.
posted by r_nebblesworthII at 10:19 AM on September 20, 2010
"I would have hated it if someone"
That's an excellent way to be a good person. Treat others as you would have others treat you. The golden rule is indeed golden.
"lets see how the dance classes go..."
Bad news there, and I suspect you know that already. She may be feeling lonely due to her long distance relationship and you already have a crush on her. It would be even worse if you worked together. Oh, wait. YOU DO.
posted by 2oh1 at 4:51 PM on September 20, 2010
That's an excellent way to be a good person. Treat others as you would have others treat you. The golden rule is indeed golden.
"lets see how the dance classes go..."
Bad news there, and I suspect you know that already. She may be feeling lonely due to her long distance relationship and you already have a crush on her. It would be even worse if you worked together. Oh, wait. YOU DO.
posted by 2oh1 at 4:51 PM on September 20, 2010
Yes, perhaps taking Minuet classes might be safer.
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:11 AM on September 21, 2010
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:11 AM on September 21, 2010
This thread is closed to new comments.
But you already knew that.
posted by youcancallmeal at 5:09 AM on September 19, 2010 [1 favorite]