Anyy point in counselling?
July 11, 2009 3:14 AM Subscribe
Is there any point in relationship counselling if I have already decided to leave?
Follow up to earlier question - left my partner of 11 years about 2 months ago. She is having problems dealing with it and keeps asking about counselling. I am not going to lie and pretend it might help because it won't. In fact, I am already in another relationship.
But, if there is any possibility that it might help her move on, I would consider it. Might sound stupid, but would a counsellor force the issue?
Follow up to earlier question - left my partner of 11 years about 2 months ago. She is having problems dealing with it and keeps asking about counselling. I am not going to lie and pretend it might help because it won't. In fact, I am already in another relationship.
But, if there is any possibility that it might help her move on, I would consider it. Might sound stupid, but would a counsellor force the issue?
Um. I have very little experience with couples counseling. My gut feeling on this one, though, is that by going to counseling with her, you make her think that you are still interested in the relationship between the two of you. You are happy with your decision to leave her. You're not interested in a relationship with her at all. In fact, as you stated above, you're already in a new relationship, which I assume is a pretty happy one.
All that being said, I think you're being a little hard on your ex. You two were together for eleven years. That's longer than a significant number of MARRIAGES last. You left her two months ago and you're trying to tell me that you REALLY expect her to just be over it already? Um. What? After eleven years?
It sucks, but this is one of those situations where you have to be cruel to be kind. No contact with your ex. Don't pick up the phone when she calls, delete e-mails and texts she sends you, block her on Twitter/Myspace/Facebook/Metafilter/LinkedIn/whatever.
Enjoy your new relationship because your old one is dunzo.
posted by SkylitDrawl at 3:30 AM on July 11, 2009 [12 favorites]
All that being said, I think you're being a little hard on your ex. You two were together for eleven years. That's longer than a significant number of MARRIAGES last. You left her two months ago and you're trying to tell me that you REALLY expect her to just be over it already? Um. What? After eleven years?
It sucks, but this is one of those situations where you have to be cruel to be kind. No contact with your ex. Don't pick up the phone when she calls, delete e-mails and texts she sends you, block her on Twitter/Myspace/Facebook/Metafilter/LinkedIn/whatever.
Enjoy your new relationship because your old one is dunzo.
posted by SkylitDrawl at 3:30 AM on July 11, 2009 [12 favorites]
Yeah, it's misleading and gives her false hope, and while it might make her feel a little better now (thanks to the false hope) in the long run it prolongs and intensifies the pain.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 3:36 AM on July 11, 2009
posted by A Terrible Llama at 3:36 AM on July 11, 2009
Three comments thus far and all saying 'Nix it' but maybe not, not if you can go into a room with her and in a supportive and safe environment say to her, so that she can absolutely hear, in the presence of another who will remind her of this in future sessions, and say to her the following:
"We had a nice thing. It was good. You are a fine person; I know that I was lucky to be with you. I wish for you nothing but the very best. But: What we had is done. I am moving on. I am sorry that you are hurting; that is why I am here today. I will not be back again. What we had is done. For you to hold on to any hopes that we are to re-kindle a dead, doused fire is futile."
To tell her of your new beau will bring her nothing but more pain. She'll find out anyways, soon enough, or perhaps life will spare her this until she is stronger; I hope so.
I wish you both peace.
posted by dancestoblue at 3:59 AM on July 11, 2009 [5 favorites]
"We had a nice thing. It was good. You are a fine person; I know that I was lucky to be with you. I wish for you nothing but the very best. But: What we had is done. I am moving on. I am sorry that you are hurting; that is why I am here today. I will not be back again. What we had is done. For you to hold on to any hopes that we are to re-kindle a dead, doused fire is futile."
To tell her of your new beau will bring her nothing but more pain. She'll find out anyways, soon enough, or perhaps life will spare her this until she is stronger; I hope so.
I wish you both peace.
posted by dancestoblue at 3:59 AM on July 11, 2009 [5 favorites]
There is a Dan Hicks song called "How can you leave me if you won't go away"
If she wants to seek council ling then well and good, be better if you weren't involved.
posted by mattoxic at 4:07 AM on July 11, 2009
If she wants to seek council ling then well and good, be better if you weren't involved.
posted by mattoxic at 4:07 AM on July 11, 2009
Man up and tell her about your new relationship.
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 4:30 AM on July 11, 2009 [8 favorites]
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 4:30 AM on July 11, 2009 [8 favorites]
Every form of relationship counseling that I know of is designed to repair relationships, not to help the partners work through the end of the relationship. From what little you've said, it sounds like she still believes the relationship is salvageable, and that's why she's suggesting counseling. If that's the case, counseling will only give her false hope.
posted by foxy_hedgehog at 4:41 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by foxy_hedgehog at 4:41 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
I know I've already responded but...does she know about your new relationship?
posted by SkylitDrawl at 4:49 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by SkylitDrawl at 4:49 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
If you have a child or anything else in your shared life that will keep you engaged with each other in the future, then counseling would be great if you need to work on communicating in a healthy/effective way together.
Otherwise tell her what dancestoblue said above: "We had a nice thing. It was good. You are a fine person; I know that I was lucky to be with you. I wish for you nothing but the very best. But: What we had is done...."
You can do that without the including wound-salting fact of your new relationship. Plenty of people start new relationships without being over the old one, and plenty of people move on from old relationships without jumping into something new, so saying "I'm over you and here's proof" is more about showing off the new love than it is about dealing fairly and kindly with the old love.
posted by headnsouth at 5:13 AM on July 11, 2009 [2 favorites]
Otherwise tell her what dancestoblue said above: "We had a nice thing. It was good. You are a fine person; I know that I was lucky to be with you. I wish for you nothing but the very best. But: What we had is done...."
You can do that without the including wound-salting fact of your new relationship. Plenty of people start new relationships without being over the old one, and plenty of people move on from old relationships without jumping into something new, so saying "I'm over you and here's proof" is more about showing off the new love than it is about dealing fairly and kindly with the old love.
posted by headnsouth at 5:13 AM on July 11, 2009 [2 favorites]
does she know about your new relationship?
Yeah, I'm wondering this as well. As St. Alia of the Bunnies already said, tell her you're seeing someone. Telling her is going to suck. Her reaction is going to suck. But it needs to be out in the open. A counselor can't force the issue. But you can.
You are in the position of power here, so be honest and straightforward. You're in a delicate situation - you have to mind her feelings, but you can't give her hope that your relationship is anything but dead.
posted by futureisunwritten at 6:06 AM on July 11, 2009
Yeah, I'm wondering this as well. As St. Alia of the Bunnies already said, tell her you're seeing someone. Telling her is going to suck. Her reaction is going to suck. But it needs to be out in the open. A counselor can't force the issue. But you can.
You are in the position of power here, so be honest and straightforward. You're in a delicate situation - you have to mind her feelings, but you can't give her hope that your relationship is anything but dead.
posted by futureisunwritten at 6:06 AM on July 11, 2009
What do you want to have happen?
What can you do to accomplish it?
Do that.
It sounds like you've already decided what your next steps are, so really, she is the only one that stands to benefit or not from counseling (or whatever next steps she identifies). Good on you for being willing to participate if it can help her. But, I suspect, that if you're clear and upfront with her about what she can and cannot expect from you from here on out, she may decide that counseling is the wrong direction. A session or two with an objective 3d party might help one or both of you come to closure quicker if your communication together isn't on track enough. (That 3d party might be the same person you or she were considering as counselor, but reframing it this way may help to manage both of your expectations for the result).
posted by TruncatedTiller at 6:49 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
What can you do to accomplish it?
Do that.
It sounds like you've already decided what your next steps are, so really, she is the only one that stands to benefit or not from counseling (or whatever next steps she identifies). Good on you for being willing to participate if it can help her. But, I suspect, that if you're clear and upfront with her about what she can and cannot expect from you from here on out, she may decide that counseling is the wrong direction. A session or two with an objective 3d party might help one or both of you come to closure quicker if your communication together isn't on track enough. (That 3d party might be the same person you or she were considering as counselor, but reframing it this way may help to manage both of your expectations for the result).
posted by TruncatedTiller at 6:49 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
You were with this person for 11 years. In two months you manage to drop them utterly and move on to the next person. That would be hard for anyone to swallow.
If you're clear that the counseling will absolutely not cause you to change course, and you've said that to her, but she still thinks it's worthwhile, even for her sake, then you've got nothing to loose other than an hour of your time and maybe your share of the bill.
You don't have much to gain from it, other than the sense that you've made a good faith effort to help your ex see that it's over and done with in a way which she can't now. Your ex possibly has a lot to gain out it, particularly if she continues the counseling on her own.
In talking to your ex, just be clear that this isn't about fixing things, it's about helping her cope. If she's fine with that, then do it. Otherwise, stay away from her and give her time to heal.
posted by wfrgms at 7:19 AM on July 11, 2009 [2 favorites]
If you're clear that the counseling will absolutely not cause you to change course, and you've said that to her, but she still thinks it's worthwhile, even for her sake, then you've got nothing to loose other than an hour of your time and maybe your share of the bill.
You don't have much to gain from it, other than the sense that you've made a good faith effort to help your ex see that it's over and done with in a way which she can't now. Your ex possibly has a lot to gain out it, particularly if she continues the counseling on her own.
In talking to your ex, just be clear that this isn't about fixing things, it's about helping her cope. If she's fine with that, then do it. Otherwise, stay away from her and give her time to heal.
posted by wfrgms at 7:19 AM on July 11, 2009 [2 favorites]
Don't tell her about the new relationship. Don't go to counseling. Just tell her it's over and leave her alone. Judging by the facts you laid out, and the circumstances of this separation, it's clear you will do more harm than good. I wish her luck.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 8:01 AM on July 11, 2009 [5 favorites]
posted by Optimus Chyme at 8:01 AM on July 11, 2009 [5 favorites]
I agree with SkylitDrawl. I just wanted to add that the old adage is it takes a person roughly half the length of a relationship to fully get over a relationship, and from what I've seen this is true for a lot of people. So two months is no time whatsoever to get over an 11 year relationship, especially if she has to deal with the punch in the gut of you already moving on to another relationship. So she might still have issues stemming from this relationship five years later, even. Be patient; there's no magic bullet.
posted by Nattie at 8:06 AM on July 11, 2009
posted by Nattie at 8:06 AM on July 11, 2009
I don't follow this, "helping the ex move on," rationale. If you broke up with her after 11 years, and it wasn't mutual, then when it becomes clear to her that the relationship has no chance of surviving, she's going to be pissed as hell at you. As she should be, really, that's human. And she'll have to work through that. I don't see, however, how mutual counseling could help in that situation, unless you feel like sitting there an hour a week to get yelled at. (I mean, maybe you deserve to be yelled at --- we don't know anything about the circumstances of the break-up, or your behavior toward each other beforehand.)
But the answer she almost certainly wants, here, is "Now that we've talked things out I see our problems weren't that bad, we should get back together." Having you sitting there going, "well, basically I realized that certain things you do annoy the hell out of me/we don't look at life the same way or share important goals and I found that unbearable/I don't love you anymore/I love someone else instead" is not a recipe for coming to a calm acceptance that the relationship has come to a natural end. And some version of those reasons, in prettier, more neutral language, is what you'd be saying. If she were in a place where she could hear, "hey, this just wasn't working out" and accept it, she wouldn't want counseling in the first place.
posted by Diablevert at 8:07 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
But the answer she almost certainly wants, here, is "Now that we've talked things out I see our problems weren't that bad, we should get back together." Having you sitting there going, "well, basically I realized that certain things you do annoy the hell out of me/we don't look at life the same way or share important goals and I found that unbearable/I don't love you anymore/I love someone else instead" is not a recipe for coming to a calm acceptance that the relationship has come to a natural end. And some version of those reasons, in prettier, more neutral language, is what you'd be saying. If she were in a place where she could hear, "hey, this just wasn't working out" and accept it, she wouldn't want counseling in the first place.
posted by Diablevert at 8:07 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
I think dancestoblue might have a pretty good point. In a safe environment with a counselor you might be able to, if not relieve the pain of rejection, at least help her accept why it ended- but I'm not sure if that's considered an important part of the healing process. For me, when I've felt rejected or abandoned, it has been helpful to understand why- even if it's painful to hear. It's been a part of my healing to comprehend if and how I contributed to the end.
posted by hellboundforcheddar at 8:09 AM on July 11, 2009
posted by hellboundforcheddar at 8:09 AM on July 11, 2009
The best advice is still the advice we gave you last month. STOP TALKING TO HER. She'll understand that you're leaving her when you're NOT THERE ANYMORE.
She sounds a bit unstable to me, based on her extreme denial in your last question and this one. You need to get out for real. Don't entertain the idea of couple's counselling — you're not a couple! She needs to get that. Don't let her push you around. If the genders were reversed and this were an ex-boyfriend you were trying to leave and who refused to believe you about this even 2 months later, people would be suggesting restraining orders.
If you must reply, say "I'm not going to couple's counselling with you because we are no longer a couple and we're not going to be again in the future. Please don't contact me again. I won't be contacting you again." And then stick to it.
posted by heatherann at 8:27 AM on July 11, 2009 [7 favorites]
She sounds a bit unstable to me, based on her extreme denial in your last question and this one. You need to get out for real. Don't entertain the idea of couple's counselling — you're not a couple! She needs to get that. Don't let her push you around. If the genders were reversed and this were an ex-boyfriend you were trying to leave and who refused to believe you about this even 2 months later, people would be suggesting restraining orders.
If you must reply, say "I'm not going to couple's counselling with you because we are no longer a couple and we're not going to be again in the future. Please don't contact me again. I won't be contacting you again." And then stick to it.
posted by heatherann at 8:27 AM on July 11, 2009 [7 favorites]
Here's another reason to not go to counseling with your ex: You will have to tell your current girlfriend, "I'm going to counseling with my ex." Or, not tell her. Neither of those actions are great.
posted by Houstonian at 10:08 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by Houstonian at 10:08 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
So basically you were emotionally not in the relationship for months, or maybe even years before you finally broke up with her (based on your previous post and the fact that you're happily seeing someone else). You had a LONG time to mentally detach from her, and all that time, she's still trying to work on the relationship, I assume, or she wouldn't be fighting so hard.
Of course she hasn't moved on after two months even though you have. You mentally broke up with her a long time ago and then finally told her about it, and the shock she's displaying surprises you? It shouldn't. Stop talking to her, and whatever you do, don't tell her about the new girlfriend because that will only cause her pointless grief when she realizes you were probably flirting with that girl before you broke up with her.
Individual counseling is probably a good idea for both of you, but going together probably won't accomplish much.
posted by slow graffiti at 11:17 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
Of course she hasn't moved on after two months even though you have. You mentally broke up with her a long time ago and then finally told her about it, and the shock she's displaying surprises you? It shouldn't. Stop talking to her, and whatever you do, don't tell her about the new girlfriend because that will only cause her pointless grief when she realizes you were probably flirting with that girl before you broke up with her.
Individual counseling is probably a good idea for both of you, but going together probably won't accomplish much.
posted by slow graffiti at 11:17 AM on July 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
You'd probably both benefit from individual relationship counselling, but doing it as a unit just keeps you both with one foot in the old relationship. It might be appropriate in situations where people need help to change the way they engage from being a couple to being co-operating separated parents, but I can't see it helping your situation.
posted by Lolie at 12:19 PM on July 11, 2009
posted by Lolie at 12:19 PM on July 11, 2009
Seriously, stop talking to her altogether. You're making things worse for her and for yourself every single time you do.
posted by srrh at 1:30 PM on July 11, 2009
posted by srrh at 1:30 PM on July 11, 2009
It seems like therapy is a good idea in this situation, but to echo what others have said, couples therapy is, alone, probably not a good idea. It may be beneficial to arrange to see a therapist specializing in couple's therapy, but one that will agree to see you both separately.
What I mean by that is that it will be good to see someone and talk things out for both of you, don't do it together. It'll give her false hope and won't help you at all in the long run. If, after a while, the therapist thinks it might be good to tell her you're done in person, he might want to set something up with the two of you - it might give her the closure she seems to need, and will allow you to get the situation over with so you can move on without worrying about her.
posted by neewom at 1:51 PM on July 11, 2009
What I mean by that is that it will be good to see someone and talk things out for both of you, don't do it together. It'll give her false hope and won't help you at all in the long run. If, after a while, the therapist thinks it might be good to tell her you're done in person, he might want to set something up with the two of you - it might give her the closure she seems to need, and will allow you to get the situation over with so you can move on without worrying about her.
posted by neewom at 1:51 PM on July 11, 2009
I have friends who did this. The female half of the relationship claimed she just wanted to work through what went wrong so she could fix herself for future relationships.
No. No no no no no no no no. It was bad for both of them and turned a little sadness into a white hot ball of resentment and anger that got in the way of both of their lives for quite a while.
It'll be worse for her than for you, if my sideline experience is any indicator. But, no. Run, don't walk.
posted by Gucky at 2:14 PM on July 11, 2009
No. No no no no no no no no. It was bad for both of them and turned a little sadness into a white hot ball of resentment and anger that got in the way of both of their lives for quite a while.
It'll be worse for her than for you, if my sideline experience is any indicator. But, no. Run, don't walk.
posted by Gucky at 2:14 PM on July 11, 2009
would a counsellor force the issue?
Not having you in her life, at all, in any way, any more would force the issue. It would do so quite literally: if you cut off all contact (no in-person conversations, no phone calls, no e-mails or IMing, no social networking connections, nothing), your ex would be forced to determine how to carry on and live in a personal and social world that does not include you.
posted by Meg_Murry at 2:22 PM on July 11, 2009
Not having you in her life, at all, in any way, any more would force the issue. It would do so quite literally: if you cut off all contact (no in-person conversations, no phone calls, no e-mails or IMing, no social networking connections, nothing), your ex would be forced to determine how to carry on and live in a personal and social world that does not include you.
posted by Meg_Murry at 2:22 PM on July 11, 2009
The advice here is about the sanest I've ever seen in a relationship-filter question. Either you go or you don't. But, really, why are you still communicating with her at all? You've already broken up with her. I most agree with the suggestion of counseling for both of you, but separately. Eleven years is a long time.
posted by lilywing13 at 12:36 AM on July 13, 2009
posted by lilywing13 at 12:36 AM on July 13, 2009
The sooner you're out of her life completely, the sooner hers will improve.
posted by Kurichina at 10:27 AM on July 13, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by Kurichina at 10:27 AM on July 13, 2009 [1 favorite]
i went though this- in a relationship for 6 years, tried to break up with him, he beggeg for counseling, i knew i would still leave him but agreed, thinking it would help him on the path to getting over me - take it from someone who has been through it - don't do it. it made my life more stressful, and even impacted my next relationship. generally, thy only way she will start to move on is by dating people, and in order for her to let herself do that, you might have to cut down to minimal or no contact by force. i'm currently doing that now to my ex. it feels terrible, like i'm being cruel, but it has worked out for the best. any questions, feel free to message me.
posted by assasinatdbeauty at 7:41 PM on July 13, 2009
posted by assasinatdbeauty at 7:41 PM on July 13, 2009
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by brain at 3:26 AM on July 11, 2009