Running my own midnight movie
July 19, 2013 3:33 PM Subscribe
I've got a notion to organize a movie screening of some sci-fi movie at a local theater, and sell tickets. It seems to me that the easiest legal way to do this is to buy the performance rights and rent a screen at a franchise theater. Assuming I know ahead of time what those costs are, Kickstarter could be the ticket sales mechanism. [actual question inside]
The MPAA has helpful links on buying rights (http://www.mpaa.org/contentprotection/public-performance-law) but it's unclear what that would actually cost for something like I'm planning. Renting the theater costs at least a hundred bucks, but seems pretty straightforward.
Has anyone here ever done something like this? What hurdles should I anticipate? Would you pay 10 or 15 bucks to go see a movie that you like with a bunch of randoms who also like that movie?
The MPAA has helpful links on buying rights (http://www.mpaa.org/contentprotection/public-performance-law) but it's unclear what that would actually cost for something like I'm planning. Renting the theater costs at least a hundred bucks, but seems pretty straightforward.
Has anyone here ever done something like this? What hurdles should I anticipate? Would you pay 10 or 15 bucks to go see a movie that you like with a bunch of randoms who also like that movie?
Have you gone to the local theater and asked them what they know about rights?
I live in a bubble where there are lots of local film festival kinds of events, but this sort of thing appears to happen near me all the time. I bet the manager can totally work with you on this. You bring the customers, they clear the rights and show the movie (and make sure they get the right format for their gear, or handle the film if it's old school).
posted by straw at 3:56 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
I live in a bubble where there are lots of local film festival kinds of events, but this sort of thing appears to happen near me all the time. I bet the manager can totally work with you on this. You bring the customers, they clear the rights and show the movie (and make sure they get the right format for their gear, or handle the film if it's old school).
posted by straw at 3:56 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
Building on Sara C.'s point -- what would you be expecting from the theater's staff? Monitoring to keep people from sneaking in, ticket-taking, and food/drink sales?
posted by spunweb at 3:57 PM on July 19, 2013
posted by spunweb at 3:57 PM on July 19, 2013
If you are thinking of a classic sci-fi movie and not a new release, $10-15 seems like more than I'd want pay without some other draw - food maybe or movie trivia and prizes beforehand or something else to make it an "event" rather than just a movie that happens to be at midnight.
Along the line of Sara C.'s comment, I always figured the chain theater $100 plans were basically for a private showing of a movie that's already at that theater.
An indie theater might be more interested in working with you to create this (more than I imagine a chain with a corporate office would be). And for me it would feel more like a special event if it weren't at my usual chain theater.
What about something outdoors? I always thought the movies in Washington Square Park in San Fran were pretty cool. This might be turning your plan into a bigger plan than you want to deal with but if there isn't something like this in your area, maybe you could work with your city council to start it.
posted by Beti at 3:58 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
Along the line of Sara C.'s comment, I always figured the chain theater $100 plans were basically for a private showing of a movie that's already at that theater.
An indie theater might be more interested in working with you to create this (more than I imagine a chain with a corporate office would be). And for me it would feel more like a special event if it weren't at my usual chain theater.
What about something outdoors? I always thought the movies in Washington Square Park in San Fran were pretty cool. This might be turning your plan into a bigger plan than you want to deal with but if there isn't something like this in your area, maybe you could work with your city council to start it.
posted by Beti at 3:58 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
There's already a Kickstarter for film screenings - you'll want to take a look at Tugg. They allow folks to promote local screenings of a wide library of movies at local theaters Kickstarter-style - you set up the event, and if you sell enough tickets before the screening, they set up the theater rental and license and it happens. If not, no loss for anyone.
If you're looking to do it yourself without the help of Tugg or a local theater handling the booking, costs vary widely, and are really prohibitive for all but the most tenacious promoter.
Performance rights for many films - and, sometimes, the media (ie, the film itself) - can be coordinated for non-commercial or small organizations by distributors like Park Circus or Swank Motion Pictures. For other films, you may need to go directly to the specific distributor of that film. These rights may be flat fee - often in the $150 - $500 range depending on the title - or they may be variable, starting at a certain fee and moving up depending on audience count.
Be aware, though, that the theater rental itself may cost hundreds or even thousands depending on the size and location of the theater - $100 in any major city would be a real bargain, and that almost certainly wouldn't include staff assistance. If you manage to rent an actual 35mm film, you have to factor in shipping costs of those heavy canisters, which are likely to end up being hundreds of dollars, and also a projectionist, who will charge an hourly rate. Shipping and projectionist costs will also come into play if you play a DCP, or digital cinema package, as many movies are shown today. You will generally be looking at a $1000+ bill in any scenario.
posted by eschatfische at 4:00 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
If you're looking to do it yourself without the help of Tugg or a local theater handling the booking, costs vary widely, and are really prohibitive for all but the most tenacious promoter.
Performance rights for many films - and, sometimes, the media (ie, the film itself) - can be coordinated for non-commercial or small organizations by distributors like Park Circus or Swank Motion Pictures. For other films, you may need to go directly to the specific distributor of that film. These rights may be flat fee - often in the $150 - $500 range depending on the title - or they may be variable, starting at a certain fee and moving up depending on audience count.
Be aware, though, that the theater rental itself may cost hundreds or even thousands depending on the size and location of the theater - $100 in any major city would be a real bargain, and that almost certainly wouldn't include staff assistance. If you manage to rent an actual 35mm film, you have to factor in shipping costs of those heavy canisters, which are likely to end up being hundreds of dollars, and also a projectionist, who will charge an hourly rate. Shipping and projectionist costs will also come into play if you play a DCP, or digital cinema package, as many movies are shown today. You will generally be looking at a $1000+ bill in any scenario.
posted by eschatfische at 4:00 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
Longtime theater projectionist here;
Every time I've seen this done, the cost isn't a simple $100/$150: it's always been based on the actual ticket sales, unless as others say this was simply room rental on a weekday morning. You're going to need to *rent* rights to show a film: nobody is likely to actually *sell* performance rights. And trust me: $100 is NOT going to cover that theater rental fee plus little goodies like personnel costs: I don't work for free, and neither does anyone else in the theater!
Since you're talking old movies..... are you talking about film, VHS, DVD? If film: 16mm, 35mm, what? What's the aspect ratio? Please note: no theater can run every format there is; not every old movie is available in a format a specific theater CAN show...... example: a couple years ago, we told a group we could run most 35mm films or DVDs; we could not run x, y, or z. So what did they do? They brought one of the formats we specifically told them we could NOT run, and got mad AT US. Sheesh.
And no: I would NOT pay $10-$15 for an old movie I've probably seen a ton of times...... maybe --- MAYBE --- I'd consider as much as $5 for a really special film, but that's still pushing it. You would probably not be permitted to sell any kind of food or drinks: you don't have have the required health department permits, nor would any theater be likely to be willing to give up their main revenue stream. (And I also can't see a theater risking their OWN health department permits by letting you do your own sales.)
And there's one more problem no-one has yet mentioned: it's one thing for a theater to rent to you for a single specific event, but as a regularly-scheduled weekly thing? Not likely. They've got their own shows to run, and aren't gonna agree to give up the time, especially if you're thinking prime times like Fridays, Saturdays or holidays.
posted by easily confused at 5:08 PM on July 19, 2013 [6 favorites]
Every time I've seen this done, the cost isn't a simple $100/$150: it's always been based on the actual ticket sales, unless as others say this was simply room rental on a weekday morning. You're going to need to *rent* rights to show a film: nobody is likely to actually *sell* performance rights. And trust me: $100 is NOT going to cover that theater rental fee plus little goodies like personnel costs: I don't work for free, and neither does anyone else in the theater!
Since you're talking old movies..... are you talking about film, VHS, DVD? If film: 16mm, 35mm, what? What's the aspect ratio? Please note: no theater can run every format there is; not every old movie is available in a format a specific theater CAN show...... example: a couple years ago, we told a group we could run most 35mm films or DVDs; we could not run x, y, or z. So what did they do? They brought one of the formats we specifically told them we could NOT run, and got mad AT US. Sheesh.
And no: I would NOT pay $10-$15 for an old movie I've probably seen a ton of times...... maybe --- MAYBE --- I'd consider as much as $5 for a really special film, but that's still pushing it. You would probably not be permitted to sell any kind of food or drinks: you don't have have the required health department permits, nor would any theater be likely to be willing to give up their main revenue stream. (And I also can't see a theater risking their OWN health department permits by letting you do your own sales.)
And there's one more problem no-one has yet mentioned: it's one thing for a theater to rent to you for a single specific event, but as a regularly-scheduled weekly thing? Not likely. They've got their own shows to run, and aren't gonna agree to give up the time, especially if you're thinking prime times like Fridays, Saturdays or holidays.
posted by easily confused at 5:08 PM on July 19, 2013 [6 favorites]
(Oh also: no, you can NOT run my projection booth equipment yourself: you WOULD need the theater's actual projectionist..... not "you wouldn't be ALLOWED to run" my booth: you DO NOT KNOW HOW to run it. This stuff ain't your high school's AV projector.)
posted by easily confused at 5:14 PM on July 19, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by easily confused at 5:14 PM on July 19, 2013 [2 favorites]
From my one experience, I can tell you that licensing public performance rights for a film you plan on charging admission to will be far more expensive than getting the rights for a free screening. And there may also be restrictions on what kind/how much promotion you can do.
posted by Devoidoid at 5:19 PM on July 19, 2013
posted by Devoidoid at 5:19 PM on July 19, 2013
Most movie theatres who would consider this -- aka small indie ones -- probably already run midnight movies and are already paying a person whose entire job is to program midnight movies. There's an art to it. (I have a friend who has this job, in fact.)
If you want to be the person who CURATES the midnight movie sci-fi special, contact the person who programs the midnight movies at your local art house and see if you can. You probably would have to have either a really really awesome pitch or have some kind of notority beyond "I love movies!" -- because, the person who's programming the midnight movies already also loves them. I wouldn't expect to make money on it for yourself, though. If you want to do it for fun, that might be possible. If you want to make money, that's a lot trickier. You might be able to get away with it, though, if you decided this was something you wanted to do for charity.
posted by Countess Sandwich at 5:23 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
If you want to be the person who CURATES the midnight movie sci-fi special, contact the person who programs the midnight movies at your local art house and see if you can. You probably would have to have either a really really awesome pitch or have some kind of notority beyond "I love movies!" -- because, the person who's programming the midnight movies already also loves them. I wouldn't expect to make money on it for yourself, though. If you want to do it for fun, that might be possible. If you want to make money, that's a lot trickier. You might be able to get away with it, though, if you decided this was something you wanted to do for charity.
posted by Countess Sandwich at 5:23 PM on July 19, 2013 [1 favorite]
Check your local library - some have screening space/auditorium space that might suit your purposes.
Also, people may be more amenable to working with you if the proceeds (after covering rental, equip etc.) are going to charity; couldn't tell from your post whether your objective is to make profit for yourself, or just enough to keep the night running?
posted by NorthernAutumn at 6:38 PM on July 19, 2013
Also, people may be more amenable to working with you if the proceeds (after covering rental, equip etc.) are going to charity; couldn't tell from your post whether your objective is to make profit for yourself, or just enough to keep the night running?
posted by NorthernAutumn at 6:38 PM on July 19, 2013
Tugg is probably the most painless way for you to do what you're trying to do, though they only have access to certain film libraries. If you're wedded to showing a specific film, you may have to dig around a little more (or you may not be able to get the rights to show it at all).
Everyone here has fantastic advice. In particular, listen to easily confused about the importance of being clear about tech details.
As for costs — I run a weekly film series something like what you're describing, and our costs come to a minimum of $500 per screening (barring unusual circumstances) — and that's excluding shipping (we show exclusively 35mm and 16mm prints, which can add up to another $200 in shipping costs) and labor (we're professional projectionists, so they let us do it ourselves - but normally, projectionists get paid anywhere from ~$10 to ~$20 per hour, depending on the theater).
posted by bubukaba at 9:02 PM on July 19, 2013
Everyone here has fantastic advice. In particular, listen to easily confused about the importance of being clear about tech details.
As for costs — I run a weekly film series something like what you're describing, and our costs come to a minimum of $500 per screening (barring unusual circumstances) — and that's excluding shipping (we show exclusively 35mm and 16mm prints, which can add up to another $200 in shipping costs) and labor (we're professional projectionists, so they let us do it ourselves - but normally, projectionists get paid anywhere from ~$10 to ~$20 per hour, depending on the theater).
posted by bubukaba at 9:02 PM on July 19, 2013
Certain theatres might already do something like this.
For example, here in Nottingham, you can be in a nice theatre on a Sunday afternoon with 30 of your friends for £200 or you can have a tiny theatre with 21 of your friends.
Check around your local art house and indie cinemas.
posted by Katemonkey at 12:51 AM on July 20, 2013
For example, here in Nottingham, you can be in a nice theatre on a Sunday afternoon with 30 of your friends for £200 or you can have a tiny theatre with 21 of your friends.
Check around your local art house and indie cinemas.
posted by Katemonkey at 12:51 AM on July 20, 2013
You might be able to find a space that isn't a theater that would be appropriate, like a meeting room with a large projection screen, or for a smaller group you might be able to get a private room at a restaurant for no extra charge if everyone is buying a meal.
You'll need to bring your own equipment and maybe a screen, you may be able to rent these things locally.
Renting the theater costs at least a hundred bucks
I think it's safe to assume that the cost to rent a theater will absolutely be greater than $100, indeed. There may also be fees for cleaning, employees (the cost will be much more than what they actually get paid), running over on time, etc.
I might pay $10 to go see a movie, particularly if it appeals to friends. I probably wouldn't unless I could buy the ticket at the door though.
posted by yohko at 7:45 AM on July 20, 2013
You'll need to bring your own equipment and maybe a screen, you may be able to rent these things locally.
Renting the theater costs at least a hundred bucks
I think it's safe to assume that the cost to rent a theater will absolutely be greater than $100, indeed. There may also be fees for cleaning, employees (the cost will be much more than what they actually get paid), running over on time, etc.
I might pay $10 to go see a movie, particularly if it appeals to friends. I probably wouldn't unless I could buy the ticket at the door though.
posted by yohko at 7:45 AM on July 20, 2013
If you are energetic and good at marketing, you might be able to get a theatre to partner with you on some special events. For many films, the distributor may take a portion of ticket sales. If you're persuasive, a theatre owner might even take you on as a part-time employee. I say put together a presentation, and give it a shot.
posted by theora55 at 8:57 AM on July 20, 2013
posted by theora55 at 8:57 AM on July 20, 2013
Our organization is looking into public performance rights, and one thing we've learned is that you can't advertise the name of the movie or the characters on your outside publicity. You can say things like "a classic animated feature" or "a 60s B movie" but that's it. And yeah, you do have to pay a lot more for a license that lets you charge admission. Even then the licensing company takes part of your box office.
posted by Biblio at 11:58 AM on July 20, 2013
posted by Biblio at 11:58 AM on July 20, 2013
Biblio, none of that is strictly true - it all depends on the rightsholder or distributor you're working with.
Whether or not admission will be charged can influence how much you pay, but that also depends on who you're working with. Other things that can influence how much you pay include the popularity of the title you want to show, the seating capacity of the venue, whether the venue is technically a theater or not, and (if you're contracted to pay a minimum vs. a percentage) how much you gross on the night of the show.
posted by bubukaba at 12:39 PM on July 20, 2013
Whether or not admission will be charged can influence how much you pay, but that also depends on who you're working with. Other things that can influence how much you pay include the popularity of the title you want to show, the seating capacity of the venue, whether the venue is technically a theater or not, and (if you're contracted to pay a minimum vs. a percentage) how much you gross on the night of the show.
posted by bubukaba at 12:39 PM on July 20, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
My understanding is that those "rent the theatre for $100!" schemes are for birthday parties or corporate events, not for other people who are in the business of screening films to use their facilities to screen a film they have no input on.
You might want to specifically bring up the fact that you would be charging admission for the event, which would center around screening a film of your choice.
posted by Sara C. at 3:42 PM on July 19, 2013 [4 favorites]