How to get my sister out of a dog loan
February 22, 2018 3:03 PM Subscribe
My sister bought her ex a dog on credit. He wanted a $4K dog, and had no credit, and my sister, who is low IQ and disabled but legally an adult got a loan with some sketchy puppy mill loan company. Since the loan is in her name, the dog is too. Her ex pays her back monthly in cash but isn't diligent about it. He's refusing/too busy to do things like get the dog his necessary shots, so my sister is doing stuff like that out of a fear that the dog could give a kid rabies and sue her since the dog is in her name. He still owes something like $3K on the dog, and they are both using this as an incentive to keep each other in their lives, keeping their terrifically unhealthy relationship alive. How can we get the dog in his name or get the loan company to switch the loan into his name?
She could pay off the loan, and switch out the name, but then there's no guarantee he'd pay her back at that point. Is there any way to ensure payment of the last $3K? Is there any way to ensure the dog stays with him but my sister is reimbursed? He has been known to be violent, and has slashed my mom's tires in the past.
His parents don't care about him or the dog and likely would not pay for the dog. My mother, who my sister lives with, doesn't want the dog. Everyone lives in Illinois.
anon email: mysistersdogproblem@gmail.com
She could pay off the loan, and switch out the name, but then there's no guarantee he'd pay her back at that point. Is there any way to ensure payment of the last $3K? Is there any way to ensure the dog stays with him but my sister is reimbursed? He has been known to be violent, and has slashed my mom's tires in the past.
His parents don't care about him or the dog and likely would not pay for the dog. My mother, who my sister lives with, doesn't want the dog. Everyone lives in Illinois.
anon email: mysistersdogproblem@gmail.com
If it'd be possible to transfer the dog's ownership to him, then $3K sounds like a small price to pay to get this dipshit out of her life. Get him to consent to the transfer & make it official, then your family can help her pay off the loan and say goodbye to this terrible person forever. Just take the financial hit: you know he's dangerous, his abusive behaviour will likely escalate, and a badly-trained and unvaccinated dog is a huge liability.
posted by pseudostrabismus at 3:16 PM on February 22, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by pseudostrabismus at 3:16 PM on February 22, 2018 [4 favorites]
What happens if she stops paying? Since she lives at home for thenhit on her credit score really matter? Would having a bad credit score actually prevent her in future from making such poor decisions?
posted by saucysault at 3:27 PM on February 22, 2018 [11 favorites]
posted by saucysault at 3:27 PM on February 22, 2018 [11 favorites]
Is there any way to ensure the dog stays with him but my sister is reimbursed? He has been known to be violent, and has slashed my mom's tires in the past.
hahaha, oh god this is insane. Just get out of interacting with this dude ASAP. If you can help your sister pay any of the remaining $3k on the dog to release her from responsibility from it, do it. The dog is not her responsibility beyond that point (which is sad, and as a dog lover, bums me out dearly), but this is crazytalk. Dude who is violent "owes" your sister $3k; just pay it off, and don't deal with him anymore. Call the police as necessary.
$3k is a small mistake to make, and worth the loss.
What happens if she stops paying? Since she lives at home for thenhit on her credit score really matter? Would having a bad credit score actually prevent her in future from making such poor decisions?
This can go to collections and cause problems regardless of where you live or how you pay your rent. It can lead to garnished wages, and decreased employment options because employers can run credit checks on new employees (in some states). While this would be nice, it has lasting ramifications beyond just a dip in one's credit score.
posted by furnace.heart at 3:31 PM on February 22, 2018 [8 favorites]
hahaha, oh god this is insane. Just get out of interacting with this dude ASAP. If you can help your sister pay any of the remaining $3k on the dog to release her from responsibility from it, do it. The dog is not her responsibility beyond that point (which is sad, and as a dog lover, bums me out dearly), but this is crazytalk. Dude who is violent "owes" your sister $3k; just pay it off, and don't deal with him anymore. Call the police as necessary.
$3k is a small mistake to make, and worth the loss.
What happens if she stops paying? Since she lives at home for thenhit on her credit score really matter? Would having a bad credit score actually prevent her in future from making such poor decisions?
This can go to collections and cause problems regardless of where you live or how you pay your rent. It can lead to garnished wages, and decreased employment options because employers can run credit checks on new employees (in some states). While this would be nice, it has lasting ramifications beyond just a dip in one's credit score.
posted by furnace.heart at 3:31 PM on February 22, 2018 [8 favorites]
Honestly she should just return the dog if she is able to do so. This guy doesn't sound like he would be a great dog parent either.
posted by corb at 3:46 PM on February 22, 2018 [11 favorites]
posted by corb at 3:46 PM on February 22, 2018 [11 favorites]
Have you even asked this guy if he'll accept the loan? It seems like the obvious first step.
posted by Jubey at 5:25 PM on February 22, 2018
posted by Jubey at 5:25 PM on February 22, 2018
In IL this may be considered financial abuse of a disabled individual. You can call adult protective services regarding this case, if he directly encouraged her to take out a loan for goods of his own gain when he was aware she couldn't understand the consequences.
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:36 PM on February 22, 2018 [23 favorites]
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:36 PM on February 22, 2018 [23 favorites]
*Especially if she works have been unable to navigate the loan process on her own.
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:36 PM on February 22, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:36 PM on February 22, 2018 [1 favorite]
If your sister is intellectually disabled, this is financial abuse in Illinois. You can call DHS, and while they may not go after the "boyfriend," they can and will go after the lender to get the debt discharged. Here's the info:
Office of Inspector General
Department of Human Services
(800) 368-1463 (voice/TTY)
This number is specifically indicated for: "[Reporting] abuse, neglect, or financial exploitation of individuals 18 or over in a group home, CILA, day or residential program, or a state operated mental health or developmental disability facility, and for individuals ages 18 to 59 in a private home." Emphasis mine.
Here is the link to the Illinois AG's definition of abuse/financial exploitation: http://www.ag.state.il.us/rights/abuse.html
posted by juniperesque at 7:05 PM on February 22, 2018 [29 favorites]
Office of Inspector General
Department of Human Services
(800) 368-1463 (voice/TTY)
This number is specifically indicated for: "[Reporting] abuse, neglect, or financial exploitation of individuals 18 or over in a group home, CILA, day or residential program, or a state operated mental health or developmental disability facility, and for individuals ages 18 to 59 in a private home." Emphasis mine.
Here is the link to the Illinois AG's definition of abuse/financial exploitation: http://www.ag.state.il.us/rights/abuse.html
posted by juniperesque at 7:05 PM on February 22, 2018 [29 favorites]
Probably good to keep in mind a few details from the post:
The woman likes the man; sounds like she doesn't necessarily want to end their relationship.
If he's low-IQ himself, it might be hard to get him charged for exploiting another low-IQ person
If he's average-IQ, he can be charged... but average IQ indicates he's also a (sexual?) predator, and one who's already shown low conscience.
The man has been violent in the past.
For all of these reasons, charging him could end up being a bad idea.
posted by pseudostrabismus at 9:08 PM on February 22, 2018 [3 favorites]
The woman likes the man; sounds like she doesn't necessarily want to end their relationship.
If he's low-IQ himself, it might be hard to get him charged for exploiting another low-IQ person
If he's average-IQ, he can be charged... but average IQ indicates he's also a (sexual?) predator, and one who's already shown low conscience.
The man has been violent in the past.
For all of these reasons, charging him could end up being a bad idea.
posted by pseudostrabismus at 9:08 PM on February 22, 2018 [3 favorites]
Also, the person is more important than the dog, but...there is a real possibility of violence here towards the dog if you make him angry enough. Limit the complaints to the lender. And, honestly, if you could think of a way to get him to surrender the dog to a home that actually wants him, it would be a great kindness.
posted by praemunire at 9:41 PM on February 22, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by praemunire at 9:41 PM on February 22, 2018 [4 favorites]
I'm so sad this is an AskMe in which I have to detail Fuck You Money (tm).
Does it cost $3k to pay off the loan and tranfer ownership? PAY THAT.
This is what it costs to get a violent unstable abuser out of your lives. DO IT.
----
I'm not sure about how you reach your sister and get her to change her mind about this guy. I do know how you diffuse this danger and buy some room to convince her. PAY IT.
posted by jbenben at 1:08 AM on February 23, 2018 [4 favorites]
Does it cost $3k to pay off the loan and tranfer ownership? PAY THAT.
This is what it costs to get a violent unstable abuser out of your lives. DO IT.
----
I'm not sure about how you reach your sister and get her to change her mind about this guy. I do know how you diffuse this danger and buy some room to convince her. PAY IT.
posted by jbenben at 1:08 AM on February 23, 2018 [4 favorites]
I agree with returning the dog to the breeder. If they won't take it, bringing it to a reputable shelter is a perfectly reasonable option in this case. In either case, assume the guy is not paying any more money back. Your family can then figure out if paying off the loan or defaulting on it is the best option for your sister financially.
posted by Rock Steady at 8:40 AM on February 23, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by Rock Steady at 8:40 AM on February 23, 2018 [1 favorite]
Before taking the dog away from the ex, you should probably get legal advice. In my jurisdiction he would be deemed the owner, as he has care and control over the animal, and the animal would be his property (the fact of the loan and the papers being in her name does not disprove him claiming the animal was a gift). Taking the dog to a shelter without his permission could be pursued criminally, another headache she does not need. Ideally, he would agree to sign for ownership of the dog with the promise to pay the $3,000 by a set time (so when he defaults she can take him to small claims court), but considering her inability to advocate for herself you may just want to consider taking whatever steps necessary to limit him ever needing to contact her again, including just writing off the money as a bad debt.
posted by saucysault at 9:31 AM on February 23, 2018
posted by saucysault at 9:31 AM on February 23, 2018
In my years of experience in veterinary medicine, I have found that establishing formal pet ownership can be a challenging process. With proof of payment for 1) the dog itself 2) its veterinary care and 3) its license and registration, my (non-legally binding) opinion is that your sister would have a very strong claim. If he is in possession of the dog and will fight to keep it, I agree that it may be not worth the hassle and you could just let him keep the dog. It doesn't sound like it will be well cared for in that situation, but it is a reasonable option if it helps get him out of her life.
posted by Rock Steady at 10:32 AM on February 23, 2018
posted by Rock Steady at 10:32 AM on February 23, 2018
A couple of other options:
She takes back physical possession of the dog and then returns it to seller for a (partial) refund or sells it to a third party. She will probably still owe money on the loan but the loss will be less. a $4,000 dog probably has some value to new owner, although not nearly what she paid for it. You would probably have to help make sure that is going to a good home, or at least better than its current home.
If it doesn't seem prudent to retake possession she can sell him the dog in exchange for an IOU (make it a legal loan so you can take him to small claims court if he doesn't pay) If he has an asset that can be used collateral, all the better. I'm not sure that her keeping ownership will increase the odds of him paying her back any more than they are already. She would still be on the hook for the loan but assuming it is a personal loan (that the dog is not collateral) it doesn't matter to the lender what happens to the dog.
posted by metahawk at 11:27 AM on February 23, 2018
She takes back physical possession of the dog and then returns it to seller for a (partial) refund or sells it to a third party. She will probably still owe money on the loan but the loss will be less. a $4,000 dog probably has some value to new owner, although not nearly what she paid for it. You would probably have to help make sure that is going to a good home, or at least better than its current home.
If it doesn't seem prudent to retake possession she can sell him the dog in exchange for an IOU (make it a legal loan so you can take him to small claims court if he doesn't pay) If he has an asset that can be used collateral, all the better. I'm not sure that her keeping ownership will increase the odds of him paying her back any more than they are already. She would still be on the hook for the loan but assuming it is a personal loan (that the dog is not collateral) it doesn't matter to the lender what happens to the dog.
posted by metahawk at 11:27 AM on February 23, 2018
This thread is closed to new comments.
Honestly, I think the best thing at this point is to take the dog back from whence it came. This sounds like a bad situation all around.
posted by hydra77 at 3:15 PM on February 22, 2018 [6 favorites]