Trouble Talking with Parents About Planning for Their Future
July 1, 2015 6:43 AM Subscribe
My siblings and I know that we need to talk with our retirement-age/elderly parents about their finances, end-of-life-directives, wishes, and plans for the future before they get sick or too old. So far, both parents are healthy, but we want to start the ball rolling before any crises emerge. However, the dysfunction in our family is getting in our way.
Unfortunately, the state of their marriage severely impedes our ability to deal with things as a family.
a) Both parents are extremely reluctant to talk to each other about major plans. Their marriage has existed in an unhealthy stasis for years, partially held together by mutual agreement not to confront anything. They basically live like separated people, except in the same house.
b) Mom has not ruled out eventually leaving Dad, although Dad seems unaware of this. We've told we her we support any decision, but urged her to consider doing it before Dad gets too old.
c) Mom is younger than Dad, making it likely that she will become one of his primary caretakers when he declines. She is already caretaking another relative, so my siblings and I don't want her to become a constant caretaker for him too. As it stands, it seems Dad just assumes she will take care of him.
d) My siblings and I all live in different states and one is overseas.
e) Mom is not emotionally ready to talk about her own retirement/aging. She insists that she's never had a chance to really live, so asking about eventual-end-of-life is going to be dicey.
f) We have no idea the state of their finances. They appear to be fine, but we don't know whether there's enough money for a long term care facility, or for Mom's eventual old-age (she never worked).
g) Should Mom be the first person to get sick, it's unlikely Dad will be a good caretaker for her. It's possible as one of them gets sick or old that we'd need to separate them.
h) As you can tell from this anonymous post, we are somewhat scared to talk to them in general. Our upbringing was tumultuous and we were discouraged from asking questions about important issues or divulging any family secrets, even to each other. Obviously, we're adults now and still need to deal with this.
i) We have no close family members or friends-of-family who can help us with them.
j) As a result of said tumultuous upbringing, several of us are reluctant to move them into our own homes to caretake them there, but are ready to explore other options (move them to nearby apartments, hiring visiting caretakers, visiting ourselves).
k) Previous attempts to bring this up have been rebuffed.
So far, we plan to:
a) do this in person.
b) talk to each of them separately.
c) emphasize that we're not interested in any bequest - we're worried about their future welfare.
Is there a checklist for things we'll need to cover? Should we just focus on Dad now, and talk to Mom about her own plans later? Should we mention to Dad that we're concerned about Mom having to caretake him?
This will probably be the first of many conversations, but we'd really appreciate any advice you might have. It's not anywhere near a crisis yet, but it's been weighing on us. Have any of you gone through something like this?
Unfortunately, the state of their marriage severely impedes our ability to deal with things as a family.
a) Both parents are extremely reluctant to talk to each other about major plans. Their marriage has existed in an unhealthy stasis for years, partially held together by mutual agreement not to confront anything. They basically live like separated people, except in the same house.
b) Mom has not ruled out eventually leaving Dad, although Dad seems unaware of this. We've told we her we support any decision, but urged her to consider doing it before Dad gets too old.
c) Mom is younger than Dad, making it likely that she will become one of his primary caretakers when he declines. She is already caretaking another relative, so my siblings and I don't want her to become a constant caretaker for him too. As it stands, it seems Dad just assumes she will take care of him.
d) My siblings and I all live in different states and one is overseas.
e) Mom is not emotionally ready to talk about her own retirement/aging. She insists that she's never had a chance to really live, so asking about eventual-end-of-life is going to be dicey.
f) We have no idea the state of their finances. They appear to be fine, but we don't know whether there's enough money for a long term care facility, or for Mom's eventual old-age (she never worked).
g) Should Mom be the first person to get sick, it's unlikely Dad will be a good caretaker for her. It's possible as one of them gets sick or old that we'd need to separate them.
h) As you can tell from this anonymous post, we are somewhat scared to talk to them in general. Our upbringing was tumultuous and we were discouraged from asking questions about important issues or divulging any family secrets, even to each other. Obviously, we're adults now and still need to deal with this.
i) We have no close family members or friends-of-family who can help us with them.
j) As a result of said tumultuous upbringing, several of us are reluctant to move them into our own homes to caretake them there, but are ready to explore other options (move them to nearby apartments, hiring visiting caretakers, visiting ourselves).
k) Previous attempts to bring this up have been rebuffed.
So far, we plan to:
a) do this in person.
b) talk to each of them separately.
c) emphasize that we're not interested in any bequest - we're worried about their future welfare.
Is there a checklist for things we'll need to cover? Should we just focus on Dad now, and talk to Mom about her own plans later? Should we mention to Dad that we're concerned about Mom having to caretake him?
This will probably be the first of many conversations, but we'd really appreciate any advice you might have. It's not anywhere near a crisis yet, but it's been weighing on us. Have any of you gone through something like this?
I think you find this discussion of the 40/70 Rule useful. The 40/70 rule is that the time to start talking about long-term aging issues with parents is by the time the kids are 40 and the parents are 70. After then, you may not have the time to set up any necessary documents or come to agreement while all the decision-makers are fully competent to do so.
My parents resisted these discussions for years, until it was nearly too late to do anything about it. Thankfully, they did in the end provide enough information that I was able to step in and help out. But it would have been a lot easier if they had been willing earlier to address these issues.
posted by suelac at 9:58 AM on July 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
My parents resisted these discussions for years, until it was nearly too late to do anything about it. Thankfully, they did in the end provide enough information that I was able to step in and help out. But it would have been a lot easier if they had been willing earlier to address these issues.
posted by suelac at 9:58 AM on July 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
I'd echo crocomancer's comment about events forcing a decision - my grandparents were very much like this. It was only when my grandmother had to deal with the hassle of my grandfather dying intestate (we had no idea even if he wanted to be buried or cremated until my sister remembered a conversation with him from a few years before) that she made a will herself, and even then only because my dad basically strongarmed her into doing it.
Again, she only updated her will when my dad (only child) died so that my sister and I could deal with the estate. She wasn't very communicative about that, either - my sister set up the appointment, but she didn't tell us whether she'd gone to it or not, and it was only when she died recently that we found (to our relief) that she had in fact done it. It's probably not hugely surprising that she refused to share any details of her 3+ years of cancer treatment with us, which also made things way more stressful than necessary (we found a pile of "chemotherapy information for patients and families" leaflets in with her papers when clearing her house - damn it, grandma).
From the sounds of your previous struggles with this/similar issues, it just might not be possible to have this conversation. The relationship with my grandmother around this stuff was very strained - she could be emotionally manipulative and unpredictable, and my sister and I were mostly too scared to ever even try to talk about it with her, especially when it came to things like end of life care and her ability to stay in her own home. We mostly just didn't say anything and sucked up the extra hassle of having her doctors call us frequently wonderining if we had any tips for getting through to her/having to deal with acute crises as and when they came up because she refused to plan - even though it was hard, it was easier than talking to her about it.
The only positive for me has been a steadfast conviction that I am not going to pull any of this older-generation (in my family) secrecy and avoidance bullshit, and I will very much get my own affairs in order as soon as I have any affairs to speak of.
posted by terretu at 1:37 PM on July 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
Again, she only updated her will when my dad (only child) died so that my sister and I could deal with the estate. She wasn't very communicative about that, either - my sister set up the appointment, but she didn't tell us whether she'd gone to it or not, and it was only when she died recently that we found (to our relief) that she had in fact done it. It's probably not hugely surprising that she refused to share any details of her 3+ years of cancer treatment with us, which also made things way more stressful than necessary (we found a pile of "chemotherapy information for patients and families" leaflets in with her papers when clearing her house - damn it, grandma).
From the sounds of your previous struggles with this/similar issues, it just might not be possible to have this conversation. The relationship with my grandmother around this stuff was very strained - she could be emotionally manipulative and unpredictable, and my sister and I were mostly too scared to ever even try to talk about it with her, especially when it came to things like end of life care and her ability to stay in her own home. We mostly just didn't say anything and sucked up the extra hassle of having her doctors call us frequently wonderining if we had any tips for getting through to her/having to deal with acute crises as and when they came up because she refused to plan - even though it was hard, it was easier than talking to her about it.
The only positive for me has been a steadfast conviction that I am not going to pull any of this older-generation (in my family) secrecy and avoidance bullshit, and I will very much get my own affairs in order as soon as I have any affairs to speak of.
posted by terretu at 1:37 PM on July 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
My tip is, find a good family/state lawyer, talk to him or her about the situation, and see if that professional is willing to have the necessary discussions with your parents from an impersonal strictly professional perspective. Let your parents know you'r shopping for someone to help them get their affairs in order, then tell them who you picked and ask them to be available to meet with the lawyer to talk about hiring him/her for what's needed.
This is pretty much how we handled it.
posted by BigLankyBastard at 2:57 PM on July 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
This is pretty much how we handled it.
posted by BigLankyBastard at 2:57 PM on July 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
You may find this NYT article and the site it links to helpful.
posted by leslies at 4:15 PM on July 2, 2015
posted by leslies at 4:15 PM on July 2, 2015
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So I guess what I'm really saying is that you may have to make the best plans you can with your siblings and support your parents as best you can with what they are prepared to tell you. They know you are willing to help them, so if they don't want to talk about it you have to respect that.
posted by crocomancer at 8:45 AM on July 1, 2015