Please tell me what to do next...
March 9, 2012 1:00 AM Subscribe
What's the next step in this relationship? Should I make a move? Why is this so confusing?
[[ Story so far ]]
I've been spending some time with a nice lady: a lunch, a day out at a museum, another day out + shopping, a day at a fair + sitting at a park + dinner with my friends, a dinner + stopping by a place for to see a set of jazz this evening.
Thanks to advice from the hivemind on specifically calling out that tonight was a date when I invited her out. And to keep things simple!
Things went pretty well - we had some laughs. The jazz place was really crowded. I put my arm around her briefly a few times while we struggled to talk through the din.
We went back to her place (she doesn't have car, and I live 20 miles away). I asked to use her bathroom, went up to her place, and afterwards briefly sat on her couch and co-surfed the web for a little bit.
We talked about possibly meeting up tomorrow night - complicated due to a bunch of different things going on related to work.
I left and she walked me to my car. She thanked me for dinner and jazz. We hugged and went our separate ways.
[[ What really happened ]]
The whole evening I was thinking:
1. Should I try to hold her hand while we walk back to the car from dinner?
2. Should I try to put my arm around her while we walk back to the car from dinner?
3. Should I try to kiss her?
None of those happened. Sheez, i'm nearly 30 but I feel like I'm in my teens. And this certainly wouldn't be my first relationship (I've had a 6+ year one!)
Surely she doesn't just think we're friends after so many dates? But at the same time, she doesn't really flirt with me, nor does her body language say "come hither".
[[ The question ]]
I'm not sure what's going to happen tomorrow, if we even meet.
One possibility I'm thinking of is that we'd watch a DVD that I lent to her... and maybe do the couch move kind of thing. But it's not my place so I'm not sure if I can invite my way in like that.
Otherwise, I'm not sure... and then I'll be travelling for the next week and a half starting Saturday.
Someone proposed that I say "I'm interested in your romantically" or words to that effect - but I find that kind of awkward.
Any other thoughts on what the next steps might be?
Please tell me what to do. :)
[[ Story so far ]]
I've been spending some time with a nice lady: a lunch, a day out at a museum, another day out + shopping, a day at a fair + sitting at a park + dinner with my friends, a dinner + stopping by a place for to see a set of jazz this evening.
Thanks to advice from the hivemind on specifically calling out that tonight was a date when I invited her out. And to keep things simple!
Things went pretty well - we had some laughs. The jazz place was really crowded. I put my arm around her briefly a few times while we struggled to talk through the din.
We went back to her place (she doesn't have car, and I live 20 miles away). I asked to use her bathroom, went up to her place, and afterwards briefly sat on her couch and co-surfed the web for a little bit.
We talked about possibly meeting up tomorrow night - complicated due to a bunch of different things going on related to work.
I left and she walked me to my car. She thanked me for dinner and jazz. We hugged and went our separate ways.
[[ What really happened ]]
The whole evening I was thinking:
1. Should I try to hold her hand while we walk back to the car from dinner?
2. Should I try to put my arm around her while we walk back to the car from dinner?
3. Should I try to kiss her?
None of those happened. Sheez, i'm nearly 30 but I feel like I'm in my teens. And this certainly wouldn't be my first relationship (I've had a 6+ year one!)
Surely she doesn't just think we're friends after so many dates? But at the same time, she doesn't really flirt with me, nor does her body language say "come hither".
[[ The question ]]
I'm not sure what's going to happen tomorrow, if we even meet.
One possibility I'm thinking of is that we'd watch a DVD that I lent to her... and maybe do the couch move kind of thing. But it's not my place so I'm not sure if I can invite my way in like that.
Otherwise, I'm not sure... and then I'll be travelling for the next week and a half starting Saturday.
Someone proposed that I say "I'm interested in your romantically" or words to that effect - but I find that kind of awkward.
Any other thoughts on what the next steps might be?
Please tell me what to do. :)
She doesn't think you're just friends, but she's not going to make it so easy for you that she might as well be making the first move for you. What do you exactly expect by "flirtatious, come hither" behavior? Outright telling you to kiss her? (using your words to broach the topic pretty much counts as making the first move) Touching you? (also pretty much counts as making the first move) What can she do? If she's been sitting next to you on the couch, making eye contact, and letting you put your arm around her, those are pretty good situations for you to make your move. If you feel strange just suddenly moving in for a kiss, I'd initiate some flirtatious banter or play footsie first, or something like that. You can do it. Just imagine whatever it is you're waiting for from her, and do it yourself.
posted by quincunx at 1:11 AM on March 9, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by quincunx at 1:11 AM on March 9, 2012 [4 favorites]
I think you should kiss her. Or, if you need a bridging move, say "I would really like to kiss you". Either she's thinking the same thing or she's not, and you don't need a trick or a sales pitch, just action.
Avoid "I'm interested in you romantically" or things that sound like you're unloading a massive burden – at the early stages, you're going for easy and fun and not terms-and-conditions. Kiss her!
posted by carbide at 1:14 AM on March 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
Avoid "I'm interested in you romantically" or things that sound like you're unloading a massive burden – at the early stages, you're going for easy and fun and not terms-and-conditions. Kiss her!
posted by carbide at 1:14 AM on March 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
I think it's kinda awk to jump straight to the kiss, but I'm not the girl in question so what do I know. I like the idea of taking her hand first, and see how she reacts. Anytime I have ever held hands for the first time with someone romantically, kissing has followed in seconds.
posted by cairdeas at 1:21 AM on March 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by cairdeas at 1:21 AM on March 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
I've said this before in these types of questions, but I'll keep repeating it because it worked beautifully on me.
We'd spent a little time together, realised we enjoyed each others company, and then he said, "I'd like to kiss you but I'm nervous about it". It gave me the opening to say something like "bring it on!" (which I did), or if I wasn't comfortable, I could have easily said, "um, no, sorry, I think we're better staying as friends".
The times when guys have just unexpectedly tried to plant their lips on mine were awkward. I really liked the approach of "I'd like to kiss you but..." because I could either eagerly agree or graciously decline.
posted by malibustacey9999 at 2:02 AM on March 9, 2012 [9 favorites]
We'd spent a little time together, realised we enjoyed each others company, and then he said, "I'd like to kiss you but I'm nervous about it". It gave me the opening to say something like "bring it on!" (which I did), or if I wasn't comfortable, I could have easily said, "um, no, sorry, I think we're better staying as friends".
The times when guys have just unexpectedly tried to plant their lips on mine were awkward. I really liked the approach of "I'd like to kiss you but..." because I could either eagerly agree or graciously decline.
posted by malibustacey9999 at 2:02 AM on March 9, 2012 [9 favorites]
A great way to break the ice is to make some kind of physical contact that you are comfortable with, like holding her hand or putting your arm around her, and then complimenting her appearance or stating your attraction to her. This can be a great way to initiate that you are interested in her without having to do "moves" that you are uncomfortable with such as kissing spontaneously, etc. If she responds well, you can move up the playbook by asking for or just going in for a kiss. If she doesn't, be glad it wasn't nearly as awkward as going in for a kiss she wasn't comfortable with.
Good luck!
posted by mungaman at 2:35 AM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
Good luck!
posted by mungaman at 2:35 AM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
Seeing as how your question is dejavu for me and, as the female side of a similar equation, this point is rapidly approaching (at least I sure hope so :) here's what I've been seeing from the gentleman in question and how I've been interpreting it, if the other side of the story might help you gain the confidence to make your move.
We met for drinks a couple of days ago and had as wonderful a time as you describe you had last night. I noticed that he tends to *ping* to check my responses (positive or negative) before proceeding further with his quite subtle flirtations - for example, when ordering his second beer (while I was still more than halfway through my first) he said, oh you're much slower than I am and I answered well that way given our relative sizes I can keep drinking with you this evening but still walk out together (rather than be dead drunk knowing my minuscule capacity) and he laughs and puts his arm out to show a shoulder hug saying "Oh most likely we'd weave our way out all the way home". But sadly enough, said the poor girl, he must have dithered like you and instead I was escorted home politely in a taxi and left at the door.
Yesterday when we met he made his awareness of my physical proximity very clear although it wasn't a date per se since we both had to be elsewhere and muttered as an aside "good thing there's no beer here". I now await the next opportunity to see what happens as he leaves this coming week for a business trip just like you are - from my side, short of grabbing him, I hope I've been able to send clear signals of 'welcome' ;p if he were to lean over and kiss me.
I'm in my 40s and feel as unsure as you do but at the same time what kind of come hither can one do that wouldn't feel ridiculous or unnatural, particularly if there's already a natural rapport ?
I'd say that if she didn't flinch or move away when you'd put your arm around her, you can choose to do as others above have suggested - ask, compliment or just go for it :P
posted by infini at 2:58 AM on March 9, 2012
We met for drinks a couple of days ago and had as wonderful a time as you describe you had last night. I noticed that he tends to *ping* to check my responses (positive or negative) before proceeding further with his quite subtle flirtations - for example, when ordering his second beer (while I was still more than halfway through my first) he said, oh you're much slower than I am and I answered well that way given our relative sizes I can keep drinking with you this evening but still walk out together (rather than be dead drunk knowing my minuscule capacity) and he laughs and puts his arm out to show a shoulder hug saying "Oh most likely we'd weave our way out all the way home". But sadly enough, said the poor girl, he must have dithered like you and instead I was escorted home politely in a taxi and left at the door.
Yesterday when we met he made his awareness of my physical proximity very clear although it wasn't a date per se since we both had to be elsewhere and muttered as an aside "good thing there's no beer here". I now await the next opportunity to see what happens as he leaves this coming week for a business trip just like you are - from my side, short of grabbing him, I hope I've been able to send clear signals of 'welcome' ;p if he were to lean over and kiss me.
I'm in my 40s and feel as unsure as you do but at the same time what kind of come hither can one do that wouldn't feel ridiculous or unnatural, particularly if there's already a natural rapport ?
I'd say that if she didn't flinch or move away when you'd put your arm around her, you can choose to do as others above have suggested - ask, compliment or just go for it :P
posted by infini at 2:58 AM on March 9, 2012
Best practices based on my experiences. Things escalate depending on various factors including how responsive I am and how aggressive he is and whether we're having coffee or cocktails. You could probably start at number 3 or 4 at the beginning of the date and move towards 5 at your own pace.
1. Sitting close - i.e., when we are sitting close enough that we are touching, and neither of us moves, or at least does not immediately move.
2. Light touching on the hand or arm while talking - no flinching or pulling away, huzzah.
3. Holding hands
4. Looking each other in the eye and smiling without talking. That's a direct green light to:
5. Moving in for a light, simple kiss on the mouth.
Go for it - you told this woman you want to date her - and she said yes by going out on dates with you. Chances are quite good that she'll be happy to kiss you back.
posted by bunderful at 4:39 AM on March 9, 2012 [4 favorites]
1. Sitting close - i.e., when we are sitting close enough that we are touching, and neither of us moves, or at least does not immediately move.
2. Light touching on the hand or arm while talking - no flinching or pulling away, huzzah.
3. Holding hands
4. Looking each other in the eye and smiling without talking. That's a direct green light to:
5. Moving in for a light, simple kiss on the mouth.
Go for it - you told this woman you want to date her - and she said yes by going out on dates with you. Chances are quite good that she'll be happy to kiss you back.
posted by bunderful at 4:39 AM on March 9, 2012 [4 favorites]
Arm around shoulder.
Look at her eyes. Look at her mouth. Back to her eyes.
Eyebrow flash and/or head tilt with a smile.
Kiss.
You used the word date and trying for a kiss is expected on a date, so body language should be sufficient to ask her permission.
posted by anaelith at 4:48 AM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
Look at her eyes. Look at her mouth. Back to her eyes.
Eyebrow flash and/or head tilt with a smile.
Kiss.
You used the word date and trying for a kiss is expected on a date, so body language should be sufficient to ask her permission.
posted by anaelith at 4:48 AM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
I told you what to do last time -- try to kiss her, or at least hold her hand -- and you didn't listen. Are you going to listen this time?
Regarding your point that she doesn't seem to flirt with you: do you flirt with her?
You've hung out five times and used the word date this last time, and you still didn't kiss her. Humans are complicated and there are a million possibilities, but really I see two:
You guys just aren't really clicking. There's a reason you haven't felt an opportunity to make a move, and because it hasn't really been there.
You are way, way too in your head and nervous about this. If you ask a girl on multiple dates, it is unambiguous that they are dates, and she keeps going on dates with you, and you feel like you are both having a nice time, she probably wants you to kiss her. Playing that "does she want me to" game in your head is paralyzing; you have to actually take some action to find out. Which is OK. Leaning in for the kiss and seeing how it goes at the end of a successful date (or fifth date) doesn't make you a creep.
posted by J. Wilson at 5:04 AM on March 9, 2012 [5 favorites]
Regarding your point that she doesn't seem to flirt with you: do you flirt with her?
You've hung out five times and used the word date this last time, and you still didn't kiss her. Humans are complicated and there are a million possibilities, but really I see two:
posted by J. Wilson at 5:04 AM on March 9, 2012 [5 favorites]
J. Wilson is right. I'd like to add that if she is not ready for you to kiss her at this point, she may never be ready. What have you got to lose? Go for it in any one of the ways already suggested and find out. If she kisses back...Yahoo! If not, you got your answer...move on. Stop playing games in your head. Live.
posted by txmon at 7:27 AM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by txmon at 7:27 AM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
Smile, compliment, look her in the eyes.
all there is to it.
posted by Ironmouth at 7:46 AM on March 9, 2012
all there is to it.
posted by Ironmouth at 7:46 AM on March 9, 2012
You guys just aren't really clicking. There's a reason you haven't felt an opportunity to make a move, and because it hasn't really been there.
I agree. The temperature is way too low. When you find yourself "co-surfing the web" on a date you need to be making bold steps toward raising the temperature. Be flirty, touchy, etc., but for God's sake do not sit on the couch and co-surf the web together.
posted by jayder at 8:40 AM on March 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
I agree. The temperature is way too low. When you find yourself "co-surfing the web" on a date you need to be making bold steps toward raising the temperature. Be flirty, touchy, etc., but for God's sake do not sit on the couch and co-surf the web together.
posted by jayder at 8:40 AM on March 9, 2012 [3 favorites]
You need to assume that if you've been on multiple dates with you that she wants to kiss you. If she won't kiss you after multiple dates, she's not worth messing with and you can move on and stop wasting your time with her.
So there is no down side to kissing her.
posted by jayder at 8:42 AM on March 9, 2012
So there is no down side to kissing her.
posted by jayder at 8:42 AM on March 9, 2012
Goodness. I'm always the woman on the other end of this. And I can say from experience that if she's gone out on five dates with you she wants you to hold her hand/make a move. She's probably waiting for you to do it.
When the moment strikes you (ie. you're going for a walk, you've just grabbed a coffee together), just hold her hand. If she lets you do that, she might be open to a kiss. Keep your feelers out. If you're not sure, it's perfectly OK to ask if you can kiss her. In fact, it's kind of sweet.
It might help to do something where you're not just going from a car to a restaurant, which allows you the time and space for move-making. Take her to the zoo or the park. Window shopping would be good for this, too.
posted by Miss T.Horn at 8:54 AM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
When the moment strikes you (ie. you're going for a walk, you've just grabbed a coffee together), just hold her hand. If she lets you do that, she might be open to a kiss. Keep your feelers out. If you're not sure, it's perfectly OK to ask if you can kiss her. In fact, it's kind of sweet.
It might help to do something where you're not just going from a car to a restaurant, which allows you the time and space for move-making. Take her to the zoo or the park. Window shopping would be good for this, too.
posted by Miss T.Horn at 8:54 AM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
I'm just the sort of guy to flat-out say "I'm interested in you romantically", but then again there are times my entire repertoire seems to be made of well-played awkward. Combined with a touch of suave. "Suawkward", I call it. (Patent pending.)
You say you find stating your feelings to be kind of awkward. Is that more or less awkward than what you're doing now?
posted by cardioid at 9:15 AM on March 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
You say you find stating your feelings to be kind of awkward. Is that more or less awkward than what you're doing now?
posted by cardioid at 9:15 AM on March 9, 2012 [2 favorites]
You guys hug? Next time, when you're both standing up, wrap your arms around her waist. Hold her close, and arrange yourself so your bodies are in contact as much as possible. Turn your hips slightly and slouch so that your legs fit together, your inner thigh pressed against her hip, your knee between her knees, not grinding, but just touching. Place your hands at the top of her hips, with your thumbs open so you're gently grasping her at the waist. You should be able to feel each other breathing. If she seems comfortable, hold this position for a while. If you're nervous, count to ten, feel her heartbeat, smell her hair.
Then start to pull away. Slide your hands across her back and rest them around her waist, still gentle, but firm, like that's where they belong. Tilt your head towards her and look into her eyes. Smile just a little bit and say something like "you're so beautiful" and then kiss her.
I mean, every woman is different, but on me this move is nigh foolproof.
posted by milk white peacock at 9:18 AM on March 9, 2012 [5 favorites]
Then start to pull away. Slide your hands across her back and rest them around her waist, still gentle, but firm, like that's where they belong. Tilt your head towards her and look into her eyes. Smile just a little bit and say something like "you're so beautiful" and then kiss her.
I mean, every woman is different, but on me this move is nigh foolproof.
posted by milk white peacock at 9:18 AM on March 9, 2012 [5 favorites]
I second milk white peacock
posted by Danithegirl at 11:29 AM on March 9, 2012
posted by Danithegirl at 11:29 AM on March 9, 2012
Best answer: You can't just kiss her without laying the groundwork.
I mean - yes, an unexpected first kiss out of the blue can be great, in theory. But it comes on the first date when there is incredible chemistry, before dinner because you just can't wait. Not on date 6.
You should have been building up such physical tension that both of you can't bear it not to kiss each other any longer.
As you pull away from the hello hug, keep your hand on the small of her back. Hand on the lower back also works well when you lean in close to hear something, or when you are moving through a crowded bar or restaurant. Or at the museum - she's wandered over to another painting, and when you come up next to her you put it there and stand there for a moment.
Brush her hair off her cheek. Pull her coat collar in close to keep her warm and look her in the eye and give her a compliment. Touch her arm, then her knee. Grab her hand quickly when she says something endearing and give in a light squeeze. Take her by the wrist to examine her bracelet, or comment on her small hands or her nail polish.
Sit at the bar and angle toward her so that you thighs are all intertwined. Slide your knee between hers and put your foot on her barstool. Reach across her for a cocktail napkin and put your other arm around her or on her thigh to steady your self. When you get up to go the the bathroom, press up against her back as you walk by or drag your hand across her shoulders. Help her put on her coat and lift her hair out of her collar afterward.
You have to build up this casual touch (and watch her reciprocate, or not) before you slip your hand into hers - usually at a time when it makes sense to do so. Hold hands for the first time when you are hurrying across a crosswalk as the timer clicks down, or working through a crowded space and don't want to lose each other, or she is stepping down off of something and needs a hand to steady herself. Anytime you leave a place and are about to talk a walk is also a natural time to do so.
Once you are comfortable being in each other's physical space, THEN you kiss her. When you are hugging goodbye, look her in the eye for a minute. Cup her face in your hand, smooth your thumb across her cheek. She will make it clear if she wants you to kiss her.
Don't do it out of the blue without building up the physical flirtation first. Don't talk about it. TOUCH HER. FLIRT WITH HER. And then fucking kiss her already because she thinks it's really weird that you haven't yet.
posted by amaire at 12:43 PM on March 9, 2012 [31 favorites]
I mean - yes, an unexpected first kiss out of the blue can be great, in theory. But it comes on the first date when there is incredible chemistry, before dinner because you just can't wait. Not on date 6.
You should have been building up such physical tension that both of you can't bear it not to kiss each other any longer.
As you pull away from the hello hug, keep your hand on the small of her back. Hand on the lower back also works well when you lean in close to hear something, or when you are moving through a crowded bar or restaurant. Or at the museum - she's wandered over to another painting, and when you come up next to her you put it there and stand there for a moment.
Brush her hair off her cheek. Pull her coat collar in close to keep her warm and look her in the eye and give her a compliment. Touch her arm, then her knee. Grab her hand quickly when she says something endearing and give in a light squeeze. Take her by the wrist to examine her bracelet, or comment on her small hands or her nail polish.
Sit at the bar and angle toward her so that you thighs are all intertwined. Slide your knee between hers and put your foot on her barstool. Reach across her for a cocktail napkin and put your other arm around her or on her thigh to steady your self. When you get up to go the the bathroom, press up against her back as you walk by or drag your hand across her shoulders. Help her put on her coat and lift her hair out of her collar afterward.
You have to build up this casual touch (and watch her reciprocate, or not) before you slip your hand into hers - usually at a time when it makes sense to do so. Hold hands for the first time when you are hurrying across a crosswalk as the timer clicks down, or working through a crowded space and don't want to lose each other, or she is stepping down off of something and needs a hand to steady herself. Anytime you leave a place and are about to talk a walk is also a natural time to do so.
Once you are comfortable being in each other's physical space, THEN you kiss her. When you are hugging goodbye, look her in the eye for a minute. Cup her face in your hand, smooth your thumb across her cheek. She will make it clear if she wants you to kiss her.
Don't do it out of the blue without building up the physical flirtation first. Don't talk about it. TOUCH HER. FLIRT WITH HER. And then fucking kiss her already because she thinks it's really weird that you haven't yet.
posted by amaire at 12:43 PM on March 9, 2012 [31 favorites]
Response by poster: Wow, that last answer was very prescriptive. I'm not a very touchy feely person myself - wish I had read that earlier!
posted by StrictlyVague at 1:21 PM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by StrictlyVague at 1:21 PM on March 9, 2012 [1 favorite]
I'm often the woman in the situation. It's partly because I likely give off mixed signals because I can't decide if I want to kiss them. For me, the first kiss works best if it comes at the end of the date and is a very brief kiss on the lips. It works well because then we both get to part ways and I can think about whether I enjoyed the kiss and want to kiss him more. This way, I don't feel social pressure to do any more and the situation often ends with a little awkward excitement (if I end up liking the guy). Plus, if I don't like the guy, I don't ever have to spend more time with him.
In short, give her a quick kiss at the end of the date.
posted by parakeetdog at 1:33 PM on March 9, 2012
In short, give her a quick kiss at the end of the date.
posted by parakeetdog at 1:33 PM on March 9, 2012
Response by poster: Update: We went out to dinner, went back to her place to watch a dvd.
Midway through she got cold and put a blanket over herself, and I moved closer to "share" and put my arm around her. For the rest of the movie.
It was kind of late, and after the movie we snuggled for a bit on the couch, half dozing off, sometimes joking/laughing, just talking about topical stuff. I held her hand. I had both arms around her. I kissed her on the cheek she didn't respond. I told her I'd miss her on my trip, and she said she'd miss me too. [I really wish I had said that I liked her. Oh why didn't I do that!]
It was some real snuggling - nothing risque. About an hour of this later, I ended up in a position where I was facing her, and I went for it. I tried to kiss her on the lips. But she turned away a bit and didn't say anything. I was pretty embarrassed, confused, and didn't say anything either.
By now it was really late and I really had to leave. She walked me to the lobby of her place. We hugged - i tried to hug her straight on, but it end up being a side hug (i just realized that's how its kind of always been.) She wished me well on my trip, I said I'd call her when I got back.
Now, I'm really confused. This doesn't feel like a rejection - although is that coming next?
I guess I have time to think this over, and to wait until I can post my next question.
posted by StrictlyVague at 2:03 AM on March 10, 2012
Midway through she got cold and put a blanket over herself, and I moved closer to "share" and put my arm around her. For the rest of the movie.
It was kind of late, and after the movie we snuggled for a bit on the couch, half dozing off, sometimes joking/laughing, just talking about topical stuff. I held her hand. I had both arms around her. I kissed her on the cheek she didn't respond. I told her I'd miss her on my trip, and she said she'd miss me too. [I really wish I had said that I liked her. Oh why didn't I do that!]
It was some real snuggling - nothing risque. About an hour of this later, I ended up in a position where I was facing her, and I went for it. I tried to kiss her on the lips. But she turned away a bit and didn't say anything. I was pretty embarrassed, confused, and didn't say anything either.
By now it was really late and I really had to leave. She walked me to the lobby of her place. We hugged - i tried to hug her straight on, but it end up being a side hug (i just realized that's how its kind of always been.) She wished me well on my trip, I said I'd call her when I got back.
Now, I'm really confused. This doesn't feel like a rejection - although is that coming next?
I guess I have time to think this over, and to wait until I can post my next question.
posted by StrictlyVague at 2:03 AM on March 10, 2012
You didn't blow this by not saying you like her. Thought patterns like that are destructive and not accurate. You've been clear about your interest.
What is this girl like? Do you even know? You haven't told us, and you should.
In general, at this point in dating, you should be able to kiss the person you're dating. From my perspective, you tried, and she rejected you. Maybe she's too "nice"/nonconfrontational/etc. to tell you no, so she keeps agreeing to dates and hoping you'll get the hint.
The other option I see is that her boundaries are different than those of most people, and she's less comfortable with the physical aspects of dating than most people. Are you willing to deal with that?
At this point, if you're still interested in pursuing things, you might want to try talking with her. Tell her your thoughts and ask her for hers.
posted by J. Wilson at 6:47 AM on March 10, 2012 [1 favorite]
What is this girl like? Do you even know? You haven't told us, and you should.
In general, at this point in dating, you should be able to kiss the person you're dating. From my perspective, you tried, and she rejected you. Maybe she's too "nice"/nonconfrontational/etc. to tell you no, so she keeps agreeing to dates and hoping you'll get the hint.
The other option I see is that her boundaries are different than those of most people, and she's less comfortable with the physical aspects of dating than most people. Are you willing to deal with that?
At this point, if you're still interested in pursuing things, you might want to try talking with her. Tell her your thoughts and ask her for hers.
posted by J. Wilson at 6:47 AM on March 10, 2012 [1 favorite]
Man, what? I'm sorry, but she cuddles on the couch with you for hours and then dodges the kiss? Something is up with this, like maybe she's already partnered and trying to navigate a not-quite-cheating boundary. I'm not saying that's exactly what it is. I don't even think you should bother trying to find out what it is. I think you should gather up your dignity and skip this one.
posted by milk white peacock at 8:01 AM on March 10, 2012 [7 favorites]
posted by milk white peacock at 8:01 AM on March 10, 2012 [7 favorites]
Next time you meet, tell her explicitly that you like her romantically. And if she doesn't react/respond, ask her explicitly what she feels about you. You will get your answer right there. You guys have been hanging around and snuggling enough for it to be a reasonable question to ask directly.
Regarding "Rejection": substitute that with "Not interested" in your thoughts. If someone is not interested in you, they are not worth your interest or time.
posted by xm at 10:26 AM on March 10, 2012 [3 favorites]
Regarding "Rejection": substitute that with "Not interested" in your thoughts. If someone is not interested in you, they are not worth your interest or time.
posted by xm at 10:26 AM on March 10, 2012 [3 favorites]
I'm sorry to hear that it didn't go well.
Do you have a beard? Or chili pepper breath? There are a (very) few reasons why she might really like you and be trying to work up the courage to address some fixable problem which is standing in the way of you guys kissing. It's a bit annoying that she's taking so long to do so, but at this point you're down to a) ask her flat out what the problem is, or b) give up and assume the problem is actually unfixable (she's not that into you).
Again, it's unfortunate that you're doing all the work here, so you might also go with c) decide that even if the problem is fixable for her, you now have a problem because she's so wishy-washy.
posted by anaelith at 10:47 AM on March 10, 2012 [1 favorite]
Do you have a beard? Or chili pepper breath? There are a (very) few reasons why she might really like you and be trying to work up the courage to address some fixable problem which is standing in the way of you guys kissing. It's a bit annoying that she's taking so long to do so, but at this point you're down to a) ask her flat out what the problem is, or b) give up and assume the problem is actually unfixable (she's not that into you).
Again, it's unfortunate that you're doing all the work here, so you might also go with c) decide that even if the problem is fixable for her, you now have a problem because she's so wishy-washy.
posted by anaelith at 10:47 AM on March 10, 2012 [1 favorite]
anaelith put is a little more clearly than I did, but yes, I've had guys tell me to brush before they'll kiss (because I do smoke) - having a quick dental check up if you don't smoke won't hurt either. This isn't something many people would flat out tell you nor, I think, should you want to put them in that awkward spot.
posted by infini at 10:54 AM on March 10, 2012
posted by infini at 10:54 AM on March 10, 2012
Yep, time to talk. The only other thing I can think is, are you sure she's not an evangelical Christian? I'm getting that from the side-hugs and cheek kisses... there are Christian colleges where direct hugs are actually against the rules but you can side-hug all you want.
posted by cairdeas at 11:10 AM on March 10, 2012
posted by cairdeas at 11:10 AM on March 10, 2012
(In other words you can hug/cuddle all you want as long as the genitals aren't lined up)
posted by cairdeas at 11:11 AM on March 10, 2012
posted by cairdeas at 11:11 AM on March 10, 2012
Response by poster: She's not religious - so that rules out the evangelical angle. I also don't think it's an odor/beard issue. (No smoking, I have great oral hygiene.)
She's pretty straight forward, doesn't seem like the person who would play games or having something on the side. She has a 6 day a week 12-16 hour a day job right now. I really like her because she's smart, funny, and (i think) has good communication skills. Maybe she's a little reserved?
My trip is about to start - perfect timing. By the time I can get back online, I'll be able to ask a post a new question, and hopefully by then I'll have some thoughts straightened out.
posted by StrictlyVague at 3:38 PM on March 10, 2012
She's pretty straight forward, doesn't seem like the person who would play games or having something on the side. She has a 6 day a week 12-16 hour a day job right now. I really like her because she's smart, funny, and (i think) has good communication skills. Maybe she's a little reserved?
My trip is about to start - perfect timing. By the time I can get back online, I'll be able to ask a post a new question, and hopefully by then I'll have some thoughts straightened out.
posted by StrictlyVague at 3:38 PM on March 10, 2012
StrictlyVague, it sounds like you did a great job with the physical flirting, and I'm sorry that you have to deal with such mixed signals from this woman.
One thing to think about: how was she taking part is the snuggling? Was it totally passive, like she didn't stop you at any point but also never initiated? Or was she nuzzling closer, taking your hand, putting her arm around you, whatever? The onus is on her not to give mixed signals and to clearly communicate what she's up for, but you might have been able to get a sense of her reluctance ahead of time based on how she interafted with you during the snuggling. The fact that you remember that most of the hugs have been side hugs - not promising in terms of her romantic interest in you.
I think when she turned down the kiss it would have been totally normal and reasonable for you to ask why. While you were still leaned in close, you could have said (gently and with a light and not-upset tone) "What, no kisses?" or "What's wrong?" Or even "I've gotta say, Jane, I feel like you're giving me some mixed signals here." The key is too be playful and light and totally non-accusatory.
That opens the door for her to say, "No, sorry, I kind of have a headache and want to head home. But I think you're great and maybe kisses next time." Or "I'm having a lot of fun hanging out but I'm not sure I'm feeling it on the romantic side of things." Or "My breath smells all garlicky and I'm embarrassed! Do you have any gum?"
You guys just need to get a dialogue going. She is the one who is not following the standard social script and this point, and its okay to ask why.
posted by amaire at 7:37 AM on March 11, 2012 [4 favorites]
One thing to think about: how was she taking part is the snuggling? Was it totally passive, like she didn't stop you at any point but also never initiated? Or was she nuzzling closer, taking your hand, putting her arm around you, whatever? The onus is on her not to give mixed signals and to clearly communicate what she's up for, but you might have been able to get a sense of her reluctance ahead of time based on how she interafted with you during the snuggling. The fact that you remember that most of the hugs have been side hugs - not promising in terms of her romantic interest in you.
I think when she turned down the kiss it would have been totally normal and reasonable for you to ask why. While you were still leaned in close, you could have said (gently and with a light and not-upset tone) "What, no kisses?" or "What's wrong?" Or even "I've gotta say, Jane, I feel like you're giving me some mixed signals here." The key is too be playful and light and totally non-accusatory.
That opens the door for her to say, "No, sorry, I kind of have a headache and want to head home. But I think you're great and maybe kisses next time." Or "I'm having a lot of fun hanging out but I'm not sure I'm feeling it on the romantic side of things." Or "My breath smells all garlicky and I'm embarrassed! Do you have any gum?"
You guys just need to get a dialogue going. She is the one who is not following the standard social script and this point, and its okay to ask why.
posted by amaire at 7:37 AM on March 11, 2012 [4 favorites]
I wonder if this woman just isn't feeling fireworks because you aren't histocompatable.
Much more explained here. Basically, all those times people said it was "chemistry" that attracted them? it's true.
posted by Cathy from Encino at 3:21 AM on March 13, 2012
Much more explained here. Basically, all those times people said it was "chemistry" that attracted them? it's true.
posted by Cathy from Encino at 3:21 AM on March 13, 2012
This thread is closed to new comments.
kissing near lips is in the murky space between romantic lips and platonic cheek so it might be a less anxiety ridden step for you.
posted by saraindc at 1:10 AM on March 9, 2012 [3 favorites]