You suck! No, you! Mom?!?!
May 13, 2008 9:59 AM Subscribe
How do you resolve conflicts in rec sport leagues, minor traffic accidents, etc. - especially when any relevant arbiters or authorities are either late arriving or unlikely to arrive at all.
I guess another way to phrase the question is how do you navigate quickly escalating situations when the stakes are clearly low enough that a group of adults can be reasonably expected to work it out without profanity or fisticuffs? Only they don't.
Specifically, very competitive local rec game (tennis), potential national rec league implications. All small potatoes in the grand scheme, no prize money, almost never any refs - but (for background) people have been banned for TEN YEARS due to faking identities in the national finals. Across five matches last night, we saw spectator interference, blatant gamesmanship, and most unfortunately a racket thrown in anger that accidentally cleared the net and came very close to clocking the opposing player.
That last one was very scary and all parties were appropriately shaken, but the incident only further poisoned an already bad atmosphere, already fueled by a previously ironic public park team vs. country club class war, which is now definitely not. Yes, the rich guys were the ones behaving badly, though I'm not especially proud of my use of the phrase "suck my cock."
We've beaten them handily. They just greased one past us. How do I avoid being sued for breaking some affluent white guy's nose when we see them again in the playoffs?
I guess another way to phrase the question is how do you navigate quickly escalating situations when the stakes are clearly low enough that a group of adults can be reasonably expected to work it out without profanity or fisticuffs? Only they don't.
Specifically, very competitive local rec game (tennis), potential national rec league implications. All small potatoes in the grand scheme, no prize money, almost never any refs - but (for background) people have been banned for TEN YEARS due to faking identities in the national finals. Across five matches last night, we saw spectator interference, blatant gamesmanship, and most unfortunately a racket thrown in anger that accidentally cleared the net and came very close to clocking the opposing player.
That last one was very scary and all parties were appropriately shaken, but the incident only further poisoned an already bad atmosphere, already fueled by a previously ironic public park team vs. country club class war, which is now definitely not. Yes, the rich guys were the ones behaving badly, though I'm not especially proud of my use of the phrase "suck my cock."
We've beaten them handily. They just greased one past us. How do I avoid being sued for breaking some affluent white guy's nose when we see them again in the playoffs?
Player: Turn around, walk back to the service line, and keep your mouth shut.
posted by BozoBurgerBonanza at 10:24 AM on May 13, 2008
posted by BozoBurgerBonanza at 10:24 AM on May 13, 2008
How do I avoid being sued for breaking some affluent white guy's nose when we see them again in the playoffs?
By reminding yourself that being sued could be the least of your worries if you strike someone? Assault charges are another possibility, and no judge will accept "they were cheating and poor sports" as an excuse for violence.
posted by JaredSeth at 10:29 AM on May 13, 2008
By reminding yourself that being sued could be the least of your worries if you strike someone? Assault charges are another possibility, and no judge will accept "they were cheating and poor sports" as an excuse for violence.
posted by JaredSeth at 10:29 AM on May 13, 2008
I've found buying everyone a beer and leaving it for tomorrow usually works.
posted by jeffamaphone at 10:29 AM on May 13, 2008
posted by jeffamaphone at 10:29 AM on May 13, 2008
Response by poster: Are you looking more for advice on how to stay calm yourself, how to calm your teammates, how to keep people you're disagreeing with calm, or more general diplomatic advice?
(On a side note, anytime people care enough about winning to cheat, you really should have a referee or judge of some sort.)
All of the above. I guess I'm really looking for some guidance on a position or posture that can elevate the situation, instead of merely ignoring it. I'm usually very good at this, but every once in a while (say 3 times, lifetime) a situation will just spiral out of control.
Refs would be ideal - but that's the question. What to do when there are no refs or judges? There has to be a way to manage the conflict in between turning the other cheek and throwing down, you know?
posted by NoRelationToLea at 10:51 AM on May 13, 2008
(On a side note, anytime people care enough about winning to cheat, you really should have a referee or judge of some sort.)
All of the above. I guess I'm really looking for some guidance on a position or posture that can elevate the situation, instead of merely ignoring it. I'm usually very good at this, but every once in a while (say 3 times, lifetime) a situation will just spiral out of control.
Refs would be ideal - but that's the question. What to do when there are no refs or judges? There has to be a way to manage the conflict in between turning the other cheek and throwing down, you know?
posted by NoRelationToLea at 10:51 AM on May 13, 2008
Does this rec league have any governing board? An organizer, at least? Those are the people responsible for keeping things civil and dealing with assholes and rules infractions (providing rules actually exist).
posted by Thorzdad at 10:59 AM on May 13, 2008
posted by Thorzdad at 10:59 AM on May 13, 2008
There must be rules of conduct for the league, no? I play in a soccer league and we have a player who I'm embarrassed to say is on my team and cannot control his temper. It's simple. If you get a red card, you're banned for the next match. Fight and you're banned for the season. I can think of someone else who was banned for life from the league and I'm really glad he was.
I simply don't understand it myself. It's just not that important. I think the solution is early intervention. You can tell when someone is starting to get frustrated. At that point, you have to get them to cool down. Can you call a timeout? Sanction people on your own team at least, e.g. if you engage in this, you'll be off the team, or not play in the next match. Get them to recognize when they are beginning to get involved.
If there are no sanctions, there is no cost to the behavior.
posted by idb at 11:33 AM on May 13, 2008
I simply don't understand it myself. It's just not that important. I think the solution is early intervention. You can tell when someone is starting to get frustrated. At that point, you have to get them to cool down. Can you call a timeout? Sanction people on your own team at least, e.g. if you engage in this, you'll be off the team, or not play in the next match. Get them to recognize when they are beginning to get involved.
If there are no sanctions, there is no cost to the behavior.
posted by idb at 11:33 AM on May 13, 2008
Response by poster: idb - there are indeed rules of conduct. Thorzdad - there is indeed a governing board. Unfortunately, the aesthetic of this league, and tennis in general, is very much a gentleman's code, enforced by its participants. Appeals to relevant authorities are purposely made to be very difficult. There are never any officials on site for any match except for regional or national level, so any initiation of the process is almost always dismissed as a he-said/she-said.
Quite simply, there really is no real cost to behaving somewhat poorly or bending the rules left and right. In fact, I'm often surprised the league works as well as it does, nationwide, considering its laissez-faire philosophy. Behaving outrageously badly will earn often severe punishments, but pretty much anything short of that goes.
For example, there's a web page that lists the players who are currently officially sanctioned. There might be a two dozen names on that list - out of thousands, maybe tens of thousands of participants. Enforcement of the rules is clearly not a priority.
In truth, that's why I extended the question to minor car accidents, and pretty much life in general. I've often found there's many situations where Big Brother simply isn't there. Then what?
idb - your example in particular is problematic because the problem child in my specific situation is the captain of the other team and really the only one who could regulate his own behavior. His actual team members are actually pretty good guys for the most part, and were actually quite embarrassed and apologetic for him.
posted by NoRelationToLea at 11:59 AM on May 13, 2008
Quite simply, there really is no real cost to behaving somewhat poorly or bending the rules left and right. In fact, I'm often surprised the league works as well as it does, nationwide, considering its laissez-faire philosophy. Behaving outrageously badly will earn often severe punishments, but pretty much anything short of that goes.
For example, there's a web page that lists the players who are currently officially sanctioned. There might be a two dozen names on that list - out of thousands, maybe tens of thousands of participants. Enforcement of the rules is clearly not a priority.
In truth, that's why I extended the question to minor car accidents, and pretty much life in general. I've often found there's many situations where Big Brother simply isn't there. Then what?
idb - your example in particular is problematic because the problem child in my specific situation is the captain of the other team and really the only one who could regulate his own behavior. His actual team members are actually pretty good guys for the most part, and were actually quite embarrassed and apologetic for him.
posted by NoRelationToLea at 11:59 AM on May 13, 2008
Best answer: Reframe the question from "How do I get my preferred outcome (or the 'right' or 'correct' outcome)" in any particular situation to "How do I get along with this aggressive and somewhat loutish individual who seems to like to bend the rules in his own favor".
Point is, the difficulty seems to be not how to play the game but how to get along with an aggressive and unpleasant individual.
That, obviously, is not an easy situation to deal with but in general it's a lot like dealing with a bully in any sort of situation. You have to stand your own ground to a certain degree because they sense weakness and go for the jugular when they can. But as soon as you're yelling, swearing, getting into a physical confrontation, or anything of that sort the bully has "won" because that is just what he was aiming to do to you.
In short, you've got to walk that fine line between being pushed over and being pushed into being as big a jerk as the bully.
Easier said than done, I know . . .
posted by flug at 2:52 PM on May 13, 2008 [2 favorites]
Point is, the difficulty seems to be not how to play the game but how to get along with an aggressive and unpleasant individual.
That, obviously, is not an easy situation to deal with but in general it's a lot like dealing with a bully in any sort of situation. You have to stand your own ground to a certain degree because they sense weakness and go for the jugular when they can. But as soon as you're yelling, swearing, getting into a physical confrontation, or anything of that sort the bully has "won" because that is just what he was aiming to do to you.
In short, you've got to walk that fine line between being pushed over and being pushed into being as big a jerk as the bully.
Easier said than done, I know . . .
posted by flug at 2:52 PM on May 13, 2008 [2 favorites]
« Older What are Directions for a Board of Directors | Need history-tour services for the Deaf in Boston Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
(On a side note, anytime people care enough about winning to cheat, you really should have a referee or judge of some sort.)
posted by ErWenn at 10:22 AM on May 13, 2008