How much money is my data worth?
January 8, 2007 12:54 PM Subscribe
I sent an almost-new laptop into the service department of a very reputable computer company for repair and they replaced the hard drive on it and threw away all my data without asking. There was nothing wrong with the hard drive. What is a reasonable request on them to make up for this?
I am pretty sure that the hard drive was replaced as a screw-up by the company, and not because there was anything physically wrong with the disk. I have my documents backed up, but I lost a bunch of installed applications and a custom triple-boot setup that took forever to get working right. I'm estimating it will take at least 16 hours to restore the laptop to a similar condition to where it was before, although some applications and data have been lost permanently.
I'm currently thinking of asking them to refund the cost of warranty support for the laptop, which is about $200. Is this reasonable?
I am pretty sure that the hard drive was replaced as a screw-up by the company, and not because there was anything physically wrong with the disk. I have my documents backed up, but I lost a bunch of installed applications and a custom triple-boot setup that took forever to get working right. I'm estimating it will take at least 16 hours to restore the laptop to a similar condition to where it was before, although some applications and data have been lost permanently.
I'm currently thinking of asking them to refund the cost of warranty support for the laptop, which is about $200. Is this reasonable?
Depends on what kind of repair it was. If they were fixing a broken screen, you might be in luck. Otherwise, I bet they'll say it was your responsibility to record the changes you made to it, i.e the steps for the triple boot. If they are truly reputable, they might not charge you for the repair, but I don't see how the warranty is affected by what they did.
posted by mdoar at 1:00 PM on January 8, 2007
posted by mdoar at 1:00 PM on January 8, 2007
I had a similar situation and was, indeed, SOL for the reasons emptyinside mentioned. So, I'm just here to recommend Acronis True Image - very easy backup and, more importantly, very easy restore. It won't help you get your data back this time, but you won't have this issue again.
posted by SampleSize at 1:20 PM on January 8, 2007
posted by SampleSize at 1:20 PM on January 8, 2007
Best answer: I will say that you had the responsibility to back up your data. It's not nice, or fair, but you should not have expected nothing to happen to your data. What if the laptop was damaged in transit? It wouldn't be their fault, but you'd still be SOL with your data.
I say chalk this one up to a life lesson and move on. You are just as culpable in this one, more if you were aware of the risk you took by sending in a computer without a backup.
posted by qwip at 1:29 PM on January 8, 2007
I say chalk this one up to a life lesson and move on. You are just as culpable in this one, more if you were aware of the risk you took by sending in a computer without a backup.
posted by qwip at 1:29 PM on January 8, 2007
Best answer: Right, they usually urge you to backup your data, not just because they might have to replace your hard drive, but because lots of times they put on the default factory image to install drivers, etc, that might fix any other problem you've been having. Even if you didn't send it in for this purpose, that's pretty standard.
I'd look into a solid backup option. I have a big external USB hard drive I use for this purpose. Last time I sent it in, they wiped it with their image, and I just installed my own image right on top of it without missing a beat.
posted by Brian James at 1:30 PM on January 8, 2007
I'd look into a solid backup option. I have a big external USB hard drive I use for this purpose. Last time I sent it in, they wiped it with their image, and I just installed my own image right on top of it without missing a beat.
posted by Brian James at 1:30 PM on January 8, 2007
Best Buy is infamous for doing this, but they do urge you in the strongest terms possible to back up your data before giving them your laptop.
posted by empath at 2:08 PM on January 8, 2007
posted by empath at 2:08 PM on January 8, 2007
because lots of times they put on the default factory image to install drivers, etc, that might fix any other problem you've been having.
Having worked in a high-volume laptop repair depot, I can say that it's actually more of a method of split-half-searching for the core of the issue as efficiently and unambiguously as possible than taking on additional problems.
posted by secret about box at 2:35 PM on January 8, 2007
Having worked in a high-volume laptop repair depot, I can say that it's actually more of a method of split-half-searching for the core of the issue as efficiently and unambiguously as possible than taking on additional problems.
posted by secret about box at 2:35 PM on January 8, 2007
People, notice this: it's not data he's missing. It's applications. He backed up his data, but you often can't back up an application. Just try backing up Microsoft Office. You shouldn't have to have an external drive (though it's a good idea, like Brian James says) just to get warranty service.
posted by koeselitz at 2:35 PM on January 8, 2007
posted by koeselitz at 2:35 PM on January 8, 2007
He backed up his data, but you often can't back up an application. Just try backing up Microsoft Office.
You can't reinstall it from the CD?
posted by secret about box at 2:36 PM on January 8, 2007
You can't reinstall it from the CD?
posted by secret about box at 2:36 PM on January 8, 2007
I spent some time in the hell hole that was Futureshop's tech bench. A note for our noncanadian friends: they're owned by bestbuy and weren't much different even before the acquisition. We were pushed very hard to sell as much service (such as installs, backups & virus removals) as possible for the largely good obvious reason: (mostly) unattended service is nearly free to provide so the margins are disgusting.
This being said: if the warrantly work was done by (or at least acceptted by) a retail store instead of the manufacturer I wold think you'd have a very case if you're willing to be loud, in person, and are able to escalate quickly. At the very least, from the manager's POV, the tech should have called to sell you backup service. They lost a nearly 100% profitable sale.
Depending on the manufacturer they may not have had the option to perform the work in house and a request of the workorder and it's case history and call logs to verify that someone attempted to contact you before risking data loss would also be a good idea. Particularly if the bench made you fill out a release that included options for proactively allowing services if deemed necessary. Futureshop's is basically a a checklist with items like the above mentioned virus and backup services, checkboxes yes/no and a price list.
If they asked you up front for an ok to perform work with a strong likelihood of data destruction and you declined I'd be prepared to get very vocal and demand (asking is a sign of weakness) somewhat more than the value of the warranty.
posted by mce at 2:37 PM on January 8, 2007
This being said: if the warrantly work was done by (or at least acceptted by) a retail store instead of the manufacturer I wold think you'd have a very case if you're willing to be loud, in person, and are able to escalate quickly. At the very least, from the manager's POV, the tech should have called to sell you backup service. They lost a nearly 100% profitable sale.
Depending on the manufacturer they may not have had the option to perform the work in house and a request of the workorder and it's case history and call logs to verify that someone attempted to contact you before risking data loss would also be a good idea. Particularly if the bench made you fill out a release that included options for proactively allowing services if deemed necessary. Futureshop's is basically a a checklist with items like the above mentioned virus and backup services, checkboxes yes/no and a price list.
If they asked you up front for an ok to perform work with a strong likelihood of data destruction and you declined I'd be prepared to get very vocal and demand (asking is a sign of weakness) somewhat more than the value of the warranty.
posted by mce at 2:37 PM on January 8, 2007
Best answer: When I've sent laptops to Dell, they instucted me to remove the HD before shipping to avoid just such a problem.
No help to onalark but for future reference consider doing this.
posted by trinity8-director at 2:40 PM on January 8, 2007
No help to onalark but for future reference consider doing this.
posted by trinity8-director at 2:40 PM on January 8, 2007
When I've sent laptops to Dell, they instucted me to remove the HD before shipping to avoid just such a problem.
No help to onalark but for future reference consider doing this.
In general, you should simply back up irreplacable data and leave the components of the machine where they are. Let the troubleshooters determine whether or not the drive is the cause of the problem, related to it, or has been damaged by it.
Again, in general. This isn't a rule, but it's close.
posted by secret about box at 2:45 PM on January 8, 2007
No help to onalark but for future reference consider doing this.
In general, you should simply back up irreplacable data and leave the components of the machine where they are. Let the troubleshooters determine whether or not the drive is the cause of the problem, related to it, or has been damaged by it.
Again, in general. This isn't a rule, but it's close.
posted by secret about box at 2:45 PM on January 8, 2007
My procedure is to never let the darn thing out of my sight. On site service all the way.
posted by mrbugsentry at 2:55 PM on January 8, 2007
posted by mrbugsentry at 2:55 PM on January 8, 2007
Yea, unfortunately, you're probably SOL. I have a lot of warranties on computers at work and I asked specifically about data recovery in case something happened. Their reply is the data is my property, not their's, and thusly all data backup/recovery is left to me.
posted by jmd82 at 3:01 PM on January 8, 2007
posted by jmd82 at 3:01 PM on January 8, 2007
My procedure is to never let the darn thing out of my sight. On site service all the way.
As long as your local repair shop has a workflow that allows for this—not all do—and you still back up all of your important data, do whatever floats your boat.
Remember, the best way to prevent your data from being lost is being able to replace it.
posted by secret about box at 3:01 PM on January 8, 2007
As long as your local repair shop has a workflow that allows for this—not all do—and you still back up all of your important data, do whatever floats your boat.
Remember, the best way to prevent your data from being lost is being able to replace it.
posted by secret about box at 3:01 PM on January 8, 2007
Their reply is the data is my property, not their's, and thusly all data backup/recovery is left to me.
Neither is their property, of course. I find it silly for a company to imply anything different. The reality that they should explain is that a lot of things can go wrong with a computer, and you can put a massive amount of personal data on it
When things go wrong, data recovery becomes a time sink that interferes with the service center's ability to provide service for the products that was originally sold (i.e., sans personal data) to customers. It's a matter of making sure you can support all the millions of customers you have without doubling the size of your service division, because that will increase costs and may still ultimately lower the turnaround time for repairs. The math on this gets nasty when you start dealing with tens of thousands of computers a day.
That's why computer companies rarely do data rescue/backup/transfer for free.
posted by secret about box at 3:07 PM on January 8, 2007
Neither is their property, of course. I find it silly for a company to imply anything different. The reality that they should explain is that a lot of things can go wrong with a computer, and you can put a massive amount of personal data on it
When things go wrong, data recovery becomes a time sink that interferes with the service center's ability to provide service for the products that was originally sold (i.e., sans personal data) to customers. It's a matter of making sure you can support all the millions of customers you have without doubling the size of your service division, because that will increase costs and may still ultimately lower the turnaround time for repairs. The math on this gets nasty when you start dealing with tens of thousands of computers a day.
That's why computer companies rarely do data rescue/backup/transfer for free.
posted by secret about box at 3:07 PM on January 8, 2007
(Apologies if I'm just babbling shit you guys already know.)
posted by secret about box at 3:08 PM on January 8, 2007
posted by secret about box at 3:08 PM on January 8, 2007
Am I the only one who's worried that they may sell onalark's old hard drive as refurbished, and possibly not wipe his data, or else not thoroughly wipe his data? I hope you had anything sensitive encrypted.
posted by IndigoRain at 7:05 PM on January 8, 2007
posted by IndigoRain at 7:05 PM on January 8, 2007
Am I the only one who's worried that they may sell onalark's old hard drive as refurbished, and possibly not wipe his data, or else not thoroughly wipe his data? I hope you had anything sensitive encrypted.
I read the question to mean that they wiped his existing drive with a factory disk image; the questioner thought the loss of his configuration meant his hard drive was replaced, which I (and other respondents) think is a less likely scenario.
posted by Brian James at 9:35 PM on January 8, 2007
I read the question to mean that they wiped his existing drive with a factory disk image; the questioner thought the loss of his configuration meant his hard drive was replaced, which I (and other respondents) think is a less likely scenario.
posted by Brian James at 9:35 PM on January 8, 2007
Best answer: People, notice this: it's not data he's missing. It's applications. He backed up his data, but you often can't back up an application. Just try backing up Microsoft Office.
The heck are you talking about? You can make an image of the whole drive. This is a 100% reliable backup of the operating system and every installed program. It works with Office just fine, and it would have preserved the poster's elaborate triple boot setup. You don't even need a second/external drive, as apps like Acronis True Image and Norton Ghost can burn the image to CD-R/DVD-R. I think they also support network transfers, so you could e.g. upload it to a server somewhere (there are lots of online backup services now) or you could store it on a friend's computer/laptop.
posted by Rhomboid at 10:18 PM on January 8, 2007
The heck are you talking about? You can make an image of the whole drive. This is a 100% reliable backup of the operating system and every installed program. It works with Office just fine, and it would have preserved the poster's elaborate triple boot setup. You don't even need a second/external drive, as apps like Acronis True Image and Norton Ghost can burn the image to CD-R/DVD-R. I think they also support network transfers, so you could e.g. upload it to a server somewhere (there are lots of online backup services now) or you could store it on a friend's computer/laptop.
posted by Rhomboid at 10:18 PM on January 8, 2007
Response by poster: The hard drive was replaced, at least according to the repair order I received. I didn't send in the laptop with anything resembling a bad hard drive, and I didn't request that it be replaced. The company in question also didn't attempt to contact me before they removed a 6 month-old hard drive that was completely full (90 GB of usage) and threw it in the trash can. I sent the computer in with a display problem, and with a discoloration issue.
Yes, all the data on the hard drive was my responsibility, and I do have 50 GB of it recovered. I just think their attitude for wiping the disk was a bit cavalier, and I'm almost certain there was nothing wrong with the hard drive.
Thanks to everybody who answered so far, I'll update with what I asked from them and what I ended up getting. I know about hard drive ghosting and I don't need to buy a utility to do it for me, I didn't have access to an external hard drive with the capacity to ghost my drive when I sent the computer out for repair.
posted by onalark at 3:04 PM on January 9, 2007
Yes, all the data on the hard drive was my responsibility, and I do have 50 GB of it recovered. I just think their attitude for wiping the disk was a bit cavalier, and I'm almost certain there was nothing wrong with the hard drive.
Thanks to everybody who answered so far, I'll update with what I asked from them and what I ended up getting. I know about hard drive ghosting and I don't need to buy a utility to do it for me, I didn't have access to an external hard drive with the capacity to ghost my drive when I sent the computer out for repair.
posted by onalark at 3:04 PM on January 9, 2007
Best answer: I never let a drive with my data on it out of my possession. If it's a dead drive, I write it off and replace it. Otherwise, the service center has no need for the drive to replace anything else. Pull it before you give them the machine.
Notably, the Thinkpad support guys always told me to do this before I sent machines back to them.
posted by Caviar at 2:12 PM on January 12, 2007
Notably, the Thinkpad support guys always told me to do this before I sent machines back to them.
posted by Caviar at 2:12 PM on January 12, 2007
Response by poster: Lesson learned, I complained to the company in question (Apple) and asked for compensation, but wasn't offered any.
I'll remove my hard drive from my laptop in the future when sending it in to Apple.
posted by onalark at 3:32 PM on January 13, 2007
I'll remove my hard drive from my laptop in the future when sending it in to Apple.
posted by onalark at 3:32 PM on January 13, 2007
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Best of luck however, chances are, you'll spend 16 hours on customer service and hold times... Just cut your losses, get your system up and running.
posted by emptyinside at 12:58 PM on January 8, 2007