Most efficient way to reduce my father's Covid risk at funeral
April 28, 2022 10:20 PM Subscribe
One of my father's close friends just died. My father wants to go to their funeral. I want to support my father, but reduce his risk. What are the things I could focus on that will have the most effect?
We're in South Africa, cases are rapidly rising. My father got his 3rd vax in January.
My father is in his mid eighties and has some co morbidities.
I don't think he should go at all, and I'm pretty sure he would listen to me if I dissuaded him, but that would cause some severe tension with my other siblings and I need to get on with them so I can look after my father in the long term.
I would suggest that he can maybe arrange a visit with his friend's family rather than go to the funeral, but they are probably overwhelmed at the moment, and my father is very shy and a funeral will be much easier for him socially.
The funeral is indoors in a cathedral.
I'm wondering if I can phone the family and ask about Covid protocols, or would that be insensitive? In the invite, they said everyone will be masked. But it's an open invitation so no one knows how many people there will be.
So. To my question. Get my father to wear an n95 mask that fits well?
Try to get a seat near a door?
Remind him not to remove his mask or let it slip down?
He's sort of passive and uninterested in Covid precautions, will follow my advice but only if I'm constantly on his case.
I think he might be more than usually open to warnings right now as my brother has developed complications from a mild bout of Covid.
Honestly I wish I could just tell him I don't want him to go, but he's an adult and gets to make his own choices.
We're in South Africa, cases are rapidly rising. My father got his 3rd vax in January.
My father is in his mid eighties and has some co morbidities.
I don't think he should go at all, and I'm pretty sure he would listen to me if I dissuaded him, but that would cause some severe tension with my other siblings and I need to get on with them so I can look after my father in the long term.
I would suggest that he can maybe arrange a visit with his friend's family rather than go to the funeral, but they are probably overwhelmed at the moment, and my father is very shy and a funeral will be much easier for him socially.
The funeral is indoors in a cathedral.
I'm wondering if I can phone the family and ask about Covid protocols, or would that be insensitive? In the invite, they said everyone will be masked. But it's an open invitation so no one knows how many people there will be.
So. To my question. Get my father to wear an n95 mask that fits well?
Try to get a seat near a door?
Remind him not to remove his mask or let it slip down?
He's sort of passive and uninterested in Covid precautions, will follow my advice but only if I'm constantly on his case.
I think he might be more than usually open to warnings right now as my brother has developed complications from a mild bout of Covid.
Honestly I wish I could just tell him I don't want him to go, but he's an adult and gets to make his own choices.
Are you able to go with him? If so, N95 mask and seat nearest the door. Definitely get him food and water immediately beforehand and bring a cooler if you need to, to keep in the car and take him out there for refreshments. If you can bring a portable urinal, do that too.
Don't phone the family. Just assume you need to take full precautions.
posted by Lyn Never at 10:56 PM on April 28, 2022 [3 favorites]
Don't phone the family. Just assume you need to take full precautions.
posted by Lyn Never at 10:56 PM on April 28, 2022 [3 favorites]
I suspect all you can do these days is put on an N95 AND KEEP IT ON while indoors and/or around other people. No taking it off for air, so someone can hear you, or snacks.
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:10 PM on April 28, 2022 [5 favorites]
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:10 PM on April 28, 2022 [5 favorites]
Masking up is only effective as far as a person is actually comfortable and compliant with using them. So I would bring him an array of different masks to try on and choose whatever is the best combo of effective and comfortable for him, erring on the side of comfortable. If you can get him some masks that he doesn’t see as such a huge pain to wear, you can trust that he will be more likely to go along with your fussing. (I know it’s not fussing but in fact legitimate concern, but you know what I mean.)
Remind him that if he is socially overwhelmed or just wants a break to do so outside and not in a nook or oratory inside the church that might look appealing, due to poor air flow. Depending on the time of the service, you could plan to have a meal with him beforehand, and he could use this as an excuse to defer offers of refreshments (“oh I’m fine, I just had brunch with my kid”) while you use it as a time to remind him of safety protocol and ensure he’s done simple stuff like visited the bathroom and has hand sanitizer in his pocket before he heads off. When you’re shy and grieving it can be really easy to forget things like that.
From the older folks in my family who have attended funerals during this pandemic I’ve learned that I have to unclench somewhat about this specific issue. When you reach a certain age or frailty, you have to constantly balance risk and reward. For some of my relatives, closure and feeling like they have been respectful to the spirit of a loved one is a much better use of their remaining time. For others, focusing on longevity and health is a way of doing that, but it seems like there is a threshold in my family of like, 75 and up where they just shrug and accept the risk. I’ve had a lot more success asking them to be careful about every day things like grocery shopping and choir practice than funerals.
posted by Mizu at 11:51 PM on April 28, 2022 [9 favorites]
Remind him that if he is socially overwhelmed or just wants a break to do so outside and not in a nook or oratory inside the church that might look appealing, due to poor air flow. Depending on the time of the service, you could plan to have a meal with him beforehand, and he could use this as an excuse to defer offers of refreshments (“oh I’m fine, I just had brunch with my kid”) while you use it as a time to remind him of safety protocol and ensure he’s done simple stuff like visited the bathroom and has hand sanitizer in his pocket before he heads off. When you’re shy and grieving it can be really easy to forget things like that.
From the older folks in my family who have attended funerals during this pandemic I’ve learned that I have to unclench somewhat about this specific issue. When you reach a certain age or frailty, you have to constantly balance risk and reward. For some of my relatives, closure and feeling like they have been respectful to the spirit of a loved one is a much better use of their remaining time. For others, focusing on longevity and health is a way of doing that, but it seems like there is a threshold in my family of like, 75 and up where they just shrug and accept the risk. I’ve had a lot more success asking them to be careful about every day things like grocery shopping and choir practice than funerals.
posted by Mizu at 11:51 PM on April 28, 2022 [9 favorites]
Response by poster: To answer the question, I will be taking him to the funeral, so I will be with him.
posted by Zumbador at 11:55 PM on April 28, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by Zumbador at 11:55 PM on April 28, 2022 [1 favorite]
This might sound silly, but if you can afford to, and have them arrive in time, get a bunch of black N95 masks, for him, and also to donate to the funeral.
If it feels more "respectful", he's more likely to wear it at the funeral, and it means his friends can do so too, and if everyone wearing *better* masks , there's less risk.
And the n95 ones have the gap making them easier to speak in.
And yes, being near better outdoor airflow does help also.
Trying to avoid everyone taking off their masks and eating will be the hard bit.
posted by Elysum at 12:54 AM on April 29, 2022 [6 favorites]
If it feels more "respectful", he's more likely to wear it at the funeral, and it means his friends can do so too, and if everyone wearing *better* masks , there's less risk.
And the n95 ones have the gap making them easier to speak in.
And yes, being near better outdoor airflow does help also.
Trying to avoid everyone taking off their masks and eating will be the hard bit.
posted by Elysum at 12:54 AM on April 29, 2022 [6 favorites]
If the deceased was also eighty-something, there’s other folks in this same boat. What about streaming the proceedings? Do you know the family well enough to propose it? You can deal with the venue, e-vites, etc. and pay for it.
posted by carmicha at 1:10 AM on April 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by carmicha at 1:10 AM on April 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
Cathedral is good (sounds like some air flow). But if you are choosing between right by the door and center aisle vs off more to the edge, you might go for the latter to reduce a lot of people walking by (inevitably some without masks) and extra talking at close range.
posted by slidell at 1:13 AM on April 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by slidell at 1:13 AM on April 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
avoiding mask-down activities like eating and drinking
This is an important point to stress and stress again - a lot of people seem to treat eating and drinking like magic activities during which you can't get infected or infect anyone. And other people have trouble with the peer pressure of everyone else taking off their mask to eat or drink, and people there might say things like why isn't he eating or drinking, it's fine, everyone else is doing it...
If he does get thirsty or hungry - what should his plan of action be?
Also consider whether your father is likely to take off his mask at times "so people can hear him better", especially at an event that might be crowded and loud. If you think he might, do some practice with him to show him how it really doesn't make much difference, and that it's the right thing to do to say no when other people tell him to take it off.
If you think he might have trouble dealing with peer pressure, you could suggest some lines to him ("I promised my daughter I'd keep it on", "I've got condition X so I have to be careful", etc.)
posted by trig at 5:07 AM on April 29, 2022 [4 favorites]
This is an important point to stress and stress again - a lot of people seem to treat eating and drinking like magic activities during which you can't get infected or infect anyone. And other people have trouble with the peer pressure of everyone else taking off their mask to eat or drink, and people there might say things like why isn't he eating or drinking, it's fine, everyone else is doing it...
If he does get thirsty or hungry - what should his plan of action be?
Also consider whether your father is likely to take off his mask at times "so people can hear him better", especially at an event that might be crowded and loud. If you think he might, do some practice with him to show him how it really doesn't make much difference, and that it's the right thing to do to say no when other people tell him to take it off.
If you think he might have trouble dealing with peer pressure, you could suggest some lines to him ("I promised my daughter I'd keep it on", "I've got condition X so I have to be careful", etc.)
posted by trig at 5:07 AM on April 29, 2022 [4 favorites]
The N95 by BNX, preferably "fish-style" tri-fold in black, is available from Home Depot and other places.
True N95s have behind-head loops and don't "slip down" unless you force it down or have fitment problems. And the "fish style" has a better seal for top/bottom than the normal "fold-flat" style
posted by kschang at 5:16 AM on April 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
True N95s have behind-head loops and don't "slip down" unless you force it down or have fitment problems. And the "fish style" has a better seal for top/bottom than the normal "fold-flat" style
posted by kschang at 5:16 AM on April 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
I don't think he should go at all, and I'm pretty sure he would listen to me if I dissuaded him, but that would cause some severe tension with my other siblings and I need to get on with them so I can look after my father in the long term.
I don’t want your dad to attend this funeral either. Why would his staying away cause problems with your siblings? This is not a “must-attend” situation.
posted by BostonTerrier at 9:22 AM on April 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
I don’t want your dad to attend this funeral either. Why would his staying away cause problems with your siblings? This is not a “must-attend” situation.
posted by BostonTerrier at 9:22 AM on April 29, 2022 [1 favorite]
An additional datapoint for well-intentioned recommenders of specific N95 masks: the asker is in South Africa. We do not have easily accessible sources for inexpensive and genuine N95 masks.
There are plenty available through our local Amazon equivalent, but I have strong concerns that they're all counterfeits. The main concern with counterfeits as far as I understand it is that the fit may be decent but the filtration medium inside may be substandard. Positive reviews mean absolutely nothing; unless a lay person has specialised equipment for testing the performance of filtration medium, they have absolutely no way to tell other buyers whether the product is legitimate.
I have found various legitimate medical supply shops which have real masks, but they are expensive and in relatively short supply. I have no personal recommendations because I haven't attempted to buy any of these, opting instead to wear a (very) tightly-fitted fabric mask on top of a surgical mask for additional nonwoven filtration (these I have more confidence in, since I can get them from a pharmacy).
I am not a medical professional and I don't like to be a downer / worrywart, but please don't assume that an N95 mask from Takealot is going to be better / safer.
(If anyone is in South Africa and does have a specific source to recommend, please do! To the best of my knowledge, Korean KF94 masks are seldom counterfeited, and it is possible to get them here from specialised suppliers, but they are also pricey.)
posted by confluency at 4:53 AM on April 30, 2022 [1 favorite]
There are plenty available through our local Amazon equivalent, but I have strong concerns that they're all counterfeits. The main concern with counterfeits as far as I understand it is that the fit may be decent but the filtration medium inside may be substandard. Positive reviews mean absolutely nothing; unless a lay person has specialised equipment for testing the performance of filtration medium, they have absolutely no way to tell other buyers whether the product is legitimate.
I have found various legitimate medical supply shops which have real masks, but they are expensive and in relatively short supply. I have no personal recommendations because I haven't attempted to buy any of these, opting instead to wear a (very) tightly-fitted fabric mask on top of a surgical mask for additional nonwoven filtration (these I have more confidence in, since I can get them from a pharmacy).
I am not a medical professional and I don't like to be a downer / worrywart, but please don't assume that an N95 mask from Takealot is going to be better / safer.
(If anyone is in South Africa and does have a specific source to recommend, please do! To the best of my knowledge, Korean KF94 masks are seldom counterfeited, and it is possible to get them here from specialised suppliers, but they are also pricey.)
posted by confluency at 4:53 AM on April 30, 2022 [1 favorite]
Regarding the funeral: I am extremely conservative in my COVID risk-taking and I too would not be happy to have an elderly relative attend an indoor funeral --especially since we're heading into the fifth wave. But I have had to come to terms with my own parents (who are two decades younger) making their own decisions according to their own risk tolerance, and doing my best to support them (they did both get COVID in December, but in a much more risky situation than this).
A seat by the door to maximise ventilation, plus the best mask you can get your dad to wear, plus encouragement to talk outside the church afterwards and not linger in an indoor space, may be the best you can do here if he is insistent on going. Assuming that the cathedral is an old-style building, I am optimistic that it has a very high ceiling and will have a large volume of air proportional to the number of people inside. Honestly this sounds safer to me than arranging a private visit with the family indoors in a normal residential home, especially since the latter situation is much more likely to devolve into informal maskless indoor talking, eating and drinking for an extended period of time. A formal funeral inside a church has an end, and in my previous church-going experience people tend to talk outside rather than inside afterwards.
posted by confluency at 5:03 AM on April 30, 2022 [1 favorite]
A seat by the door to maximise ventilation, plus the best mask you can get your dad to wear, plus encouragement to talk outside the church afterwards and not linger in an indoor space, may be the best you can do here if he is insistent on going. Assuming that the cathedral is an old-style building, I am optimistic that it has a very high ceiling and will have a large volume of air proportional to the number of people inside. Honestly this sounds safer to me than arranging a private visit with the family indoors in a normal residential home, especially since the latter situation is much more likely to devolve into informal maskless indoor talking, eating and drinking for an extended period of time. A formal funeral inside a church has an end, and in my previous church-going experience people tend to talk outside rather than inside afterwards.
posted by confluency at 5:03 AM on April 30, 2022 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks confluency that's very useful. I got some n95s from Takelot but I've been doubtful about them.
This helps me to rather focus on rather finding a way to combine a cloth mask with a surgical mask in a way that's comfortable and secure.
posted by Zumbador at 9:20 AM on April 30, 2022
This helps me to rather focus on rather finding a way to combine a cloth mask with a surgical mask in a way that's comfortable and secure.
posted by Zumbador at 9:20 AM on April 30, 2022
In case it's helpful, this kf-94 seller might ship to South Africa (not sure how much it costs or how long it takes, though). I found them originally through a recommendation here.
posted by trig at 9:28 AM on April 30, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by trig at 9:28 AM on April 30, 2022 [1 favorite]
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Assume that all indoor spaces are contaminated, even though there is no-one with him in the room at the time.
posted by ianK at 10:37 PM on April 28, 2022 [10 favorites]