support when estranged elder parents are suddenly impoverished
March 31, 2022 4:35 PM Subscribe
Is there a support group for this?
Therapy helps but I still feel like the only person going through this.
My parents are in their late 60s. I'm the oldest child, a daughter, single, no kids, living closer to them than my sibling does.
I've long suspected their retirement plans were not well funded. But I recently found out they have no retirement fund, no savings, no assets, not even the house they raised us in, and are not eligible for Social Security or Medicare. They are unwilling to talk about it. They are still living something close to the middle class lifestyle they raised me and my sibling in, using gig work and entry level retail to pay rent and bills. I don't know how long this can last.
I don't know how to plan for the future. My mental health is not great and would plummet if I had to help them in person. I'm currently seeing them at family gatherings twice a year and texting a bit in between, and that's enough. My finances definitely can't handle paid care. My sibling is more willing to help in terms of taking my parents in when the time comes, but I can't fathom the cost of regular healthcare for uninsured no-Medicare elders, much less if there was an emergency or a chronic condition or a need for help with daily tasks.
None of the support groups I can find seems to fit.
I guess the only people who could understand are those who are also related to my parents. My sibling has heard me explain the bean-spill, but tells me I must be mistaken. Sibling is completely onboard with my parents' narrative that they haven't retired because they simply enjoy working and have great prospects. My extended family don't understand what is going on. Because again, my parents won't talk about it, are pretending to be comfortably middle class, and have sworn me to secrecy after the accidental bean-spill.
The extended family didn't understand what went on when I was growing up. The book Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents is helping me with that, as well as years of therapy, ongoing. Extended family don't understand why I have low contact with my parents now. Extended family are sometimes great, very present and reliable and comforting. And sometimes they blame my choice to be estranged for how my parents act toward them (complaining about me, clinging, lashing out, distancing), and want me to solve my parents' behavior.
Friends my age are going through the thing where their parents are becoming elders. But I don't know anyone who doesn't at least have Social Security and Medicare, usually plus a good bit more. I don't know anyone else who can only stand to be around their parents for a couple of hours, and then only with others also around.
From my reading, most people who don't have Social Security and Medicare are new immigrants or domestic workers. I'm guessing what happened is that my dad's employer for his long, middle-class career somehow didn't pay FICA. The employer is defunct now. But it's not like my parents are new immigrants who could look to an immigrant community for help. It's not like they worked their whole lives as domestic workers so they'd have built up a community of those who know their finances are very modest. The suddenness of this and the layer of secrecy are the hardest things for me. I feel very alone.
My parents are in their late 60s. I'm the oldest child, a daughter, single, no kids, living closer to them than my sibling does.
I've long suspected their retirement plans were not well funded. But I recently found out they have no retirement fund, no savings, no assets, not even the house they raised us in, and are not eligible for Social Security or Medicare. They are unwilling to talk about it. They are still living something close to the middle class lifestyle they raised me and my sibling in, using gig work and entry level retail to pay rent and bills. I don't know how long this can last.
I don't know how to plan for the future. My mental health is not great and would plummet if I had to help them in person. I'm currently seeing them at family gatherings twice a year and texting a bit in between, and that's enough. My finances definitely can't handle paid care. My sibling is more willing to help in terms of taking my parents in when the time comes, but I can't fathom the cost of regular healthcare for uninsured no-Medicare elders, much less if there was an emergency or a chronic condition or a need for help with daily tasks.
None of the support groups I can find seems to fit.
I guess the only people who could understand are those who are also related to my parents. My sibling has heard me explain the bean-spill, but tells me I must be mistaken. Sibling is completely onboard with my parents' narrative that they haven't retired because they simply enjoy working and have great prospects. My extended family don't understand what is going on. Because again, my parents won't talk about it, are pretending to be comfortably middle class, and have sworn me to secrecy after the accidental bean-spill.
The extended family didn't understand what went on when I was growing up. The book Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents is helping me with that, as well as years of therapy, ongoing. Extended family don't understand why I have low contact with my parents now. Extended family are sometimes great, very present and reliable and comforting. And sometimes they blame my choice to be estranged for how my parents act toward them (complaining about me, clinging, lashing out, distancing), and want me to solve my parents' behavior.
Friends my age are going through the thing where their parents are becoming elders. But I don't know anyone who doesn't at least have Social Security and Medicare, usually plus a good bit more. I don't know anyone else who can only stand to be around their parents for a couple of hours, and then only with others also around.
From my reading, most people who don't have Social Security and Medicare are new immigrants or domestic workers. I'm guessing what happened is that my dad's employer for his long, middle-class career somehow didn't pay FICA. The employer is defunct now. But it's not like my parents are new immigrants who could look to an immigrant community for help. It's not like they worked their whole lives as domestic workers so they'd have built up a community of those who know their finances are very modest. The suddenness of this and the layer of secrecy are the hardest things for me. I feel very alone.
Edit: E.g. There's a home in Woodburn right now, that's about $1200/mo via mortgage loan on Craigslist. It'd be purchased in a couple years, then if they truly need outside support, they may just be able to say, "State, please supply support." I believe if you qualify for MC by age, it legally cannot be taken away.
posted by firstdaffodils at 5:15 PM on March 31, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by firstdaffodils at 5:15 PM on March 31, 2022 [1 favorite]
AlAnon might be helpful if there's a group nearby. It's for people who are worried about someone else's drinking, but you will both have the same goal of ultimately having to accept that other adults have to face the consequences of their own actions.
posted by bleep at 5:30 PM on March 31, 2022 [4 favorites]
posted by bleep at 5:30 PM on March 31, 2022 [4 favorites]
r/JustNOFamily
Or one of the associated subreddits like JustNoMIL (includes moms, steps, egg donors, various female "parental" figures", etc, not just MILs), JustNoFIL (includes dads, steps, sperm donors, various male "parental figures", etc, not just FILS)... and the like, if they fit.
Seriously. I know it's Reddit. But this is one of the useful parts, especially if you read the rules in the sidebar and wander through some recent posts before posting your own thing. I strongly recommend that if you already use Reddit, you make another account just for this stuff - and be cautious about what details you share - to protect your privacy. Your story is going to be familiar to a great many people there - and they have some pretty darn good advice.
posted by stormyteal at 6:46 PM on March 31, 2022 [6 favorites]
Or one of the associated subreddits like JustNoMIL (includes moms, steps, egg donors, various female "parental" figures", etc, not just MILs), JustNoFIL (includes dads, steps, sperm donors, various male "parental figures", etc, not just FILS)... and the like, if they fit.
Seriously. I know it's Reddit. But this is one of the useful parts, especially if you read the rules in the sidebar and wander through some recent posts before posting your own thing. I strongly recommend that if you already use Reddit, you make another account just for this stuff - and be cautious about what details you share - to protect your privacy. Your story is going to be familiar to a great many people there - and they have some pretty darn good advice.
posted by stormyteal at 6:46 PM on March 31, 2022 [6 favorites]
Not a support group suggestion, but I think an important step in helping you navigate this emotionally is to learn more facts about it. If you can't get more of the facts from your parents, which could understandably be the case, it may be worth finding someone you can consult with who has professional expertise on what kinds of financial/health care support is available in the state/locality that your parents live in. Prefacing this with I have no particular expertise, but I didn't think it was possible to not qualify for Medicare (unless you were not a citizen, as you mentioned). And if your employer didn't pay FICA, does that really mean you have no eligibility for any social security coverage at all? I don't know the answer to these questions, but your post sounds like you don't know for sure either, and knowing the answers would help you, I'm sure. Also, if it does turn out to be true that your parents will not be able to avail themselves of these federal programs, what is available for them in their state?
And I want to emphasize, I'm not saying you should figure this out to solve the problem for them. I'm saying that knowing more about the reality of this situation can help ease your anxiety about it, as well as help you think through what you may or may not be willing or able to take on in the future.
posted by leticia at 6:55 PM on March 31, 2022 [4 favorites]
And I want to emphasize, I'm not saying you should figure this out to solve the problem for them. I'm saying that knowing more about the reality of this situation can help ease your anxiety about it, as well as help you think through what you may or may not be willing or able to take on in the future.
posted by leticia at 6:55 PM on March 31, 2022 [4 favorites]
If you're parents are us citizens, when their income and assets drop low enough they will qualify for medicaid. Medicaid also covers long term care (nursing homes). Some states have decent home based community services, it may or may not be an actual useful resource for paid assistance. In IL people on Medicaid over 60 can get up to somewhere close to 4 hours a day a few times a week for day time chores and things like grocery shopping. Meals on Wheels is also a thing.
It doesn't solve housing issues, but it will be helpful in the long term.
posted by AlexiaSky at 8:10 PM on March 31, 2022 [11 favorites]
It doesn't solve housing issues, but it will be helpful in the long term.
posted by AlexiaSky at 8:10 PM on March 31, 2022 [11 favorites]
I don’t know your parents’ situation around Medicare, but if they don’t get it for free they should be able to buy it for a cheaper monthly premium than many other plans.
posted by mismatched at 8:12 PM on March 31, 2022
posted by mismatched at 8:12 PM on March 31, 2022
It sounds like you have a difficult relationship with your parents. Is it possible they are lying to you or manipulating you for sympathy and to get your attention? If your dad had a long, typical career, have you seen anything from the IRS confirming he has no social security benefits? The fact that you can’t find anyone else in this situation and that you are trying to pull away from them makes me think they are not being entirely transparent with you.
posted by bluedaisy at 8:44 PM on March 31, 2022 [18 favorites]
posted by bluedaisy at 8:44 PM on March 31, 2022 [18 favorites]
my dad's employer for his long, middle-class career somehow didn't pay FICA
I would be skeptical of anybody with a work history like that having inadequate credits with social security. It's an unrealistic scenario.
posted by LoveHam at 4:11 AM on April 1, 2022 [8 favorites]
I would be skeptical of anybody with a work history like that having inadequate credits with social security. It's an unrealistic scenario.
posted by LoveHam at 4:11 AM on April 1, 2022 [8 favorites]
My sibling is more willing to help in terms of taking my parents in when the time comes [...]
Well, this is huge. If your sibling is willing to potentially take them in, that's one big piece of it. And then as others have said, the health insurance part is likely not as dire as it may seem. That's not to say that health care is not a big problem in the US, it absolutely is. But there is probably some way for them to get coverage.
However it sounds very vexing in the sense that your parents accidentally let some information slip, but far from the whole picture. Some of what they are telling you really doesn't sound that plausible. If they have some shame about their situation-- a common reason why people obfuscate like this--they are not going to tell you much more. I wonder if there is someone else they can talk to. I have a family member who volunteers with low-income seniors in her state, helping them with taxes and other issues. Public libraries and senior centers in their area might be able to put your parents in contact with resources like that. (I have seen announcements from my own public library inviting seniors to come in for free financial planning talks and things.)
It sounds like the situation is somewhat hopeful because your parents, while they almost certainly have been bullshitting you to some extent, have a lot of initiative if they are putting part-time jobs together and things like that. They may be able to turn some of that towards actual planning, but possibly better with someone who is not a family member.
posted by BibiRose at 6:42 AM on April 1, 2022
Well, this is huge. If your sibling is willing to potentially take them in, that's one big piece of it. And then as others have said, the health insurance part is likely not as dire as it may seem. That's not to say that health care is not a big problem in the US, it absolutely is. But there is probably some way for them to get coverage.
However it sounds very vexing in the sense that your parents accidentally let some information slip, but far from the whole picture. Some of what they are telling you really doesn't sound that plausible. If they have some shame about their situation-- a common reason why people obfuscate like this--they are not going to tell you much more. I wonder if there is someone else they can talk to. I have a family member who volunteers with low-income seniors in her state, helping them with taxes and other issues. Public libraries and senior centers in their area might be able to put your parents in contact with resources like that. (I have seen announcements from my own public library inviting seniors to come in for free financial planning talks and things.)
It sounds like the situation is somewhat hopeful because your parents, while they almost certainly have been bullshitting you to some extent, have a lot of initiative if they are putting part-time jobs together and things like that. They may be able to turn some of that towards actual planning, but possibly better with someone who is not a family member.
posted by BibiRose at 6:42 AM on April 1, 2022
Based on what you've written, I don't think your parents are reliable reporters of their own situation. There's a strong odor of manipulation around this, even if it's true that your parents have been royally screwed by their employer.
If you really want to help sort this out, I'd start with your local Area Agency on the Aging.
posted by stowaway at 7:32 AM on April 1, 2022 [10 favorites]
If you really want to help sort this out, I'd start with your local Area Agency on the Aging.
posted by stowaway at 7:32 AM on April 1, 2022 [10 favorites]
From my reading, most people who don't have Social Security and Medicare are new immigrants or domestic workers. I'm guessing what happened is that my dad's employer for his long, middle-class career somehow didn't pay FICA.
There are quite a few jobs that don't pay into Social Security. Teachers for example. My mom is 9 quarters short at 73. She considered getting a part time job but her teacher retirement is ok.
But anyways, if he was in a profession that had some kind of union that opted out of FICA contributions, and then his pensions were poorly managed or went defunct, it's very possible.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:30 AM on April 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
There are quite a few jobs that don't pay into Social Security. Teachers for example. My mom is 9 quarters short at 73. She considered getting a part time job but her teacher retirement is ok.
But anyways, if he was in a profession that had some kind of union that opted out of FICA contributions, and then his pensions were poorly managed or went defunct, it's very possible.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:30 AM on April 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
Why do you think they are not eligible for Medicare? The hospitalization portion, Part A is free. It only needs signing up. Part B, outpatient, and Part D, prescription do cost, though there are many Advantage plans that roll all parts into one policy and are usually more affordable. For lower-income there may be no or low cost.
For very low-income, Medicaid-eligible 65 and older are what's called"dual-eligible". There are special policies for NO COST for this group.
Are they undocumented? That's the only reason I can think of where a resident 65 or older would not be eligible.
posted by citygirl at 7:01 PM on April 1, 2022 [2 favorites]
For very low-income, Medicaid-eligible 65 and older are what's called"dual-eligible". There are special policies for NO COST for this group.
Are they undocumented? That's the only reason I can think of where a resident 65 or older would not be eligible.
posted by citygirl at 7:01 PM on April 1, 2022 [2 favorites]
I know this is more complex than just saying this, but I wanted to say that you do not have to take care of your parents. It is alright not to take care of your parents. Single, married, with kids, without kids, nearby, far away - you do not have to take them in, you do not have to be their main caretaker, especially given how they treat you and raised you. If you were raised in a family where you were never allowed to say no, I can relate to the panic of being forced back again. Folks raised by borderline or narcissist parents talk about this dynamic a lot.
Do not take on power of attorney, medical power of attorney. Take care of yourself.
posted by Geameade at 6:48 AM on April 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
Do not take on power of attorney, medical power of attorney. Take care of yourself.
posted by Geameade at 6:48 AM on April 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
Source: Nearly a caregiver, spoke extensively with someone who provided care in Oregon.
That situation sucks and I'm sorry. You're never alone.
posted by firstdaffodils at 4:57 PM on March 31, 2022 [2 favorites]