How does this scam work?

March 9, 2020 12:56 PM

Somebody's making a very inept attempt to scam me. I don't even understand how it's supposed to work.

I'm a dealer in rare books. I recently got an inquiry from someone who claimed to be interested in some of my books. He said I didn't need to worry about shipping because he has a "personal freight forwarder" who would pick the books up. That seemed weird to me but I continued corresponding with him. Eventually I got this rather garbled tale:

***********************

Hi,

Apologies for my delays in getting back to you.

The total cost of my order is fine but I have just been informed by my freight forwarder that he cannot receive payment via credit or debit card at the moment. So I want you to help me process additional CAD$1,580 on my credit card and sent to my freight forwarder who is going to pick up the merchandise from you.

The additional CAD$1,580 that will processed on my credit card and sent to my freight forwarder is for the shipping of merchandise in your store plus some other goods. Also, I am compensating you with the sum of CAD$150 for your time and transfer fee. Please note that I should have given the shipping agency my credit card to deduct the shipping fees but he told me he doesn't have the facilities to charge or debit credit card at the moment, so that is why I bring my vote of confidence in you.

Below are the charges you will make on my credit card:

Order fee: (CAD$2,528)
Agent fee with shipping fare: (CAD$1,580)
Transfer fee plus your compensation: (CAD$150)
Total: (CAD$4,258.00) = Current rate in USD is US$3,171.10

Please do get back to me if you are in office, so I can forward my credit card information to you for process, then you can transfer the shipping fees to my agent and let me know when the order will be ready for pick up.

I look forward to hearing back from you.

Best Regards,

**********************

My question is, how does this scam work? He's supposedly giving me his credit card. The intention is obviously to get my credit card info, access to my bank account, or money from me in some way. I'm very curious to know exactly how this person is planning to ruin my day. For the record, it's not going to happen. Thanks!

posted by Joan Rivers of Babylon to Computers & Internet (19 answers total)

It's a stolen credit card, they want you to run the stolen credit card and send cash or a money order to their "freight forwarder" (aka themselves). The CC processor eventually claws the money back from you, and the scammer walks away with $1.5k.
posted by muddgirl at 12:59 PM on March 9, 2020 [41 favorites]

Just a guess, but I'd expect that any credit card info he gives you will be bogus. You're correct in assuming he's just trying to get your info.

If it were me, I'd tell him to send his agent with cash money, no checks, no money orders. Then check any bills with one of those pens used by stores to check for counterfeits. Before I gave him anything
posted by qurlyjoe at 1:02 PM on March 9, 2020

Yeah, any time they want you to reimburse an extra amount it is so they can then have the original payment go poof in your bank account. They want you to hand the other person cash.

You see this a lot when they send a check but it's for way too much and they want you to reimburse the remainder but keep a "small amount" for yourself.

Also, I am compensating you with the sum of CAD$150 for your time and transfer fee.

That's the "oh look, free money!" hook.
posted by OnTheLastCastle at 1:05 PM on March 9, 2020 [5 favorites]

Response by poster: What would be the most creative and fulfilling way to tell this individual to go fuck him/herself?
posted by Joan Rivers of Babylon at 1:09 PM on March 9, 2020 [7 favorites]

What would be the most creative and fulfilling way to tell this individual to go fuck him/herself?

"I am only able to provide you funds in pennies. But for your trouble, I am also willing to give you two 3 oz. bottles of Purell. The bottles expired in 2010 but still probably better than nothing."
posted by Constance Mirabella at 1:13 PM on March 9, 2020 [17 favorites]

You can waste their time by engaging with them and leading them on, like this writer did.
posted by yearly at 1:13 PM on March 9, 2020 [2 favorites]

Yes, and add more fun to it by giving yourself a great name. There was one guy who replied to a scammer (there are lots of sites btw, just google scambaiter) by saying, "Hi scammer, I am intrigued by your offer. My name is Clint Eastwood." And the scammer responded with "Hi, Clint, nice to meet you! ..."
posted by Melismata at 1:22 PM on March 9, 2020 [1 favorite]

The first 6 digits of the credit card number can be plugged into this webpage to tell you which bank issued the card. You can notify them that you're being scammed, and ask them if it has been reported stolen. I don't know what, if anything, they can tell you, but they should accept your report and ideally notify the victim.

You can report the scammer's email address, traditionally to abuse@[the user's domain, e.g. gmail.com]. Send them the full email with headers.

You can call the cops; I don't know if they'll get out of bed for a crime that fails to come to completion like this, but there may well be a detective working these kinds of cases. Canada may have some kind of

You can notify other book dealers; I always hear about book dealers having some social communities online that get used as backchannels for tracking rare book thieves who steal from one dealer and try to sell to another, etc. Book dealers are as good a target as any for this scam because you do phone business, you are generally independent operators, and you have high-value items that you're eager to unload.

And yes, most importantly, you can jerk them around. But unlike a common email scammer, this one expects you to be moderately intelligent, so they may get spooked easily. If I were you, I'd come off as greedy and difficult, but ultimately willing to do it.
posted by Sunburnt at 1:24 PM on March 9, 2020 [26 favorites]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance-fee_scam#Online_sales_and_rentals
posted by Monochrome at 1:28 PM on March 9, 2020

Response by poster: It's tempting to waste a bunch of my time fucking with this idiot, but a) life is too short, and b) because I'm a dealer, my contact information and name are freely available, and I don't really want to enrage him too much. As a compromise solution, I've just sent him this email (he had previously given me an address in Fiji) !?:

Hello Victor -

Thank you for the information. It's unfortunate that your shipper is unable to accept either debit or credit cards.

However, as it turns out, that shouldn't be a problem. I've just been invited by friends to an all-expenses paid vacation in Fiji, just down the road from where you're located. What are the odds! So I will be able to hand-deliver these books to you sometime in April.

However, since they are quite heavy, I will need to charge you an extra US$2,500.oo due to the airline fees that I will be charged.

Looking forward to meeting you!

Sincerely,
posted by Joan Rivers of Babylon at 1:39 PM on March 9, 2020 [52 favorites]

Is taking the high road of an adult an option here? You don't need to do this strange, passive aggressive exercise. It accomplishes nothing, and the good feeling you're expecting is short-lived and artificial. If anything, the good angel on my left shoulder would start to chide me about this eventually.

Disengage. Move on. They're not trying to scam you they're simply hoping to scam "someone".
posted by humboldt32 at 2:24 PM on March 9, 2020 [2 favorites]

Response by poster: Well, we're different people I guess. I feel perfectly fine about responding in a juvenile manner to a dickhead who's trying to interfere in my attempt at making a living. If I ruined his day, all the better. My feeling of satisfaction is altogether genuine, I can assure you.
posted by Joan Rivers of Babylon at 2:35 PM on March 9, 2020 [44 favorites]

Wasting these people’s time is actually a civic service, because for every second they spend with you that’s one less second they can rip other people off. If everyone did this to scammers they would be unable to steal anything. I sell stuff on craigslist and I have a giant stack of fake checks that I have picked up over the years from these people. It’s a lot of fun.
posted by Slinga at 2:44 PM on March 9, 2020 [23 favorites]

Once they’ve contacted you, they are indeed trying to scam you, not an abstract someone. And you indeed do a service by publicizing their scam and wasting their time. Also be aware that these scams overwhelmingly target the elderly, and others taken to be the most gullible or desperate.

That said I’d let it go even if the scammer responds now. But telling your fellow book dealers is a good idea indeed. They may be targeting the business because they assume gullibility or lack of internet savvy. They also do tend to come in waves once you have bitten even slightly so prepare for new scams in your inbox.

Also google “Kitboga” if you want to laugh at the whole thing while being outraged about it.
posted by spitbull at 3:23 PM on March 9, 2020 [5 favorites]

What if you get his credit card info and the freight forwarder's info then just say you ran the card (DON"T) and that you sent a money order to the freight forwarder (also don't) and keep him occupied while you play dumb when he doesn't see the money come through.

See if you can get him on the phone. Increase the weirdness of your supposed solutions. Tell him you cancelled the money order and instead sent iTunes gift cards to the forwarder. Send him blurry pictures of the (fake) gift cards. Ask him to have the freight forwarder call you. Continue to be gently baffled and seemingly helpful. Suggest that your cousin who lives in Fiji could deliver the merchandise, and that he will reimburse the $150 in cash since the transaction is so tragically challenging. Does he have an address your cousin can bring the goods and cash to?

Basically, get as much info as you can from him and then report it to the FBI fraud department.

If you are worried about repercussions since your address is known, maybe just skip it. But if you're good at acting and think you can pull it off without making him too mad, playing dumb is a great way to tie up his attention and time.
posted by ananci at 3:24 PM on March 9, 2020 [2 favorites]

I deal in vinyl records and see this scam all the time. I generally reply with a brief, "How do you sleep at night?" type of email, telling them how much it would hurt a small business to fall for such a thing. Many write back apologies. Some just disappear.
posted by dobbs at 4:35 PM on March 9, 2020 [9 favorites]

I always reply to text scams with some variation of "GOD HAS SEEN WHAT YOU HAVE DONE, MAY ALL THAT YOU LOVE TURN AWAY FROM YOU, MAY YOUR HAPPINESS BECOME ASH, THIS CURSE CANNOT BE REMOVED, LOOK WHAT YOU HAVE DONE TO YOURSELF WICKED SINNER"

I believe an amazingly high percentage of grifters are superstitious af. Never, ever hear from them again.
posted by moneyjane at 10:14 PM on March 9, 2020 [13 favorites]

Just to be clear, the scammer is almost certainly in India or Eastern Europe, not Fiji, and you’ll never get any real information from them.
posted by spitbull at 4:21 AM on March 10, 2020

This is the oldest scam in the cyber world. The only way to process his credit card will give him your banking info. When the charge goes through it will hold his "funds" until he has enough info to steal your money from the return banking and by the time your bank is aware the transaction is fraudulent your bank account will be wiped out
posted by The_imp_inimpossible at 4:54 AM on March 10, 2020