It's Complicated (But Not Really)
October 29, 2013 3:55 AM Subscribe
What would you call this type of relationship?
Let me preface this by saying that this is more of a language question than anything else - neither party concerned puts great importance on "labelling" relationships.
So, myself and this woman I know were thinking about what, exactly, one would call the kind of relationship we have. We are very close friends, for starters: we share a deep level of emotional intimacy, mutual understanding, and have yet to get enough of each others' company. We also share a strong mutual attraction for one another, as well as feelings for one another that could be called romantic. If relevant, there has been some physicality involved as well. However, neither one of us would say we were dating, let alone in a "relationship".
So tell me, AskMe: is there a word or term, in any language (preferably English, although not required) for the space between "close friends" and "dating/in a relationship"?
Let me preface this by saying that this is more of a language question than anything else - neither party concerned puts great importance on "labelling" relationships.
So, myself and this woman I know were thinking about what, exactly, one would call the kind of relationship we have. We are very close friends, for starters: we share a deep level of emotional intimacy, mutual understanding, and have yet to get enough of each others' company. We also share a strong mutual attraction for one another, as well as feelings for one another that could be called romantic. If relevant, there has been some physicality involved as well. However, neither one of us would say we were dating, let alone in a "relationship".
So tell me, AskMe: is there a word or term, in any language (preferably English, although not required) for the space between "close friends" and "dating/in a relationship"?
Response by poster: (To clarify: by "some physicality" I mean more at a fairly light - although very pleasant - level. Although the physicality isn't so much the point as the emotional nature of our relationship.)
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 4:01 AM on October 29, 2013
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 4:01 AM on October 29, 2013
It's called love.
posted by Annika Cicada at 4:04 AM on October 29, 2013 [34 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 4:04 AM on October 29, 2013 [34 favorites]
The funny thing about the word "friend" is how wide ranging the word is. It goes from acquaintances we click a button on to follow on Facebook to people we tell our deepest secrets to because we trust them with our lives and can't imagine our lives without. There are friends we fuck and friends we fight. There are friends who hold our hand and friends who have our back.
So you're friends. It's not an exact word, but I think it's still apt.
posted by inturnaround at 4:10 AM on October 29, 2013 [14 favorites]
So you're friends. It's not an exact word, but I think it's still apt.
posted by inturnaround at 4:10 AM on October 29, 2013 [14 favorites]
So as not to break the edit rules, based on what you describe I believe it is love you are feeling. How would you put it in relationship terms? I guess you could say "we love each other" I don't know for sure but from what you've described, it sure seems like a real, honest loving thing that is really something nice. So, if I were in your situation I'd be direct about it as "love" and let the ambiguity take it's course a little?
posted by Annika Cicada at 4:11 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Annika Cicada at 4:11 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
I know what you mean about how it feels like there isn't a word for that but there should be. People tend to make up their own words - one of my old roommates spontaneously came up with one when she was trying to explain to a guy that he wasn't her boyfriend, he was more like....her friend-boy. (She was on the phone and I overheard that. I stuck my head into the room, apologized for interrupting, but told her that I was going to be stealing that because it was awesome.)
But I think inturnaround has it - you're friends. You just define it differently. If you want to call it something else, maybe make something up that's yours alone.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:31 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
But I think inturnaround has it - you're friends. You just define it differently. If you want to call it something else, maybe make something up that's yours alone.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:31 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
I think it depends on how long you have sustained this level of intimacy, and also, what challenges you've worked on together to overcome. If it's fairly new (under 18 months), it could be a crush. If you've passed the year and a half mark and learned/taught navigating issues, you love each other and of course, YMMV.
I do admire that you've been able to keep the physical aspects "light". Considering all the other factors are in place, that's hard to do! For me!
posted by thinkpiece at 4:33 AM on October 29, 2013
I do admire that you've been able to keep the physical aspects "light". Considering all the other factors are in place, that's hard to do! For me!
posted by thinkpiece at 4:33 AM on October 29, 2013
um-friends, as in "She's my, um.. friend."
posted by empath at 4:35 AM on October 29, 2013 [12 favorites]
posted by empath at 4:35 AM on October 29, 2013 [12 favorites]
I think the word you are looking for is "intimates." Friends whilst sharing a lot (including perhaps physical intimacy) usually don't share romantic feelings.
posted by three blind mice at 4:40 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by three blind mice at 4:40 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Fear of commitment?
posted by Serene Empress Dork at 5:02 AM on October 29, 2013 [13 favorites]
posted by Serene Empress Dork at 5:02 AM on October 29, 2013 [13 favorites]
I generally despise it, but for your situation I think the word "lovers" would apply nicely.
posted by Mizu at 5:28 AM on October 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
posted by Mizu at 5:28 AM on October 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
The topic you bring up is one I've thought of frequently. The truth is that the English language (and most if not all languages in fact) is not adept at defining emotional bonds. The majority of human history relationships were merely contractual bonds. Marriage = family business, children, legacy... not love or romance. The words Girlfriend and Boyfriend are very new in the english language. These terms did not exist a few generations back. And even these terms are limiting because nowadays it is possible to have a friend of the opposite gender without creating a scandal but this was not the case when these terms came about. Hence the 'girl/boy-friend' combination. But just because they didn't have a word for this kind of relationship doesn't mean that many people didn't have this kind of relationship. There just wasn't a word for it because it wasn't the type that was accepted by society. Seems like a friends with benefits situation from my end, but there is currently no one word to describe your relationship- you would have to make one up and see it if catches on in society.
Friend is a word that is thrown around a lot and considering how many friends betray one another I often think that it is too vague a term to use in any lasting relationship. A more clear word would be ally. What makes someone a friend is wishy washy at best, but it's pretty clear to everyone what makes an ally. A person is either on your side or they are not.
Poetry exists for the sole reason that when it comes to explaining deep emotions, complex partnerships and moods, normal language is limited at best.
posted by manderin at 5:30 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Friend is a word that is thrown around a lot and considering how many friends betray one another I often think that it is too vague a term to use in any lasting relationship. A more clear word would be ally. What makes someone a friend is wishy washy at best, but it's pretty clear to everyone what makes an ally. A person is either on your side or they are not.
Poetry exists for the sole reason that when it comes to explaining deep emotions, complex partnerships and moods, normal language is limited at best.
posted by manderin at 5:30 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
How does this feel: Romantic friendship.
posted by dawkins_7 at 5:37 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by dawkins_7 at 5:37 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
My dear man, why should we spoil for you the very essence of poetry? That is, of course, not quite getting the right words for whatever it is you feel at the moment. We would be guilty of abetting your laziness, at the very least, but more tragic, we would drain the energy from the urgent search for expression that underlies the best feelings and makes for a more expressive man.
I can come up with dozens, but you won't get any of them from me. My service to our species is to withhold from you the easy out.
This seed is what makes your relationship with this person special. It's entirely up to you to probe at it until perfection sits before you gleaming.
Then, you must share it with us.
posted by FauxScot at 5:46 AM on October 29, 2013 [14 favorites]
I can come up with dozens, but you won't get any of them from me. My service to our species is to withhold from you the easy out.
This seed is what makes your relationship with this person special. It's entirely up to you to probe at it until perfection sits before you gleaming.
Then, you must share it with us.
posted by FauxScot at 5:46 AM on October 29, 2013 [14 favorites]
I would call it "johnny" but that is a spur-of-the-moment thing and I like to be creative. Otherwise, FWB. It's close enough to what you have. If you have to put a label on it, then most people will get the gist of what you have without having to go into a deep explanation of what "johnny" means.
posted by JJ86 at 5:53 AM on October 29, 2013
posted by JJ86 at 5:53 AM on October 29, 2013
According to the definitions in The Four Loves by C.S. Lewis, it sounds like philia with a touch of eros.
posted by Rainflower at 5:57 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by Rainflower at 5:57 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: You guys are the best.
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 6:13 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 6:13 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
An intimate friend, which plays off the different meanings of intimate.
posted by drlith at 6:16 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by drlith at 6:16 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Intimate friendship maybe covers it. Soul mate?
But if you're Trekkies at all, it sounds like Imzadi to me.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 6:24 AM on October 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
But if you're Trekkies at all, it sounds like Imzadi to me.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 6:24 AM on October 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
Among my peeps, we call these people "Special Lady Friends" and "Special Man Friends."
posted by *s at 6:43 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by *s at 6:43 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
If she's skinny you could call her your 'waif' - that's what I call my girlfriend, who is of the kind you describe.
posted by honey-barbara at 8:06 AM on October 29, 2013
posted by honey-barbara at 8:06 AM on October 29, 2013
Marge Piercy calls it "sweet friends" in Woman on the Edge of Time. I always liked that descriptor.
posted by dlugoczaj at 8:16 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by dlugoczaj at 8:16 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
I call this person my best friend.
posted by desuetude at 8:22 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by desuetude at 8:22 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Friends with potential. Why aren't you two dating?
posted by onlyconnect at 8:31 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by onlyconnect at 8:31 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
Seconding "friends with potential" as it's also a reference to the film Say Anything and anything that references John Cusack is cool in my book.
(And gently pointing out that there are plenty of reasons why two people could have decided that full-on dating isn't something they want to do - or even why one person could decide that full-on dating isn't something they want to do, so perhaps avoiding "why aren't you dating" questions may be best because hell, we don't know their life....)
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:43 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
(And gently pointing out that there are plenty of reasons why two people could have decided that full-on dating isn't something they want to do - or even why one person could decide that full-on dating isn't something they want to do, so perhaps avoiding "why aren't you dating" questions may be best because hell, we don't know their life....)
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:43 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
Although the song is about the love of a woman for her hard working man, it keeps coming to mind...Let It Grow (Weir/Barlow)
...
What shall we say, shall we call it by a name,
As well to count the angels dancing on a pin.
Water bright as the sky from which it came,
And the name is on the earth that takes it in.
We will not speak but stand inside the rain,
And listen to the thunder shouting I am! I am! I am! I am.
Why speak of it? Just revel in it and let it grow.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 8:48 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
...
What shall we say, shall we call it by a name,
As well to count the angels dancing on a pin.
Water bright as the sky from which it came,
And the name is on the earth that takes it in.
We will not speak but stand inside the rain,
And listen to the thunder shouting I am! I am! I am! I am.
Why speak of it? Just revel in it and let it grow.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 8:48 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
I occasionally describe such relationships as bromances regardless of the genders involved. Soul mates or chosen family also work though they have some mutually-exclusive overtones.
posted by tchemgrrl at 9:17 AM on October 29, 2013
posted by tchemgrrl at 9:17 AM on October 29, 2013
Is either of you romantically involved with someone else? If not, what would happen to the friendship if one of you did become more romantically involved with someone else? I know this is not really an answer to your question but it might help you to clarify how this woman fits into your larger world.
posted by mareli at 10:35 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by mareli at 10:35 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
It really sounds like you could leave it at "friend".
posted by windykites at 10:35 AM on October 29, 2013
posted by windykites at 10:35 AM on October 29, 2013
English not required? Well Brazilian Portuguese has the perfect word for this: rolo. Literally, it means "entangled", but not in a bad way. She's your rolo, you're her rolo, you have a rolo together.
You could also say that you have a lance with her, literally this would mean a play or a move in a game (but not in the 'playa' sense, a lance can be absolutely serious). Or how about its English equivalent, thing? — you have a thing going on.
posted by Tom-B at 10:58 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
You could also say that you have a lance with her, literally this would mean a play or a move in a game (but not in the 'playa' sense, a lance can be absolutely serious). Or how about its English equivalent, thing? — you have a thing going on.
posted by Tom-B at 10:58 AM on October 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
I've heard friends of mine who have this thing say "she's my Person."
posted by clavicle at 11:23 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by clavicle at 11:23 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
If you need to describe it to someone else, you can say what you said here: "It's complicated."
Otherwise, I don't see why it needs a name. Labeling such things is about comparing it to something else or communicating to someone who does not know. Words for this seem to get reinvented every generation, presumably because labels routinely fail to capture what we think or feel or want to say about something budding yet we know not into what. We currently have fwb. We used to say "keeping company." I tend to say "passed the time pleasantly" about past relationships of that sort.
I tend to keep such things private in part because labeling things has enormous power to shape the direction they take and I don't like that. People who are close to me know it. They don't need it tagged and labeled like some facebook pic. If I am not making social introductions, I generally do not need to communicate the nature of my relationship. No label required. It just is what it is.
posted by Michele in California at 4:27 PM on October 29, 2013
Otherwise, I don't see why it needs a name. Labeling such things is about comparing it to something else or communicating to someone who does not know. Words for this seem to get reinvented every generation, presumably because labels routinely fail to capture what we think or feel or want to say about something budding yet we know not into what. We currently have fwb. We used to say "keeping company." I tend to say "passed the time pleasantly" about past relationships of that sort.
I tend to keep such things private in part because labeling things has enormous power to shape the direction they take and I don't like that. People who are close to me know it. They don't need it tagged and labeled like some facebook pic. If I am not making social introductions, I generally do not need to communicate the nature of my relationship. No label required. It just is what it is.
posted by Michele in California at 4:27 PM on October 29, 2013
Response by poster: Otherwise, I don't see why it needs a name.
Again, this is a language question; we are not assigning some moral or philosophical importance to calling it something.
Also I am having a hard time choosing Best Answers here, because these are all thoughtful, touching and/or hilarious. You guys are really fantastic. Going to leave this unresolved just because I'm loving the dynamic and the input.
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 5:27 PM on October 29, 2013
Again, this is a language question; we are not assigning some moral or philosophical importance to calling it something.
Also I am having a hard time choosing Best Answers here, because these are all thoughtful, touching and/or hilarious. You guys are really fantastic. Going to leave this unresolved just because I'm loving the dynamic and the input.
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 5:27 PM on October 29, 2013
MetaSpouse
posted by a humble nudibranch at 9:40 PM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by a humble nudibranch at 9:40 PM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Bff.
Partner in crime.
Sister from another mister/brother from another mother.
In Anne of Green Gables, Montgomery uses the phrase "bosom friend."
If you're feeling romantic, she's your girl.
posted by rue72 at 10:24 PM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Partner in crime.
Sister from another mister/brother from another mother.
In Anne of Green Gables, Montgomery uses the phrase "bosom friend."
If you're feeling romantic, she's your girl.
posted by rue72 at 10:24 PM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
We are very close friends, for starters: we share a deep level of emotional intimacy, mutual understanding, and have yet to get enough of each others' company. We also share a strong mutual attraction for one another, as well as feelings for one another that could be called romantic. If relevant, there has been some physicality involved as well. However, neither one of us would say we were dating, let alone in a "relationship".
Huh. Sounds like the definition of a LTR to me. Like marriage-type LTR.
posted by glasseyes at 10:57 AM on October 30, 2013
Huh. Sounds like the definition of a LTR to me. Like marriage-type LTR.
posted by glasseyes at 10:57 AM on October 30, 2013
Marisa Stole the Precious Thing: "However, neither one of us would say we were dating, let alone in a "relationship"."
My counter to this is that friendship IS a relationship. But I exactly know what you mean (oh boy, do I ever) and no, there is not a great shorthand way to indicate close committed relationships between adults which do not fall neatly into the categories of "family" (whether blood or chosen) or "romantic partner." Those are the roles which are widely-understood to mean "this person has a priority status in my life." Like I said, I use "best friend" for this, which kind of works but still doesn't jibe with assumptions/expectations.
If it falls in-between, it makes a lot of people uncomfortable, it doesn't compute. Because the expectation is that romantic relationships are only serious if they're both sexual and monogamous, and family relationships are not romantic at all. And if you DO have family members or a spouse, it is assumed that they would "outrank" some sort of "really close friend." (People can get really weirdly adamant about this in my experience. I've thought about it a lot and can go on and on, PM me if you like.)
posted by desuetude at 9:15 AM on October 31, 2013
My counter to this is that friendship IS a relationship. But I exactly know what you mean (oh boy, do I ever) and no, there is not a great shorthand way to indicate close committed relationships between adults which do not fall neatly into the categories of "family" (whether blood or chosen) or "romantic partner." Those are the roles which are widely-understood to mean "this person has a priority status in my life." Like I said, I use "best friend" for this, which kind of works but still doesn't jibe with assumptions/expectations.
If it falls in-between, it makes a lot of people uncomfortable, it doesn't compute. Because the expectation is that romantic relationships are only serious if they're both sexual and monogamous, and family relationships are not romantic at all. And if you DO have family members or a spouse, it is assumed that they would "outrank" some sort of "really close friend." (People can get really weirdly adamant about this in my experience. I've thought about it a lot and can go on and on, PM me if you like.)
posted by desuetude at 9:15 AM on October 31, 2013
My person like this is, simply, "my person."
posted by fritillary at 4:52 PM on December 17, 2013
posted by fritillary at 4:52 PM on December 17, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by inturnaround at 3:59 AM on October 29, 2013 [1 favorite]