Give a genderqueer sibling a hand?
August 12, 2013 2:38 PM Subscribe
How would I know if I was something other than cisgender?
It's recently come to my attention that some things that I've been assuming about myself for, oh, my entire life, may not actually be the case. So far, I've been assuming that because I have a male body and am attracted to other men, I'm a gay man. Over the past 2-ish months, though, I've been considering both my gender and sexuality in much greater detail. Suddenly, I find myself sexually attracted to both men and women, and considering that I may actually be under the genderqueer umbrella, specifically: agender.
Before I continue, I'd like to acknowledge that I'm operating from a place of privilege, and that that's probably going to come through in both what I have to say and the questions I ask. It is absolutely not my intent to insult anyone or use incorrect terminology or display my privilege. I apologise in advance if I inadvertently say something offensive, and I would appreciate any pointers.
Firstly, my change in sexuality. Previous to now, I haven't really considered women sexually. I've noticed that a particular woman is attractive, but only in the aesthetic sense. Now, I find myself looking at women with a different eye, one that sees them as sexually interesting. The idea of maybe having sexual intercourse with a woman is interesting to me, suddenly. (I realise that women get leered at and suchlike by men a lot, so I'm trying to not do this. I feel somewhat awkward in explaining this, as it seems to me that I'm implying that I'm only seeing women in a sexual fashion, which I'm not. I'm trying to treat everyone as I used to, irrespective of how I now find them - as a human being. None of my friends of either gender have commented on a change in my behaviour, so hopefully I'm doing this OK. Most of what I know of how men look at women comes from reading various threads here on the Green and on the Blue. I really don't want to be a creeper.) For the sake of clarity, I'm a Kinsey 5.9.
So, suddenly I'm attracted to women as well as mostly men. I'm surprised at how little this is bothering me. I've yet to have any kind of Real World experience of relationships or sex with women, which is perhaps why.
Secondly, my gender confusion. My actual question is right at the top of this Ask - how would I know if I was something other than cisgender? I look at my physical body and it's male. So I always assumed that that's what I was - a man. Reading the threads about trans* individuals has made me question that assumption, though. While my body is male, my mind doesn't seem to be. In the week since signing up for this account, even, my attitudes have changed. I don't feel like a man, and I don't feel like what I would expect it would be like to feel like a woman. The best way I think I can describe how I feel is like water in a vase - if you pour the water from a square vase into a cylindrical one, the water is still the same, it's just a different shape. If I woke up with female sexual characteristics tomorrow, I would probably be surprised but I'd also not be overly bothered. If I woke up without any kind of sexual characteristics whatsoever tomorrow, I'd feel the same way. I'm as sure of this as one can be without actually experiencing such a situation. I'm concerned, though, that this is something that lots of cisgender people experience. I don't want to claim to be something that I'm not. People in minorities already get "I have friends who are X, so I totally know what it's like!" and other such nonsense. I've experienced enough of this through coming out as gay to know that it's not something I want to inflict on others. I've no desire to physically alter my sexual characteristics.
I've been reading up on Wikipedia and on a subreddit, and the experiences of other people who identify as agender/genderqueer seem to really chime with how I feel.
I realise that I have lots of privilege in looking the way I do, and I don't want to lose that. What I seem to want to do is explore things that are more stereotypically feminine. I had the urge the other day to put on some mascara, and I got very excited when I bought my first bottle of nail varnish (Barry M #299, Racing Green - it seemed apt). I want to express my androgynous nature more, but "androgynous" seems to me to be the wrong word, as I don't seem to want aspects of andro and gyne, I want something that is gender neutral, but it seems that androgyne is as close as I'm going to get. What I want and how to express it is somewhat confusing to me right now. I guess this is because it's all pretty new.
As to my actual questions:
Is this how cisgender individuals who have sat and thought about it generally experience the world? Or is it much more likely that I'm agender?
Is it common for one to experience a massive change in awareness/perspective in this fashion?
Are there any online resources I should be looking at? I've found a couple of blogs and subreddits already, but maybe there's the One True Website for folks like me?
Any other thoughts, tips or tricks?
Personal experiences are most welcome. Memail is turned on if you'd prefer to chat that way, and I wholeheartedly promise to preserve your anonymity.
It's recently come to my attention that some things that I've been assuming about myself for, oh, my entire life, may not actually be the case. So far, I've been assuming that because I have a male body and am attracted to other men, I'm a gay man. Over the past 2-ish months, though, I've been considering both my gender and sexuality in much greater detail. Suddenly, I find myself sexually attracted to both men and women, and considering that I may actually be under the genderqueer umbrella, specifically: agender.
Before I continue, I'd like to acknowledge that I'm operating from a place of privilege, and that that's probably going to come through in both what I have to say and the questions I ask. It is absolutely not my intent to insult anyone or use incorrect terminology or display my privilege. I apologise in advance if I inadvertently say something offensive, and I would appreciate any pointers.
Firstly, my change in sexuality. Previous to now, I haven't really considered women sexually. I've noticed that a particular woman is attractive, but only in the aesthetic sense. Now, I find myself looking at women with a different eye, one that sees them as sexually interesting. The idea of maybe having sexual intercourse with a woman is interesting to me, suddenly. (I realise that women get leered at and suchlike by men a lot, so I'm trying to not do this. I feel somewhat awkward in explaining this, as it seems to me that I'm implying that I'm only seeing women in a sexual fashion, which I'm not. I'm trying to treat everyone as I used to, irrespective of how I now find them - as a human being. None of my friends of either gender have commented on a change in my behaviour, so hopefully I'm doing this OK. Most of what I know of how men look at women comes from reading various threads here on the Green and on the Blue. I really don't want to be a creeper.) For the sake of clarity, I'm a Kinsey 5.9.
So, suddenly I'm attracted to women as well as mostly men. I'm surprised at how little this is bothering me. I've yet to have any kind of Real World experience of relationships or sex with women, which is perhaps why.
Secondly, my gender confusion. My actual question is right at the top of this Ask - how would I know if I was something other than cisgender? I look at my physical body and it's male. So I always assumed that that's what I was - a man. Reading the threads about trans* individuals has made me question that assumption, though. While my body is male, my mind doesn't seem to be. In the week since signing up for this account, even, my attitudes have changed. I don't feel like a man, and I don't feel like what I would expect it would be like to feel like a woman. The best way I think I can describe how I feel is like water in a vase - if you pour the water from a square vase into a cylindrical one, the water is still the same, it's just a different shape. If I woke up with female sexual characteristics tomorrow, I would probably be surprised but I'd also not be overly bothered. If I woke up without any kind of sexual characteristics whatsoever tomorrow, I'd feel the same way. I'm as sure of this as one can be without actually experiencing such a situation. I'm concerned, though, that this is something that lots of cisgender people experience. I don't want to claim to be something that I'm not. People in minorities already get "I have friends who are X, so I totally know what it's like!" and other such nonsense. I've experienced enough of this through coming out as gay to know that it's not something I want to inflict on others. I've no desire to physically alter my sexual characteristics.
I've been reading up on Wikipedia and on a subreddit, and the experiences of other people who identify as agender/genderqueer seem to really chime with how I feel.
I realise that I have lots of privilege in looking the way I do, and I don't want to lose that. What I seem to want to do is explore things that are more stereotypically feminine. I had the urge the other day to put on some mascara, and I got very excited when I bought my first bottle of nail varnish (Barry M #299, Racing Green - it seemed apt). I want to express my androgynous nature more, but "androgynous" seems to me to be the wrong word, as I don't seem to want aspects of andro and gyne, I want something that is gender neutral, but it seems that androgyne is as close as I'm going to get. What I want and how to express it is somewhat confusing to me right now. I guess this is because it's all pretty new.
As to my actual questions:
Is this how cisgender individuals who have sat and thought about it generally experience the world? Or is it much more likely that I'm agender?
Is it common for one to experience a massive change in awareness/perspective in this fashion?
Are there any online resources I should be looking at? I've found a couple of blogs and subreddits already, but maybe there's the One True Website for folks like me?
Any other thoughts, tips or tricks?
Personal experiences are most welcome. Memail is turned on if you'd prefer to chat that way, and I wholeheartedly promise to preserve your anonymity.
This sounds more like a kink than true gender confusion. Personally I think genders are held in much too rigid boxes--you can be a man and still want to dress like a woman, for example, or even fantasize about being a woman, in a sexual context. And your aesthetic appreciation of women's sexuality does not sound like true attraction, as per your 5.9.
posted by tooloudinhere at 3:09 PM on August 12, 2013
posted by tooloudinhere at 3:09 PM on August 12, 2013
I don't know if it will be helpful, but the Gender Gumby exercise can be handy in identifying where specific parts of your gender and presentation fall on multiple ranges.
posted by MonsieurBon at 3:12 PM on August 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by MonsieurBon at 3:12 PM on August 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
Is this how cisgender individuals who have sat and thought about it generally experience the world? Or is it much more likely that I'm agender?
I think gender is a bit more of a spectrum than we generally think. I'm a cisgender woman, and I think of myself as very far over on the "woman" end of the spectrum, in that if I woke up tomorrow and had a male body, I would NOT feel like myself -- it would feel completely, absolutely, 100% wrong and I would do everything in my power to fix it. Reading trans* people's descriptions of "feeling wrong" about their assigned genders, I totally relate to that feeling of having one "correct" gender.
I've also talked to many people who feel like they're maybe more in the middle of the gender spectrum, where moving a bit and switching over to the other side wouldn't be that big a deal. Some of those people identify as genderqueer or agender, others as exclusively one gender.
posted by jaguar at 3:18 PM on August 12, 2013
I think gender is a bit more of a spectrum than we generally think. I'm a cisgender woman, and I think of myself as very far over on the "woman" end of the spectrum, in that if I woke up tomorrow and had a male body, I would NOT feel like myself -- it would feel completely, absolutely, 100% wrong and I would do everything in my power to fix it. Reading trans* people's descriptions of "feeling wrong" about their assigned genders, I totally relate to that feeling of having one "correct" gender.
I've also talked to many people who feel like they're maybe more in the middle of the gender spectrum, where moving a bit and switching over to the other side wouldn't be that big a deal. Some of those people identify as genderqueer or agender, others as exclusively one gender.
posted by jaguar at 3:18 PM on August 12, 2013
My experience with this stuff is: it takes time to understand, and it also changes over time, and also time time time time time.
Is it common for one to experience a massive change in awareness/perspective in this fashion?
Yeah, sometimes! Things happen, things happen for a while, things happen permanently, things happen temporarily. It's not to be worried about but to be experienced. (I would relay some experience stuff here, but I don't want it on my permanent record.)
I really encourage you to not fret and not fuss, to let things be and evolve, and to do and try things that are good and healthy for you, including trying new things. The whole point of a lot of this stuff is that you don't need to call yourself anything, and you don't need to even explain it to anyone. "Agender" is a big word. It means non-gendered. You may or may not be that!
If I could offer any advice from my experience, it's that maybe it might be helpful to set aside some of the privilege-policing and super-organized language/experience stuff. You can deal with that later, after some time just being. For example, it can be anti-useful to reflect on privilege when you are trying to flower and be. And it can be undermining to adopt identities that have political victimology attached when you are working at getting who you are. (I realize that might sound... off, but, hey, just speaking from experience! Politicization of identity is what happens after we have the experience of that identity, not when we are learning what our identity might be.) My point is: first, go forth, be you, see where that takes you.
posted by RJ Reynolds at 3:28 PM on August 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
Is it common for one to experience a massive change in awareness/perspective in this fashion?
Yeah, sometimes! Things happen, things happen for a while, things happen permanently, things happen temporarily. It's not to be worried about but to be experienced. (I would relay some experience stuff here, but I don't want it on my permanent record.)
I really encourage you to not fret and not fuss, to let things be and evolve, and to do and try things that are good and healthy for you, including trying new things. The whole point of a lot of this stuff is that you don't need to call yourself anything, and you don't need to even explain it to anyone. "Agender" is a big word. It means non-gendered. You may or may not be that!
If I could offer any advice from my experience, it's that maybe it might be helpful to set aside some of the privilege-policing and super-organized language/experience stuff. You can deal with that later, after some time just being. For example, it can be anti-useful to reflect on privilege when you are trying to flower and be. And it can be undermining to adopt identities that have political victimology attached when you are working at getting who you are. (I realize that might sound... off, but, hey, just speaking from experience! Politicization of identity is what happens after we have the experience of that identity, not when we are learning what our identity might be.) My point is: first, go forth, be you, see where that takes you.
posted by RJ Reynolds at 3:28 PM on August 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
To amplify what tooloudinhere said, and also what the others say: don't waste energy trying to map yourself into the external societal construct of gender. Your recent reading has clearly hit home, and persuaded you that gender is not a binary, but (as is most any other aspect of identity) arguably a "spectrum". And not simply a linear spectrum: a multidimensional matrix of whateverness. Obsessing over the right, single label for yourself just takes away time from being you. Just be you.
posted by xueexueg at 3:52 PM on August 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by xueexueg at 3:52 PM on August 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
I've poked around the same issues and asked some of the same questions, especially here on MeFi, much to everyone's consternation. I am also a gay man (in the broadly understood sense, I guess). But I also don't really know what it means to "feel inherently male." I don't spend a lot of time thinking about my hypothetical masculinity. And I definitely don't embody any kind of archetypal, traditional manhood, being an awkward and kind of nebbishy gay man and all.
I haven't made a lot of conclusions, but I do have a few. I don't think that the existing language provides a particularly effective model of reality. As a consequence, rather than starting with existing terms and trying to define them, it may be more practical to identify commonalities and then name them. If "gender" is an incoherent term, then it's more useful to focus on more tractable terms. Finally, gender and sexuality are probably complicated, which means that layman discussions of them will be superficial and confused and I should probably focus on the copious academic literature on the subject.
So, how do I move on in the meantime? I clearly have some kind of physical anatomy, and there are people I'm attracted to, and there are things I'd like to do with them. I am whatever I am, and that is not negotiable, hair-splitting terminology be damned. I can continue my search for effective terminology, but in the meantime I can use the conventional terminology as a crutch. For example, I could say that "I date gay men" and have that mean something, but not necessarily "I could date any gay man and I could never date anyone who does not specifically identify as a gay man." It definitely simplifies things for me to think in terms of fuzzy logic and blurred boundaries.
posted by Nomyte at 3:54 PM on August 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
I haven't made a lot of conclusions, but I do have a few. I don't think that the existing language provides a particularly effective model of reality. As a consequence, rather than starting with existing terms and trying to define them, it may be more practical to identify commonalities and then name them. If "gender" is an incoherent term, then it's more useful to focus on more tractable terms. Finally, gender and sexuality are probably complicated, which means that layman discussions of them will be superficial and confused and I should probably focus on the copious academic literature on the subject.
So, how do I move on in the meantime? I clearly have some kind of physical anatomy, and there are people I'm attracted to, and there are things I'd like to do with them. I am whatever I am, and that is not negotiable, hair-splitting terminology be damned. I can continue my search for effective terminology, but in the meantime I can use the conventional terminology as a crutch. For example, I could say that "I date gay men" and have that mean something, but not necessarily "I could date any gay man and I could never date anyone who does not specifically identify as a gay man." It definitely simplifies things for me to think in terms of fuzzy logic and blurred boundaries.
posted by Nomyte at 3:54 PM on August 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
Without intent to disrespect trans* folks and the anguish they feel before becoming able to self-express in a way that's true to themselves, it is worth pointing out that for many other people it's perfectly possible to feel sort of blasé/fine about your gender without internalizing or accepting all the baggage that comes with it. I was born a boy, am now a man, and have never been confused for anything other. But...I don't walk around all day being like "woooo! man-ness!!" (except maybe occasionally in a bout of wry Louis CK-esque privilege-honestying). In fact, there are a lot of "masculine" values that I'd actively reject. I guess I would describe my relationship to my gender as contingent or sometimes precarious; conversely, every trans* person I know basically describes their relationship to the gender assigned at birth as NOPE NOPE NOPE.
posted by threeants at 4:54 PM on August 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by threeants at 4:54 PM on August 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
I'm struggling to articulate this, but... First we feel a certain way, and then it is natural to try to find a label for it. And often, there isn't a neat label. You are who you are, and then you try to define it, but there are limited definitions available. Your experiences are not uncommon, and you don't have to fit yourself into any certain subset. Explore, be yourself, and discover what you like, and I know this is easier to say than do, but try not to have to define yourself in any specific way. This has come out so much less eloquently than I'd like, but my point is gender and sexuality is fluid, changeable, and our society does not have all the words or right framework for the reality of it.
posted by catatethebird at 4:59 PM on August 12, 2013
posted by catatethebird at 4:59 PM on August 12, 2013
Best answer: Another vote for "this is normal."
It's common to claim that everyone has a strong innate gender identity, and nobody has a choice in the matter. My own suspicion is that it's more complicated than that. Some people really do have a strong binary gender identity, and no choice in the matter. (Sometimes it matches the sex they were assigned at birth, and then they're cis; sometimes it doesn't, and then they're trans.) For that matter, some people have a strongly nonbinary gender identity; or a strong aversion to both of the binary categories or even to the very idea of belonging to a gender at all; or strong but conflicted feelings on the matter.
But then, yeah, some people are just like "Eh, whatever, I can live in any category," or "Fuck, all of those categories are kind of dumb, but I guess I could tolerate whichever" or even "Oh wow, they all look so appealing, I can't decide!"
In practice, people like that tend to end up identifying as cis, at least in the absence of strong social pressure. If you don't have a strong brand loyalty, and someone gives you a free iPhone, you'll probably become an Apple user, you know? Sticking to the category you were assigned at birth is cheap and easy, and if you really don't care either way, why not do it?
(On the other hand, there's also a long history of people transitioning under social pressure — for instance, AFAB people adopting male roles so they can do things like join the army or become professional musicians or escape shitty arranged marriages or whatever. I suspect that at least some of the people who've done that weren't trans* as we understand the term. Rather, they were people without a strong innate gender identity either way, and so when transitioning became more convenient than not transitioning, they transitioned. (And okay, even calling it "transitioning" is probably anachronistic and misleading, but fuck it, I've only got the words I've got.))
So what do you do? What do you call yourself? I dunno. The way we talk about gender identity nowadays is to medicalize it. If you need access to surgery or hormones or a new letter on your driver's license in order to live without dysphoria, then you get a diagnosis and a label. If you're fine with the bodyparts, blood levels and paperwork that you've got, then you don't "need" a diagnosis or a label. And actually I think that's partly right — you really don't need a label if there's no bureaucracy forcing you to adopt one. But yeah, it can definitely be disorienting to be label-less.
Adrienne Rich once said, "When someone with the authority of a teacher, say, describes the world and you are not in it, there is a moment of psychic disequilibrium, as if you looked into a mirror and saw nothing." And that's kind of what it sounds like you're describing. "Wait a minute! What the fuck?! When people talk about the landscape of gender identities, there's never anything on there that sounds like me." If it's any consolation, people who do fit into one of the straightforward diagnostic categories also experience that same psychic disequilibrium — because for every very-slightly-enlightened person who's like "There are five kinds of people: cis men, trans men, cis women, trans women, and agender people" there's still a bajillion totally-unenlightened people who are like "There are two kinds of people: cis men and cis women and THAT'S IT" But that's not to say, like, "Oh stop whining some people have it worse," because that sense of disequilibrium is hard for everyone.
The only solution I've found is to just be like "Fuck it, I'm gonna talk openly about my own experiences, and I don't need some kind of diagnosis to give me permission to do that." Regardless of how you identify or what pronouns you use or whether or not you have a label that fits right, you can still talk about (say) why painting your nails is awesome, or what it's like to suspect that you could wake up in another body and not mind at all, or the experience of questioning your identity and then deciding "yup, male," or whatever. And as long as you're careful not to drown out other people's voices and not to speak for anyone but yourself (it sounds like you're already pretty attentive to that), there's nothing inherently appropriative or whatever about just saying "Hey, so lemme tell you a story about this thing that happened to me."
posted by Now there are two. There are two _______. at 5:19 PM on August 12, 2013 [20 favorites]
It's common to claim that everyone has a strong innate gender identity, and nobody has a choice in the matter. My own suspicion is that it's more complicated than that. Some people really do have a strong binary gender identity, and no choice in the matter. (Sometimes it matches the sex they were assigned at birth, and then they're cis; sometimes it doesn't, and then they're trans.) For that matter, some people have a strongly nonbinary gender identity; or a strong aversion to both of the binary categories or even to the very idea of belonging to a gender at all; or strong but conflicted feelings on the matter.
But then, yeah, some people are just like "Eh, whatever, I can live in any category," or "Fuck, all of those categories are kind of dumb, but I guess I could tolerate whichever" or even "Oh wow, they all look so appealing, I can't decide!"
In practice, people like that tend to end up identifying as cis, at least in the absence of strong social pressure. If you don't have a strong brand loyalty, and someone gives you a free iPhone, you'll probably become an Apple user, you know? Sticking to the category you were assigned at birth is cheap and easy, and if you really don't care either way, why not do it?
(On the other hand, there's also a long history of people transitioning under social pressure — for instance, AFAB people adopting male roles so they can do things like join the army or become professional musicians or escape shitty arranged marriages or whatever. I suspect that at least some of the people who've done that weren't trans* as we understand the term. Rather, they were people without a strong innate gender identity either way, and so when transitioning became more convenient than not transitioning, they transitioned. (And okay, even calling it "transitioning" is probably anachronistic and misleading, but fuck it, I've only got the words I've got.))
So what do you do? What do you call yourself? I dunno. The way we talk about gender identity nowadays is to medicalize it. If you need access to surgery or hormones or a new letter on your driver's license in order to live without dysphoria, then you get a diagnosis and a label. If you're fine with the bodyparts, blood levels and paperwork that you've got, then you don't "need" a diagnosis or a label. And actually I think that's partly right — you really don't need a label if there's no bureaucracy forcing you to adopt one. But yeah, it can definitely be disorienting to be label-less.
Adrienne Rich once said, "When someone with the authority of a teacher, say, describes the world and you are not in it, there is a moment of psychic disequilibrium, as if you looked into a mirror and saw nothing." And that's kind of what it sounds like you're describing. "Wait a minute! What the fuck?! When people talk about the landscape of gender identities, there's never anything on there that sounds like me." If it's any consolation, people who do fit into one of the straightforward diagnostic categories also experience that same psychic disequilibrium — because for every very-slightly-enlightened person who's like "There are five kinds of people: cis men, trans men, cis women, trans women, and agender people" there's still a bajillion totally-unenlightened people who are like "There are two kinds of people: cis men and cis women and THAT'S IT" But that's not to say, like, "Oh stop whining some people have it worse," because that sense of disequilibrium is hard for everyone.
The only solution I've found is to just be like "Fuck it, I'm gonna talk openly about my own experiences, and I don't need some kind of diagnosis to give me permission to do that." Regardless of how you identify or what pronouns you use or whether or not you have a label that fits right, you can still talk about (say) why painting your nails is awesome, or what it's like to suspect that you could wake up in another body and not mind at all, or the experience of questioning your identity and then deciding "yup, male," or whatever. And as long as you're careful not to drown out other people's voices and not to speak for anyone but yourself (it sounds like you're already pretty attentive to that), there's nothing inherently appropriative or whatever about just saying "Hey, so lemme tell you a story about this thing that happened to me."
posted by Now there are two. There are two _______. at 5:19 PM on August 12, 2013 [20 favorites]
I listened to a panel earlier this year on which a trans woman discussed her gender as part of her larger perception of her body, and her trans-ness as the outgrowth of her decisions to modify, tinker with, and generally manage her body as she saw fit.
This was a bit of a revelation to me. I more or less identify as a cis woman - I have no issues with my genitalia, I don't feel particularly feminine but feel more or less female, and certainly not male - but like you, if I woke up with opposite-sex characteristics tomorrow I'd be surprised and probably call around to find someone willing to help me play with them, rather than being upset. I get weirded out by being called a "lady" or any other particularly-gendered term almost as much as I get weirded out being called "sir."
But thinking about it in more general terms - in the "if I could make my body do whatever I wanted, what would I do with it?" sense - it because clear to me that my self-image is definitely different from my physical self, and I'd feel more perfect in a body that was much closer to androgyny than my current double-G, broad-hipped self is.
I don't know what, if anything, I'm going to do with this information, but thinking about it in pieces makes it easier to say "you know what, I might like to get a breast reduction. Let's think about that" rather than "I don't identify as a man so I'm stuck with what I've got." I still don't think "trans" is a useful label to apply to myself, but I kind of like the idea of living in a sci-fi world where I can get whatever body modification I want because dammit, it's my body.
posted by restless_nomad at 5:23 PM on August 12, 2013 [10 favorites]
This was a bit of a revelation to me. I more or less identify as a cis woman - I have no issues with my genitalia, I don't feel particularly feminine but feel more or less female, and certainly not male - but like you, if I woke up with opposite-sex characteristics tomorrow I'd be surprised and probably call around to find someone willing to help me play with them, rather than being upset. I get weirded out by being called a "lady" or any other particularly-gendered term almost as much as I get weirded out being called "sir."
But thinking about it in more general terms - in the "if I could make my body do whatever I wanted, what would I do with it?" sense - it because clear to me that my self-image is definitely different from my physical self, and I'd feel more perfect in a body that was much closer to androgyny than my current double-G, broad-hipped self is.
I don't know what, if anything, I'm going to do with this information, but thinking about it in pieces makes it easier to say "you know what, I might like to get a breast reduction. Let's think about that" rather than "I don't identify as a man so I'm stuck with what I've got." I still don't think "trans" is a useful label to apply to myself, but I kind of like the idea of living in a sci-fi world where I can get whatever body modification I want because dammit, it's my body.
posted by restless_nomad at 5:23 PM on August 12, 2013 [10 favorites]
I think from our desire (as a society) to reject rigid labels, whilst, of course, there are many positives in terms of acceptance and the opportunity for self-expression, the potential for confusion on an individual basis is escalating. Personally, I am a biological woman, and I completely identify as a woman. Having said that, beginning in my childhood, numerous people have commented in regard to (their perception of) my masculinity. Although I'm physically very feminine, the way in which I interpret information and express myself is very epitome of the cool, logical, and emotionless stereotypical male. Now, were I younger or perhaps a little more easily influenced by popular culture, I may have found this somewhat confusing in terms of my own identity as a woman. My point is, you have right to consider and reject some aspects of our culture, and particularly so if they're becoming overwhelming or unnecessarily confusing to you personally - there is no, "absolute right" at any point in time; perhaps the pendulum has swung a little too far in this respect.
posted by Nibiru at 5:29 PM on August 12, 2013
posted by Nibiru at 5:29 PM on August 12, 2013
I'm very much a ciswoman but if I woke up a dude, eh. There's no horror there, no wrongness, apart from the fact my heterosexual husband would become a platonic coparent which would make me very sad. I'm cis not because I feel that way, but because I don't feel trans* desires to change it.
I look very female, but I do not like what 'female' means. I bound my chest for a while in highschool because I loathed what 'teenage girl with big boobs' meant to the world around me. Now, in my thirties, I don't have that same loathing but I still do not like what my gender means to the world around me, even though I'm totally fine with the gender itself. Does that make sense? I think I probably would have thought I was trans* as a teen if that had been a concept I was familiar with, and that wouldn't have been entirely correct. There is a difference between 'I do not want to be what the world tells me my gender is' and 'I do not wish to be the gender I was assigned at birth'.
It's easier for me to be masculine though - I can swagger around in jeans and boots and plain shirts and short hair, and not only not be treated terribly for it, I will still get some sort of sexual attention (primarily from dudes). It wavers around though - sometimes I feel more masculine, sometimes more feminine. The two things are separate from my gender but are affected in their manifestation by my gender (masculinity presents very differently on a body with almost cartoonish female secondary sexual characteristics). I don't put too much thought into it because I don't think it helps me at all, I just roll with whatever I'm feeling.
posted by geek anachronism at 5:47 PM on August 12, 2013 [6 favorites]
I look very female, but I do not like what 'female' means. I bound my chest for a while in highschool because I loathed what 'teenage girl with big boobs' meant to the world around me. Now, in my thirties, I don't have that same loathing but I still do not like what my gender means to the world around me, even though I'm totally fine with the gender itself. Does that make sense? I think I probably would have thought I was trans* as a teen if that had been a concept I was familiar with, and that wouldn't have been entirely correct. There is a difference between 'I do not want to be what the world tells me my gender is' and 'I do not wish to be the gender I was assigned at birth'.
It's easier for me to be masculine though - I can swagger around in jeans and boots and plain shirts and short hair, and not only not be treated terribly for it, I will still get some sort of sexual attention (primarily from dudes). It wavers around though - sometimes I feel more masculine, sometimes more feminine. The two things are separate from my gender but are affected in their manifestation by my gender (masculinity presents very differently on a body with almost cartoonish female secondary sexual characteristics). I don't put too much thought into it because I don't think it helps me at all, I just roll with whatever I'm feeling.
posted by geek anachronism at 5:47 PM on August 12, 2013 [6 favorites]
Hmm, I've read a lot on this subject and had many a thought provoking conversation on this topic with people of a wide range of genders, however, all I can really offer you here is my personal experience:
I am in a "female body" (shorthand, I know). I want to stay in this body and am not interested in taking hormones or getting surgery to change my body.
I am fine with female pronouns. I also find it kind of flattering and somehow "right" when people use male pronouns with me. It is always appreciated when they ask what I prefer, because it's just generally good manners I guess, but also because I can tell they see something about me that is on a genderqueer spectrum, and I like being seen correctly.
I don't refer to myself as transgender because, maybe similar to your concern, I have many close friends who are transexual and I don't want to feel like I'm jumping on the bandwagon or stealing someone else's identity or whatever. I would never have this judgement of someone else's self-label, this is just, for me, for whatever reason, what feels respectful to my loved ones given my personal gender.
I don't feel like a woman the way 95% of the women I meet seem like - at least the way I read them. I know that there are infinite numbers of ways to be a woman. I just don't feel like one of those ways. On the other hand, I don't really feel like 95% of men I meet either. I feel like a masculine female gender I guess, that is not super common really.
For me this is not a big part of what occupies my thinking about myself. It's not something I need to process much emotionally or verbally. But it is a core and deep part of me. For whatever reason - it is something that has just always felt easy or right to me (I was a deeply tomboy kid).
So what does all this mean for you? I don't know! I know my experience is super different from yours. I guess I'm trying to model for you, or show an example that there are many different ways to experience "alternative" (for lack of other easy phrase) gender identity. I have one "alternative" way, and there are a million other ways to be gendered or not gendered.
I wish you the best in finding and learning the way that feels true to you.
posted by latkes at 5:50 PM on August 12, 2013 [4 favorites]
I am in a "female body" (shorthand, I know). I want to stay in this body and am not interested in taking hormones or getting surgery to change my body.
I am fine with female pronouns. I also find it kind of flattering and somehow "right" when people use male pronouns with me. It is always appreciated when they ask what I prefer, because it's just generally good manners I guess, but also because I can tell they see something about me that is on a genderqueer spectrum, and I like being seen correctly.
I don't refer to myself as transgender because, maybe similar to your concern, I have many close friends who are transexual and I don't want to feel like I'm jumping on the bandwagon or stealing someone else's identity or whatever. I would never have this judgement of someone else's self-label, this is just, for me, for whatever reason, what feels respectful to my loved ones given my personal gender.
I don't feel like a woman the way 95% of the women I meet seem like - at least the way I read them. I know that there are infinite numbers of ways to be a woman. I just don't feel like one of those ways. On the other hand, I don't really feel like 95% of men I meet either. I feel like a masculine female gender I guess, that is not super common really.
For me this is not a big part of what occupies my thinking about myself. It's not something I need to process much emotionally or verbally. But it is a core and deep part of me. For whatever reason - it is something that has just always felt easy or right to me (I was a deeply tomboy kid).
So what does all this mean for you? I don't know! I know my experience is super different from yours. I guess I'm trying to model for you, or show an example that there are many different ways to experience "alternative" (for lack of other easy phrase) gender identity. I have one "alternative" way, and there are a million other ways to be gendered or not gendered.
I wish you the best in finding and learning the way that feels true to you.
posted by latkes at 5:50 PM on August 12, 2013 [4 favorites]
Hi, I'm a bi person who describes her relationship to gender as "not being very good at femaleness".
Re attraction: you like who you like. You can give that whatever name you want, from "gay but every once in awhile, hey, you never know" to "bi" to "queer" to "a 4 on the Kinsey scale", or you can choose to not give any special name to your extremely specific sexuality at all*.
Re gender: I consider myself cisgender and definitely use feminine pronouns for myself. But I absolutely hate a lot of aspects of conforming to female gender standards, especially in terms of appearance. Like you, I also feel like "oh OK, I got XX, that's cool..." but would probably be equally happy as a man. I don't feel like I'm a guy trapped in a female body, but whether I'm female or male doesn't make a strong difference to my life. There are some things about my personality which are traditionally female, and other things which definitely aren't. But I tend to feel like, if I were male, there would be things about me that skewed "appropriate gender expression for men", and other things which definitely weren't. I've never felt like I was the "wrong" gender, just that I'm one of those people who kind of sucks at being a specific socially-agreed-on gender. Make sense?
Anyway, it sounds like you fall into the same category? I don't know, I feel like if you think you're transgender, then that's your experience of your gender, OK. On the other hand, I feel like my gender situation is similar to yours and I would never presume to include myself in that category, knowing a little about the actual experiences of "actual" transpeople. I mean, my gender dysphoria amounts to refusing to shave my pits, not grokking the whole makeup concept, and being ok with my grubby nails.
*FWIW in my experience and personal opinion, I feel like everyone has a specific style of attraction that is absolutely specific to them. Which may or may not map in a literal way to their named public orientation. There are lots of straight people who've had a few queer experiences but don't identify that way, gay people who have one or two hetero partners in their past, etc. There's nothing wrong with that, in my opinion.
posted by Sara C. at 6:38 PM on August 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
Re attraction: you like who you like. You can give that whatever name you want, from "gay but every once in awhile, hey, you never know" to "bi" to "queer" to "a 4 on the Kinsey scale", or you can choose to not give any special name to your extremely specific sexuality at all*.
Re gender: I consider myself cisgender and definitely use feminine pronouns for myself. But I absolutely hate a lot of aspects of conforming to female gender standards, especially in terms of appearance. Like you, I also feel like "oh OK, I got XX, that's cool..." but would probably be equally happy as a man. I don't feel like I'm a guy trapped in a female body, but whether I'm female or male doesn't make a strong difference to my life. There are some things about my personality which are traditionally female, and other things which definitely aren't. But I tend to feel like, if I were male, there would be things about me that skewed "appropriate gender expression for men", and other things which definitely weren't. I've never felt like I was the "wrong" gender, just that I'm one of those people who kind of sucks at being a specific socially-agreed-on gender. Make sense?
Anyway, it sounds like you fall into the same category? I don't know, I feel like if you think you're transgender, then that's your experience of your gender, OK. On the other hand, I feel like my gender situation is similar to yours and I would never presume to include myself in that category, knowing a little about the actual experiences of "actual" transpeople. I mean, my gender dysphoria amounts to refusing to shave my pits, not grokking the whole makeup concept, and being ok with my grubby nails.
*FWIW in my experience and personal opinion, I feel like everyone has a specific style of attraction that is absolutely specific to them. Which may or may not map in a literal way to their named public orientation. There are lots of straight people who've had a few queer experiences but don't identify that way, gay people who have one or two hetero partners in their past, etc. There's nothing wrong with that, in my opinion.
posted by Sara C. at 6:38 PM on August 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I know exactly what you're saying about privilege! As a gay man who has never questioned his gender identity, I can't really do enough justice to this question. Fortunately, I have plenty of friends who happen to be genderqueer/trans* and I'm in particular very close to one of them, so I took the liberty of using this question as an excuse to interview them about something I've wanted to learn more about for some time. Here's a summary of what I talked to them about, both now and in the past, plus collecting it with stuff that other genderqueer/trans* individuals have told me:
posted by Conspire at 7:27 PM on August 12, 2013 [4 favorites]
- Everyone relates to their gender differently depending on personal experiences. There's no need to prove yourself, nor are there any personal experiences that you absolutely MUST have to be trans*. Identify as whatever you feel comfortable with - if you don't claim to speak for other people, no one can say that you're fake. There's no such thing as real or fake trans*.
- Remember that gender identity and sexual orientation are related but ultimately separate. In addition, gender presentation is also separate. Just like how sexual orientation can be fluid, gender identity and presentation can be fluid as well. Sometimes my friend wakes up and feels totally like a girl and wants to throw on a dress and be called "she"; other times, they wake up in boy mode and won't stop texting me with questions on what it's like to have a dick. And even other times, they wake up as a girl and want to dress all butch. And that's all okay.
- You don't need to force a label on yourself if you don't want to. It's okay to just "be". In some of the idle speculation I've had with them in the past, the two of us have wondered if most people have had moments of gender fluidity, but had never really questioned them or given much thought to them due to the way they're taught that gender is binary; but they still identify as female/male. Patriarchy-constructed gender binaries may be the dominant model, but in no way does it necessarily reflect human experience.
- On that note, it is precisely because of the gender binary that people internalize that it is not particularly uncommon to realize really late into the game that one's gender identity doesn't match the models society shoves upon us. So don't downgrade your personal realization as being less "worthy" because it was sudden when the common narrative is that it's something that people have always "angsted over" and "always known." Again, as long as you don't claim to speak for other people, your experiences are all that matter.
- And on THAT note, again, there's no requirement that you have to be this trans* to identify as trans*. For instance, if you choose to pick up the genderqueer label even just because you have troubles with the way society defines gender and don't particularly have that many glaring genderqueer experiences, that is perfectly fine so long as you aren't denigrating anyone else's experiences.
- This is going to be a lot of introspection on your part. Try to have fun with it, experiment with your gender identity and presentation, and figure out what feels more comfortable. Try to have fun with it!
- In summary, I would stress that you should be cautious in trying to develop and validate what you're feeling based upon other people's experiences. While you can read up on a billion accounts of how other trans* people have felt in the past, your experience is still uniquely yours, and any contradictory accounts do not say anything about the validity of your experiences. A special note of caution here is that sometimes cultural resistance against trans* people can shape how trans* people choose to present their narratives publicly. It's like the 'born this way' narrative of being gay - it's technically not 100% true, and the truth is probably a lot greyer than that, but we present it in a simplified and more sympathetic way for general consumption. Trans* experiences can be subject to the same forces.
posted by Conspire at 7:27 PM on August 12, 2013 [4 favorites]
I don't know if anyone can say what is "normal" for cis people or not. Are there any statistics for internal sense of gender among self-identified cis people?
I know a couple of cis people who have described to me that they feel so strongly gendered that if they were in the body of the other gender, they would want to fully transistion back. They have a sense of an internal gender which is as strong as any trans* person I have met.
But there are also people who may be default cis: people without a strong gender identity - or who feel like they are both genders - who have continued in their birth gender because that was the easiest thing to do, and because transistioning wouldn't be "truer" for them. Some may identify as genderqueer, but chose to not change pronouns because that is not important to them. (And because English wants gender in pronouns, unlike, for example, Chinese).
It's also possible to experience episodic gender dysphoria (rather than the consistent dysphoria that trans* people describe before transitioning). Or at least I think so, because I feel like I have experienced episodic gender dysphoria - the feeling like I'm in the wrong body or would be happier as the other gender. But it is periodic and doesn't last, so I don't want to transition, for fear of just flipping my dysphoria. I identified as cis for a long while; now, I might identify as cis-ish or genderqueer but can't be bothered with changing pronouns.
As for crossdressing women in the 17th century: everyone should read the excellent book by two Dutch scholars called The Tradition of Female Travavestitism in Early Modern Europe. It looks at 100 or more women who passed as men for short and long periods. Some were just looking to travel safely; others expressed feelings of being like a man inside. It's a fascinating read, and based on accounts of real women from court cases, etc, rather than literature.
posted by jb at 8:39 PM on August 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
I know a couple of cis people who have described to me that they feel so strongly gendered that if they were in the body of the other gender, they would want to fully transistion back. They have a sense of an internal gender which is as strong as any trans* person I have met.
But there are also people who may be default cis: people without a strong gender identity - or who feel like they are both genders - who have continued in their birth gender because that was the easiest thing to do, and because transistioning wouldn't be "truer" for them. Some may identify as genderqueer, but chose to not change pronouns because that is not important to them. (And because English wants gender in pronouns, unlike, for example, Chinese).
It's also possible to experience episodic gender dysphoria (rather than the consistent dysphoria that trans* people describe before transitioning). Or at least I think so, because I feel like I have experienced episodic gender dysphoria - the feeling like I'm in the wrong body or would be happier as the other gender. But it is periodic and doesn't last, so I don't want to transition, for fear of just flipping my dysphoria. I identified as cis for a long while; now, I might identify as cis-ish or genderqueer but can't be bothered with changing pronouns.
As for crossdressing women in the 17th century: everyone should read the excellent book by two Dutch scholars called The Tradition of Female Travavestitism in Early Modern Europe. It looks at 100 or more women who passed as men for short and long periods. Some were just looking to travel safely; others expressed feelings of being like a man inside. It's a fascinating read, and based on accounts of real women from court cases, etc, rather than literature.
posted by jb at 8:39 PM on August 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
I am a cis woman. If I woke up tomorrow with a male body, it might be hot for a while, but I would rapidly want to go back to my own body. I identify very strongly as a woman, and I feel very female -- but not particularly "feminine." My dress is fairly utilitarian, I wear makeup sometimes but not a lot, I don't do anything to my hair except let it grow and pull it back and cut it short occasionally, etc.
I strongly, STRONGLY reject binary and gender-essentialist roles. I don't like to play with power tools "in spite" of being a woman; I like to play with power tools, and I am a woman. I don't like to snuggle with my children "because" I am a woman; I like to snuggle with my children, and I am a woman. Etc.
So, there you go. I peg the needle in terms of having a strong gender identity, but my culturally-bound gender presentation and expression does not really have the same fervor about it.
posted by KathrynT at 9:06 PM on August 12, 2013 [4 favorites]
I strongly, STRONGLY reject binary and gender-essentialist roles. I don't like to play with power tools "in spite" of being a woman; I like to play with power tools, and I am a woman. I don't like to snuggle with my children "because" I am a woman; I like to snuggle with my children, and I am a woman. Etc.
So, there you go. I peg the needle in terms of having a strong gender identity, but my culturally-bound gender presentation and expression does not really have the same fervor about it.
posted by KathrynT at 9:06 PM on August 12, 2013 [4 favorites]
I'm agender. I never had any desire to do "stereotypical" masculine or feminine things, or dress in a specific way that would lean to one or the other. I simply don't care at all and am often not even aware what others consider "typical male" or "typical female". It never made sense to me.
Androgyny, as you said yourself, is having characteristics of both. Agender is having those of neither. So in my, umm, expert opinion, you sound more like androgyne than agender, since you say you are interested in and aware of fashion and have a desire to try out "feminine" things.
posted by MinusCelsius at 10:26 PM on August 12, 2013
Androgyny, as you said yourself, is having characteristics of both. Agender is having those of neither. So in my, umm, expert opinion, you sound more like androgyne than agender, since you say you are interested in and aware of fashion and have a desire to try out "feminine" things.
posted by MinusCelsius at 10:26 PM on August 12, 2013
You haven't mentioned if you have considered it, but given your specific examples of things you've been excited to try lately, if you are trying to find a label that fits who you are now you might look at crossdressing. Many crossdressers are cisgender, but of course it is possible to be non-cisgendered and interested in crossdressing as well.
Also, it's not like there's going to be some terrible consequence for taking some time to figure out what label you want to use for yourself. You are exploring now, and you don't have to know what you "are" yet.
posted by yohko at 10:49 PM on August 12, 2013
Also, it's not like there's going to be some terrible consequence for taking some time to figure out what label you want to use for yourself. You are exploring now, and you don't have to know what you "are" yet.
posted by yohko at 10:49 PM on August 12, 2013
I'm a ciswoman and I think I feel very much like KathrynT above. I am a woman and identify as a woman. On the other hand, for most of my life I have felt like I am "not a real girl". Which is to say I'm not traditionally feminine - don't wear makeup, don't have a massive shoe collection, don't love clothes shopping for fun, shave my legs only sporadically if at all and armpits only if surgery requires me to. I think I own one skirt and haven't worn it in years. On the other hand, sometimes I like painting my (short) fingernails. I like men's clothing, but because I have boobs and hips it doesn't work on me, it isn't comfortable. Sometimes girlier clothing is, so I wear it. I love jewellery because it's pretty. I do girly things like cross-stitch but guy things like playing computer games. But again, like KathrynT said above, I do these things because I like doing them - not because they're gendered.
Sexuality is another spectrum. I have been, in my life, straight, asexual, bisexual, lesbian and sometimes terribly confused about it. I've learned that there's a lot of fluidity in sexual identity. And deprivation does strange things to your sexuality: there are days when I think I am pansexual because it has been so long since I've had it. It's why I like "queer" so much - it seems to have useful elements of fluidity in it.
Anyway, there are no rules for any of this. It can just be something you think about and play with and experiment with. You don't have to be anything. It's completely up to you. But nailpolish is definitely fun.
Also, if you didn't see this FPP yesterday you should check it out. There's a lot of people out there thinking about these things, sometimes along similar angles to you!
posted by Athanassiel at 11:01 PM on August 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
Sexuality is another spectrum. I have been, in my life, straight, asexual, bisexual, lesbian and sometimes terribly confused about it. I've learned that there's a lot of fluidity in sexual identity. And deprivation does strange things to your sexuality: there are days when I think I am pansexual because it has been so long since I've had it. It's why I like "queer" so much - it seems to have useful elements of fluidity in it.
Anyway, there are no rules for any of this. It can just be something you think about and play with and experiment with. You don't have to be anything. It's completely up to you. But nailpolish is definitely fun.
Also, if you didn't see this FPP yesterday you should check it out. There's a lot of people out there thinking about these things, sometimes along similar angles to you!
posted by Athanassiel at 11:01 PM on August 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
If you were genderqueer, you'd feel abnormal in airports.
Airports are somehow the most rigidly gendered places I've ever been in, except for children's toy stores. Maybe it's all the TSA surveillance that does it, or all the men's and women's restrooms, or the fact that on a transcontinental flight you will be herded into close proximity with approximately 200 other people for many inescapable hours. Outside of Almódovar films, people who travel on airplanes somehow self-select for conventional gender presentation. It's not just middle- or upper-class identity (air travel being expensive).
In LAX and Houston International I was wearing a heavy leather jacket and pants, and I have short hair. I started thinking, "Why didn't I wear something pink?"
There's also a dearth of lower-income people, black, Hispanic, needless to say Arab-American air travelers in U.S. airports.
posted by bad grammar at 2:21 PM on August 13, 2013
Airports are somehow the most rigidly gendered places I've ever been in, except for children's toy stores. Maybe it's all the TSA surveillance that does it, or all the men's and women's restrooms, or the fact that on a transcontinental flight you will be herded into close proximity with approximately 200 other people for many inescapable hours. Outside of Almódovar films, people who travel on airplanes somehow self-select for conventional gender presentation. It's not just middle- or upper-class identity (air travel being expensive).
In LAX and Houston International I was wearing a heavy leather jacket and pants, and I have short hair. I started thinking, "Why didn't I wear something pink?"
There's also a dearth of lower-income people, black, Hispanic, needless to say Arab-American air travelers in U.S. airports.
posted by bad grammar at 2:21 PM on August 13, 2013
Response by poster: Thank you for your responses, you've given me a lot to think about.
posted by A Puppet made from a Sock at 12:42 PM on August 14, 2013
posted by A Puppet made from a Sock at 12:42 PM on August 14, 2013
Response by poster: So, I figured I'd follow up. I tried the nail polish thing, and I think it's just not me. I had a friend coo over it, who I've since given the bottle of polish to, but it just didn't feel right. It felt like I was taking something female and applying it to myself, like I was using a fluorescent marker to add highlighting to a particular sentence in a book. I was making something about myself stand out that didn't really warrant standing out.
I tried the Gender Gumby thing, which was interesting. It seems that I'm all over the map, so I think I'm going to identify as AOTM.
Regarding my physical conformation, I kind of wish that my body was made of LEGO so that I could attach (and more likely, remove) various different bits and bobs at will.
posted by A Puppet made from a Sock at 2:21 AM on February 13, 2014 [1 favorite]
I tried the Gender Gumby thing, which was interesting. It seems that I'm all over the map, so I think I'm going to identify as AOTM.
Regarding my physical conformation, I kind of wish that my body was made of LEGO so that I could attach (and more likely, remove) various different bits and bobs at will.
posted by A Puppet made from a Sock at 2:21 AM on February 13, 2014 [1 favorite]
« Older I want to get paid for what I was told I'd be paid... | I feel a crushing lack of energy, apathy, lack of... Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
I have no idea what it feels like to be A Woman, and I am one. I only know how it feels to be *this* woman, the one I am. I like my body fine - it doesn't feel wrong or alien to me in any way. There are a great many ways to be a man or a woman, internally and ex-, so the fact that you don't know what it feels like to be a man may have a lot less to do with being trans* than it does with you thinking consciously about what it "means" to "be" a man or a woman.
Or not. I have no idea if you're trans* or not. You certainly wouldn't be the first trans* person to have the realization long past puberty.
posted by rtha at 3:06 PM on August 12, 2013 [13 favorites]