Why do I always end up in the 'Friend Zone'?
June 11, 2013 5:09 PM Subscribe
This happens to me far too often when I've dated men, I hear the 'I like you as a friend' after a handful of dates far too often. Is there something I could be doing wrong?
I'm a 29, almost 30 woman. I've been single for a few months, was with Ex-SO for 5 years. Recently put myself out there again and met a great guy. Hit it off right away, had a lot in common, some great dates but by date 6 he sat me down and said he loves spending time with me but he wants to be my friend and nothing more. I'm ok with that but just have a hard time figuring out why this keeps happening. In my early 20s when I was single it happened a lot, met great guy, fun dates and was 'friended by date 4 or 5.
I feel like I'm doing something wrong or something is wrong with me??? I get if there is no chemistry or spark people want to movie on, but on the dates it appears that there is? Unless I'm completely delusional? I've honestly tried to reflect as to why this happens so much and I can't figure it out.
Here is what I don't do:
-I don't over share info about past relationships
-Sleep with someone right away (usually wait until we are exclusive)
-act like a crazy or clingy
-act like one of the guys.
Help me get some perspective and clarity? Help me breat this pattern!
I'm a 29, almost 30 woman. I've been single for a few months, was with Ex-SO for 5 years. Recently put myself out there again and met a great guy. Hit it off right away, had a lot in common, some great dates but by date 6 he sat me down and said he loves spending time with me but he wants to be my friend and nothing more. I'm ok with that but just have a hard time figuring out why this keeps happening. In my early 20s when I was single it happened a lot, met great guy, fun dates and was 'friended by date 4 or 5.
I feel like I'm doing something wrong or something is wrong with me??? I get if there is no chemistry or spark people want to movie on, but on the dates it appears that there is? Unless I'm completely delusional? I've honestly tried to reflect as to why this happens so much and I can't figure it out.
Here is what I don't do:
-I don't over share info about past relationships
-Sleep with someone right away (usually wait until we are exclusive)
-act like a crazy or clingy
-act like one of the guys.
Help me get some perspective and clarity? Help me breat this pattern!
There's no accounting for taste.
You don't seem delusional. If you went on 4 or 5 dates then he must have thought you were pretty cool. But at some point his attraction went *poof*. Who knows, maybe his ex called him. Maybe he discovered he has some crazy fetish. Maybe he really wants somebody who's older or taller or who shares his secret love of Phil Collins. It doesn't matter because it's his problem.
I think you should be glad you were let down after just 4 or 5 dates. It's frustrating as hell but at least you are now know that it was not going to work out. It's ok to analyze a little bit but then you should just move on as best as you can without thinking that you did something wrong.
posted by mr.ersatz at 5:23 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
You don't seem delusional. If you went on 4 or 5 dates then he must have thought you were pretty cool. But at some point his attraction went *poof*. Who knows, maybe his ex called him. Maybe he discovered he has some crazy fetish. Maybe he really wants somebody who's older or taller or who shares his secret love of Phil Collins. It doesn't matter because it's his problem.
I think you should be glad you were let down after just 4 or 5 dates. It's frustrating as hell but at least you are now know that it was not going to work out. It's ok to analyze a little bit but then you should just move on as best as you can without thinking that you did something wrong.
posted by mr.ersatz at 5:23 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
I think that "let's be friends" is the way many people say, "I like you and you're a great person, but that spark I'm looking for isn't there with you."
If you're dating decent people who are not just going to disappear/stop calling/be jerks if they don't feel like you're the one for them, you'll get this a lot. From the numbers you listed above, I don't think that this is a chronic problem. You're well within the normal limits.
Keep dating and you'll find someone with mutual spark and mutual goals.
posted by quince at 5:24 PM on June 11, 2013 [6 favorites]
If you're dating decent people who are not just going to disappear/stop calling/be jerks if they don't feel like you're the one for them, you'll get this a lot. From the numbers you listed above, I don't think that this is a chronic problem. You're well within the normal limits.
Keep dating and you'll find someone with mutual spark and mutual goals.
posted by quince at 5:24 PM on June 11, 2013 [6 favorites]
Ask your newly-expanded circle of male friends to keep an eye out among their friends for a great guy or two for you.
posted by nicebookrack at 5:28 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by nicebookrack at 5:28 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
You just got out of a relationship, you've been single a few months, and you had this thing happen with one guy.
Major Problem Alert!!!!
Oh, wait . . .
You say this "keeps happening," but it sort of sounds like you're grasping for a pattern. You just got out of a five year relationship. You haven't been single in a long time. You're looking back at your dating info from five years ago, and as I said, it sounds like you're looking for a pattern.
And by the way, "let's just be friends" is an attempt at a kind break-up. Most relationships don't work out. Flag and move on. People say weird things that they don't one hundred percent mean because it seems like the right thing to say at a given moment.
Shit happens. Your only problem is that you need to stop looking for problems. And that you sound a bit judgmental about other women, all those "crazy and clingy" women who sleep with guys right away and "act like one of the guys," or whatever. Dating isn't a meritocracy, okay? I am really attractive, and I am in the midst of a dry spell from hell. It's not like there's a big measuring stick in the sky that says who deserves a boyfriend or to get laid or whatever. Nor is there a measuring stick in the sky that says that there is some concrete thing objectively wrong with you that made this guy not want to date you. You guys just weren't right for each other. Happens all the time.
But yeah, once in the past five years isn't a pattern.
If this goes on and on for, like, a year, come back to us. But otherwise, chill out.
posted by ablazingsaddle at 5:34 PM on June 11, 2013 [13 favorites]
Major Problem Alert!!!!
Oh, wait . . .
You say this "keeps happening," but it sort of sounds like you're grasping for a pattern. You just got out of a five year relationship. You haven't been single in a long time. You're looking back at your dating info from five years ago, and as I said, it sounds like you're looking for a pattern.
And by the way, "let's just be friends" is an attempt at a kind break-up. Most relationships don't work out. Flag and move on. People say weird things that they don't one hundred percent mean because it seems like the right thing to say at a given moment.
Shit happens. Your only problem is that you need to stop looking for problems. And that you sound a bit judgmental about other women, all those "crazy and clingy" women who sleep with guys right away and "act like one of the guys," or whatever. Dating isn't a meritocracy, okay? I am really attractive, and I am in the midst of a dry spell from hell. It's not like there's a big measuring stick in the sky that says who deserves a boyfriend or to get laid or whatever. Nor is there a measuring stick in the sky that says that there is some concrete thing objectively wrong with you that made this guy not want to date you. You guys just weren't right for each other. Happens all the time.
But yeah, once in the past five years isn't a pattern.
If this goes on and on for, like, a year, come back to us. But otherwise, chill out.
posted by ablazingsaddle at 5:34 PM on June 11, 2013 [13 favorites]
I agree that this sounds normal. I met a lot of people on OKCupid that I stayed friends with because one or both of us felt more platonic about the other than romantic. It's a numbers game. Enjoy the friendships and maybe you'll meet a partner through one of them, who knows?
posted by xenophile at 5:35 PM on June 11, 2013
posted by xenophile at 5:35 PM on June 11, 2013
Be more fun. The more genuine fun you emanate, the more people will want to spend time with you. I think a lot of dating advice boils down to this.
But ... you say you've been single for just a few months after a 5 year relationship. It might take you a while to break out of your previous relationship mindset and be open to someone new. That's what they might be picking up on.
posted by griselda at 5:39 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
But ... you say you've been single for just a few months after a 5 year relationship. It might take you a while to break out of your previous relationship mindset and be open to someone new. That's what they might be picking up on.
posted by griselda at 5:39 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: To ablazingsaddle
I appreciate the advice but to be clear the comment that it keeps happening was referring to in my early 20s when similar things would happen all too often. Because it happened with the first guy I was seeing since my break up I just don't want to fall into that pattern again if there is something I'm doing wrong.
And the list I made was not intended to be judgemental, but common reasons why men (from the mouths of many men in my life) usually are not into women after a few dates. Not saying that's always the case.
posted by bluehermit at 5:39 PM on June 11, 2013
I appreciate the advice but to be clear the comment that it keeps happening was referring to in my early 20s when similar things would happen all too often. Because it happened with the first guy I was seeing since my break up I just don't want to fall into that pattern again if there is something I'm doing wrong.
And the list I made was not intended to be judgemental, but common reasons why men (from the mouths of many men in my life) usually are not into women after a few dates. Not saying that's always the case.
posted by bluehermit at 5:39 PM on June 11, 2013
Just as an aside, if you wait until you're exclusive with a guy for sexytimes to happen, you may wind up pushing some guys away. And not necessarily bad guys. With both my marriages and most of my long term relationships, sexy times happened pretty fast.
If I went on five dates with a girl and nothing happened sexually, I would probably assume we were just going to be friends.
posted by musofire at 5:45 PM on June 11, 2013 [11 favorites]
If I went on five dates with a girl and nothing happened sexually, I would probably assume we were just going to be friends.
posted by musofire at 5:45 PM on June 11, 2013 [11 favorites]
I don't know the "why." Maybe ask a guy friend who's known you a while? I know it's obvious, but it's what I'd do.
OK, I am no champion of dating, but here's what I'd do about it. Make a move a little sooner so as not to waste your time. Assuming you're attractive enough to GET to date 4 or 5, he would hardly recoil if you got a little friendly on date 2. If you're progressing that far, right, he must not think you're ugly. So try to clarify things sooner. I don't mean sex. I mean a little more than hand-holding. Then you'll know something's up if, well, a red-blooded man doesn't want to do more than hold hands.
posted by skbw at 5:47 PM on June 11, 2013
OK, I am no champion of dating, but here's what I'd do about it. Make a move a little sooner so as not to waste your time. Assuming you're attractive enough to GET to date 4 or 5, he would hardly recoil if you got a little friendly on date 2. If you're progressing that far, right, he must not think you're ugly. So try to clarify things sooner. I don't mean sex. I mean a little more than hand-holding. Then you'll know something's up if, well, a red-blooded man doesn't want to do more than hold hands.
posted by skbw at 5:47 PM on June 11, 2013
My gut reaction, if you're going on like 6 dates with a guy, and you're not sleeping with him, what sort of romantic stuff is going on? I'm totally not telling you to get physical with anyone before you are ready, not at all, but is there romantic energy? Are you open to that sort of energy, or do you just shut it down? You may not be acting like a man, but are you in your feminine mind? If I was hanging around with a man where he didn't even seem interested in sex, I would lose interest romantically. It's kind of one of the larger points of dating, right?
posted by amodelcitizen at 5:49 PM on June 11, 2013 [9 favorites]
posted by amodelcitizen at 5:49 PM on June 11, 2013 [9 favorites]
Hey, if you don't want to sleep with someone, please don't feel you have to sleep with them in order to progress the relationship: that's arrant nonsense and there are plenty of guys that would be perfectly happy not jumping into bed straight away and may even prefer.
It does not make you less attractive, and does not, in my opinion, fall under the rubric of "things you should change to get a steady, good boyfriend/girlfriend". Doing things you are not comfortable with is not a great way to get a good relationship.
I wouldn't get too hooked up on this one guy, it's just a statistical thing. I don't think you are doing *anything* wrong.
posted by smoke at 5:50 PM on June 11, 2013 [21 favorites]
It does not make you less attractive, and does not, in my opinion, fall under the rubric of "things you should change to get a steady, good boyfriend/girlfriend". Doing things you are not comfortable with is not a great way to get a good relationship.
I wouldn't get too hooked up on this one guy, it's just a statistical thing. I don't think you are doing *anything* wrong.
posted by smoke at 5:50 PM on June 11, 2013 [21 favorites]
Sample size is too small. Give it a year and revisit your opinion on whether this is a problem or not.
Dating is like anything else. A new job, a new house, a new pretty much anything. If you haven't done it and it's a sudden change everything is going to feel weird and wrong and out of place and like it doesn't fit, or there's something wrong with it.
Everyone blows a bunch of dates, everyone gets friendzoned. A few people win instantly but that's like the lottery on top of the normal experiences everyone else is having. Winning it is like getting a free drink from a bartender you don't even know. Completely chance, and don't expect it.
The alternative to friendzoning is, as others said, short lived flings that burn out quickly when you play the same script but sleep with the person. That obviously isn't what you want, so keep fishing. Nothing is wrong here and this is how the "system" works.
posted by emptythought at 5:54 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
Dating is like anything else. A new job, a new house, a new pretty much anything. If you haven't done it and it's a sudden change everything is going to feel weird and wrong and out of place and like it doesn't fit, or there's something wrong with it.
Everyone blows a bunch of dates, everyone gets friendzoned. A few people win instantly but that's like the lottery on top of the normal experiences everyone else is having. Winning it is like getting a free drink from a bartender you don't even know. Completely chance, and don't expect it.
The alternative to friendzoning is, as others said, short lived flings that burn out quickly when you play the same script but sleep with the person. That obviously isn't what you want, so keep fishing. Nothing is wrong here and this is how the "system" works.
posted by emptythought at 5:54 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
I appreciate the advice but to be clear the comment that it keeps happening was referring to in my early 20s when similar things would happen all too often.
You just got dumped a fair bit in your early 20's. I stand by my earlier comment - this is normal. There is no such thing as a "friendzone". There is a kind, gentle sort of dumping. You are normal. Not a special snowflake. Dating sucks.
And the list I made was not intended to be judgemental, but common reasons why men (from the mouths of many men in my life) usually are not into women after a few dates. Not saying that's always the case.
As I said above, there's no checklist. There's no magic bullet. And the way you're thinking about this, as some sort of linear "This is what guys like" thing is going to drive you crazy. People are into or not into people for all sorts of reasons. "Clingy" women get married every day. Women who act like one of the guys have boyfriends. Guys say bitchy things to justify dumping a girl. No need to read the tea leaves.
I agree with other comments, though, suggesting that if there is nothing physical going on, a guy might not feel romantic chemistry with you. Not talking about sex, but do you make out with guys? Do you hold their hands?
posted by ablazingsaddle at 5:57 PM on June 11, 2013 [10 favorites]
You just got dumped a fair bit in your early 20's. I stand by my earlier comment - this is normal. There is no such thing as a "friendzone". There is a kind, gentle sort of dumping. You are normal. Not a special snowflake. Dating sucks.
And the list I made was not intended to be judgemental, but common reasons why men (from the mouths of many men in my life) usually are not into women after a few dates. Not saying that's always the case.
As I said above, there's no checklist. There's no magic bullet. And the way you're thinking about this, as some sort of linear "This is what guys like" thing is going to drive you crazy. People are into or not into people for all sorts of reasons. "Clingy" women get married every day. Women who act like one of the guys have boyfriends. Guys say bitchy things to justify dumping a girl. No need to read the tea leaves.
I agree with other comments, though, suggesting that if there is nothing physical going on, a guy might not feel romantic chemistry with you. Not talking about sex, but do you make out with guys? Do you hold their hands?
posted by ablazingsaddle at 5:57 PM on June 11, 2013 [10 favorites]
My wild, wild stab in the dark of a guess is that you have an awesome, really fun, magnetic personality, but there is something physical about you that is an issue for these guys.
I'm guessing this because of a friend I have who has the same thing happen to her over and over. If this is the case for you I guess there are two things you can do. Obviously the first is work on the physical thing if it's possible, and that might be an issue. The second is to just keep trying. That's what my friend does, she is always meeting new guys and it seems quite likely to me that she'll find the right one for her in the end.
posted by cairdeas at 6:01 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
I'm guessing this because of a friend I have who has the same thing happen to her over and over. If this is the case for you I guess there are two things you can do. Obviously the first is work on the physical thing if it's possible, and that might be an issue. The second is to just keep trying. That's what my friend does, she is always meeting new guys and it seems quite likely to me that she'll find the right one for her in the end.
posted by cairdeas at 6:01 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: cairdeas you could be right, I've always carried 'a few extra pounds' and I've been working very hard the past year to shed the weight. Maybe that could make a difference, only time will tell I guess
posted by bluehermit at 6:04 PM on June 11, 2013
posted by bluehermit at 6:04 PM on June 11, 2013
Hey, if you don't want to sleep with someone, please don't feel you have to sleep with them in order to progress the relationship.
Seconding this so hard. If anything, doing something you're not comfortable with would if anything make you less attractive because it shows a lack of personal boundaries and self-respect (not that there is anything wrong or unattractive at all with sleeping with a guy on date 1 if that's what you want to do).
posted by Asparagus at 6:35 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
Seconding this so hard. If anything, doing something you're not comfortable with would if anything make you less attractive because it shows a lack of personal boundaries and self-respect (not that there is anything wrong or unattractive at all with sleeping with a guy on date 1 if that's what you want to do).
posted by Asparagus at 6:35 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
Look, as somebody who re-entered the dating pool after age 40, I feel for you. Dating sucks. People are finicky and prone to changing their mind at any time. Don't take it personally!
Don't worry about trying to not come off as "crazy" or "clingy." And if you feel a sudden need to kiss the guy (or more), then do it! If I had to guess, you may be working too hard to be "cool," which some men could read as not very interested. And as soon as somebody pulls that "friends" line with you, drop him like a dirty pair of socks.
And do not worry about your weight. A few extra pounds will not make the difference between dating success and ignominy.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 6:51 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
Don't worry about trying to not come off as "crazy" or "clingy." And if you feel a sudden need to kiss the guy (or more), then do it! If I had to guess, you may be working too hard to be "cool," which some men could read as not very interested. And as soon as somebody pulls that "friends" line with you, drop him like a dirty pair of socks.
And do not worry about your weight. A few extra pounds will not make the difference between dating success and ignominy.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 6:51 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
It sounds like the first time around, in your 20s, you dated a number of guys who didn't work out and then you dated the guy who became your boyfriend. I don't see why it won't go the same way this time around. The only thing that makes your situation a tad different from what happens all the time to everyone is that it takes 4-6 dates instead of 2-3 before the guys want out.
Maybe this is bad luck, or maybe you are choosing guys with a certain personality type or trait that makes them more passive/less decisive. Or for some reason--cultural or demographic?--the guys around you are more inclined to stretch out the early phase of dating longer than "normal" guys would. Does it sound to you as if it could be something along those lines?
Since (if I'm reading this right) you're not exclusive with these guys, it could just be that they're dating other women too and the timing is off. E.g. by your date #5 they've already reached date #7 with someone else, and she has asked them to be exclusive so they need to stop dating you.
FWIW in my experience the "few extra pounds" might prevent you from getting a date in the first place, but it's not something a guy suddenly notices and decides he doesn't like on the fifth date. If they thought you weren't attractive, they wouldn't continue past date #1.
posted by ocksay_uppetpay at 7:26 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
Maybe this is bad luck, or maybe you are choosing guys with a certain personality type or trait that makes them more passive/less decisive. Or for some reason--cultural or demographic?--the guys around you are more inclined to stretch out the early phase of dating longer than "normal" guys would. Does it sound to you as if it could be something along those lines?
Since (if I'm reading this right) you're not exclusive with these guys, it could just be that they're dating other women too and the timing is off. E.g. by your date #5 they've already reached date #7 with someone else, and she has asked them to be exclusive so they need to stop dating you.
FWIW in my experience the "few extra pounds" might prevent you from getting a date in the first place, but it's not something a guy suddenly notices and decides he doesn't like on the fifth date. If they thought you weren't attractive, they wouldn't continue past date #1.
posted by ocksay_uppetpay at 7:26 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
Not to push too hard on this, because obviously this might not be the issue at all, and there might not be "an issue" anyway... but someone can be unsure at the start if they are/could be attracted to you, and give it a lot of time just because they like your personality so much. I've definitely done that, met a guy and really wanted to be attracted to him because he was so great, and gave it a shot to see if my feeling would change.
posted by cairdeas at 7:38 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by cairdeas at 7:38 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
"let's just be friends", "not enough chemistry" and similar phrases are almost always a polite way to say "i think i can do better", sadly. It's also possible for people to keep going on dates (for various reasons) after deciding that it's probably not going to work out. The quick solution is to go on dates with people with worse social skills than you, so you can better read and encourage their interest. The better solution is to keep doing what you're doing (the rules you listed are good), live so that you're generally happy with your own life, and make your dates more romantic/exciting (but continue not sleeping together until you're sure you're both sure).
posted by sninctown at 8:29 PM on June 11, 2013
posted by sninctown at 8:29 PM on June 11, 2013
As others have said, there IS no friendzone. "I like us better as friends" / "I don't feel the romantic spark" -- these are just really popular lines people use to communicate that they don't want to date you any longer. But you know what's awesome? Your radar for decent guys must be pretty sharp. Otherwise your question would have been, "Why do guys always fade out and disappear on me without a word?"
Anyway, if you just look at this "friendzone" business as one exit strategy, and the "fade out" as another (less mannerly) exit strategy, then really all you're experiencing is the fact that it's hard to meet someone with whom you really click. Most of us currently in a relationship went on a hell of a lot of dates before we met our SO's. (Sounds like you know this from your own experiences before you had that 5+ year relationship.) The bad and good news, then: this will keep happening, until one day it doesn't -- until, that is, you meet someone who has been looking for a woman just like you. This is the guy you want to end up with, anyway -- not the one who'd prefer you fifteen pounds lighter, or who wishes you were quicker to jump in the sack with him, etc. etc.
My only advice to you stems from the following question: all of these recent relationships in which guys "friendzoned" you -- why did it always come down to the guy breaking it off?
When it comes to these non-starter kind of relationships (i.e., dating someone with whom you ultimately don't click), you seem to hold the guy's attention a lot longer than most women do. Why is that? Could it possibly be because you're overly focused on the fact that he seems to like you, rather than determining whether you really like HIM?
I mean, statistically, it seems highly unlikely to me that you've met several guys in a row you were absolutely over the moon about. (And you shouldn't keep going on dates with anyone unless you're 110% excited by him.) Go back over these guys in your head and ask yourself, were you really thrilled about each of them? And if not, then why weren't you more picky? Why didn't you end it? Why weren't you asking yourself after each date, "Do I really like this guy? Or is it more that I just like the feeling that he's into me?" Asking yourself these questions might have led to YOU breaking it off much earlier -- with a couple of them, at least.
Anyway, my tip for future dates: forbid yourself from wondering if he likes you. Forbid yourself from trying to make him like you. Keep asking yourself only this: "Do I really like him?"
At the least, this may restore to you a sense of your own agency in the dating process--something which (judging from your question) you feel the lack of right now.
posted by artemisia at 9:45 PM on June 11, 2013 [18 favorites]
Anyway, if you just look at this "friendzone" business as one exit strategy, and the "fade out" as another (less mannerly) exit strategy, then really all you're experiencing is the fact that it's hard to meet someone with whom you really click. Most of us currently in a relationship went on a hell of a lot of dates before we met our SO's. (Sounds like you know this from your own experiences before you had that 5+ year relationship.) The bad and good news, then: this will keep happening, until one day it doesn't -- until, that is, you meet someone who has been looking for a woman just like you. This is the guy you want to end up with, anyway -- not the one who'd prefer you fifteen pounds lighter, or who wishes you were quicker to jump in the sack with him, etc. etc.
My only advice to you stems from the following question: all of these recent relationships in which guys "friendzoned" you -- why did it always come down to the guy breaking it off?
When it comes to these non-starter kind of relationships (i.e., dating someone with whom you ultimately don't click), you seem to hold the guy's attention a lot longer than most women do. Why is that? Could it possibly be because you're overly focused on the fact that he seems to like you, rather than determining whether you really like HIM?
I mean, statistically, it seems highly unlikely to me that you've met several guys in a row you were absolutely over the moon about. (And you shouldn't keep going on dates with anyone unless you're 110% excited by him.) Go back over these guys in your head and ask yourself, were you really thrilled about each of them? And if not, then why weren't you more picky? Why didn't you end it? Why weren't you asking yourself after each date, "Do I really like this guy? Or is it more that I just like the feeling that he's into me?" Asking yourself these questions might have led to YOU breaking it off much earlier -- with a couple of them, at least.
Anyway, my tip for future dates: forbid yourself from wondering if he likes you. Forbid yourself from trying to make him like you. Keep asking yourself only this: "Do I really like him?"
At the least, this may restore to you a sense of your own agency in the dating process--something which (judging from your question) you feel the lack of right now.
posted by artemisia at 9:45 PM on June 11, 2013 [18 favorites]
I disagree that it's anything you're doing 'wrong'.
I do, however, agree with those who say your sample size is too small. If this had been happening for your whole twenties, then maybe. But you've just come out of a 5-year relationship: give it some time!
posted by Salamander at 10:03 PM on June 11, 2013
I do, however, agree with those who say your sample size is too small. If this had been happening for your whole twenties, then maybe. But you've just come out of a 5-year relationship: give it some time!
posted by Salamander at 10:03 PM on June 11, 2013
Oh, wait: just read what artemisia said instead. Several times. This is excellent advice, all of it. Especially the fact that being 'friendzoned' is actually just a kind of breakup that happens more to you cause you're cool and pick decent people, rather than the vanishing act that assholes are more likely to pull.
posted by Salamander at 10:06 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by Salamander at 10:06 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
I've always carried 'a few extra pounds' and I've been working very hard the past year to shed the weight.
There are plenty of men who either don't mind a few extra pounds or actually prefer it. So if they are going on 5-6 dates with you, then I do not think your weight would be a problem that would cause a pattern. I assume if a guy had a problem with your weight, then he would either not go on the first date or not get to the 2nd date. That being said. Being healthy is a good thing so I would not want to deter you from trying to be healthy. Just that I do not think it would be the root of the problem here.
I am inclined to think that maybe it is the type of guys you are attracted to combined with some trait in your personality that just makes you friendly rather than sexy and them date you for 4-5 times before realizing it. It might be hard to change. So just be yourself and when the right guy comes along then he will last longer than 4 dates! At least you find out quickly so you can move on rather than wasting 6 months at a time. Good luck.
posted by Jaelma24 at 10:25 PM on June 11, 2013
There are plenty of men who either don't mind a few extra pounds or actually prefer it. So if they are going on 5-6 dates with you, then I do not think your weight would be a problem that would cause a pattern. I assume if a guy had a problem with your weight, then he would either not go on the first date or not get to the 2nd date. That being said. Being healthy is a good thing so I would not want to deter you from trying to be healthy. Just that I do not think it would be the root of the problem here.
I am inclined to think that maybe it is the type of guys you are attracted to combined with some trait in your personality that just makes you friendly rather than sexy and them date you for 4-5 times before realizing it. It might be hard to change. So just be yourself and when the right guy comes along then he will last longer than 4 dates! At least you find out quickly so you can move on rather than wasting 6 months at a time. Good luck.
posted by Jaelma24 at 10:25 PM on June 11, 2013
like others have said guys wouldn't be asking you out if they had a problem with your weight. my guess is it is the lack of sex but you have to be true to who you are. are you physically affectionate with the guys you do like that you are dating? i think a lot of guys will wait a few months for sex with ms. right, but if they aren't getting any signals or encouragement then they may be likely to move on.
one thing you could do is just ask this latest guy to give you a heads up. you could send him an email to make it easier and just tell him you feel this has happened in the past and wondered if there was some vibe you are giving off that puts you in the friendzone and ask him what he thinks it is about.
posted by wildflower at 11:40 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
one thing you could do is just ask this latest guy to give you a heads up. you could send him an email to make it easier and just tell him you feel this has happened in the past and wondered if there was some vibe you are giving off that puts you in the friendzone and ask him what he thinks it is about.
posted by wildflower at 11:40 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
I join with some others in suspecting it is the lack of sex. I'm not saying that sex needs to happen at some magic point, but I think that for a lot of guys, they're not willing to get exclusive before having sex, because they don't know what they're jumping into, and don't want to feel like a jerk if they break up with you after the first time they have sex with you if it doesn't work out.
What physical stuff has happened with these guys, and how long - timewise, not date-wise - were these relationships?
Also, dude, the early twenties /suck/.
posted by corb at 12:21 AM on June 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
What physical stuff has happened with these guys, and how long - timewise, not date-wise - were these relationships?
Also, dude, the early twenties /suck/.
posted by corb at 12:21 AM on June 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
Honestly, it just sounds like you're experiencing the fact that its hard to meet someone you click with romantically. Really hard. 4-5 dates is about when you have to come to terms with the lack of chemistry, if you otherwise like the person.
But also, how are things going physically? If we don't have sex after five dates, and you don't explicitly tell me otherwise, I am most likely thinking that it's not going to happen and you don't want it to happen. Especially if we're not all hot and heavy but just stopping short of sex.
Finally, tell us more about what you do and don't do on dates. You're describing this pattern (as you see it), but the useful information (if you're right about the pattern) is about date details, not the pattern itself.
posted by J. Wilson at 6:09 AM on June 12, 2013
But also, how are things going physically? If we don't have sex after five dates, and you don't explicitly tell me otherwise, I am most likely thinking that it's not going to happen and you don't want it to happen. Especially if we're not all hot and heavy but just stopping short of sex.
Finally, tell us more about what you do and don't do on dates. You're describing this pattern (as you see it), but the useful information (if you're right about the pattern) is about date details, not the pattern itself.
posted by J. Wilson at 6:09 AM on June 12, 2013
Yes, the twenties suck - for everyone.
I'm going to guess you feel a little sexually underconfident. Getting to six dates seems like the guys are attracted to you and enjoy being around you. But I'm guessing (and I may be way wrong) that they may not be feeling your interest. You can show you're into them by flirting, being suggestive or playful, without jumping into bed with them if that's something you don't feel comfortable with in the early stages. Let yourself have a little fun. : )
posted by inkypinky at 6:10 AM on June 12, 2013
I'm going to guess you feel a little sexually underconfident. Getting to six dates seems like the guys are attracted to you and enjoy being around you. But I'm guessing (and I may be way wrong) that they may not be feeling your interest. You can show you're into them by flirting, being suggestive or playful, without jumping into bed with them if that's something you don't feel comfortable with in the early stages. Let yourself have a little fun. : )
posted by inkypinky at 6:10 AM on June 12, 2013
bluehermit: "I've always carried 'a few extra pounds' and I've been working very hard the past year to shed the weight"
It is NOT THIS. I promise you. Please don't take dating issues and turn them into weight issues. I've known thin women who I weren't attracted to, and I've know "curvy" women who were sex goddesses. If you were unattractive to him you wouldn't have gotten date one, much less six.
If this happens a lot, my guess is that you need to flirt more. You probably go on dates, and are nice and respectful, and he is too, and you both have a great time and it's fun and friendly. But not sexual and flirty. Work on that. As a man, I try to be very respectful of women's boundaries, especially early on, so if you aren't giving signals that you want to be touched/teased/flirted with, I won't do it. So take that initiative. Some ideas:
- Touch him more, gradually escalating, from arm to back to waist/chest to face.
- hold his hand
- snuggle up close to him. for any reason. for no reason
- brush your leg against his. play footsie with him
- Sexual hints/double entendres
- flip your hair, bite your lip, give him the seductive gaze, wink
- kiss him good night
Now I'm not saying go out and push your boundaries in a way that makes you uncomfortable, but it sounds like you want to date these guys. And, to me, the big difference between dating and being friends is sex, so I'm taking the logical leap that you would like to have sex with these guys. So just be a little less subtle about letting them know it.
posted by I am the Walrus at 6:23 AM on June 12, 2013 [8 favorites]
It is NOT THIS. I promise you. Please don't take dating issues and turn them into weight issues. I've known thin women who I weren't attracted to, and I've know "curvy" women who were sex goddesses. If you were unattractive to him you wouldn't have gotten date one, much less six.
If this happens a lot, my guess is that you need to flirt more. You probably go on dates, and are nice and respectful, and he is too, and you both have a great time and it's fun and friendly. But not sexual and flirty. Work on that. As a man, I try to be very respectful of women's boundaries, especially early on, so if you aren't giving signals that you want to be touched/teased/flirted with, I won't do it. So take that initiative. Some ideas:
- Touch him more, gradually escalating, from arm to back to waist/chest to face.
- hold his hand
- snuggle up close to him. for any reason. for no reason
- brush your leg against his. play footsie with him
- Sexual hints/double entendres
- flip your hair, bite your lip, give him the seductive gaze, wink
- kiss him good night
Now I'm not saying go out and push your boundaries in a way that makes you uncomfortable, but it sounds like you want to date these guys. And, to me, the big difference between dating and being friends is sex, so I'm taking the logical leap that you would like to have sex with these guys. So just be a little less subtle about letting them know it.
posted by I am the Walrus at 6:23 AM on June 12, 2013 [8 favorites]
I think what Jaelma about giving off friendly vibes rather than sexy vibes is very interesting.
I give off 'friendly' vibes. I am fun, funny and a bit quirky -- and I have dates like this, too. I am cute, albeit a little chubby and short....not sex goddess material at all. I don't really give off "sexy fun times" signals .....But I do to my partner. She finds me sexy. I sent sexy fun times vibes to her and vice versa.
I am not saying you are not sexy -- just that you will be very, very, very sexy to the right man no matter your weight! You just have to keep looking until you find that special guy. It just takes time. What you are going through sounds very normal.
posted by Lescha at 10:01 AM on June 12, 2013
I give off 'friendly' vibes. I am fun, funny and a bit quirky -- and I have dates like this, too. I am cute, albeit a little chubby and short....not sex goddess material at all. I don't really give off "sexy fun times" signals .....But I do to my partner. She finds me sexy. I sent sexy fun times vibes to her and vice versa.
I am not saying you are not sexy -- just that you will be very, very, very sexy to the right man no matter your weight! You just have to keep looking until you find that special guy. It just takes time. What you are going through sounds very normal.
posted by Lescha at 10:01 AM on June 12, 2013
Did you feel a spark with the most recent guy? Did you feel the same type of spark you did when you first met your Ex (assuming you two hit it off quickly)? When I first started online dating, I would always accept multiple dates from the same guy even if I didn't feel a connection to him. I kept hoping I would feel a connection to one of these guys since they were all great on paper. I discovered that if I didn't feel the spark after date one or two, I wasn't going to feel it.
I wonder if the guys are picking up on your lack of real interest. This has happened to me on several occasions where I just felt "meh" about the guy, but kept going on dates because I kept hoping the "meh" feeling would turn into something more. Now, I just don't go on more than two days with a guy unless I feel a spark and it is a huge relief.
posted by parakeetdog at 10:22 AM on June 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
I wonder if the guys are picking up on your lack of real interest. This has happened to me on several occasions where I just felt "meh" about the guy, but kept going on dates because I kept hoping the "meh" feeling would turn into something more. Now, I just don't go on more than two days with a guy unless I feel a spark and it is a huge relief.
posted by parakeetdog at 10:22 AM on June 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks everyone, really great advice I appreciate it!
Upon reading the responses and doing some reflecting, I think part of the problem is I'm sending a 'friendly vibe' vs. 'sexy vibe'. I think I just need to learn how to flirt better! I'm sitting, waiting for a guy to make the first move but if I'm not sending those signals then no wonder nothing really moves forward....
To answer some of the questions posed to me...
I'm at a point in my life where I don't need to be 100% exclusive to sleep with someone, but the connection has to be there for me to want to do it.
The dates always seem to go really well, usually consist of dinner, drinks, maybe a physical activity outside like hiking, golf, going for a walk.
artemisia you're right, a big chunk of them I probably wasn't into it as much as I hoped to be and maybe they picked up on that, or I sent out 'not interested' signals. Most recent guy I was really into, just probably sat back too much waiting for something to happen.
I just need flirting lessons to get the ball rolling I think :)
Thanks again everyone!
posted by bluehermit at 12:28 PM on June 12, 2013
Upon reading the responses and doing some reflecting, I think part of the problem is I'm sending a 'friendly vibe' vs. 'sexy vibe'. I think I just need to learn how to flirt better! I'm sitting, waiting for a guy to make the first move but if I'm not sending those signals then no wonder nothing really moves forward....
To answer some of the questions posed to me...
I'm at a point in my life where I don't need to be 100% exclusive to sleep with someone, but the connection has to be there for me to want to do it.
The dates always seem to go really well, usually consist of dinner, drinks, maybe a physical activity outside like hiking, golf, going for a walk.
artemisia you're right, a big chunk of them I probably wasn't into it as much as I hoped to be and maybe they picked up on that, or I sent out 'not interested' signals. Most recent guy I was really into, just probably sat back too much waiting for something to happen.
I just need flirting lessons to get the ball rolling I think :)
Thanks again everyone!
posted by bluehermit at 12:28 PM on June 12, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
Get a book called (horribly) How To Marry the Man of your Choice..
It's really good and it will teach you how to have productive conversations with men.
Good Luck!
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 5:22 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]