I'm having real strange sleeping issues. I can stay up 2 days straight, sleep one night, then 2 days again. And I'm complete opposite.. sleep during day, awake at night.. Is it age or the fact I lost my job and am stumped, yet oh so happy?
December 16, 2009 5:46 PM Subscribe
I'm having real strange sleeping issues. I can stay up 2 days straight, sleep one night, then 2 days again. And I'm complete opposite.. sleep during day, awake at night.. Is it age or the fact I lost my job and am stumped, yet oh so happy?
Well, see what happened or has been happening is all these years I been working, say since 2001, I could never adjust to sleeping early, say 11pm to 1pm, and wake up early.
I still went to sleep around 3-4am almost everynight, woke up like 10am.. which was in fact late. Habitually. I had to you know.. make sure I had bosses that really liked me.. as in personally.
I purposely stay up all night so I go to work having been up, so I could crash as soon as I get home and hopefully reset my internal clock.
But instead, after work I "wake up" again and end up still going to sleep at 3-4am.
It's as if something is telling me, either I have somehow associated the night sky with the beginning of the day, or I just really hate society or something. Subconciously, my body wants to sleep while the rat race is out there. And it wants to be UP when they're asleep. I love late nights..
I think I just really really really love late nights.. because the world is asleep and I just.. I need to be away from that mess in that way, yet I live in a big city.. always have, and want to live here. I can't live in the boonies..
Is this just the price I pay?? Is it age? Mid 30's (despite this being a problem since early 20's)
Is it due to being fired? (Maybe, post-fired syndrome, despite me actually loving it because I feel so free. I feel like I just been released from Death Row after found wrongfully charged)
Well, see what happened or has been happening is all these years I been working, say since 2001, I could never adjust to sleeping early, say 11pm to 1pm, and wake up early.
I still went to sleep around 3-4am almost everynight, woke up like 10am.. which was in fact late. Habitually. I had to you know.. make sure I had bosses that really liked me.. as in personally.
I purposely stay up all night so I go to work having been up, so I could crash as soon as I get home and hopefully reset my internal clock.
But instead, after work I "wake up" again and end up still going to sleep at 3-4am.
It's as if something is telling me, either I have somehow associated the night sky with the beginning of the day, or I just really hate society or something. Subconciously, my body wants to sleep while the rat race is out there. And it wants to be UP when they're asleep. I love late nights..
I think I just really really really love late nights.. because the world is asleep and I just.. I need to be away from that mess in that way, yet I live in a big city.. always have, and want to live here. I can't live in the boonies..
Is this just the price I pay?? Is it age? Mid 30's (despite this being a problem since early 20's)
Is it due to being fired? (Maybe, post-fired syndrome, despite me actually loving it because I feel so free. I feel like I just been released from Death Row after found wrongfully charged)
I am completely a night person - I never have been able to get up in the morning, and was an insomniac for years until I discovered that I sleep best from 6am to 2pm. Some people are just like that. You need to arrange your life around it - I have a job that I work from 5pm to 1am, and I love it - I get to sleep when I want to, and work in a nice quiet empty office. I have fond that a lot of places are happy to have someone willing to work nights, so it's actually been really good for my career. I think that a lot of the advice given out to people with sleeping issues neglects the possibility that some people are nightowls, and can sleep just fine if they can find the time of day that's right for them.
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 6:02 PM on December 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 6:02 PM on December 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
ack - fond=found, also - even if you're a night person, it's still important to have a schedule that you stick to - staying up for 2 days isn't going to do you any good.
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 6:05 PM on December 16, 2009
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 6:05 PM on December 16, 2009
You might be a nigh owl, or this could be gibberish.
posted by fixedgear at 6:08 PM on December 16, 2009
posted by fixedgear at 6:08 PM on December 16, 2009
I'm this way too, but you really need to get some sleep or hope whatever you're on right now starts passing you out. This post reads like a drunk little sister.
posted by june made him a gemini at 6:23 PM on December 16, 2009
posted by june made him a gemini at 6:23 PM on December 16, 2009
I'm guessing that since this is an anon post that it's been moderated and deemed good to stay...
Being a night owl is fine. I tell people I keep "musicians hours" or "bartenders hours" knocking off for bed sometime just before dawn and sleeping a good solid 8 until around noon. But I keep to it and do it every day. It's my natural rhythm, what I get to when I don't have an alarm clock in my life. When I have to be up early I get a horrible case of jet lag like pretty much anyone who has to get up 6 hours earlier than they're used to. It's fine, as long as you can find a job that supports it. And speaking of jobs...
To me, nothing says "wacky screwed up sleep" like depression. And/or drugs. Since you're unemployed (right?) you might well be depressed and have trouble filling your time in worthwhile ways. If you're drinking or doing drugs: Stop. Stimulants like caffeine too.
At any rate a trip to a doctor is warranted.
posted by Ookseer at 6:26 PM on December 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
Being a night owl is fine. I tell people I keep "musicians hours" or "bartenders hours" knocking off for bed sometime just before dawn and sleeping a good solid 8 until around noon. But I keep to it and do it every day. It's my natural rhythm, what I get to when I don't have an alarm clock in my life. When I have to be up early I get a horrible case of jet lag like pretty much anyone who has to get up 6 hours earlier than they're used to. It's fine, as long as you can find a job that supports it. And speaking of jobs...
To me, nothing says "wacky screwed up sleep" like depression. And/or drugs. Since you're unemployed (right?) you might well be depressed and have trouble filling your time in worthwhile ways. If you're drinking or doing drugs: Stop. Stimulants like caffeine too.
At any rate a trip to a doctor is warranted.
posted by Ookseer at 6:26 PM on December 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
I'm not a shrink or in any way shrink-like, but this kind of screams "manic episode" to me. I would get yourself to someone who is shrink-like, because they have meds for that.
posted by craichead at 6:36 PM on December 16, 2009 [3 favorites]
posted by craichead at 6:36 PM on December 16, 2009 [3 favorites]
Hook up with your doctor and bring them a printout of your usual sleep pattern (maybe record it using Google Calendar for the week before your appointment). This will spare you trying to explain too much in your current sleep-addled state.
Likely, you'll get a bunch of blood work to rule out underlying physical conditions, and then a referral for a sleep study, where they'll be able to analyze your sleep patterns and diagnose your precise issue. There are a lot of sleep disorders that involve circadian rhythms and they are treatable.
If you're depressed or anxious, you should also address those concerns with your regular doctor, as they can affect your sleep too.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 6:36 PM on December 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
Likely, you'll get a bunch of blood work to rule out underlying physical conditions, and then a referral for a sleep study, where they'll be able to analyze your sleep patterns and diagnose your precise issue. There are a lot of sleep disorders that involve circadian rhythms and they are treatable.
If you're depressed or anxious, you should also address those concerns with your regular doctor, as they can affect your sleep too.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 6:36 PM on December 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
Maybe DSPS? Try googling Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome and see if it sounds familiar. It's only been figured out fairly recently so there isn't a tremendous amount of research on it. It's essentially a Circadian rhythm disorder that can somewhat be controlled with stimulants (which sucked for me) or as someone wrote above, a night job.
posted by December at 6:57 PM on December 16, 2009
posted by December at 6:57 PM on December 16, 2009
Your post makes you seem altered. This may be a sign of both depression and sleep deprivation.
People aren't night owls. Human biology dictates that up until about 100 years ago, we went to bed when the sun went down and got up similarly.
Like many people who love the online life (including myself) you're using the wrong criteria to determine when you're tired. It sounds like you're sitting in front of a TV/Computer until you begin to micro sleep from exhaustion. Nix the caffeine, and see what happens if you don't use your computer/tv. You'll be exhausted about 10-11pm.
Right now, you're shining a flashlight into your hindbrain saying "It's Daylight!" Clean up your sleep hygiene and see what happens. Possibly visit a sleep clinic as well.
posted by filmgeek at 7:00 PM on December 16, 2009 [2 favorites]
People aren't night owls. Human biology dictates that up until about 100 years ago, we went to bed when the sun went down and got up similarly.
Like many people who love the online life (including myself) you're using the wrong criteria to determine when you're tired. It sounds like you're sitting in front of a TV/Computer until you begin to micro sleep from exhaustion. Nix the caffeine, and see what happens if you don't use your computer/tv. You'll be exhausted about 10-11pm.
Right now, you're shining a flashlight into your hindbrain saying "It's Daylight!" Clean up your sleep hygiene and see what happens. Possibly visit a sleep clinic as well.
posted by filmgeek at 7:00 PM on December 16, 2009 [2 favorites]
I have to agree that you sound somewhat manic, for what that's worth.
posted by Red Loop at 7:09 PM on December 16, 2009
posted by Red Loop at 7:09 PM on December 16, 2009
Alteration in sleep patterns is a classic symptom of depression. Interestingly, depression can be brought on by a lack of sunlight - this is known as Seasonal Affective Disorder. I don't see why you wouldn't have that, since it sounds like you're not getting much sunlight.
"Year-round SAD from being an indoor person" is one of my pet diagnoses, because I suffer from it. I take a vitamin D supplement every day. It really did wonders for me. If you're not able to go to a doctor (e.g. if you're unemployed and uninsured) it's worth trying.
As you know, just because you can stay up for 2 days then sleep one day, that doesn't mean you should. Is this a common thing? I think that's why everyone's voting "manic."
If the problem is more that you consistently get 8-9 hours of sleep, but they're at odd hours, that's not such a big deal. Look for jobs that have a night shift. I worked night shift for many years, and I thought it was pretty awesome.
posted by ErikaB at 7:25 PM on December 16, 2009
"Year-round SAD from being an indoor person" is one of my pet diagnoses, because I suffer from it. I take a vitamin D supplement every day. It really did wonders for me. If you're not able to go to a doctor (e.g. if you're unemployed and uninsured) it's worth trying.
As you know, just because you can stay up for 2 days then sleep one day, that doesn't mean you should. Is this a common thing? I think that's why everyone's voting "manic."
If the problem is more that you consistently get 8-9 hours of sleep, but they're at odd hours, that's not such a big deal. Look for jobs that have a night shift. I worked night shift for many years, and I thought it was pretty awesome.
posted by ErikaB at 7:25 PM on December 16, 2009
People aren't night owls
nice - way to disregard the entire life experience of a few people in this thread
through how much of human history do you think it has been advantageous to have a few individuals awake and alert when the rest are sleeping and vulnerable? Doesn't seem so unlikely that we may have evolved this way when you look at it like that, hmm?
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 7:26 PM on December 16, 2009 [3 favorites]
nice - way to disregard the entire life experience of a few people in this thread
through how much of human history do you think it has been advantageous to have a few individuals awake and alert when the rest are sleeping and vulnerable? Doesn't seem so unlikely that we may have evolved this way when you look at it like that, hmm?
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 7:26 PM on December 16, 2009 [3 favorites]
i'm the same way. you're a night owl. (it's called phase-shift insomnia--i have it too) you also sound a little manic. i don't know if that's an underlying cause or just a result of your sleeplessness.
see a doctor who specializes in sleep. for me, i take ambien at night to fall asleep and that helps pretty well. if i go without, i would generally fall into a 27-hour day (i did this as a college student for a long time). it's just the way i'm wired. if i could find a job that was compatible with that sleep schedule, i'd do it, but i don't, so it's drugs for me, and it works.
start with getting your sleep regulated with a sleep specialist. if you're still feeling too jacked up, check in with a mental health professional to get the mania evaluated.
also, if you are female and on the pill, consider switching pills. i found enormous differences in my sleep quality and quantity based on the different progestins available.
posted by thinkingwoman at 7:28 PM on December 16, 2009
see a doctor who specializes in sleep. for me, i take ambien at night to fall asleep and that helps pretty well. if i go without, i would generally fall into a 27-hour day (i did this as a college student for a long time). it's just the way i'm wired. if i could find a job that was compatible with that sleep schedule, i'd do it, but i don't, so it's drugs for me, and it works.
start with getting your sleep regulated with a sleep specialist. if you're still feeling too jacked up, check in with a mental health professional to get the mania evaluated.
also, if you are female and on the pill, consider switching pills. i found enormous differences in my sleep quality and quantity based on the different progestins available.
posted by thinkingwoman at 7:28 PM on December 16, 2009
Yeah, I'd look into Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome.
posted by MsMolly at 7:58 PM on December 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by MsMolly at 7:58 PM on December 16, 2009 [1 favorite]
I don't think this necessarily has to be mania (from this description alone, you aren't even close to the full set of symptoms necessary to make an official diagnosis, but a few of the more well-known ones are presented here), but I recommend seeing either a physician or someone in mental health to get an assessment. If that is what's going on, it's a good idea to try to manage it sooner rather than later.
posted by so_gracefully at 8:18 PM on December 16, 2009
posted by so_gracefully at 8:18 PM on December 16, 2009
I understand where the suggestions that mania is involved are coming from, but the lack of clarity and inarticulate nature of the question could also be caused by several things including sleep deprivation, English as a second language, or a learning disability (which is exacerbated by a lack of sleep). I think seeing a doctor, starting with a primary care and a full blood workup, is the best thing you could do. From there, you may be referred to a therapist and/or psych, prescribed something, and/or be given behavior altering suggestions which might be more conducive to a better sleep cycle.
You should also look at your nutritional habits and before bed rituals. Resetting a long established sleep pattern can be incredibly difficult, but sometimes small adjustments (less sugar, caffeine, and alcohol/more fruits & vegetables, lean protein, and water) can make a big difference. Also, a lot of people make the mistake of not properly unwinding before bedtime. Meaning up until they shut off the lights and pull the covers over them, they are using their computer, their surroundings are loud and bright, and they are basically over stimulating themselves before going to bed. If you are sleep-walking through the day, and getting a second-wind at night, you are probably not expending enough energy during your waking hours. Maybe introducing an exercise routine or being more physically active will make a difference.
Basically, there could be a lot of reasons for your insomnia and night-owl tendencies, but the most beneficial thing you can do is see a doctor and go from there. The good thing is that the situation is far from helpless, and may be resolved relatively easily with some basic lifestyle changes. Good luck!
posted by katemcd at 9:00 PM on December 16, 2009
You should also look at your nutritional habits and before bed rituals. Resetting a long established sleep pattern can be incredibly difficult, but sometimes small adjustments (less sugar, caffeine, and alcohol/more fruits & vegetables, lean protein, and water) can make a big difference. Also, a lot of people make the mistake of not properly unwinding before bedtime. Meaning up until they shut off the lights and pull the covers over them, they are using their computer, their surroundings are loud and bright, and they are basically over stimulating themselves before going to bed. If you are sleep-walking through the day, and getting a second-wind at night, you are probably not expending enough energy during your waking hours. Maybe introducing an exercise routine or being more physically active will make a difference.
Basically, there could be a lot of reasons for your insomnia and night-owl tendencies, but the most beneficial thing you can do is see a doctor and go from there. The good thing is that the situation is far from helpless, and may be resolved relatively easily with some basic lifestyle changes. Good luck!
posted by katemcd at 9:00 PM on December 16, 2009
I agree with those suggesting you may be manic.
posted by elektrotechnicus at 9:15 PM on December 16, 2009
posted by elektrotechnicus at 9:15 PM on December 16, 2009
I'm not totally sure what you're asking here, but: It's as if something is telling me, either I have somehow associated the night sky with the beginning of the day, or I just really hate society or something. Subconciously, my body wants to sleep while the rat race is out there. And it wants to be UP when they're asleep. I love late nights..
I did this.
I worked afternoons and evenings in a tourist town, and had the choice between getting up early and having nothing to do but look at horrible obnoxious tourists until work, after which I would be exhausted, or I could get up at 3pm just before work, get off at eleven and stay up the rest of the night with other like-minded people. I found I didn't want to go to bed because by not going to bed it felt like putting off the next day.
>: I'm not a shrink or in any way shrink-like, but this kind of screams "manic episode" to me.
Oh, for christ's sake. I was in a very similar way at one point, and it wasn't manic. What about sleep deprivation?
Anonymous, I suggest you start setting an alarm to wake up at a specific time, and sticking to it no matter what to try to get your circadian rhythyms straightened out. As well, try to go to bed before you're completely exhausted. You didn't mention alcohol or psychedelic drugs, but if you're doing any of that I'd stop for a while. I find even coffee in the morning can make me jittery well into the night.
posted by dunkadunc at 9:22 PM on December 16, 2009
I did this.
I worked afternoons and evenings in a tourist town, and had the choice between getting up early and having nothing to do but look at horrible obnoxious tourists until work, after which I would be exhausted, or I could get up at 3pm just before work, get off at eleven and stay up the rest of the night with other like-minded people. I found I didn't want to go to bed because by not going to bed it felt like putting off the next day.
>: I'm not a shrink or in any way shrink-like, but this kind of screams "manic episode" to me.
Oh, for christ's sake. I was in a very similar way at one point, and it wasn't manic. What about sleep deprivation?
Anonymous, I suggest you start setting an alarm to wake up at a specific time, and sticking to it no matter what to try to get your circadian rhythyms straightened out. As well, try to go to bed before you're completely exhausted. You didn't mention alcohol or psychedelic drugs, but if you're doing any of that I'd stop for a while. I find even coffee in the morning can make me jittery well into the night.
posted by dunkadunc at 9:22 PM on December 16, 2009
I can completely relate to this. I favor the night hours because I get time to myself, and I also feel the most alert from about 11pm to 2am, and I can easily stay awake all night. This isn't ideal when I have to maintain regular hours for work, and I've had some success taking a combination of calcium, magnesium and melatonin two hours before I want to fall asleep. (advice from this comment made by anniep). It sounds like you enjoy maintaining these hours but are concerned about the oddness of it (?). Whenever I am on vacation or have no commitments I find myself reverting to the odd schedule, and I am okay with that. When it affects my relationships or commitments then I know I need to rework my sleep habits.
posted by koselig at 10:21 PM on December 16, 2009
posted by koselig at 10:21 PM on December 16, 2009
My opinion, and that's all it is, is that some folks do better with a nighttime schedule. Perhaps, in the history of our species, these were the ones who kept an eye out on the camp. The third watch folks that tended the campfire.
That said, OP, you aren't coming across like a good guard at night. I understand your schedule is all effed up right now, and, probably, that's part of it. It's hard to not have a solid schedule for eating, sleeping, pooping, etc. Really, I understand. I'm a woman in my early 40s who's had more than my fair share of the "4 o'clocks" over a couple decades, which is how I've referred to my sometime insomnia.
OP, you say you are very happy with this schedule. My first question is "Why?" Are you getting a lot more done around the house? More done with personal goals? Spending more time with friends? How is this beneficial? It seems grueling, really.
I identify with night people, and I'm looking at work schedule change largely as a result of it. This change doesn't interfere with time with my children, spouse, work, or friends. I'd still be getting to my job by noon and still getting enough necessary sunlight for vitamin D, which is important. Granted, I work part-time and am a full-time mom.
I'm also an only child who loves my solitude. Time after everyone else is in bed = bonus quiet. Are your motivations the same?
Two days on and one night off? Really? As mentioned above, please keep a log. And also keep a log of what you wanted to get accomplished and what didn't. It might be illuminating, pardon the pun.
I hope you find peace in this. I do appreciate the challenge you are facing. I hope you find a resolution.
posted by lilywing13 at 11:31 PM on December 16, 2009
That said, OP, you aren't coming across like a good guard at night. I understand your schedule is all effed up right now, and, probably, that's part of it. It's hard to not have a solid schedule for eating, sleeping, pooping, etc. Really, I understand. I'm a woman in my early 40s who's had more than my fair share of the "4 o'clocks" over a couple decades, which is how I've referred to my sometime insomnia.
OP, you say you are very happy with this schedule. My first question is "Why?" Are you getting a lot more done around the house? More done with personal goals? Spending more time with friends? How is this beneficial? It seems grueling, really.
I identify with night people, and I'm looking at work schedule change largely as a result of it. This change doesn't interfere with time with my children, spouse, work, or friends. I'd still be getting to my job by noon and still getting enough necessary sunlight for vitamin D, which is important. Granted, I work part-time and am a full-time mom.
I'm also an only child who loves my solitude. Time after everyone else is in bed = bonus quiet. Are your motivations the same?
Two days on and one night off? Really? As mentioned above, please keep a log. And also keep a log of what you wanted to get accomplished and what didn't. It might be illuminating, pardon the pun.
I hope you find peace in this. I do appreciate the challenge you are facing. I hope you find a resolution.
posted by lilywing13 at 11:31 PM on December 16, 2009
It's as if something is telling me, either I have somehow associated the night sky with the beginning of the day, or I just really hate society or something. Subconciously, my body wants to sleep while the rat race is out there. And it wants to be UP when they're asleep. I love late nights..
I think I just really really really love late nights.. because the world is asleep and I just.. I need to be away from that mess in that way, yet I live in a big city.. always have, and want to live here. I can't live in the boonies..
I get what you mean. I feel (and am inclined) very similarly... I feel as if staying up late when everyone else is asleep gives me some sort of 'peace' from people in general - it feels almost magical being awake while everyone else is asleep, sort of as if having the world to yourself. At the same time, it's important to keep pace with the 'real world' to some extent. Maybe you could find a job that consists of night shifts. Or maybe you need to be more disciplined - making a conscious decision to sleep at least around midnight, and finding ways to help your body adapt to an earlier sleep cycle (katemcd has good suggestions). Try to find alternative ways of getting that 'peace' and feeling of freedom / release that you get from staying up late - basically, try to carve out personal time for yourself in healthier, more practical ways (perhaps a hobby or some sort of meditation might help?).
posted by aielen at 12:05 AM on December 17, 2009
I think I just really really really love late nights.. because the world is asleep and I just.. I need to be away from that mess in that way, yet I live in a big city.. always have, and want to live here. I can't live in the boonies..
I get what you mean. I feel (and am inclined) very similarly... I feel as if staying up late when everyone else is asleep gives me some sort of 'peace' from people in general - it feels almost magical being awake while everyone else is asleep, sort of as if having the world to yourself. At the same time, it's important to keep pace with the 'real world' to some extent. Maybe you could find a job that consists of night shifts. Or maybe you need to be more disciplined - making a conscious decision to sleep at least around midnight, and finding ways to help your body adapt to an earlier sleep cycle (katemcd has good suggestions). Try to find alternative ways of getting that 'peace' and feeling of freedom / release that you get from staying up late - basically, try to carve out personal time for yourself in healthier, more practical ways (perhaps a hobby or some sort of meditation might help?).
posted by aielen at 12:05 AM on December 17, 2009
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by OmieWise at 6:01 PM on December 16, 2009 [2 favorites]