Fuck, I hate trying to sell myself.
January 18, 2007 12:57 PM Subscribe
I just went through a fairly extensive interview process. I thought I nailed it after each step on the way. I ended up not getting the job, so there's
I had a phone interview, a sit down with the owner of this smallish company, and a round table interview with some of the people that I'd be reporting to. Everyone seemed to like me and all that.
Throughout the process they contradicted themselves: they aren't really desparate for someone, then they say that 4 people will be moving up and they need to fill those spots. Something else that surprised me, they said that they like to interview people a lot because the nature of their business, interviews expose prospective clients to their business.
Well a week after the third interview I got a 3 sentence form letter saying that my credentials are excellent and they are sure I'd be an asset to any company... but they're not going to pursue me.
My question is, do I have a right to know why?? I feel like I gave up a lot of my time (took 2 days off work for the interviews) to proceed with the process and deserve an explanation............do I? What are the possible reasons they don't want to let me know why I didn't get the job (may they be afraid of some kind of suit??)
I had a phone interview, a sit down with the owner of this smallish company, and a round table interview with some of the people that I'd be reporting to. Everyone seemed to like me and all that.
Throughout the process they contradicted themselves: they aren't really desparate for someone, then they say that 4 people will be moving up and they need to fill those spots. Something else that surprised me, they said that they like to interview people a lot because the nature of their business, interviews expose prospective clients to their business.
Well a week after the third interview I got a 3 sentence form letter saying that my credentials are excellent and they are sure I'd be an asset to any company... but they're not going to pursue me.
My question is, do I have a right to know why?? I feel like I gave up a lot of my time (took 2 days off work for the interviews) to proceed with the process and deserve an explanation............do I? What are the possible reasons they don't want to let me know why I didn't get the job (may they be afraid of some kind of suit??)
Why don't you call someone who was responsible for the position and ask?
posted by muddgirl at 1:13 PM on January 18, 2007
posted by muddgirl at 1:13 PM on January 18, 2007
Using job interviews as a manner of promoting your company is not only sleazy, it's mind-bogglingly stupid. I think they are not such a desirable company to work for.
posted by loiseau at 1:15 PM on January 18, 2007
posted by loiseau at 1:15 PM on January 18, 2007
They weren't serious in the first place, and any concern for you is the farthest thing from their minds. They tipped their hand when they let you know that "they like to interview people a lot because the nature of their business, interviews expose prospective clients to their business."
Give them what they say they want and tell as many people as you can by any means the true "nature of their business."
posted by jamjam at 1:16 PM on January 18, 2007
Give them what they say they want and tell as many people as you can by any means the true "nature of their business."
posted by jamjam at 1:16 PM on January 18, 2007
Keep in the back of your mind the fact that you might have been fantastic and nailed every part of the interview, and there still might have been someone better.
Also remember that you might have thought things went perfectly, and they disagreed. I do a bit of interviewing, and it's not an uncommon situation.
I don't think you deserve an explination, but you can certainly ask for one.
posted by NotMyselfRightNow at 1:17 PM on January 18, 2007
Also remember that you might have thought things went perfectly, and they disagreed. I do a bit of interviewing, and it's not an uncommon situation.
I don't think you deserve an explination, but you can certainly ask for one.
posted by NotMyselfRightNow at 1:17 PM on January 18, 2007
Response by poster: Yesterday I emailed one of the guys who interviewed me but haven't gotten a response. The fact that he told me that they interview people to get leads makes me think this wasn't that.
Do people generally get a reason as to why they didn't get a position??
posted by premortem at 1:18 PM on January 18, 2007
Do people generally get a reason as to why they didn't get a position??
posted by premortem at 1:18 PM on January 18, 2007
Anytime an interviewer starts throwing out contradictory statements or other red flags, even if all other things seem copacetic, pause and think about what that red flag might indicate. Oftentimes, we blind ourselves to these red flags because we really want the job or away from our old job or whatever, but these are the points to concentrate on. If you listen closely and try to not let your desire bias you, then 9 times out of 10, you will know exactly why someone did or did not hire you.
It sounds like these people told you a possible motivation and said other things to indicate that they were never particularly interested in you as a candidate. Be glad that you do not work for a company that has so little regard for people and their time.
posted by melangell at 1:21 PM on January 18, 2007 [1 favorite]
It sounds like these people told you a possible motivation and said other things to indicate that they were never particularly interested in you as a candidate. Be glad that you do not work for a company that has so little regard for people and their time.
posted by melangell at 1:21 PM on January 18, 2007 [1 favorite]
Do people generally get a reason as to why they didn't get a position??
I've never got one. Anybody else?
posted by canine epigram at 1:23 PM on January 18, 2007
At least they sent you a letter. These days it is unusual. They don't reply because of some chance that they would say something that would provoke the candidate to sue or cause problems. They replied. Drop it. Move on.
posted by JayRwv at 1:24 PM on January 18, 2007
posted by JayRwv at 1:24 PM on January 18, 2007
Do you deserve a possible explanation?.. Probably.
Will you get one?.. bloodly unlikely....
I've been through plenty of interviews and lots of "we decided not to choose you" types of letters. I dont think I've ever had someone tell me clearly and directly why they didnt choose me.
Part of it is the nature of interviewing (the majority of potential employers like to claim the "high ground" by acting like YOU need the job...and they are in a position of power to decide whether or not to hire you.
As others have said... they sound like a crappy group to work for.. best to just move on.. chalk it up to experience
posted by jmnugent at 1:24 PM on January 18, 2007
It's not uncommon for companies to interview 5, 10 even 30 people, especially if they receive many interesting applicants.
It's also not uncommon for companies to post the job and interview EVEN if they think they already have the right candidate- they need to do their due diligence for the optics, and to make sure they have a better idea of who's out there.
Nobody's owed a job, you don't have any particular right to this job, so you have no claims on them. Of course this shouldn't prevent you from contacting them, first to thank them for the opportunity to be interviewed, then to express how impressed you were with their company, and to express interest in any similar position that may open in the future, and then to inquire if they had any suggestions for what you could improve on, for a future interview.
posted by Artful Codger at 1:27 PM on January 18, 2007 [1 favorite]
It's also not uncommon for companies to post the job and interview EVEN if they think they already have the right candidate- they need to do their due diligence for the optics, and to make sure they have a better idea of who's out there.
Nobody's owed a job, you don't have any particular right to this job, so you have no claims on them. Of course this shouldn't prevent you from contacting them, first to thank them for the opportunity to be interviewed, then to express how impressed you were with their company, and to express interest in any similar position that may open in the future, and then to inquire if they had any suggestions for what you could improve on, for a future interview.
posted by Artful Codger at 1:27 PM on January 18, 2007 [1 favorite]
What kind of company tries to get leads by interviewing people they never intend to hire?
At any rate, I have never gotten a solid explanation for why I wasn't hired, except vague things like they found someone who was better qualified / had more experience / etc. I have had some interviews where they left me hanging and didn't let me know I didn't get the job until I inquired a couple of times.
I've been put through the ringer as well ... one company put me through two interviews for an internship position that they told me they were ready to offer me, but lost funding for the internship. They then called me a month later to ask me to interview for a new internship with a different team within the company. I then went through 3 more interviews, gave them a full portfolio of my work, and then they started asking me about whether I would be able to do it for 6 months instead of 3, part-time instead of full-time, and basically kept making the position less & less desirable. I kept saying it was fine and I'd still love the position, (I *really* wanted this internship!) but at the last minute they told me that they found an intern who they felt was better suited. They totally wasted my time and got my hopes up, but that was the best explanation I got out of the whole thing.
Job hunting just sucks.
posted by tastybrains at 1:35 PM on January 18, 2007
At any rate, I have never gotten a solid explanation for why I wasn't hired, except vague things like they found someone who was better qualified / had more experience / etc. I have had some interviews where they left me hanging and didn't let me know I didn't get the job until I inquired a couple of times.
I've been put through the ringer as well ... one company put me through two interviews for an internship position that they told me they were ready to offer me, but lost funding for the internship. They then called me a month later to ask me to interview for a new internship with a different team within the company. I then went through 3 more interviews, gave them a full portfolio of my work, and then they started asking me about whether I would be able to do it for 6 months instead of 3, part-time instead of full-time, and basically kept making the position less & less desirable. I kept saying it was fine and I'd still love the position, (I *really* wanted this internship!) but at the last minute they told me that they found an intern who they felt was better suited. They totally wasted my time and got my hopes up, but that was the best explanation I got out of the whole thing.
Job hunting just sucks.
posted by tastybrains at 1:35 PM on January 18, 2007
Back when I was job-searching (2001-2004), I had many interviews and none of them ended up hiring me. None of them volunteered a reason why, either, and the few times when I tried asking, they would be really vague.
From what you mentioned about them contradicting themselves, it seems like maybe they weren't sure exactly what the position was. This would explain why you felt like the interview process was going well, but why you didn't get the job. This happened to me once, too: lots of very promising interviews for a position, but I didn't get the job. They really did go in a different direction with the position than they had initially thought; this is common at small, growing companies. It had nothing to do with me, so much as the way they decided to re-form the job no longer fit with what I was looking for or had to offer.
(This was a rare case where I kinda found out what happened.)
So sometimes, for real, it's not you, it's them.
posted by Sprout the Vulgarian at 1:47 PM on January 18, 2007
From what you mentioned about them contradicting themselves, it seems like maybe they weren't sure exactly what the position was. This would explain why you felt like the interview process was going well, but why you didn't get the job. This happened to me once, too: lots of very promising interviews for a position, but I didn't get the job. They really did go in a different direction with the position than they had initially thought; this is common at small, growing companies. It had nothing to do with me, so much as the way they decided to re-form the job no longer fit with what I was looking for or had to offer.
(This was a rare case where I kinda found out what happened.)
So sometimes, for real, it's not you, it's them.
posted by Sprout the Vulgarian at 1:47 PM on January 18, 2007
canine epigram, the Civil Service gave me an explanation of why they turned me down, but six months later, and apparently because some government wonk thought it a good idea.
My understanding of the interview process in general is that, since hiring someone immediately exposes the employer to wrongful dismissal suits and investment in the hiree, there’s a lot more attention paid to any negative feelings from those doing the interview than is necessarily rational, since the cost of dealing with something negative after an offer is greater.
So you could have had excessive dandruff in the final interview, and some interviewer was a fan of conscientious scalp hygiene and thought that was a useful index of attention to detail in how you work, so they said ‘eh, I have a bad feeling about him.’
posted by Aidan Kehoe at 1:49 PM on January 18, 2007
My understanding of the interview process in general is that, since hiring someone immediately exposes the employer to wrongful dismissal suits and investment in the hiree, there’s a lot more attention paid to any negative feelings from those doing the interview than is necessarily rational, since the cost of dealing with something negative after an offer is greater.
So you could have had excessive dandruff in the final interview, and some interviewer was a fan of conscientious scalp hygiene and thought that was a useful index of attention to detail in how you work, so they said ‘eh, I have a bad feeling about him.’
posted by Aidan Kehoe at 1:49 PM on January 18, 2007
canine epigram: "
Do people generally get a reason as to why they didn't get a position??
I've never got one. Anybody else?"
Nor have I.
posted by loiseau at 2:10 PM on January 18, 2007
Do people generally get a reason as to why they didn't get a position??
I've never got one. Anybody else?"
Nor have I.
posted by loiseau at 2:10 PM on January 18, 2007
Here's my gut reaction, and I doubt you're going to like it: They never intended to hire you. They led you on and hosted a phony interview just to promote themselves. They're utter sleazebags. Don't look back.
Uh, not buying that. What kind of company has the time / resources or much less reasons to host phony interviews to promote themselves? And even if they were doing this, who the hell did they promote themselves with? Certainly not you. Not the other prospects, either - unless you met them you have no reason to believe they were or were not interviewing X number of other prospects. This really makes no sense.
That said, you're probably not going to get an explanation - I was in a similar situation once and I never got an explanation from the company but I did finally drag one out of the career counselor at my college that recommended I interview with the company. When I did find out, I was more upset than I was before, and wished I hadn't found out, FWIW.
You might consider sending a polite letter to whomever you interviewed with and request their reasons for not selecting you. You could point out that you spent a lot of time preparing and interviewing for the position, and while you know you don't necessarily deserve a complete disclosure from them, you would appreciate any help they could give you in honing your interviewing skills, etc..
posted by allkindsoftime at 2:30 PM on January 18, 2007
Uh, not buying that. What kind of company has the time / resources or much less reasons to host phony interviews to promote themselves? And even if they were doing this, who the hell did they promote themselves with? Certainly not you. Not the other prospects, either - unless you met them you have no reason to believe they were or were not interviewing X number of other prospects. This really makes no sense.
That said, you're probably not going to get an explanation - I was in a similar situation once and I never got an explanation from the company but I did finally drag one out of the career counselor at my college that recommended I interview with the company. When I did find out, I was more upset than I was before, and wished I hadn't found out, FWIW.
You might consider sending a polite letter to whomever you interviewed with and request their reasons for not selecting you. You could point out that you spent a lot of time preparing and interviewing for the position, and while you know you don't necessarily deserve a complete disclosure from them, you would appreciate any help they could give you in honing your interviewing skills, etc..
posted by allkindsoftime at 2:30 PM on January 18, 2007
I received an explanation once, but only because I pushed the interviewer afterward. Ultimately it didn't really help me to know.
posted by lunalaguna at 2:31 PM on January 18, 2007
posted by lunalaguna at 2:31 PM on January 18, 2007
I've certainly heard that employers don't like to give (non-)prospective employees reasons because it opens them up to the possibility of lawsuits (matter of fact, I think I heard this on Metafilter). Of course it's impossible to say in this circumstance whether that was actually the case or not.
posted by Paragon at 2:36 PM on January 18, 2007
posted by Paragon at 2:36 PM on January 18, 2007
"Do people generally get a reason as to why they didn't get a position??"
Once. I applied for a job at a beer distributor and got told (through the staffing agency that did the prescreening) that I didn't get the job because "they're looking for someone with more experience."
The weird part? I had three years of experience in a closely-related job and the ad I answered said "No experience necessary." Even the staffing agency was confused, because they thought I was a great candidate.
So, for all I know, they didn't like my haircut. (Come to think of it, I had a ponytail, and both the interviewers had shaved heads.) The point is: Asking why you didn't get hired won't get you anything: The company that inteviewed you will give you some meanigless generality like "there was a better candidate" or "you need more experience", and there's a good chance the generality is a lie anyway.
In situations like this, it's best just to tell yourself "It's not me, it's them," and forget about the whole thing, unless the story is so good you use it on a blog somewhere.
(Oh wait, I just remembered the other time a company told me why they wouldn't hire me: "It's a family company. The owners won't let me hire a man with hair as long as yours, unless he's Native American and have a letter from his tribe saying it's part of his culture." Shit like that is why I don't live in Arizona anymore.)
posted by faster than a speeding bulette at 2:40 PM on January 18, 2007
Once. I applied for a job at a beer distributor and got told (through the staffing agency that did the prescreening) that I didn't get the job because "they're looking for someone with more experience."
The weird part? I had three years of experience in a closely-related job and the ad I answered said "No experience necessary." Even the staffing agency was confused, because they thought I was a great candidate.
So, for all I know, they didn't like my haircut. (Come to think of it, I had a ponytail, and both the interviewers had shaved heads.) The point is: Asking why you didn't get hired won't get you anything: The company that inteviewed you will give you some meanigless generality like "there was a better candidate" or "you need more experience", and there's a good chance the generality is a lie anyway.
In situations like this, it's best just to tell yourself "It's not me, it's them," and forget about the whole thing, unless the story is so good you use it on a blog somewhere.
(Oh wait, I just remembered the other time a company told me why they wouldn't hire me: "It's a family company. The owners won't let me hire a man with hair as long as yours, unless he's Native American and have a letter from his tribe saying it's part of his culture." Shit like that is why I don't live in Arizona anymore.)
posted by faster than a speeding bulette at 2:40 PM on January 18, 2007
Do people generally get a reason as to why they didn't get a position??
I did once, sort of.
I was basically told at an interview (before I interviewed for my current job) that if I was adamant about my desired rate of pay, I wouldn't get the job. I told the interviewer that she was asking me to take a pay cut to do the exact same thing I was doing at my previous job. Needless to say, I didn't get the job. so I went to the company next door, applied, and a year later, I'm a big bad manager. Hehehehe...
Anyway, a company that does those sorts of sleezy practices isn't a company you want to work for. I agree with jamjam--tell everyone you know about their little "interviews."
posted by Verdandi at 2:43 PM on January 18, 2007
I did once, sort of.
I was basically told at an interview (before I interviewed for my current job) that if I was adamant about my desired rate of pay, I wouldn't get the job. I told the interviewer that she was asking me to take a pay cut to do the exact same thing I was doing at my previous job. Needless to say, I didn't get the job. so I went to the company next door, applied, and a year later, I'm a big bad manager. Hehehehe...
Anyway, a company that does those sorts of sleezy practices isn't a company you want to work for. I agree with jamjam--tell everyone you know about their little "interviews."
posted by Verdandi at 2:43 PM on January 18, 2007
What kind of company tries to get leads by interviewing people they never intend to hire?
That's just weird. I know I've done interviews where the person was indeed great, but not RIGHT, or where an entirely different job or approach becomes attractive that wasn't expected, but to interview someone as marketing?
This is hurting my head. What kind of business was this? What industry benefits from not hiring interviewees?
posted by rokusan at 2:54 PM on January 18, 2007
That's just weird. I know I've done interviews where the person was indeed great, but not RIGHT, or where an entirely different job or approach becomes attractive that wasn't expected, but to interview someone as marketing?
This is hurting my head. What kind of business was this? What industry benefits from not hiring interviewees?
posted by rokusan at 2:54 PM on January 18, 2007
The two big jobs I didn't get, I got explanations for. One was a distance issue (I had lived far away from the office at the time, and they weren't sure if I should relocate - I was fresh out of school), the other was an in-depth chat about my skills and personality (it helped that I was already previously involved with the company, and the person hiring was a mentor to me). I did get rejected from Starbucks without explanation - I suspect it was because I wouldn't be there long enough, as I would have left for a study abroad tour soon after.
Interviewing as marketing is an interesting strategy, to say the least.
posted by divabat at 5:25 PM on January 18, 2007
Interviewing as marketing is an interesting strategy, to say the least.
posted by divabat at 5:25 PM on January 18, 2007
I've never gotten a reason for not getting a job. These people sound like real weirdos; I can't imagine their input would be of any help to you. If they have any at all; interviewing as advertising?? Eesh. Sounds like the place is in real trouble; be thankful you didn't get the job.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:11 PM on January 18, 2007 [1 favorite]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:11 PM on January 18, 2007 [1 favorite]
I think it really depends on what the reason is. If it's something basic they may tell you. E.g. "Your desired compensation was out of our range" or "We're looking for someone with more experience." If it's something like, "your awkwardness rubbed people the wrong way and we don't believe you may fit in with our team" then they may choose to keep that to themselves.
posted by pinksoftsoap at 9:54 PM on January 18, 2007
posted by pinksoftsoap at 9:54 PM on January 18, 2007
Do people generally get a reason as to why they didn't get a position??
Sometimes, but even then you have no idea if it's the real reason or not.
<story>
In December I went in 4 times to interview for a mid-level engineering job at a local Fortune 500 company.
The first time in I interviewed with 13 different people, including the manager and his director. The second time in I picked up three people I had missed before.
Then I got called back in because the VP of Engineering wanted to interview me.
Finally I got called back in because the Senior VP of Engineering wanted to interview me.
In early January they got back in touch to let me know they wouldn't be needing my services. Stated reason: they reorganized the position out of existence.
</story>
Do I believe them? Sure, why not. It's as good a reason as any.
How this applies to you: the best feedback you can realistically expect is being called back for multiple interviews. If you were doing something horribly wrong they never would have invited you in for the third.
posted by tkolar at 10:02 PM on January 18, 2007
Sometimes, but even then you have no idea if it's the real reason or not.
<story>
In December I went in 4 times to interview for a mid-level engineering job at a local Fortune 500 company.
The first time in I interviewed with 13 different people, including the manager and his director. The second time in I picked up three people I had missed before.
Then I got called back in because the VP of Engineering wanted to interview me.
Finally I got called back in because the Senior VP of Engineering wanted to interview me.
In early January they got back in touch to let me know they wouldn't be needing my services. Stated reason: they reorganized the position out of existence.
</story>
Do I believe them? Sure, why not. It's as good a reason as any.
How this applies to you: the best feedback you can realistically expect is being called back for multiple interviews. If you were doing something horribly wrong they never would have invited you in for the third.
posted by tkolar at 10:02 PM on January 18, 2007
Response by poster: Well I don't feel like I deserve the job and do know there's a good posibility that there are better canidates out there so I'd just like to know what the reasons were. But as many said, whatever reason they give I'll either won't like or would be skeptical as to if that was the real reason.
By form letter I meant an email with a pdf of a form letter attached to it.
The company is a calibration firm that deals in biological and chemical lab equipment. So most of the people they interview are currently working in some type of laboratory setting (I would presume) and have equipment that needs calibrating on an annual or biannual basis. A major part of the first face-to-face was the guy giving me a tour of their facilities and bragging about their credentials and the work they do.
Thanks for all the comments, I guess I needed to be more jaded and move on. So much for trying to improve my interview techniques -- but why would this company want to do that anyway?
posted by premortem at 9:24 AM on January 19, 2007
By form letter I meant an email with a pdf of a form letter attached to it.
The company is a calibration firm that deals in biological and chemical lab equipment. So most of the people they interview are currently working in some type of laboratory setting (I would presume) and have equipment that needs calibrating on an annual or biannual basis. A major part of the first face-to-face was the guy giving me a tour of their facilities and bragging about their credentials and the work they do.
Thanks for all the comments, I guess I needed to be more jaded and move on. So much for trying to improve my interview techniques -- but why would this company want to do that anyway?
posted by premortem at 9:24 AM on January 19, 2007
By the time you get to a face to face interview, they already know you're qualified.
What they're looking for is how well you and they hit it off as people -- what it would be like to work with you every day.
At your next live interview, project your personality and enthusiasm rather than your qualifications.
This happened to me: The interviewer had to keep wiping blood from her lips, and I asked whether she was OK. She said she had a broken filling in a tooth and was seeing a dentist that afternoon. However, she was worried whether the cut would heal in time for an important presentation the next day.
I said "Don't worry. The inside of the mouth is the fastest healing part of the body. Think back to a time when you bit your cheek or tongue and drew blood. It healed by the next day. You'll be fine."
A broad smile from her made it clear that I would get the job.
This is an extreme example, but you need to get that smile.
posted by KRS at 10:23 AM on January 19, 2007
What they're looking for is how well you and they hit it off as people -- what it would be like to work with you every day.
At your next live interview, project your personality and enthusiasm rather than your qualifications.
This happened to me: The interviewer had to keep wiping blood from her lips, and I asked whether she was OK. She said she had a broken filling in a tooth and was seeing a dentist that afternoon. However, she was worried whether the cut would heal in time for an important presentation the next day.
I said "Don't worry. The inside of the mouth is the fastest healing part of the body. Think back to a time when you bit your cheek or tongue and drew blood. It healed by the next day. You'll be fine."
A broad smile from her made it clear that I would get the job.
This is an extreme example, but you need to get that smile.
posted by KRS at 10:23 AM on January 19, 2007
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:00 PM on January 18, 2007