I used to have a secretary, now I am the secretary.

February 13, 2008 9:29 PM

How do I stop having "jobs" and start having a career? In particular, friends and (even) acquaintances often tell me that based on my skills and abilities they are surprised that I'm not doing more responsible (and therefore, I am sure, lucrative) work. But I can't figure out how to make the jump. Can you help?

My work history in a nutshell:
15 years with one of the largest catalog retailers in the US. I worked my way up from entry level order taker to a reasonably responsible and rewarding (especially considering my age and experience at the time) job in the Training department of that company. Then my job was eliminated (along with about 50 other people).

At the time, I was shell-shocked and unable to find another T&D job, but instead turned my "hobby and passion" into a new career path and took a job as Statewide volunteer coordinator for a nonprofit (with a pay cut). I was mysteriously let go after nine months in that job, at the same time a new Executive Director was hired.

I then moved to a responsible administrative position at a smaller nonprofit. Again, a pay cut. I worked there for 3 1/2 years, but resigned this past December due to (basically) an overly stressful work environment that kept me from spending as much time with my infant son as I would like (think: 80+ hour weeks). Our parting was amicable and orderly. On my resume, it simply looks like I left this job to take another.

After interviewing several places, I have just started a new job with a larger, more "corporate" nonprofit where I am culturally a better fit but where my responsibilities are fewer and (again) a pay cut. (I now make about 82% of what I made when I left the job above.)

I'm clearly on a downward spiral, in terms of pay and "career" but I can't seem to sort out how to reverse it. Friends and even just general business contacts sent me a ton of open job listings that they thought I would do well at, but which, when I looked at them, I clearly had no hope of getting an interview for because even I was confident that I could do the job, there was no possible way I could spin my experience into anything that would get me past the resume cut.

How do I reverse this? Clearly its not "the right way" for every job I've had to pay a bit less than the one prior. But the jobs that are the next step up aren't even interested in interviewing me, even with networking contacts saying "you should absolutely consider her, she'd be perfect".

I would take another corporate T&D job, but they don't want to hire me because I've been out of the field too long. I have all the skills to be a project manager, but can't get an interview because I've never held a job with that title (even though I can show that I've done each part of the job responsibility, point by point.)

I should be planning, designing, coordinating, supervising. Instead I'm copying, filing, and typing. How do I get (back) on track?

posted by anastasiav to work & money (16 comments total)

If you can do the job but can't make the resume cut then what you need to do is find someone in the company who will recommend you for the job (or will want to hire you herself). The best way to do this is by networking. Write a resume for the job you want and tell all of those well-intentioned friends what you are looking for and ask if they know someone who might be able to help you.

I don't know the T&D field but seems hard to believe that good training skills have changed in past five years. You may just not have the connections to make easy. Can you attend trade shows or training seminars for trainers or the local professional society. It will help you make connections and also give you something to talk about in your intervew (if it is a class on your resume as well) that shows current interest.
posted by metahawk at 9:51 PM on February 13, 2008

Friends and even just general business contacts sent me a ton of open job listings that they thought I would do well at, but which, when I looked at them, I clearly had no hope of getting an interview for because even I was confident that I could do the job, there was no possible way I could spin my experience into anything that would get me past the resume cut.

So, if I understand this correctly....business contacts (who are familiar with your work) gave you job leads for which you were qualified, and you didn't apply because you "clearly had no hope"? There was "no possible way"?

Am I reading this right? Your contacts gave you leads which you didn't pursue?
posted by edverb at 9:53 PM on February 13, 2008

So, if I understand this correctly....business contacts (who are familiar with your work) gave you job leads for which you were qualified, and you didn't apply because you "clearly had no hope"? There was "no possible way"?

Am I reading this right? Your contacts gave you leads which you didn't pursue?

This doesn't seem odd to me - my friends often send me job listings for stuff *they* think I'd be great at, but when I really look at it, either I don't have the right degree or the requisite number of years experience or am lacking several of the "required" attributes. Just because they sent them doesn't mean I'll persue them.

anastasiav, I'm in a similar boat as you, so I thank you for posting this.
posted by tristeza at 4:20 AM on February 14, 2008

Your current job description might not require you to do anything more than "copying, filing, and typing" but the only way to break out of that position is to do more. Nonprofits typically never have all the staff they need to do all work. Find out where the gaps are and volunteer to do those. This will be the way to make a name for yourself, be recognized, and to gain the experience in management work. When you become the indispensable expert then update your resume and hand it to the director of the nonprofit.
posted by JJ86 at 5:37 AM on February 14, 2008

If you have the chops to be a PM, then you are going to need a personal rec to get in the door. If your contacts were sending you PM jobs (or similar) that they think you could do and would be good at, then maybe that's your doorway. That's the way I made the jump. Good luck.
posted by Medieval Maven at 5:58 AM on February 14, 2008

"I have all the skills to be a project manager, but can't get an interview because I've never held a job with that title (even though I can show that I've done each part of the job responsibility, point by point.)"

"...but when I really look at it, either I don't have the right degree or the requisite number of years experience or am lacking several of the "required" attributes."



Guys, these are the worst reasons for not applying (or not applying well) for a job I've ever heard. Most companies lay out a set of criteria for a job because they think those criteria are going to help them attract a pool of people who are able to deliver what the organisation needs. They're simply interested in hiring someone who can do the work.

Welcome to the skills based CV.

I picked that PDF because it is a good example of the concept. It's not a great execution, though. If you're more than 10 minutes out of college, or have no college, put education last. Don't include "achievements and interests." If you have extra space on your 2nd page, a section for Technical Skills (which would include basic stuff like Office applications, any HTML skills you have, etc) is a nice way to finish off the resume.

If your job titles have been diminishing, then either leave them off (listing companies and responsibilities) or list them with the oldest first.

FWIW, my "career" is a train wreck of web design, journalism, marketing, consulting, and self-employment. I always use a skills-based CV and present it as a "broad skill set."
posted by DarlingBri at 6:04 AM on February 14, 2008 [6 favorites has favorites]

This doesn't seem odd to me - my friends often send me job listings for stuff *they* think I'd be great at, but when I really look at it, either I don't have the right degree or the requisite number of years experience or am lacking several of the "required" attributes.

And I thought I was the only one experiencing this hurdle. I keep running onto "jack-of-all-trades" job postings, where the employer is looking to bundle multiple positions into a single worker. I'm more than qualified for half the requirements, but the rest of the requirements are off on a completely different career track. Quite frustrating.
posted by Thorzdad at 6:27 AM on February 14, 2008

So, if I understand this correctly....business contacts (who are familiar with your work) gave you job leads for which you were qualified, and you didn't apply because you "clearly had no hope"? There was "no possible way"?

Am I reading this right? Your contacts gave you leads which you didn't pursue?

DarlingBri, I do already used a skills-based resume, and I highly recommend it to others.

Here's an example of "no possible way". A contact from company W sent me a listing for a training job that was open in another division of her (fairly large) company. When I looked at it, though, one of the items listed as "required" along with the resume was a portfolio showing an assortment of web-based / e learning modules that you had designed or developed. I don't have that. I could easily design the learning content for such a module, but I'm not a web developer, which is clearly what they wanted (the job description also mentioned using CSS, Dreamweaver, Flash etc.), so I sent my contact back a "thanks for thinking of me" email but I didn't apply -- because it was clear from the posting that I did not have the hardcore technical skills that the position requires.

There were at least two others that listed a Masters in Education as a requirement. Again, I can't list that, so I'm not going to make the first HR resume cut.

There were many, many others that I did apply for (and in many cases spent hours building a different skills based resume tailored to the individual job posting) but never heard anything back from. The only places who seem want to interview me are places that are offering jobs that are more-or-less the same or less than my current experience (and in at least two cases they told me during the interview they weren't going to hire me because I was "overqualified" - ugh!).
posted by anastasiav at 6:50 AM on February 14, 2008

I don't know why no one has suggested this, but about what going back to school?
posted by matteo at 7:44 AM on February 14, 2008

what about
posted by matteo at 7:45 AM on February 14, 2008

You say your current employer is bigger? Is it possible for you to move up? You might try talking to your supervisor or the hiring manager at your company and express to them that you'd like more responsibility at your company. Put together a resume for your company. Act like you're interviewing again. If they say they don't have the position open for you right now, tell them that you want to set up an action plan which puts you in line for a better title. Express to them how much you enjoy working with them but that you need forward momentum to be satisfied there and you want a chance to put your broader skillset to use in their organization. Be persistent. Continue to do your job well, even above and beyond if you can.

Start networking like crazy. It's so painful (well, it is for me!) but it's really the best way to identify where you want to work and what you want to do. Identify any continuing education which might better position you for interviews and go do them.

Another thing, if you're able to survive on your current salary, maybe think about doing something extracurricular after hours which puts you in a networking position but also gives you some fresh perspective. Do a Habitat for Humanity project if they are in your area. Take a pottery class or a car maintenance class or anything that you have an interest in but that is outside of your comfort zone. Volunteer to usher at your local theater and get to watch all sorts of plays. I don't know! I've found that if I can do one of these types of new experiences a year that it just really energizes me and gets me charged up about all sorts of things -- it also helps me to just appreciate life.

So, my advice is keep pushing on your career but, if you haven't given yourself a break in awhile, maybe take the time to widen your perspective a bit. I think it could help.
posted by amanda at 7:45 AM on February 14, 2008

You may also just need to update your skillset. Since online learning and dreamweaver/CSS were mentioned, online aspects of training may be a good place to focus. I had a huge reply typed out but I will MeFi mail you instead :)
posted by DarlingBri at 7:53 AM on February 14, 2008

A few ideas - first, don't select yourself out of jobs. If you've got 85% of the requirements, then send a resume. Very, very rarely do employers get exactly the candidate they want. Instead, you read a lot of resumes and interview a lot of people then you pick the candidate that most closely matches what you want. If you send a resume the worst thing that can happen is you won't get the job. By not sending a resume, you've guaranteed that you won't get the job.

Second, in your current non-profit do they post jobs internally? Start pushing your way up the ladder. You've done this before and you know how to get it done. Build your network; line up internal references. Take on extra responsibility and let people know you're looking to advance in the non-profit.

Last, when you've taken on additional responsibilities talk to your boss about getting your title revised. That's usually much easier in a non-profit. Even a little change might make your skills stand out more - if you're title is Administrative Assistant, perhaps Coordinator is a better fit.
posted by 26.2 at 8:27 AM on February 14, 2008

Have you tried temp work? That can lead to a job - and often a good job that you wouldn't otherwise get, because employers have a chance to really get to know YOU and how you work, as you are not just another faceless resume to them.

Sign up with a temp agency or several. Your admin skills will serve you well there, as often those foot-in-the-door temp jobs are admin type jobs.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 8:40 AM on February 14, 2008

ah, anastasiav, I am sorry too hear your dilemma, although I've been fortunate in recent years, in my early career I was stuck and typecast too, so I know how defeating that can feel. But I broke on out and you can too! I didn't get on my real career path until my late 20s early 30s.

To any of us who know you here, you are one of the smartest, brightest mefites - I am sure I am not alone in thinking anyone should be so lucky as to employ you!

I don't know if you are sending your resume out online but I would advocate not doing that. I have seen people sending out an e-resume and having it rejected in seconds - I don't like the idea that a bot can weed you out based on keywords that are or aren't present. So instead of that, or at least in addition to that, send out a snail mail version on nice paper. You can always find an address online and just direct to the attention of the human resources manager.

Also, one trick that I have done that has been very effective - although it is a bit costly so I reserved it for only the *best* opportunities - I sent my resume out via USPS priority mail. This had the advantage of usually beating out other entrants AND everyone opens priority mail, it doesn't sit in a pile. HR people responded favorably and I usually always at least got a call. Some HR people commented on it being creative and a smart attention-getter.

Beyond that, I am going to repeat advice I gave to a similar question:

a number of years ago, I made a career shift (from the not-for-profit world to the land of filthy lucre) and the best advice I was given came from an experienced HR / career counselor. He told me to call people who held the types of jobs I wanted and to tell them that I was considering a career shift, and could they spend a few minutes with me for an informational interview. I was initially not at all enthused about this advice - what a lot of work it seemed! But it proved to be great networking, most people agreed and were very friendly and helpful to me, and I learned a lot about the realities of the field that I wanted to break into. Almost everyone I met suggested one or two names of other people - some even called contacts for me.

People were really good about sharing when I told them that I wanted to hear their experience - why/how did you get in this field? What do you like most about it? What would you recommend that I do to break in? What do you think that I have that are transferrable skills?

Someone that I met in this process later called me to tell me about an entry level marketing opportunity in a company - and I got that job. I only stayed in that company for a few years, but it was pivotal in making my transition.

It's a lot of hard work to break out of being stuck in a groove, but it is do-able! Don't let the difficulty of the mission discourage you, not giving into that will be your biggest challenge. And remember, part of what you are up against is not YOU, but the reality of a difficult hiring environment and locale so it will take persistence.

Best of luck to you.
posted by madamjujujive at 10:43 AM on February 14, 2008 [4 favorites has favorites]

You may not have the desired resume, but you have the knowledge, intelligence and the ability to learn new specific skills. Use your network. Have coffee or a phone with at least 1 or 2 contacts a week. Explain that you're looking to re-enter the T&D field, and need a foot in the door.

Remember that you're interviewing the company too, and that you're giving them the opportunity to hire someone smart, hard-working, intelligent and creative. So apply for jobs that are similar to what you want, and especially for jobs at companies you like. The interviewers may know of another position coming up, or may hire you when candidate A, who had the perfect resume, doesn't work out. It's hard to get a job with a plain old cold response to a listing. Having somebody at the company who knows you helps tremendously, so use your network. Speaking of which, I'm nearby, and would be happy to meet for coffee, and help you network. I have a gmail account, and even check it sometimes!
posted by theora55 at 5:38 PM on February 14, 2008