Sunk Enemy Vessels
January 2, 2007 7:58 AM Subscribe
Would the Navys of the 18-19th centuries share information about a warship sunk with all hands?
I am re-reading the complete Aubrey-Maturin novels, and a question occurred to me as I read the sequence about Jack Aubrey, in the Leopard, managing to sink the Dutch warship that pursued them near Antarctica. The pursuing vessel (the name of which I do not have in front of me) was sunk, quite suddenly, with all hands lost.
My question is this: Would the British Navy make any effort to inform the Dutch that their ship had been sunk?
On the one hand, there would be considerable advantage to denying the Dutch the knowledge that they had no ship in that area, anymore. On the other hand, I can see how the old-school genteelness of those times may extend so far as wishing, for the sake of the families of those lost, to pass the information about a lost vessel along.
Does anyone have any specific information (citations would be helpful) about whether such knowledge was shared between enemies during the Napoleonic Wars and the War of 1812 period?
I am re-reading the complete Aubrey-Maturin novels, and a question occurred to me as I read the sequence about Jack Aubrey, in the Leopard, managing to sink the Dutch warship that pursued them near Antarctica. The pursuing vessel (the name of which I do not have in front of me) was sunk, quite suddenly, with all hands lost.
My question is this: Would the British Navy make any effort to inform the Dutch that their ship had been sunk?
On the one hand, there would be considerable advantage to denying the Dutch the knowledge that they had no ship in that area, anymore. On the other hand, I can see how the old-school genteelness of those times may extend so far as wishing, for the sake of the families of those lost, to pass the information about a lost vessel along.
Does anyone have any specific information (citations would be helpful) about whether such knowledge was shared between enemies during the Napoleonic Wars and the War of 1812 period?
In the age of sail sinkings were common, whether by battle or storm so if a ship didn't send back news or if it failed to appear at a designated port by a designated time then it was assumed lost. In naval warfare, war ships were often accompanied by smaller cruisers and escorts that carried news between ships and shore. I'm not aware of any example of naval protocol to inform an adversary of their own losses.
posted by StarForce5 at 10:05 AM on January 2, 2007
posted by StarForce5 at 10:05 AM on January 2, 2007
My friend (an avid fan of the series), had this to say:
I know of no specific information on this topic, though the Dutch ship was called the Waakzaamheid. It seems to me that your opinion is correct, the rules of courtesy are too strong to ignore for tactical advantage, especially when you consider the tenuous lines of communication that would render most tactical advantages unactable. Then, consider the state of the French fleet at the time. It would be unlikely that the resources would be expended to repeat any naval expedition on the French side. And considering British concerns during the war of a possible naval invasion, it would be prudent to have the French ship another ship off to the South Atlantic, if they could get them to do it. Also, think on the role gossip plays in the O'Brien novels. He presents sailors as no better than chatty old women when it comes to information. As soon as they put in to port the word would get out. This of course is far from directly contacting the Dutch about the loss of their citizens. But mainly I think your impulse concerning the rules of war is what rings truest here. After all, were there survivors they wouldn't be held incommunicado, regardless of the strategic situation. They'd report it because they'd expect themselves to be reported. I wish I had some specific examples for you, but I haven't any.
posted by cowbellemoo at 10:06 AM on January 2, 2007
I know of no specific information on this topic, though the Dutch ship was called the Waakzaamheid. It seems to me that your opinion is correct, the rules of courtesy are too strong to ignore for tactical advantage, especially when you consider the tenuous lines of communication that would render most tactical advantages unactable. Then, consider the state of the French fleet at the time. It would be unlikely that the resources would be expended to repeat any naval expedition on the French side. And considering British concerns during the war of a possible naval invasion, it would be prudent to have the French ship another ship off to the South Atlantic, if they could get them to do it. Also, think on the role gossip plays in the O'Brien novels. He presents sailors as no better than chatty old women when it comes to information. As soon as they put in to port the word would get out. This of course is far from directly contacting the Dutch about the loss of their citizens. But mainly I think your impulse concerning the rules of war is what rings truest here. After all, were there survivors they wouldn't be held incommunicado, regardless of the strategic situation. They'd report it because they'd expect themselves to be reported. I wish I had some specific examples for you, but I haven't any.
posted by cowbellemoo at 10:06 AM on January 2, 2007
If C.S. Forester is to be believed, many naval dispatches were published (not having any Hornblower books in-front of me I can't tell you the name of the paper they appeared in) at some point after being digested by the Admiralty, so news of claimed significant victories/events and their details would get out, then definitely get back to the enemy. This is a time when private travel was usually possible even between countries at war, so news known in one place was known by all, eventually.
Round trip time to the somewhere like the Southern Ocean would be many months, so the tactical use of a central government knowing whether one of its ships had been sunk in a distant place was practically nil. Whether or not a local commander knew would be a different matter.
posted by Quinbus Flestrin at 12:59 PM on January 2, 2007
Round trip time to the somewhere like the Southern Ocean would be many months, so the tactical use of a central government knowing whether one of its ships had been sunk in a distant place was practically nil. Whether or not a local commander knew would be a different matter.
posted by Quinbus Flestrin at 12:59 PM on January 2, 2007
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by rolypolyman at 9:20 AM on January 2, 2007