Im worried that I believe in my beliefs too strongly.

November 28, 2006 7:10 AM

I am not stupid, but I know nearly nothing and will never change this fact. Help me accept this.

When humans are babies, they take in information from the world around them. It is necessary for them to create beliefs, and make decisions about their world, in order for them to function in it normally. This is why children are curious. Once humans feel safe in their environment, they tend to not bother asking questions and being curious. Their knowledge curve becomes close to stagnate.

I need information, book recommendations especially, about why humans have false beliefs. How can humans be deceived? How can emotions be altered? Books about the placebo effect, books about self deception. People create lies unconsciously to make their world comfortable.

I'm worried that I believe in my beliefs too strongly.

From time to time I think I truly understand something, say a subject in politics, I feel superior in a way to others when it comes to that subject. Then I learn something that blows my mind, and I realize how little I knew. This is a good thing. Basically, I want to read books that will make this happen more, also, make me realize and NOT FORGET that I know very little, and much of what I think I know is wrong.

Thanks in advance.

posted by JokingClown to education (49 comments total)

some examples:


A Mind of its Own: How Your Brain Distorts and Deceives

Introduction to Logic, 12th Edition

Crimes Against Logic
posted by JokingClown at 7:24 AM on November 28, 2006

The Demon-Haunted World and Why People Believe Weird Things.
posted by cog_nate at 7:31 AM on November 28, 2006

why humans have false beliefs. How can humans be deceived? How can emotions be altered? Books about the placebo effect, books about self deception. People create lies unconsciously to make their world comfortable.

This article addresses this particular part of your question.
posted by vytae at 7:32 AM on November 28, 2006

No one ever smacked me around politically more than Noam Chomsky. He'll take a statement that the media and the intellectuals repeat endlessly like "Bush is trying to spread democracy in the middle east" and show you not just that it isn't true but that it's such obvious bullshit that a ten year old should see through it. He presents a picture of the world that is completely at odds with the one you'll get from both the liberal and the conservative medias. I prefer his lectures, interviews, and Q&A sessions to his books, for the most part, but regardless of format his stuff is available for free all over the internet.

In another area entirely, there's Zen and the Art of Motorcydle Maintenance by Robert Pirsig. It'll make you think about science and art and just about everything else differently.
posted by Clay201 at 7:32 AM on November 28, 2006

The total non-attachment to any one view of reality or another is an important tenet of Buddhism. This book is a lovely starting place.
posted by 2or3whiskeysodas at 7:39 AM on November 28, 2006

The God Delusion
posted by M.C. Lo-Carb! at 7:40 AM on November 28, 2006

I feel superior in a way to others
"There's your problem."

That is indeed my problem. I'm aware I have that (everyone has that, although most wont use the word superior). I'm aware its my problem, which is why I asked this question... how can I change this permanently?

Clay201: Noam Chomsky is great. Some people obsess over him too much, but he has some awesome writings. I own several of his books.
posted by JokingClown at 7:42 AM on November 28, 2006

Cosmic Trigger by Robert Anton Wilson. Hell, anything by RAW.
posted by oh pollo! at 7:43 AM on November 28, 2006

As I get older, the less I subscribe to strong beliefs. It drives my wife crazy (she is very principled). But I've seen so many of my precious beliefs dashed on the rocks of reality that it seems pointless to believe I'm right anymore. That's not to say that I'm apathetic — I care very much — but that there's very little that is knowable, there's very little that is not subjective.

I think the fact that you're aware enough to ask this question demonstrates maturity. There are some good book recommendations in this thread. Read them. Don't get trapped in "either/or" thinking. Just because somebody opposes Bush, for example, doesn't mean they have to subscribe to the ideals of the liberal Democrats. You don't have to belong to one of the major political parties. You don't have to belong to organized religion. You don't have to have a favorite sports team. You can love Mozart, The Who, and Kelly Clarkson equally — don't believe anyone who tells you you're uncool if you don't.
posted by jdroth at 7:49 AM on November 28, 2006

Second Cosmic Trigger, and to a lesser extent, The Illuminatus Trilogy by Robert Shea and RAW.
posted by The Bellman at 8:01 AM on November 28, 2006

Why People Believe Weird Things. Written by a former true believer (and ultramarathon cyclist) turned skeptic.
posted by adamrice at 8:04 AM on November 28, 2006

Well, I wouldn't worry too much about it. You have to believe something right? However, you might try The Art of Self-Persuasion: The Social Explanation of False Beliefs by Raymond Boudon.

It isn't a book, but this website seems to address the kind of thing that you are talking about. Here particularly. I can't vouch for whether it is crazy or not.

Finally, you might enjoy this radio show.
posted by ND¢ at 8:04 AM on November 28, 2006

2or3whiskeysodas: I have been looking into Buddhism recently, very interesting. Ill definitely check out that book.

M.C. Lo-Carb!: Funny you mention God Delusion, I just watched part of the authors movie on the subject today.

oh pollo!/ The Bellman: I own the Illuminatus trilogy. I tried reading it and had a hard time getting into it. I didn't give it enough of a chance, ill need to read more sometime.
posted by JokingClown at 8:06 AM on November 28, 2006

"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance." Confucius
posted by caddis at 8:07 AM on November 28, 2006

jdroth: I have come to the same conclusion. But I want to set that conclusion in stone. Very hard stone. Like diamond maybe. Whats the hardest substance known to man? I want to set it in a substance harder than that. I'm surprised by how many of the recommendations I've already read. I agree though, great recommendations.
posted by JokingClown at 8:10 AM on November 28, 2006

The more you know, the more you know you don't know. This is one symptom of grad school, but happens to everyone who steps out of their bubble of banality.

Congratulations on entering the real world.
posted by chrisamiller at 8:10 AM on November 28, 2006

The Seven Sins of Memory: How the Mind Forgets and Remembers.
posted by yetanother at 8:13 AM on November 28, 2006

for the record, the thing that depresses me more than anything else is that in all likelihood I wont live to be over 120 years old, no matter how healthy I am.

I am currently twenty years old. If I live to be 120 that means I have lived one 6th of my life. If a was one years old, and had lived one 6th of my life that means Id die by the age of 6.

This depresses me because it gives me so little time to learn. If a learn at the same rate I have on average for my whole life, that means Ive learned 1/6th of everything I will learn in my life. I dont feel that I know very much, so that depresses me.
posted by JokingClown at 8:20 AM on November 28, 2006

Learn about "active listening," so when you spend time with people who have a different perspective you can learn from them, rather than argue with them.
posted by Biblio at 8:23 AM on November 28, 2006

I'm aware its my problem, which is why I asked this question... how can I change this permanently?

Commit yourself to constantly question your view of the world, down to the smallest details. Try to identify, at every opportunity, your assumptions. Ask questions—to yourself, to your friends and family and innocent bystanders—about anything you think you know.

Try not to worry about not learning enough: there is no race. Just keep learning, and give people and ideas a respectful benefit of the doubt, but test and explore those ideas.
posted by cortex at 8:25 AM on November 28, 2006

JokingClown - cheer up.

During your lifetime you will learn things (especially in science) that have never been known before. You are on the front line - you are riding the wave of reality!

Buy the ticket... take the ride.
posted by Blip at 8:30 AM on November 28, 2006

I second the Buddhism thing, you might want to look at the excellent free book Mindfulness In Plain English (also available to buy as a printed book).

Maintaining a few firmly held beliefs is pretty much a prerequisite for getting anything done. This is related to the observation that optimists get more done than pessimists despite making more mistakes, and is also IMHO probably something to do with the popularity of religion.
posted by teleskiving at 8:38 AM on November 28, 2006

you are unusual for 20, in that many 20-year-olds know everything.

fauxscot's rule of equal ignorance....

the body of human knowledge is so HUGE, one person cannot know a significant part of it... hence, we are all essentially equally ignorant. The task is to rise above zero a little bit! (this also applies to fame...)

statistically, you probably won't live to 120, incidentally, and you'd better get cracking. the challenge is not to live long, but to remain active, effective, and productive as long as life permits, IMO.

Have fun!
posted by FauxScot at 8:46 AM on November 28, 2006

A Thousand Plateaus, by Gilles Deleuze and Felix Guattari.

Ways of the Hand, by David Sudnow.

Goedel, Escher, Bach, by Douglas Hofstadter

I read these three in a 5 month period some years back and they had a big effect. I'd already read the Robert Anton Wilson and a bunch of Artaud, hehe...
posted by Joseph Gurl at 8:50 AM on November 28, 2006

David Hume, specifically, Of Miracles. It comes from his book, An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding.
posted by ifranzen at 8:51 AM on November 28, 2006

Im hoping that cryogenics and nanotechnology will advance in my lifetime so i can live past 120 :)

Assuming it doesn't, I am already cracking. :) I need to get some books an information on how to stay healthy. Preferably one with an intended audience of above 50 years, old, so I can know about diseases that wont affect me for 30 plus years, and change my lifestyle to avoid them while Im young.
posted by JokingClown at 8:54 AM on November 28, 2006

Noam Chomsky... presents a picture of the world that is completely at odds with the one you'll get from both the liberal and the conservative medias

Right, so you're exchanging one Authority for another. Not the answer, I'm afraid.

Just keep your attitude, and stop worrying so much. Live, learn, experience, and you'll do fine. (And what's with the "set that conclusion in stone" stuff? Isn't setting things in stone what you're trying to get away from?)
posted by languagehat at 8:59 AM on November 28, 2006

I second Pirsig's Zen and the Art and the sequel Lila.

Both were eye-openers for me on the road to understanding that I have much to understand.
posted by stungeye at 9:07 AM on November 28, 2006

More votes for Pirsig's Zen and the Art and RAW's Cosmic Trigger. I was forever changed by both.
posted by base_16 at 9:12 AM on November 28, 2006

You are confusing quantity for quality. Just a grain of the good stuff is all you need.
posted by StickyCarpet at 9:28 AM on November 28, 2006

You deserve praise for your early--and precocious--steps toward self-knowledge.

My hunch is that while you recognize the need for flexibility and intellectual humility--and have therefore taken a vital first step-- you haven't truly taken it aboard. You need to make a concerted effort to force your mind outward, to challenge your own beliefs at least as much as outside ideas, for the rest of your life.

First look at what filters and fun-house mirrors distort information on the way into your head. Read, for example, this.

Recognize that people occasionally let others do their thinking for them (such as when they choose to follow a fleeing mob) because it is an unrealistic goal to think through every single possible decision all the time. Sometimes you need to rely on the herd, not hold it in contempt.

Buy Reading for Survival, a folksy socratic dialogue by an underrated author. Amazon. Excerpt.

Let go of your need for external validation of your intelligence and perception. If you actually achieve your perceptial and intellectual goals, you'll be such a freakish, unpleasant outcast that nobody will see you clearly at all. You'll also be terrible company for most of the interim period. In other words, don't do this for the chicks.

Finally, show compassion for those who haven't or can't follow your path. Or, more succinctly: don't be a dick.
posted by Phred182 at 10:03 AM on November 28, 2006

"Influence" by Robert Cialdini. Amazon.

PBS Frontline episode "A Class Divided." Watch it online here.
posted by Phred182 at 10:13 AM on November 28, 2006

Seconding The Demon Haunted World. It was most influential book on my worldview, and really served to remind me to remember that all we have is our own perspective.
posted by Durhey at 11:07 AM on November 28, 2006

I'm too young to know (26), but I'm pretty sure it will take you a long time (like decades, say) to get to where you want to be. I started trying to improve along the lines you mention 5 or 6 years ago, and I've come pretty far if I'm looking back at where I started...but not very far if I look forward to where I'd like to be. So where's the advice in that? If you change for the better, but only a tiny bit at a time, that's what success feels like.

Incidentally, I believe in the things I believe in a lot more strongly than I ever did, it's just that there are very few of them. I have a couple principles that I'm very committed to (of course not as committed as I'd like to be, see above), and a lot of stuff has just fallen away.

But of course I may not be on the right path at all - I may have spent the last 6 years going in the wrong direction. The only thing I can really offer is the part about real change being slow. I wouldn't want to give you any other specific advice anyway, because I think you can only learn the really important things through experience, not by hearing them.

That and try reading the Tao Te Ching (mostly the first half - Stephen Mitchell's english version is great, available in tiny-paperback and also online). If it's boring, try reading it again a few years later. I'm not saying it's more important than the other books mentioned, but no one had mentioned it yet.
posted by pinespree at 11:18 AM on November 28, 2006

Right, so you're exchanging one Authority for another. Not the answer, I'm afraid.

Just keep your attitude, and stop worrying so much. Live, learn, experience, and you'll do fine. (And what's with the "set that conclusion in stone" stuff? Isn't setting things in stone what you're trying to get away from?)

Your half right about the Chomsky thing. You speak harshly about it, I'm guessing because you aren't a fan of him. Its only "trading one authority for another" if you assume that he made chompsky into a undebatable (or nearly so) authority.

As far as setting it in stone, its important to read what i wanted to set in stone: The only thing i want set in stone is that much of what i know is incorrect, and many of my beliefs are flawed. I want my belief that my other beliefs are often wrong and incorrect, that is all.
posted by JokingClown at 11:23 AM on November 28, 2006

For a historical perspective on the same thing, try Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds.

"We see one nation suddenly seized, from its highest to its lowest members, with a fierce desire of military glory; another as suddenly becoming crazed upon a religious scruple, and neither of them recovering its senses until it has shed rivers of blood and sowed a harvest of groans and tears, to be reaped by its posterity."

Pretty prescient for 1841.

I'd also be wary of Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: it can certainly offer you tantalizing insights into alternative ways of looking at the world, but at its end it's also a very nice (accidental, I'm sure) portrait of self-delusion.
posted by Paragon at 12:06 PM on November 28, 2006

JokingClown: It sounds a bit as if you see your life's goal as to accumulate as much data as possible.

I would draw a distinction between knowledge and wisdom.

I'd define knowledge as raw information about all kinds of things, and wisdom as deep understanding of human nature and the experience of living as a human being.

Knowledge can be useful, but very knowledgeable people can still be educated fools, and some very wise people have relatively little knowledge of the "book-learning" variety.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 1:06 PM on November 28, 2006

Also: I second jdroth. The older I get, the less I'm sure about. I think what's grown is my confidence and comfort in being uncertain about many things.

I remember reading an article in the New Yorker many years ago, about a famous intellectual who was dying of a terminal disease. I don't remember his name, but I was struck by something he said. IIRC: "I used to have millions of opinions, but now I've managed to get it down to mere thousands."

It helps to remember that much of our understanding of the world and life is provisional, and subject to change... or at least, it should be.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 1:13 PM on November 28, 2006

Right, so you're exchanging one Authority for another. Not the answer, I'm afraid.

I said no such thing. The point was simply that Chomsky does a good job of refuting existing assumptions. Clearly it's possible for a writer to do that without becoming the new "Authority." If it weren't, every answer in this thread would be useless.
posted by Clay201 at 1:44 PM on November 28, 2006

I would be remiss if I failed to point out that Zefrank addressed this very question today.
posted by adamrice at 4:12 PM on November 28, 2006

Forget more "non-fiction" books. I think you need more art in your life.

Now I wish I could write you a melody so plain
That could hold you dear lady from going insane
That could ease you and cool you and cease the pain
Of your useless and pointless knowledge
posted by Idiot Mittens at 5:07 PM on November 28, 2006

The book Labyrinths of Reason did this to me. Although it does focus manily on paradoxes, it also speaks in length about the vulnerability of our beliefs. After reading it, I felt both enlightened and incredibly idiotic. I read it well over 10 years ago and it is still my favorite.
posted by Ugh at 5:15 PM on November 28, 2006

I said no such thing.

I know, but you know as well as I do that plenty of people use Chomsky as a substitute Bible. Pirsig is a good opener of minds, because he doesn't try to implant a new orthodoxy. Chomsky, not so much.
posted by languagehat at 5:33 PM on November 28, 2006

Thank you all very much for your comments. They are all quite helpful.

(although ironically, some people commented on my personal beliefs while making assumptions about me which were entirely false. When I ask a question on meta filter I approach it in a very specific precise way. Just because I talk about that one thing, or ask for that one thing doesn't make it the main purpose of my life. oh well)

I dont want that to overshadow how much everyone helped me including the people I disagreed with about myself.
posted by JokingClown at 6:05 PM on November 28, 2006

Taking up life drawing at the Art Students League as a regular hobby was an amazing way to learn, and repeatedly confront the truth that we see what we want to see, not necessarily what is there.

It's also a great way to give yourself the discipline to take a closer look.
posted by extrabox at 8:06 PM on November 28, 2006

I definitely agree with that, I'm a bit of an artist myself (only as a hobby)
posted by JokingClown at 2:30 AM on November 29, 2006

Read Conjectures and Refutations by Karl Popper and Fooled by Randomness by Nassim Taleb. Add some reading about Socrates and you should by alright!
posted by Knorhaen at 8:05 AM on November 29, 2006

Now that you know that you don't know anything, the second thing to realize is that everyone else is in exactly the same boat, but the people everyone listens to just act like they aren't. So don't ever let on that you don't know what you're talking about, because there's a good chance the other person knows less than you and will never know the difference. The alternative is to let some other monkey who doesn't know what he's talking about become the authority, and trust me, that's no fun for anyone.

You can practice, while you're reading Popper, the ability to take the good bits from what he's saying while being aware that he's pretty much a wanker.
posted by Mr. Gunn at 9:49 PM on November 29, 2006

I've always felt that the most important step in learning anything is realizing how much you don't know. Most people never even get to that point and they walk around their entire lives thinking they're much smarter than they actually are. It sounds to me like you're on the right path to knowing a lot of stuff. It's all about being a life-long learner, but only because you enjoy it.
posted by bda1972 at 10:47 PM on November 29, 2006