CPAP camping - question on cables needed for battery (charge & connect)
March 22, 2023 3:55 PM Subscribe
I have questions on (a) device needed for charging the deep-cycle battery, and (b) cable/adapter needed for the CPAP's DC-DC converter to connect to the battery.
I'm planning to camp for two nights. I've read this AskMe as well as the battery guide from my CPAP manufacturer (ResMed, AirSense 10) and believe I've identified a couple good candidate deep-cycle 100Ah batteries that will last me a couple nights (example . Another example).
Now I need to figure out the care and feeding of the battery, as well has what I need to hook up the CPAP.
1. Is this sort of thing really all that is needed to charge a battery? And if yes, is it worth spending $40 more to get the 5A version of the same charger? (Note, FWIW, I will not be charging the battery during the trip.)
2. The DC-DC converter for the CPAP will have a car adapter -type plug. I don't even know what to call the sort of adapter/cable assembly that will be needed to accept the plug and connect it to the battery. Any recommendations?
3. Bonus question: if you have an AirSense 10 and have obtained a DC-DC adapter, any links to what you bought (if it made you happy) would be welcome.
4. My budget is about $400 (tops!) which is why I've decided to roll my own instead of getting one of the simpler solutions that are more expensive. If you know of a different approach that will get 2 nights of power for a CPAP that isn't over $400, I'm all ears. Weight isn't an issue (car camping).
Lastly, thanks very much for reading and helping someone get a good nights' sleep on a much needed getaway.
I'm planning to camp for two nights. I've read this AskMe as well as the battery guide from my CPAP manufacturer (ResMed, AirSense 10) and believe I've identified a couple good candidate deep-cycle 100Ah batteries that will last me a couple nights (example . Another example).
Now I need to figure out the care and feeding of the battery, as well has what I need to hook up the CPAP.
1. Is this sort of thing really all that is needed to charge a battery? And if yes, is it worth spending $40 more to get the 5A version of the same charger? (Note, FWIW, I will not be charging the battery during the trip.)
2. The DC-DC converter for the CPAP will have a car adapter -type plug. I don't even know what to call the sort of adapter/cable assembly that will be needed to accept the plug and connect it to the battery. Any recommendations?
3. Bonus question: if you have an AirSense 10 and have obtained a DC-DC adapter, any links to what you bought (if it made you happy) would be welcome.
4. My budget is about $400 (tops!) which is why I've decided to roll my own instead of getting one of the simpler solutions that are more expensive. If you know of a different approach that will get 2 nights of power for a CPAP that isn't over $400, I'm all ears. Weight isn't an issue (car camping).
Lastly, thanks very much for reading and helping someone get a good nights' sleep on a much needed getaway.
OK, I learned more about batteries now! You are right, for a capacity vs cost, you can't beat a sealed lead acid battery (you pay for it, of course, with weight and speed of charging). The Jackery unit I linked has significantly less capacity. Sorry about that.
posted by rockindata at 4:39 PM on March 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by rockindata at 4:39 PM on March 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: The CPAP mfg recommends using a deep-cycle battery. I have not found newer documentation that recommends otherwise. That Jackery unit is lithium, does not say that it's deep-cycle battery, and is rated for 46Ah which will only get me through one night's sleep. I've looked at Jackery and the model that has the required Ah eats up most of my budget.
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 4:39 PM on March 22, 2023
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 4:39 PM on March 22, 2023
Response by poster: Whoops, you beat me on preview. Thanks for taking a look at this.
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 4:40 PM on March 22, 2023
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 4:40 PM on March 22, 2023
Best answer: 1. The capacity of the charger isn't really critical if you don't need to charge while you're away - you just leave it trickling away until it's fully charged. Do charge it when you get back, as it's not good for batteries to be left discharged. Also charge it up immediately before you go on a trip, because batteries will lose a tiny bit of charge over time. Most cheaper chargers shouldn't be left charging for extended periods, but some more expensive ones can be left on permanently and will apply a 'float charge' to keep the battery at 100% without damage. If you're happy to put it on charge and take it off manually, I would focus your spending on getting the best quality battery you can, because you're not worried about fast charging or maintenance charging.
If you can add a solar panel within your budget you may be able to extend the number of nights from a battery, but I wouldn't rely on that for something so critical, because you're at the mercy of the weather.
2. The adaptor you are looking at is generally called a car cigarette lighter or auxiliary power outlet. They were originally only a receptacle for a cigarette lighter, but have become kind of standard for a 12v power outlet in vehicles. I find they can be a little fragile but, as long as you don't twist the plug while it's in the socket it will be fine.
3. No idea, sorry.
That Jackery unit is 160 watt-hours, not 160 amp-hours. That equates to 13.3 amp-hours (amp-hours = watt-hours / volts).
The manufacturer guide you linked gives the battery amp-hour required as 68 for the highest number and 9 for the lowest (you didn't give the actual model details in full) to run the device for 8 hours. This is obviously a big range, but I assume you've worked out that 100 amp-hour will run your device for 16 hours or so (two nights).
Lead-acid is probably your best bet, given your budget. Lithium batteries can be a bit smaller and lighter for the same capacity, but they do cost a lot more.
posted by dg at 4:59 PM on March 22, 2023
If you can add a solar panel within your budget you may be able to extend the number of nights from a battery, but I wouldn't rely on that for something so critical, because you're at the mercy of the weather.
2. The adaptor you are looking at is generally called a car cigarette lighter or auxiliary power outlet. They were originally only a receptacle for a cigarette lighter, but have become kind of standard for a 12v power outlet in vehicles. I find they can be a little fragile but, as long as you don't twist the plug while it's in the socket it will be fine.
3. No idea, sorry.
That Jackery unit is 160 watt-hours, not 160 amp-hours. That equates to 13.3 amp-hours (amp-hours = watt-hours / volts).
The manufacturer guide you linked gives the battery amp-hour required as 68 for the highest number and 9 for the lowest (you didn't give the actual model details in full) to run the device for 8 hours. This is obviously a big range, but I assume you've worked out that 100 amp-hour will run your device for 16 hours or so (two nights).
Lead-acid is probably your best bet, given your budget. Lithium batteries can be a bit smaller and lighter for the same capacity, but they do cost a lot more.
posted by dg at 4:59 PM on March 22, 2023
Best answer: This comes with everything you need to connect your AirSense 10 to the battery.
My wife uses the AirSense 10, and due to timing / circumstances we actually ended up getting an inverter, but it still serves the same purpose and she just plugs it in with the regular AC cord into the inverter. It's an extra little thing to carry around when we camp, and there's some efficiency loss, but it still works well. I am getting a new AirSense on Friday, but have used a Respironics for the last several years. I was able to find a direct alligator-clip-to-DC-in for it. I will probably pick up the one I linked for this year since I'll now have the AirSense.
As for Battery, we each use an EverSmart 690, 101 Ah. We each get at least 3 nights; never tried to go longer so not sure what the max is, but you might be able to get by with a little smaller if you know 2 will be your max and lugging it around will be an issue. Thankfully we only have about a 50ft walk from the car to where we set up the tent so it's not a big deal for us.
Get whatever trickle charger you like, as mentioned the voltage shouldn't matter if you don't care how long it takes to charge. We keep ours in the garage and after a full charge on each immediately after camping weekends, I just switch the charger between my battery and the wife's every month or so or whenever I think about it.
posted by SquidLips at 5:30 PM on March 22, 2023 [2 favorites]
My wife uses the AirSense 10, and due to timing / circumstances we actually ended up getting an inverter, but it still serves the same purpose and she just plugs it in with the regular AC cord into the inverter. It's an extra little thing to carry around when we camp, and there's some efficiency loss, but it still works well. I am getting a new AirSense on Friday, but have used a Respironics for the last several years. I was able to find a direct alligator-clip-to-DC-in for it. I will probably pick up the one I linked for this year since I'll now have the AirSense.
As for Battery, we each use an EverSmart 690, 101 Ah. We each get at least 3 nights; never tried to go longer so not sure what the max is, but you might be able to get by with a little smaller if you know 2 will be your max and lugging it around will be an issue. Thankfully we only have about a 50ft walk from the car to where we set up the tent so it's not a big deal for us.
Get whatever trickle charger you like, as mentioned the voltage shouldn't matter if you don't care how long it takes to charge. We keep ours in the garage and after a full charge on each immediately after camping weekends, I just switch the charger between my battery and the wife's every month or so or whenever I think about it.
posted by SquidLips at 5:30 PM on March 22, 2023 [2 favorites]
The battery guide for your unit was published in 2018!
Your question is a bit like asking "how can I buy a good buggy-whip oiler to get my horses to run fast?"
Battery technology has come a long way since then. In fact, the term "deep cycle" battery only applies to older Lead Acid batteries, which are a technological and ecological nightmare.
Don't buy a "deep cycle" battery, since that will be lead acid.
posted by soylent00FF00 at 7:19 PM on March 22, 2023
Your question is a bit like asking "how can I buy a good buggy-whip oiler to get my horses to run fast?"
Battery technology has come a long way since then. In fact, the term "deep cycle" battery only applies to older Lead Acid batteries, which are a technological and ecological nightmare.
Don't buy a "deep cycle" battery, since that will be lead acid.
posted by soylent00FF00 at 7:19 PM on March 22, 2023
We've been car camping with my CPAP using something like this that plugs into the lighter socket and fits in a cupholder. It could only handle the power needs of the CPAP with the engine on - the CPAP would uselessly turn off and on every ~30sec or so with the engine off. After the first night where I slept without it and we ended up with condensation on the inside of all the windows, we left the car idling overnight using both the CPAP and AC. Only used ~1/4 tank of gas overnight.
posted by gible at 10:03 PM on March 22, 2023
posted by gible at 10:03 PM on March 22, 2023
Best answer: I had this CPAP camping challenge this past summer, and here's how I solved it. I have an AirSense 10 auto, and I use heated tubing and a humidifier.
I bought the Jackery Portable Power Station Explorer 300, 293Wh Backup Lithium Battery, 110V/300W Pure Sine Wave AC Outlet (Currently $299 on Amazon) and the KFD DC Adapter Car Charger for Resmed S10 Series,ResMed Airsense 10 S10 AirCurve 10 Series CPAP and BiPAP Machine,90W Resmed S10 370001 37297 Rockpals 300W/500W Vehicle Power Supply Cord Cable Charger
With the Jackery fully charged and using the DC cable (this is key), I had enough battery life to last through the night and had charge left over. I slept 8 hours with no issue. I ran the car in the morning to charge the battery the next day.
posted by msladygrey at 6:26 AM on March 23, 2023 [2 favorites]
I bought the Jackery Portable Power Station Explorer 300, 293Wh Backup Lithium Battery, 110V/300W Pure Sine Wave AC Outlet (Currently $299 on Amazon) and the KFD DC Adapter Car Charger for Resmed S10 Series,ResMed Airsense 10 S10 AirCurve 10 Series CPAP and BiPAP Machine,90W Resmed S10 370001 37297 Rockpals 300W/500W Vehicle Power Supply Cord Cable Charger
With the Jackery fully charged and using the DC cable (this is key), I had enough battery life to last through the night and had charge left over. I slept 8 hours with no issue. I ran the car in the morning to charge the battery the next day.
posted by msladygrey at 6:26 AM on March 23, 2023 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Thanks all for the thoughtfulness and recommendations. Here's what I ended up going with:
Renogy 100Ah 12V Deep Cycle AGM Battery - this will cover one night sleeping with the humidifier on, which according to the guide will consume ~45Ah of battery. So for the sake of the battery's health and longevity, the discharge will be kept < 50% (though I've read in some places it can be discharged down 80%, I'm not going to risk it)
Grecell T300 288Wh Portable Power Station - this is aimed at handling the mere ~17Ah that supposedly will be consumed by one night of CPAP usage without the humidifier on . And it's slightly less expensive than the equivalent Jackery
KFD DC-DC adapter for the CPAP, linked to above by msladygrey
NOCO GC017 15A 14AWG 12V Adapter, Heavy-Duty Cigarette Lighter Plug, and Female Socket with Battery Clamps to connect the CPAP's DC-DC adapter to the battery
Schumacher SC1282 Fully Automatic Battery Charger and Maintainer - 10 Amp/2 Amp 12V - for charging the Renogy battery
And finally and optionally, AstroAI Multimeter 2000 Counts Digital Multimeter with DC AC Voltmeter and Ohm Volt Amp Tester -- to check the Renogy's voltage / charge state
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 7:55 PM on March 29, 2023
Renogy 100Ah 12V Deep Cycle AGM Battery - this will cover one night sleeping with the humidifier on, which according to the guide will consume ~45Ah of battery. So for the sake of the battery's health and longevity, the discharge will be kept < 50% (though I've read in some places it can be discharged down 80%, I'm not going to risk it)
Grecell T300 288Wh Portable Power Station - this is aimed at handling the mere ~17Ah that supposedly will be consumed by one night of CPAP usage without the humidifier on . And it's slightly less expensive than the equivalent Jackery
KFD DC-DC adapter for the CPAP, linked to above by msladygrey
NOCO GC017 15A 14AWG 12V Adapter, Heavy-Duty Cigarette Lighter Plug, and Female Socket with Battery Clamps to connect the CPAP's DC-DC adapter to the battery
Schumacher SC1282 Fully Automatic Battery Charger and Maintainer - 10 Amp/2 Amp 12V - for charging the Renogy battery
And finally and optionally, AstroAI Multimeter 2000 Counts Digital Multimeter with DC AC Voltmeter and Ohm Volt Amp Tester -- to check the Renogy's voltage / charge state
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 7:55 PM on March 29, 2023
These are all good choices, and I apologize for my earlier comments in which I was a Lithium Nazi. ;-)
The AGM battery is a Lead-Acid formula, a type of battery which has 100+ years of history, and is reliable, safe, and genrally can be recycled. And, you can totally discharge a lead-acid from 100% to 0% when needed.
The big issue with Lead acids is cycle life - if you routinely discharge to 100% they will quickly lose capacity (like within 10 to 100 cycles).
Lithiums, by contrast, can do 1000-3000 full cycles without problem, are lighter weight and recharge much more efficiently. For long-term heavy use, lithium is (almost) always better these days.
To keep your AGM (or other Lead Acid battery) happy, make sure you charge it up to full as soon as possible. They really don't like to sit at 25% to 50% charge state for long.
posted by soylent00FF00 at 8:09 PM on March 31, 2023 [2 favorites]
The AGM battery is a Lead-Acid formula, a type of battery which has 100+ years of history, and is reliable, safe, and genrally can be recycled. And, you can totally discharge a lead-acid from 100% to 0% when needed.
The big issue with Lead acids is cycle life - if you routinely discharge to 100% they will quickly lose capacity (like within 10 to 100 cycles).
Lithiums, by contrast, can do 1000-3000 full cycles without problem, are lighter weight and recharge much more efficiently. For long-term heavy use, lithium is (almost) always better these days.
To keep your AGM (or other Lead Acid battery) happy, make sure you charge it up to full as soon as possible. They really don't like to sit at 25% to 50% charge state for long.
posted by soylent00FF00 at 8:09 PM on March 31, 2023 [2 favorites]
Just to add to the above advice - if you let your AGM battery discharge so far that it drops below 2v, no battery charger can charge it. This should never be a problem unless you have a load connected for a long time and completely ignore it. Unlikely to happen, but make sure you disconnect everything while you're storing it for any amount of time.
posted by dg at 7:40 PM on April 2, 2023
posted by dg at 7:40 PM on April 2, 2023
I camp for up to a week at a time and used to solar charge a big battery. But then my CPAP doctor recommended I get a nonprescription oral appliance. SnoreRx is $60. You soften it by soaking it in warm water, then hold it in your mouth for a minute, then dunk in ice water. It's adjustable.
I used it on an 8-day float trip; my friends said I didn't snore at all and I felt fully alert all day so I guess it worked. It does make my teeth a little sore so now I won't use it more than 3 nights in a row. YMMV.
posted by neuron at 5:29 PM on April 3, 2023 [1 favorite]
I used it on an 8-day float trip; my friends said I didn't snore at all and I felt fully alert all day so I guess it worked. It does make my teeth a little sore so now I won't use it more than 3 nights in a row. YMMV.
posted by neuron at 5:29 PM on April 3, 2023 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: So I discovered, later rather than sooner, that the CPAP mfg's battery recommendation on battery size was way overblown. The usage in Ah of my CPAP on my settings *and* using that power-hungry humidifier function is 1/4 of the draw that the CPAP mfg said it would be. Confirmed both by a Wh monitor I hooked up to the battery, and running the CPAP off AC with a Kill-A-Watt. Both measured ~12Ah for 8hrs of usage, compared to 44Ah. Even if I assume the mfg's recommended batt size takes into account a 50% discharge floor, it's still 2x what I actually used. TL;DR get a Kill-a-Watt and measure your nightly usage before you go out and buy more battery than you might need (which in my case is enough to accommodate The Revolution when it arrives at my door, looking to charge their phones).
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 9:07 PM on April 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 9:07 PM on April 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
Since this was posted, it seems that at least one company is making a lithium battery pack which will output directly into an Airsense S10 without a separate converter. "Easylonger ES400 AIR Battery Pack"
See my comment on the most recent question on this topic.
posted by richb at 3:33 PM on August 27, 2023
See my comment on the most recent question on this topic.
posted by richb at 3:33 PM on August 27, 2023
This thread is closed to new comments.
This type of thing is relatively new, its not surprising that your CPAP docs are stuck in 2010's battery world
posted by rockindata at 4:25 PM on March 22, 2023 [2 favorites]