CPAP in the wilderness?
August 2, 2023 10:55 AM Subscribe
What do you do for CPAP when there isn't an electric outlet available (camping etc)?
I normally use a standard CPAP machine at home (Philips/Resmed Airsense 10) which plugs into a wall outlet. But I'm considering what I would need to go camping etc, while not spending unnecessary amounts of money for an infrequent event.
Do I need a different CPAP machine that is battery powered? Do I need a battery-to-ac converter from my CPAP manufacturer (Resmed)? Can I use any old battery to ac converter (what specs should I look for)? Will this be covered by standard medical insurance?
I normally use a standard CPAP machine at home (Philips/Resmed Airsense 10) which plugs into a wall outlet. But I'm considering what I would need to go camping etc, while not spending unnecessary amounts of money for an infrequent event.
Do I need a different CPAP machine that is battery powered? Do I need a battery-to-ac converter from my CPAP manufacturer (Resmed)? Can I use any old battery to ac converter (what specs should I look for)? Will this be covered by standard medical insurance?
What you ideally want is a separate travel CPAP. They are much smaller than traditional ones and meant to be used in travel (your standard one is not meant to hold up to travel... in fact, my wife's Dreamstation was kaputted by a trip to Ireland this year, and we had to scramble to find her another CPAP while in Ireland... fortunately we were staying with friends and they happened to have friends who ran a CPAP provider... who graciously lent us one for free).
Unfortunately they travel CPAPs are expensive and don't typically have humidifiers. One, the Transcend Micro, has an accessory that supposedly provides humidity without a tank. Don't know how well it works.
As far as batteries go, you can get CPAP-specific battery packs but almost anything will work as long as it has an appropriate power rating and connector, and non-CPAP ones will be much cheaper. We live in a place that's prone to power outages and we need our CPAPs to always work, so I got us each one of these. It has a 12V car lighter outlet which we use with a car adapter to our CPAP. (It also has AC outlets, but going DC is more efficient.) It runs our Dreamstation 2s for at least a couple nights with heated tube and humidifier. It might well run a week with just the blower. It would be pretty heavy to travel with, can't go on a plane, and is probably overkill (there are smaller ones, of course). It can be solar-charged and also has USB ports for charging your digital devices. I chose this one because it has a LiFePO4 battery (better longevity and safer than typical lithium ion chemistries, though lower power density), was online (can power devices while charging, so can essentially function as a UPS), and was affordable. It's worked well so far, but there are a lot of very similar ones available on Amazon from various Chinese vendors with wacky names.
posted by kindall at 11:20 AM on August 2, 2023 [3 favorites]
Unfortunately they travel CPAPs are expensive and don't typically have humidifiers. One, the Transcend Micro, has an accessory that supposedly provides humidity without a tank. Don't know how well it works.
As far as batteries go, you can get CPAP-specific battery packs but almost anything will work as long as it has an appropriate power rating and connector, and non-CPAP ones will be much cheaper. We live in a place that's prone to power outages and we need our CPAPs to always work, so I got us each one of these. It has a 12V car lighter outlet which we use with a car adapter to our CPAP. (It also has AC outlets, but going DC is more efficient.) It runs our Dreamstation 2s for at least a couple nights with heated tube and humidifier. It might well run a week with just the blower. It would be pretty heavy to travel with, can't go on a plane, and is probably overkill (there are smaller ones, of course). It can be solar-charged and also has USB ports for charging your digital devices. I chose this one because it has a LiFePO4 battery (better longevity and safer than typical lithium ion chemistries, though lower power density), was online (can power devices while charging, so can essentially function as a UPS), and was affordable. It's worked well so far, but there are a lot of very similar ones available on Amazon from various Chinese vendors with wacky names.
posted by kindall at 11:20 AM on August 2, 2023 [3 favorites]
Deep-cycle battery, from what I gather; combine it with something like the Resmed AirMini (which I enjoy using for travel, paid out of pocket though).
A big question you'll want to keep in mind when looking at options: How long do you expect to have to go between opportunities to charge. If you just need enough battery to get through the night, & can charge it through the day at an outlet because you're at a campsite or car where that's an option but inconvenient to plug in direct; that's a very different requirement from if you're deep in the woods & want to go a week without charging.
Also, do you expect to fly with the battery? If you're only planning on camping where you're traveling from home via land, that opens up more options vs. if you need to be TSA-compliant.
posted by CrystalDave at 11:23 AM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
A big question you'll want to keep in mind when looking at options: How long do you expect to have to go between opportunities to charge. If you just need enough battery to get through the night, & can charge it through the day at an outlet because you're at a campsite or car where that's an option but inconvenient to plug in direct; that's a very different requirement from if you're deep in the woods & want to go a week without charging.
Also, do you expect to fly with the battery? If you're only planning on camping where you're traveling from home via land, that opens up more options vs. if you need to be TSA-compliant.
posted by CrystalDave at 11:23 AM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
It's not a terrible idea to have a Portable Power Station for unforeseen emergencies as well as camping and other travel. You'll usually find a number of people in the reviews talking about CPAP use specifically and how much time they get from however many watt hours. We use these camping to run a 12v fridge.
You wouldn't be able to fly with one of these though, if that's part of your calculations.
posted by Lyn Never at 11:29 AM on August 2, 2023 [3 favorites]
You wouldn't be able to fly with one of these though, if that's part of your calculations.
posted by Lyn Never at 11:29 AM on August 2, 2023 [3 favorites]
you can buy an DC/DC power supply for the Airsense (Resmed provides them for the suppliers to sell), and hook that directly up to a "Deep cycle" battery which you can get at walmart. This will not require you to buy a DC->AC power inverter, and with the gained efficiency of not converting the power from DC to AC to DC, you can buy a smaller battery.
power requirements can be found in this PDF. You will need to know what your pressure normally is to size the smallest battery. you can go off the "maximum" setting if you don't have that data.
If you can bear to use the CPAP with the humidifer and heated hose turned off, you can get away with using the smallest battery. you can still fill the tank, just won't humidify as well without the heat.
posted by ArgentCorvid at 11:34 AM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
power requirements can be found in this PDF. You will need to know what your pressure normally is to size the smallest battery. you can go off the "maximum" setting if you don't have that data.
If you can bear to use the CPAP with the humidifer and heated hose turned off, you can get away with using the smallest battery. you can still fill the tank, just won't humidify as well without the heat.
posted by ArgentCorvid at 11:34 AM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
Forgot to add: you can also buy purpose-built Lithium battery packs for CPAP machines (like this) that are much smaller than a Lead/Acid battery, but they are expensive.
posted by ArgentCorvid at 11:39 AM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by ArgentCorvid at 11:39 AM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
Not covered by standard insurance, no, but CPAPs & accessories are usually eligible for FSA/HSA/HRA. kindall mentioned the Transcend Micro; at the company's site, "We are often asked if a customer can use an HSA (Health Savings Accounts) or FSA (Flexible Savings Accounts) to purchase one of our CPAP machines, and we are happy to say that the answer is yes. [...] It’s not only CPAP machines that can be purchased using an HSA or FSA, you can also use funds in these accounts to purchase CPAP accessories". Please, check with your account provider prior to any CPAP-related purchases from any company.
posted by Iris Gambol at 11:53 AM on August 2, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by Iris Gambol at 11:53 AM on August 2, 2023 [2 favorites]
Have you read this thread from earlier this year? I did so and ended up not going with any of the options presented when I went camping for two nights. I borrowed a Jackery Explorer 1500 for my identical CPAP to yours and it worked just fine! We also used it to charge our phones etc a bunch, and ended up topping off the Jackery charge at a ranger station, but that probably wasn't necessary.
posted by knile at 4:55 PM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by knile at 4:55 PM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
I'm the knucklehead who wrote the post linked above by knile. My reading of Resmed's battery guide was far too literal. I would have gotten by just fine (for two nights) with the Grecell T300 288Wh Portable Power Station, which is a helluva lot lighter than the AGM battery I also got.
Do I need a battery-to-ac converter from my CPAP manufacturer (Resmed)? Can I use any old battery to ac converter (what specs should I look for)?
Check out the KFD DC-DC adapter I linked to in my post, you don't need to pay top dollar to get one from ResMed. I def recommend using that instead of just plugging the CPAP's AC adapter into the power pack, if you want to maximize battery life.
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 5:39 PM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
Do I need a battery-to-ac converter from my CPAP manufacturer (Resmed)? Can I use any old battery to ac converter (what specs should I look for)?
Check out the KFD DC-DC adapter I linked to in my post, you don't need to pay top dollar to get one from ResMed. I def recommend using that instead of just plugging the CPAP's AC adapter into the power pack, if you want to maximize battery life.
posted by jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only at 5:39 PM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
FWIW, CPAP is covered by Medicaid. I got one through SFHP, which is in conjunction with MediCAL, California's version of Medicaid.
A bit of Googling revealed this battery off Amazon through CPAPExtras, compatible with my Redmed Airsense 11, for about $250. It's basically a 24000 mAh powerbank with a special cable for the Resmed that is enough for one or two nights of use, according to the description. And you need to turn the humidifier OFF for best battery life.
There are several more on Amazon, all claim to be CPAP battery , some go as low as 162 USD.
posted by kschang at 7:13 PM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
A bit of Googling revealed this battery off Amazon through CPAPExtras, compatible with my Redmed Airsense 11, for about $250. It's basically a 24000 mAh powerbank with a special cable for the Resmed that is enough for one or two nights of use, according to the description. And you need to turn the humidifier OFF for best battery life.
There are several more on Amazon, all claim to be CPAP battery , some go as low as 162 USD.
posted by kschang at 7:13 PM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]
Resmed 10 has the barrel plug and you can find converters from "auto DC power" (aka cigarette adapter) to that for about $30-50 on Amazon. Then you just need some sort of a power bank that has that sort of plug. Roypow has a 30W one for about $73, but that's a bit small. You probably need something like Renogy 266 Wh one which is like $160
posted by kschang at 7:37 PM on August 2, 2023
posted by kschang at 7:37 PM on August 2, 2023
What do you do for CPAP when there isn't an electric outlet available (camping etc)?
If it’s just a couple of days I skip it entirely. I get terrible sleep though.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 7:45 PM on August 2, 2023
If it’s just a couple of days I skip it entirely. I get terrible sleep though.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 7:45 PM on August 2, 2023
Resmed 10 has the barrel plug and you can find converters from "auto DC power" (aka cigarette adapter) to that for about $30-50 on Amazon.
If you do this you need to be sure that the output is 24 Volts, not 12, like most cars use. The machine won't work on 12.
posted by ArgentCorvid at 8:42 PM on August 2, 2023
If you do this you need to be sure that the output is 24 Volts, not 12, like most cars use. The machine won't work on 12.
posted by ArgentCorvid at 8:42 PM on August 2, 2023
Which is why I specified "converters from auto DC power". There's a transformer in the middle that steps it up to 24V.
posted by kschang at 9:31 PM on August 2, 2023
posted by kschang at 9:31 PM on August 2, 2023
I saved this reddit post from 2 years ago in the hopes of getting a full night's sleep from a battery backup system, since the official Resmed battery didn't give me more than a 4 hours during my last power failure (CPAP only; the humidifier I disconnected). I've got the Airsense 10, which I used for 5 years and now I keep as a travel unit and the 11, not sure which model I was using had when this last happened,
The user goes into detail about parts, with links, but they've set up what seems to be the gold standard: DC to DC converter from Resmed and a sealed deep-cycle marine battery. This is going to be a heavy-ass battery, not for hiking but fine for car-camping, but being sealed, it's okay to have in your bedroom as well. There's also a link to a charger/maintainer. The 100Ah battery was good for 3 full nights of 8-hour sleep, or close to it.
Obviously it's 2 years later; some of the devices will have iterated to new models/versions, but this should give you a good idea of what it takes to do the marine battery version. Depending on your needs, you can get a smaller battery as well, or multiple batteries, and charge them as opportunity presents while you're traveling. And if you're exclusively using this setup outdoors, a regular car battery will do the trick, though it will potentially emit hydrogen gas, and you want to be careful about keeping the battery upright in general. (and not a bad idea to keep it sheltered, but not in the tent)
Happy Zs! If you go with this solution, please let me know how it went for you.
posted by Sunburnt at 3:07 AM on August 3, 2023
The user goes into detail about parts, with links, but they've set up what seems to be the gold standard: DC to DC converter from Resmed and a sealed deep-cycle marine battery. This is going to be a heavy-ass battery, not for hiking but fine for car-camping, but being sealed, it's okay to have in your bedroom as well. There's also a link to a charger/maintainer. The 100Ah battery was good for 3 full nights of 8-hour sleep, or close to it.
Obviously it's 2 years later; some of the devices will have iterated to new models/versions, but this should give you a good idea of what it takes to do the marine battery version. Depending on your needs, you can get a smaller battery as well, or multiple batteries, and charge them as opportunity presents while you're traveling. And if you're exclusively using this setup outdoors, a regular car battery will do the trick, though it will potentially emit hydrogen gas, and you want to be careful about keeping the battery upright in general. (and not a bad idea to keep it sheltered, but not in the tent)
Happy Zs! If you go with this solution, please let me know how it went for you.
posted by Sunburnt at 3:07 AM on August 3, 2023
Re: my comment above, I have the 9 (now used for travel) and the 10, not 10+11. Oops!
posted by Sunburnt at 12:07 PM on August 3, 2023
posted by Sunburnt at 12:07 PM on August 3, 2023
I know one person who brings his regular machine and a big solar panel with a couple car-sized sealed batteries, and another who got the surgery where you break the jaw so it sticks out. Two very different solutions to the same problem.
posted by wnissen at 3:56 PM on August 3, 2023
posted by wnissen at 3:56 PM on August 3, 2023
For funsies, I checked Resmed's website, and turns out they sell their own battery for 10 and 11 series. That explains why there are clones of such on Amazon for 20% less.
(Then I found the rabbit hole of "CPAP Water", which is more expensive than Evian...)
posted by kschang at 9:40 AM on August 9, 2023
(Then I found the rabbit hole of "CPAP Water", which is more expensive than Evian...)
posted by kschang at 9:40 AM on August 9, 2023
"Easylonger ES400 AIR Battery Pack" is a 148Wh lithium battery pack that comes with cables for most CPAPs including the Airsense S10 and has switchable output voltage, so you don't need to buy a separate DC-DC adapter. It's less than 1kg in weight and about the size of a paperback book.
It's £170 in the UK, I couldn't see it on the US amazon site.
I bought one last week and used it camping for one night. It worked perfectly for me, went from full to "3/4" charge after 8 hours usage on my Airsense S10 (no humidifier) (the charge indicator is not precise and only shows quarters).
I haven't measured it accurately myself but "jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only" in the previous question on this topic measured his Airsense S10 at 12Ah per 8h night with humidifier. (Thanks for sharing that!) Assuming that he's measuring that at the 12V side (the S10 actually takes 24V in after DC-DC converter), that would be 96Wh, so you might expect to get 1.5 nights with humidifier, or perhaps 2-4 nights without humidifier.
Having read the previous questions on this, I was pleased to find that and it's much easier and a little cheaper than a big battery pack + a separate DC-DC converter.
posted by richb at 3:31 PM on August 27, 2023
It's £170 in the UK, I couldn't see it on the US amazon site.
I bought one last week and used it camping for one night. It worked perfectly for me, went from full to "3/4" charge after 8 hours usage on my Airsense S10 (no humidifier) (the charge indicator is not precise and only shows quarters).
I haven't measured it accurately myself but "jerome powell buys his sweatbands in bulk only" in the previous question on this topic measured his Airsense S10 at 12Ah per 8h night with humidifier. (Thanks for sharing that!) Assuming that he's measuring that at the 12V side (the S10 actually takes 24V in after DC-DC converter), that would be 96Wh, so you might expect to get 1.5 nights with humidifier, or perhaps 2-4 nights without humidifier.
Having read the previous questions on this, I was pleased to find that and it's much easier and a little cheaper than a big battery pack + a separate DC-DC converter.
posted by richb at 3:31 PM on August 27, 2023
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P. S. apneaboard.com and cpaptalk.com are longstanding online forums with a lot of info about camping etc., just make sure you're looking at recent info.
posted by wintersweet at 11:06 AM on August 2, 2023 [1 favorite]