Limbo between quitting and starting.
June 14, 2017 8:20 AM Subscribe
I've given notice as my less-than-ideal, toxic job . They're gettin' real weird. It's making me quite uncomfortable. I've never had to navigate this before. How should I proceed?
My current employ is a hot mess; blatant nepotism, lack of management (at best), toxic management practices (at worst), and a dangerous work environment is the cherry on top. I was brought on to try and help contain the mess and start modernizing some of the systems and practices around the place. It became pretty clear, pretty fast that I was not going to be given the reins to even steer my department, let alone some of the systemic problems with upper management. I've got a laundry list of actual problems that boil down to capital-Q Quality, overall toxic culture, and work/life balance. A month after I started, I was looking for a new job. This place has taken a serious toll on my mental health, and has been a constant source of grief for me (and probably my therapist too). It's taken a while, but I found a solid gig who is more in line with my ideals.
New company fits my skills a bit better, offers an incredible work/life balance, get to occasionally travel to some foreign countries that I love, and might eventually provide a workers visa in another country which my family would not be opposed to living in. It's a slight pay decrease, but should level back out to where I'm at now in a couple years. Overall, for my sanity, it's the right choice, and is probably closer to 'dream job' status than not...it's certainly better than my current employ by leaps. I'm pretty damn excited about it to say the least.
I was honestly expecting to give my 2 weeks notice, and they would just pull some 'GET OUT NOWWWWW' shit. It should be stated that other people who have voluntarily left have been escorted from the building, written off forever, shit-talked openly. This company does not normally treat people who leave very well. When I gave my 2 weeks notice at my current job, my direct supervisor flipped out a bit. He started swearing to himself (it wasn't directed at me, but was still really uncomfortable). He kept asking if this was about money, if I could be convinced to stay, if it was about him, over and over again and I tried to keep my answers to a minimum, and used a whole lot of 'That won't be possible' language to keep things solid. He ended up offering me an absurd amount of money to stay, at which point I felt like I had to tell him that this wasn't a financial decision. I shouldn't have said that, it opened up a whole can of worms I'm not comfortable talking about with these people, and now things are getting weird at work. The out-of-state managing partners were texting and calling me until pretty late in the evening (abnormal), and begging me to stay. It is quite clear to me that they're not going to be chill with this, let alone professional about this. One of our out-of-state partners is flying in next week, and cleared his schedule the first morning to meet with me for several hours. I am not looking forward to this meeting.
The rub is that I feel a great deal of loyalty to my current subordinates; they've got it worse than I do. Many of them don't have the same opportunities that I do to move on as easily. If I stay for these next few weeks, I could provide them with a couple key pieces that would make their lives easier and more straightforward. I realize that I don't have to do this, but I want to do this. However, I'm not sure if I can. I've never been in this spot before, and I have no idea how to handle it. While I don't necessarily feel the need to burn this bridge, but there's no way I'm even keeping this job on my resume. The company on a whole has a bad reputation (now) in my local industry, and having it listed would do me no favors going forward. I do have several people here I could get glowing references from if necessary. But my industry is relatively small, and I know it's very possible I'll run into these folks professionally again.
Basically my question is, how do I navigate the next couple weeks of work? At what point is it appropriate to just bail? What's the best way to navigate the fact that they REALLY want me to stay, but there's nothing they can offer me to keep me in this position? Should I just give them an insane twilight-zone level contract in the hopes that they'll stop asking (ie, triple my salary! Let me work part time! Fire my boss! Fire half the office staff!)?
My current employ is a hot mess; blatant nepotism, lack of management (at best), toxic management practices (at worst), and a dangerous work environment is the cherry on top. I was brought on to try and help contain the mess and start modernizing some of the systems and practices around the place. It became pretty clear, pretty fast that I was not going to be given the reins to even steer my department, let alone some of the systemic problems with upper management. I've got a laundry list of actual problems that boil down to capital-Q Quality, overall toxic culture, and work/life balance. A month after I started, I was looking for a new job. This place has taken a serious toll on my mental health, and has been a constant source of grief for me (and probably my therapist too). It's taken a while, but I found a solid gig who is more in line with my ideals.
New company fits my skills a bit better, offers an incredible work/life balance, get to occasionally travel to some foreign countries that I love, and might eventually provide a workers visa in another country which my family would not be opposed to living in. It's a slight pay decrease, but should level back out to where I'm at now in a couple years. Overall, for my sanity, it's the right choice, and is probably closer to 'dream job' status than not...it's certainly better than my current employ by leaps. I'm pretty damn excited about it to say the least.
I was honestly expecting to give my 2 weeks notice, and they would just pull some 'GET OUT NOWWWWW' shit. It should be stated that other people who have voluntarily left have been escorted from the building, written off forever, shit-talked openly. This company does not normally treat people who leave very well. When I gave my 2 weeks notice at my current job, my direct supervisor flipped out a bit. He started swearing to himself (it wasn't directed at me, but was still really uncomfortable). He kept asking if this was about money, if I could be convinced to stay, if it was about him, over and over again and I tried to keep my answers to a minimum, and used a whole lot of 'That won't be possible' language to keep things solid. He ended up offering me an absurd amount of money to stay, at which point I felt like I had to tell him that this wasn't a financial decision. I shouldn't have said that, it opened up a whole can of worms I'm not comfortable talking about with these people, and now things are getting weird at work. The out-of-state managing partners were texting and calling me until pretty late in the evening (abnormal), and begging me to stay. It is quite clear to me that they're not going to be chill with this, let alone professional about this. One of our out-of-state partners is flying in next week, and cleared his schedule the first morning to meet with me for several hours. I am not looking forward to this meeting.
The rub is that I feel a great deal of loyalty to my current subordinates; they've got it worse than I do. Many of them don't have the same opportunities that I do to move on as easily. If I stay for these next few weeks, I could provide them with a couple key pieces that would make their lives easier and more straightforward. I realize that I don't have to do this, but I want to do this. However, I'm not sure if I can. I've never been in this spot before, and I have no idea how to handle it. While I don't necessarily feel the need to burn this bridge, but there's no way I'm even keeping this job on my resume. The company on a whole has a bad reputation (now) in my local industry, and having it listed would do me no favors going forward. I do have several people here I could get glowing references from if necessary. But my industry is relatively small, and I know it's very possible I'll run into these folks professionally again.
Basically my question is, how do I navigate the next couple weeks of work? At what point is it appropriate to just bail? What's the best way to navigate the fact that they REALLY want me to stay, but there's nothing they can offer me to keep me in this position? Should I just give them an insane twilight-zone level contract in the hopes that they'll stop asking (ie, triple my salary! Let me work part time! Fire my boss! Fire half the office staff!)?
Maybe you can help them focus on the future, and not so much on you? There are things they can do to make it more likely that the next person in your position will want to stay and will be able to do a good job. If they can focus on that, then there are positive things they can do to make the situation better. Getting you to stay would then become less of an all-or-nothing do-or-die proposition.
posted by amtho at 8:27 AM on June 14, 2017
posted by amtho at 8:27 AM on June 14, 2017
Best answer: These seem like the kind of people who will "burn" you regardless of how soft you try to make your departure. Tell the out-of-state partner "There is nothing that will get me to stay here. I am going to leave. If you want me to leave now, I will do that, and I will sign this letter of resignation that I have written, and you won't be on the hook for severance or unemployment or anything. If you want me to stay until June 30th for the sole purpose of facilitating handover of my responsibilities, I will do that. Pick one."
posted by Etrigan at 8:29 AM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by Etrigan at 8:29 AM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]
Best answer: I would make it clear that you're staying for the next 2 weeks (or whatever your notice was) out of courtesy, but that you won't be negotiating to stay, and if they'd like to maximize your remaining time with them to help transition to your replacement/setting up for the interim, that the discussions about you not quitting are off the table. If they can't agree to that, then let them know that at the end of whatever workday you're in, you will need to leave.
posted by xingcat at 8:32 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by xingcat at 8:32 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]
Best answer: Some variation of:
Thanks but my decision to leave is final. Please let me know when you'd like to discuss handover of my tasks (if appropriate for the asker).
Repeat cheerfully, like a broken record, to anybody who may ask, text, want meetings to discuss.
Sit at your desk and summarise tasks for your subordinates or transition tasks to them actively.
If they don't like that and ask you to leave so be it.
Do not take calls, messages, emails after hrs. If possible turn off your phone.
posted by koahiatamadl at 8:33 AM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]
Thanks but my decision to leave is final. Please let me know when you'd like to discuss handover of my tasks (if appropriate for the asker).
Repeat cheerfully, like a broken record, to anybody who may ask, text, want meetings to discuss.
Sit at your desk and summarise tasks for your subordinates or transition tasks to them actively.
If they don't like that and ask you to leave so be it.
Do not take calls, messages, emails after hrs. If possible turn off your phone.
posted by koahiatamadl at 8:33 AM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]
If I stay for these next few weeks, I could provide them with a couple key pieces that would make their lives easier and more straightforward.
Given the level of mismanagement and pervasive issues up to and including safety(!), I'm not sure this sounds realistic-- you haven't been able to fix their workplace yet. What's going to happen in two weeks? Is there anything you can write out for them like today, or sit with them for an hour or two to hand off?
Tell whoever keeps making offers that this is not a negotiation and that your decision is final and you will not be entertaining counter-offers, so please stop. Leaving now would help drive the point home.
posted by kapers at 8:34 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]
Given the level of mismanagement and pervasive issues up to and including safety(!), I'm not sure this sounds realistic-- you haven't been able to fix their workplace yet. What's going to happen in two weeks? Is there anything you can write out for them like today, or sit with them for an hour or two to hand off?
Tell whoever keeps making offers that this is not a negotiation and that your decision is final and you will not be entertaining counter-offers, so please stop. Leaving now would help drive the point home.
posted by kapers at 8:34 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Do not take calls, messages, emails after hrs. If possible turn off your phone.
Not planning on thread-sitting, but I do want to say, this is exactly how I've handled this. Phone's been off as soon as I leave the building. They've never called my personal phone before, and this is new behavior (hence, the discomfort).
posted by furnace.heart at 8:39 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]
Not planning on thread-sitting, but I do want to say, this is exactly how I've handled this. Phone's been off as soon as I leave the building. They've never called my personal phone before, and this is new behavior (hence, the discomfort).
posted by furnace.heart at 8:39 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]
Best answer: It sounds like you want to tough this out because of obligation to your team, so I am here to say that it's possible to get through two awful weeks in order to do this - I have done it myself. (In fact, the first sentence of your question could literally describe my former employer with whom I was in this exact situation.)
Everybody trying to talk you into staying - this is where you need to draw the line. Be very clear it's not up for discussion, that you are only staying to facilitate the transition for your team. If that hours long meeting with the partner you're dreading turns out to be him trying to convince you to stay, for example, you can and should end the meeting and say you aren't willing to discuss staying, that it would be a better use of your time to be working on the transition.
Be firm, get up and leave meetings when you have to, and if they won't take no for an answer, stop coming to work and know that at least you tried to be the bigger person.
posted by something something at 8:40 AM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]
Everybody trying to talk you into staying - this is where you need to draw the line. Be very clear it's not up for discussion, that you are only staying to facilitate the transition for your team. If that hours long meeting with the partner you're dreading turns out to be him trying to convince you to stay, for example, you can and should end the meeting and say you aren't willing to discuss staying, that it would be a better use of your time to be working on the transition.
Be firm, get up and leave meetings when you have to, and if they won't take no for an answer, stop coming to work and know that at least you tried to be the bigger person.
posted by something something at 8:40 AM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]
There's no obligation on you to do this - but in principle you could use the meeting with the out-of-state partner as a kind of exit interview that lays out exactly why you weren't able to change things round in the way that you probably intended when you joined. If they're flipping out at the idea of you leaving, maybe they had it in their heads that you were going to be the solution? And now the solution is leaving, so they panic.
Of course that doesn't alter your decision to leave, which for all the reasons you've said is not up for discussion. If the partner who's flying in can respect that, get past it, and still show an interest in what you've learned while you've been there, then hypothetically it could be a useful / constructive meeting. Albeit not an easy one.
posted by rd45 at 9:43 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]
Of course that doesn't alter your decision to leave, which for all the reasons you've said is not up for discussion. If the partner who's flying in can respect that, get past it, and still show an interest in what you've learned while you've been there, then hypothetically it could be a useful / constructive meeting. Albeit not an easy one.
posted by rd45 at 9:43 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]
Thanks but my decision to leave is final. Please let me know when you'd like to discuss handover of my tasks (if appropriate for the asker).
Excellent advice. Additionally (if you're so inclined), prepare a document (maybe a spreadsheet) that gives a status report on any ongoing projects that someone else will have to take on when you leave. Make it detailed enough to be genuinely valuable.
Hand over the document as you say the words above. This can give you another way to deflect conversation about your motivations for leaving and any potential for getting you to stay.
posted by John Borrowman at 9:48 AM on June 14, 2017
Excellent advice. Additionally (if you're so inclined), prepare a document (maybe a spreadsheet) that gives a status report on any ongoing projects that someone else will have to take on when you leave. Make it detailed enough to be genuinely valuable.
Hand over the document as you say the words above. This can give you another way to deflect conversation about your motivations for leaving and any potential for getting you to stay.
posted by John Borrowman at 9:48 AM on June 14, 2017
"There is nothing that will get me to stay here. I am going to leave. If you want me to leave now, I will do that, and I will sign this letter of resignation that I have written, and you won't be on the hook for severance or unemployment or anything."
Why should OP offer to give up any rights at all? What's with gratuitously offering they won't be "on the hook" for severance or unemployment? If they owe those things, they owe them.
posted by thelonius at 10:01 AM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]
Why should OP offer to give up any rights at all? What's with gratuitously offering they won't be "on the hook" for severance or unemployment? If they owe those things, they owe them.
posted by thelonius at 10:01 AM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]
"Frankly, just leave. Provide the key pieces to your subordinates via email. Pack your stuff and go, and then block the phone numbers of the out-of-state managing partners and whoever else you don't want to talk to anymore."
No. Don't do this. You have given notice and as long as they require you to come in you have to do this. Everything else would be highly unprofessional.
"Thanks but my decision to leave is final. Please let me know when you'd like to discuss handover of my tasks (if appropriate for the asker). "
Phrase it more polite and indirect.
"Thank you so much for trying to change my mind but I have signed another offer which suits my personal and career needs better and I am not going do break this contract, no matter what a counter offer may be. Of cause I will be available to make the transition as smooth as possible."
I am not a native speaker and I am sure somebody else can phrase this better but it may give you an idea.
posted by yoyo_nyc at 10:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]
No. Don't do this. You have given notice and as long as they require you to come in you have to do this. Everything else would be highly unprofessional.
"Thanks but my decision to leave is final. Please let me know when you'd like to discuss handover of my tasks (if appropriate for the asker). "
Phrase it more polite and indirect.
"Thank you so much for trying to change my mind but I have signed another offer which suits my personal and career needs better and I am not going do break this contract, no matter what a counter offer may be. Of cause I will be available to make the transition as smooth as possible."
I am not a native speaker and I am sure somebody else can phrase this better but it may give you an idea.
posted by yoyo_nyc at 10:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]
I like to give the impression like there is nothing you can do, you have already obligated yourself. Like, you are already obligated to go to the other company, you have signed an agreement or something. They can't argue with some mystery third party that may or may not be a piece of paper or may or may not technically exist. You are already obligated beyond the turning back point, so sorry.
posted by Foam Pants at 10:05 AM on June 14, 2017
posted by Foam Pants at 10:05 AM on June 14, 2017
I don't get it. You expected them to walk you to the door, cursing you out all the way. But instead they are acting like they know they fucked up, and really want you to stay...? And that's what you're uncomfortable with?
Most people think (very mistakenly) that's exactly what will happen when they fantasize about telling their boss to take their job and shove it...
I don't see any boundary crossing here to be honest. All the attention you're getting is a signal to let you know they genuinely want you to stay. I see management in a panic because they had been counting on you for... something. They're opening negotiations. Is there anything that could make you stay? If you had a honest conversation about all the broken things, and asked for power to change those broken things, on top of the money, would that change your mind? This seems like an opportunity, not some kind of situation you have to endure. It's all upside for you... you either actually get some agency to fix the company's problems, or you walk away to a better job.
What's the problem again?
posted by danny the boy at 10:15 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]
Most people think (very mistakenly) that's exactly what will happen when they fantasize about telling their boss to take their job and shove it...
I don't see any boundary crossing here to be honest. All the attention you're getting is a signal to let you know they genuinely want you to stay. I see management in a panic because they had been counting on you for... something. They're opening negotiations. Is there anything that could make you stay? If you had a honest conversation about all the broken things, and asked for power to change those broken things, on top of the money, would that change your mind? This seems like an opportunity, not some kind of situation you have to endure. It's all upside for you... you either actually get some agency to fix the company's problems, or you walk away to a better job.
What's the problem again?
posted by danny the boy at 10:15 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]
This happened to someone I know pretty well too (*cough, cough, ahem, cough*).
Note first: IANAL. Now: The reason they're panicking is likely legal-related. For positions with little or clearly-delimited responsibility, legally it's easier to walk someone out the door. But for positions with more transverse/crossover responsibility and someone they haven't got a written trail of negativity on (I'm assuming they don't), all of a sudden they can't do that. However, what they CAN do to cover their asses is do everything possible to convince you to stay.
In other words: if you continue firmly refusing to stay, and just finish off your two-week notice period, it will be stressful, yes, but you will likely be fine.
I would not, and I mean in no case whatsoever, sign over any legal rights.
The person I know managed a three-month notice period in a situation like this (the legal notice period in their country). And after refusing yet another raise proposal, was taken to task more than once in an overt attempt to convince them to sign a "voluntary" resignation. This person had already lawyered up, and lawyer was also strongly advising to stay out the notice period, sign nothing, and divulge no more than the strict minimum. Person ended up okay overall and is happy in their new job.
posted by fraula at 10:22 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]
Note first: IANAL. Now: The reason they're panicking is likely legal-related. For positions with little or clearly-delimited responsibility, legally it's easier to walk someone out the door. But for positions with more transverse/crossover responsibility and someone they haven't got a written trail of negativity on (I'm assuming they don't), all of a sudden they can't do that. However, what they CAN do to cover their asses is do everything possible to convince you to stay.
In other words: if you continue firmly refusing to stay, and just finish off your two-week notice period, it will be stressful, yes, but you will likely be fine.
I would not, and I mean in no case whatsoever, sign over any legal rights.
The person I know managed a three-month notice period in a situation like this (the legal notice period in their country). And after refusing yet another raise proposal, was taken to task more than once in an overt attempt to convince them to sign a "voluntary" resignation. This person had already lawyered up, and lawyer was also strongly advising to stay out the notice period, sign nothing, and divulge no more than the strict minimum. Person ended up okay overall and is happy in their new job.
posted by fraula at 10:22 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]
I just left a job that was draining my ever-loving soul, for most of the same reasons, and encountered a lot of the same push back (except the weird calls at all hours). You work, you give it all you can, you tell your coworkers everything you can that will help them navigate the hole you are leaving, but once you're done with the final commitment you gave them, pack your desk, leave your office, and don't look back. Once I saw the light at the end of the tunnel and my way out, I told everyone that would listen that I would work up until 5 PM on my last day (and I did), but once the clock struck 5, they were on their own.
The getting you to stay piece of it, I never even entertained it. "I have made my decision and have an agreement with my new employer to start working with them after my two weeks here is up."
posted by deezil at 10:24 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]
The getting you to stay piece of it, I never even entertained it. "I have made my decision and have an agreement with my new employer to start working with them after my two weeks here is up."
posted by deezil at 10:24 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]
You have given notice and as long as they require you to come in you have to do this. Everything else would be highly unprofessional.
furnace.heart stated that they don't feel the need to burn bridges but they aren't even going to put this job on their resume because it's a known fact in their industry that the company is toxic. OP, I'm not suggesting that you toss a match behind you when you leave, and certainly let your boss know that you're leaving earlier than you initially anticipated, but it's totally fine to walk out the moment you're fed up enough. There is no legal requirement (unless you signed one) to the two-week notice.
They asked when it was appropriate to bail; IMO, it's now.
posted by cooker girl at 10:26 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]
furnace.heart stated that they don't feel the need to burn bridges but they aren't even going to put this job on their resume because it's a known fact in their industry that the company is toxic. OP, I'm not suggesting that you toss a match behind you when you leave, and certainly let your boss know that you're leaving earlier than you initially anticipated, but it's totally fine to walk out the moment you're fed up enough. There is no legal requirement (unless you signed one) to the two-week notice.
They asked when it was appropriate to bail; IMO, it's now.
posted by cooker girl at 10:26 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]
Best answer: I left a toxic work environment with poor management last summer. I put in my two weeks and everyone was acting like the world was coming to an end. I had to have long talks with several different managers about why I was leaving. Could I stay for the summer, a month, or just part time? It was guilt trip after guilt trip. It was texts, calls, meetings. This went on for three days. Then my district manager told me the regional manager wanted to speak to me next, a man I had only met in passing a couple times. It wasn't going to end so I just left. I suggest you do the same.
posted by blackzinfandel at 10:43 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by blackzinfandel at 10:43 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Sounds to me like there is a good chance that the out of state managers forced your local management to hire you to help fix the problems, but as is often the case with these things, the local people didn't actually give you the power that the out of state higher ups wanted you to have, hence your manager's freakout.
One of my clients is the out of state person (not literally yours, but his businesses are set up similarly, though usually with less dysfunction), and I saw that sort of shit all the time.
Have that meeting, making it clear at the outset that you won't be staying, and lay out the situation for them. Tell them, factually but without conclusion, what the situation is on the ground there, if they want to hear it. In the meantime, document processes and do whatever else will ease the transition like the professional you are. If it gets to be too much, say so, and if they continue to act like children caught with their hand in the cookie jar and take it out on you, just leave and don't come back.
posted by wierdo at 12:20 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]
One of my clients is the out of state person (not literally yours, but his businesses are set up similarly, though usually with less dysfunction), and I saw that sort of shit all the time.
Have that meeting, making it clear at the outset that you won't be staying, and lay out the situation for them. Tell them, factually but without conclusion, what the situation is on the ground there, if they want to hear it. In the meantime, document processes and do whatever else will ease the transition like the professional you are. If it gets to be too much, say so, and if they continue to act like children caught with their hand in the cookie jar and take it out on you, just leave and don't come back.
posted by wierdo at 12:20 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]
danny the boy, the problem is (I think) is this- the culture at the OP's workplace is so toxic s/he can't deal with it. The employers are not just accepting the decision and dealing with it, they are putting OP through all sorts of hell. It's a tough place to be, and endure.
1. Basically [the] question is, how do I navigate the next couple weeks of work?
The options are:
A. Suck it up as best you can.
B. Don't stay. Just leave. They will carry on whether you're there or not.
2. At what point is it appropriate to just bail?
Now.
3. What's the best way to navigate the fact that they REALLY want me to stay, but there's nothing they can offer me to keep me in this position?
There is none. See option A, question 1 above.
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 12:43 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]
1. Basically [the] question is, how do I navigate the next couple weeks of work?
The options are:
A. Suck it up as best you can.
B. Don't stay. Just leave. They will carry on whether you're there or not.
2. At what point is it appropriate to just bail?
Now.
3. What's the best way to navigate the fact that they REALLY want me to stay, but there's nothing they can offer me to keep me in this position?
There is none. See option A, question 1 above.
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 12:43 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]
I would ask yourself what has this company done for you? And then, therefore, what do you owe them? From your description it sounds to me like they have been [and are] wholly unprofessional - they made you promises to get you in there and then broke them - so I'm not sure why you owe it to them to be 'professional'. They made this mess for themselves and they put you right in the middle of it in an untenable position, personally I'd walk asap and not look back. The guilt will last about as long as it takes them to forget you and make your problems someone else's.
posted by AllTheQuestions at 1:44 PM on June 14, 2017
posted by AllTheQuestions at 1:44 PM on June 14, 2017
Best answer: Practice giving no fucks. What can they do to you? Fire you? Are they going to imprison you, or beat you up? You've made your decision and you know you're not changing it—how exactly does it hurt you if they want to waste their time making you tell them that over and over again? Definitely continue not talking to them outside of business hours, but when you're at work just do your best to focus on setting things up for your team and otherwise simply cease to care or react to whatever other bullshit they want to send your way. It's just words, and in a couple of weeks they won't see you for dust.
Just focus on what matters, tune out the bullshit, and count down the days.
Or, if it is truly unbearable and you can't do that, then walk. Two weeks is a courtesy, not a requirement. You probably are overestimating how much long-term difference your attempting to smooth the transition will make to your subordinates. If the rest of the picture is as bad as you say, anything you do for them now will be overwhelmed by a torrent of toxic awfulness within a week of your departure no matter what you do. Life will go on without you, and what you do between now and your departure will probably not make such a big difference that it's worth sacrificing your own sanity over.
Your call.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 4:28 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]
Just focus on what matters, tune out the bullshit, and count down the days.
Or, if it is truly unbearable and you can't do that, then walk. Two weeks is a courtesy, not a requirement. You probably are overestimating how much long-term difference your attempting to smooth the transition will make to your subordinates. If the rest of the picture is as bad as you say, anything you do for them now will be overwhelmed by a torrent of toxic awfulness within a week of your departure no matter what you do. Life will go on without you, and what you do between now and your departure will probably not make such a big difference that it's worth sacrificing your own sanity over.
Your call.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 4:28 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]
I think wierdo has it. And just be as Zen as you can. Maybe you already did this before giving your notice, but if not: Get any stuff you have there out as soon as possible—come in over the weekend this week to pick things up if that's easier, less subject to prying, etc. Don't leave the disposition of anything that belongs to you up to them.
It doesn't sound like they really want you to stay for something specific to you and how awesome you are, because otherwise they would have treated you better or given you the power to actually do your job to its full extent. Don't let them flatter you. It sounds like the local team and/or the entire management chain doesn't know how to treat you or anyone better. It sounds like as you say, these people are not professionals (I mean, writing off and shit-talking anyone who leaves? Hysterically calling anyone who wants to leave? Hello, sick system, top to bottom). It sounds like they fear your leaving will remove what thin veneer of fakery overlays their incompetence. I'm going to guess if these people have trouble with workplace safety, they also have trouble with basic courtesies like planning for ways not to bother someone when they're sick or away, much less objective succession planning.
Anyway, yeah, don't wait for them to tell you what to do in terms of documenting and passing along info on how to do key things. If you're not still overwhelmed with other work or something, e.g., it would hold up a production process to pull off of something without their approval, I would just start creating documents and setting up check-ins with people. Do the best you can until either your time is up or they decide it's up. Even if you're not able to start documenting things in earnest until sometime after meeting with that out-of-state partner, you would do well to at least compile a set of notes for yourself to bring to the meeting on the following.
1. Positively, your plan for documentation: How you hope to help them by passing along the knowledge and information you have, what you've done already, and your proposed next steps and/or any meetings or assistance you'd ideally like to have.
2. As neutrally as possible, what systemic challenges they face of which they may not have full awareness and/or that come with some liability, such as workplace safety issues, production-chain issues that threaten the product, etc. I wanted to say sexual-harrassment or other serious conduct issues, but there you might want to step lightly and/or consult someone before passing along info on your way out.
Know that even if they decide you're done before you pass along all the information you wanted to, it will be fine. People at companies with processes that are probably as bad as if not worse than yours have surely been laid off before without any chance to pass along information to their subordinates. Do the best you can by them, but don't sweat it too much. It's going to suck for them either way—at very least because they're just still working there, regardless of anything specific you do or don't do—but you have to do what you need to do for yourself.
posted by limeonaire at 5:57 PM on June 14, 2017
It doesn't sound like they really want you to stay for something specific to you and how awesome you are, because otherwise they would have treated you better or given you the power to actually do your job to its full extent. Don't let them flatter you. It sounds like the local team and/or the entire management chain doesn't know how to treat you or anyone better. It sounds like as you say, these people are not professionals (I mean, writing off and shit-talking anyone who leaves? Hysterically calling anyone who wants to leave? Hello, sick system, top to bottom). It sounds like they fear your leaving will remove what thin veneer of fakery overlays their incompetence. I'm going to guess if these people have trouble with workplace safety, they also have trouble with basic courtesies like planning for ways not to bother someone when they're sick or away, much less objective succession planning.
Anyway, yeah, don't wait for them to tell you what to do in terms of documenting and passing along info on how to do key things. If you're not still overwhelmed with other work or something, e.g., it would hold up a production process to pull off of something without their approval, I would just start creating documents and setting up check-ins with people. Do the best you can until either your time is up or they decide it's up. Even if you're not able to start documenting things in earnest until sometime after meeting with that out-of-state partner, you would do well to at least compile a set of notes for yourself to bring to the meeting on the following.
1. Positively, your plan for documentation: How you hope to help them by passing along the knowledge and information you have, what you've done already, and your proposed next steps and/or any meetings or assistance you'd ideally like to have.
2. As neutrally as possible, what systemic challenges they face of which they may not have full awareness and/or that come with some liability, such as workplace safety issues, production-chain issues that threaten the product, etc. I wanted to say sexual-harrassment or other serious conduct issues, but there you might want to step lightly and/or consult someone before passing along info on your way out.
Know that even if they decide you're done before you pass along all the information you wanted to, it will be fine. People at companies with processes that are probably as bad as if not worse than yours have surely been laid off before without any chance to pass along information to their subordinates. Do the best you can by them, but don't sweat it too much. It's going to suck for them either way—at very least because they're just still working there, regardless of anything specific you do or don't do—but you have to do what you need to do for yourself.
posted by limeonaire at 5:57 PM on June 14, 2017
This thread is closed to new comments.
Realistically, nothing is going to change by you staying. Nothing. So go.
posted by cooker girl at 8:24 AM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]