Can pregnancy and an art studio mix?
July 16, 2015 10:04 AM Subscribe
I recently learned I was pregnant. Just before that, I put down a deposit on a rented workspace. Artists work in adjacent spaces, using paint, pens, etc. The place does not actually smell fume-y. Should I be worried about safety?
About a month ago, I agreed to rent a 10' x15' workspace inside an old metalworks foundry that has been carved up into artist's studios.
I love the space and was very much looking forward to working there. (I am a writer, so won't be handling art supplies myself.) But in the meantime, I learned that I was pregnant. Yesterday I went to check the space out, think about how I might decorate it, etc. But an hour or so after leaving, I found myself dwelling on possible safety concerns.
The details: The space is a wing off of a huge old foundry building in a semi-industrial area of town. To enter the space, I have to walk past a number of cars that are parked inside (most look like they haven't been driven in years). Then I open a door and enter a big space with maybe twenty-foot ceilings that has been divided into 10-15 studios, which are separated from one another with drywall partitions. Much of the time, I will be the only person in the space (lots of these folks only work at night). It smells a little dusty, like the old building that it is, but does not smell like chemical fumes or VOCs. However, people who work in there do use oil paints, probably permanent markers, the solvents that go along with oil paints, etc. There are no windows that open, but the space is porous and probably drafty.
Is there some way of figuring out whether it is safe for me to be in there during my pregnancy? Should I run for the hills on general principle? (I figure I can probably still back out, citing pregnancy concerns, offering to pay half a month or a month's rent so they can find another tenant.) I had really wanted this to work out, and I don't want to be overcautious, but I don't want to be stupid either.
(You are not my doctor, natch.)
About a month ago, I agreed to rent a 10' x15' workspace inside an old metalworks foundry that has been carved up into artist's studios.
I love the space and was very much looking forward to working there. (I am a writer, so won't be handling art supplies myself.) But in the meantime, I learned that I was pregnant. Yesterday I went to check the space out, think about how I might decorate it, etc. But an hour or so after leaving, I found myself dwelling on possible safety concerns.
The details: The space is a wing off of a huge old foundry building in a semi-industrial area of town. To enter the space, I have to walk past a number of cars that are parked inside (most look like they haven't been driven in years). Then I open a door and enter a big space with maybe twenty-foot ceilings that has been divided into 10-15 studios, which are separated from one another with drywall partitions. Much of the time, I will be the only person in the space (lots of these folks only work at night). It smells a little dusty, like the old building that it is, but does not smell like chemical fumes or VOCs. However, people who work in there do use oil paints, probably permanent markers, the solvents that go along with oil paints, etc. There are no windows that open, but the space is porous and probably drafty.
Is there some way of figuring out whether it is safe for me to be in there during my pregnancy? Should I run for the hills on general principle? (I figure I can probably still back out, citing pregnancy concerns, offering to pay half a month or a month's rent so they can find another tenant.) I had really wanted this to work out, and I don't want to be overcautious, but I don't want to be stupid either.
(You are not my doctor, natch.)
You say there are no windows and only mention one door. Is this a legal workplace?
posted by Carol Anne at 10:48 AM on July 16, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by Carol Anne at 10:48 AM on July 16, 2015 [1 favorite]
I'd also go with "the follow your nose" advice. paint thinner, flux, acetone all smell terrible.
The only thing I could think could be dangerous without smelling bad is if someone is welding in there. You good have fire/explosive danger there.
posted by French Fry at 11:07 AM on July 16, 2015
The only thing I could think could be dangerous without smelling bad is if someone is welding in there. You good have fire/explosive danger there.
posted by French Fry at 11:07 AM on July 16, 2015
Response by poster: Carol Anne, I am not sure about the legal status of the workspace. I am not concerned with that per se, though, only the possibility of environmental hazard.
posted by toomuchkatherine at 11:15 AM on July 16, 2015
posted by toomuchkatherine at 11:15 AM on July 16, 2015
If it's an old foundry, there are most likely trace metals and dust which are not good for you to breathe. You might want to check out and see if there was asbestos or lead used earlier or if any dumping occurred during its active industrial lifetime. Small exposures of lead, asbestos and aromatic solvents are not good during a pregnancy. Lead can be absorbed through the skin, and inhaling harmful volatile compounds means your lungs delivers it right to your bloodstream without being filtered by your liver or kidneys.
Smell is not a good indicator of safety. The nose is easily fatigued; initially you may smell the presence of a solvent, then the sensation goes away, not the volatile organic compound.
If you can not expose yourself during your pregnancy, my money would be in the NOT camp.
posted by effluvia at 11:17 AM on July 16, 2015 [5 favorites]
Smell is not a good indicator of safety. The nose is easily fatigued; initially you may smell the presence of a solvent, then the sensation goes away, not the volatile organic compound.
If you can not expose yourself during your pregnancy, my money would be in the NOT camp.
posted by effluvia at 11:17 AM on July 16, 2015 [5 favorites]
There are a lot of things that are bad for you that don't have an odor.
Think about how you would feel if there were a problem with your pregnancy.
posted by amtho at 11:59 AM on July 16, 2015
Think about how you would feel if there were a problem with your pregnancy.
posted by amtho at 11:59 AM on July 16, 2015
Congrats on your pregnancy!
Without knowing the history of the site and what products are used there now, it's pretty hard to weigh the risks. You could have someone sample the indoor air and compare those concentrations to typical indoor air as an indicator of whether the air is much different from other spaces. People use canisters that you leave in the space for a certain amount of time for that. However, I'm guessing that the testing and analysis might be at least as expensive as breaking your lease with a month's rent for their trouble.
posted by ldthomps at 12:32 PM on July 16, 2015
Without knowing the history of the site and what products are used there now, it's pretty hard to weigh the risks. You could have someone sample the indoor air and compare those concentrations to typical indoor air as an indicator of whether the air is much different from other spaces. People use canisters that you leave in the space for a certain amount of time for that. However, I'm guessing that the testing and analysis might be at least as expensive as breaking your lease with a month's rent for their trouble.
posted by ldthomps at 12:32 PM on July 16, 2015
I would ask the owners about lead and asbestos.
However, I would also trust a pregnant woman's nose above the noses of non-pregnant humans. I was once the only one in my building who smelled a gas leak, and the men from public works asked if I was pregnant (I wasn't, but I was breastfeeding). Apparently pregnant women are unusually sensitive to such odors and will often insist on calling in reports when other family members can't smell a thing.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 12:34 PM on July 16, 2015
However, I would also trust a pregnant woman's nose above the noses of non-pregnant humans. I was once the only one in my building who smelled a gas leak, and the men from public works asked if I was pregnant (I wasn't, but I was breastfeeding). Apparently pregnant women are unusually sensitive to such odors and will often insist on calling in reports when other family members can't smell a thing.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 12:34 PM on July 16, 2015
None of us can really give you a definitive answer because we can't test the air in there. I'm a painter, and as much as I love the smell of oil painting studios, I've only been comfortable renting space and working where there is ample fresh air. The fact that you've asked this question might mean that you'll still have nagging doubts no matter what we say. Given that, will you be able to enjoy working in the space, especially on days when you walk in and smell solvents?
posted by MelissaSimon at 12:46 PM on July 16, 2015
posted by MelissaSimon at 12:46 PM on July 16, 2015
Why are you debating this?
Back out of the agreement ASAP.
posted by jbenben at 1:28 PM on July 16, 2015 [3 favorites]
Back out of the agreement ASAP.
posted by jbenben at 1:28 PM on July 16, 2015 [3 favorites]
Without proper ventilation, I would just say no. A one time exposure (like painting a room or going to a nail salon) is one thing; daily exposure is entirely something else. Also you absolutely cannot rely on the other artists using enviro friendly or low VOC materials.
The 1st tri is the most critical for exposure. You could try to postpone your rental until after the 2nd tri so as to not lose your deposit.
You could also ask for a list of chemicals used in the studio and look them up individually on motherrisk which is a good resource for studies done such as this link on environmental risks.
Solvents for example show a higher risk of neural tube defects.
I hated being limited by pregnancy too but consider this the first of many times you'll need to put your kid first.
Also... mazel tov!
posted by St. Peepsburg at 1:58 PM on July 16, 2015
The 1st tri is the most critical for exposure. You could try to postpone your rental until after the 2nd tri so as to not lose your deposit.
You could also ask for a list of chemicals used in the studio and look them up individually on motherrisk which is a good resource for studies done such as this link on environmental risks.
Solvents for example show a higher risk of neural tube defects.
I hated being limited by pregnancy too but consider this the first of many times you'll need to put your kid first.
Also... mazel tov!
posted by St. Peepsburg at 1:58 PM on July 16, 2015
Have you discussed this with your OB or Midwife?
Statements like this one: Think about how you would feel if there were a problem with your pregnancy aren't really helpful, because it sets women up to feel as though they must take the the blame for anything that happens ("OMG, I ate a tuna sandwich that one time and tuna has mercury and that MUST be why this happened"), when the vast majority of fetal defects are caused by things outside of her control, including genetic factors, and those whose causes are completely unknown. Environmental chemical exposures are the lowest cause of birth defects (about 4%), by a wide margin. Certainly I don't disagree that there are certain precautions one can take against known teratogenic agents, but the fact remains that the vast majority of "issues" have no known or traceable cause.
The most significant environmental hazards that we know about are lead, mercury and mercury compounds, radiation (x rays), pesticides, polychlorinated biphenyls (banned since the '70s but may linger in the environment), nicotine (and alcohol), certain pharmaceuticals (category D or X by the FDA, including tetracycline and retinoic acid), toxoplasma exposure, and infectious agents and viruses (including rubella). And exposure is not the only variable - frequency of exposure makes a difference, as does the point in your pregnancy during which exposure occurs.
I would urge you to ignore the internet in this case, and talk with your medical professionals, and use science as your guide. This material from Columbia might also be helpful in evaluating the risks.
posted by anastasiav at 2:12 PM on July 16, 2015 [6 favorites]
Statements like this one: Think about how you would feel if there were a problem with your pregnancy aren't really helpful, because it sets women up to feel as though they must take the the blame for anything that happens ("OMG, I ate a tuna sandwich that one time and tuna has mercury and that MUST be why this happened"), when the vast majority of fetal defects are caused by things outside of her control, including genetic factors, and those whose causes are completely unknown. Environmental chemical exposures are the lowest cause of birth defects (about 4%), by a wide margin. Certainly I don't disagree that there are certain precautions one can take against known teratogenic agents, but the fact remains that the vast majority of "issues" have no known or traceable cause.
The most significant environmental hazards that we know about are lead, mercury and mercury compounds, radiation (x rays), pesticides, polychlorinated biphenyls (banned since the '70s but may linger in the environment), nicotine (and alcohol), certain pharmaceuticals (category D or X by the FDA, including tetracycline and retinoic acid), toxoplasma exposure, and infectious agents and viruses (including rubella). And exposure is not the only variable - frequency of exposure makes a difference, as does the point in your pregnancy during which exposure occurs.
I would urge you to ignore the internet in this case, and talk with your medical professionals, and use science as your guide. This material from Columbia might also be helpful in evaluating the risks.
posted by anastasiav at 2:12 PM on July 16, 2015 [6 favorites]
Ask your doctor. Personally, I wouldn't have any concerns about this, but I work in a lab and so my tolerance level of risk from chemicals is pretty high. (I personally think that if something that is common in the western world was truely risky, then someone would have noticed).
You could also consider asking the manager how people handle chemical safety in the building. Or wander in and ask the painters if they are using anything dangerous. Dangerous chemicals are labelled as such. This is how chemical safety works. And even then, very few chemicals that you can buy off the shelf are dangerous via inhalation. You can look up the SDS for more info. As for the building itself, just don't eat any of the building, and you're almost certainly fine. If asbestos is a concern, well, it's not going to affect your pregnancy.
Note that doing tests on the safety of chemicals for pregnant women is ethically impossible, so pretty much all the science on this will say "No recorded issues", but then will probably say something like "but avoid if possible". Which is mostly a butt covering exercise.
posted by kjs4 at 6:44 PM on July 16, 2015
You could also consider asking the manager how people handle chemical safety in the building. Or wander in and ask the painters if they are using anything dangerous. Dangerous chemicals are labelled as such. This is how chemical safety works. And even then, very few chemicals that you can buy off the shelf are dangerous via inhalation. You can look up the SDS for more info. As for the building itself, just don't eat any of the building, and you're almost certainly fine. If asbestos is a concern, well, it's not going to affect your pregnancy.
Note that doing tests on the safety of chemicals for pregnant women is ethically impossible, so pretty much all the science on this will say "No recorded issues", but then will probably say something like "but avoid if possible". Which is mostly a butt covering exercise.
posted by kjs4 at 6:44 PM on July 16, 2015
Ask people who have been pregnant.
Every smell can bother you, there's a TON of stress put on pregnant women regarding stuff like this, alerting the neighbors to your pregnancy and asking them about the chemicals they are using will potentially make you a nuisance...
When I wrote that you should back out of the lease, I meant that you should walk away from all of the unnecessary stress this agreement brings. You're making a whole new person, that's a huge thing. Why would you waste any time on all of these unknown variables? Even determining if there is a risk or not is ultimately unknowable, and it's not like the question won't still be in the back of your mind every time you walk in the door.
Believe me, your life is about to get very complicated. Enjoy your pregnancy, focus on the future. Unload this headache and find a place to work on your endeavors that won't give you pause, put you into possible conflict with your neighbors, or otherwise throw up any red flags for you or anyone else.
Enjoy your pregnancy! Don't waste this time worrying about something like this, since it is ultimately unknowable how risky an environment this is or is not. No one here can give you a satisfying answer, further investigation like an environmental study of the premises won't help, either, given current scientific knowledge. Walk away from this agreement because you are pregnant and you have better things to do than trying to parse this situation.
As someone who has been pregnant, that's my take. This doesn't sound like it's worth the headache all things considered. Congratulations and good luck!
posted by jbenben at 7:16 PM on July 16, 2015
Every smell can bother you, there's a TON of stress put on pregnant women regarding stuff like this, alerting the neighbors to your pregnancy and asking them about the chemicals they are using will potentially make you a nuisance...
When I wrote that you should back out of the lease, I meant that you should walk away from all of the unnecessary stress this agreement brings. You're making a whole new person, that's a huge thing. Why would you waste any time on all of these unknown variables? Even determining if there is a risk or not is ultimately unknowable, and it's not like the question won't still be in the back of your mind every time you walk in the door.
Believe me, your life is about to get very complicated. Enjoy your pregnancy, focus on the future. Unload this headache and find a place to work on your endeavors that won't give you pause, put you into possible conflict with your neighbors, or otherwise throw up any red flags for you or anyone else.
Enjoy your pregnancy! Don't waste this time worrying about something like this, since it is ultimately unknowable how risky an environment this is or is not. No one here can give you a satisfying answer, further investigation like an environmental study of the premises won't help, either, given current scientific knowledge. Walk away from this agreement because you are pregnant and you have better things to do than trying to parse this situation.
As someone who has been pregnant, that's my take. This doesn't sound like it's worth the headache all things considered. Congratulations and good luck!
posted by jbenben at 7:16 PM on July 16, 2015
I'd be more worried about industrial dust from the foundry days. And I'd live somewhere else.
posted by persona au gratin at 4:18 AM on July 17, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by persona au gratin at 4:18 AM on July 17, 2015 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks, everybody. I decided to back out of my lease, and the landlords were gracious about it. The logic of 'it may be harmless, but you can't know for sure, so why set yourself up to have to worry about it' won out.
posted by toomuchkatherine at 12:37 PM on July 25, 2015
posted by toomuchkatherine at 12:37 PM on July 25, 2015
This thread is closed to new comments.
Stray fumes from oil paint, marker pens and so on are not particularly toxic. You'd have to be huffing the stuff from a paper bag to add any appreciable risk to your pregnancy.
posted by pipeski at 10:22 AM on July 16, 2015