How do I get involved with an awesome new start-up without selling myself short?
April 13, 2011 1:11 PM
I am a freelancer and recently a startup launched that does exactly what I do, and it looks to me like they want to head in a direction that I'd like to go. I really want to do what they're doing, and I want to tell them I'm really interested in helping. I would even be happy doing some sort of internship for them (I am currently a college student). How do I express that to them without selling myself short?
One of the people involved in the launch of the company contacted me asking for some details about my work and rates, but I haven't heard back from him in about a week and a half. Understandable, as starting a new company is no doubt a time-consuming endeavor.
However this company is doing exactly the things I want to do with my career, and I have enough freelance work on the side that I could offer some of my services for free, if that would get me in the door.
Any advice on how to get involved in projects like this, I would really appreciate. I wanna sort of send an email saying "I'm here to help" but I have no idea how to phrase it without seeming desperate.
Thanks everyone!
One of the people involved in the launch of the company contacted me asking for some details about my work and rates, but I haven't heard back from him in about a week and a half. Understandable, as starting a new company is no doubt a time-consuming endeavor.
However this company is doing exactly the things I want to do with my career, and I have enough freelance work on the side that I could offer some of my services for free, if that would get me in the door.
Any advice on how to get involved in projects like this, I would really appreciate. I wanna sort of send an email saying "I'm here to help" but I have no idea how to phrase it without seeming desperate.
Thanks everyone!
Without knowing more about the company and what it does, giving a precise answer is an exercise in choose-your-own-adventure (if this, then this works best, if that then this other thing works best).
However, I can give you my reaction to working them for free: No. Way.
Start ups oftensucker compensate employees with boat loads of options. Which means those employees worked for free when if that start-up fails. At least get options if you end up working for them, but don't rely on those to pay your rent, food, or a cup of coffee.
Get compensated for your work. I mean unless they're sucking up all your freelance work, but if that is the case I'd question the viability of the product if one start-up can absorb so much work it puts a freelancer out of business.
Good Luck.
posted by forforf at 1:37 PM on April 13, 2011
However, I can give you my reaction to working them for free: No. Way.
Start ups often
Get compensated for your work. I mean unless they're sucking up all your freelance work, but if that is the case I'd question the viability of the product if one start-up can absorb so much work it puts a freelancer out of business.
Good Luck.
posted by forforf at 1:37 PM on April 13, 2011
I haven't done this myself, but what I would do is approach them for a job / freelance gig (whatever your ideal is). Follow up once with them 2-3 weeks after your last contact and still pursue your ideal situation just to make sure that they remember you're there. If you get the brush-off or don't hear back from them for another 2 weeks, feel free to contact them and let them know "I am interested in any work that you have available in the future. I would also be interested in an unpaid internship if you are going to offer one." That also is important, because it differentiates the unpaid internship from your regular work.
Basically, to avoid devaluing yourself don't give work away. But since you are interested in the project, you would be willing to do an unpaid internship where you earn something else - experience. Just make sure that you differentiate between work (where you work for money) and internship (where you work for experience) when you ask, and voilà - you've avoided devaluing your work.
posted by Tehhund at 1:39 PM on April 13, 2011
Basically, to avoid devaluing yourself don't give work away. But since you are interested in the project, you would be willing to do an unpaid internship where you earn something else - experience. Just make sure that you differentiate between work (where you work for money) and internship (where you work for experience) when you ask, and voilà - you've avoided devaluing your work.
posted by Tehhund at 1:39 PM on April 13, 2011
If you're in college (undergrad?) can you get an internship for credit? That's a foot in the door, won't take up all your time, and you can still keep up your other free-lance work.
As a life-time freelancer, I never work for free. I might offer a big discount or a deferred payment schedule (really rarely, to be honest), but I never give it away. If I don't value my time and work, why would anyone else?
And you're not "here to help"--you're someone who has a skill that might be useful to them.
posted by Ideefixe at 2:24 PM on April 13, 2011
As a life-time freelancer, I never work for free. I might offer a big discount or a deferred payment schedule (really rarely, to be honest), but I never give it away. If I don't value my time and work, why would anyone else?
And you're not "here to help"--you're someone who has a skill that might be useful to them.
posted by Ideefixe at 2:24 PM on April 13, 2011
They were either feeling you out for your level of skill or they can't afford to pay you. They didn't forget about you. Either way, they're still the competition.
Not all companies, especially startups, aren't set up to do proper internships.
posted by rhizome at 2:54 PM on April 13, 2011
Not all companies, especially startups, aren't set up to do proper internships.
posted by rhizome at 2:54 PM on April 13, 2011
Finding good employees who are enthusiastic, qualified, smart, and who think independently is difficult, and it's the single most important thing a company must do. If you are potentially an employee like this, they want you and need you. Don't try to squeeze them, but don't think you have to sell yourself for less than you're worth.
posted by amtho at 3:57 PM on April 13, 2011
posted by amtho at 3:57 PM on April 13, 2011
I think amtho's answer is the best so far.
The word 'startup' has no useful definition. It could be one guy working out of his mom's basement with $0 or it could be 100's of guys with $100M in funding. You need to find out what it is because that will determine the best way to approach the company and what you can reasonably expect out of it.
The first question is: Does the company have funding? If so, then how much?
If the company has no money and can't pay its employees then it's not a real company (yet), its just an idea. If you do any work for this idea, then you should be considered a founder. Meaning you should own some % of the company for your trouble. The bigger your input is, then the bigger your share should be. Think the case with 3 founders, it might be a third each, or 40/40/20. Generally there won't be many more than 5 founders because it can get kinda hard to find more people than that that will work for pure equity. At this point, the founders are simply working to get the idea to the point where some investor will give them hard cash to turn it into a company. Usually that means building a prototype, getting a alpha version written, launching a site, whatever.
If the company is funded then you should expect to be paid (legally in the USA you have to get at least minimum wage, you can't work for free). If you're really contributing a significant portion of the work, using the expertize you brought to the party, then you're not an intern. You should think of an intern as being paid in 'education' rather than $. IMHO early stage startups are not a suitable place to get an internship - real startups at this point are far to busy to have an education function. If they claim otherwise I'd say they're exploiting the situation. How much you get paid above minimum wage and how much stock you get are a negotiation. The more funding the company has the more likely they are to want to pay you cash rather than stock. When you talk about stock, don't focus on the number of options they offer, ask what % of the company that represents. Key technical contributers reporting to a VP level guy or higher would typically get between 0.1% and 0.4% of the company (it sure ain't the same as being a founder)
Don't sell yourself short. If you've spent time really understanding this area/market/technology AND you've got the skills to make real progress towards it, then you're a very valuable guy. On a practical level get in contact with the CEO (or whoever is in charge) and tell them you're interested and sell yourself as being able to really help them. The keys are self confidence and self reliance.
Startups are an adventure. Go work for one if you want to be master of your own destiny. Sure you may end up spending a couple of years working your ass off for a below average wage and a boat load of stock that ends up being worthless. But I guarantee you will have accumulated priceless experience in the process.
posted by Long Way To Go at 5:39 PM on April 13, 2011
The word 'startup' has no useful definition. It could be one guy working out of his mom's basement with $0 or it could be 100's of guys with $100M in funding. You need to find out what it is because that will determine the best way to approach the company and what you can reasonably expect out of it.
The first question is: Does the company have funding? If so, then how much?
If the company has no money and can't pay its employees then it's not a real company (yet), its just an idea. If you do any work for this idea, then you should be considered a founder. Meaning you should own some % of the company for your trouble. The bigger your input is, then the bigger your share should be. Think the case with 3 founders, it might be a third each, or 40/40/20. Generally there won't be many more than 5 founders because it can get kinda hard to find more people than that that will work for pure equity. At this point, the founders are simply working to get the idea to the point where some investor will give them hard cash to turn it into a company. Usually that means building a prototype, getting a alpha version written, launching a site, whatever.
If the company is funded then you should expect to be paid (legally in the USA you have to get at least minimum wage, you can't work for free). If you're really contributing a significant portion of the work, using the expertize you brought to the party, then you're not an intern. You should think of an intern as being paid in 'education' rather than $. IMHO early stage startups are not a suitable place to get an internship - real startups at this point are far to busy to have an education function. If they claim otherwise I'd say they're exploiting the situation. How much you get paid above minimum wage and how much stock you get are a negotiation. The more funding the company has the more likely they are to want to pay you cash rather than stock. When you talk about stock, don't focus on the number of options they offer, ask what % of the company that represents. Key technical contributers reporting to a VP level guy or higher would typically get between 0.1% and 0.4% of the company (it sure ain't the same as being a founder)
Don't sell yourself short. If you've spent time really understanding this area/market/technology AND you've got the skills to make real progress towards it, then you're a very valuable guy. On a practical level get in contact with the CEO (or whoever is in charge) and tell them you're interested and sell yourself as being able to really help them. The keys are self confidence and self reliance.
Startups are an adventure. Go work for one if you want to be master of your own destiny. Sure you may end up spending a couple of years working your ass off for a below average wage and a boat load of stock that ends up being worthless. But I guarantee you will have accumulated priceless experience in the process.
posted by Long Way To Go at 5:39 PM on April 13, 2011
I don't want to pee on your parade but is it possible they contacted you as part of their competition assessment - getting info on your offering and rates in order to determine how they should structure their rates to remain competitive / what they can offer that you can't?
posted by nothing too obvious at 7:34 PM on April 13, 2011
posted by nothing too obvious at 7:34 PM on April 13, 2011
Meant to add - that may explain if they don't get back in touch or are not responsive to your follow-ups.
posted by nothing too obvious at 7:37 PM on April 13, 2011
posted by nothing too obvious at 7:37 PM on April 13, 2011
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posted by jsavimbi at 1:37 PM on April 13, 2011