Why can't I give it away?
December 9, 2010 12:20 PM Subscribe
How can I get rid of my freaking car?
I want to give my car to local charity. It's old, it runs. I had bought a new one.
I can't find the title. In order to get the title, I had to get a letter from Honda saying I had successfully paid them for the car. I did. I sent the request for a new title to the RMV (Mass.) along with a $25 fee. They kicked it back to me, saying they need the California title (where I bought the car originally. I have lived in Ma. since 2001).
I don't have a title of any kind. I had the car for eleven years, and in that time, I lost it.
The charity puts old cars together with unemployed people who need them. I want to give my car to them, but having navigated through the Massachusetts RMV hell I find it hard to take that I now have to do the exact same thing in California and then return and file the same paperwork in Ma. that I have already filed.
On top of that, Mass. required an original copy of the lien release (or whatever it's called) from Honda and didn't return it. So now I have to go back to Honda to get an original if I want a title from the state of California. Plus, I don't really understand. I paid off the car while living in Massachusetts. Why would Ca. have a title for it?
Can someone either cheer me up and possibly provide some direction to sustain me through the cold dark winter of giving a car to another human being? Is there any way I can get rid of this car without going through some sort of eternal DMV hell?
I want to give my car to local charity. It's old, it runs. I had bought a new one.
I can't find the title. In order to get the title, I had to get a letter from Honda saying I had successfully paid them for the car. I did. I sent the request for a new title to the RMV (Mass.) along with a $25 fee. They kicked it back to me, saying they need the California title (where I bought the car originally. I have lived in Ma. since 2001).
I don't have a title of any kind. I had the car for eleven years, and in that time, I lost it.
The charity puts old cars together with unemployed people who need them. I want to give my car to them, but having navigated through the Massachusetts RMV hell I find it hard to take that I now have to do the exact same thing in California and then return and file the same paperwork in Ma. that I have already filed.
On top of that, Mass. required an original copy of the lien release (or whatever it's called) from Honda and didn't return it. So now I have to go back to Honda to get an original if I want a title from the state of California. Plus, I don't really understand. I paid off the car while living in Massachusetts. Why would Ca. have a title for it?
Can someone either cheer me up and possibly provide some direction to sustain me through the cold dark winter of giving a car to another human being? Is there any way I can get rid of this car without going through some sort of eternal DMV hell?
You knew that DMV stands for "Department of Morons & Villains" right? You might try looking at the DMV website to get information on what you might need.
Generally, even if no cash changes hands, the DMV or RMV will regard it as a "sale" and you as the "seller." In CA, the seller is required to notify the DMV. You need to do this properly so as to avoid being identified in the future as the legal owner of the car. (Otherwise, all you will be transferring is possession. Being the legal owner might conceivably expose you to some kind of future liability, including taxes, fees, etc. It's a pain in the ass, but you may as well do it right.
Besides which, any charity is going to want to make sure they get proper documentation, as would any buyer.
posted by Hylas at 12:31 PM on December 9, 2010
Generally, even if no cash changes hands, the DMV or RMV will regard it as a "sale" and you as the "seller." In CA, the seller is required to notify the DMV. You need to do this properly so as to avoid being identified in the future as the legal owner of the car. (Otherwise, all you will be transferring is possession. Being the legal owner might conceivably expose you to some kind of future liability, including taxes, fees, etc. It's a pain in the ass, but you may as well do it right.
Besides which, any charity is going to want to make sure they get proper documentation, as would any buyer.
posted by Hylas at 12:31 PM on December 9, 2010
Have you talked to the charity about it?
I donated my car w/o title and let them deal with it. This is likely a problem they deal with regularly.
posted by bitdamaged at 12:33 PM on December 9, 2010
I donated my car w/o title and let them deal with it. This is likely a problem they deal with regularly.
posted by bitdamaged at 12:33 PM on December 9, 2010
Best answer: I think this is the form you need: Application for Duplicate Title. Also, scroll down to "Requirements for paying off your car loan" on this page.
posted by muddgirl at 12:35 PM on December 9, 2010
posted by muddgirl at 12:35 PM on December 9, 2010
Response by poster: I don't know why, but I'm finding this totally demoralizing. Actually, I do know why. It's because it's demoralizing.
Is there any way for me to get rid of this car without doing this? At this point I just want it out of our yard.
(I did talk to the charity; they do need the title.)
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:36 PM on December 9, 2010
Is there any way for me to get rid of this car without doing this? At this point I just want it out of our yard.
(I did talk to the charity; they do need the title.)
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:36 PM on December 9, 2010
Response by poster: Thanks Muddgirl -- do you think I would need to go back to Honda for a lien release before Ca.'s RMV?
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:38 PM on December 9, 2010
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:38 PM on December 9, 2010
Have you considered a junk service? They'll often remove abandoned vehicles with titles or documentation if it's on your property.
posted by blue_beetle at 12:41 PM on December 9, 2010
posted by blue_beetle at 12:41 PM on December 9, 2010
I hate to rain on the parade, but even a salvage service will often need to get a title, if they're reputable at all.
posted by randomkeystrike at 12:45 PM on December 9, 2010
posted by randomkeystrike at 12:45 PM on December 9, 2010
do you think I would need to go back to Honda for a lien release before Ca.'s RMV?
It depends - it looks like sometimes California will clear your title automatically, depending on when you payed off your car and who you had a lien through. If that's the case then you just need a duplicate title - it should already be in your name. But I can't guess as to what happened, so either you'll have to dig through your memory and try to remember whether your lien was cleared or not.
If not, then you will absolutely need to get another lien release.
posted by muddgirl at 12:48 PM on December 9, 2010
It depends - it looks like sometimes California will clear your title automatically, depending on when you payed off your car and who you had a lien through. If that's the case then you just need a duplicate title - it should already be in your name. But I can't guess as to what happened, so either you'll have to dig through your memory and try to remember whether your lien was cleared or not.
If not, then you will absolutely need to get another lien release.
posted by muddgirl at 12:48 PM on December 9, 2010
Meant to say that either you'll have to remember what happened when you received your title (if the lien was listed and signed off or if it was in your name only), or you'll have to brave the scary California DMV phone tree which may or may not be able to tell you who has the listed title on your car.
posted by muddgirl at 12:55 PM on December 9, 2010
posted by muddgirl at 12:55 PM on December 9, 2010
Response by poster: I'm just going to move away, change my name, start a new life.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 1:02 PM on December 9, 2010 [6 favorites]
posted by A Terrible Llama at 1:02 PM on December 9, 2010 [6 favorites]
I don't know why, but I'm finding this totally demoralizing. Actually, I do know why. It's because it's demoralizing.
I don't have anything helpful to add, but I cringed when I saw this was in MA. The RMV is an awful, awful place, and I feel for you.
posted by Tu13es at 1:06 PM on December 9, 2010
I don't have anything helpful to add, but I cringed when I saw this was in MA. The RMV is an awful, awful place, and I feel for you.
posted by Tu13es at 1:06 PM on December 9, 2010
The last time I had to get rid of a car I didn't have a copy of the title for (in California, btw), I just took it to a tow yard and asked them to junk it. I paid a fee, signed some papers, and it was out of my life forever.
posted by katillathehun at 1:08 PM on December 9, 2010
posted by katillathehun at 1:08 PM on December 9, 2010
ATL -- I cannot even tell you how much I feel your pain here, and how many Bad Flashbacks this is giving me. (I had a dead car in my garage, and an original lender [Chrysler effing Credit] who not only didn't have a copy of a lien waiver to give me, but who disavowed all knowledge of me, the car, or of having ever made the original loan.) Anyway, I totally understand the leave town/change name impulse.
A couple of thoughts:
--It couldn't hurt to try local junkyards and see if they'd be willing to take it w/o the title.
--Deep breathing. Lots and lots of deep breathing.
--Is there someone in your life who might be willing to take on some of the legwork here? Someone who either doesn't mind or actively enjoys warfare with bureaucracy?
posted by Kat Allison at 1:12 PM on December 9, 2010
A couple of thoughts:
--It couldn't hurt to try local junkyards and see if they'd be willing to take it w/o the title.
--Deep breathing. Lots and lots of deep breathing.
--Is there someone in your life who might be willing to take on some of the legwork here? Someone who either doesn't mind or actively enjoys warfare with bureaucracy?
posted by Kat Allison at 1:12 PM on December 9, 2010
Best answer: Here's what I'd do. I'd sit in a quiet corner, breathe slowly, sip the obligatory Single Malt, and think where the stupid title is. Heck, I would even randomly but slowly walk around in the house and look at places in an unfocused way, until something tells me where it is. I've found amazing stuff among my belongings only by slowing down and not trying too hard.
Then I would let the active search go for one or two days, only playfully returning my thoughts to the matter. I would also try to remember what I'm dreaming. Finally, I would return to an active search, going over the intuitive hotspots and the intellectually most satisfying options again. Could it be in a lost corner of the car itself? Under the cushions? Behind a never-moved and steadily piled-up bookcase?
But that's because I never ever throw stuff away, it is always just mislaid (but how, sometimes: I've been searching for my old travel diary from a 1977 trip to Greece for several years now. It must be somewhere, surely...).
If this doesn't work after a time, you had at least some time to sublimate your frustration about the issue in a way to make it workable (as opposed to paralyzing) in your pursuit of a replacement title.
posted by Namlit at 1:17 PM on December 9, 2010
Then I would let the active search go for one or two days, only playfully returning my thoughts to the matter. I would also try to remember what I'm dreaming. Finally, I would return to an active search, going over the intuitive hotspots and the intellectually most satisfying options again. Could it be in a lost corner of the car itself? Under the cushions? Behind a never-moved and steadily piled-up bookcase?
But that's because I never ever throw stuff away, it is always just mislaid (but how, sometimes: I've been searching for my old travel diary from a 1977 trip to Greece for several years now. It must be somewhere, surely...).
If this doesn't work after a time, you had at least some time to sublimate your frustration about the issue in a way to make it workable (as opposed to paralyzing) in your pursuit of a replacement title.
posted by Namlit at 1:17 PM on December 9, 2010
Response by poster: Here's what I'd do. I'd sit in a quiet corner, breathe slowly, sip the obligatory Single Malt, and think where the stupid title is.
Well, here's the required subtext of the epic tale:
I think I do know where the title is, or I'm pretty sure. It's buried in a box called 'Memorabilia' behind forty other boxes in our smallest closet. That closet door is located in a corner between a piano and a crib, about a foot and a half apart.
In that box is about fifteen pounds of photographs, diaries, and horrible, horrible, horrible mistakes from the past eleven years, and among those mistakes is all evidence of a totally ill-advised and embarrassing first marriage along with lots of other odds and ends I'm successfully repressing and would only have to excavate because I'm being strong-armed by the department of motor vehicles in order to give a running car to an unemployed person.
Obligatory scotch, indeed!
posted by A Terrible Llama at 1:29 PM on December 9, 2010 [4 favorites]
Well, here's the required subtext of the epic tale:
I think I do know where the title is, or I'm pretty sure. It's buried in a box called 'Memorabilia' behind forty other boxes in our smallest closet. That closet door is located in a corner between a piano and a crib, about a foot and a half apart.
In that box is about fifteen pounds of photographs, diaries, and horrible, horrible, horrible mistakes from the past eleven years, and among those mistakes is all evidence of a totally ill-advised and embarrassing first marriage along with lots of other odds and ends I'm successfully repressing and would only have to excavate because I'm being strong-armed by the department of motor vehicles in order to give a running car to an unemployed person.
Obligatory scotch, indeed!
posted by A Terrible Llama at 1:29 PM on December 9, 2010 [4 favorites]
Ah, a classic choice between Scylla and Charybdis. Strong-arm your past, man. We've all been there. I do it in large chunks, with averted eyes. Good luck! (You might want to tune the piano while you're at it).
posted by Namlit at 1:36 PM on December 9, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by Namlit at 1:36 PM on December 9, 2010 [2 favorites]
I have no idea how it happened, but I wound up with two old, crappy vehicles with no titles. We bought newer vehicles and let the old ones languish in the parking lot of our building for several months, figuring we'd donate them or something when we got around to it. Naturally fate had other plans.
Our landlord decided to resurface the parking areas over the summer, and we had basically 48 hours to move all our vehicles. One of the old junkers started up ok and we were able to park it on the street, but the other one had apparently died a quiet death at some point and it would not even jump-start.
I tore our apartment apart looking for the title and it was nowhere to be found, nor was I able to find the title for the other car... I have absolutely no idea why we don't have them but they are just not anywhere I could think of. We didn't know if we could push it into the street to park it without functional power steering, and the charity websites I looked up were pretty iffy about taking it without a title (under "some circumstances" they might take it, but it didn't say what those circumstances were, and they couldn't guarantee they'd get back to me about it before our deadline anyway.) If the apartment people had had it towed it would have cost a small fortune in towing and storage fees, so I was pretty frantic about figuring out a way to get rid of the thing.
I finally thought to Google "auto wrecking" and found a couple of nearby places who could accept a junk vehicle without a title. They even came and picked it up for free... they just wanted to make sure I understood that they couldn't give me any money for the car unless I had the title. They did say if I found the title within 3 days to call them and they could pay me for the car.
I'm in Illinois so I don't know if there are differing state laws in play, but it might be worthwhile to call some junkyards in your area and see what they say.
posted by Serene Empress Dork at 1:43 PM on December 9, 2010
Our landlord decided to resurface the parking areas over the summer, and we had basically 48 hours to move all our vehicles. One of the old junkers started up ok and we were able to park it on the street, but the other one had apparently died a quiet death at some point and it would not even jump-start.
I tore our apartment apart looking for the title and it was nowhere to be found, nor was I able to find the title for the other car... I have absolutely no idea why we don't have them but they are just not anywhere I could think of. We didn't know if we could push it into the street to park it without functional power steering, and the charity websites I looked up were pretty iffy about taking it without a title (under "some circumstances" they might take it, but it didn't say what those circumstances were, and they couldn't guarantee they'd get back to me about it before our deadline anyway.) If the apartment people had had it towed it would have cost a small fortune in towing and storage fees, so I was pretty frantic about figuring out a way to get rid of the thing.
I finally thought to Google "auto wrecking" and found a couple of nearby places who could accept a junk vehicle without a title. They even came and picked it up for free... they just wanted to make sure I understood that they couldn't give me any money for the car unless I had the title. They did say if I found the title within 3 days to call them and they could pay me for the car.
I'm in Illinois so I don't know if there are differing state laws in play, but it might be worthwhile to call some junkyards in your area and see what they say.
posted by Serene Empress Dork at 1:43 PM on December 9, 2010
Ah, a classic choice between Scylla and Charybdis.
Indeed... you know, if it's a toss-up between a storage closet containing what's left of a bad marriage and the California DMV... I'd take a shady auto junking service (you can narrow it down farther to find one in your town).
posted by muddgirl at 1:52 PM on December 9, 2010
Indeed... you know, if it's a toss-up between a storage closet containing what's left of a bad marriage and the California DMV... I'd take a shady auto junking service (you can narrow it down farther to find one in your town).
posted by muddgirl at 1:52 PM on December 9, 2010
Just a random thought: Mass is extremely strict with automobile titles. New Hampshire is not. (I once registered a car there that did not exist -- you don't need to produce a title for cars more than 10 year old, I believe -- so that I could have a spare plate to use on various project cars.) I would bet $5 that if you contacted a similar charity over the border in NH they would gladly take the car off your hands with little hassle. Might be worth looking into should you not wish to expend the effort tracking things down and sorting out the title issue.
posted by lazywhinerkid at 2:06 PM on December 9, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by lazywhinerkid at 2:06 PM on December 9, 2010 [2 favorites]
It looks like Good News Garage has an operation in MA and although their FAQ says they do require a title, they recommend you call their vehicle processor so maybe they might have more info? I can't say enough good things about these guys; I donated my broken-down car, they fixed it up and I got a wonderful card from the single mother who received it. Good luck!
posted by Wuggie Norple at 4:41 PM on December 9, 2010
posted by Wuggie Norple at 4:41 PM on December 9, 2010
Best answer: Maybe the best time to plow through that pile of past you don't want to face is while you're in the midst of a stupid exercise that will result in a very happy circumstance for someone else.
If it cheers you up at all, I don't know this for sure but I think that you are giving someone an amazing gift. I've never been without a car or access to one, but just thinking of the feeling it would give me to be handed the means to reliably transport me and my family places, without spending hours on bus schedules or whatnot if the bus even served where I needed to go, I think that would be an amazing flood of relief and a newfound sense of hope. At the very least it would be one less thing to worry about.
The thought of going through rings of DMV hell makes me want to move and change my name too.
I am not sure about this next thought - but did your subconscious prompt you to get to this point so that you would have to go through that pile, and are you coming here to get some fortification for going in and doing it? I think we end up in situations sometimes exactly when we are ready to be there, and I'm not sure how that happens but I think it does. If you weren't ready, you wouldn't have come here.
posted by mrs. taters at 6:27 AM on December 10, 2010
If it cheers you up at all, I don't know this for sure but I think that you are giving someone an amazing gift. I've never been without a car or access to one, but just thinking of the feeling it would give me to be handed the means to reliably transport me and my family places, without spending hours on bus schedules or whatnot if the bus even served where I needed to go, I think that would be an amazing flood of relief and a newfound sense of hope. At the very least it would be one less thing to worry about.
The thought of going through rings of DMV hell makes me want to move and change my name too.
I am not sure about this next thought - but did your subconscious prompt you to get to this point so that you would have to go through that pile, and are you coming here to get some fortification for going in and doing it? I think we end up in situations sometimes exactly when we are ready to be there, and I'm not sure how that happens but I think it does. If you weren't ready, you wouldn't have come here.
posted by mrs. taters at 6:27 AM on December 10, 2010
Response by poster: Thanks everybody for the advice and for not giving me a hard time about the good fortune in life to be able to give someone a car and my selfishness for whinging about bureaucracy when someone without a car really needs mine.
I'm going to suck it up and do what I have to do to get the Ma. title -- I got the number for Honda and printed the form for CA's duplicate title (although as you'd expect it requires a "notarization from the legal owner of record release of ownership and/or interest" a sentence I can't even parse, never mind wrap my head around the idea of how I'm supposed to get a notarization in person from a business in California.
I don't even know if I'm the legal owner or not. I must be. Right?
And there's a fee but they don't tell you what it is, so the upside to all of this is it's getting pretty funny.
In case it's not clear, it was my first car and I didn't buy it until I was almost thirty. I didn't know about this stuff. I might yet junk it if they really beat me down, but for now I'm just going to go ahead and let this take weeks of baby steps instead of facing it all at once.
And yeah, I opted for the DMV x 2 rather than face that box in the closet. The value of a little repression of memory in life gets underestimated a lot.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 8:18 AM on December 10, 2010
I'm going to suck it up and do what I have to do to get the Ma. title -- I got the number for Honda and printed the form for CA's duplicate title (although as you'd expect it requires a "notarization from the legal owner of record release of ownership and/or interest" a sentence I can't even parse, never mind wrap my head around the idea of how I'm supposed to get a notarization in person from a business in California.
I don't even know if I'm the legal owner or not. I must be. Right?
And there's a fee but they don't tell you what it is, so the upside to all of this is it's getting pretty funny.
In case it's not clear, it was my first car and I didn't buy it until I was almost thirty. I didn't know about this stuff. I might yet junk it if they really beat me down, but for now I'm just going to go ahead and let this take weeks of baby steps instead of facing it all at once.
And yeah, I opted for the DMV x 2 rather than face that box in the closet. The value of a little repression of memory in life gets underestimated a lot.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 8:18 AM on December 10, 2010
Response by poster: (Wuggie -- those are my guys. They're an above-board crew and don't take cars without their paperwork and due to the notaries and such no one can do it for me.)
posted by A Terrible Llama at 8:21 AM on December 10, 2010
posted by A Terrible Llama at 8:21 AM on December 10, 2010
Aha, I think I found the page you're looking for: Changing Legal Owner.
I wonder if you can convince the former lien-holder to submit the application for duplicate title for you. It doesn't hurt to call and ask.
posted by muddgirl at 8:32 AM on December 10, 2010
I wonder if you can convince the former lien-holder to submit the application for duplicate title for you. It doesn't hurt to call and ask.
posted by muddgirl at 8:32 AM on December 10, 2010
Response by poster: Oh! I just released I only have to fill out parts one through three; I think I might be able to do this without calling Honda, because it looks like in California Honda would have notified the DMV automatically, years ago. So I think as far as California is concerned, I am the legal owner.
I'm probably getting too excited about this. It can only end in heartbreak.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 8:46 AM on December 10, 2010
I'm probably getting too excited about this. It can only end in heartbreak.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 8:46 AM on December 10, 2010
Response by poster: I find it hilarious that this is going on so I thought I'd post an update.
The situation now is that I again I have to resubmit the request for title to California with an original copy of the release of the lien, which MA RMV looked at, crumbled up, and threw over their shoulder. CA really, really wanted that piece of paper, so now I have to get it from Honda once again.
And although CA rejected all my paperwork, they still cashed my check.
They're seriously cracking me up.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 2:11 PM on January 19, 2011
The situation now is that I again I have to resubmit the request for title to California with an original copy of the release of the lien, which MA RMV looked at, crumbled up, and threw over their shoulder. CA really, really wanted that piece of paper, so now I have to get it from Honda once again.
And although CA rejected all my paperwork, they still cashed my check.
They're seriously cracking me up.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 2:11 PM on January 19, 2011
This thread is closed to new comments.
You bought the car in California, where a California title was issued to the title holder. I suspect that when you paid it off, the lein holder merely signed on the "lein payed off" line and sent the title to you (that is what happened when I payed off my car loan). You could have taken that in to California or Mass and had a clean title issued, but I'm guessing you didn't (no one does - it costs money and it doesn't matter as long as you save the signed-off title).
Since that probably didn't happen, the title is still in California, and it probably still has your lein-holder's name on it. You need to send a lein-release to California and pay the fee to issue you a clean title.
posted by muddgirl at 12:28 PM on December 9, 2010