Letting go of other people's problems
October 4, 2010 10:45 PM Subscribe
How does one learn to let go of other people's mistakes?
Sometimes, when friends make obviously very unwise choices after I've advised them on a way to do what it is they are setting out to do in a less damaging way, they go ahead and do things their way anyway. On occasion, this impacts me personally, and I find it difficult to move on.
I understand intellectually that sometimes people have to make their own mistakes so as to learn from them, but I find it hard to leverage that knowledge into a more healthy way of responding emotionally. What techniques can I use to change my emotional reaction so that I seem like less of a shitheel when I find it hard to be completely supportive?
Sometimes, when friends make obviously very unwise choices after I've advised them on a way to do what it is they are setting out to do in a less damaging way, they go ahead and do things their way anyway. On occasion, this impacts me personally, and I find it difficult to move on.
I understand intellectually that sometimes people have to make their own mistakes so as to learn from them, but I find it hard to leverage that knowledge into a more healthy way of responding emotionally. What techniques can I use to change my emotional reaction so that I seem like less of a shitheel when I find it hard to be completely supportive?
I'd tell you but you wouldn't listen anyway.
Here's the secret to feeling better: You cannot force others to make better decisions. You can tell them your thoughts and provide information but your responsibility ends there.
posted by zephyr_words at 11:13 PM on October 4, 2010
Here's the secret to feeling better: You cannot force others to make better decisions. You can tell them your thoughts and provide information but your responsibility ends there.
posted by zephyr_words at 11:13 PM on October 4, 2010
Off the top of my head, The Four Agreements by Don Miguel Ruiz comes to mind. Of which three are:
1. Don't take anything personally.
2. Don't make assumptions.
3. Always do your best.
posted by phaedon at 12:04 AM on October 5, 2010 [2 favorites]
1. Don't take anything personally.
2. Don't make assumptions.
3. Always do your best.
posted by phaedon at 12:04 AM on October 5, 2010 [2 favorites]
Can you find a sympathetic ear? My friend's daughter just married a man in the military and is living with her mom, who wants her to move down and be on base with her husband. About once a week my friend "rants" to me about how she thinks her daughter should go and lists multiple points about why it would be better for her, knowing she's scared, although here are a few reasons why it wouldn't. I let her go on like this even though I've heard it all before, agreeing with her along the way, and she feels a lot better. We just did this yesterday, in fact.
So is there a third trusted friend (doesn't have to know the person, even talk to your dog or cat!) who you can rant to about why your friend is making the wrong choice and how you think your advice would be better? That might help you at least sort out your feelings and get it off your mind.
posted by IndigoRain at 12:11 AM on October 5, 2010
So is there a third trusted friend (doesn't have to know the person, even talk to your dog or cat!) who you can rant to about why your friend is making the wrong choice and how you think your advice would be better? That might help you at least sort out your feelings and get it off your mind.
posted by IndigoRain at 12:11 AM on October 5, 2010
As a parental figure to a 19 year old male who currently seems totally committed to doing whatever he can to make his stated objectives as hard to to achieve as possible, I sympathize.
My present method seems to involve quite a lot of cursing and fuming. But I try my best to do that where he's not going to hear it. And hopefully what I've personally learned from witnessing his utter lack of common sense will make me a better parent next time around (she's 5 at present, so there's a way to go yet).
When it's friends rather than kids, I think you've got much less of an obligation to be supportive. I don't think that makes you a shitheel. If people are going to do obviously stupid things, your best bet is just try not to get any on you. And don't lend them money.
posted by flabdablet at 12:57 AM on October 5, 2010 [2 favorites]
My present method seems to involve quite a lot of cursing and fuming. But I try my best to do that where he's not going to hear it. And hopefully what I've personally learned from witnessing his utter lack of common sense will make me a better parent next time around (she's 5 at present, so there's a way to go yet).
When it's friends rather than kids, I think you've got much less of an obligation to be supportive. I don't think that makes you a shitheel. If people are going to do obviously stupid things, your best bet is just try not to get any on you. And don't lend them money.
posted by flabdablet at 12:57 AM on October 5, 2010 [2 favorites]
Stop thinking of living as a series of choices that are RIGHT or WRONG. What's best for you is not always what's best for another person at a given time, even if the RESULT would be easier or logically better. So forget about it. Think of choices as choices people are free to make, and the advice you give as giving them the tools they need to evaluate the right choice for them.
posted by shazzam! at 1:04 AM on October 5, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by shazzam! at 1:04 AM on October 5, 2010 [1 favorite]
To address the "On occasion, this impacts me personally, and I find it difficult to move on" part, I find that the following quote by Golda Meir helps me find the sweet-spot of good perspective: Don't be humble, you're not that great.
In other words, everything in the world impacts you personally, on some level. Whatever they're doing that's screwing up their lives (and yours by proxy) is probably happening to you at a lesser degree. There's no need to trump their suffering with a request from them to ease yours. Or to validate your advice-giving and ego with negative outcome evidence from their not taking it.
Part of being a good friend is to be along for the bumpy parts of the ride. That's where the forgiveness, support and growth happens. It's where and how they know to be there for you when you surprise yourself and Do Something Wrong. Which you will eventually, because you're not that great.
posted by iamkimiam at 1:22 AM on October 5, 2010 [2 favorites]
In other words, everything in the world impacts you personally, on some level. Whatever they're doing that's screwing up their lives (and yours by proxy) is probably happening to you at a lesser degree. There's no need to trump their suffering with a request from them to ease yours. Or to validate your advice-giving and ego with negative outcome evidence from their not taking it.
Part of being a good friend is to be along for the bumpy parts of the ride. That's where the forgiveness, support and growth happens. It's where and how they know to be there for you when you surprise yourself and Do Something Wrong. Which you will eventually, because you're not that great.
posted by iamkimiam at 1:22 AM on October 5, 2010 [2 favorites]
I'm surprised at some of the rabid responses here. Apparently some people here have never had friends who repeatedly make truly poor life choices.
Still, as my grandma always says, you can't change the way people act--you can only change the way you respond to them. If you have some friends who are making poor life choices, when you can see the consequences of those choices coming like a freight train, and especially when those consequences impact you in a significant way... well, you have some choices too, don't you? You can choose to put up with it because that is the price of admission*, you can choose to try to issue some kind of wake-up call to your friend (will probably fail if they're truly intent on self-destruction or just not ready to change), or you can choose to pull away from that friendship to save your own sanity and well-being.
*Dan Savage [video] was talking about romantic partners, but it works for any interpersonal relationship.
posted by amberwb at 8:31 AM on October 5, 2010
Still, as my grandma always says, you can't change the way people act--you can only change the way you respond to them. If you have some friends who are making poor life choices, when you can see the consequences of those choices coming like a freight train, and especially when those consequences impact you in a significant way... well, you have some choices too, don't you? You can choose to put up with it because that is the price of admission*, you can choose to try to issue some kind of wake-up call to your friend (will probably fail if they're truly intent on self-destruction or just not ready to change), or you can choose to pull away from that friendship to save your own sanity and well-being.
*Dan Savage [video] was talking about romantic partners, but it works for any interpersonal relationship.
posted by amberwb at 8:31 AM on October 5, 2010
Response by poster: Just to defend myself a little, I do make plenty of mistakes myself. I'm not above knowing the right/smart/wise thing to do and not doing it. Nor do I always have the right answer, but in some situations there's clearly a smart way to go about something and a not-so-smart way to do it. I just sometimes have a problem with being judgmental instead of supportive once their decision is made, which I know isn't really an okay reaction.
I should be helping them make the best of the situation (if they ask for said help), not fuming to myself that they wouldn't be in the situation if they'd just listened to me, by God. ;)
Thanks for all the advice. It's helpful to see the different perspectives people have.
posted by wierdo at 8:41 AM on October 5, 2010
I should be helping them make the best of the situation (if they ask for said help), not fuming to myself that they wouldn't be in the situation if they'd just listened to me, by God. ;)
Thanks for all the advice. It's helpful to see the different perspectives people have.
posted by wierdo at 8:41 AM on October 5, 2010
You can give someone binoculars and make them look at what is there on the hill, you can tell them what it is like to stand on the hill, and what happens afterward, but they are still going to walk there step-by-painful-step and experience it themselves. Mistakes are personal and need to be personally experienced for people to learn. You should distance yourself from the problem not the person, and resist saying I-told-you-so afterward.
posted by meepmeow at 9:51 AM on October 5, 2010
posted by meepmeow at 9:51 AM on October 5, 2010
The thing that has worked for me is to really try to empathize with them. Think about those times that you've known the 'right' course of action and not taken it. Why? Not the self-berating "because I was stupid" or "denial" but the real reason, with all of its emotional complexity. Were you still shell-shocked from a big life change and didn't have the mental energy to handle your responsibilities any more? Did you feel a sense of responsibility to someone else, however irrational, that made you sacrifice your own well-being? Were you insisting to yourself that there MUST be a core of good inside everyone and you won't give up on them even if it it's hurting you?
If you can be sympathetic to the essence of whatever basically human impulse is pushing them the wrong way, it both helps you be persuasive and helps you maintain your support for them. I've also observed that people who can't forgive themselves for making mistakes tend to have more trouble empathizing with others' mistakes, so looking at your own errors with a sympathetic eye may be a good place to start as well if that rings true to you.
The other thing to keep in mind is that there are some times when, for your own mental health, you just have to disengage from someone else's choices. As meepmeow says, you can disengage from the problem without disengaging from the person.
posted by Lady Li at 10:21 AM on October 5, 2010 [1 favorite]
If you can be sympathetic to the essence of whatever basically human impulse is pushing them the wrong way, it both helps you be persuasive and helps you maintain your support for them. I've also observed that people who can't forgive themselves for making mistakes tend to have more trouble empathizing with others' mistakes, so looking at your own errors with a sympathetic eye may be a good place to start as well if that rings true to you.
The other thing to keep in mind is that there are some times when, for your own mental health, you just have to disengage from someone else's choices. As meepmeow says, you can disengage from the problem without disengaging from the person.
posted by Lady Li at 10:21 AM on October 5, 2010 [1 favorite]
I should be helping them make the best of the situation (if they ask for said help), not fuming to myself that they wouldn't be in the situation if they'd just listened to me
I recommend doing both. Nothing dispels idiot-generated anger like a good old fume.
Go somewhere absolutely private (a car in heavy traffic is good) and curse their sorry asses until you're hoarse. That will save you wanting to do it when next you meet, and put you in a good place for the sympathy and the commiseration and the polite refusal to fund further boneheadedness.
posted by flabdablet at 10:26 AM on October 5, 2010
I recommend doing both. Nothing dispels idiot-generated anger like a good old fume.
Go somewhere absolutely private (a car in heavy traffic is good) and curse their sorry asses until you're hoarse. That will save you wanting to do it when next you meet, and put you in a good place for the sympathy and the commiseration and the polite refusal to fund further boneheadedness.
posted by flabdablet at 10:26 AM on October 5, 2010
One thing that helped me with this (a little) was when I realized recently that a friend who has been irritating me for years by making comments about how she thinks I should be disciplining my son differently is probably thinking this about me! "I've been telling her since he was a toddler that she needs to be more firm with him and give him consequences! Why won't she do it? She'd have had him whipped into shape by now if she'd listened to me!"
posted by not that girl at 12:23 PM on October 5, 2010
posted by not that girl at 12:23 PM on October 5, 2010
I could have written your question 20 years ago. I felt responsible for advising people who asked. I took it personally when they ignored my advice and screwed up. I felt sorry for them when their relationship problems got worse, and I lost respect if it was a practical matter where there actually was a "right way" to do a job. I felt responsible for assisting them, and it made me feel good to impart some of my "good judgment" to them. And I liked being thought of as a smart person with common sense.
Here are some ideas that contributed to my gradual shift away from advice giving:
--Why do I keep doing it, when the same undesirable outcome keeps happening? (Crazy means doing the same thing over and over again, hoping for a different result.)
--Literally why do I give advice? What's in it for me? How do the positives stack up against the negatives.
--These people aren't aware that I'm entering them into a deal: I give advice, and then they follow the advice. That deal exists in my imagination.
--How can I tolerate the bad feelings I get when I don't give advice?
--What might happen if I totally stayed out of it? Would I feel responsible for their mistakes? Why is that okay?
--Given that I do want to help people, what other outlets can I find?
It's taken years, but now I rarely give advice -- and most of the time, it's difficult to stop myself. But I keep resisting, because something good keeps happening: my friends and relatives make their own choices, and I notice all the anxiety and irritation I'm not feeling about their choices. Sometimes, when a reasonable person asks about something complicated, we talk about their options. Or I ask them questions about what they're thinking and feeling.
What techniques can I use to change my emotional reaction so that I seem like less of a shitheel when I find it hard to be completely supportive?
In the aftermath, you wanted the satisfaction of having helped them, and you didn't get it. The most you can do is remind yourself that you actually feel disappointed, hurt, and ignored. These feelings easily turn into anger, but you're better off with your primary feelings. Feel bad for a bit, and it will pass. Recognize your own part in causing your own discomfort. Think about what you might do differently next time.
posted by wryly at 1:25 PM on October 5, 2010
Here are some ideas that contributed to my gradual shift away from advice giving:
--Why do I keep doing it, when the same undesirable outcome keeps happening? (Crazy means doing the same thing over and over again, hoping for a different result.)
--Literally why do I give advice? What's in it for me? How do the positives stack up against the negatives.
--These people aren't aware that I'm entering them into a deal: I give advice, and then they follow the advice. That deal exists in my imagination.
--How can I tolerate the bad feelings I get when I don't give advice?
--What might happen if I totally stayed out of it? Would I feel responsible for their mistakes? Why is that okay?
--Given that I do want to help people, what other outlets can I find?
It's taken years, but now I rarely give advice -- and most of the time, it's difficult to stop myself. But I keep resisting, because something good keeps happening: my friends and relatives make their own choices, and I notice all the anxiety and irritation I'm not feeling about their choices. Sometimes, when a reasonable person asks about something complicated, we talk about their options. Or I ask them questions about what they're thinking and feeling.
What techniques can I use to change my emotional reaction so that I seem like less of a shitheel when I find it hard to be completely supportive?
In the aftermath, you wanted the satisfaction of having helped them, and you didn't get it. The most you can do is remind yourself that you actually feel disappointed, hurt, and ignored. These feelings easily turn into anger, but you're better off with your primary feelings. Feel bad for a bit, and it will pass. Recognize your own part in causing your own discomfort. Think about what you might do differently next time.
posted by wryly at 1:25 PM on October 5, 2010
Uh, I do give plenty of advice on AskMe. It satisfies my ego and I rarely find out what the asker really chose to do. It's all about me!
posted by wryly at 1:28 PM on October 5, 2010
posted by wryly at 1:28 PM on October 5, 2010
This thread is closed to new comments.
The point, here, is to get you used to the fact that your opinion about how to deal with a situation is just one opinion, and that you should be focused on giving the person an idea of what might help, rather than convincing them that your recommendation is the only right one.
After all, you're not giving advice to be right, are you? If so, knock it off. You're giving advice to be helpful, and that's why you should only offer it when asked, and you should understand that the choice they make is their responsibility rather than yours, and that they're going to have information and points of view and other opinions from other people to consider along with yours.
In short: if you truly believe you have the answers to everyone's problems, write a book. In the meantime, stop getting so invested in your opinions and their successes/failures. I say this as someone who used to do the same thing.
Oh, and the knowledge that "sometimes people have to make their own mistakes so as to learn from them"? That's a bit arrogant, don't you think? You're not their father/mother, and you shouldn't be looking down on them. If you're giving advice in that vein, I'm not surprised they're rejecting it.
of course you don't have to take my advice; it's just my opinion, and you're bound to get some other good ones. ultimately you have to make your own mistakes so as to learn from them.
posted by davejay at 11:00 PM on October 4, 2010 [8 favorites]