How to de-creepify a basement?

July 19, 2010 2:03 PM

Are basements inherently creepy? Or is there some way I can make it so my kids don't fear our new basement?

My family, including my kids who are 5 and 7, will soon be moving into our new-to-us house. The house is about 100 years old and has an unfinished basement. They've never before lived in a house with a basement.

It's not a particularly creepy basement as far as basements go. It's mostly open and doesn't have any scary rooms or nooks. The washer and dryer are down there, as will be my husband's work area/shop.

But, it does have a big furnace, pipes on the ceiling, boarded up windows, and that general old basement feel. One of my kids mentioned something about thinking the basement was scary.

Short of finishing it, is there anything I can do or say so they never figure out that basements are scary? Or, is fearing a basement something all children with basements must experience?

posted by bluedaisy to home & garden (53 answers total)

I know it's unfinished, but can you set up a play area of some kind for them down there? My basement was where I had all my parties and stuff in high school--we had couches, a tv/vcr, a stereo, etc. Nothing fancy, but it was fun to hang out down there. Make it a place they enjoy or that's fun in some way, and it won't be scary.
posted by leesh at 2:07 PM on July 19, 2010

You've got a vast library of horror books and films stacked against you. Sorry.

Plus the fact that basements are scary.
posted by sbutler at 2:07 PM on July 19, 2010 [5 favorites]

it's scary because it's kind of a secret place that hides under the house. Can be a bit damp, a bit dark, and full of strange noises and spiders.
Maybe you can make it a fun mystery, or a place for forbidden pursuits. Lots of cardboard boxes to make the biggest for to hide in! A tarp, paints and a few big pads of paper on an easel make a place where they can make a huge mess without being bad!
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 2:08 PM on July 19, 2010 [1 favorite]

*biggest FORT. Was typing in a dark basement, there.
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 2:09 PM on July 19, 2010

I've never really thought about this in detail, but it's my impression that unfinished basements seem scary because they are generally poorly lit and tend to have a lot shadows. Perhaps you can strategically place a lot of lamps around the basement to eliminate such shadows, if they exist? Or just to make the place seem brighter.
posted by puritycontrol at 2:10 PM on July 19, 2010 [5 favorites]

I don't remember thinking basements were always scary.

Plenty of lighting helps a lot to eradicate any creepy basement vibes. Also, make sure there are no spiders- some kids get freaked out by them.

Maybe put something new and large and fun to play with down there, so your kids associate it with playing? A ball pit, or a big easel and paints, or build a fort, or whatever your kids would find fun and appealing.
posted by ambrosia at 2:10 PM on July 19, 2010

I never was afraid of any particular basement, including the unfinished ones in my own parents' house and the houses of my friends growing up, nor of basements in general. It might be a cultural thing, so make sure that you don't end up subconsciously hinting that the basement is scary.
posted by XMLicious at 2:12 PM on July 19, 2010

I didn't have a basement growing up, but our garage gave off the same creepy vibe when it was all closed up. (Made all the worse by the numerous palmetto bugs every Florida garage is home to.) I think a huge part of the problem was that I was always sent to go there for chores alone.

Try involving the kids with laundry duties, projects with your husband, and general creative play. Then start sending them down by themselves for the odd chore or errand.
posted by Wossname at 2:13 PM on July 19, 2010

Yeah, I think light is key... and finishing the floors and walls. A house I rented several years ago had a basement that looked exactly like the one in the Blair Witch Project, and it scared the ever loving shit out of me every time I had to go down there. My rational mind could not over come visceral imaginings.
posted by kimdog at 2:13 PM on July 19, 2010

... yeah, actually, come to think of it my parents actually had to keep me out of the basement because I was curious to go through the boxes and boxes of interesting things down there.
posted by XMLicious at 2:15 PM on July 19, 2010

When I was about that age, the best thing about our unfinished basement was the smooth concrete floor. Roller-skating!
posted by asperity at 2:16 PM on July 19, 2010 [3 favorites]

Good lighting that you can turn on from the top of the stairs.

Speaking as a child of suburbia- basements rule.
posted by mkultra at 2:16 PM on July 19, 2010 [2 favorites]

I think you're missing a trick here. Scary basement could be a great way of keeping the li'l tearaways in line.
posted by i_cola at 2:19 PM on July 19, 2010 [1 favorite]

I just moved into a house of similar age, with boarded up windows in the basement. We quickly had glass block windows installed, with a vent in each window, and it helped hugely with the perception of the basement as dark and dank and gross.
posted by pixiecrinkle at 2:20 PM on July 19, 2010

I grew up in a 100+ year old house with an unfinished creepy basement (complete with mysterious preserves in jars that were there when we moved in) and my brother and I thought it was the coolest thing ever. We would spend hours down there with a blacklight and glow-in-the-dark crayons, but it was the 1970s so YMMV.
posted by JoanArkham at 2:21 PM on July 19, 2010

I was never afraid of my unfinished basement as a kid. It was a nifty place filled with cave crickets and a big woodstove and piles of lumber. My parrents always took me down with them when they did laundry when I was home with them, so I could play with the crickets.

I guess what I'm saying is make the basement an adventure. Adventures are fun.
posted by strixus at 2:21 PM on July 19, 2010

I'm a grown-up and I still find the basement scary. It's poorly lit and I can't help thinking I'm going to fall down the stairs or walk eye-first into a sticking-out nail or something ridiculous.

Here's what I can think of to de-creepify a basement:

-Light. Lots and lots of light. Preferably switched on from the very top of the stairs.
-Make sure it's as clean as you can reasonably get a basement - as little dust and mustiness as possible.
-Remove all evidence of bugs, spiders, etc.
-Good sturdy stairs, with a handrail if possible.
-Keep stuff tidy, preferably in boxes, especially for things like old busted toys or anything significantly older than the kids.
-You probably can't do anything about the pipers, but cover up any exposed wires, sharp edges, etc.

Keep in mind that you can never tell what will freak a kid out, and creepiness isn't always a bad thing, as long as there's nothing truly harmful to back it up. I remember some of the creepy things from my childhood with quite a bit of weird fondness, like swarms of mayflies and the Emergency Broadcast System buzz.
posted by Metroid Baby at 2:29 PM on July 19, 2010 [5 favorites]

Nthing that getting light into the basement is going to make a huge difference, and if you can make some of that sunlight that would help even more. If there are small windows, perhaps you could build slanted sunlight in that stuck out into your yard.

Also I'd use lots of light paint and cover or hide as much machinery as possible.

The other ecky thing about basements though, is that they are often very damp (and therefore smelly), a dehumidifier might go a long, long way to making it nicer.
posted by Some1 at 2:29 PM on July 19, 2010

My aunt had a huge unfinished basement that I couldn't wait to go play in when I was little. It had nothing to do with lighting, paint, or lack of spiders, and everything to do with it being full of toys and we could be as loud as we wanted down there.
posted by haplesschild at 2:30 PM on July 19, 2010

Number one item: smell. Basements have a scent to them and that is the smell of a fearful place to many. So, eliminate dampness, move some air through there, get rid of the gently rotting bits of whatever, and get something relatively fresh, without being artificial, circulating.

Do fun things down there. Positive memories make for positive associations.

Finish the backs of the steps. Slat stairs say "yes, please wrap your filthy talons around my ankles and yank me through, screaming, into the dark place where neither the pitiful thirty watt bulb nor God will look."
posted by adipocere at 2:31 PM on July 19, 2010 [14 favorites]

I didn't find basements scary until I cut myself on a lightswitch in our unfinished one when I was 8. (The faceplate of lightswitches is really quite sharp when there's no wall behind it..)

So I agree with covering up sharp edges.
posted by nat at 2:33 PM on July 19, 2010

Some old friends introduced me to a hilariously fun way to demystify cellars and basements. They would play hide and seek in the dark. It was a riot, since you didn't really have to stay in one place, but any noise you made immediately gave you away. You also knew the gig was up as the noise of the searcher came closer to you. I don't remember a single instance when everyone could keep their mouths shut or keep from laughing.
Naturally, you want to make sure it's difficult to get hurt, since one person will be stumbling around, feeling around for the others, who themselves might be trying to squirm out of the way.
Jeez, I couldn't even wipe the smirk off my face as I wrote this, it's that funny. I can't even imagine what it would be like with kids who were really gung-ho about it.
Definitely a sensory substitution activity, replacing sight with hearing and touch.
posted by girdyerloins at 2:34 PM on July 19, 2010

You should get some cans of bright colorful spray-paint and paint a big series of goofy-looking "Basement Monsters" on the wall. One of the genius strategies about Sesame Street was taking adorable, harmless-looking characters (Grover, Oscar, and Telly) and putting them in the category of "Monster", so that when kids think "monster", they're more likely to think of their TV friends than about some slavering fanged throat-ripper. You should employ the same strategy! Big fantastical creatures with curious eyes and smiles and fur and stuff! You can introduce the kids to the basement, and when they ask what the things on the walls are, just be all casual: "Oh, those are the Basement Monsters. they live down here. That one's Jeremy, and that one's Penelope, and that one is Mrs. Truffle. Mrs. Truffle is Jeremy's mom, and Penelope hates eating rice, but that one over there is Puzzle Michael, and he loves eating rice, so they're always arguing about rice and whether they should have it for dinner," etc. Essentially, you're creating a narrative about the basement that's more intriguing for them to be curious, rather than the current narrative of basement-as-site-of-unknown fear.
posted by Greg Nog at 2:37 PM on July 19, 2010 [4 favorites]

5 and 7? Buy some drywall and have them help you finish the basement. It doesn't have to be a good job, but it will let them want it to turn out well, suggest lights, etc.
posted by rhizome at 2:39 PM on July 19, 2010

As kids, we were always sent to the basement to play, and I hated it.

Not because it was creepy. It wasn't. It was semi-finished, but finished in all hard surfaces. Tile floor. Brick surrounding the support columns. Vinyl couches.

It was cold and hard and uncomfortable. My parents rarely spent time in the basement, but we kids were supposed to be thrilled when we were told to spend our free time down there.

I would suggest two things. First, if your basement is dry enough, provide lots of soft surfaces. Warm thick rugs on the floor. Upholstered, cushy, comfy furniture. Pillows everywhere. Bean bag chairs. Secondly, if you want to make sure that this is a pleasant place for your kids to spend time, then spend lots of your time there yourself. If you don't find it to be a warm, welcoming space, they probably won't either.
posted by marsha56 at 2:42 PM on July 19, 2010 [2 favorites]

It's creepy right now because it's empty. Fill it with your stuff, take the boards off the windows (or fake it and hang cute curtains over the boards), make sure it's well lit, and then have them hang out in there while you're doing laundry and whatnot. They'll get accustomed to it in no time.
posted by stefanie at 2:42 PM on July 19, 2010

Clowns. Paint clowns on the wall.

Nah, just kidding.

nthing "more light," and - as a kid I found any unfamiliar house creepy in spots, simply because I wasn't used to it. I don't know that you need to do a lot about this, unless there's some need for them to start sleeping in the basement day 1. I think they will get used to it, especially if you use the space for mundane things, and don't keep any people tied up down there that you intend to harvest the skin off of.
posted by randomkeystrike at 2:45 PM on July 19, 2010

Remember a light that gets turned on from the top of the stairs is also a light that is turned OFF from the top of the stairs. A second light controlled from the actual basement can help prevent some serious sibling inflicted trauma.
posted by ecurtz at 2:59 PM on July 19, 2010 [11 favorites]

Hey, welcome to my basement last year! You are describing ours to a "T".

We eventually finished it (here is what it looked like when we moved in, then cleaned it out.) (Here's the in-between stage.)

In the interim stage, we got better lighting (yay, IKEA!) and put up an indoor swing, a bucket on a block and tackle next to the stairs (you could reach through the slats to put stuff in the bucket and send it down, sorry I don't have a picture but here is something similar we did on the back porch) and put down foam floor mats that can be hosed off when they get dirty. They are soft enough under foot, but are smooth enough to ride a trike on.
posted by jeanmari at 3:07 PM on July 19, 2010 [7 favorites]

Oh my god, Greg Nog's answer is PERFECT! I was going to suggest make them help you clean it up. They will never want to go down there again, not because it's creepy, but because it represents work.

Another suburban child of the 70's here. Unfinished basements were magical mysterious places, full of all sorts of unknown treasures. Mom's high school yearbooks! Dad's army stuff! Once we came upon a stash of Dad's old Playboy magazines. That kept the entire neighborhood's children entertained for an entire summer.

Encourage your kids to think of it as a magical place where anything (good) can happen and you never know what you might find.! (Just find a better hiding spot for your/your partner's porn stash.)
posted by SuperSquirrel at 3:08 PM on July 19, 2010

Surely the easiest solution is to make the attic so scary that the basement seems safe by comparison. I think accidentally mentioning (and then denying the existence of) their "older brother" while glancing at the ceiling should do it.
posted by nicwolff at 3:08 PM on July 19, 2010

smooth enough to ride a trike on

Race courses can be built from stacks of boxes and chalk outlines on the floor. We RODE OUR BIKES in the winter! How cool is that?
posted by SuperSquirrel at 3:11 PM on July 19, 2010

Basements are scary to me because of the "no escape" factor, but then again having ground level windows seems a bit insecure (might not hear someone breaking one to get in). So not sure if I would ever feel really comfortable descending into one. But having lots of light (switch controls at the top and bottom of stairs sounds good), plus finished stairs (no slats!) is good. Possibly also a motion light down there, I dunno. I'm pretty paranoid and have a very active imagination, so I would myself go overboard in finishing it. Like having no hiding places; so I can see from the top or partway down the stairs whether a fiend is waiting for me.

jeanmari's basement looks awesome, though, so there's hope! Very clean, well-lit, uncluttered, and lots of white paint (with pops of color) seems the best way to go.
posted by JenMarie at 3:14 PM on July 19, 2010

Lots of light. And if it was me, I'd get the cheapest $5 a gallon white paint and a sprayer and paint the entire place white. Walls, ceiling, pipes, everything. Makes a huge difference.
posted by gjc at 3:25 PM on July 19, 2010 [1 favorite]

I remember being scared by our basement when my family moved to our first basement-having dwelling. I was four. My father set up a little wood shop down there and spent lots of time on projects, and I spent lots of time watching him measure and cut, and cleaning up sawdust. It didn't take long before the basement no longer meant "the scary dark place where monsters are", but instead was "the place where Dad does his projects, with all the saws and magnets and leftover wood for building stuff". At some point Dad put an old bucket seat from a car down there, and I'd sit down there and read for hours with the spiders. Unsurprisingly, I grew up to be a huge nerd.
posted by yomimono at 3:32 PM on July 19, 2010

Thanks, JenMarie! What you are seeing there is a floor that "floats" above the concrete floor using Dricore (you can also even level out your floor using the DriCore shims underneath). This allows for a small amount of moisture to actually travel between the DriCore and the concrete and go down the drain should there ever be a need. Let's hope it is never needed.

On top of the DriCore are Flor carpet tiles. These are installed as connected to each other and not the DriCore. In the event of something crazy happening, portions of the floor can be replaced DIY-style without having to redo everything. The laundry room section is 2 x 2 matte ceramic tile on top of crack-isolation membrane (like NobleSeal or similar).

Add some IKEA furniture off of Craigslist and voila! Better basement.
posted by jeanmari at 3:35 PM on July 19, 2010 [4 favorites]

Since you mention your kids have never lived anywhere with a basement, it might be good just to explain what basements are and what they are traditionally used for. That might sound really pedantic, but I remember when my niece and nephew came over to our new-to-us house and took the tour of the whole place, my 7 year old niece announced that she liked everything except the garage. "I didn't like the garage. That room was kind of dark, and not very pretty." (The garage at her house was converted by previous owners to a home office, so she didn't have any basis of reference as to what garages normally look like.)

How you explain the purpose and function of the basement can probably go a long way towards de-creepifying it.
posted by ambrosia at 3:47 PM on July 19, 2010

Put their video game system down there.
posted by Ignatius J. Reilly at 3:47 PM on July 19, 2010

Why shouldn't kids have some creepy places to be afraid of? It's part of childhood.
posted by jockc at 3:54 PM on July 19, 2010 [1 favorite]

Clean it up really well. Part of the basement ickiness is the mold-y aroma, the dust, cobwebs, and dirt. Get it in good repair. Put in some decent shelves for large play. My sister had her basement ceiling painted - they used a sprayer. It made it feel much spiffier.

I still dislike the roar of a furnace. Talk to a code officer and see if they recommend walling off a furnace room as a safety issue.

Then put some good play stuff down there. Your kids will learn from your attitude. If you think it's a nice place to play, so will they.
posted by theora55 at 4:13 PM on July 19, 2010

Lighting. I remember scaring the CRAP out of my sister coming out of a hiding place under the basement stairs. It was a creepy, scary basement. A couple weeks later Mom announced all kids would be getting rooms in the basement. The most noticeable before/after difference was the guinea pig & the lighting. Or maybe I should say memorable. All the other differences were un-memorable. But I remember it wasn't scary down there once been moved in, and it had been *totally* scary before.
posted by Ys at 4:31 PM on July 19, 2010

When I was a kid, we didn't have a basement. But *both* sets of grandparents had unfinished basements, and they kept the NEATEST STUFF down there. One was a gardening grampa, and he'd keep his various harvests on shelves on the walls (and I could EAT them, and they were GOOD) and all his tools were stored down there, and he also had various things that were all kinds of fun (an empty gigantic wire spool, the kind you can make roll by standing on the middle and walking) and large toys not suitable for inside the house. My other grampa had carpentry tools and a great big set of wooden blocks--in retrospect, made from scrap ends of other projects, but still REALLY COOL to a little kid.

Both basements were really well lit, and it never even occurred to me to be scared of them. They were the fun place to go play when we were visiting. Part of it was the novelty--we didn't have one--and part of it was the STUFF.
posted by galadriel at 5:03 PM on July 19, 2010

Our main play area in the summer was a semi-finished basement -- it definitely had some creepiness to it, but the pleasant parts: cool in the summer, some natural light, good toy storage, lots of space for our big dollhouses and to lay out lego towns, a cushioned place to sit and read. (An old mattress IIRC.)

Also, the openings to the crawl spaces were covered on that side of the basement. The other side of the basement had the furnace, laundry, and crawl space access. (We lived on the side of a hill, so the basement got bigger as you went further back in the house. There was actually an outside door at the back of the basement right at ground level, while the crawl space only just reached the front of the house.)

Agreed with all those who say light switches at top and bottom!

What made it still seem creepy/uncomfortable: spiderwebs in the more abandoned corners, plumbing in less-than-great repair, crummy stairs, unshaded florescent lighting, the trap door.
posted by epersonae at 5:16 PM on July 19, 2010

jeanmari, I'm really envious and look forward someday to projects like that on my own (still hypothetical) house!

haha, I realized reading answers that the actual question is about how to make it less creepy for the kids; meanwhile I wrote all about my own adult terror...
posted by JenMarie at 5:27 PM on July 19, 2010

My bedroom used to be on the finished side of the basement, but I was still kinda terrified of the unfinished side, which was where the furnace and power tools and other noisy machines and bugs and dripping water were. There were still bugs and mildew and dust and weird noises and creaky stairs and flickering fluorescent lights and lots of junk on my side, and I always avoided the unfinished side after dark, but it was also kind of nice to have a room that was a sanctuary away from the rest of the house.

My suggestion? Make your basement like jeanmari's above. That's a basement I wouldn't mind living in; it's clean and pleasing to the eye and full of light.
posted by limeonaire at 6:05 PM on July 19, 2010

And now that I think about it some more, one of my childhood friends had a basement that we loved—it had carpet and lots of toys and soft, warm lighting and lots of interesting (but not scary) things stored away. Another childhood friend had an unfinished basement, but it wasn't scary, 'cause we could go Rollerblading down there, and it was clean and dry.
posted by limeonaire at 6:08 PM on July 19, 2010

You know, I was talking to my mother just a couple of days ago about how creepy my partially-unfinished basement was (I'm in my late 20s). Every few weeks I go stand down there trying to figure out how to make it nicer, before losing my nerve and coming back upstairs. Things I have discovered I don't like are pretty much what everyone's mentioned above: lots of spiders, bad, uncovered lighting, damp smell, carpets with mystery stains on them, and a small room full of the landlord's crap that I fear is harboring rodents or even worse spiders than the ones out in the main area.

Whenever I get motivated, things I think I want to do are: clean all the cobwebs, get a dehumidifier down there, clean the scary tiny bathroom, find some way to cover or add more lighting everywhere, and add cheerful curtains and possibly rugs. Now after seeing jeanmari's link, I must add "indoor swing."

I grew up in Arizona, where pretty much no one had basements, so I don't know what my feelings would have been as a kid. I loved poorly lit attics filled with crap, however. But attics have a different vibe than basements, probably because of the underground + dank smell factor.
posted by wending my way at 7:43 PM on July 19, 2010

We lived in a few houses with basements when I was a kid and I think scariness was a factor of how far removed it was from the main living space. If it was too quiet and secluded, it would creep me out. If it had a TV it was ok.
posted by bonobothegreat at 7:59 PM on July 19, 2010

Basements can be the Greatest Thing Ever or the Worst Thing Ever, it's the details that make the difference.

For example - when I was 9 our family moved into a house with a big, completely unfinished basement. But it was fun because it instantly became our roller rink (can you say 70's?). Stereo + skates = fun.

I will agree with everyone who said that the main hurdle for a kid in the basement is light or lack thereof. Make sure the lights can be turned on by wall switches instead of pull strings, and make sure the light switches (ALL of them for the whole basement) are near the entrance. Multiple switches are even better.

Carpet the stairs down to the basement if you can. Cold, hard or creaky stairs only amplify the creepiness effect. If it's not creepy to descend into, it won't be as creepy when you get there.

Make the basement the place where your kids can do the jillion other things they aren't allowed to do in the 'nice' part of the house - play with paints, make a lot of noise, throw a ball around. That will make it seem more like a fun hideaway than a spooky sinister catacomb.
posted by contessa at 8:50 PM on July 19, 2010

You've got a vast library of horror books and films stacked against you. Sorry.

True, and as such: please, please do your best to feed your kids a media diet that is free of scary not entirely positive references to the basement for as long as humanly possible. It's amazing what kind of things stick with kids, and what little moments permanently alter their associations. For some awful reason, I was allowed to watch It when I was young and ended up avoiding everything related to clowns and drainage sewers for as long as I can remember. I know that it's impossible, but perhaps a worthwhile effort until they learn that the basement is a fun and safe place.
posted by blazingunicorn at 11:40 PM on July 19, 2010

Shut off the air conditioning.

The house will heat up. The basement will be dramatically cooler and suddenly a very attractive hangout spot. My parents were stingy with the AC, so I spent many summer days hiding downstairs and reading.

Also, install some kind of light on the stairs (the kind at floor level, not overhead), that is always on at night. Nothing is more difficult than working up the nerve to walk past that giant yawning black stairway that leads down to even more darkness, after you've just watched your first episode of The X-Files without permission. I'll be safe if I don't look down there, just run by it really fast and don't look...
posted by castlebravo at 7:04 AM on July 20, 2010

I've really got to disagree with all the people suggesting you encourage your kids to play down there, but that's probably because I read "100-year-old house" and think of the classic New England fieldstone cellar. There is almost no way to finish such a basement, nor make it a "play area". However, my current house has such a cellar, that's pretty well-lit, and has a decent tool work-bench area. After a few months' familiarity with it, I was willing to dash down and change the laundry over while barefoot, but it still feels kind of daring.

The good news is that things you may hate about your basement (hitting your head on pipes, uneven floors that make the shelving wobble) won't bother your kids at all. The bad news is that things you take entirely for granted with bother the heck out of them - furnaces and exposed pipes are inherently scary, old cement floors that make their own dirt are always yukky. The semi-good news is that fixing a lot of things that make it mildly unpleasant for you will make it better for them, too, and the more they're down there with you, the more they'll get used to it. If you've got a bulkhead stair, open that up frequently so that it's not mysterious, because the door-to-nowhere effect can be pretty freaky.

To add to everyone else's suggestion of good lighting (essential!!!) I'd include running a dehumidifier to reduce the "basement smell" as much as possible.
posted by aimedwander at 7:42 AM on July 20, 2010

Thanks to everyone for all the great ideas! I could have marked them all as best answer. I marked the best ideas and responses that made me laugh.

The entire house is one big fix-up project, so the basement is low on the list and might not be top on the list til, oh, the kids are out of high school. But you have given me some great suggestions for things we can do in the interim. Luckily, it's a pretty dry basement (and will be drier once we do some work on drainage outside), so it's not smelly or moldy. I'll also look into getting some simple fixtures to cover the many bare light bulbs. And maybe I'll put some of our older small area rugs in the washing machine area to brighten things up. I do like the idea of painting it all white, but that's going to have to wait til the rest of the house (the part that we're living in) is in better shape. And, we actually don't need the space right now, which is part of the reason this house is so great.

And a double plus thanks to whomever suggested glass blocks in the windows. That could work perfectly--still secure, much more light.

Thanks!
posted by bluedaisy at 9:43 AM on July 20, 2010