Pre-looking for a NYC apartment.
December 8, 2009 9:23 AM Subscribe
How to spend part of a short trip to NYC "looking" for an apartment when it's way, way too soon to sign a lease? Assuming I'm going to be working in the Bronx, I'm not sure what the best neighborhood would be (Upper East Side?). Details inside.
OK, here's the situation. I live in upstate New York (a few hours away from the city), where I have a job that's scheduled to end next summer. Next week I'm going to NYC for a job interview. Let's assume for the sake of this thread that I'll get the job (which, to make a long story short, is pretty likely). I'll be scheduled to start in early fall of next year, after my current upstate job ends.
I have read lots of AskMe questions about finding an apartment in NYC, so I realize that it's impossible to find a place this early since you can't start looking earlier than 4-6 weeks in advance.
The job will be in the Bronx. Subway stop: 4/B/D at 161st St - Yankee Stadium. My salary will be at least 55k, which is their standard starting salary. However, it might be higher based on my previous work experience.
This is my basic question: I'll have a couple extra days of free time during the upcoming NYC trip, and I'd like to spend it in a way that's semi-productive in helping me think about where I should look for apartments once the time finally comes to do so. As someone who's pretty familiar with NYC overall but hasn't spent any time in the UES, where should I be looking? If you think UES is a good option, where would you recommend walking around to get a feel for the area?
Additional background info:
My goal is a 1-bedroom (maybe a studio if it's not tiny) with the potential for my girlfriend to move in eventually. I would not be interested in living with roommates. I hope to find a place for 1500 or less. Subway will be the main mode of transportation.
Brooklyn and Astoria are routinely recommended, and I'm familiar with these areas. If I were going to work in, say, midtown or lower Manhattan, I would love to live in Brooklyn and would happily live in Astoria. But I'm concerned that the distance to the Bronx job essentially rules them out. Even living in one of the more desirable Brooklyn neighborhoods (Brooklyn Heights, Park Slope, etc.) would appear to mean at least 2 solid hours of commuting every workday -- not an appealing prospect.
Upper East Side: Commuting from just anywhere in the UES would be a dream come true. Based on past AskMe questions, the UES sounds like a pretty dull place to live, but more affordable than most places in Manhattan. Of course, I am still concerned about affordability. I've been checking CraigsList and there seem to be reasonable 1-bedrooms for 1500/mo. or less on a daily basis, though it's hard to judge a place without seeing it.
The Bronx: I'm not particularly interested in living here unless people strongly recommend it (with a more specific comment than "Why not live in the Bronx?"). My girlfriend would be nervous about the relatively high crime rate, etc.
Any tips?
OK, here's the situation. I live in upstate New York (a few hours away from the city), where I have a job that's scheduled to end next summer. Next week I'm going to NYC for a job interview. Let's assume for the sake of this thread that I'll get the job (which, to make a long story short, is pretty likely). I'll be scheduled to start in early fall of next year, after my current upstate job ends.
I have read lots of AskMe questions about finding an apartment in NYC, so I realize that it's impossible to find a place this early since you can't start looking earlier than 4-6 weeks in advance.
The job will be in the Bronx. Subway stop: 4/B/D at 161st St - Yankee Stadium. My salary will be at least 55k, which is their standard starting salary. However, it might be higher based on my previous work experience.
This is my basic question: I'll have a couple extra days of free time during the upcoming NYC trip, and I'd like to spend it in a way that's semi-productive in helping me think about where I should look for apartments once the time finally comes to do so. As someone who's pretty familiar with NYC overall but hasn't spent any time in the UES, where should I be looking? If you think UES is a good option, where would you recommend walking around to get a feel for the area?
Additional background info:
My goal is a 1-bedroom (maybe a studio if it's not tiny) with the potential for my girlfriend to move in eventually. I would not be interested in living with roommates. I hope to find a place for 1500 or less. Subway will be the main mode of transportation.
Brooklyn and Astoria are routinely recommended, and I'm familiar with these areas. If I were going to work in, say, midtown or lower Manhattan, I would love to live in Brooklyn and would happily live in Astoria. But I'm concerned that the distance to the Bronx job essentially rules them out. Even living in one of the more desirable Brooklyn neighborhoods (Brooklyn Heights, Park Slope, etc.) would appear to mean at least 2 solid hours of commuting every workday -- not an appealing prospect.
Upper East Side: Commuting from just anywhere in the UES would be a dream come true. Based on past AskMe questions, the UES sounds like a pretty dull place to live, but more affordable than most places in Manhattan. Of course, I am still concerned about affordability. I've been checking CraigsList and there seem to be reasonable 1-bedrooms for 1500/mo. or less on a daily basis, though it's hard to judge a place without seeing it.
The Bronx: I'm not particularly interested in living here unless people strongly recommend it (with a more specific comment than "Why not live in the Bronx?"). My girlfriend would be nervous about the relatively high crime rate, etc.
Any tips?
Response by poster: I should add that Washington Heights, Inwood, etc., don't seem like viable options given the subway routes.
posted by Jaltcoh at 9:28 AM on December 8, 2009
posted by Jaltcoh at 9:28 AM on December 8, 2009
No, I wouldn't think so.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:29 AM on December 8, 2009
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:29 AM on December 8, 2009
Best answer: If the Upper East Side is too dull, you could go slightly north into East Harlem where 1500 dollars would probably get you a very nice place. The neighborhood is a lot safer than it's been in past years, there's a lot of newly renovated housing stock and they've even put a new Costco-anchored shopping center over on the East River.
posted by JaredSeth at 9:35 AM on December 8, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by JaredSeth at 9:35 AM on December 8, 2009 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I lived on 99th and Lexington for two and a half years (2004-6), and there was plenty going on. Not immediately by my apartment (which was across from the bus hub - FUN), but certainly on Third Avenue and Second Avenue in the 70s, 80s and 90s. Lots of shopping, bars, restaurants. I liked living a little away from the business, because it was (a little) quieter, and I was two and a half blocks from the 6 train. When you get here, take the 4/5 to 59th St., and walk up to 86th St (the next express stop) along Second and Third Avenue.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:36 AM on December 8, 2009
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:36 AM on December 8, 2009
Best answer: UES (specifically from 82nd to 89th Street, and York to Lexington). This would be ideal because the express train, (4 train) at 86 and Lex will give you a fairly short commute. There's shopping on 86th and a bunch of restaurants/bars on 2nd Ave... just don't look for any nightlife... or 'cool spots'.
If the length of your commute isn't a deciding factor, and non-boring is important, try Downtown Brooklyn/ Boerum Hill, but remember, if you live someplace central and close to transportation, the entire city is your neighborhood.
Disclaimer: I live int the Bronx near 161st and Yankee Stadium
posted by Stu-Pendous at 9:45 AM on December 8, 2009
If the length of your commute isn't a deciding factor, and non-boring is important, try Downtown Brooklyn/ Boerum Hill, but remember, if you live someplace central and close to transportation, the entire city is your neighborhood.
Disclaimer: I live int the Bronx near 161st and Yankee Stadium
posted by Stu-Pendous at 9:45 AM on December 8, 2009
Best answer: Why wouldn't the 116 streets and higher B/D stops in Manhattan be an option? I'd be surprised if you could find something comfortable for two people on UES at your price.
posted by Mavri at 9:53 AM on December 8, 2009
posted by Mavri at 9:53 AM on December 8, 2009
Best answer: Yes, there's lots of new apartment buildings on or near Frederick Douglass, especially between 110th and 125th.
posted by plastic_animals at 9:56 AM on December 8, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by plastic_animals at 9:56 AM on December 8, 2009 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: It's worth noting that a subway ride from, say, Atlantic Avenue station to 161st Street on the 4 train is 38 minutes, according to Google Maps.
I still think I'd be spending at least 2 hours a day commuting. Using your example, let's say I'm lucky enough to find a great apartment just a 6-minute walk from the Atlantic Ave station. And let's say my walk to work from the 161st St station is also 6 minutes. That's 50 minutes just going one way. Add a few minutes since I'll want to feel confident about showing up on time at my new job every day, and sometimes you have to pass up a subway car in the morning because there's just no room. So, to be optimistic, it'll take me a solid hour from the time I leave my apartment to the time I show up at work. Then I need to do the same thing to get back home after work. That makes at least 2 hours a day.
posted by Jaltcoh at 10:03 AM on December 8, 2009
I still think I'd be spending at least 2 hours a day commuting. Using your example, let's say I'm lucky enough to find a great apartment just a 6-minute walk from the Atlantic Ave station. And let's say my walk to work from the 161st St station is also 6 minutes. That's 50 minutes just going one way. Add a few minutes since I'll want to feel confident about showing up on time at my new job every day, and sometimes you have to pass up a subway car in the morning because there's just no room. So, to be optimistic, it'll take me a solid hour from the time I leave my apartment to the time I show up at work. Then I need to do the same thing to get back home after work. That makes at least 2 hours a day.
posted by Jaltcoh at 10:03 AM on December 8, 2009
Response by poster: Oh, lower/east Harlem is certainly an option. I just don't know much about it. I probably should have mentioned it in the original post.
posted by Jaltcoh at 10:08 AM on December 8, 2009
posted by Jaltcoh at 10:08 AM on December 8, 2009
Best answer: East Harlem can be great, depending on exactly where you are. Walk around the neighborhood. At night.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:27 AM on December 8, 2009
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:27 AM on December 8, 2009
Best answer: I don't think it would be a bad idea to spend the few days checking out places currently advertised on Craigslist, in your budget. You can look at places on the UES, to get a feel for what $1500 will get you there, distance to the subway, etc. and then compare with similar features in some of the other neighborhoods suggested. You might even want to keep track of what Craigslist apartments you saw and liked (or saw and didn't like), so that you have an address or building name or contact information to start with when you move here eventually, bearing in mind of course that the rental market may have shifted by then. If you do that, I probably wouldn't mention that you're not looking to move until the fall; if you recontact people in the fall they probably won't remember you or you can say your job plans shifted and now you're ready to move.
The past few years I've had a number of friends live in the 90s on the east side, generally in big buildings that seem like they're probably out of your price range. I haven't looked on the UES myself, but if I was interested in living near there, I might look in the low 100s, because my impression is that the neighbor is still cheaper than 96th and below, but close enough that you can derive the benefits (stores, restaurants, etc) from the 80s and 90s.
posted by Caz721 at 10:34 AM on December 8, 2009
The past few years I've had a number of friends live in the 90s on the east side, generally in big buildings that seem like they're probably out of your price range. I haven't looked on the UES myself, but if I was interested in living near there, I might look in the low 100s, because my impression is that the neighbor is still cheaper than 96th and below, but close enough that you can derive the benefits (stores, restaurants, etc) from the 80s and 90s.
posted by Caz721 at 10:34 AM on December 8, 2009
Best answer: Oh, lower/east Harlem is certainly an option. I just don't know much about it. I probably should have mentioned it in the original post.
Yeah lower/east Harlem isn't bad at all. You can get a pretty decent living space for a pretty decent (by NYC standards) price. I lived for a while in west Harlem and was fine. Lower Harlem, thanks in part to the Columbia takeover, is gentrifying really quickly, which is good and bad. It's a nice neck of the woods. Lots of great eateries, bars, grocery stores. The area just north of the northern end of Central Park is actually one of my favorite little neighborhoods in New York.
I also lived in Wash Heights for a bit, and I agree you don't want to be there. It's not a great place to live generally (well, I didn't like it much), and the commute wouldn't make any sense for you really.
UES is pretty meh, imo. Really spendy for very little space and few good eating/drinking/shopping joints.
So yeah, Harlem or Queens would be my advice. Also consider that securing an apartment in NYC can be a real pain and things tend to get down to the wire - so mere availability might be a factor. I remember once looking at an apt in Manhattan at the same time as someone else and the two of us literally racing - on foot, through midtown - back to the real estate office to try and sign the papers first. So keep that in mind. An early start is key.
posted by Lutoslawski at 10:43 AM on December 8, 2009 [1 favorite]
Yeah lower/east Harlem isn't bad at all. You can get a pretty decent living space for a pretty decent (by NYC standards) price. I lived for a while in west Harlem and was fine. Lower Harlem, thanks in part to the Columbia takeover, is gentrifying really quickly, which is good and bad. It's a nice neck of the woods. Lots of great eateries, bars, grocery stores. The area just north of the northern end of Central Park is actually one of my favorite little neighborhoods in New York.
I also lived in Wash Heights for a bit, and I agree you don't want to be there. It's not a great place to live generally (well, I didn't like it much), and the commute wouldn't make any sense for you really.
UES is pretty meh, imo. Really spendy for very little space and few good eating/drinking/shopping joints.
So yeah, Harlem or Queens would be my advice. Also consider that securing an apartment in NYC can be a real pain and things tend to get down to the wire - so mere availability might be a factor. I remember once looking at an apt in Manhattan at the same time as someone else and the two of us literally racing - on foot, through midtown - back to the real estate office to try and sign the papers first. So keep that in mind. An early start is key.
posted by Lutoslawski at 10:43 AM on December 8, 2009 [1 favorite]
You're going to need to check your math here.
You say you will earn $55,000, and want to spend an upper limit of $1,500 per month in rent.
$55,000 annually is $4,583.33 per month. Factor in federal, state, and local taxes and assume you take home $2,291.66 after taxes each month.
Subtract rent from that and you are left with $791.66 to spend on commuting costs, food, clothing, going out, paying utilities, etc.
If we assume that all taxes will only consume 40% of your take home pay, then you are left with around $1,200 per month, which, while better, is not ideal.
Pretty much not going to happen.
Manhattan is a very expensive place to live and $55,000, while a nice salary in most places, is pretty much a salary level at which you need to have a roommate.
And this is not even getting into the whole problem of convincing a landlord that you can pay your rent.
posted by dfriedman at 10:57 AM on December 8, 2009
You say you will earn $55,000, and want to spend an upper limit of $1,500 per month in rent.
$55,000 annually is $4,583.33 per month. Factor in federal, state, and local taxes and assume you take home $2,291.66 after taxes each month.
Subtract rent from that and you are left with $791.66 to spend on commuting costs, food, clothing, going out, paying utilities, etc.
If we assume that all taxes will only consume 40% of your take home pay, then you are left with around $1,200 per month, which, while better, is not ideal.
Pretty much not going to happen.
Manhattan is a very expensive place to live and $55,000, while a nice salary in most places, is pretty much a salary level at which you need to have a roommate.
And this is not even getting into the whole problem of convincing a landlord that you can pay your rent.
posted by dfriedman at 10:57 AM on December 8, 2009
Best answer: I lived in Washington Heights for a while and I'd say that it'd definitely a very viable option for getting to the stadium quickly. All you do is take the A from 181st or 190th to 145th (3-4 stops) and transfer to the D. From the D its two stops to Yankee Stadium. You can do it in 15 minutes if you catch a transfer. I'd say try out the various commutes. You'll see that Washheights/inwood works out nicely.
You can find nice 1 BR's on the Hudson river side for ~1200-1500 a month. You won't regret it. It's a great neighborhood.
posted by jourman2 at 11:32 AM on December 8, 2009
You can find nice 1 BR's on the Hudson river side for ~1200-1500 a month. You won't regret it. It's a great neighborhood.
posted by jourman2 at 11:32 AM on December 8, 2009
Response by poster: driedman: I said I'll earn at least 55k but quite possibly more. That's the baseline salary for someone straight out of law school, but I'll have 3 years of good post-law-school experience. I just don't know, and I'm not going to ask before I have a job offer.
And I mentioned 1500/mo. as a ceiling. I would be disappointed if I end up having to pay that much. I agree that if it turns out I'm making only 55k, I should look for cheaper places. I'm hoping to pay more like 1200-1300 or less; if this means living in Harlem or Astoria, so be it.
posted by Jaltcoh at 11:32 AM on December 8, 2009
And I mentioned 1500/mo. as a ceiling. I would be disappointed if I end up having to pay that much. I agree that if it turns out I'm making only 55k, I should look for cheaper places. I'm hoping to pay more like 1200-1300 or less; if this means living in Harlem or Astoria, so be it.
posted by Jaltcoh at 11:32 AM on December 8, 2009
Response by poster: jourman2: Hmm, interesting! Yes, I'll consider Wash Hts/Inwood now.
posted by Jaltcoh at 11:38 AM on December 8, 2009
posted by Jaltcoh at 11:38 AM on December 8, 2009
Best answer: Well, I would seriously consider looking at Washington Heights given your upper rent limit.
What I would do is go to Washington Heights while you are here in NYC and take the A line from 168th/175th/181st to 145th and transfer to the D up to Yankee Stadium.
See if it's an acceptable commute for you.
I live in Washington Heights and commute on the A to midtown in about 15 minutes.
posted by dfriedman at 11:40 AM on December 8, 2009
What I would do is go to Washington Heights while you are here in NYC and take the A line from 168th/175th/181st to 145th and transfer to the D up to Yankee Stadium.
See if it's an acceptable commute for you.
I live in Washington Heights and commute on the A to midtown in about 15 minutes.
posted by dfriedman at 11:40 AM on December 8, 2009
You should be able to find 1 BRs in Harlem for that kind of rent. I live in the part of the neighborhood that Lutoslawski was talking about (just north of Central Park), and my 2 BR is only a few hundred dollars more than your $1500 limit.
posted by ocherdraco at 11:48 AM on December 8, 2009
posted by ocherdraco at 11:48 AM on December 8, 2009
Response by poster: For your price range, boring is good.
Agreed. BTW, I didn't mean to put too much emphasis on evaluating how boring/exciting the UES is. I don't eat out very often (prefer to cook at home), and I assume I'd usually be taking the subway when I do.
posted by Jaltcoh at 12:01 PM on December 8, 2009
Agreed. BTW, I didn't mean to put too much emphasis on evaluating how boring/exciting the UES is. I don't eat out very often (prefer to cook at home), and I assume I'd usually be taking the subway when I do.
posted by Jaltcoh at 12:01 PM on December 8, 2009
Response by poster: Keep in mind that you can take a bus, walk, or bike to work, too.
Good point about the walking. I like to walk. I don't see myself biking through the Bronx in a suit and tie, though.
posted by Jaltcoh at 12:03 PM on December 8, 2009
Good point about the walking. I like to walk. I don't see myself biking through the Bronx in a suit and tie, though.
posted by Jaltcoh at 12:03 PM on December 8, 2009
I haven't dealt with the company myself but friends of mine have found decent places in Harlem at reasonable NYC rents from gonofee.com.
I, too, live just a few blocks north of Central Park. A couple of local blogs, Harlem Bespoke and HarlemCondoLife often have information about neighborhood real estate.
posted by plastic_animals at 12:09 PM on December 8, 2009
I, too, live just a few blocks north of Central Park. A couple of local blogs, Harlem Bespoke and HarlemCondoLife often have information about neighborhood real estate.
posted by plastic_animals at 12:09 PM on December 8, 2009
You should also be aware that many if not most landlords will either want you to make 40 times the rent annually or to have a guarantor (who usually has to be in-state).
posted by JaredSeth at 12:15 PM on December 8, 2009
posted by JaredSeth at 12:15 PM on December 8, 2009
Response by poster: You should also be aware that many if not most landlords will either want you to make 40 times the rent annually
I know... So, to rent a place for 1500, I'd need to be making 60k, which is likely. If I turn out to be making only 55k, I'll have to look for 1375/mo. or less. I'm fine with that.
posted by Jaltcoh at 12:38 PM on December 8, 2009
I know... So, to rent a place for 1500, I'd need to be making 60k, which is likely. If I turn out to be making only 55k, I'll have to look for 1375/mo. or less. I'm fine with that.
posted by Jaltcoh at 12:38 PM on December 8, 2009
I don't think the area around Yankee Stadium has worse crime than areas of Washington Heights, although I certainly wouldn't swear to it. I have no idea what your girlfriend thinks the Bronx is like these days, but you might want to look into the current reality. I bet you could get a much nicer place around where you'll be working. The area immediately around the courthouse has a lovely little park and is a long way from Bonfire of the Vanities (which is what I always think about when I'm there.)
(Also, even if you get credit for three years of practice and a higher salary, $1200-1300 is going to be painful, unless you're quite confident your gf will be moving in and taking some of the cost. YMMV of course--it's a personal decision whether the spend the money on rent vs looking in a less desirable area or living in a smaller apt.)
posted by Mavri at 1:19 PM on December 8, 2009
(Also, even if you get credit for three years of practice and a higher salary, $1200-1300 is going to be painful, unless you're quite confident your gf will be moving in and taking some of the cost. YMMV of course--it's a personal decision whether the spend the money on rent vs looking in a less desirable area or living in a smaller apt.)
posted by Mavri at 1:19 PM on December 8, 2009
Response by poster: unless you're quite confident your gf will be moving in and taking some of the cost
No, I'm not assuming this at all.
posted by Jaltcoh at 1:21 PM on December 8, 2009
No, I'm not assuming this at all.
posted by Jaltcoh at 1:21 PM on December 8, 2009
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posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:28 AM on December 8, 2009