Help me find my station (wagon) in life.

May 25, 2009 3:13 PM

The time comes in every man's life -- the time when he considers buying a station wagon as his next car. Difficulty: a cheaper, used one. Help me out.

Almost 2 years ago, my wife and I decided to be a one car family. I take public transportation to work everyday (by choice -- I did even when I had a car, and will continue to), and I figured that I didn't quite need my own car. Worst case scenario, if she had the car, I'd use Zipcar, blah blah blah. We sold both of our older vehicles and we settled on a lovely, fun Honda Fit.

My wife's commute changed. The Fit has become less and less available to me. I've found myself renting a van or borrowing a truck to haul things that won't fit in the Fit. I've discovered the awful time pressures and surprising expense of using a car sharing service. Even though I'll only end up using it once a week, I think it's time for me to go back to having my own car.

Here's where things get weird. I think I want a station wagon. A good one! One with lots of torque and decent enough performance, enough space in back to hold a pinball machine (with the legs and backboard taken off), perhaps one of those rear-facing thirds seat for potential future additions to the family. One of those safe boat-like things. One that my nearly 6'5" self can get in and out of and sit upright in relatively easily. One with over 22-23 mpg city/highway average. And, oh yeah, since I'll end up only driving this thing a handful of times a month, I really don't want to pay more than around $6000 or so.

Folly? That's what I'm here to find out. (Yes, I've checked on insurance costs, in case that was your first thought.)

I've been looking at the Craigslist ads for used Volvo V70s and Mercedes E320s in the "10 years old and 130k" range of things, and I generally like what I see. I live in California, where the idea of buying a 10 year old car doesn't seem all that ridiculous. But there's part of me that thinks that I'm likely getting myself into a nice, shiny money pit, and there's another part of me that has trouble with the fact that I'm considering buying a Mercedes, even if it's a beater.

Anyone with experience with performance wagons that are on the older side who can guide me?

posted by eschatfische to travel & transportation (39 comments total)

My boyfriend has a VW Passat wagon (turbo) that he loves. It is a 2004 with low mileage and was significantly more expensive than what you want (I think like $12k), but I think 2000s and before are generally closer to your range. His performs really well and is very comfortable. If you fold down the back seats, it holds a ton of stuff.
posted by ishotjr at 3:20 PM on May 25 [1 favorite]

I will suggest taking a peek at the Honda Element. While it's not a station wagon, it is THE Bee's Knees at hauling stuff around, and the rest of it isn't bad, either. I have an 04 that I got specifically to haul tons of equipment to LAN parties, camping trips, and gaming / anime conventions that I am staff on, and it has been a wonderful blessing. It handles the roads as well as dirt trails, does decent mileage (22-24 MPG), and fits me well (6'4"). Also, it can seat 4 people easily, and is a cinch to clean the inside of.

They were cheap originally, as they were marketed to Gen Y / Extreme Sport kids just out of college, but the older generation snatched them up, they were such a good bargain. Prices have gone up on later models, but you might be lucky with an older year.
posted by GJSchaller at 3:21 PM on May 25

The e320 will be a torquemonster, the V70 won't. You might also want to look at Subaru, but they tend to be built for HP over torque.

But there's part of me that thinks that I'm likely getting myself into a nice, shiny money pit, and there's another part of me that has trouble with the fact that I'm considering buying a Mercedes, even if it's a beater.

MBZs often make very good used cars, but they can get expensive. I got a number of trouble-free years out of my C280, but this year a lot of things broke. I'm still well within my budget, and spending a lot less than if I had bought or leased a new car.

I don't remember exactly when, but Audi, BMW, and Mercedes have all started bringing their "sportswagons" to the US in the last ten years. BMW has 3- and 5- series wagons. Mercedes ahs C- and E- class wagons. Audi does an A3 and A4 wagon, but the RS6 Avant might be the only way to get an A6-size wagon (complete with stupid-fast engine).

You might also look into the smaller wagons and hatchbacks - Ford Focus Wagon, VW Golf, A3, etc.
posted by b1tr0t at 3:25 PM on May 25

You want a Roadmaster stationwagon (Buick I think) or it's equivalent Chevy/GM. Gas hogs but you are not using it as a daily driver so who cares.
posted by patnok at 3:32 PM on May 25

http://www.bowtieclassic.com/Pictures%20new/4-2-06%20010.jpg
posted by patnok at 3:33 PM on May 25

link


there finally!
posted by patnok at 3:35 PM on May 25

Consider a minivan. More room, better mileage. Town and Country and Grand Caravan can haul 4X8 sheets of plywood with the hatch closed
posted by Redhush at 3:46 PM on May 25

Redhush has a great suggestion - a used Chrysler minivan would be very affordable yet offer the gas mileage and space that you need.

I have a Hyundai Santa Fe, which is a lot like a station wagon. The rear window opens separately from the hatch, which makes it GREAT for hauling things like baseboards, trees, lap siding, PVC pipes, and labrador retrievers.
posted by Ostara at 3:52 PM on May 25

Just to clarify, I've owned a minivan and an SUV in the past, and my hope is to avoid going back in that direction. I really like the deceptively sporty handling, decent mileage and cargo-hauling ability of our Fit Sport, but it's just a little too small. My hope was to find something inbetween the Fit and the minivan/SUV space, and the larger "sportswagons" b1tr0t mentioned seem to fit the bill.
posted by eschatfische at 3:58 PM on May 25

My husband is about your height, and he loves his 1999 Saab 9-5 wagon. I drive a Saab, too, albeit a different model, and I am always surprised by how powerful and roomy his car is. He paid about $8500 for it a year ago, and it had about 70,000 miles on it then. I bet you could find something close to your budget in a Saab; there are a few on Ebay near your price range right now. This 2003 Saab Arc wagon is very highly regarded by Saabophiles, although since it's newer it might be tough to find one in your budget. I know these examples aren't in CA, but I thought they would give you an idea of what's out there.

My sister-in-law drove a Passat wagon and that's also a very nice option.
posted by katie at 4:09 PM on May 25

If you you want even more space (width!) than a V70 and a decent price plus a virtually unbreakable car, consider looking into the last years of the Volvo 945 production, which ended in 1989. They tried to upgrade the old model to make it less look-me-coming-from-the-eighties in the last few convulsions before the model was discontinued.
They do have the six-seat option for kids in the back; one needs to buy some extra seats for that.
I've been packing almost anything into mine, I even drove an antique grand piano in it (not as wide as the modern ones, agreed). They're a little boring but they have a very good reputation with car repair people here in Sweden. And they almost turn on the spot. No front-drive car does that. They were safe for their time, and are sure safer than many minivans. There's the 960 too, same back, better front, more power.
posted by Namlit at 4:14 PM on May 25

Protege5?
posted by one_bean at 4:16 PM on May 25

Go for a sweet E34 BMW 525iT. Here's one for next to nothing in the Bay Area. They're great cars, and the 2.5L inline six is one of the greatest engines ever made, bar none.
posted by saladin at 4:23 PM on May 25 [1 favorite]

Subarus actually tend to favor torque over horsepower. At least with the 2.5L engine. I just don't know if they're big enough for your needs.

Seconding looking at a Buick Roadmaster. They're probably pretty cheap by now.
posted by krisak at 4:44 PM on May 25

Everybody but everybody has Subarus in Juneau. It isn't uncommon for me to park between two wagons of the same make/model/color as mine. The Forrester is a nice vehicle, although the new model is more of a RAV4. I own a Legacy Outback about 8 years old. It is a stick. It is a little slow to get up to speed but handles really well in icy weather. It can hold quite a bit, although the Forrester has more height inside. The lack of choice of wiper speeds drives me crazy in this wet climate. The gas mileage isn't bad for an all-wheel drive vehicle. I would buy this model again.
posted by Foam Pants at 4:45 PM on May 25 [1 favorite]

Sounds like you want a Subaru Forrester. Make sure you get one with the turbocharged engine.
Any higher performance European car for $6000 is going to be a money pit of maintenance and repair. I work for a European car maker, so trust me, they get expensive.
A Subaru might incur some significant repairs or maintenance, if you're looking in the 6k price range, but not nearly that of a European.

If you're really set on a fast, fun station wagon for occasional driving, though, I can make a couple great recommendations:

Audi S4 Avant. 4.2 liter V8 with about 350 horsepower. Their V8 is really reliable and that transmission isn't really prone to many problems. The A4 range doesn't have too many electronic doo-dads that fail, either. You might find some 2.7turbo S4s in your price range, but don't be tempted. They are potentially huge money pits, so make sure it's been extremely well maintained. Buy one from a fanatical enthusiast with all of their records.

They make a similar A6 Avant with the 4.2. It's not as fast, but the trade off is the size of the car. The previous generations of A6 have some predictable problems, but they're easy to fix. Look for one that has CV boots/axles and a prop-shaft seal done recently.

The Allroad might look tempting, too. But don't do it. It's heavier than the A6 and has features like adjustable air suspension that fails more often than you'll find it useful.

The A3 is a sharp little car but make sure you see the service records before you buy one. I mean, really make sure. The four-door VW GTI is a much better bet. It has fewer problems and you get an identical car for less money. It's definitely NOT big enough for a pinball machine, though. But the DSG transmission is not overhyped. It's phenomenal.

Avoid, at all costs, 1.8Turbo VWs and Audis, Especially with an automatic trans. They might look like a sweet compromise between torque and economy, but they're problem prone. Especially in front-wheel drive. I can't emphasize that enough.

The BMW 5 series station wagon is also a pretty sweet ride.

For what it's worth, I think Volvos are fine, albeit boring.

The fast Euro-wagons are awesome sleepers! But six grand in that arena might be getting you into trouble. For one in good condition, you might be looking at more like $8k. A very fun and worth it $8k.

The Japanese fast-wagons are probably a safer bet, but after you drive some of the Germans, they'll feel like tin cans. Cheap, reliable, fun tin cans.
posted by Jon-o at 4:45 PM on May 25 [2 favorites]

Subarus and Audis are nice cars, but I would stay far away from anything with a turbo or AWD in the 100k+ range. AWD systems are mechanically complex and expensive to maintain, Turbos are high-wear components and put additional strain on your engine.

For a high-miles car, you really can't beat a 2.5-3.2 liter inline six with RWD.
posted by b1tr0t at 5:07 PM on May 25

A Saab 9-5 Arc or Aero wagon in the 2002 or 2003 vintage could suit you. Torque, mass, performance, space. No third row seat, though. They aren't exactly low-maintenance cars but you should be able to to make up for it with the discount vs. equally fun European wagons of the same age and mileage. (Saab has never been a good resale car, and with the make likely being phased out of the US mass market, even less so.)
posted by MattD at 5:13 PM on May 25

b1tr0t, I agree about turbos. They're like a crazy girlfriend. They're a blast when they're good, but it's only a matter of time before catastrophic failure.

About AWD, I have to disagree. Audi AWD (except A3 and TT) is purely mechanical and is extremely simple consisting of a 100% mechanical center differential integral to the transmission. It suffers very few failures and require no maintenance.
Subaru AWD is different and has a viscous coupling center differential which, I believe, requires more maintenance. I can't speak for their reliability, though.
posted by Jon-o at 5:34 PM on May 25 [1 favorite]

Volvo 240GL wagon. Big. Boxy. Mechanically very simple and so inexpensive to maintain. And, men who drive Volvos are hot.

Check out this picture of a 240 leaping over trucks, as if Evil Knievel is driving. Just try THAT in a wussy Mercedes.

(We bought a 1992 model in 1999. The odometer broke shortly before the 250k mile mark. So not sure of the mileage now but it's a lot, and it's still going strong. We like the V70s too but the 240s have more room in the back)
posted by txvtchick at 5:40 PM on May 25

Seconding the VW Passat wagon. I bought my 2000 model in '01 and have put about 160k on it. The only work done has been regular maintenance: regular oil changes, tune up every other year and last year oxy sensors. Soon I'll be doing the timing belt and flushing the coolant and transmission fluid.

It's only a 1.8 turbo, but it can haul loads and flies on the freeway. Excellent mileage too.

Once a guy backed into this car with his Jeep cherokee and left me with a scratch and broken signal light. The entire quarter panel on his jeep was destroyed. My insurance adjuster laughed at his cherokee and said my car was built like a tank. Man, I love the thing!
posted by snsranch at 5:42 PM on May 25

This is going to sound like an oddball suggestion -- but have you considered a PT Cruiser? Seriously. My significant other bought a used one, and you would not believe the crap he can cram in there. If you left the hatch up, a pinball table would fit, no prob. A bedroom set from IKEA -- bedframe and chest and night tables and all? Check. With the seats down (or better yet, out) it's got more room than you'd belive. I checked the local CL here (Vancouver) and the first hit was a '03 for 6K. It gets pretty good mileage, as well. Torque, not so much, but I might be biased because I drive a 1.8T VW with more torque than I need.
posted by cgg at 5:46 PM on May 25

Don't get a post-Saab Saab. Well, at least if you ever drove and loved an older Saab. There's no Saab left in them. It's a Saab story... :) We were very disappointed with our 2001 93.

Check consumer reports online for their projected reliability for cars from ages past.

I'd go with a Japanese car. They'll have much higher average reliability than anything European.
posted by reddot at 6:14 PM on May 25

Or for that matter a older Jeep Cherokee. 2wd with the 4.0 liter. get a 2dr take out the back seat. lots of room. dependable & easy/cheap to fix.

My sister-in-law had one of those sleds that I suggested earlier it had a 350ci corvette motor in it. That's what you want. Forget all that European crap. get something Joe mechanic down the street (or you) can fix with parts from the local auto parts store. If I'm not mistaken your requirements are : Haul a load when needed. Not a daily driver. Cheap to fix/maintain. Able to "look" like a bad ass ride. Check out the links at the bottom of the page. Buy American!
posted by patnok at 6:23 PM on May 25

I am a 6' tall male with a station wagon. I love it for all the reasons you list above. It's a 1994 Volvo 940 wagon. It can and has hauled: a commercial grade stair climber, a trailered boat, a flagstone patio (several loads), 12 college students, dogs, dressers and dozens of pounds of pork barbecue. Sometimes you have to leave the hatch open. Other times, you have to latch things to the roof. It gets about 22 mpg on the highway.

The Volvo 960 wagon would meet your torque needs. I believe they stopped making the 940/960 in the late 1990s.

Anecdotally, German cars are expensive to repair, so you may want to avoid these, especially if you are purchasing an older car.
posted by Andy's Gross Wart at 6:44 PM on May 25 [1 favorite]

I love the Honda Element, but it definitely does not meet your requirements. Any with automatic transmissions accelerate sluggishly, and you'd have to find one with extremely high mileage to hit that price range. It can fit everything and a half in it though and has great mileage (25 mpg) 6 years later.
posted by miscbuff at 7:15 PM on May 25

I own both a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a Ford Freestyle. The Freestyle is wider, taller, and longer, and carries a hell of a lot more cargo.
posted by megatherium at 7:40 PM on May 25

I have a Volvo 240 wagon. Some good points: it's not that powerful in the grand scheme of things, but it's definitely noticeably more powerful than the Fit. (My girlfriend has a Fit. I have no basis for comparing it to the other cars mentioned here, though.) I've been to SF a few times and it has no trouble with the hills. It is very maneuverable, with an extremely tight turning radius. It has lots of room, and some have the third seat in the back. Until last year it was totally reliable as far as major things go. They are very cheap these days.

Bad points: it has been plagued with minor electrical problems, which is apparently pretty common. The phantom warning lights aren't that big a deal, but the failed relay which disabled fourth gear was pretty annoying. (There was nothing wrong with the transmission, the electronics just thought that the overdrive-off button was permanently pressed.) Mileage isn't that great; about 20-22, for both highway and city. They may finally be showing their age; mine has been having some trouble the last couple of years, and now has a too-expensive-to-fix transmission leak.

I wouldn't count on one of them lasting more than a couple more years, but if you decide to make "cheap" the important factor, you could probably do a lot worse.
posted by equalpants at 8:21 PM on May 25

Don't get me wrong, I love shopping for cars with other peoples hypothetical money. But we're kind of rehashing some pretty usual used car territory. Japanese cars are going to be cheap and reliable, Europeans are going to be alternately really nice or really broken, and Domestics are going to be tanks that are easy to fix. The best thing to do is test drive a few cars and see how they feel. Try:
Audi A6 Avant
BMW 5 Series wagon
Caprice (or GM variant) Wagon. These will be wallowy and kind of a big pudding. So avoid the turd 5.0 engine and get the 5.7 for some ass-hauling.
Subaru Forrester

Bigger vehicles like Jeeps, even though that 4.0 is maybe the best engine on Earth, handle like trucks and might be lacking the performance you're looking for.

The best piece of car-buying wisdom that was ever given to me is as follows:

FAST CHEAP RELIABLE
You can pick two.

As far as I'm concerned, there are a ton of awesome, fun station wagons out there. A wagon is a great choice, since it typically has more quirky style than its sedan counterpart while still remaining kind of anonymous looking. But don't fall for the minivan/crossover trap. They're all anonymous and no cajones.

If you ask me, driving something a hand-full of times per month is a reason to spend MORE on a car, rather than less. Buy a cheap beater to subject to the wear and tear of a daily driver. But if you're only using the car once a week, get something you're going to really enjoy when you drive it. If it needs a little more maintenance, that's fine, because it'll take you longer to put the miles on it.
Full disclosure: I talked my friend into an RS4. Ignore me if responsibility is a big priority for you.
posted by Jon-o at 8:25 PM on May 25

Seconding Patnok on the Buick Roadmaster with the 350cu in (5.7l) Chevy V8. The engine is a a heavier and lower HP cousin of the Corvette's.

However, be aware that GM / Buick cars, while they will run to very high mileage (over 200k miles easily) have plenty of weaknesses compared to Hondas, which in my experience are very well engineered and reliable. With a Roadmaster, expect a larger chance of being on a first-name relationship with your garage.

Two common issues to look for with high-mileage Roadmasters: rear windows sagging (easily fixed), missing/broken rear bolts on the exhaust manifold (which can lead to reduced mileage). Also look for any evidence of a coolant leak at the water pump or difficulty starting, which may indicate a compromised Optispark.
posted by zippy at 10:18 PM on May 25

Beware the European cars mentioned. Saabs and Volvos have had all sorts of reliability problems. BMW's and Benzes in the $5-6k range tend to do better, though I'm not sure they'll have the room you're wanting. For good or ill, they're not safe, boat-like things.

In general, carsurvey.org is your friend.

Having noted that you're in the SF area, have you seen this? Sounds like it has more than enough life in it for your needs and cheap! Even if it needs things and you put $2k into it, you're still well under your budget--and you have a car with $2k worth of new stuff.

That one's a bit of a one-off, but those cars from that era, anything built on a Caprice platform, will about survive nuclear war and infants. Caprices and similar from those days are revered in the Middle East, have survived over the years in the face of searing heat, lots of blowing dusty sand, not-great roads and, uh, infrequent maintenance that tends to be the norm in that part of the world.

I drove around Saudi Arabia in a '78 Caprice purchased in 2002. Nothing could stop that car.

As people have noted the Buick and Chevy wagons from the mid-90s have a lot going for 'em. MPG's would probably be a little lower than you'd prefer, but no big deal for the infrequent driving.
posted by ambient2 at 11:45 PM on May 25

Beware the European cars mentioned. Saabs and Volvos have had all sorts of reliability problems
Oh don't throw them all on a heap. Someone above seconded my suggestion of a Volvo 940 - I've been driving a '93 model for ten years, when I sold it it had run more than 160,000 miles. The only issues were a generator that got replaced with a 2nd hand one, and the whatever you call it oil container under the motor, ditto. The rest is maintenance: brakes, exhaust system. And I'm talking about slushy and salty Sweden and a car that got battered about on gravel tracks and stuff.

The older Saabs we see hereabouts are often much rustier than your average elderly Volvo, and in general their reputation in terms of reliability is not as good, yes. Friends have various models of Mercedes station wagons and complain a lot about them. Rust, plastic parts detaching themselves mysteriously, axle bearings that wear out, you name it.
posted by Namlit at 4:48 AM on May 26

You can always look into a toyota matrix. They are station wagon like. I used one (had it as a rental) to move myself into my appartment. The back seats and the fron passenger seat fold down to give you tons of room for things. Plus they are under 20,000 new.
posted by majortom1981 at 4:53 AM on May 26

Before settling on my '93 Volvo 945 Turbo, I drove quite a few trying to find the right car for me. If you're all about the power, take a hard look at the Volvo 960 or 850. I found both to have a good amount of pickup for the amount of Swedish iron they were hauling around. I also drove a V70 and found it to be about the same. Some Volvo enthusiasts will tell you never to buy a Volvo whose name starts with a letter, but I found the V70 to be fine on my test drive, although it did have more gee-whiz luxo-barge type gadgets and I don't know how long before those start to age and fail. If I had it to do all over again, I'd still probably get the 940 turbo because it's the end of the line for the classic B230 red-block engine and has all the engineering fixes that keep them relatively trouble free. Be warned that the same cannot be said for my car's electrical system, which needs more care and attention than my previous cars (Hondas and Toyotas) ever did. (The Brickboard is a must-bookmark if you get an older Volvo. You'd be surprised how many simple things you can fix on these cars with the included tool kit.)

Another car I'd seriously consider looking at would be an early 90's Toyota Camry wagon with the V6. There's one that keeps getting passed around in my family, and while basic inside, the engine just won't die.
posted by 1f2frfbf at 6:33 AM on May 26

I love my Toyota Matrix and would recommend that. It's the 5-door version of the Corolla. I haul band gear in it all the time. It doesn't have quite the interior height of a Jeep, but with the back seats folded down (headrests come off so this is possible) there's an impressive amount of storage space. I bought an '07 model new.
posted by emelenjr at 6:36 AM on May 26

We put 200k miles on a '90 Camry with a V6 before I gave it to my mother. It still works fine, and here in southern New Mexico the paint is only now starting to fade. We bought a Passat, which gets better mileage than the Toyota and is quicker, but I don't expect it to be as durable. And we were very tempted by the Matrix -- you'd never guess from the outside that there's that much room inside.
posted by Killick at 7:51 AM on May 26

Beware the European cars mentioned. Saabs and Volvos have had all sorts of reliability problems

Oh don't throw them all on a heap. Someone above seconded my suggestion of a Volvo 940 - I've been driving a '93 model for ten years, when I sold it it had run more than 160,000 miles.

Older Volvos are tanks. Newer ones definitely have a spottier reputation and I know some years and models in the early 00s had and have serious and ongoing expensive computer problems. If the OP is going to buy a Volvo he should definitely look into the reliability of the specific model he's interested in.
posted by 6550 at 9:16 AM on May 26

Was in the same position as you last year. I ended up looking for and finding a '95 Merc E320 wagon. Betsy (my car) had 127k miles and I paid $6300 -- I couldn't be happier. 1995 is the last year of the W124 chassis Mercedes and is considered by many to be the best-built car *ever*. It's ridiculously over-built and should last another 200k miles with little issue. There's a reason that in many countries you see bazillions of W124s (300E, 260E, 220E, E320, etc.) as taxi cabs -- they're designed to take a butt kicking and keep running.

Should you get one, keep up on the maintenance and it will treat you well. Fix things as they break or wear out (don't "wait" until a few things are wrong, otherwise the repair bill could make you faint). You'll also be well-served to look for a car that's had the head re-built, the engine wiring harness replaced, and if you're lucky a new or rebuilt transmission -- those were three weak points on the car from the factory and in the 15 or whatever years since people have fixed them and in many fixed the original weakness in the part.

Good luck!
posted by lazywhinerkid at 12:53 PM on May 26

P.S. You would be well-served to avoid the W210 chassis cars (1996-2002 E-Class cars). They (along with the W202 C-Class cars) are considered to be much more unreliable and poorly-built than their predecessors -- and from personal experience I can tell you that they are just that.
posted by lazywhinerkid at 12:57 PM on May 26