Um, honey....

January 7, 2009 10:13 AM

How do I tell my SO that he smells bad?

My SO and I have been living together for nine months and are planning to spend the rest of our lives together. We have a great relationship and have no problem communicating about almost anything. But this is not "Honey I really don't like your mother" or "We need to talk about your bedroom skills." I get the sense that he's not very thorough with toilet paper in the bathroom and it makes his ass stink. He usually goes a couple of days without showering which would not be a big deal except for this issue. At times when we're sitting on the couch and he gets up, I smell something that is very unpleasant. Sometimes I can smell it on the couch cushions when he's not even home. I do his laundry and the stains in his underwear are beyond what I would think are normal "skid marks" and I've seen the same on his bathrobe. I brought it up several months ago, after I noticed his bathrobe the first time, and I mentioned that I sometimes smell something that I can't identify and wondered if it was related to the bathrobe stains. He didn't say much but said he would "work on it." At this point I was thinking about buying those moist wipes made for bathroom use and just put them in the bathroom where he'll see them. I just don't know how to say to him that I think he doesn't know how to wipe his own ass.

posted by anonymous to human relations (53 comments total)

Communication is the key to any healthy relationship. You just need to lay it out the way you did here.
posted by jeffamaphone at 10:17 AM on January 7

"You smell bad."
posted by jmmpangaea at 10:20 AM on January 7 [1 favorite]

Just say it.
posted by grabbingsand at 10:23 AM on January 7

You stink. It makes me want to throw up. Start taking showers more often and learn how ot wipe.

Seriously. He's a guy, be direct. Thus subtle stuff most likely won't work.
posted by theichibun at 10:23 AM on January 7 [3 favorites]

"Hey, honey, I really don't feel turned on when I smell you. I would like it if you showered more often/paid more attention to personal hygiene. I bought some body wash and moist wipes for you." Buy him new underwear but don't make a big deal out of it, just put it in his drawer.

When he cleans up, reward him with lots of wild sex. Sex is often a good motivator for men sorry for the stereotype. Positively reward him in some way at every opportunity. Wow, you smell great! *passionate kiss* MMmmm, that cologne drives me wild! *nibbles on ear*
posted by desjardins at 10:24 AM on January 7 [3 favorites]

The wet wipes are a godsend. Cleanliness is easy to attain with those.

Not that I would know or anything.
posted by grubi at 10:25 AM on January 7 [2 favorites]

Looks like nobody ever taught this guys how to wipe. "Skid marks" shouldn't ever appear, not in light or heavy form. Tell him that he has to wipe his little tushy after pooping until the toilet paper no longer comes away soiled.

And it's not just a "you smell" issue, it's a serious health issue for you, your potential future family, and especially your SO.
posted by Grither at 10:25 AM on January 7 [1 favorite]

I do his laundry and the stains in his underwear are beyond what I would think are normal "skid marks" and I've seen the same on his bathrobe.

Skid marks are not 'normal'. At all. He needs to know this, and wipe his damned arse. This is entirely his problem and he needs to wipe like a grown up. I'm not sure subtle will work, here, as he's obviously clueless.
posted by Brockles at 10:28 AM on January 7

"Honey, you stink bad. Like really really really bad. You're a grown up - you shouldn't have skidmarks on your underwear."

He'll get defensive, hehaw, and pretend that you're lying. He might even get upset and claim that it didn't bother you for 9 months, that it shouldn't bother you now. And he'll act like he doesn't care and you shouldn't either. Don't you love him?

It's all nonsense so don't give in. Living together does not mean that both sides get to air out their dirty laundry and force their disgusting habits on another person. What it means is forming a routine and a way of life where both people find a nice balance where being together makes their lives better not only emotionally but also physically. Your boyfriends poop-poor habits is impacting your way of life negatively. And guess what? Your friends notice too when they come over. Passive aggressive hints are not going to get your way. He's use to smelling bad and is comfortable with it. He might not like it but he's comfortable not changing because his not changing still gets him what he wants and he might dislike change. You need to be upfront, firm, and loud. If you have a loud mouthed friend who has no problem going "damn man, why does your couch smell like ass?", invite them over. Fight this thing head on or else you're going to be covered in poop the rest of your life together because that's exactly what's happening now. His poop is on you and unless you ask for that, that's pretty rude.
posted by Stynxno at 10:29 AM on January 7 [4 favorites]

you need to be as clear and direct with him as possible.....if you skirt around the issue he will not get it......."Honey, we need to talk"....."Is something really serious" (because it is) and keep a straight face after you are done explaining.....
posted by The1andonly at 10:33 AM on January 7

Siding with Brockles in that skid marks are not normal.

Also, I would be extra concerned for YOU because clearly he isn't cleaning any of his naughty bits properly, so you are getting set up for some gross and nasty infections in YOUR naughty bits.
posted by gwenlister at 10:35 AM on January 7 [3 favorites]

There is a reason why we have that phrase, "He's so stupid he can't wipe his own ass," or variously, "what, you think I can't wipe my own ass?" Wiping our asses is something we all learned to do before kindergarden when the teachers asked our parents if we were potty trained.

Your boyfriend can't wipe his own ass, and calling that to his attention is just going to be cripplingly embarrassing. But placing Wet Wipes near the toilet will make him feel like an admonished child. Acknowledge this hygenic foible with grace and dignity, like the others have said, and just tell him. This is not a "quirk" you'll be able to live with indefinitely, so just get it over with right now.
posted by zoomorphic at 10:36 AM on January 7

Compliment him when he just came out of the shower ("Hey, what a lovely smell in here").

[but seriously what most of everyone else said, tell him, straight on. Might not be so much fun to be on the receiving end of that sort of criticism, but what's now is that you are on the receiving end of stuff and that's not nice either, no precious, not nice at all]
posted by Namlit at 10:42 AM on January 7

Though you don't say so outright, I can only imagine that this problem must make your SO much less sexually appealing and a slight embarrassment around your friends. You have every right to demand that he change. Your SO must have certain qualities that compensate for his hygienic deficiencies - perhaps intelligence and kindness? If so, you should be able to bring up this topic without a huge amount of trouble.

I'd suggest that you be firm but civil in voicing your concern. As someone already said, passive aggressive hints aren't enough if you've already brought this up before. An infinite amount of strategically placed wet-wipes will do no good. Neither will leaving magazines on the kitchen table opened to an article stating "Scientists Agree: Never Showering and Constantly Walking Around with Smelly Shit Matting Your Asshair is Totally Fucking Gross." So: just say that he has to take care of himself for the sake of the relationship. Don't dance around the issue, but don't be insulting. Just lay out the facts. Since this isn't a probing indictment of some unchangeable aspect of his character, he shouldn't be too insulted.

If he insists on being gross after this warning, then start throwing things at him.
posted by Lemon of Byzantium at 10:45 AM on January 7 [1 favorite]

double cube n'thing desjardins: My wife got me clean (and everything else I do) exactly that way. We men are definitely like dogs (mentally people, mentally). We want to please if there is a treat reward.

Mix in the forthright honest stuff later. Now all I have to hear is, "Dude; stink" and I RUN to the shower. Treats.
posted by Kensational at 10:46 AM on January 7 [4 favorites]

At its core, this is a health issue for you. You should not be in a situation where you are coming in contact with his fecal material on a daily basis. Maybe approaching it in this way (Its unhealthy and I'm scared I'm going to get sick) will help.

Also, yeah, no oral sex until he "cleans up" his act. Bleah.
posted by anastasiav at 10:51 AM on January 7

Ewww! I would have no problem saying to my SO:

"There was a big skid mark in your boxers this morning, I almost touched it and it was gross. Next time wipe your ass."

Harsh but fair. Poo should not be left places.
posted by cardamine at 10:54 AM on January 7

I see two issues here. One is the excessive "skid marks" and their cause. The second is your SO's lack of response to the hygiene issue resulting from said skid marks.

The excessive skid marks may be a symptom of some medical condition, rather than an inability to wipe properly. They are definitely not normal. You may want to go to him and say that you are worried about his health, that you see this problem because you do his laundry, it is not normal, and you see it as a possible health issue symptom, that you love him, are becoming very worried, and want him to be checked out by a doctor about this ASAP. (He may be aware of this but embarrassed and reluctant to deal with it.) If it *is* medical, it may be treatable.

You also need to say that in the mean time perhaps there may be some coping things he can do to treat this problem, such as using moist wipes, more frequent showers, and changing of underwear.
posted by gudrun at 10:58 AM on January 7 [3 favorites]

This is so not even remotely close to normal that are you sure he doesn't need to see a doctor?
posted by meerkatty at 11:00 AM on January 7 [1 favorite]

Sometimes I really wish we could reply anonymously to stuff like this, but oh well.

Just saying, but I wonder if it might be possible that there's something wrong with his GI tract, anus, and/or diet that's making it legitimately hard to keep clean? See previous mudbutt thread. At any rate, wiping until the paper comes back clean is not a guarantee of no skidmarks ever.

Note: I didn't ask the mudbutt question. Seriously. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 11:06 AM on January 7 [2 favorites]

Just saying, but I wonder if it might be possible that there's something wrong with his GI tract, anus, and/or diet that's making it legitimately hard to keep clean?

Yeah, I was thinking piles.

Shut up, three quarters of you are going to get them sometime in your life, too.

(Not that that's any excuse for not showering, of course.)
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 11:12 AM on January 7

I'm curious to know when you started noticing the smells. You said you have have been living with him for 9 months... did the smell just happen the last two weeks? Or maybe thinking back to before you were shacked up, rolling in the hay of each other's barns, say 12 months ago - did you ever notice the smell? Has it grown to intolerable just recently?

I'm asking this because never would I move in with a person if they, their clothes, and their home smelled like damn SHIT - much less continue the relationship. I would be as subtle as baseball bat on this with him. Short of standing him against the wall with a bucket of lye and a firehouse... "close you're eyes honey or you'll go blind, this is going to sting but it's what's best".... I would make him take a Calgon bath, making sure soap molecules touch every surface of his skin. Tell him to spread his cheeks and clean between those slabs of fat with his bare hands so he can feel the shit coming loose.

Show him his shit stained underwear, ask him if this is what underwear is supposed to look like? You've washed it in hot water with bleach and there is still a brown mark running north to south. Make him throw them out, go tell him to buy new ones because the site of shit on his clothes disgusts you. Ditto with the robe. A shit-smelling robe? C'mon! Do you understand what's going on here? SHIT IS LEAKING OUT OF HIS UNDERWEAR, ONTO HIS ROBE, INTO THE DAMN COUCH! THE COUCH... THAT'S 3 LAYERS! Take the covers off the couch, wash and bleach, repeat. Tell him to clean up his act - literally, because you can only stand so much.

Or you can take the subtle approach, quietly washing his stained underwear and smelly robe, all the while getting the smell of shit on your own self from watching TV on the couch, asking "honey, did you notice I bought some wet wipes in the bathroom?" Soon, if not already, you'll start smelling like shit and people will be posting to AskMeFi "my coworker smells like poop and we don't know how to bring it up."
posted by spoons at 11:25 AM on January 7 [9 favorites]

As with all uncomfortable situations, I'd phrase my complaint in the form of a hip hop lyric parody:
"Yo, Biggie Smells, you got a odor below your waist please don't stink up the place. Cause I see some ladies tonight who should be havin your baby. Bay-bee!"
posted by mullacc at 11:34 AM on January 7 [10 favorites]

You might try saying "something smells like poop", while checking and re-checking your shoes and his shoes. That might work. You will probably have to do it more than once for the message to be clear.
posted by cockeyed at 11:40 AM on January 7 [1 favorite]

"Your butt stinks."

Sometimes in situations like this I think it's less embarrassing to be brazen than to be subtle. It's like when somebody farts in a room and nobody acknowledges it. I, for one, would feel much better if someone just yelled out, "Who farted?"

It's tip-toeing around these subjects that makes them seem like a big deal. But then again, I had a long-term boyfriend who used to stand by the bathroom door and say, "I can hear you in there. I KNOW what you're doing," so I'm not particularly sensitive about these things.
posted by Evangeline at 11:40 AM on January 7 [1 favorite]

He'll work on it?

Oh, my. That'd not be what I would expect someone confronted with their poopy undies.

Seconding that he likely has some kind of GI troubles for which he needs to talk to a doctor.

Also, that this is a health issue for you. Also, that whatever level of tolerance you've shown previously, the tolerance needs to stop (no more euphemisms like "unidentifiable bad smells") because grown men who have access to plumbing should not smell like shit.

And lastly, as someone who has had to tell an employee that he smells (in that case, it was a sour unwashed laundry smell), please, please do his co-workers and his boss this favor, too. It will keep him from getting promoted at work, but he'll never get the real reason why, just vague stuff about his professional demeanor. (Also, they are wondering how on earth this man can find a good woman who lives with him and willl marry him and yet endures his stink.)

(Short-term solution, yeah, buy the wipes.)
posted by desuetude at 11:41 AM on January 7

It's going to be embarrassing enough. Maybe you can fudge a little (ha!) and start with, "Honey, I've recently noticed..."? At least then he won't be forced to face that you've been tolerating it for 9 mos.
posted by juliplease at 11:51 AM on January 7

I'd bet he has Chron's disease, or some similar problem. He needs to see a doctor.

Nthing being really clear with him.
posted by Ironmouth at 12:05 PM on January 7

Does he drink a lot of soda or diet soda? Also - does he eat a lot of seeds (peanuts, etc)?
posted by Fuka at 12:22 PM on January 7

Wish I could post this anonymously as well...

When I first came to college, I did not have the best hygiene. Like your boyfriend, I just didn't shower enough. I think my parents just never emphasized the whole 'you really need to shower more often post-puberty' thing, so I didn't know I was doing anything wrong. My boyfriend gently confronted me about it. It was incredibly embarrassing, like really really horribly embarrassing, but the fact that he was doing it out of love made it ok anyway. I made an effort to change, and he would help with gentle reminders if I slipped up.

We're still together two years later and I am so, so grateful that he told me about the problem- and then stuck with me anyway. Frankly, for me, it was one of the things that really proved his love for me. And I would have been much more ashamed if he had waited a really long time before bringing it up, because I would know I had been bothering him all that time.

Maybe the skid mark thing is a separate issue from the shower frequency, but the same concept applies, I think. Just make it clear that you love him and want to help him. This could actually strengthen your relationship if you handle it right.
posted by showbiz_liz at 12:30 PM on January 7 [2 favorites]

You might also consider installing a bidet seat on your toilet (after having a conversation with him that, unfortunately, I don't think you can avoid). If you're in an apartment, there is even one that runs on batteries so you don't have to hard wire it.

I don't have one (although I kind of really want one) but it seems like it would be a LOT easier to keep his area clean if he had access to one of these.
posted by MsElaineous at 12:39 PM on January 7 [1 favorite]

I am inclined to believe this is more than a laziness issue, and that he's vaguely aware something is wrong but is in denial about needing to do something about it. Hemmoroids, some sort of irritable bowel or Crohn's sort of problem that causes him to have frequent and/or messy flatulence, or "leakage" all sound like possibilities. It can't be very pleasant for him, either, and if a frank conversation reveals he is "doing his best" wiping, then I agree with those who have suggested a doctor's visit is in order. In addition to additional cleansing measures (more frequent showers and wipes) he might want to consider a diet changes (more fiber; fewer greasy or volatile foods) as a first step.
posted by aught at 12:42 PM on January 7

Seconding Ironmouth. As someone with a history of serious gastrointestinal issues, he may want to get a workup. Sometimes 'shit ain't easy'.
posted by arimathea at 12:42 PM on January 7

Man everyone's freaking out. The guy just needs to shower every day I doubt he's got anything super dangerous or abnormal. Dudes just stink if they don't shower, especially as they get older and if he likes to have a beer or three every day. I disagree that you need to call him out about it confrontationally. It is possible to address an issue effectively without telling him he is disgusting.

Actually I think this speaks to a larger issue. On the internet everyone likes to emphasize honesty, but sometimes creative stretches of the truth are called for in order to maintain the common good.

"Do I look fat in this?" ...Honey, that dress isn't my favorite actually, I never liked it, but you don't look fat because you aren't fat. {truth-> dress is too small}

"Was it good?" I'm kind of tired but that was really nice anyway. {truth-> they were doing something silly that killed the mood but doesn't need to be dissected}

"You like it better when I shave my legs?" I don't mind it but I do prefer smooth legs, they just feel so much nicer in the ol'sack. {truth-> hoping she shaves arms also}

"Do you think I smell bad?" I just think you should shower every single day, when you do that you smell fine. Please do that. Like, now, k? Then nookie. Go. {truth-> swamp ass}

Telling the difference between expressing your important feelingz and protecting your partner's ego is a skill that only comes with maturity. Sadly a lot of couples demolish each other's self regard before they figure this out.

Of course, it's HIS responsibility not to ruin your image of him by not taking care of himself. If you do want to have a big talk with him, it would be ok to work in some generalizations like: "It's good for our sex life if I know you're still trying to impress me you know."

If you try any of this and he ignores your specific injunctions it's acceptable to shame him into action though. If he's that complacent though you may want to look into an alternative man who knows how to take a freaking hint.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 1:06 PM on January 7 [5 favorites]

I'm nth-ing the direct approach. I would guess that no one ever taught him to wipe himself, so he just wads up some paper, takes a swipe and drops it in the john. Tell him you want him to fold, wipe, inspect and repeat until there is NO skid. If it takes a second round of paper, he should flush in between, so he doesn't plug the toilet.

I have two kids, and they had some problems like this when they were first starting to deal with their own toilet issues. It was my fault, because I had never showed them a good technique.

I'd have him do his own laundry on the skid items also--maybe after he gets to savor that experience he will take more care. In the meantime, I hope you have been adding some bleach to the wash--fecal matter is REALLY laden with harmful bacteria.

I'd be grateful (although embarrassed) if someone told me, but I'd definitely want to know! its similar to having a booger hanging out of your nose. As embarrassing as it might be to be told about it, it beats finding it yourself and wondering how long its been there.
posted by midwestguy at 1:26 PM on January 7

Print this thread out and show it to him.
posted by fixedgear at 1:32 PM on January 7

One other thing that just came to mind. Is he washing his hands after using the toilet? That should probably be your first step. If there's that much shit hanging around after he goes and he's not hand washing, there is probably fecal matter all over your house.
posted by meerkatty at 1:38 PM on January 7

The excessive skid marks may be a symptom of some medical condition, rather than an inability to wipe properly. They are definitely not normal.

Nthing gudrun's comments.

Your SO may be wiping properly but experiencing bowel incontinence which can occur for a variety of medically-related reasons including a past surgery (fissurectomy, colectomy, or prostate surgery), lax rectal sphincter, rectal prolapse, medication side effects, diet irregularities, nerve or muscle damage, or severe hemorrhoids.

Please suggest he visit a gastroenterologist for examination.
posted by terranova at 1:40 PM on January 7

Sounds like a job for... a bidet! Could you just order this, install it one day while he wasn't around, then just show him the "cool new gadget!" you bought? Okay, so this won't solve the underlying hygiene (or health, or diet) problem, but it could deal with the issue at hand and maybe even start getting him addicted to being clean. And if he has a gadget fetish, it could even be an easy sell...
posted by SeanCier at 1:58 PM on January 7 [1 favorite]

I think that you should tel him.. oh honey, i can't stand more that strange smell that comes quite often from your pants., hahahaha you must really do something about it soon! I tell my patients and my lover and my friends like this when that happen, why you ponder so much about it? . on this ocasions you MUST BE FRANK! hell!
posted by zulonline at 2:12 PM on January 7

I don't quite know what to say, but once you get there, this hand held bidet is a godsend! (you can find them elsewhere for around 20 bucks) It takes about 3 minutes to install, and you are daisy fresh all day long!
posted by Vaike at 2:16 PM on January 7 [1 favorite]

[This is an answer from an anonymous user.]

One time I was giving my boyfriend a full body massage. He was naked and laying face down. I started on his lower back and butt and then I saw some stragglers between his cheeks. I told him about it, kind of giggled and stopped massaging him. He went in the bathroom, took care of it and it hasn't been a problem since.

I don't know how to help you get him to bathe regularly, but you can try the above for the skid mark problem.
posted by cortex at 2:46 PM on January 7

If you want to go the embarrassment route, put a clothesline in the front yard.
posted by Frank Grimes at 5:38 PM on January 7

You posters above who say he should deal with his skid-marky laundry: you really think someone who can't wipe their ass properly or shower with any sort of regularity will do his own laundry? Particularly if it's gross? ...I don't. Direct approach.

Kudos, or something, this would be a major deal breaker for me. I imagine all of the poo particles all over your house and I kinda have to wonder how you can get turned on in the midst of that. Direct approach! For your sanity, nostrils, and your sex life! Do it now!
posted by alpha_betty at 6:26 PM on January 7

I'm exceptionally prone to UTIs and I'm really, REALLY obsessive about the cleanliness of my bits and anything that comes near them. You can totally frame this as a health issue for you (because it is).

If this were my s/o, I would mention that I'd seen the skidmarks in his underwear and thought that maybe he was having stomach problems, but since it's gone on for so long, I was wondering if he thought he should go to the doctor - or maybe he should start showering more, because man, I'd hate to get a UTI from having sex!
posted by grapefruitmoon at 6:38 PM on January 7

At least do get him the wet wipes.
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 7:08 PM on January 7

If your SO is overweight, it may be difficult for him to reach where he needs to reach.

I say this after years of working in nursing homes and assisted livings. Men, especially, had a tough time with this and were much less likely to ask for help when needed.

Just a thought...
posted by Grlnxtdr at 8:35 PM on January 7 [1 favorite]

This is basically an "are you really ready for long-term commitment" test. You do not "think" your SO doesn't know how to wipe his own ass, your SO DOESN'T know how to wipe his own ass, there are shit stains on his bathrobe for God's sake. I'm sorry but it HAS to be said. When I was relatively early in single digits, okay, my Dad seriously got on my case about Doing the Whole Job Right, explaining to me that I was making more and more odious work for my mother in the laundry department. Someone never did that for this poor guy and if you love him you have to take the bullet.

Your SO has a serious personal hygiene deficiency that could negatively affect his life in all sorts of ways and you are the person who has to lay it out for him, and not with any tiptoeing around about that "smell you can't identify." You can identify that smell, it is shit from your SO's ass. That isn't what you should say to him but if it isn't what you communicate you did it wrong.

That said: acknowledge that talking about it is uncomfortable for both of you. Be clear that you are identifying a bad fecal smell from him. Be clear that stains in underwear and bathrobes are not normal. If you have to tell a white lie and say something like you used to do the family laundry sometimes and it was never an issue it is probably better than saying you asked the internet and we all said oh hell no, sister. For heaven's sake don't tell him it's time to be a grown up or act normal or anything like that, it will just amplify the "I'm getting remedial potty training from my SO" factor. But you gotta rip this bandaid off. One last factor to consider: diet. Fatty and low fiber diets are much harder to clean up after. As a genetic suffer of hemorrhoids who thankfully prevents this painful, embarrassing condition through diet and hygiene, supplemental fiber is KEY.
posted by nanojath at 10:14 PM on January 7

Kill two birds with one stone, teach him that every time he takes a shit - as well as learning to wipe his arse - he then follows that up with a shower. (During which he washes his cock and balls, his arse, and his pits. Thoroughly, with soap.)

Really, I just can't believe this guy isn't single. You're an angel, but you're going to have to be his mum just a little bit until he figures this stuff out.
posted by The Monkey at 5:05 AM on January 8

follow-up from the OP

Update - I took the coward's way out and wrote down what I wanted to say to him, apologizing for having to write it and have him read it instead of being able to have a conversation about it. But he did read it and felt badly that I was having to bring up the issue again as well as glad that I felt like I could talk to him about it. I mentioned that I was concerned that there could be health issues in addition to the hygiene issue, and we talked about him finding a new doctor (he's on new insurance). Overall he responded to it very well and I felt much better getting it out in the open.

Thanks to everyone who provided helpful advice and brought the medical aspect to my attention, which I hadn't thought of before. I will say in his defense that this is really the ONLY issue I have with him, and in all other ways he is a wonderful caring loving attentive funny honest mature sensitive man whom I love dearly. As to why it took me a while to bring it up with him, I think I was in denial and hoping if I ignored it, it would go away...

posted by jessamyn at 8:55 AM on January 8

on reading the OP's followup:

You did NOT take the coward's way out -- you dealt with the problem like an adult, via an easier medium. Respect abounds.
posted by liquado at 10:42 AM on January 8 [6 favorites]

Your husband really just needs a lot more fiber and water in his diet. He's constipated.
posted by acorncup at 8:54 AM on January 9

Rock on with the write down! You got the point across, which was the whole point. That was still an act of courage, not cowardliness. Hat's off!
posted by buzzv at 10:49 AM on February 4