Helping a friend be accountable instead of self-loathing
March 19, 2021 12:13 AM Subscribe
A dear friend has been going through a rough patch with her partner, and I want to support her, but am feeling powerless and ignorant. She says that she has been "mean" to him, that he is fed up. She can see that this behavior is hurtful and unfair, and that it reflects her own fears, but says she is trying as hard as she can and can't do any more. Is there any advice I can give, or any constructive way I can support her?
Today is the first that I've really heard how bad things were. I know very little about the current circumstances between them apart from this. The only other details I have are a sprinkling of conversations the past few months when she'd say that they had been fighting, or using what I thought was self-deprecating language about how she was such a pain to him.
Today, she mentioned constantly asking for his attention, taking things he says as evidence of invalidation, crying and begging him not to leave her. Even these statements were made hyperbolically, so I'm not sure what things really look like between them - whether she's been difficult and petty, or if her behavior has been harsh. Either way, it's not good for either of them.
My friend was abused and bullied as a kid, and has deep fears of inadequacy and unworthiness. She's been in therapy for decades, and they even started going to couples therapy, but she says it isn't working. She's also dealing with major+treatment-resistant depression and a major illness that just got diagnosed this past year - she's trying a new therapy for depression and her illness is pretty well managed, but I know that these are stressors for her and for the relationship.
I've seen a lot of advice on how to help people identify and get *away* from bad partners, but never how to help if you're worried someone you care for is treating people badly. She's beating herself up with the thought that her partner is going to break up with her this weekend, and I am at a loss as to what to say. Some part of me really hopes that's not the case - he's been absolutely wonderful for her, and she for him, in some ways - but when she says that he's fed up and says he can't see a future with her and that they need to talk this weekend, it's a fully reasonable thing to expect.
I've been saying, "you are whole and worthy of love, even if this relationship ends". I've also been pointing out that she doesn't *know* that her partner will break up with her, and that the only person who knows what he wants is him. I know that I'm motivated in part by the desire for her to not sabotage the relationship if it can be saved: they love each other a lot, and I want them both to be happy.
But, of course, her partner has every right to not want to be with someone who is mean, or who pressures him to spend all their time together. Some part of me feels like it's important to acknowledge that she's right, that behaving in these ways isn't healthy or kind. At the same time, that seems likely to only exacerbate her self-blame/shame spiral.
I recognize that I'm not her therapist, and shouldn't want to become her therapist. She hasn't asked me for advice - she actually has been withdrawn for weeks, and has flinched away whenever I've asked how things are going with the work she's doing in therapy. When she opened up with all this pain and anger and self-disgust today, my heart just cracked. Any advice would be so deeply appreciated. Thank you.
Today is the first that I've really heard how bad things were. I know very little about the current circumstances between them apart from this. The only other details I have are a sprinkling of conversations the past few months when she'd say that they had been fighting, or using what I thought was self-deprecating language about how she was such a pain to him.
Today, she mentioned constantly asking for his attention, taking things he says as evidence of invalidation, crying and begging him not to leave her. Even these statements were made hyperbolically, so I'm not sure what things really look like between them - whether she's been difficult and petty, or if her behavior has been harsh. Either way, it's not good for either of them.
My friend was abused and bullied as a kid, and has deep fears of inadequacy and unworthiness. She's been in therapy for decades, and they even started going to couples therapy, but she says it isn't working. She's also dealing with major+treatment-resistant depression and a major illness that just got diagnosed this past year - she's trying a new therapy for depression and her illness is pretty well managed, but I know that these are stressors for her and for the relationship.
I've seen a lot of advice on how to help people identify and get *away* from bad partners, but never how to help if you're worried someone you care for is treating people badly. She's beating herself up with the thought that her partner is going to break up with her this weekend, and I am at a loss as to what to say. Some part of me really hopes that's not the case - he's been absolutely wonderful for her, and she for him, in some ways - but when she says that he's fed up and says he can't see a future with her and that they need to talk this weekend, it's a fully reasonable thing to expect.
I've been saying, "you are whole and worthy of love, even if this relationship ends". I've also been pointing out that she doesn't *know* that her partner will break up with her, and that the only person who knows what he wants is him. I know that I'm motivated in part by the desire for her to not sabotage the relationship if it can be saved: they love each other a lot, and I want them both to be happy.
But, of course, her partner has every right to not want to be with someone who is mean, or who pressures him to spend all their time together. Some part of me feels like it's important to acknowledge that she's right, that behaving in these ways isn't healthy or kind. At the same time, that seems likely to only exacerbate her self-blame/shame spiral.
I recognize that I'm not her therapist, and shouldn't want to become her therapist. She hasn't asked me for advice - she actually has been withdrawn for weeks, and has flinched away whenever I've asked how things are going with the work she's doing in therapy. When she opened up with all this pain and anger and self-disgust today, my heart just cracked. Any advice would be so deeply appreciated. Thank you.
She hasn't asked me for advice
Then you've already done exactly the right thing by not giving her any.
Any advice would be so deeply appreciated.
Getting a glimpse into the inner lives of tortured people is always really hard. The thing to keep reminding yourself is that they have had much more practise at dealing with their particular torture than you have, and if what they need from you is advice then that's what they'll ask for. Their torture is not yours to solve unless they explicitly ask for your help in doing exactly that.
This will let you step back far enough from the edge of the howling abyss to recover your own footing and just remain the kind of solid and comforting presence in their lives that you must have been in order for them to have opened up to you in the first place.
And everything Mizu said.
posted by flabdablet at 5:30 AM on March 19, 2021 [8 favorites]
Then you've already done exactly the right thing by not giving her any.
Any advice would be so deeply appreciated.
Getting a glimpse into the inner lives of tortured people is always really hard. The thing to keep reminding yourself is that they have had much more practise at dealing with their particular torture than you have, and if what they need from you is advice then that's what they'll ask for. Their torture is not yours to solve unless they explicitly ask for your help in doing exactly that.
This will let you step back far enough from the edge of the howling abyss to recover your own footing and just remain the kind of solid and comforting presence in their lives that you must have been in order for them to have opened up to you in the first place.
And everything Mizu said.
posted by flabdablet at 5:30 AM on March 19, 2021 [8 favorites]
As someone who has several medical conditions that aren't going particularly well and also treatment-resistant major depression, I agree that giving her advice is really not what she needs from you unless she specifically asks for it. Please also steer away from aphorisms like whenever a door closes, a window opens or trying to remind her about the good things since (if she's anything like me) it will just give her another stick to beat herself with.
It's hard to say without sounding cheesy or cliched, but just let her know that what she's going through is really hard and you're really sorry things are so tough. Most of all just listen to her, let her know that you hear and understand the way she feels. That whatever happens with her partner, you're going to still be her friend and you care about her. And you're glad she trusts you enough to talk to you and tell you what's going on.
But! Don't belabour the point or make a big speech of all those things at once. It is a paradox that people being kind is often harder to deal with than indifference. And when you feel like a worthless, rotten person, someone treating you like you aren't can just break you.
And yes, look after yourself. You're doing a good thing to help support your friend and it can be tough to be around someone who is that deep in despair. Make sure you do some nice things for yourself and lean on those in your life who can support you.
posted by Athanassiel at 6:57 AM on March 19, 2021 [3 favorites]
It's hard to say without sounding cheesy or cliched, but just let her know that what she's going through is really hard and you're really sorry things are so tough. Most of all just listen to her, let her know that you hear and understand the way she feels. That whatever happens with her partner, you're going to still be her friend and you care about her. And you're glad she trusts you enough to talk to you and tell you what's going on.
But! Don't belabour the point or make a big speech of all those things at once. It is a paradox that people being kind is often harder to deal with than indifference. And when you feel like a worthless, rotten person, someone treating you like you aren't can just break you.
And yes, look after yourself. You're doing a good thing to help support your friend and it can be tough to be around someone who is that deep in despair. Make sure you do some nice things for yourself and lean on those in your life who can support you.
posted by Athanassiel at 6:57 AM on March 19, 2021 [3 favorites]
It does sound like you're doing the right things so far. Its not your job to fix either her or the relationship (that's why she has a therapist), so your job is to be a good friend. I can say from personal experience that there is a lot of stress that comes with trying to challenge a history of abuse and depressive thoughts, so anything you can do to help her deal with that will be very good. Asking her directly about therapy might be increasing that stress and internal conflict which might push her away a bit, so I would avoid pushing on that.
I would recommend trying to focus on small but concrete cases where she is having problems so you can help reinforce her sense of control and ability to improve. Its not really important that you know what's "really going on" as long as there's no active abuse happening, because even she probably doesn't know which of her behaviors are actually problematic and which are not a big deal. But just by listening and caring, you can help her learn that people can actually care about her without having to "fix" her for bring broken. Keep it up, and try not to worry too much if she's quiet for a few days, she's been through worse it sounds like
posted by JZig at 6:58 AM on March 19, 2021
I would recommend trying to focus on small but concrete cases where she is having problems so you can help reinforce her sense of control and ability to improve. Its not really important that you know what's "really going on" as long as there's no active abuse happening, because even she probably doesn't know which of her behaviors are actually problematic and which are not a big deal. But just by listening and caring, you can help her learn that people can actually care about her without having to "fix" her for bring broken. Keep it up, and try not to worry too much if she's quiet for a few days, she's been through worse it sounds like
posted by JZig at 6:58 AM on March 19, 2021
The other comments are right - it's not your job to fix her problems, or suggest things if she doesn't ask for it. As her friend, I think you can remind her what *you* love about her and why you value her friendship. Maybe send her a funny picture/meme/link every so often like "I saw this and it reminded me of [shared experience]" - maybe sharing a laugh would give her a tiny moment of healing, you know? If possible, maybe you can invite her out to do something fun and say you wanna see her and hang out with her. She needs a distraction from all of this and to remind her that while this is a bad situation right now, there are other good experiences to be had in this world (despite everything).
To me it sounds like she has a lot of trauma and shame, and if she were asking me what she should she do, I would suggest that she look into taking a trauma-based approach to her healing. But I'm not an expert in trauma (I can only speak from my own experiences), and I don't think you are either, so this might not be something you can suggest to her, even if she were to ask your advice. However, if it interests you, it might be something that you can learn more about on your own.
posted by foxjacket at 8:31 AM on March 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
To me it sounds like she has a lot of trauma and shame, and if she were asking me what she should she do, I would suggest that she look into taking a trauma-based approach to her healing. But I'm not an expert in trauma (I can only speak from my own experiences), and I don't think you are either, so this might not be something you can suggest to her, even if she were to ask your advice. However, if it interests you, it might be something that you can learn more about on your own.
posted by foxjacket at 8:31 AM on March 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
“This sounds really hard and stressful. How can I support you?”
posted by bluedaisy at 11:11 AM on March 19, 2021 [5 favorites]
posted by bluedaisy at 11:11 AM on March 19, 2021 [5 favorites]
You don't have to know the truth of her marriage to be her friend. She trusted you enough to be able to share her deepest fears about herself. The best thing you can do is not to argue her out of it but to let her know you still love and care about her as she is. So things that might be helpful to say
- Thank you for trusting me enough to share that
- I don't know how you are in your marriage but in our friendship, this is how I see you [provide details of what makes her a good friend, strengths that you see in her based on your personal experience of her]
- That sounds really hard, I'm so sorry you are in such a bad place but I also appreciate that you can let me the friend that that you can lean on/share that with.
- What can I do - you want me to just listen, offer a hug or help you problem solve?
posted by metahawk at 11:53 AM on March 19, 2021 [2 favorites]
- Thank you for trusting me enough to share that
- I don't know how you are in your marriage but in our friendship, this is how I see you [provide details of what makes her a good friend, strengths that you see in her based on your personal experience of her]
- That sounds really hard, I'm so sorry you are in such a bad place but I also appreciate that you can let me the friend that that you can lean on/share that with.
- What can I do - you want me to just listen, offer a hug or help you problem solve?
posted by metahawk at 11:53 AM on March 19, 2021 [2 favorites]
I think we all tend to underestimate the transformative power of holding an open, nonjudgmental space for someone. Implicitly give them the promise that they won’t be interrupted. Show them how deeply you can listen. Only use words to reflect back their words and what you’re feeling off them (and not what sense you’re making of all this, unless asked).
It sounds like you’re already doing this, so keep on being a good friend. When in doubt, practice erring towards holding that safe space and empathetic silence.
posted by iamkimiam at 1:12 AM on March 20, 2021 [1 favorite]
It sounds like you’re already doing this, so keep on being a good friend. When in doubt, practice erring towards holding that safe space and empathetic silence.
posted by iamkimiam at 1:12 AM on March 20, 2021 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: A much-belated thanks, everyone. Many of these suggestions are already part of my toolbox, but it is always good to be reminded. The core suggestion, to take a breath and back up, is powerful medicine - I took it. I don't think it is helping my friend, but it is helping me not make things worse for my friend, which is very important.
posted by rrrrrrrrrt at 5:02 PM on March 23, 2021
posted by rrrrrrrrrt at 5:02 PM on March 23, 2021
This thread is closed to new comments.
If she seems open to it and most importantly brings it up on her own, you could talk about choices she can make when she realizes she is engaging in these unwanted behaviors. Like, don’t condemn the actions, but help her come up with things she can pivot to instead. When she catches herself pressuring him to be together when he wants space, could she step back and focus on something engrossing like a book she loves or an active discord chat or maybe calling someone else for company? When she realizes she has been mean, could she step back and maybe write in a journal, or go for a walk? Sometimes just verbalizing these kinds of plans can cement them in my head instead of constantly privately ruminating about them and forgetting in the moment. This is stuff she most likely has already worked on in therapy but as her friend you might have better specific ideas for her.
Most importantly just take care of yourself. Reach out to other people for support so you don’t end up feeling as drained by your interactions with her. Do what you can to maintain resilience, and don’t take any of it directly onto your own shoulders. You aren’t her therapist and it seems like she doesn’t want you to be, either. Express as much kindness to yourself as you do to her.
posted by Mizu at 12:44 AM on March 19, 2021 [8 favorites]