Girlfriend vs. Friends
September 3, 2007 9:15 PM Subscribe
Girlfriend vs. friends: how to bring the two together?
This is a sticky relationship question and I'm looking for anecdotal advice from anyone who has gone through the same thing.
I have a group of six close friends who I've known for the past 10 years. We get together often, at times as frequent as once a week, and while I was single they were the center of my social life.
I've been with someone for a year and a half now and while she loves spending time with my friends outside of this group, she really hates hanging out with the core bunch. These other friends are all important to me, but I miss having that core base, the sense of family. She and I have been having fights about this for awhile and getting nowhere.
Some details:
- I am the social one in the relationship. She prefers one on one or up to four people, and does not have her own group to spend time with (for parity sake).
- She is my core base now... we spend like 4-5 days a week together and go away often. I'm not ignorant of that. Nor am I going to use getting-along-with-my-friends as a litmus test for my relationships.
- The current agreement is that I make time to see them on our nights off, but what this really comes down to is that I never see them anymore (such as most of this summer).
- These aren't college beer buds: they are a mixed group, and other wives/girlfriends have joined over the years.
- I'm not an asshole. In general I try to do what makes her happiest.
- She has given it a try, but has now made up her mind that she is happier not seeing them. All efforts on my part to bring these two parts of my life together are met with annoyance on her part.
Ugh... I'm not painting too pretty a picture. This is just one of our sore spots. I strongly feel like these friends of mine are a positive force in my life, and that they love me and she loves me, so why can't it work... I'm interested in hearing if any of you have successfully navigated these waters.
Thanks for your time and sorry for the rambling nature of the post-
cgs
This is a sticky relationship question and I'm looking for anecdotal advice from anyone who has gone through the same thing.
I have a group of six close friends who I've known for the past 10 years. We get together often, at times as frequent as once a week, and while I was single they were the center of my social life.
I've been with someone for a year and a half now and while she loves spending time with my friends outside of this group, she really hates hanging out with the core bunch. These other friends are all important to me, but I miss having that core base, the sense of family. She and I have been having fights about this for awhile and getting nowhere.
Some details:
- I am the social one in the relationship. She prefers one on one or up to four people, and does not have her own group to spend time with (for parity sake).
- She is my core base now... we spend like 4-5 days a week together and go away often. I'm not ignorant of that. Nor am I going to use getting-along-with-my-friends as a litmus test for my relationships.
- The current agreement is that I make time to see them on our nights off, but what this really comes down to is that I never see them anymore (such as most of this summer).
- These aren't college beer buds: they are a mixed group, and other wives/girlfriends have joined over the years.
- I'm not an asshole. In general I try to do what makes her happiest.
- She has given it a try, but has now made up her mind that she is happier not seeing them. All efforts on my part to bring these two parts of my life together are met with annoyance on her part.
Ugh... I'm not painting too pretty a picture. This is just one of our sore spots. I strongly feel like these friends of mine are a positive force in my life, and that they love me and she loves me, so why can't it work... I'm interested in hearing if any of you have successfully navigated these waters.
Thanks for your time and sorry for the rambling nature of the post-
cgs
she really hates hanging out with the core bunch. These other friends are all important to me, but I miss having that core base, the sense of family. She and I have been having fights about this for awhile and getting nowhere.
I know this isn't the kind of comment you are looking for, but I'm questioning whether you and she are really suited for each other. Consider what you've told us:
-- You have a really close group of friends you have known for 10 years, with whom it is very important to you that you spend time.
-- Your girlfriend "hates" spending time with these friends.
What does this say about you and your girlfriend's compatibility? How can you LOVE spending time with these friends, and she HATES it? I certainly think that couples can disagree on some likes and dislikes, but it's tough for me to see how you can be compatible and have such divergent views on your friends. I would expect, if your friends are quality people worth spending so much time with, that your girlfriend would agree.
Not to hold my life out as the gold standard of connubial harmony, but I have a similar group of friends (known them for upward of fifteen or twenty years) --- and without exception, my wife loves them.
posted by jayder at 9:38 PM on September 3, 2007
I know this isn't the kind of comment you are looking for, but I'm questioning whether you and she are really suited for each other. Consider what you've told us:
-- You have a really close group of friends you have known for 10 years, with whom it is very important to you that you spend time.
-- Your girlfriend "hates" spending time with these friends.
What does this say about you and your girlfriend's compatibility? How can you LOVE spending time with these friends, and she HATES it? I certainly think that couples can disagree on some likes and dislikes, but it's tough for me to see how you can be compatible and have such divergent views on your friends. I would expect, if your friends are quality people worth spending so much time with, that your girlfriend would agree.
Not to hold my life out as the gold standard of connubial harmony, but I have a similar group of friends (known them for upward of fifteen or twenty years) --- and without exception, my wife loves them.
posted by jayder at 9:38 PM on September 3, 2007
Your girlfriend will never be part of "the family"; at best, she's the beloved girlfriend of one of the family members. Don't make her fake something she doesn't feel.
I don't agree with this. The poster has been dating her for a year and a half, which is a long time suggesting long-term commitment, and if she's still not comfortable with these people, there's something wrong: something wrong either with her, or with the friends.
posted by jayder at 9:44 PM on September 3, 2007
I don't agree with this. The poster has been dating her for a year and a half, which is a long time suggesting long-term commitment, and if she's still not comfortable with these people, there's something wrong: something wrong either with her, or with the friends.
posted by jayder at 9:44 PM on September 3, 2007
I think on first read I thought she didn't like hanging out with the whole group all together, but would hang out in smaller, more intimate settings. Now I re-read and it sounds like she doesn't want to see anyone from the group at all ever, which seems a lot harsher than what I previously thought.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:46 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:46 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
I'm with jayder on this, if she hates your friends so much that you're basically not allowed to see them, she might not be the girl for you. I mean, dude, if the gender roles of this question were reversed, plenty of people would be in here telling a girl that boyfriends who keep them from their friends are control freaks that frequently end up mentally and maybe even physically abusive. Someone who really loves you will make the effort to, if not love the people you love, at least allow you the space to have those other healthy relationships that make you happy.
posted by lia at 9:51 PM on September 3, 2007 [4 favorites]
posted by lia at 9:51 PM on September 3, 2007 [4 favorites]
Woah - she's dictating who you can and cannot spend time with? Sounds like a deal-breaker to me.
It's clingy, needy, controlling behavior, and you shouldn't put up with it.
posted by chrisamiller at 10:01 PM on September 3, 2007
It's clingy, needy, controlling behavior, and you shouldn't put up with it.
posted by chrisamiller at 10:01 PM on September 3, 2007
If I give your girlfriend the benefit of the doubt, she is basically "I like your friends well enough, I just don't like big groups, why don't you spend time with them on the days when we're not together?" I don't think not liking groups is a serious personality flaw, but I guess since you're social it could be a deal breaker for you. Anyway, tips:
Go really slow. Introduce her to your friends one on one, give them opportunities to hang out, in small groups or with you, her, and just one friend. I'm guessing she probably has trouble interacting in a big group situation (even if she doesn't look like it to you, she may be scared silly). Letting her get to know people in her preferred method (one on one) should make it less omg group! and more a bunch of people she knows.
When you're with the group together, try and keep a security blanket for her, make sure she's always next to or talking to one person she knows fairly well. If you want to, e.g., go watch football in the living room, don't leave her with a group she doesn't know in the kitchen. Take her with you or help start a conversation for her with one of your friends who she knows.
Look in to why you haven't been seeing these people this summer. Are the days you and your girlfriend apart just sucky for hanging with your group? (I.e. your group only meets Saturdays, your girlfriend wants to be with you on Saturdays.) If this is the case, then you need to put your foot down and at least spend some Saturdays with your group. If it's mostly been you being lazy, though, well... stop being so lazy, make time.
P.S. It's really hard to tell from your post if she hates the core bunch because she hates them, or because you only spend time with them in a big group setting. Please elaborate.
posted by anaelith at 10:04 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
Go really slow. Introduce her to your friends one on one, give them opportunities to hang out, in small groups or with you, her, and just one friend. I'm guessing she probably has trouble interacting in a big group situation (even if she doesn't look like it to you, she may be scared silly). Letting her get to know people in her preferred method (one on one) should make it less omg group! and more a bunch of people she knows.
When you're with the group together, try and keep a security blanket for her, make sure she's always next to or talking to one person she knows fairly well. If you want to, e.g., go watch football in the living room, don't leave her with a group she doesn't know in the kitchen. Take her with you or help start a conversation for her with one of your friends who she knows.
Look in to why you haven't been seeing these people this summer. Are the days you and your girlfriend apart just sucky for hanging with your group? (I.e. your group only meets Saturdays, your girlfriend wants to be with you on Saturdays.) If this is the case, then you need to put your foot down and at least spend some Saturdays with your group. If it's mostly been you being lazy, though, well... stop being so lazy, make time.
P.S. It's really hard to tell from your post if she hates the core bunch because she hates them, or because you only spend time with them in a big group setting. Please elaborate.
posted by anaelith at 10:04 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
What specifically is it about your buds that she doesn't like? Is it the activities? Their behavior? Your behavior when you're around them?
My own experience is that my boyfriend likes to go hiking with his pals, or watch sports, or drink a lot... all things I am not into.
So, as a compromise, most of the time he sees them without me, most of the time they see him without me, and we occasionally get together for parties, etc.
posted by k8t at 10:22 PM on September 3, 2007
My own experience is that my boyfriend likes to go hiking with his pals, or watch sports, or drink a lot... all things I am not into.
So, as a compromise, most of the time he sees them without me, most of the time they see him without me, and we occasionally get together for parties, etc.
posted by k8t at 10:22 PM on September 3, 2007
Hmmm...sounds like she is a tad jealous of your bond with your friends, or insecure enough about her relationship with you that they pose a (perceived) threat to her. Has she had some rocky relationships in the past? Been cheated on or dumped? Here, lie down on my couch...
Of course I'm not a mental health professional, just someone who has been down the same road. It's gonna be tough to resolve the two, and you might just have to decide which is more important.
posted by jpmack at 10:41 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
Of course I'm not a mental health professional, just someone who has been down the same road. It's gonna be tough to resolve the two, and you might just have to decide which is more important.
posted by jpmack at 10:41 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
I have to be honest and say that I'm not sure you really can bring together your girlfriend and your friends, given the information provided.
As described by you, your girlfriend comes off as a classic needy girlfriend with low self esteem. Some common symptoms of this are:
1. She doesn't have many (if any) friends of her own.
2. She has few interests other than hanging out with her boyfriend, whose attention validates her.
3. She does not like her boyfriend's friends, because they compete with her for his attention
4. She believes that she must spend 24 hours a day, 7 days a week with her boyfriend, and if he does not agree, he does not love her
5. She seriously thinks it's reasonable to demand that a boyfriend only see his friends on a "night off", as if she has a right to every waking moment of her boyfriend's time
Because of this, I don't think you are ever going to get her to want to spend time with your friends.
If you are willing to look past this, and try to stay with her, I think your only option is to set some boundaries and stick by your guns. Tell her that time with your friends is important to you, and that you're not going to ignore your friends. She doesn't have to come with you to hang out with them. You can (amazingly!) spend time apart, on occasion.
More concretely: schedule a night every few weeks to get together with your friends, and do not allow her to override these plans.
Be up front about this with her. Let her know that no matter how big a part of your life she may be, she cannot be your entire life, and your friends matter. She doesn't have to like them, nor does she even have to ever be around them. She simply needs to accept that you aren't going to stop seeing long time friends just because she doesn't want to spend time with them herself.
posted by tocts at 10:47 PM on September 3, 2007 [3 favorites]
As described by you, your girlfriend comes off as a classic needy girlfriend with low self esteem. Some common symptoms of this are:
1. She doesn't have many (if any) friends of her own.
2. She has few interests other than hanging out with her boyfriend, whose attention validates her.
3. She does not like her boyfriend's friends, because they compete with her for his attention
4. She believes that she must spend 24 hours a day, 7 days a week with her boyfriend, and if he does not agree, he does not love her
5. She seriously thinks it's reasonable to demand that a boyfriend only see his friends on a "night off", as if she has a right to every waking moment of her boyfriend's time
Because of this, I don't think you are ever going to get her to want to spend time with your friends.
If you are willing to look past this, and try to stay with her, I think your only option is to set some boundaries and stick by your guns. Tell her that time with your friends is important to you, and that you're not going to ignore your friends. She doesn't have to come with you to hang out with them. You can (amazingly!) spend time apart, on occasion.
More concretely: schedule a night every few weeks to get together with your friends, and do not allow her to override these plans.
Be up front about this with her. Let her know that no matter how big a part of your life she may be, she cannot be your entire life, and your friends matter. She doesn't have to like them, nor does she even have to ever be around them. She simply needs to accept that you aren't going to stop seeing long time friends just because she doesn't want to spend time with them herself.
posted by tocts at 10:47 PM on September 3, 2007 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: wow... thanks for all the responses!
she has spent time w/ some of the group one on one and it has gone ok. w/ some of the others it hasn't. she's said that she gave it a year, and that it took her awhile to realize that she is happier not being there. (pretty hard to argue w/ that... thought that hasn't stopped me :-/)
she is pretty up front about me making time for them, but so far that hasn't worked out so great. i know i have to be more deliberate, like setting out days ahead of time and making it clear, but often it gets dicey... like they'll get together on one night, but i won't have time to clear that day w/ her ahead of time, etc. she doesn't want me to cut them out, but it almost feels like i have to lead two lives....maybe that will pass...
re: pinksuperhero, i feel like alot of it comes from her really not liking the group vibe. often we get shouty, all talking on top of each other... this drives her crazy. she feels like we cut her off and don't pay attention.
re: jayder -- that's where i'm at right now.. i've started to look at how i am with the friends and how i am with her... could i be that different in the two settings?
one of the friends has had trouble bringing boyfriends into the
group, but not to this extent. i think it was a little easier since the boyfriends also had social groups of their own...
my gf feels like the group is a clique, and in some ways i've been disappointed in the group for not being more welcoming.
also, talking about it w/ them is very uncomfortable. maybe even inadvisable, considering you can't really talk about situations like this w/ the parties involved... it can get defensive very quickly...
normally, i'm happy to compartmentalize my life. but this is the one group that i want to make work. she's said she will join the group once in a while, but has made it clear that she won't be happy. so then i feel like a douche dragging her out... plus i'll probably be neurotic, worrying about how she is feeling.
talking about relationships can sometimes be too subjective for internet advice, but thanks for the input.
posted by cgs at 10:47 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
she has spent time w/ some of the group one on one and it has gone ok. w/ some of the others it hasn't. she's said that she gave it a year, and that it took her awhile to realize that she is happier not being there. (pretty hard to argue w/ that... thought that hasn't stopped me :-/)
she is pretty up front about me making time for them, but so far that hasn't worked out so great. i know i have to be more deliberate, like setting out days ahead of time and making it clear, but often it gets dicey... like they'll get together on one night, but i won't have time to clear that day w/ her ahead of time, etc. she doesn't want me to cut them out, but it almost feels like i have to lead two lives....maybe that will pass...
re: pinksuperhero, i feel like alot of it comes from her really not liking the group vibe. often we get shouty, all talking on top of each other... this drives her crazy. she feels like we cut her off and don't pay attention.
re: jayder -- that's where i'm at right now.. i've started to look at how i am with the friends and how i am with her... could i be that different in the two settings?
one of the friends has had trouble bringing boyfriends into the
group, but not to this extent. i think it was a little easier since the boyfriends also had social groups of their own...
my gf feels like the group is a clique, and in some ways i've been disappointed in the group for not being more welcoming.
also, talking about it w/ them is very uncomfortable. maybe even inadvisable, considering you can't really talk about situations like this w/ the parties involved... it can get defensive very quickly...
normally, i'm happy to compartmentalize my life. but this is the one group that i want to make work. she's said she will join the group once in a while, but has made it clear that she won't be happy. so then i feel like a douche dragging her out... plus i'll probably be neurotic, worrying about how she is feeling.
talking about relationships can sometimes be too subjective for internet advice, but thanks for the input.
posted by cgs at 10:47 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
If she likes to see people "one on one or up to four people", does that mean she would be up to double-dating with one of your friends and his wife/girlfriend? Maybe you can go out with one friend (for a movie, for dinner) at a time for a while, so she can get to know them better without all the fuss of meeting a whole bunch of friends who are already close to each other. Maybe she doesn't hate them, but rather, hates the feeling of being with you plus them. Could she maybe feel left out or like an outsider?
posted by CrazyLemonade at 10:47 PM on September 3, 2007
posted by CrazyLemonade at 10:47 PM on September 3, 2007
Oh, I should have previewed. Although I see maybe I did kinda have a point with the "doesnt hate them but hates feeling left out".
posted by CrazyLemonade at 10:50 PM on September 3, 2007
posted by CrazyLemonade at 10:50 PM on September 3, 2007
I agree with others --- I'd like to know what, specifically, she doesn't like about the friends.
If you and your friends act like assholes, regaling each other with decades-old in-jokes and leaving her out of the fun, then yeah, I understand why she would not enjoy being with you and your friends. But that would be quite rude of you, and your question makes you sound like a thoughtful person, so I am assuming you're not leaving her out of the fun.
If you and your friends are acting civilized and inclusive, giving her every chance to be part of the fun, and not dwelling on in-jokes and long-past anecdotes without including her, then her aversion to your friends doesn't make sense.
posted by jayder at 10:51 PM on September 3, 2007
If you and your friends act like assholes, regaling each other with decades-old in-jokes and leaving her out of the fun, then yeah, I understand why she would not enjoy being with you and your friends. But that would be quite rude of you, and your question makes you sound like a thoughtful person, so I am assuming you're not leaving her out of the fun.
If you and your friends are acting civilized and inclusive, giving her every chance to be part of the fun, and not dwelling on in-jokes and long-past anecdotes without including her, then her aversion to your friends doesn't make sense.
posted by jayder at 10:51 PM on September 3, 2007
Yeah, I should have previewed, too.
i feel like alot of it comes from her really not liking the group vibe. often we get shouty, all talking on top of each other... this drives her crazy. she feels like we cut her off and don't pay attention. ... my gf feels like the group is a clique, and in some ways i've been disappointed in the group for not being more welcoming.
It's all starting to make sense.
I admit, that kind of loud, raucous thing can be irritating for people who haven't been part of the clique for a long time. Especially if they are not making an effort to be inclusive. I'm thinking, in light of your clarification, that the problem may be more with the friends and not with the girlfriend.
I guess it comes down to this question: Is she a keeper? If she is, you may need to cut back on your socializing with them, or compartmentalize.
posted by jayder at 10:57 PM on September 3, 2007
i feel like alot of it comes from her really not liking the group vibe. often we get shouty, all talking on top of each other... this drives her crazy. she feels like we cut her off and don't pay attention. ... my gf feels like the group is a clique, and in some ways i've been disappointed in the group for not being more welcoming.
It's all starting to make sense.
I admit, that kind of loud, raucous thing can be irritating for people who haven't been part of the clique for a long time. Especially if they are not making an effort to be inclusive. I'm thinking, in light of your clarification, that the problem may be more with the friends and not with the girlfriend.
I guess it comes down to this question: Is she a keeper? If she is, you may need to cut back on your socializing with them, or compartmentalize.
posted by jayder at 10:57 PM on September 3, 2007
Response by poster: half of us went to college together, so talking about that is an immediate negative. i feel like we aren't too in-jokey, but maybe i don't have the perspective. honestly, i don't see us as a college clique, considering i wasn't friends w/ some of them at school, but she feels that way.
she really hates big noisy groups. i like both big and small groups. our main activity, in this group, is to get together and watch Survivor, drink wine and yell at the tv. (she hates reality tv...) i've been getting all analytical about it, comparing this situation against the social settings where she has enjoyed herself.
i don't want to portray her so negatively. aside from this issue, things are mainly great between us... we share alot of interests and are very active. i just realized that i hadn't seen my crew for like two months and that i missed them...
posted by cgs at 11:08 PM on September 3, 2007
she really hates big noisy groups. i like both big and small groups. our main activity, in this group, is to get together and watch Survivor, drink wine and yell at the tv. (she hates reality tv...) i've been getting all analytical about it, comparing this situation against the social settings where she has enjoyed herself.
i don't want to portray her so negatively. aside from this issue, things are mainly great between us... we share alot of interests and are very active. i just realized that i hadn't seen my crew for like two months and that i missed them...
posted by cgs at 11:08 PM on September 3, 2007
From what you said, I can completely sympathize with your girlfriend. I hate big loud groups, and I loathe reality TV. I could take something like that every now and then, but would hate being dragged to some event like that on a regular basis (pretty much regardless of the people involved).
My advice to you is to give up all hope that your girlfriend will ever enjoy hanging out with your crew and to stop pressuring her to join you (when more than a few of them are involved). On the other hand, try to establish a little more leeway to make plans without her clearance. Make a deal with her: you won't drag her to your parties, but instead, you are allowed to just go off and hang out with your friends, say once every two weeks, without clearing it with her first. (Provided, of course, that you don't have something specific planned with her for that night.)
posted by epimorph at 11:38 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
My advice to you is to give up all hope that your girlfriend will ever enjoy hanging out with your crew and to stop pressuring her to join you (when more than a few of them are involved). On the other hand, try to establish a little more leeway to make plans without her clearance. Make a deal with her: you won't drag her to your parties, but instead, you are allowed to just go off and hang out with your friends, say once every two weeks, without clearing it with her first. (Provided, of course, that you don't have something specific planned with her for that night.)
posted by epimorph at 11:38 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
I think you need to just pick a day, let your girlfriend know, and let your pals know that it's the day you're available, and if they want you for something special on other days they're going to have to give you some scheduling time, the end. You may end up spending a couple days alone because your friends don't want to do anything on your day, but think of it as bonus time to catch up on your reading or something.
Practice saying:
"Sorry, honey, it's survivor night."
"No can do, I have other plans, but hey, I'm always free on xday--if you want to do something then, let me know."
posted by anaelith at 11:55 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
Practice saying:
"Sorry, honey, it's survivor night."
"No can do, I have other plans, but hey, I'm always free on xday--if you want to do something then, let me know."
posted by anaelith at 11:55 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]
I don't see that this has to be a versus situation. You like big noisy groups, she hates big noisy groups. If you're spending 4 or 5 nights a week with her, I think you should hang out with your friends once a week or so. She can go or not go as she chooses. Couples don't need to be attached at the hip. You'll both be healthier and happier if you're both doing the things that make you happy.
posted by gt2 at 12:04 AM on September 4, 2007
posted by gt2 at 12:04 AM on September 4, 2007
For a year she tried to hang out with a group of people who's behavior she doesn't appreciate. Your friends are loudly shouting at the television and yelling over each other. If you're busy shouting over each other, it's no wonder she doesn't feel that they want to get to know her.
In your response, you said that you're disappointed in the group for not being more welcoming and you feel uncomfortable talking to the group about their behavior. How exactly do you expect your girlfriend to fix the problem if YOU can't do it. They are your incredibly close friends and you can't talk to them?
It sounds as though she is willing to socialize with them in smaller groups or perhaps for different activities. Surely, you do something a bit less raucous.
She's not asking you to avoid these people. She's asking you to see them without her. I'm super social and I can see her point.
posted by 26.2 at 1:52 AM on September 4, 2007 [1 favorite]
In your response, you said that you're disappointed in the group for not being more welcoming and you feel uncomfortable talking to the group about their behavior. How exactly do you expect your girlfriend to fix the problem if YOU can't do it. They are your incredibly close friends and you can't talk to them?
It sounds as though she is willing to socialize with them in smaller groups or perhaps for different activities. Surely, you do something a bit less raucous.
She's not asking you to avoid these people. She's asking you to see them without her. I'm super social and I can see her point.
posted by 26.2 at 1:52 AM on September 4, 2007 [1 favorite]
I think you're worrying about something that doesn't have to be an issue.
Your girlfriend sounds like she's really tried the best she can. Even though she really hates big noisy groups and she hates reality T.V., for your sake she tried for a year to go with you to be with your big group of noisy friends to watch reality T.V.
She's tried to contribute to the group, but they cut her off and don't pay her attention, and you yourself say that you're disappointed that they haven't been more welcoming.
She sounds wonderful--she really understands how important this group is to you, she tried her best for a year, it's not a good fit, so she'll still get together with them some, but just nowhere near as frequently as you want. Plus, she's encouraging you to see them on your own. What more could you want?
We get together often, at times as frequent as once a week, and while I was single they were the center of my social life.
I think this is the key here: when you were single. Our focus changes when we become part of a relationship. We don't ignore our friends, but they're no longer the center of our lives. Our partner is. You can't have both being the center (which you probably know).
You also can't force incompatible people/groups to like each other, much as you'd like them to. You're setting yourself up for disappointment if you continue to try.
The current agreement is that I make time to see them on our nights off, but what this really comes down to is that I never see them anymore (such as most of this summer).
That's not her fault, though. It's up to you (and them) to figure out the scheduling.
I am the social one in the relationship. She prefers one on one or up to four people
Here's an article that might apply to your girlfriend (I don't know for sure) and that might give you some insight: Caring For Your Introvert.
I'd recommend that you stop making this an issue in your relationship. Your girlfriend clearly cares for you, and if you try to do what makes her happiest, then accept that she recognizes her own likes, dislikes, and boundaries. Please honor them. She's being perfectly reasonable and generous.
posted by purplesludge at 2:01 AM on September 4, 2007 [1 favorite]
Your girlfriend sounds like she's really tried the best she can. Even though she really hates big noisy groups and she hates reality T.V., for your sake she tried for a year to go with you to be with your big group of noisy friends to watch reality T.V.
She's tried to contribute to the group, but they cut her off and don't pay her attention, and you yourself say that you're disappointed that they haven't been more welcoming.
She sounds wonderful--she really understands how important this group is to you, she tried her best for a year, it's not a good fit, so she'll still get together with them some, but just nowhere near as frequently as you want. Plus, she's encouraging you to see them on your own. What more could you want?
We get together often, at times as frequent as once a week, and while I was single they were the center of my social life.
I think this is the key here: when you were single. Our focus changes when we become part of a relationship. We don't ignore our friends, but they're no longer the center of our lives. Our partner is. You can't have both being the center (which you probably know).
You also can't force incompatible people/groups to like each other, much as you'd like them to. You're setting yourself up for disappointment if you continue to try.
The current agreement is that I make time to see them on our nights off, but what this really comes down to is that I never see them anymore (such as most of this summer).
That's not her fault, though. It's up to you (and them) to figure out the scheduling.
I am the social one in the relationship. She prefers one on one or up to four people
Here's an article that might apply to your girlfriend (I don't know for sure) and that might give you some insight: Caring For Your Introvert.
I'd recommend that you stop making this an issue in your relationship. Your girlfriend clearly cares for you, and if you try to do what makes her happiest, then accept that she recognizes her own likes, dislikes, and boundaries. Please honor them. She's being perfectly reasonable and generous.
posted by purplesludge at 2:01 AM on September 4, 2007 [1 favorite]
With the further explanation, it definitely sounds like this is a basic temperamental thing that you probably can't force to work any better than it already is. Big raucous groups are the worst type of social situation for me, and especially if they were all doing an activity I hated, it wouldn't so much be an issue of "I will just suck it up and do this for the person I love for one night." If it were, no big deal - you make compromises in a relationship. But you may have someone on your hands as introverted as I am, and in my case it wouldn't just be a not-great night, it would throw me off balance and make me generally out of sorts and unhappy for at least a day or two unless I could always arrange to have a lot of alone time the next day to recharge.
She's trying to be up front with you about why the situation doesn't work for her, and to offer ways for it to work for you without making her miserable, and maybe that's the best you can manage in this kind of situation.
I don't think it would be unreasonable for you to work something out with her where there's more flexibility in arranging to see your friends on short notice without her. And/or perhaps you could try to find some other activity to do with the group that is less conducive to noisy behavior and might be more manageable for her.
posted by Stacey at 4:37 AM on September 4, 2007
She's trying to be up front with you about why the situation doesn't work for her, and to offer ways for it to work for you without making her miserable, and maybe that's the best you can manage in this kind of situation.
I don't think it would be unreasonable for you to work something out with her where there's more flexibility in arranging to see your friends on short notice without her. And/or perhaps you could try to find some other activity to do with the group that is less conducive to noisy behavior and might be more manageable for her.
posted by Stacey at 4:37 AM on September 4, 2007
I've been in her place before, in the past. And my boyfriend thought that the issue was what you'd described.
What was it really? The fact that I was intent on hanging out with my boyfriend, with his friends, but what ends up happening is "This is so-and-so's girlfriend, Blah. Okay have fun." And I'd end up having to make conversation with someone I just met when the only thing we have in common is that we're someone's girlfriend and the person I wanted to see was at the other end of the room.
You can bring the two together, but if you're treating the situation like girlfriend playdates, then goddamnit you've got to knock it off. No wonder she's annoyed. You might not realize you're doing it, but take a look at the situation and see if that's what happens.
posted by sephira at 5:13 AM on September 4, 2007
What was it really? The fact that I was intent on hanging out with my boyfriend, with his friends, but what ends up happening is "This is so-and-so's girlfriend, Blah. Okay have fun." And I'd end up having to make conversation with someone I just met when the only thing we have in common is that we're someone's girlfriend and the person I wanted to see was at the other end of the room.
You can bring the two together, but if you're treating the situation like girlfriend playdates, then goddamnit you've got to knock it off. No wonder she's annoyed. You might not realize you're doing it, but take a look at the situation and see if that's what happens.
posted by sephira at 5:13 AM on September 4, 2007
Response by poster: thanks, everyone.... i feel like i have a better perspective on it all, now. i'm not describing all the aspects of the situation, but you've addressed much of it.
one further question: when i start doing the solo thing w/ them, how do i field their questions when they ask where she is? do i just come out and say "she doesn't like hanging out w/ the group", or do i just make up reasons till they stop asking?
i don't want to antagonize the situation, but i also don't want to lie about it.
posted by cgs at 5:55 AM on September 4, 2007
one further question: when i start doing the solo thing w/ them, how do i field their questions when they ask where she is? do i just come out and say "she doesn't like hanging out w/ the group", or do i just make up reasons till they stop asking?
i don't want to antagonize the situation, but i also don't want to lie about it.
posted by cgs at 5:55 AM on September 4, 2007
You know, I'm an old married woman, and from that perspective I can tell you you don't have to be joined at the hip with your partner at all times. There is NOTHING WRONG with hanging out with your buds without her.
Simply designate Survivor night as buddy night. If they ask tell them she is also doing HER own thing. (it doesn't matter what "her own thing is." It could be reading a book in her pyjamas. Whatever.)
And then, other times you can socialize with her and one or two of the group at other times. This does two things: Letting them see she doesn't hate them, and helping them get to know HER better. Which would solve your problems.
posted by konolia at 6:29 AM on September 4, 2007
Simply designate Survivor night as buddy night. If they ask tell them she is also doing HER own thing. (it doesn't matter what "her own thing is." It could be reading a book in her pyjamas. Whatever.)
And then, other times you can socialize with her and one or two of the group at other times. This does two things: Letting them see she doesn't hate them, and helping them get to know HER better. Which would solve your problems.
posted by konolia at 6:29 AM on September 4, 2007
I would avoid saying "she doesn't like hanging out with the group." Your friends haven't been seeing you as much as they used to, which they've surely noticed. They've also probably made the connection between the fact that they see you less often and the fact that you have this girlfriend. If you think you'll want both the friends and the girlfriend in your life in the future, don't do anything to encourage the natural tendency of the group of old friends to start blaming the girlfriend for your absence. This will only lead to problems down the road.
posted by barelylegalrealist at 6:41 AM on September 4, 2007
posted by barelylegalrealist at 6:41 AM on September 4, 2007
More perspective, cgs; I'm in a situation similar to yours, and I love the girl so much I'm in for the long haul (we're married).
The advice about designating a weekly or bi-weekly night with your buds is indeed brilliant; I have been using a similar strategy for a while now. I just wanted to add that it does become more difficult when other factors and demands on your time get added into the mix, like greater professional responsibilities or kids. if you're like me, you may be left with a certain sense of guilt about enjoying yourself without your better half, which you'll just have to learn to deal with; as appears so in your case, what I share with my friends is irreplaceable and critical for my well-being.
One thing that makes this compartmentalization of your life more or less feasible is whether your gf has engagements of her own, things she can pursue while you're with your friends. 'Survivor' night is one thing, but maybe not always enough.
Regarding your last question, I've just told my friends, not that she hates them, but that she has trouble relating to them and would rather I enjoy myself rather than worrying whether she got every last quip. They've accepted that, and this has still left the door open for us all to join up for the odd barbecue or whatever.
posted by rudster at 7:00 AM on September 4, 2007
The advice about designating a weekly or bi-weekly night with your buds is indeed brilliant; I have been using a similar strategy for a while now. I just wanted to add that it does become more difficult when other factors and demands on your time get added into the mix, like greater professional responsibilities or kids. if you're like me, you may be left with a certain sense of guilt about enjoying yourself without your better half, which you'll just have to learn to deal with; as appears so in your case, what I share with my friends is irreplaceable and critical for my well-being.
One thing that makes this compartmentalization of your life more or less feasible is whether your gf has engagements of her own, things she can pursue while you're with your friends. 'Survivor' night is one thing, but maybe not always enough.
Regarding your last question, I've just told my friends, not that she hates them, but that she has trouble relating to them and would rather I enjoy myself rather than worrying whether she got every last quip. They've accepted that, and this has still left the door open for us all to join up for the odd barbecue or whatever.
posted by rudster at 7:00 AM on September 4, 2007
Since I am a huge introvert and I don't mind people knowing it, my husband has learned to simply go places by himself and tell people "she's sorry to have missed you, but large groups aren't her thing." That is nothing but the truth, and doesn't imply that I have any issues with any of the individuals in the group. Would that work for you/her?
posted by MsElaineous at 7:15 AM on September 4, 2007
posted by MsElaineous at 7:15 AM on September 4, 2007
I *hate* hanging out in large groups. I find it stressful and without benefit -- it's hard for me to make connections when the gathering tops 4-5 people. Even then, it's tricky for me.
Give her a lot of quality time 1-1 with the core members of the group and the people you think she'd most get along with. Let her form her own friendships with them, on her own terms, in relaxed settings.
She may never want to go to the big group activities, but she'll be a part of what you're hoping to introduce her to -- your social life.
posted by cior at 8:40 AM on September 4, 2007
Give her a lot of quality time 1-1 with the core members of the group and the people you think she'd most get along with. Let her form her own friendships with them, on her own terms, in relaxed settings.
She may never want to go to the big group activities, but she'll be a part of what you're hoping to introduce her to -- your social life.
posted by cior at 8:40 AM on September 4, 2007
So, also having been the girlfriend, I hear a couple of things:
- you are engaged in a loud clique with lots of in-jokes and back history. It is hard to engage anyone in this situation, especially your girlfriend.
- it sounds like your friends are one of those morphy-groups that want everyone's S.O. to join in the fun
What I'm not hearing from you is that you're trying to make the bridge. Honestly, it's fun for you to quote those movies you saw 8 years ago when you were fucked up in the dorm, but for your girlfriend, not so much. Groups like that tend not to have conversations, as much as they all talk at once, and how are you going to join in that?
Here's what my husband did to bridge the gap, and it made it more fun for everyone, so I've finally been able to make friends with them:
- start with parts of the subgroup, for her to get comfortable and bond with them on a smaller level.
- when the conversations steers too long in back in the day, change the subject, making sure that it includes GF - "oh, we went to see the best movie" or "Did Susie tell you about what she did at work last week? It rocks!"
- accept that sometimes the two don't go together. My husband's friends had a nasty, evil, fucking terrible mean monopoly game that would involve shouting, criticism, analysis of what you did six moves ahead, and just bad behavior (one of the wives cried b/c her husband was so mean to her by 'being one of the guys'). No monopoly for me EVER.
- at the big parties, orchestrate some offline kitchen conversations. I'm sure that some of these people have some things in common - nuture that.
- try doing a group activity that's new to everyone - group gets to hang, girl has some equal opportunity to get in on the ground floor. We had a lot of luck going to the movies together - opps for small convo on the side, and lots of loud yelling
If you're spending that much time together, chances are, she's going to be around for a while, so I'd suggest that you try to make it work.
My husband felt like I wasn't trying for a long time, until I took him and one of his buds to a party held by my friends, with lots of in-jokes and back in the day. They spent all night huddled in the kitchen looking lost, and after everyone else nodded politely and had to get beers after Buddy started spouting Saturday Night Live, hell, things got a little more civilized from my end.
And yes, guy's night out is always acceptable. :)
posted by beezy at 9:58 AM on September 4, 2007
- you are engaged in a loud clique with lots of in-jokes and back history. It is hard to engage anyone in this situation, especially your girlfriend.
- it sounds like your friends are one of those morphy-groups that want everyone's S.O. to join in the fun
What I'm not hearing from you is that you're trying to make the bridge. Honestly, it's fun for you to quote those movies you saw 8 years ago when you were fucked up in the dorm, but for your girlfriend, not so much. Groups like that tend not to have conversations, as much as they all talk at once, and how are you going to join in that?
Here's what my husband did to bridge the gap, and it made it more fun for everyone, so I've finally been able to make friends with them:
- start with parts of the subgroup, for her to get comfortable and bond with them on a smaller level.
- when the conversations steers too long in back in the day, change the subject, making sure that it includes GF - "oh, we went to see the best movie" or "Did Susie tell you about what she did at work last week? It rocks!"
- accept that sometimes the two don't go together. My husband's friends had a nasty, evil, fucking terrible mean monopoly game that would involve shouting, criticism, analysis of what you did six moves ahead, and just bad behavior (one of the wives cried b/c her husband was so mean to her by 'being one of the guys'). No monopoly for me EVER.
- at the big parties, orchestrate some offline kitchen conversations. I'm sure that some of these people have some things in common - nuture that.
- try doing a group activity that's new to everyone - group gets to hang, girl has some equal opportunity to get in on the ground floor. We had a lot of luck going to the movies together - opps for small convo on the side, and lots of loud yelling
If you're spending that much time together, chances are, she's going to be around for a while, so I'd suggest that you try to make it work.
My husband felt like I wasn't trying for a long time, until I took him and one of his buds to a party held by my friends, with lots of in-jokes and back in the day. They spent all night huddled in the kitchen looking lost, and after everyone else nodded politely and had to get beers after Buddy started spouting Saturday Night Live, hell, things got a little more civilized from my end.
And yes, guy's night out is always acceptable. :)
posted by beezy at 9:58 AM on September 4, 2007
re: pinksuperhero, i feel like alot of it comes from her really not liking the group vibe. often we get shouty, all talking on top of each other... this drives her crazy. she feels like we cut her off and don't pay attention.
Wow, that sounds like hell on earth. I would rather pull my fingernails out than have to deal with that on a weekly basis. Sounds (to me, an extremely biased observer) like she gave it a shot and it's just not her cup of tea. So go without her. Yell, scream, come home happy and refreshed and give her a big smooch. You don't have to tell your friends "My girlfriend hates you"; just say, Oh, she's off doing (whatever she is doing). If your friends can't deal with that, than they're babies. Feel free to post another question on that subject if need be :-D
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 3:12 PM on September 4, 2007 [1 favorite]
Wow, that sounds like hell on earth. I would rather pull my fingernails out than have to deal with that on a weekly basis. Sounds (to me, an extremely biased observer) like she gave it a shot and it's just not her cup of tea. So go without her. Yell, scream, come home happy and refreshed and give her a big smooch. You don't have to tell your friends "My girlfriend hates you"; just say, Oh, she's off doing (whatever she is doing). If your friends can't deal with that, than they're babies. Feel free to post another question on that subject if need be :-D
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 3:12 PM on September 4, 2007 [1 favorite]
Most of this has already been covered, but a couple of extras...
Sounds like she's okay with you spending time with your mates without her - you're the one that feels uncomfortable about it, maybe because your mates' partners do tend to go along? So maybe you just need to let your friends know that you're both actually okay with spending time apart, and her not being there doesn't say anything about your committment to the relationship, or about her feelings towards them. To explain her absence, you've got a world of diplomatic options - "I wanted some time with the boys" or "she's having dinner with her sister / catching up on her emails / looking forward to having the house to herself for a night". It doesn't sound like she doesn't like them, or that they don't like her, so this should be fine. As long as you keep inviting her along (with the expectation that she will mostly refuse) and she goes along occasionally (you've got to make the effort occasionally in a relationship - and if it's only occasional, it might be more fun for her), then that should do it.
Also sounds like the main issue for her is that your friends don't organise things in advance, so your choice is to meet her for dinner as planned, or cancel on her and meet up with your mates instead. Can you ask them to be a bit more considerate and try to make plans in advance? Might be tricky if most of the gang are in joined-at-the-hip relationships, so this wouldn't be a problem for them, but it's a valid request if they care about you. Or even become the organiser yourself, thereby making sure that boys' nights out (in) don't conflict with plans you've already made?
I think it sounds like you have a healthy relationship - partly because of (not despite of) the fact that your girlfriend doesn't hang out with you and your mates every week.
posted by finding.perdita at 4:49 PM on September 4, 2007
Sounds like she's okay with you spending time with your mates without her - you're the one that feels uncomfortable about it, maybe because your mates' partners do tend to go along? So maybe you just need to let your friends know that you're both actually okay with spending time apart, and her not being there doesn't say anything about your committment to the relationship, or about her feelings towards them. To explain her absence, you've got a world of diplomatic options - "I wanted some time with the boys" or "she's having dinner with her sister / catching up on her emails / looking forward to having the house to herself for a night". It doesn't sound like she doesn't like them, or that they don't like her, so this should be fine. As long as you keep inviting her along (with the expectation that she will mostly refuse) and she goes along occasionally (you've got to make the effort occasionally in a relationship - and if it's only occasional, it might be more fun for her), then that should do it.
Also sounds like the main issue for her is that your friends don't organise things in advance, so your choice is to meet her for dinner as planned, or cancel on her and meet up with your mates instead. Can you ask them to be a bit more considerate and try to make plans in advance? Might be tricky if most of the gang are in joined-at-the-hip relationships, so this wouldn't be a problem for them, but it's a valid request if they care about you. Or even become the organiser yourself, thereby making sure that boys' nights out (in) don't conflict with plans you've already made?
I think it sounds like you have a healthy relationship - partly because of (not despite of) the fact that your girlfriend doesn't hang out with you and your mates every week.
posted by finding.perdita at 4:49 PM on September 4, 2007
This thread is closed to new comments.
If you keep spending time with them, eventually she will get that your friends really are important to you and will hopefully give it another shot.
Of course, continue to spend lots of time with your girlfriend as well. If she starts to complain about you spending time with your friends, do not compromise (as long as you are being fair and spending about as much time with her as you were before). She will need to learn that in order to have a healthy, happy relationship with you, that you have to be able to have your friendships and interests outside of the relationship that the two of you share.
Don't be afraid, either. She will learn to live with it, and if she can't, it probably isn't going to work out long term for you, to be brutally honest.
You can't make her like your friends. But you can make sure that you don't lose your connection with your friends (and in many ways, yourself) because it was easier just to sink into a symbiotic relationship with your girlfriend.
posted by pazazygeek at 9:24 PM on September 3, 2007 [1 favorite]