Cats are too picky.

March 19, 2007 9:13 AM

I have questions about: feeding two cats different kinds of cat food, getting a cat that's used to grazing to eat on a schedule, premium brands of cat food, and possible alternatives to prescription diets. This is surprisingly long.

The cast of characters: Miles, 7 years old. He's had liver problems since he was a kitten, and he eats Royal Canin Renal Care LP pouches and some Felovite every day. He's pretty active, and begs (loudly) for lunch meat whenever any happens to be nearby. He didn't seem to care for the Renal Care dry food. Sorry to be so vague about Miles's health problems -- I only know that the vet runs blood test every six months to do a GPT (?) and that will the prescription food and the felovite it seems as though he's still just outside the normal range for, um, something. Sweet Jane, 11 years old. She's got a big belly, and she's not very active and not very bright. She's not at all interested in human food. Both cats are indoor only, and I've had them both since they were kittens.

For years, Sweet Jane ate Nutro Natural Choice Comeplete Care dry food (first the weight management formula, then the senior formula), which we left out and she grazed on all day. Miles would sneak some of her food, which the vet said was ok, since it was pretty low protein. She left his food alone for the most part. A while ago, I made the horrible mistake of moving Sweet Jane's dish to another room, and that activated some sort of cat neurosis, and she stopped eating her food and would only eat the dog's dry food (a cardiac prescription diet) (and, yes, I tried moving her dish back, but apparently, it had been tainted or something, because she still wouldn't eat the Nutro).

I've been reading a lot about cat food lately (thanks, biscotti!) and I wanted to get Jane some better food and also some wet food -- I had always heard that dry food was better for cats, but I know that thinking on that has changed. I bought her some Innova Reduced Fat and some Wellness cans, and she loves them, but the problem is Miles -- he seems to really like the food, too, but I think it has more protein than he should be eating. For comparison, the Royal Canin dry food has 21% crude protein (which is what he SHOULD be eating if he ate dry food) vs. 32% for the Innova Reduced fat and the Royal Canin pouches have 7% crude protein vs 10% for the Wellness canned. I know that the Royal Canin is also lower in phosphurus than most regular cat food.

I've tried monitoring them, and I've tried locking Miles in the bathroom while she eats (don't worry, he likes it in there -- he likes to sleep in the sink), but she just nibbles. She'll eat a few bites, then stop, and then ask for more a few minutes later. This morning, I gave her one of the cans (3 oz) while I was getting ready for work, and it took her half an hour to eat about two thirds of it. I know I'm probably being paranoid, but I know that cats can get liver problems from not eating for a relatively short amount of time, and, even though having two cats with liver problems would solve this whole food issue, I'd rather that not happen -- if I only give her access to her food for 20 minutes 3 times a day, will she eventually get used to the idea that she's got to get down to business and eat it, or will she just waste away?

Also, of the higher grade cat foods, which brand is cheapest? And are there alternatives to prescription diets for cats with liver problems? I would even cook stuff for him if I knew what to cook and how to do it safely. Is there anything that would work well for both cats? His food is costing me an arm and a leg, and I have to get it delivered through Vetcentric and I'm mad at them about how they handled a recall last year (as in, they didn't inform anyone, just put stickers on the new stuff and we had month's worth of the old stuff, so we didn't OPEN the new stuff, so we kept feeding Miles the bad stuff and he got sick and lost a ton of weight, the poor little guy.)

I plan on talking to my vet about this, but I thought that getting some advice first might help me know what questions to ask her.

posted by amarynth to Pets & Animals (12 answers total)

BTW, since you're talking about pet food, make sure you know about the recent urgent pet food recall.
posted by redteam at 9:37 AM on March 19, 2007

Are both of the cats similarly mobile? If Sweet Jane can get to a high spot that Miles can't reach, you could keep her food there. Also, if Sweet Jane has a big belly, you probably have a good amount of training time before she wastes away.
posted by bassjump at 10:23 AM on March 19, 2007

I've had some experience switching from dry to wet and grazing to feedings. If you're able to, you might want to start out with three to four feedings per day, then cut back to two or three. Put Sweet Jane's food out for a half hour, then take up anything she doesn't eat. Don't feed her again until the next mealtime, then do the same. When she seems to be getting the concept down, you can start taking mealtimes out and making them a bit larger.

I did some research on the dangers of fatty liver disease associated with rapid weight loss. Keeping her rate of loss down to a nice, steady crawl will be the safest way to go about doing this. You may also want to give her a daily dose of L-Carnitine (between 250 - 500 mg.), available at your local drug store. My understanding is that it helps with the metabolism of fatty acids, and is another buffer from liver disease during the weight loss process.

Data point: my two recently adopted cats (currently 20 and 17 lbs.) were in the system for about two years, and had lost absolutely no weight on their prescribed diet of 2/3 cup Royal Canin Light. I've got them on one 5 oz. can of Wellness and 250 mg. of L-Carnitine each per day. This doesn't seem like a lot, but they seem to be quite satisfied with it, and they are slowly dropping weight. I'm also playing with them to get them moving around a bit more. The 20 lb. cat is a lazy, lazy guy, and so far only "Da Bird" gets him moving. I can't rave enough about this toy.

A couple of informative links:

Dr. Pierson's site, which focuses on feline diabetes, but has everything to do with feline obesity as well, and her page on commercial canned foods.

A site selling you on something you've already been converted to, but which has some informative tidbits and links.
posted by moira at 10:28 AM on March 19, 2007

Also, on quick perusal, I think this site has a ton of very useful information on liver disease and diet. I think you may be surprised about what it has to say about protein.
posted by moira at 10:36 AM on March 19, 2007

You missed me, didn't you?

After a bit more skimming around, it looks like there are differing opinions on liver disease and diet. I'd recommend doing as much research as you can on your own, and getting a couple of professional opinions. Sorry for the too-quick link.
posted by moira at 10:48 AM on March 19, 2007

You might look into the foods from the Wysong company. They were developed by a veterinarian who is a pioneer in the field of animal nutrition. The have kibbles and wet foods. Some good info here. Incidentally, my cat (no health issues) does real well on the single-source protein Wellness (chicken and turkey) and the Innova Evo (no grain, low carb, probably too high in protein for you). He eats Serengeti dry food.
posted by vito90 at 11:02 AM on March 19, 2007

Response by poster: No apologies necessary, moira -- thanks for all of the links. It only just occurred to me that Miles has never had any of the symptoms of liver disease, and his diagnosis was just from his GPT. I suppose I should have questioned the vet more at the time, but she seemed concerned and I didn't want him to get sick. I'll have a lot of questions for her now to make up for it!
posted by amarynth at 11:07 AM on March 19, 2007

Response by poster: Actually, I shouldn't say it was just from his GPT, as there may have been some other blood tests that led the vet to that diagnosis, it's just that the GPT is the one she always shows me when she gets his results back.
posted by amarynth at 11:10 AM on March 19, 2007

According to a brief search, GPT (glutamic pyruvic transaminase) is something that is released into the blood when there has been damage to the liver or heart, so it seems your vet is right to be concerned. In my experience, they generally don't do a blood panel on a cat unless there's some illness, or unless the cat is aging. It's possible that there were other non-apparent symptoms that led to the tests in the first place, and pointed to liver disease. Next time you go in to the vet, you might consider bringing a list of questions and a notebook to scribble notes in. I know that in the past, I think I've heard and remembered and addressed everything, only to be at home hours later realizing I only had a vague idea.
posted by moira at 11:39 AM on March 19, 2007

If you mentioned why SweetJane can't eat the same food as Miles, I missed it. Having spent a lot of time living in multiple-animal households, my rule of thumb is that if there's an animal with special dietary needs, and feeding separately is difficult (as is often the case with cats), and the special diet food won't harm the other cats, then everyone eats the special diet food. I'd find a good-quality lower-protein food (the Royal Canin is actually not a bad food at all, so you may not need to switch unless you want to), and just feed it to both cats. Remember when you're reading labels that you will need to take into account the moisture content when deciphering the protein percentage, since the less moisture there is, the higher the percent will be, regardless of what the actual dry percentage is.
posted by biscotti at 3:56 PM on March 19, 2007

Absolutely check that recall list, it's incredibly long!

I have an old fat girl myself, and I just put a measured amount in her bowl once a day so that she's still able to graze but doesn't overeat. Ask the vet if there's any reason she can't eat his special diet - that would certainly make things easier.

Quick note, especially while we're on the subject of cat livers: be just a little vigilant when you're changing the eating habits of an overweight cat. Cat livers don't process fat very well, so if she stops eating for long enough to start metabolizing body fat, it starts a chain reaction that can result in hepatic lipidosis. I had no idea until my girl got very, very sick. She's fine now - it's usually treatable but the treatment can be very expensive and really miserable for everyone involved. I'm certainly not trying to scare you, it's just one of those things where an ounce of prevention is worth, say, $1700 and a stomach tube. It never would have occurred to me to make sure my obese cat was eating enough!

(And yes, cats develop food aversions very, very easily. If something bad happens within a few hours of eating something in particular they very well may avoid that food for the rest of their lives. So it doesn't surprise me that just moving her bowl would freak her out!)

The point is, since your vet knows Miles so well, you can probably just call him/her up and ask for advice. Even if they're eating the same diet it's probably hard to keep track of who's eating how much. It's probably worth it to bring all this to the doctor, even if you have to make an appointment, but since you're such a loyal client they're very likely to help you over the phone.

Also, forums and message boards have been a huge help for me with cat health and behavior. Just reading other people's stories will probably give you some ideas.
posted by ultraultraboomerang at 5:48 PM on March 19, 2007

Response by poster: Thanks for the responses, everyone! I've decided not to change anything further until we move next month, but now I have a couple of different ideas to try that will allow Jane to continue to graze and also allow Miles freedom from the bathroom while she takes her sweet time eating.
posted by amarynth at 7:48 AM on March 20, 2007