What can we do to make it right?
March 1, 2007 8:42 PM Subscribe
What should I do about an over-eager or clumsy loss-prevention officer?
I just got home from one of the most aggravating experiences in recent memory. I went to Macy's to buy some sheets for my new bed, got a bath towel from the same department, paid with my Macy's card and started going downstairs. Thinking about my laundry situation I went down to the Men's department and bought some underwear and happened across a decent pair of work pants.
On my way out I was looking at watches and an employee comes up and identifies himself as "Michael, the store manager," he has a red name tag on and a wire coming out of his ear, and he starts asking me lots of "customer satisfaction" questions:
Him: Can I get someone to open up the case for you to try something on?
Me: No, I'm just seeing what you have.
H: I see you've done some shopping with us tonight.
M: Hm? Oh, yeah (remembering my three large bags).
H: Did you have a good shopping experience?
M: Sure.
H: What would you do if you weren't happy with the people who helped you tonight?
M: They told me to go to the website and let them know.
H: Ah yes.
H: What was the name of the person who helped you?
M: Huh?
M: I didn't make a point of remembering.
At this point I start kind of looking at him like he's crazy!
H: How did you pay tonight?
M: With my Macy's card?
H: What color is your card?
Now I'm like "wtf?!" and he seems to notice that I'm not exactly happy with his line of questioning.
H: Well I just want to see how your visit was this evening.
M: Are you sure?
I then leave.
Now, I'm angry at Macy's and I'm not sure how to rectify this. Call customer service? Just outright cancel my card and make a point never to go there again? Return everything I bought?
I'm fairly livid, but I've never experienced anything like this and in fact my high-school/college girlfriend was a Macy's loss-prevention officer. So, it seems, was this guy. Just an awful shopping experience when I was just doing regular shopping. Don't they want people to pick up hundreds of dollars of impulse buys?
I just got home from one of the most aggravating experiences in recent memory. I went to Macy's to buy some sheets for my new bed, got a bath towel from the same department, paid with my Macy's card and started going downstairs. Thinking about my laundry situation I went down to the Men's department and bought some underwear and happened across a decent pair of work pants.
On my way out I was looking at watches and an employee comes up and identifies himself as "Michael, the store manager," he has a red name tag on and a wire coming out of his ear, and he starts asking me lots of "customer satisfaction" questions:
Him: Can I get someone to open up the case for you to try something on?
Me: No, I'm just seeing what you have.
H: I see you've done some shopping with us tonight.
M: Hm? Oh, yeah (remembering my three large bags).
H: Did you have a good shopping experience?
M: Sure.
H: What would you do if you weren't happy with the people who helped you tonight?
M: They told me to go to the website and let them know.
H: Ah yes.
H: What was the name of the person who helped you?
M: Huh?
M: I didn't make a point of remembering.
At this point I start kind of looking at him like he's crazy!
H: How did you pay tonight?
M: With my Macy's card?
H: What color is your card?
Now I'm like "wtf?!" and he seems to notice that I'm not exactly happy with his line of questioning.
H: Well I just want to see how your visit was this evening.
M: Are you sure?
I then leave.
Now, I'm angry at Macy's and I'm not sure how to rectify this. Call customer service? Just outright cancel my card and make a point never to go there again? Return everything I bought?
I'm fairly livid, but I've never experienced anything like this and in fact my high-school/college girlfriend was a Macy's loss-prevention officer. So, it seems, was this guy. Just an awful shopping experience when I was just doing regular shopping. Don't they want people to pick up hundreds of dollars of impulse buys?
He might have been who he said he was -- having worked in a department store myself, I know first hand that sometimes the store managers can be a little, uh, involved in the customer experience. Your experience, though, was a bit beyond the pale.
FWIW he might have asked about the color of your card because many department stores have different levels of cards (normal, gold, platinum) and it was his way of seeing how committed you were to the company.
One way to check his story - just call the store tomorrow and ask for the store manager's name. If they say "Michael So-and-so," say, "Oh, you know I think I've met him before, is he the man who looks like $whatever_he_looks_like?"
If the guy misrepresented himself, insert outrage here. Either way, you might want to let corporate know that you thought it was really peculiar and didn't appreciate the inquisition.
posted by brain cloud at 8:53 PM on March 1, 2007
FWIW he might have asked about the color of your card because many department stores have different levels of cards (normal, gold, platinum) and it was his way of seeing how committed you were to the company.
One way to check his story - just call the store tomorrow and ask for the store manager's name. If they say "Michael So-and-so," say, "Oh, you know I think I've met him before, is he the man who looks like $whatever_he_looks_like?"
If the guy misrepresented himself, insert outrage here. Either way, you might want to let corporate know that you thought it was really peculiar and didn't appreciate the inquisition.
posted by brain cloud at 8:53 PM on March 1, 2007
That seems like a better experience than the usual loss-prevention story (which tends to involve getting tackled in the parking lot).
Maybe he really was Michael the store manager? If it was my store, and I saw a good customer (one buying lots of stuff) I'd want to make sure you had a good experience. He was checking up on his employees to make sure they're following *their* customer service script ("M: They told me to go to the website and let them know.").
And he also wanted to make sure you were using a Macy's Ultra-Super-Elite Platinum card or whatever - something to give you some perks so you'd keep coming back for more stuff.
A little intrusive? Sure, in the sense that he's trying to be your friend to get you to buy more stuff, a rather manipulative sort of friendship. But, well, I've seen lots worse.
posted by jellicle at 9:02 PM on March 1, 2007
Maybe he really was Michael the store manager? If it was my store, and I saw a good customer (one buying lots of stuff) I'd want to make sure you had a good experience. He was checking up on his employees to make sure they're following *their* customer service script ("M: They told me to go to the website and let them know.").
And he also wanted to make sure you were using a Macy's Ultra-Super-Elite Platinum card or whatever - something to give you some perks so you'd keep coming back for more stuff.
A little intrusive? Sure, in the sense that he's trying to be your friend to get you to buy more stuff, a rather manipulative sort of friendship. But, well, I've seen lots worse.
posted by jellicle at 9:02 PM on March 1, 2007
Oh, and another thing -- unless Macy's has a very different approach to loss prevention than their competitors, it's been my experience that security (er, loss prevention) officers tend to try and melt into the background and not be noticed, rather than accost the customers with forced joviality. Thus reinforcing my opinion that the guy was a manager of some stripe or another. Retail managers get crazy, I tell you. Something happens to their brains.
posted by brain cloud at 9:03 PM on March 1, 2007
posted by brain cloud at 9:03 PM on March 1, 2007
H: What would you do if you weren't happy with the people who helped you tonight?
M: They told me to go to the website and let them know.
H: Ah yes.
posted by edgeways at 9:43 PM on March 1, 2007 [3 favorites]
M: They told me to go to the website and let them know.
H: Ah yes.
posted by edgeways at 9:43 PM on March 1, 2007 [3 favorites]
Sometimes retail managers distance customers by trying to figure out who among their employees is slacking. Sometimes when I, as a department store employee, was trying to gain a break ("I didn't lose a customer, I gained a break") the manager of my department would just happen to show up and get very inquisitive with the customers.
I never figured how they figured somebody would want to be harassed like that, but whatever, I got to go back to reading magazines or talking on the phone or whatever it was I did as an abhorrent retail employee.
posted by birdie birdington at 11:47 PM on March 1, 2007
I never figured how they figured somebody would want to be harassed like that, but whatever, I got to go back to reading magazines or talking on the phone or whatever it was I did as an abhorrent retail employee.
posted by birdie birdington at 11:47 PM on March 1, 2007
I've always wondered about those "May I see your papers, comrade" inspections that they pull on you as you're going out the door at BJ's/Costco/etc. They irritate the hell out of me, and although I've never been quite as ballsy as the guy in MLIS's link, I might have to try it one of these days. After I've stood around for 20 or 30 minutes to purchase my stuff, and they've transferred ownership to me, I really don't think they have any right to demand that I stand around in some other line, just so some guy can give the cart a once-over and punch a hole in the receipt.
I understand the stores need to keep shrink and other losses down, but they need to find ways of doing it that are unobtrusive and don't penalize honest customers.
posted by Kadin2048 at 12:15 AM on March 2, 2007
I understand the stores need to keep shrink and other losses down, but they need to find ways of doing it that are unobtrusive and don't penalize honest customers.
posted by Kadin2048 at 12:15 AM on March 2, 2007
Response by poster: Oh, as for the receipt-checking people at the gates, I never even stop for them. This guy was much different. Very inquisitive and not at all like an over-eager suit-type. I don't know what kind of training would beget this line of questioning, but asking someone how they paid for the merchandise they're carrying is three shades beyond rude. Who might he think he is? I mean really, if he's checking receipt then Macy's has dropped six levels down to be using CompUSA techniques out of the blue. Even lower than CompUSA if they are walking up to people not even waiting until they're leaving the store (I was looking at watches remember, not transversing the threshold of the front door).
My girlfriend in high-school and early college was a loss-prevention officer at Macy's and Emporium and I know that they have training to prevent bad stops of customers. This guy was just one shade shy of that. I mean really, as I was walking out the door my thought was "How long have you been a loss-prevention officer?" because either the training has gotten lax or Macy's is really scraping the bottom of the barrell demographically and I just got caught up in their paranoia.
All that said, he wasn't trying to be my friend. He didn't ask me if I needed a drink of water, coffee or someone to carry my (admittedly weighty) bags. It wasn't a concierge conversation. He was inquiring as to my experience with forays into my methods of payment. I'm sorry, but a store manager would not talk about money, my method of payment, or anything else relating to my reasons for possessing my purchases.
posted by rhizome at 1:14 AM on March 2, 2007
My girlfriend in high-school and early college was a loss-prevention officer at Macy's and Emporium and I know that they have training to prevent bad stops of customers. This guy was just one shade shy of that. I mean really, as I was walking out the door my thought was "How long have you been a loss-prevention officer?" because either the training has gotten lax or Macy's is really scraping the bottom of the barrell demographically and I just got caught up in their paranoia.
All that said, he wasn't trying to be my friend. He didn't ask me if I needed a drink of water, coffee or someone to carry my (admittedly weighty) bags. It wasn't a concierge conversation. He was inquiring as to my experience with forays into my methods of payment. I'm sorry, but a store manager would not talk about money, my method of payment, or anything else relating to my reasons for possessing my purchases.
posted by rhizome at 1:14 AM on March 2, 2007
Sir, I need to see your receipt.
I refused to show my receipt the last time I exited Sam's Club. It caused quite a commotion. I didn't feel like waiting in line to have my receipt checked, so I pushed my cart straight towards the door. The employee called out to me, "Sir, I need to see your receipt" to which I replied, "No thank you." The front wheels of my cart were through the door when an elderly couple (who later turned out to be off-duty Sam's employees) physically blocked my way. I pushed my cart, and they pushed back, which was infuriating. I had to work hard to stay calm. Pretty soon I was surrounded by walkie-talkie toting Sam's Club employees and a manager, and we had a tense but civil argument.
I asked why I was accused of theft. Manager said she didn't think I stole anything. I said "then I'd like to take my items to my car." She replied it was store policy, and that I had agreed to receipt checks when I signed up.
I offered to wait while they pulled a copy of my membership agreement, and promised that if I had in fact agreed to show my receipt upon exiting the store, I would hand over my receipt and apologize to all the employees for causing such a commotion. Manager opted instead to watch me leave.
posted by reeddavid at 1:28 AM on March 2, 2007
I refused to show my receipt the last time I exited Sam's Club. It caused quite a commotion. I didn't feel like waiting in line to have my receipt checked, so I pushed my cart straight towards the door. The employee called out to me, "Sir, I need to see your receipt" to which I replied, "No thank you." The front wheels of my cart were through the door when an elderly couple (who later turned out to be off-duty Sam's employees) physically blocked my way. I pushed my cart, and they pushed back, which was infuriating. I had to work hard to stay calm. Pretty soon I was surrounded by walkie-talkie toting Sam's Club employees and a manager, and we had a tense but civil argument.
I asked why I was accused of theft. Manager said she didn't think I stole anything. I said "then I'd like to take my items to my car." She replied it was store policy, and that I had agreed to receipt checks when I signed up.
I offered to wait while they pulled a copy of my membership agreement, and promised that if I had in fact agreed to show my receipt upon exiting the store, I would hand over my receipt and apologize to all the employees for causing such a commotion. Manager opted instead to watch me leave.
posted by reeddavid at 1:28 AM on March 2, 2007
I'd have told that loss prevention guy that he could either stop asking me intrusive questions or he could watch me return each and every item I had just purchased and then afterwards cut up my Macy's card.
I mean it.
posted by konolia at 4:18 AM on March 2, 2007
I mean it.
posted by konolia at 4:18 AM on March 2, 2007
Don't mean to derail, but reeddavid, Sam's Club membership policy (what you agree to when you sign up and pay them) is listed on their website under general policies:
"Receipts: To ensure that you are charged correctly for the merchandise you have selected, you will be requested to show your receipt when exiting."
So yes, for non-membership-based stores, you can ignore them when they ask to see your receipt on exit. But for Sam's Club and Costco, you already agreed to it.
posted by inigo2 at 5:04 AM on March 2, 2007
"Receipts: To ensure that you are charged correctly for the merchandise you have selected, you will be requested to show your receipt when exiting."
So yes, for non-membership-based stores, you can ignore them when they ask to see your receipt on exit. But for Sam's Club and Costco, you already agreed to it.
posted by inigo2 at 5:04 AM on March 2, 2007
Receipts: To ensure that you are charged correctly for the merchandise you have selected, you will be requested to show your receipt when exiting.
"You will be requested to show"??
That's terrible sentence construction "You will be required to show your receipt" is what I think they're going for - otherwise, it just says "we'll ask you if we can see your receipt" not "we'll make you."
Very interesting....
posted by anastasiav at 5:26 AM on March 2, 2007 [1 favorite]
"You will be requested to show"??
That's terrible sentence construction "You will be required to show your receipt" is what I think they're going for - otherwise, it just says "we'll ask you if we can see your receipt" not "we'll make you."
Very interesting....
posted by anastasiav at 5:26 AM on March 2, 2007 [1 favorite]
Exactly - all you agreed to is that they will ask you to show them your receipt - nothing further!
To the OP: I'm with those who commented above suggesting that you get in touch with the company via their website. Let them know that you're not happy (I very occasionally feel motivated to write a letter of complaint over poor service, and it's a great way of letting off steam. Use civil language, naturally, and be honest, but you can be as free as you like when describing how it made you feel/the impression it gave you about the shop. You'll feel better afterwards, too ;)
posted by different at 6:07 AM on March 2, 2007
To the OP: I'm with those who commented above suggesting that you get in touch with the company via their website. Let them know that you're not happy (I very occasionally feel motivated to write a letter of complaint over poor service, and it's a great way of letting off steam. Use civil language, naturally, and be honest, but you can be as free as you like when describing how it made you feel/the impression it gave you about the shop. You'll feel better afterwards, too ;)
posted by different at 6:07 AM on March 2, 2007
You tell your story well. A clear, concise letter to the actual store manager or a regional manager might be your best weapon, if you think Macy's has it within their power to make it up to you. And if you want something more specific than an apology, say so.
You may also want to look through the tales of customer woe at The Consumerist for ideas.
posted by gnomeloaf at 6:17 AM on March 2, 2007
You may also want to look through the tales of customer woe at The Consumerist for ideas.
posted by gnomeloaf at 6:17 AM on March 2, 2007
I just don't get the outrage about receipt checking.
I pay at the register, I check the receipt to ensure they didn't overcharge me (that they held up their end of the baragin). At the door, they check my receipt to ensure I didn't steal anything (that I held up my end of the bargain). What's the big deal? People steal all the time. Stores overcharge all the time. Both sides need to be watched.
Oh, and the receipt lady at Costco always draws a smiley face for the kid. If she forgets, there will be hell to pay.
Back to question: sounds like a socially awkward guy checking on your experience more than loss prevention.
posted by mrbugsentry at 6:35 AM on March 2, 2007
I pay at the register, I check the receipt to ensure they didn't overcharge me (that they held up their end of the baragin). At the door, they check my receipt to ensure I didn't steal anything (that I held up my end of the bargain). What's the big deal? People steal all the time. Stores overcharge all the time. Both sides need to be watched.
Oh, and the receipt lady at Costco always draws a smiley face for the kid. If she forgets, there will be hell to pay.
Back to question: sounds like a socially awkward guy checking on your experience more than loss prevention.
posted by mrbugsentry at 6:35 AM on March 2, 2007
Further to gnomeloaf, an important part of any complaint letter is a statement of what would make you satisfied you had been taken seriously.
If you want an apology, say so. Expect to get one.
If you want to interview the employee together with HR, not gonna happen.
If you want to be treated to lunch in the café, you just might get it.
If all you want is to know that management has been made aware that their staff are damaging the store’s image, virtue being its own reward, say that too. (Because yes, it is virtuous. If you were a store owner, you would want to know what kind of impression your staff were making, and the more detailed the better.)
Letters of complaint are a lot easier to write if you are in the habit of writing letters of thanks for good service. Because you know you write both kinds, you feel fine about passing on bad news as well as good.
posted by kika at 6:35 AM on March 2, 2007
If you want an apology, say so. Expect to get one.
If you want to interview the employee together with HR, not gonna happen.
If you want to be treated to lunch in the café, you just might get it.
If all you want is to know that management has been made aware that their staff are damaging the store’s image, virtue being its own reward, say that too. (Because yes, it is virtuous. If you were a store owner, you would want to know what kind of impression your staff were making, and the more detailed the better.)
Letters of complaint are a lot easier to write if you are in the habit of writing letters of thanks for good service. Because you know you write both kinds, you feel fine about passing on bad news as well as good.
posted by kika at 6:35 AM on March 2, 2007
I have a friend who frequently writes to companies. He has the best results with registered letters sent to people at the officer/executive level.
posted by mingshan at 6:36 AM on March 2, 2007
posted by mingshan at 6:36 AM on March 2, 2007
for the costco stuff - why not make them actually check the price of each item? "how much should i have paid for the giant bag of twizzlers"? yep, that's what my receipt says. what about the box of 144 granola bars?" i mean, you're just asking them to do their job, right?
posted by noloveforned at 6:50 AM on March 2, 2007
posted by noloveforned at 6:50 AM on March 2, 2007
They're not looking to see if they've overcharged you. They're doing an item count. Receipt says 10 items. Basket has 10 items. Check.
It annoys me even more at Best Buy because my stuff is already in a bag and they can not do an item count. They're just glancing to see if the date on my receipt is today's date. I mean, really, the guy in the yellow shirt who checks receipts at the door just smiled at me when I was in the check out line.
posted by onhazier at 7:20 AM on March 2, 2007
It annoys me even more at Best Buy because my stuff is already in a bag and they can not do an item count. They're just glancing to see if the date on my receipt is today's date. I mean, really, the guy in the yellow shirt who checks receipts at the door just smiled at me when I was in the check out line.
posted by onhazier at 7:20 AM on March 2, 2007
I was at costco with a friend one day, and the reciept check showed that her 5 gallon bucket of detergent had not ben charged. She had left it in the cart and pushed it through the checkout, SOP for heavy items, and mentioned it to the cashier, but it had not ben scanned. We had to wait about 10 minutes to go back and pay for the thing, and they acted like it was her fault.
posted by yohko at 7:26 AM on March 2, 2007
posted by yohko at 7:26 AM on March 2, 2007
It doesn't sound like a loss prevention tactic at all. It sounds like he was either a customer relations or market research tactic of some sort.
Your bags put you on display as a good Macy's customer, or at least one who spent a good amount of time there that night. You were a prime candidate for any sort of market research or customer satisfaction survey they were taking.
When he asked you how you paid, had you said cash, check, debit card or non-macy's credit card, he probably would have asked you if your sales associate offered you a card or told you about the benefits of using your macys card. He might have asked you why you weren't interested in a macys card. Not enough benefits to make it worthwhile? Just don't want/need another card? Not because he was grilling you, but when they combine all the customers' answers, they are able to plan a better product or a better way to market the product.
When you said you paid with your Macy's card, he asked you what color your card was because it was easier and less crass than asking you how much you ususally spend per year at Macys. Your card color would have told him that. Had you told him the color of your card, he probably would have asked you if you used or valued the extras that come with each card. Had you been open and less defensive, he might have asked you what benefits they could offer that would encourage you to become eligible for a higher-level card.
As for the other questions, possibly they've done recent training to get the employees to direct customers to the website. Possibly, they are down in sales while the number of customers has stayed steady. Maybe they are interested in finding out why customers are still visiting but buying less. Is it because of rude sales people? Salespeople who don't know enough about the products they are selling?
Or maybe the powers-that-be at macy's corporate have told store managers that they are required to spend a certain amount of hours per week interacting with customers.
Believe it or not, a lot of customers feel honored when they are approached by a store manager and asked about their experience. Similar to diners who are visited by the chef and asked about their dining experience.
For whatever reason, this guy put you on the defensive. Maybe he just isn't that good at customer interaction. Maybe he was having an off night. Who knows what the reason is. However, the implication that you were a security risk was probably the furthest thing from his mind.
posted by necessitas at 8:22 AM on March 2, 2007 [3 favorites]
Your bags put you on display as a good Macy's customer, or at least one who spent a good amount of time there that night. You were a prime candidate for any sort of market research or customer satisfaction survey they were taking.
When he asked you how you paid, had you said cash, check, debit card or non-macy's credit card, he probably would have asked you if your sales associate offered you a card or told you about the benefits of using your macys card. He might have asked you why you weren't interested in a macys card. Not enough benefits to make it worthwhile? Just don't want/need another card? Not because he was grilling you, but when they combine all the customers' answers, they are able to plan a better product or a better way to market the product.
When you said you paid with your Macy's card, he asked you what color your card was because it was easier and less crass than asking you how much you ususally spend per year at Macys. Your card color would have told him that. Had you told him the color of your card, he probably would have asked you if you used or valued the extras that come with each card. Had you been open and less defensive, he might have asked you what benefits they could offer that would encourage you to become eligible for a higher-level card.
As for the other questions, possibly they've done recent training to get the employees to direct customers to the website. Possibly, they are down in sales while the number of customers has stayed steady. Maybe they are interested in finding out why customers are still visiting but buying less. Is it because of rude sales people? Salespeople who don't know enough about the products they are selling?
Or maybe the powers-that-be at macy's corporate have told store managers that they are required to spend a certain amount of hours per week interacting with customers.
Believe it or not, a lot of customers feel honored when they are approached by a store manager and asked about their experience. Similar to diners who are visited by the chef and asked about their dining experience.
For whatever reason, this guy put you on the defensive. Maybe he just isn't that good at customer interaction. Maybe he was having an off night. Who knows what the reason is. However, the implication that you were a security risk was probably the furthest thing from his mind.
posted by necessitas at 8:22 AM on March 2, 2007 [3 favorites]
necessitas, if the Store Manager had a clipboard and started out by asking if the OP would mind spending a few minutes responding to a survey, everything you said would be spot-on.
Our OP described a wire coming out of his ear, not a clipboard. That’s the weird part. People expect all sorts of questions from uniformed people with clipboards explaining that they are taking a survey. It’s not freaky at all.
People with wires in their ears and no clipboard or explanation of what they want from you, who just start asking questions that have no obvious relevance to anything, weird me out whether they are in uniforms or not. I don’t understand the situation, what is happening, what is wanted. It’s very upsetting.
Context is all.
posted by kika at 8:56 AM on March 2, 2007
Our OP described a wire coming out of his ear, not a clipboard. That’s the weird part. People expect all sorts of questions from uniformed people with clipboards explaining that they are taking a survey. It’s not freaky at all.
People with wires in their ears and no clipboard or explanation of what they want from you, who just start asking questions that have no obvious relevance to anything, weird me out whether they are in uniforms or not. I don’t understand the situation, what is happening, what is wanted. It’s very upsetting.
Context is all.
posted by kika at 8:56 AM on March 2, 2007
I think necessitas is totally right on. What she says rings true to me, as a former veteran of the horrible life of department store sales.
Plus, you don't need a clipboard to do a survey -- I think if their intent was to collect useful information about the OP's visit, the clipboard thing would be off-putting. I can see why they would have done it in a more conversational (albiet, ultimately ham-handed) sort of way.
posted by contessa at 9:03 AM on March 2, 2007
Plus, you don't need a clipboard to do a survey -- I think if their intent was to collect useful information about the OP's visit, the clipboard thing would be off-putting. I can see why they would have done it in a more conversational (albiet, ultimately ham-handed) sort of way.
posted by contessa at 9:03 AM on March 2, 2007
I agree with those who suspect he wasn't a security type at all.
As to what to do about it: if you've got time to kill, after you've answered some of his questions, start asking some of your own. How long have you been a manager here at Macy's? Do you enjoy it? What other duties does that entail besides checking on customer satisfaction? Does it pay good money? How are the benefits?
After you've been kind enough to answer his semi-intrusive questions, I'd like to see him try to get out of answering yours.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 9:07 AM on March 2, 2007
As to what to do about it: if you've got time to kill, after you've answered some of his questions, start asking some of your own. How long have you been a manager here at Macy's? Do you enjoy it? What other duties does that entail besides checking on customer satisfaction? Does it pay good money? How are the benefits?
After you've been kind enough to answer his semi-intrusive questions, I'd like to see him try to get out of answering yours.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 9:07 AM on March 2, 2007
Collecting information only works if you collect the information. contessa, are you suggesting that Macy’s has replaced the humble clipboard with high-tech recording devices that transmit the conversation in real time to a room of scribes in India who immediately code it into a computer database? I’m sorry, but if I thought Macy’s had a team of interviewers recording my conversations without my knowledge or consent, I would dislike that much more than seeing answers ticked off on a checklist.
In my experience, people who approach me with a bunch of slightly odd questions are trying to distract me while somebody else is doing something they shouldn’t.
While this guy was probably not trying to enable someone else to steal the OPs shopping bags, he was acting like he was. While people are rightly suspicious that people wielding clipboards are trying to sell them something, I can deal with that. People trying to pickpocket me, um, not really.
Macy’s really needs to know how customers are responding to this method of approach. And if pickpockets are passing themselves off as store managers, they need to know that too.
posted by kika at 9:35 AM on March 2, 2007
In my experience, people who approach me with a bunch of slightly odd questions are trying to distract me while somebody else is doing something they shouldn’t.
While this guy was probably not trying to enable someone else to steal the OPs shopping bags, he was acting like he was. While people are rightly suspicious that people wielding clipboards are trying to sell them something, I can deal with that. People trying to pickpocket me, um, not really.
Macy’s really needs to know how customers are responding to this method of approach. And if pickpockets are passing themselves off as store managers, they need to know that too.
posted by kika at 9:35 AM on March 2, 2007
kika - retail and sales management types get all sorts of kooky ideas about the best ways to engage a customer: "be causual, talk to them, make them feel relaxed, make them feel like a friend" and all sorts of other nonsense that doesn't play out well in the real world. The guy was probably trying to engage him in a "casual conversation" and doing a lousy job at it. Or he was doing an ok job at it but rhizome was confused about his intentions and wasn't playing into it. The manager should have said "hey, while I have you here can I ask you a couple questions about your experience" but he was probably trying to do the whole "have a conversation with your customer" thing. At the very least, he should have softened things by asking "do you mind if I ask how you paid" instead of just asking how he paid.
As for the wire in his ear, yes I know security types wear wires in their ears, but they aren't the only ones. A store manager has a lot of responsibilities. When I worked in a department store back in college, the manager in charge of the store (not always the store manager) had to come collect drawer overages (when you have more than X amount of any bill in your register, you had to call someone to collect it) and do a variety of other things. Back then, the store used a really annoying bell system and each manager and each issue had a code bell that would ring throughout the store. I am glad that stores got rid of that because, as a shopper, it was a pain. Sure, he could use a cell phone, but it would be annoying and you don't always get good reception in malls and department stores anyway. The wire is a more elegant solution. He can just keep track of what he needs to do and what is going on in the store without having to stop what he is doing to answer a call.
posted by necessitas at 9:42 AM on March 2, 2007
As for the wire in his ear, yes I know security types wear wires in their ears, but they aren't the only ones. A store manager has a lot of responsibilities. When I worked in a department store back in college, the manager in charge of the store (not always the store manager) had to come collect drawer overages (when you have more than X amount of any bill in your register, you had to call someone to collect it) and do a variety of other things. Back then, the store used a really annoying bell system and each manager and each issue had a code bell that would ring throughout the store. I am glad that stores got rid of that because, as a shopper, it was a pain. Sure, he could use a cell phone, but it would be annoying and you don't always get good reception in malls and department stores anyway. The wire is a more elegant solution. He can just keep track of what he needs to do and what is going on in the store without having to stop what he is doing to answer a call.
posted by necessitas at 9:42 AM on March 2, 2007
Even if he was just a socially awkward store manager, that's worth contacting customer service about. They shouldn't promote someone who's unable to interact effectively and comfortably with customers--who's unable to put them at ease--to assistant manager, let alone to store manager. Sorry, but this totally raises my former-retail-customer-service-worker ire. Rar.
posted by paleography at 9:53 AM on March 2, 2007
posted by paleography at 9:53 AM on March 2, 2007
Please write a letter! If this person was a loss-prevention officer, then he needs more training. If this was some feeble attempt at collecting marketing information, then Macy's needs to know how this alienates customers (and I say that not only as someone who hates being bothered like you were, but also as someone who has worked in customer service and has been made to ask stupid questions under the ridiculous reasoning that "it's what the customer wants"). A well-written, articulate letter addressing a real problem that is fixable is a rare yet effective thing, and if Macy's takes it seriously, you might just make life easier for at least a few other customers and/or employees.
posted by AV at 9:55 AM on March 2, 2007
posted by AV at 9:55 AM on March 2, 2007
I'd like to Nth that it probably wasn't a security guy at all. When I worked retail, if a LP person talked to you, they would have asked to check your receipt. It sounds like this guy was over zealously checking up on his employees' actions.
posted by drezdn at 9:56 AM on March 2, 2007
posted by drezdn at 9:56 AM on March 2, 2007
He wasn't security, he was exacty who he said he was.
Macy's is having a big customer satisfaction drive right now (Every time I've shopped there in the last month the clerks have spent more time telling me how I can rate my satisfaction than actually serving me.
He didn't have a clip board because he knows those questions by heart and frankly, if I see someone comes up to me with a clipboard when I'm carrying a pile of bags I'm going to tell them to screw off because they're going to obviously take up lots of my time. He's not doing science for a research agency, he's checking up on his employees, which he all knows. He doesn't need a clip board.
And any manager in a large store has a wire in his ear these days. It keeps them available to many departments and is less intrusive than paging or on-the-hip walky talkeis.
There was obviously something about him that put you off, but cutting up your card and warning everyone on the internet away from the store because you got a bad vibe from one guy is a huge over reaction to say the least. However write the regional manager if it makes you feel better.
posted by Ookseer at 10:10 AM on March 2, 2007
Macy's is having a big customer satisfaction drive right now (Every time I've shopped there in the last month the clerks have spent more time telling me how I can rate my satisfaction than actually serving me.
He didn't have a clip board because he knows those questions by heart and frankly, if I see someone comes up to me with a clipboard when I'm carrying a pile of bags I'm going to tell them to screw off because they're going to obviously take up lots of my time. He's not doing science for a research agency, he's checking up on his employees, which he all knows. He doesn't need a clip board.
And any manager in a large store has a wire in his ear these days. It keeps them available to many departments and is less intrusive than paging or on-the-hip walky talkeis.
There was obviously something about him that put you off, but cutting up your card and warning everyone on the internet away from the store because you got a bad vibe from one guy is a huge over reaction to say the least. However write the regional manager if it makes you feel better.
posted by Ookseer at 10:10 AM on March 2, 2007
and if Macy's takes it seriously
If you go to the website or send a letter, it will be directed back to the store and the store will have to address it in some way within a short time frame -- something like 48 or 72 hours from receipt at the store. I heard this directly from 2 women that read these things for Federated and then redirect them to the appropriate people at the stores.
posted by probablysteve at 10:12 AM on March 2, 2007
If you go to the website or send a letter, it will be directed back to the store and the store will have to address it in some way within a short time frame -- something like 48 or 72 hours from receipt at the store. I heard this directly from 2 women that read these things for Federated and then redirect them to the appropriate people at the stores.
posted by probablysteve at 10:12 AM on March 2, 2007
but cutting up your card and warning everyone on the internet away from the store because you got a bad vibe from one guy is a huge over reaction to say the least
Look, I don't think it is an overreaction to being bothered while I am trying to shop. Penneys doesn't pull this crap nor does Belk's.
posted by konolia at 12:04 PM on March 2, 2007
Look, I don't think it is an overreaction to being bothered while I am trying to shop. Penneys doesn't pull this crap nor does Belk's.
posted by konolia at 12:04 PM on March 2, 2007
Oh, and speaking of Penney's, on their receipts they have a website you can visit to obtain 15 percent off your next purchase (you can do this once a month.) When you go to the website they ask you questions about your shopping experience. They get their info, you get your discount, everybody is happy, and no one got their shopping interrupted.
posted by konolia at 12:07 PM on March 2, 2007
posted by konolia at 12:07 PM on March 2, 2007
Response by poster: I understand what those of you are saying about this being a real customer satisfaction campaign, and perhaps that's exactly what happened here. However, and I don't want to get all "shoulda" about the situation, if this is the case then the campaign was designed by someone with very little marketing experience. I had three shopping bags full of $400 of mostly non-sale merchandise. I was obviously having a fine time happily spending money with very little friction or difficulty. I had less trouble buying a clearance toolbox at Sears the night before!
If that's how they want to do things then I'll treat them the same as I do the stores that ask to check my receipt: I don't patronize them. The feeling is the same. "Hey, you just helped the company out a lot...why?" Well, if I really think about it it doesn't really matter where I get my sheets and I'm going to go to the store that let's me do my thing without hassle. Make no mistake: I blew off his question about help with the watches because I don't need help shopping and I know how to find help if I want it. I actually walked around to find the watches because I wanted one and the $450 watch that caught my eye almost left with me last night. It wasn't just "on my way out." It is just plain stupid to get between a shopper and the thing they're minding their own business looking at. "Can I help you?" is certainly fine, but if I don't need help then you don't launch into something they want me to help *them* with. Call it a capitalist entitlement, fine, I can take it. It's an entitlement for them to think they have some right to my thoughts about them just because I spent money there. This is what caused them to lose a watch sale and a doubling of my spending that visit, no matter if he was a manager or a loss-prevention officer.
It's not my job to tell them how to be a better company when it's obvious I think they're doing just fine. Now I don't and this particular person fucked all of that up. I told him that I'd go to the website if I wasn't having a good shopping experience, but that was covered in the first minute of conversation! To be clear: 80% crass is less than 110% crass, but so what? I don't tolerate crass. Are they looking to boost the demographic of their shoppers who are tolerant of crass questions? Because that's who's going to be giving them the answers that inform their future strategy.
Beyond all of this, as soon as I left the store I called my mom, the most brainless and habitual shopper I know. She spends amounts that cause customer service people to call her or mail postcards telling her of sales or other things she might like. She had never heard of anything like this ever ever ever.
posted by rhizome at 7:19 PM on March 2, 2007
If that's how they want to do things then I'll treat them the same as I do the stores that ask to check my receipt: I don't patronize them. The feeling is the same. "Hey, you just helped the company out a lot...why?" Well, if I really think about it it doesn't really matter where I get my sheets and I'm going to go to the store that let's me do my thing without hassle. Make no mistake: I blew off his question about help with the watches because I don't need help shopping and I know how to find help if I want it. I actually walked around to find the watches because I wanted one and the $450 watch that caught my eye almost left with me last night. It wasn't just "on my way out." It is just plain stupid to get between a shopper and the thing they're minding their own business looking at. "Can I help you?" is certainly fine, but if I don't need help then you don't launch into something they want me to help *them* with. Call it a capitalist entitlement, fine, I can take it. It's an entitlement for them to think they have some right to my thoughts about them just because I spent money there. This is what caused them to lose a watch sale and a doubling of my spending that visit, no matter if he was a manager or a loss-prevention officer.
It's not my job to tell them how to be a better company when it's obvious I think they're doing just fine. Now I don't and this particular person fucked all of that up. I told him that I'd go to the website if I wasn't having a good shopping experience, but that was covered in the first minute of conversation! To be clear: 80% crass is less than 110% crass, but so what? I don't tolerate crass. Are they looking to boost the demographic of their shoppers who are tolerant of crass questions? Because that's who's going to be giving them the answers that inform their future strategy.
Beyond all of this, as soon as I left the store I called my mom, the most brainless and habitual shopper I know. She spends amounts that cause customer service people to call her or mail postcards telling her of sales or other things she might like. She had never heard of anything like this ever ever ever.
posted by rhizome at 7:19 PM on March 2, 2007
necessitas is right: this wasn't loss-prevention, this was a manager trying to make as sure as he could that you had a good shopping experience. As bizarre as it seems, there is a class of person who enjoys being "catered to" this way, who enjoys swooshing through a Macy's, casually informing the manager that she is a black-card customer and deserving of extra-special treatment. He saw you had 3 large bags; that means that, to him, you are absolutely better than gold.
He wanted to make sure that you were as happy as you could possibly be; if that meant showing you a watch, or canning some salesdroid who offended you, I'm sure he would've been delighted to oblige.
It's always a little disturbing to me to note the creep, year by year, in the places I shop, from helpfulness to obsequiousness to downright servility. It baffles me.
posted by ikkyu2 at 7:44 PM on March 2, 2007
He wanted to make sure that you were as happy as you could possibly be; if that meant showing you a watch, or canning some salesdroid who offended you, I'm sure he would've been delighted to oblige.
It's always a little disturbing to me to note the creep, year by year, in the places I shop, from helpfulness to obsequiousness to downright servility. It baffles me.
posted by ikkyu2 at 7:44 PM on March 2, 2007
I have to say, I read the original post twice and still don't understand what was wrong with the situation, apart from the kind of mild annoyance we all have to suffer every day when people talk to us and we're not interested in talking to them.
The fact that you believe(d) it was a "loss-prevention" thing means that you think you were being accused of being a thief?
If it wasn't for that clue, I wouldn't have even the faintest clue why you were posting, and I still don't get why you're so angry.
You had a short conversation with a mildly clueless person who asked you five inane questions. So ... what was so terrible about it?
posted by AmbroseChapel at 8:30 PM on March 2, 2007
The fact that you believe(d) it was a "loss-prevention" thing means that you think you were being accused of being a thief?
If it wasn't for that clue, I wouldn't have even the faintest clue why you were posting, and I still don't get why you're so angry.
You had a short conversation with a mildly clueless person who asked you five inane questions. So ... what was so terrible about it?
posted by AmbroseChapel at 8:30 PM on March 2, 2007
Just think: what kind of person rises to the rank of manager in a department store? Someone agressive, not too bright, a bit too enthusiastic about the company and with ideas about customer service that are eerily literal in the way they reflect the mission statement.
That's the person you encountered. It's probably not his fault, in the same sense that being chased by a rabid yippy dog is not the dog's fault. Someone higher up probably unleashed him on you with some ridiculous mandate about schmoozing with the customers. Since this guy is not a natural schmoozer (if he was, why would he be a manager in a department store, etc.), his execution was clumsy.
Writing a letter to an executive would be a good idea, although it would be nice if you mentioned the specific store in this thread, too. That way, your complaint will be stored for posterity, and the Macy's people are bound to find it sooner or later.
All that said, I would have told the schmoe to please leave me alone.
posted by bingo at 10:58 PM on March 2, 2007
That's the person you encountered. It's probably not his fault, in the same sense that being chased by a rabid yippy dog is not the dog's fault. Someone higher up probably unleashed him on you with some ridiculous mandate about schmoozing with the customers. Since this guy is not a natural schmoozer (if he was, why would he be a manager in a department store, etc.), his execution was clumsy.
Writing a letter to an executive would be a good idea, although it would be nice if you mentioned the specific store in this thread, too. That way, your complaint will be stored for posterity, and the Macy's people are bound to find it sooner or later.
All that said, I would have told the schmoe to please leave me alone.
posted by bingo at 10:58 PM on March 2, 2007
Look, I don't think it is an overreaction to being bothered while I am trying to shop. Penneys doesn't pull this crap nor does Belk's.
Do you recoil in fear when the waiter asks you how your meal was? If they ask you if you'd like coffee or desert do you storm out and start a campaign against the restaurant?
I hate bad customer service as much as the next guy. In fact much more, since I spend a good porton of my time in Japan where I get better service at McDonalds in Tokyo than the best restaurants in San Francsico.
And yet I still don't see what the guy did to piss anyone off. He was maybe a bit socially awkward, but that's not a crime, and frankly I have sympathy for a guy who doesn't have a lot of social skills but is trying his best.
If you're bothered by someone it's your responsibility to tell them. They can't read your mind. Nor would you want them to.
posted by Ookseer at 10:12 AM on March 3, 2007
Do you recoil in fear when the waiter asks you how your meal was? If they ask you if you'd like coffee or desert do you storm out and start a campaign against the restaurant?
I hate bad customer service as much as the next guy. In fact much more, since I spend a good porton of my time in Japan where I get better service at McDonalds in Tokyo than the best restaurants in San Francsico.
And yet I still don't see what the guy did to piss anyone off. He was maybe a bit socially awkward, but that's not a crime, and frankly I have sympathy for a guy who doesn't have a lot of social skills but is trying his best.
If you're bothered by someone it's your responsibility to tell them. They can't read your mind. Nor would you want them to.
posted by Ookseer at 10:12 AM on March 3, 2007
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by dilettante at 8:53 PM on March 1, 2007