I have CONFIDENCE!....or not...
March 17, 2025 2:20 PM Subscribe
How do I deal with the disconnect between how I feel about my acting vs. how other people feel about it? Whining within, be forewarned!
It took me decades to get cast in shows. Couldn't get cast in high school or college, wanted to do improv but could never get on a team. Then I found a few theaters that will take me, huzzah, and I did musical theater for years, and I did a lot of online theater in pandemic. You'd think this would be going pretty well, and it is, mostly. I'm actually allowed on stages these days!
I can sing and dance, but I'm probably average at singing after years of lessons and despite many years of dance lessons, I don't have a dancer body (no leg flexibility, genetically large stomach). Therefore, I am considered Not Good At Dancing even though I can do the moves, because I don't look great at doing other people's steps. I don't expect to get anything other than ensemble in musicals and that's all I qualify for. I personally think I can act, I can do cold readings in a lively, fun, personality-y fashion. I get great parts online. I'm probably more character actress than anything else. But almost nobody is into me as an actor IRL. I literally have only gotten good parts in non-musicals if 5 people (not exaggerating on that number, it's been 5) are at the audition and they *have* to cast me. If there's any options for choice, they aren't picking me. I get blown off quickly at almost all auditions except really small ones. I've seen people who read like they are flat and dead get cast, and I don't.
I am old, "fat" (i.e. not anorexic), weird/funny looking/obvious nerd/not a hot chick. I am in my 40's but look a lot younger. My casting can be all over the map as to whether or not I'm cast young or old--I would personally cast me as young, but if people know my age, they think I should be going for roles in their 60's. I don't fit anywhere and women are abundant and of low value and there are few parts for them and 95% of them are hot chicks. I'm not quite at the older diva stage yet. I don't fit any roles. I'll never be a director's "vision." (People are always citing "director's vision" to me as to why you don't get cast.) I think it's pretty clear that most people I know/am friends with don't think I'm very good at this, from their reactions. A few think I am, or that's what they say to me anyway, but most people can just...tell I'm not quite good enough from looking at me.
I paid an audition coach to ask what I'm doing wrong and she said she didn't see that I was doing anything wrong/off-putting, it was a perfectly normal audition. (Audition coach is also a nerd of similar ilk to me and admitted that does limit your options.) My singing teacher thinks it's all about having Confidence! and if I just went into auditions like that, it would go well. My therapist tells me to think good things about myself and discount what others think. I personally think I CAN act. But it seems like 99% of the world doesn't agree with that.
I don't know how I'm supposed to go into an audition with Confidence! and Believe In Myself! and Believe That I Am Good/Great At This! when I'm well aware that that's not how others see me, and the packaging I came with is all wrong. I may see myself as good, but others so categorically do not most of the time that I can't figure out how to deal with the disconnect. I don't know how I'm supposed to be Confident! when I haven't earned that confidence by getting respect from others, consideration, parts where there was any level of competition. The advice I get told is JUST DO IT! and "fuck 'em!" but in my heart, I know damned well I'm not what others want, and I go into auditions managing my inevitable disappointment and just hoping I come out of the audition having enjoyed the experience instead of feeling ignored. I can't just go "fuck 'em!"
So, what do you do when you think you're good, but others (whose opinions matter more) disagree?
It took me decades to get cast in shows. Couldn't get cast in high school or college, wanted to do improv but could never get on a team. Then I found a few theaters that will take me, huzzah, and I did musical theater for years, and I did a lot of online theater in pandemic. You'd think this would be going pretty well, and it is, mostly. I'm actually allowed on stages these days!
I can sing and dance, but I'm probably average at singing after years of lessons and despite many years of dance lessons, I don't have a dancer body (no leg flexibility, genetically large stomach). Therefore, I am considered Not Good At Dancing even though I can do the moves, because I don't look great at doing other people's steps. I don't expect to get anything other than ensemble in musicals and that's all I qualify for. I personally think I can act, I can do cold readings in a lively, fun, personality-y fashion. I get great parts online. I'm probably more character actress than anything else. But almost nobody is into me as an actor IRL. I literally have only gotten good parts in non-musicals if 5 people (not exaggerating on that number, it's been 5) are at the audition and they *have* to cast me. If there's any options for choice, they aren't picking me. I get blown off quickly at almost all auditions except really small ones. I've seen people who read like they are flat and dead get cast, and I don't.
I am old, "fat" (i.e. not anorexic), weird/funny looking/obvious nerd/not a hot chick. I am in my 40's but look a lot younger. My casting can be all over the map as to whether or not I'm cast young or old--I would personally cast me as young, but if people know my age, they think I should be going for roles in their 60's. I don't fit anywhere and women are abundant and of low value and there are few parts for them and 95% of them are hot chicks. I'm not quite at the older diva stage yet. I don't fit any roles. I'll never be a director's "vision." (People are always citing "director's vision" to me as to why you don't get cast.) I think it's pretty clear that most people I know/am friends with don't think I'm very good at this, from their reactions. A few think I am, or that's what they say to me anyway, but most people can just...tell I'm not quite good enough from looking at me.
I paid an audition coach to ask what I'm doing wrong and she said she didn't see that I was doing anything wrong/off-putting, it was a perfectly normal audition. (Audition coach is also a nerd of similar ilk to me and admitted that does limit your options.) My singing teacher thinks it's all about having Confidence! and if I just went into auditions like that, it would go well. My therapist tells me to think good things about myself and discount what others think. I personally think I CAN act. But it seems like 99% of the world doesn't agree with that.
I don't know how I'm supposed to go into an audition with Confidence! and Believe In Myself! and Believe That I Am Good/Great At This! when I'm well aware that that's not how others see me, and the packaging I came with is all wrong. I may see myself as good, but others so categorically do not most of the time that I can't figure out how to deal with the disconnect. I don't know how I'm supposed to be Confident! when I haven't earned that confidence by getting respect from others, consideration, parts where there was any level of competition. The advice I get told is JUST DO IT! and "fuck 'em!" but in my heart, I know damned well I'm not what others want, and I go into auditions managing my inevitable disappointment and just hoping I come out of the audition having enjoyed the experience instead of feeling ignored. I can't just go "fuck 'em!"
So, what do you do when you think you're good, but others (whose opinions matter more) disagree?
One time I didn’t get a part I swear because I wasn’t desperate enough (non-union gig). As in, I could feel the power struggle energy off the director and I’m just not submissive. So, I mean, people can be weird in this world.
So (speaking from projection) in your case I’d work on my charm. Confidence and charm are not the same thing.
I also remember an interview I wanna say with Russel Crowe? Where he said he found his confidence by stopping trying to get the part and just showing how he would fully embody the role, and let the director decide if that’s what they were looking for. And Sharon stone’s famous interview when she finally realized she was Enough. And literally got her breakout role in the next week. So maybe find interviews with other actors and understand how they approach it might help.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 3:19 PM on March 17 [6 favorites]
So (speaking from projection) in your case I’d work on my charm. Confidence and charm are not the same thing.
I also remember an interview I wanna say with Russel Crowe? Where he said he found his confidence by stopping trying to get the part and just showing how he would fully embody the role, and let the director decide if that’s what they were looking for. And Sharon stone’s famous interview when she finally realized she was Enough. And literally got her breakout role in the next week. So maybe find interviews with other actors and understand how they approach it might help.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 3:19 PM on March 17 [6 favorites]
Where are you geographically? Are you somewhere such that theater companies are kinda slim pickins? could you commute a bit further away to find your offbeat niche in a different community?
posted by seemoorglass at 3:20 PM on March 17 [2 favorites]
posted by seemoorglass at 3:20 PM on March 17 [2 favorites]
You're a middle aged femme in a deeply sexist ageist industry. That's it, that's the whole difficulty. Best not to personalize the failures or overthink unnecessary improvements when the problem is so obvious and has nothing to do with your ability or skills or confidence or charm. Sounds like you're doing a fantastic job even so. Bank on that.
posted by shadygrove at 3:35 PM on March 17 [18 favorites]
posted by shadygrove at 3:35 PM on March 17 [18 favorites]
What shadygrove said. I'm sure you *are* very good, but keep in mind all of your teachers, coaches etc are at least partly motivated to encourage you to keep going because doing so is how they get paid on an ongoing basis. By all means keep working at it for the love of the art, but try to release any and all expectations that Being Good will lead to Being Chosen, because that's just not how it works for 99% of us.
In the mean time, are you able to channel these skills you've worked so hard at into a different outlet, and get some positive feedback there? You might not be part of a "director's vision" but I'd be willing to bet you're loads more charming and personable than the average schmoe off the street who'd never set foot in an audition in the first place. I know lots of folks with performing arts backgrounds who use those skills to great success and accolades as educators, as an example (not just classroom teaching, but anything where you have to engage the public on a certain topic and try to pull people in).
posted by btfreek at 5:07 PM on March 17 [2 favorites]
In the mean time, are you able to channel these skills you've worked so hard at into a different outlet, and get some positive feedback there? You might not be part of a "director's vision" but I'd be willing to bet you're loads more charming and personable than the average schmoe off the street who'd never set foot in an audition in the first place. I know lots of folks with performing arts backgrounds who use those skills to great success and accolades as educators, as an example (not just classroom teaching, but anything where you have to engage the public on a certain topic and try to pull people in).
posted by btfreek at 5:07 PM on March 17 [2 favorites]
Totally feel ya. Many actors out there have experienced exactly what you're going through. The fact that you're confident in your abilities is a great thing. Everyone...no matter how talented they are or how "great a look" they have still gets a "no" 99% of the time. But it absolutely doesn't mean the industry doesn't think your good. For sure you're in a tough category. A middle aged woman isn't gonna see as many opportunities as someone who is younger. Just remember that in the acting world you can put in lots of years of training, get great head shots, audition a ton and still book nothing. It's not like becoming a doctor where if you put in the years and follow the path you'll be successful. No guarantees in the acting world. But if you love it, if you are confident in yourself, life is too short to quit. And as you age up the good news is that you'll have less competition as you get older. It's hard, it can be thankless, and it's easy to be resentful. Love the work, and that's all you'll ever need.
posted by ljs30 at 6:03 PM on March 17
posted by ljs30 at 6:03 PM on March 17
Consider trying out larping? The social atmosphere may favor you significantly more - it’s full of vibrant weirdos, and the games happen a lot more often than theater shows. And some of them are musical!
Consider a dating coach? Someone to work on your personal vibe with, not just your acting skills.
I’m going to go out on a limb and say that it sounds like you can act with your face and voice, but less so with your body. That would explain why you get good roles online but not in person, but it points to something you can try to influence. In theory, that audition coach should have picked up on it, but if they are the same type of nerd as you, maybe they have the same blind spot. It might be worth getting an acting coach or another audition coach for a second opinion too.
One more: consider a somatic therapist? This is a person who would help you connect your emotions to your body, and might help with fully embodying a role rather than just wearing it like a layer on top of your existing self.
posted by danceswithlight at 7:50 PM on March 17 [3 favorites]
Consider a dating coach? Someone to work on your personal vibe with, not just your acting skills.
I’m going to go out on a limb and say that it sounds like you can act with your face and voice, but less so with your body. That would explain why you get good roles online but not in person, but it points to something you can try to influence. In theory, that audition coach should have picked up on it, but if they are the same type of nerd as you, maybe they have the same blind spot. It might be worth getting an acting coach or another audition coach for a second opinion too.
One more: consider a somatic therapist? This is a person who would help you connect your emotions to your body, and might help with fully embodying a role rather than just wearing it like a layer on top of your existing self.
posted by danceswithlight at 7:50 PM on March 17 [3 favorites]
Advice that I have gotten and heard repeated is that a huge reason to be working on your own projects, even if they’re not commercially viable, is so you can go into an audition with an attitude of “I’ve got other shit to be doing right now, I am granting this audition some of my limited time so they better make it worth my while” and that this generates confidence and doesn’t bring solicitous, desperate energy into the room
posted by Jon_Evil at 7:58 PM on March 17 [5 favorites]
posted by Jon_Evil at 7:58 PM on March 17 [5 favorites]
I think it's pretty clear that most people I know/am friends with don't think I'm very good at this, from their reactions [...]
I paid an audition coach to ask what I'm doing wrong and she said she didn't see that I was doing anything wrong
So first of all well done on paying an audition coach for professional feedback. You might try asking another one too for a second opinion. But if you have friends or even acquaintances who you really think don't believe you're good enough, then I'd also try asking them for feedback. Not "am I good?", because they're likely to prioritize your feelings, but something like "I'm working on this audition and I need you to tell me 3 things to improve" or "tell me the thing to improve that would make the most difference" or whatever.
I'm probably more character actress than anything else [...] I'm not quite at the older diva stage yet.
Are you happy as a character actress? If so can you lean into it more than you have up till now? So that when a director thinks "what I need for this part is someone who can create a memorable character", you're a good fit? (Apologies if that's what you've been doing all along. It's just that for some roles it feels like looks and voice quality are paramount, but there are the other roles where the ability to be a singular weirdo matters more, and maybe that's a good niche to target.)
posted by trig at 4:41 AM on March 18 [1 favorite]
I paid an audition coach to ask what I'm doing wrong and she said she didn't see that I was doing anything wrong
So first of all well done on paying an audition coach for professional feedback. You might try asking another one too for a second opinion. But if you have friends or even acquaintances who you really think don't believe you're good enough, then I'd also try asking them for feedback. Not "am I good?", because they're likely to prioritize your feelings, but something like "I'm working on this audition and I need you to tell me 3 things to improve" or "tell me the thing to improve that would make the most difference" or whatever.
I'm probably more character actress than anything else [...] I'm not quite at the older diva stage yet.
Are you happy as a character actress? If so can you lean into it more than you have up till now? So that when a director thinks "what I need for this part is someone who can create a memorable character", you're a good fit? (Apologies if that's what you've been doing all along. It's just that for some roles it feels like looks and voice quality are paramount, but there are the other roles where the ability to be a singular weirdo matters more, and maybe that's a good niche to target.)
posted by trig at 4:41 AM on March 18 [1 favorite]
performers i know have shared success with the Alexander Technique. also see, e.g.
The AT group showed improvements relative to the control group in overall musical and technical quality, heart rate variance, self-rated anxiety and positive attitude to performance [nih]posted by HearHere at 5:20 AM on March 18
I sort of have no business answering this because I am not in the world of performing at all, but I do listen to a lot of interviews. Jon_Evil's advice is a recurring theme, performers made their own thing to be in.
Even hotties like Matt Damon and Ben Affleck, that's how they got their start. And speaking of those two, apparently Mindy Kaling got her break into TV writing doing a silly bit with a friend pretending to be Matt Damon and Ben Affleck that they fooled around with for a long time and then performed in some festival or something. Then when she was a writer she wrote herself onto the show.
On her podcast "Wiser Than Me" Julia Louis-Dreyfus interviewed Carol Burnett and "make your own thing" was the advice she got as a very young performer having no luck getting cast, and that's what she and friends did.
Think of actors who seem like they would have your problem.....not hot enough, not young enough, not a "director's vision" and find interviews with those people, see if they address this issue.
Break a leg!
posted by Jenny'sCricket at 6:14 AM on March 18
Even hotties like Matt Damon and Ben Affleck, that's how they got their start. And speaking of those two, apparently Mindy Kaling got her break into TV writing doing a silly bit with a friend pretending to be Matt Damon and Ben Affleck that they fooled around with for a long time and then performed in some festival or something. Then when she was a writer she wrote herself onto the show.
On her podcast "Wiser Than Me" Julia Louis-Dreyfus interviewed Carol Burnett and "make your own thing" was the advice she got as a very young performer having no luck getting cast, and that's what she and friends did.
Think of actors who seem like they would have your problem.....not hot enough, not young enough, not a "director's vision" and find interviews with those people, see if they address this issue.
Break a leg!
posted by Jenny'sCricket at 6:14 AM on March 18
Response by poster: Question answering:
Where are you geographically? Are you somewhere such that theater companies are kinda slim pickins? could you commute a bit further away to find your offbeat niche in a different community?
Northern California. I actually have pretty good selection for number of theaters, but I've had the best odds with really small theaters in small towns. Ones in the city--fuhgettaboutit. I've gotten into four of the smallest ones. But right now I'm inwardly pouting because one of the four is no longer going to cast me, so I won't be doing shows there any more and my options have gone way down.
I'm sure you *are* very good, but keep in mind all of your teachers, coaches etc are at least partly motivated to encourage you to keep going because doing so is how they get paid on an ongoing basis.
Good point. I think I am complete poo no matter what I do singingwise, actually, but my voice teacher somewhat thinks I'm better than I think I am. I think she's one of those "try for harder goals" people and right now I am all "look, I need to dial down to very small goals, like not fucking up."
I'd be willing to bet you're loads more charming and personable than the average schmoe off the street who'd never set foot in an audition in the first place.
Yes, but any average schmoe guy can walk in and get a part. Literally any! I don't think my charm is supplanting age/gender/looks, alas.
I do do storytelling, but I've had issues writing them for the last 5 years and there's less opportunities for doing that on a regular basis, so I haven't been doing that as much. Technically I am a teacher in my day job, if we ever get to the point of getting to teach classes.
Consider trying out larping?
I did it in the past, I don't know anyone doing it now. I had to go out of town for it.
I’m going to go out on a limb and say that it sounds like you can act with your face and voice, but less so with your body. That would explain why you get good roles online but not in person, but it points to something you can try to influence. In theory, that audition coach should have picked up on it, but if they are the same type of nerd as you, maybe they have the same blind spot. It might be worth getting an acting coach or another audition coach for a second opinion too.
I think you have nailed it. Maybe I should have had the Zoom camera on full body shots of me in the session, but that's hard for me to do in my home (the farther away I get from the laptop to see my body, the worse it looks online). I think next time I get audition coaching, I'll ask what's wrong with my body, besides the usual. I'll look into the Alexander technique thing.
But if you have friends or even acquaintances who you really think don't believe you're good enough, then I'd also try asking them for feedback. Not "am I good?", because they're likely to prioritize your feelings, but something like "I'm working on this audition and I need you to tell me 3 things to improve" or "tell me the thing to improve that would make the most difference" or whatever.
I haven't been able to get up the nerve to ask, I think that's very uncomfortable territory to be asked to tell someone they suck to their face. But it's obvious I just wasn't born up to snuff and there's not much you can do about it. Hence why the audition coach.
Are you happy as a character actress?
I'll take anything! Literally anything! (I mean, I'd like more, but I've done shows where I was barely in them.)
If so can you lean into it more than you have up till now? So that when a director thinks "what I need for this part is someone who can create a memorable character", you're a good fit? (Apologies if that's what you've been doing all along. It's just that for some roles it feels like looks and voice quality are paramount, but there are the other roles where the ability to be a singular weirdo matters more, and maybe that's a good niche to target.)
I'd like to (the audition coach seemed to think so), but there's not that many character actress roles going on either. The next show I'm going to audition for, I'm going to shoot for that because there's one in there. I will note that in musical theater auditions, you usually don't get to read aloud unless you're good enough for a callback, so I haven't had as many shots to read aloud and it hasn't made a difference when I did. For straight plays, well...I haven't gotten too many people into what I do. Maybe my body is just wrong?
As for make your own thing: I agree with the logic but don't have much drive to do that, unfortunately. I have an online theater company (on hiatus for the spring, sigh), but I don't have much knack at getting the other kids together to put on a show, nor do I want to be In Charge Running Things or directing. Like it took a year to get people to put on my 10 minute play, sheesh.
Thank you!
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:40 AM on March 18
Where are you geographically? Are you somewhere such that theater companies are kinda slim pickins? could you commute a bit further away to find your offbeat niche in a different community?
Northern California. I actually have pretty good selection for number of theaters, but I've had the best odds with really small theaters in small towns. Ones in the city--fuhgettaboutit. I've gotten into four of the smallest ones. But right now I'm inwardly pouting because one of the four is no longer going to cast me, so I won't be doing shows there any more and my options have gone way down.
I'm sure you *are* very good, but keep in mind all of your teachers, coaches etc are at least partly motivated to encourage you to keep going because doing so is how they get paid on an ongoing basis.
Good point. I think I am complete poo no matter what I do singingwise, actually, but my voice teacher somewhat thinks I'm better than I think I am. I think she's one of those "try for harder goals" people and right now I am all "look, I need to dial down to very small goals, like not fucking up."
I'd be willing to bet you're loads more charming and personable than the average schmoe off the street who'd never set foot in an audition in the first place.
Yes, but any average schmoe guy can walk in and get a part. Literally any! I don't think my charm is supplanting age/gender/looks, alas.
I do do storytelling, but I've had issues writing them for the last 5 years and there's less opportunities for doing that on a regular basis, so I haven't been doing that as much. Technically I am a teacher in my day job, if we ever get to the point of getting to teach classes.
Consider trying out larping?
I did it in the past, I don't know anyone doing it now. I had to go out of town for it.
I’m going to go out on a limb and say that it sounds like you can act with your face and voice, but less so with your body. That would explain why you get good roles online but not in person, but it points to something you can try to influence. In theory, that audition coach should have picked up on it, but if they are the same type of nerd as you, maybe they have the same blind spot. It might be worth getting an acting coach or another audition coach for a second opinion too.
I think you have nailed it. Maybe I should have had the Zoom camera on full body shots of me in the session, but that's hard for me to do in my home (the farther away I get from the laptop to see my body, the worse it looks online). I think next time I get audition coaching, I'll ask what's wrong with my body, besides the usual. I'll look into the Alexander technique thing.
But if you have friends or even acquaintances who you really think don't believe you're good enough, then I'd also try asking them for feedback. Not "am I good?", because they're likely to prioritize your feelings, but something like "I'm working on this audition and I need you to tell me 3 things to improve" or "tell me the thing to improve that would make the most difference" or whatever.
I haven't been able to get up the nerve to ask, I think that's very uncomfortable territory to be asked to tell someone they suck to their face. But it's obvious I just wasn't born up to snuff and there's not much you can do about it. Hence why the audition coach.
Are you happy as a character actress?
I'll take anything! Literally anything! (I mean, I'd like more, but I've done shows where I was barely in them.)
If so can you lean into it more than you have up till now? So that when a director thinks "what I need for this part is someone who can create a memorable character", you're a good fit? (Apologies if that's what you've been doing all along. It's just that for some roles it feels like looks and voice quality are paramount, but there are the other roles where the ability to be a singular weirdo matters more, and maybe that's a good niche to target.)
I'd like to (the audition coach seemed to think so), but there's not that many character actress roles going on either. The next show I'm going to audition for, I'm going to shoot for that because there's one in there. I will note that in musical theater auditions, you usually don't get to read aloud unless you're good enough for a callback, so I haven't had as many shots to read aloud and it hasn't made a difference when I did. For straight plays, well...I haven't gotten too many people into what I do. Maybe my body is just wrong?
As for make your own thing: I agree with the logic but don't have much drive to do that, unfortunately. I have an online theater company (on hiatus for the spring, sigh), but I don't have much knack at getting the other kids together to put on a show, nor do I want to be In Charge Running Things or directing. Like it took a year to get people to put on my 10 minute play, sheesh.
Thank you!
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:40 AM on March 18
Couple of thoughts:
— I would second the suggestion to try to become more comfortable with the physical aspects of acting. I don't know you, of course, but I know that you love to post on this here old-fashioned, text-based website, which suggests that you're a highly verbal, cerebral person. This can be really helpful with some aspects of acting—it means you are good at analyzing a script and understanding your character—but it also means that you might have trouble translating that understanding to physical action. I speak from experience—I also received the critique "too cerebral" in acting classes! And I know it can be uncomfortable and unfamiliar to develop a different relationship with your physicality. But it's a major part of an actor's skill set.
— You recently posted on another thread "I'm an On Time person" and that how people who aren't that way annoy you. I think you can use this to your advantage! Look, actors can have a reputation for being late, or flaky, or saying they have "artistic temperament" as an excuse to justify being moody or difficult to work with. But if you, in contrast, are pleasant, professional, and collaborative, you will develop a reputation for being reliable and an asset to the production. Especially for smaller ensemble or character parts, I would rather cast someone who's 70% right for the role but is professional and easygoing, than someone who is 100% right for the role but has a reputation for being flaky or difficult.
posted by clair-de-lune at 10:55 AM on March 18 [1 favorite]
— I would second the suggestion to try to become more comfortable with the physical aspects of acting. I don't know you, of course, but I know that you love to post on this here old-fashioned, text-based website, which suggests that you're a highly verbal, cerebral person. This can be really helpful with some aspects of acting—it means you are good at analyzing a script and understanding your character—but it also means that you might have trouble translating that understanding to physical action. I speak from experience—I also received the critique "too cerebral" in acting classes! And I know it can be uncomfortable and unfamiliar to develop a different relationship with your physicality. But it's a major part of an actor's skill set.
— You recently posted on another thread "I'm an On Time person" and that how people who aren't that way annoy you. I think you can use this to your advantage! Look, actors can have a reputation for being late, or flaky, or saying they have "artistic temperament" as an excuse to justify being moody or difficult to work with. But if you, in contrast, are pleasant, professional, and collaborative, you will develop a reputation for being reliable and an asset to the production. Especially for smaller ensemble or character parts, I would rather cast someone who's 70% right for the role but is professional and easygoing, than someone who is 100% right for the role but has a reputation for being flaky or difficult.
posted by clair-de-lune at 10:55 AM on March 18 [1 favorite]
Yes, but any average schmoe guy can walk in and get a part. Literally any!
If this was true I wouldn't know literally 13 unemployed male actors right now.
I haven't been able to get up the nerve to ask, I think that's very uncomfortable territory to be asked to tell someone they suck to their face.
Ok except what the person suggested you ask was: "I'm working on this audition and I need you to tell me 3 things to improve" or "tell me the thing to improve that would make the most difference" or whatever. YOU are the only person talking about sucking here.
When someone asks if you're happy doing character roles, you respond with "I'll take anything." But that doesn't answer the question! It in fact sounds like no, you're not happy with those roles, but you don't think you deserve the roles you want so you'll take them. And anyway you're just old and female and wrong and broken. Well the director's gonna see that right off the bat, and nobody wants to work with someone who's settling for a role they don't want because they hate themselves.
Suppose you were the hottest 22 year old dude in the history of humanity and could land any role you wanted, and couldn't use the excuse of how old and broken and female and wrong you are. What is that role and why do you want it?
Look, you can't go straight from where you are, mired in defeated thought patterns and an obvious deep self-loathing to CONFIDENCE. You need to keep challenging and reworking your internal monologues and assumptions. (I don't want to assume you haven't started, because I know you've mentioned a therapist previously. But if you haven't started, time to start.) But also a big part of this is, to me, you figuring out why you are still doing this thing, what it is you need need need to share, because that's where your confidence will ultimately come from.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 12:33 PM on March 18 [4 favorites]
If this was true I wouldn't know literally 13 unemployed male actors right now.
I haven't been able to get up the nerve to ask, I think that's very uncomfortable territory to be asked to tell someone they suck to their face.
Ok except what the person suggested you ask was: "I'm working on this audition and I need you to tell me 3 things to improve" or "tell me the thing to improve that would make the most difference" or whatever. YOU are the only person talking about sucking here.
When someone asks if you're happy doing character roles, you respond with "I'll take anything." But that doesn't answer the question! It in fact sounds like no, you're not happy with those roles, but you don't think you deserve the roles you want so you'll take them. And anyway you're just old and female and wrong and broken. Well the director's gonna see that right off the bat, and nobody wants to work with someone who's settling for a role they don't want because they hate themselves.
Suppose you were the hottest 22 year old dude in the history of humanity and could land any role you wanted, and couldn't use the excuse of how old and broken and female and wrong you are. What is that role and why do you want it?
Look, you can't go straight from where you are, mired in defeated thought patterns and an obvious deep self-loathing to CONFIDENCE. You need to keep challenging and reworking your internal monologues and assumptions. (I don't want to assume you haven't started, because I know you've mentioned a therapist previously. But if you haven't started, time to start.) But also a big part of this is, to me, you figuring out why you are still doing this thing, what it is you need need need to share, because that's where your confidence will ultimately come from.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 12:33 PM on March 18 [4 favorites]
Are you willing to try out a different performance form? I think you could do burlesque or cabaret or things adjacent to that pretty well. Maybe even something in the circus realm - there are options for those of us who aren't necessarily that physical.
Alternatively you could go into voice acting - that way you don't have to worry about your body so much.
You say you're in NorCal - I found that my brand of political burlesque performance art FLOURISHED in San Francisco. Granted this was over a decade ago and the spaces that most welcomed me are reducing due to cost of living and people moving, but there are likely more options especially in the independent arts space.
posted by creatrixtiara at 3:19 PM on March 18
Alternatively you could go into voice acting - that way you don't have to worry about your body so much.
You say you're in NorCal - I found that my brand of political burlesque performance art FLOURISHED in San Francisco. Granted this was over a decade ago and the spaces that most welcomed me are reducing due to cost of living and people moving, but there are likely more options especially in the independent arts space.
posted by creatrixtiara at 3:19 PM on March 18
Response by poster: Yes, but any average schmoe guy can walk in and get a part. Literally any!
I've seen it happen here. Including one amiable pothead boyfriend of a cast member who walked in a few weeks into rehearsal and got a part with a line (then he later got kicked out for showing up not sober). I can't even get a part with a line with 5 years of experience! I only know one guy who doesn't get a speaking part, and that's because he's such a low talker you can't hear him when he's speaking right in your ear....but that's small town life and theater never having enough men, is how that happens.
Burlesque: can't say I've ever seen or had any interest in it. Am actually considering cabaret now since I was told a series near here hardly has any one auditioning for theirs, but would need to work with my singing coach on it. My voice isn't great, but if I ever get it better, perhaps--I know of the voice school people here use and they are online.
When someone asks if you're happy doing character roles, you respond with "I'll take anything." But that doesn't answer the question! It in fact sounds like no, you're not happy with those roles,
I'm happy with any roles, I just don't tend to get any IRL. I've done Shakespeare parts and mostly that's about it for actual roles with names. And most of those were "we hardly got anyone auditioning."
but you don't think you deserve the roles you want so you'll take them.
I think I do deserve them! It's just convincing others.
And anyway you're just old and female and wrong and broken. Well the director's gonna see that right off the bat, and nobody wants to work with someone who's settling for a role they don't want because they hate themselves.
Hence why I'm asking this.
Suppose you were the hottest 22 year old dude in the history of humanity and could land any role you wanted, and couldn't use the excuse of how old and broken and female and wrong you are. What is that role and why do you want it?
SHAKESPEARE!!!! in Something Rotten, for the record, because it's fun, bold, attitudinal, show-offy.
Look, you can't go straight from where you are, mired in defeated thought patterns and an obvious deep self-loathing to CONFIDENCE. You need to keep challenging and reworking your internal monologues and assumptions. (I don't want to assume you haven't started, because I know you've mentioned a therapist previously. But if you haven't started, time to start.) But also a big part of this is, to me, you figuring out why you are still doing this thing, what it is you need need need to share, because that's where your confidence will ultimately come from.
You have nailed it as to why I am asking this question, right here. I go between "I suck because others think it so" vs. "Secretly I think I'm a star." It's confusing to say the least and I don't know which to believe or which is true.
And....well, now I'm going to an audition, so I gotta wind this up....
posted by jenfullmoon at 4:30 PM on March 18
I've seen it happen here. Including one amiable pothead boyfriend of a cast member who walked in a few weeks into rehearsal and got a part with a line (then he later got kicked out for showing up not sober). I can't even get a part with a line with 5 years of experience! I only know one guy who doesn't get a speaking part, and that's because he's such a low talker you can't hear him when he's speaking right in your ear....but that's small town life and theater never having enough men, is how that happens.
Burlesque: can't say I've ever seen or had any interest in it. Am actually considering cabaret now since I was told a series near here hardly has any one auditioning for theirs, but would need to work with my singing coach on it. My voice isn't great, but if I ever get it better, perhaps--I know of the voice school people here use and they are online.
When someone asks if you're happy doing character roles, you respond with "I'll take anything." But that doesn't answer the question! It in fact sounds like no, you're not happy with those roles,
I'm happy with any roles, I just don't tend to get any IRL. I've done Shakespeare parts and mostly that's about it for actual roles with names. And most of those were "we hardly got anyone auditioning."
but you don't think you deserve the roles you want so you'll take them.
I think I do deserve them! It's just convincing others.
And anyway you're just old and female and wrong and broken. Well the director's gonna see that right off the bat, and nobody wants to work with someone who's settling for a role they don't want because they hate themselves.
Hence why I'm asking this.
Suppose you were the hottest 22 year old dude in the history of humanity and could land any role you wanted, and couldn't use the excuse of how old and broken and female and wrong you are. What is that role and why do you want it?
SHAKESPEARE!!!! in Something Rotten, for the record, because it's fun, bold, attitudinal, show-offy.
Look, you can't go straight from where you are, mired in defeated thought patterns and an obvious deep self-loathing to CONFIDENCE. You need to keep challenging and reworking your internal monologues and assumptions. (I don't want to assume you haven't started, because I know you've mentioned a therapist previously. But if you haven't started, time to start.) But also a big part of this is, to me, you figuring out why you are still doing this thing, what it is you need need need to share, because that's where your confidence will ultimately come from.
You have nailed it as to why I am asking this question, right here. I go between "I suck because others think it so" vs. "Secretly I think I'm a star." It's confusing to say the least and I don't know which to believe or which is true.
And....well, now I'm going to an audition, so I gotta wind this up....
posted by jenfullmoon at 4:30 PM on March 18
but that's small town life and theater never having enough men, is how that happens.
Any chance there are roles you could try for in drag? Comedic Shakespeare parts seem like a natural fit, especially given the history...
posted by trig at 5:13 PM on March 18
Any chance there are roles you could try for in drag? Comedic Shakespeare parts seem like a natural fit, especially given the history...
posted by trig at 5:13 PM on March 18
Ok, I have an idea. One of the most effective ways to shift a vibe or get out of a funk is to do something that shows visible incremental progress every time you do it. It is such an uplifting, hopeful, positive feeling to see that progress and know that you made it happen, and you’re going to make more of it happen.
So, what I would suggest is to get a small hobby or project and do it regularly for the next few weeks, every other day or so. It doesn’t have to be acting-related, just something where visible incremental progress is almost guaranteed. Could be gardening (plants will grow) or a sport/movement practice (you will get stronger) or playing music (you will be able to play harder pieces) or whatever fits into your life.
Once you’ve gotten an achievement in your new hobby or project that you’re genuinely proud of, start showing it off to people. Could be anyone - a friend, a housemate, a theater member, a barista. Could be on social media. Bask in the glory of having other people enjoy your achievement, which is likely to amplify your own enjoyment as well. Keep doing the activity.
And then, once you’ve experienced the transformative power of visible incremental progress, try auditioning for a role. Maybe even talk up your project to the other folks at the audition. I bet you’ll bring a different energy to the room.
posted by danceswithlight at 9:11 PM on March 18 [1 favorite]
So, what I would suggest is to get a small hobby or project and do it regularly for the next few weeks, every other day or so. It doesn’t have to be acting-related, just something where visible incremental progress is almost guaranteed. Could be gardening (plants will grow) or a sport/movement practice (you will get stronger) or playing music (you will be able to play harder pieces) or whatever fits into your life.
Once you’ve gotten an achievement in your new hobby or project that you’re genuinely proud of, start showing it off to people. Could be anyone - a friend, a housemate, a theater member, a barista. Could be on social media. Bask in the glory of having other people enjoy your achievement, which is likely to amplify your own enjoyment as well. Keep doing the activity.
And then, once you’ve experienced the transformative power of visible incremental progress, try auditioning for a role. Maybe even talk up your project to the other folks at the audition. I bet you’ll bring a different energy to the room.
posted by danceswithlight at 9:11 PM on March 18 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I like that idea, danceswithlight. I do that sort of thing with knitting actually :) You should see my progress on the color work I'm doing!
I will report that tonight's audition (Something Rotten at Snooty Theater) went well for me. I did go into it trying to focus on enjoying it and less on the neverending parade of YOU SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK that goes through my brain every time I'm at Snooty Theater. I recorded my mom and her boyfriend giving me compliments after Hamlet and listened to that a few times before going in. I think I did great on the dancing. Definitely did better than some people. Tapwise I was so-so, but oh well. Some people could, some couldn't, I wasn't going for tap-dancing egg anyway so I don't super care. Singing I got through, I think I did just fine on acting it out, had an "eh" feeling from the judges there, but ah well. I did well for myself, and that is what matters in this situation. And I wanted to write that down before I get into tomorrow's inevitable pout-and-mope before I get to acceptance and seeing which of my many friends did get in. They had tons of people, so no shame in not getting in this one.
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:53 PM on March 18 [4 favorites]
I will report that tonight's audition (Something Rotten at Snooty Theater) went well for me. I did go into it trying to focus on enjoying it and less on the neverending parade of YOU SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK that goes through my brain every time I'm at Snooty Theater. I recorded my mom and her boyfriend giving me compliments after Hamlet and listened to that a few times before going in. I think I did great on the dancing. Definitely did better than some people. Tapwise I was so-so, but oh well. Some people could, some couldn't, I wasn't going for tap-dancing egg anyway so I don't super care. Singing I got through, I think I did just fine on acting it out, had an "eh" feeling from the judges there, but ah well. I did well for myself, and that is what matters in this situation. And I wanted to write that down before I get into tomorrow's inevitable pout-and-mope before I get to acceptance and seeing which of my many friends did get in. They had tons of people, so no shame in not getting in this one.
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:53 PM on March 18 [4 favorites]
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But I feel like it's all kind of similar to dating.
You might not be 'the director's vision'. That doesn't mean you aren't good enough. Just like if a person of romantic interest isn't interested in you, doesn't mean you aren't 'good enough'.
And just like dating, you just keep trying until you find the right match, ie a director that thinks you fit their vision.
It's a moving target and you don't really know until lightning strikes. You gotta keep moving forward and keep knowing your worth and don't let your confidence take a hit.
Good luck!
posted by greta simone at 2:58 PM on March 17 [4 favorites]