Dealing with leak in ceiling
July 4, 2024 6:39 PM Subscribe
It's the middle of the night and I have water leaking into my flat from the ceiling AGAIN. I need a step by step guide to dealing with multiple actors in this scenario i.e. the building management, the upstairs tenants, and the upstairs landlord. I also need help managing my anxiety around this issue. UK-Filter.
I own a ground floor leasehold flat in a small block, and have experienced recurring leaks into my flat from the upstairs flat about 4 times in the past 2 years. Right now there is a steady drip of water coming into my flat for the past hour.
Every time, I have spoken to the tenants upstairs, who say they can't identify any place in their flat that the leak could be coming from. The last time it happened I hired a plumber who said the water was definitely coming from outside my flat but couldn't gain access to the upstairs flat to confirm it was coming from there. The upstairs landlord told me to ask the plumber to return when the tenants were home, but the management company told me not to hire a plumber as it was the upstairs landlord's responsibility to do so and "they would talk to them" about this. I didn't call the plumber back. The upstairs landlord was annoyed with me. Nothing ended up happening.
The leak always happens in the early hours of the night and goes on for a few hours before stopping on its own. The layout of the flats are such that their kitchen is directly over my bedroom and the leak comes in there. There is no correlation with the rain.
I've been told by my management company that they cannot guarantee reimbursing me if I pay for further investigations that prove that the leak is coming from the upstairs flat. They say that the upstairs landlord would be responsible for covering the expense however "they cannot enforce this". If the leak stems from a communal area, they have said they will reimburse the cost.
I need step by step instructions to dealing with this stupid situation once and for all. Please help.
I could also do with advice on how to manage my anxiety. Troubles in the home hit a huge nerve for me as the my home is where I'm supposed to feel safe. I am very anxious about confrontation and every single actor in this scenario has been confrontational and unhelpful. I also feel worried that the leak will cause my ceiling to fall in and I'll die. It always happens late at night and makes me too anxious to sleep. I want to sell my flat soon and I worry that the damage will make the flat unsaleable.
I own a ground floor leasehold flat in a small block, and have experienced recurring leaks into my flat from the upstairs flat about 4 times in the past 2 years. Right now there is a steady drip of water coming into my flat for the past hour.
Every time, I have spoken to the tenants upstairs, who say they can't identify any place in their flat that the leak could be coming from. The last time it happened I hired a plumber who said the water was definitely coming from outside my flat but couldn't gain access to the upstairs flat to confirm it was coming from there. The upstairs landlord told me to ask the plumber to return when the tenants were home, but the management company told me not to hire a plumber as it was the upstairs landlord's responsibility to do so and "they would talk to them" about this. I didn't call the plumber back. The upstairs landlord was annoyed with me. Nothing ended up happening.
The leak always happens in the early hours of the night and goes on for a few hours before stopping on its own. The layout of the flats are such that their kitchen is directly over my bedroom and the leak comes in there. There is no correlation with the rain.
I've been told by my management company that they cannot guarantee reimbursing me if I pay for further investigations that prove that the leak is coming from the upstairs flat. They say that the upstairs landlord would be responsible for covering the expense however "they cannot enforce this". If the leak stems from a communal area, they have said they will reimburse the cost.
I need step by step instructions to dealing with this stupid situation once and for all. Please help.
I could also do with advice on how to manage my anxiety. Troubles in the home hit a huge nerve for me as the my home is where I'm supposed to feel safe. I am very anxious about confrontation and every single actor in this scenario has been confrontational and unhelpful. I also feel worried that the leak will cause my ceiling to fall in and I'll die. It always happens late at night and makes me too anxious to sleep. I want to sell my flat soon and I worry that the damage will make the flat unsaleable.
That sucks, I sympathize!
At this moment the main thing you can control is what gets damaged in a worst-case scenario of a ceiling collapse. From what you describe that doesn't sound imminent, but it's very messy and incconvenient if it does happen, so I would focus on that first:
- Figure out a different place to sleep, not under the leak
- Make that space as comfy and restful as possible, don't add sleeplessness to your stress!
- Clear your stuff out of the leak area - remove anything fragile or absorbent (books, rugs, bed, upholstered furniture, valuables, etc.
-If you can't move items, drape them with plastic to at least keep them dry and clean in the unlikely event of a ceiling collapse which would be a big mess of wet dusty debris. Garbage bags or dollar store shower curtains are cheap and effective for tenting items.
- Most of the time when an interior ceiling collapses from an active leak, it's a big mess and unpleasant, BUT the building itself remains structurally fine, because usually only the absorbent materials in the ceiling fall (drywall or plaster) but the structural parts (wood, metal, cement) are much more water-impervious. So if it does collapse, it will be super annoying and inconvenient, but your flat resale value will be totally fine once the damage is patched and painted over!
Usually ceiling leaks take about a week to fully repair, here's how mine went:
Day 1 = 1 hour. Cut a hole into the ceiling and figure out where the leak is coming from. Clean the small dusty wet mess from cutting a hole in the ceiling.
Day 2 = 2 hours. Fix whatever was leaking, then wait a few days for the inside of the ceiling to dry out. A fan or dehumidifier is helpful for this part.
Day 4 = 1 hour. Patch the ceiling hole, and spread some kind of paste around the edges of the hole to blend the patch into the rest of the ceiling. Wait a day for the paste to dry.
Day 5 = 1 hour. If the ceiling is textured, then they use plaster to try to copy the texture to hide the patch. If the ceiling is smooth, they will sand the dry paste to blend it into the ceiling Because you're looking at resale value, make sure they sand it VERY smooth to hide the damage. Then they clean up the dust from sanding and paint a coat of primer onto the patched area (don't skip the primer, it helps hide the patch), and wait a day for the primer to dry.
Day 6 = 1 to 3 hours. Paint the patched area - and since you're looking to resell the unit, do your best to convince them to paint the entire ceiling, so the patch blends in better. And it will look good as new!
- I agree with the above suggestion to poke a nail hole in the ceiling tonight (if it's made of drywall) and let the water out. A trickle of water that flows through the ceiling and out into a bucket doesn't wet or damage much of the surrounding material, so it's much preferable to a trickle of water that gets trapped and accumulates into a puddle inside the ceiling since that puddle can make the ceiling materials start getting mushy.
Other things to do:
Take TONS of photos!
Make sure every phone call or convo is followed with a text or email that documents the convo and contains clear photos:
"Hello Mark,
Thanks for the talk in the elevator. I wanted to summarize our conversation so we both have a record of it:
I let you know that the ceiling leak I mentioned on Date and Date is still active. It's a constant drip from my kitchen ceiling, which is directly below the kitchen of Unit 22. It's not raining today so I wonder if the leak might be from an upstairs appliance. It's been leaking every evening for X days, photo attached.
Given the leak's location, I am requesting that Unit 22's dishwasher, washing machine, and under-sink area, as well as their bathroom plumbing, be investigated to see if one of those areas is the source.
I am very concerned about my physical safety, since there is a risk of serious injury if there were a ceiling collapse, not to mention damage to my property.
I am also concerned about lasting structural damage to the unit from the persistent leak.
After I shared those concerns, you said ___.
Unfortunately, that doesn't feel like a fair solution to me, because ___ , so I am requesting ___ instead.
Our next step is for me to___, and for you to ___.
Please let me know if I missed anything that we discussed.
Thank you, Name.
Send a polite, factual email like that every 1-2 days. When you start paper trailing things like this, people usually step up their concern!
posted by nouvelle-personne at 8:53 PM on July 4 [4 favorites]
At this moment the main thing you can control is what gets damaged in a worst-case scenario of a ceiling collapse. From what you describe that doesn't sound imminent, but it's very messy and incconvenient if it does happen, so I would focus on that first:
- Figure out a different place to sleep, not under the leak
- Make that space as comfy and restful as possible, don't add sleeplessness to your stress!
- Clear your stuff out of the leak area - remove anything fragile or absorbent (books, rugs, bed, upholstered furniture, valuables, etc.
-If you can't move items, drape them with plastic to at least keep them dry and clean in the unlikely event of a ceiling collapse which would be a big mess of wet dusty debris. Garbage bags or dollar store shower curtains are cheap and effective for tenting items.
- Most of the time when an interior ceiling collapses from an active leak, it's a big mess and unpleasant, BUT the building itself remains structurally fine, because usually only the absorbent materials in the ceiling fall (drywall or plaster) but the structural parts (wood, metal, cement) are much more water-impervious. So if it does collapse, it will be super annoying and inconvenient, but your flat resale value will be totally fine once the damage is patched and painted over!
Usually ceiling leaks take about a week to fully repair, here's how mine went:
Day 1 = 1 hour. Cut a hole into the ceiling and figure out where the leak is coming from. Clean the small dusty wet mess from cutting a hole in the ceiling.
Day 2 = 2 hours. Fix whatever was leaking, then wait a few days for the inside of the ceiling to dry out. A fan or dehumidifier is helpful for this part.
Day 4 = 1 hour. Patch the ceiling hole, and spread some kind of paste around the edges of the hole to blend the patch into the rest of the ceiling. Wait a day for the paste to dry.
Day 5 = 1 hour. If the ceiling is textured, then they use plaster to try to copy the texture to hide the patch. If the ceiling is smooth, they will sand the dry paste to blend it into the ceiling Because you're looking at resale value, make sure they sand it VERY smooth to hide the damage. Then they clean up the dust from sanding and paint a coat of primer onto the patched area (don't skip the primer, it helps hide the patch), and wait a day for the primer to dry.
Day 6 = 1 to 3 hours. Paint the patched area - and since you're looking to resell the unit, do your best to convince them to paint the entire ceiling, so the patch blends in better. And it will look good as new!
- I agree with the above suggestion to poke a nail hole in the ceiling tonight (if it's made of drywall) and let the water out. A trickle of water that flows through the ceiling and out into a bucket doesn't wet or damage much of the surrounding material, so it's much preferable to a trickle of water that gets trapped and accumulates into a puddle inside the ceiling since that puddle can make the ceiling materials start getting mushy.
Other things to do:
Take TONS of photos!
Make sure every phone call or convo is followed with a text or email that documents the convo and contains clear photos:
"Hello Mark,
Thanks for the talk in the elevator. I wanted to summarize our conversation so we both have a record of it:
I let you know that the ceiling leak I mentioned on Date and Date is still active. It's a constant drip from my kitchen ceiling, which is directly below the kitchen of Unit 22. It's not raining today so I wonder if the leak might be from an upstairs appliance. It's been leaking every evening for X days, photo attached.
Given the leak's location, I am requesting that Unit 22's dishwasher, washing machine, and under-sink area, as well as their bathroom plumbing, be investigated to see if one of those areas is the source.
I am very concerned about my physical safety, since there is a risk of serious injury if there were a ceiling collapse, not to mention damage to my property.
I am also concerned about lasting structural damage to the unit from the persistent leak.
After I shared those concerns, you said ___.
Unfortunately, that doesn't feel like a fair solution to me, because ___ , so I am requesting ___ instead.
Our next step is for me to___, and for you to ___.
Please let me know if I missed anything that we discussed.
Thank you, Name.
Send a polite, factual email like that every 1-2 days. When you start paper trailing things like this, people usually step up their concern!
posted by nouvelle-personne at 8:53 PM on July 4 [4 favorites]
It is totally the upstairs landlord’s responsibility to fix this. Does sound likely that it’s a dishwasher or washing machine that the people upstairs only run in the evening - which is great news, because it’ll be quite easy to fix.
So: email the upstairs landlord & ask politely that they get a plumber in to fix it. Repeat as necessary.
Your buildings insurance should cover you for any damage. Might be worth checking your policy & confirming what kind of cover you’ll have.
posted by rd45 at 1:38 AM on July 5
So: email the upstairs landlord & ask politely that they get a plumber in to fix it. Repeat as necessary.
Your buildings insurance should cover you for any damage. Might be worth checking your policy & confirming what kind of cover you’ll have.
posted by rd45 at 1:38 AM on July 5
I lived in an apartment where a pipe started leaking between floors. The building manager called one day to ask about a flood at my place (I was on the top floor, 4-storey building) - I reported no flood whatsoever, everything was dry. The bldg mgr then came up with a plumber to confirm, and told me there was flooding on the bottom floor and they were checking all the apartments above the flooded one.
In the end, it turns out there was a pinhole leak in a pipe between the 3rd and 4th floors and it was leaking down the pipe into the bottom floor apartment. I agree with others above that in your case it sounds like it could be a dishwasher etc, but it could also be a building-level problem rather than a neighbour-level problem. Is building management the same as strata or is there a layer above your building management that you can approach?
posted by lulu68 at 1:40 AM on July 5
In the end, it turns out there was a pinhole leak in a pipe between the 3rd and 4th floors and it was leaking down the pipe into the bottom floor apartment. I agree with others above that in your case it sounds like it could be a dishwasher etc, but it could also be a building-level problem rather than a neighbour-level problem. Is building management the same as strata or is there a layer above your building management that you can approach?
posted by lulu68 at 1:40 AM on July 5
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In the short term, one small thing you could do is if you have a drywall ceiling, in the spot where you are generally getting the leak, take a small nail and poke a small hole in the ceiling. This will give the water a path of least resistance rather than soaking through all over and potentially saturating the material of the ceiling. That was the recommendation from our very good and responsive landlords the one time that it rained so hard in a short time that our building's roof leaked in the middle of the night. It also gives you some control of where the drip is.
Someone else in the UK will have better insight into what steps will get you what you need here. But I'm sending you warm thoughts - there's nothing quiet like problems in your home to stress one out.
posted by past unusual at 7:42 PM on July 4 [1 favorite]