GI Bill $; ROTC $ - What does it cover?
February 3, 2024 9:31 AM   Subscribe

In order to finance college, my grandson is considering joining the military. I think this is a horrible idea, because I think one should join the military because they want to join the military, not solely because it is a means to finance college.

My googling makes it appear that the GI Bill provides $ for tuition only, and that the same is true of ROTC. Also, it appears that if a student goes the ROTC route, they also have to take military-related courses in addition to the normal course-load while in college. Is the info I found accurate?

(If the information I found is correct, I am prepared to pay my grandson's tuition just so that he does not join the military. Although, as stated above, if he wants to join the military because he wants to join the military, I support that.)
posted by SageTrail to Education (22 answers total) 2 users marked this as a favorite
 
Yes, students in ROTC take ROTC classes. My advisees who are ROTC often have to take an overload- it's actually not dissimilar to my students who play an instrument who are getting credit for lessons and wind ensemble and orchestra, since it's usually a bunch of 1 or 2 credit courses for drills or leadership training with an occasional real course on military history thrown in. They work with me and their ROTC folks to make sure they can graduate on time with their degree.
posted by damayanti at 9:38 AM on February 3 [3 favorites]


This is a bit of a non-answer, but I would make 100% sure your grandson knows you’re willing to pay his tuition for all four years of college, because it’s such an outrageously large amount of money for an older teenager to imagine that he may simply not comprehend how life changing it would be. For example, if he decides to accept your offer, it’s perfectly possible that if he goes to community college for his first two years and then transfers to finish his degree and lives at home, depending on how he works or receives other aid he could graduate debt-free at 22 and also not need to be in the military. If he only thinks you might do this, or that it’s not actually something you’ve been planning to do but was something you’ve mentioned off-hand, I could absolutely see him not bothering to ask.
posted by mdonley at 9:49 AM on February 3 [24 favorites]


The military is basically a contract.

Approach him with a contract that satisfies both parties--you pay so much, so long, maybe even put it in your will that his college is still paid if you die before he graduates.

I hope he takes you up on it, but if not, please tell him he's adulting well in considering his life options.
posted by BlueHorse at 10:10 AM on February 3 [1 favorite]


I've known people who have done this successfully and unsuccessfully and I'm 100% with you on the philosophy of join the military only if you want to be in the military. But the people who got through did get their diplomas sometimes with delays.

If you can finance his college I think it's worth doing, if that's something you can afford. Just as a warning,
Are you up to date on college costs? I just say this because college costs are way way way higher than inflation, so even not paying attention for a few years can put sticker shock at the costs. I had a full tuition scholarship, a part time job and still ended up with 30, 000 in student loans for my undergraduate degree between mandatory "non tuition" fees, class supplies, textbooks and some health stuff got thrown in. At a in state, state school.
posted by AlexiaSky at 10:25 AM on February 3 [4 favorites]


Response by poster: Thank you for your answers so far; they are very helpful!

Still, anyone know whether this is correct?:
GI Bill provides $ for tuition only, and the same is true of ROTC
posted by SageTrail at 10:25 AM on February 3


So, as with many things in life, the answer is: it depends.

Some people will qualify for the full benefit: tuition, fees, books, room and board. Some people will only qualify for tuition and fees. Depending factors: length of active duty service, which type of service (Active Army, Active Reserve, etc.), and some other things that I don't quite understand.
posted by cooker girl at 10:38 AM on February 3 [5 favorites]


If he does at least 180 days AND he has an honorable discharge (which means unless there is a significant medical issue he'd be in much longer than 180 days) he would almost certainly be eligible for both tuition and cost of living allowance and a small book allowance. He could also go ahead and do a fair amount of college while in and use the gi bill for a master's.

Google GI bill comparison tool to learn more. I spent a couple years counseling folks getting out of the military and things are always changing but I find the VA website really through and useable. Lots and lots of people do four years, save up money, get at least two years of credit in and then use the GI Bill for both their bachelor's and master's. The trick is to get out after the first contract with your wits intact. If you aren't 'military' people check out the Air Force or maybe the Navy second choice. Google around for more ideas of why I'd say that.

But really GI Bill Comparison tool. :)
posted by stormygrey at 11:18 AM on February 3 [3 favorites]


I'm not familiar with ROTC, but yes, the GI bill provides a housing allowance during the school year. I also know two people that were medically discharged for failing boot camp that still got partial GI benefits that were pretty lucrative given their length of service. I'm not saying your relative should go in planning to medical out, just that the GI bill seems both generous and without tricky loopholes.
posted by Narrow Harbor at 11:26 AM on February 3 [1 favorite]


My brother spent several years in the marine reserves, did 3 deployments, and they still only paid for about half his state school tuition fees. It's been a while, so I don't recall if they also paid for his housing, but I don't think so. It's also hard to say if he had been more adamant and attentive and filled out the proper form, if they would have paid more, just like every other government service.

The medical benefits are ok too, as long as you live close to a place with good VA service. But they do still have medical debt.

Would I personally join just for tuition benefits? Heck no.
posted by The_Vegetables at 11:40 AM on February 3 [1 favorite]


It's also hard to say if he had been more adamant and attentive and filled out the proper form, if they would have paid more, just like every other government service.

This is the key thing, particularly if he is considering deferring college and intending to use military benefits to pay for it later. It's been a long time since I looked up the numbers, but the rate of people successfully executing this plan is pretty low. If you want to look for resources from a distinctly anti-military perspective, the search term is/was "poverty draft".
posted by hoyland at 12:15 PM on February 3 [3 favorites]


If he deals with recruiters, they are notorious for lying to meet their goals. He should ask to see everything in writing, the policy, not a note from a recruiter. Surprises with the military are Not Good. What did the ASVAB say he should and could do? Some people score high to be one thing, are placed in entirely different field of work.

ROTC is a form of officer training, and the experience of officers is quite different from enlisted. The US military is appallingly class-driven, typical of many militaries. People in the military are incredibly diverse. The military teaches and enforces structure and discipline for many, this is a big benefit. Every veteran I know has learned to be on time, etc. The military does random drug testing, so if someone uses any recreational drug, they will either have to clean up or they will be discharged. Being a veteran opens a lot of doors to jobs.

There are significant pockets of Extreme Right, Extreme Christian and the military skews Republican, because that's who funds them most. But, again, it's really diverse. My son is more influenced by his Dad's nasty politics than by his Army experience, but he is now a 2nd Amendment absolutist. I met a lot of my son's colleagues, lived with his family for several months while he was in, lots of terrific people. There is a genuine sense of service. I raised my son in Maine, he knew a few Black classmates. He joined the Army (I had quite mixed feelings) where enlisted soldiers are at least 38% people of color. There is more non-white and female leadership than you might expect. I'm probably a similar age to you; most of the Black students from my high school joined the military for the education and the pension; the economic draft was fiercer in the 70s, still exists.

If you plan to fund his education, would it come out of future inheritance? Would other grands be resentful? It's not a terrible choice, but the absolutely worst part of the military is that you may end up going to war, and even if you are not physically injured, that's a life-changer. Best luck.
posted by theora55 at 12:15 PM on February 3 [3 favorites]


Make sure your grandson knows about all the options available, including doing college abroad in another English-speaking country (the classic is Canada, but they're pretty much all going to be cheaper than the US, even for international students) - or in a country like Germany where most tuition is free and many universities teach in English.

That might sound like an extreme option to your grandson, but it's much less extreme than joining the military.

If you're in a position to be able to pay for their college tuition, could you also pay now for a session with a college planning advisor or counselor who will have information about scholarship programs, tuition wavers for things other than military service, and so on, so that your grandson can make his choice knowing more about his options?
posted by trig at 12:34 PM on February 3 [5 favorites]


The son of a close friend joined ROTC to go to the University of Vermont (out of state for him) for a basically free ride through school. He had to attend summer programs after all but his freshman year, I believe, but he is a bright kid - now no longer a kid after graduating more than 10 years ago. Depending on how many years of educational funding you are eligible for and take, your years in the military post-graduation varies. He graduated as an officer (a huge, huge benefit) and has continued to be promoted. He did volunteer for a stint in Afghanistan or Iraq (can't recall which) when that was going on because he said it was impossible to be promoted without any combat assignments. He was identified as someone the Army felt it could invest in, and now is in Kansas at the Army graduate school with his officer wife, and has had a wide choice of assignments with his wife as his career advances. He thinks they will probably stay in for the 20 years needed for retirement, with its excellent benefits.

They are probably uncommon Democratic liberals in the Army, and since he and his wife have very rarely stayed in Army housing, they have a more normal lifestyle than many others, certainly the enlisted soldiers. They just avoid political conversations or disclosure while at work. And as off-base professionals they go to work.

My point is that if your grandson goes through ROTC - or NROTC - they will graduate with a debt of time owed to the military, but will have many, many advantages once they graduate from school. The daughter of an acquaintance went to school while in the Navy NROTC to George Washington University for a Masters in Nursing - when she graduated she entered the Navy as a Nurse Practitioner.

I was a surgical ICU nurse for many years - almost every trauma surgeon and many other doctors joined the military - medical school was paid for by the military in exchange for a future commitment.

There's definitely a way savvy students can trade free tuition/room and board at college for a military commitment, but joining straight out of high school is probably the least rewarding.
I would discourage your grandson, or anyone, to enter the military right out of high school.
posted by citygirl at 3:34 PM on February 3 [5 favorites]


He had to attend summer programs after all but his freshman year, I believe

One thing to keep in mind is that for some majors, summers are when you want to do internships for your career after graduation. If he's interested in computer science, engineering, and possibly finance and some other fields this can be particularly important (and, unlike internships in various other fields, very well paid). It can also be a good time to work on research projects in his department, especially if he winds up being interested in grad school. It's possible that military experience will not be less helpful for his career than the usual summer opportunities, but it might matter a lot what field he actually goes into. Does he have any idea, even a vague one, of what he might want to do after college?
posted by trig at 5:38 PM on February 3 [1 favorite]


My son was offered and accepted an ROTC scholarship. It covered tuition and room. Not sure about board. His obligation in exchange for the scholarship was 4 years. He also agreed for an additional 3 years in exchange for his choice of assignments (Armor).

He is currently, one year to go, better off than his peers financially even ones who are in the financial sector. He has no student loans. He got a VA 30 year loan to buy his $500k house at a 1.5% rate (!), and NO MONEY down. He only had to pay closing costs out of pocket. In addition, he gets a housing stipend above his government salary that is greater than his mortgage payment.

He is planning on attending graduate business school on the GI bill. The GI bill covers tuition for sure. I am not sure about room and board.

If you don't have an ROTC scholarship but are in ROTC, you are not guaranteed a commission when you graduate. I am pretty sure but not an expert that he is not in the military and has no obligation if he does not have a scholarship. I also do not think the GI bill applies to him because he is not in the military or hasn't served yet. It would apply if he enlisted and after his tour he then went to college.

In my opinion, my son made a terrific deal by accepting the scholarship and having to serve. He has no school loans, owns a house essentially for free, and has tremendous responsibility as an officer (Captain).. He also has a maturity and focus that most of his peers do not.

Parenthetically, because we had saved some tuition money to help him pay for college that we did not have to spend, we bought him a brand new vehicle and gave him a 4 figure graduation check that my other children did not get.

MeMail me with any questions or concerns. I would not talk to a generic military recruiter, but I would talk to the ROTC department at his school of choice to ask about the benefits and obligations. They are much less inclined to mislead you as they will be dealing with you or your grandson for 4 years. Recruiters recruit and never see you again.

One more thing. My son had a double major. He had little free time. It was similar to being an athlete
He had pledged a fraternity but de-pledged because of the time commitments.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 6:14 PM on February 3 [5 favorites]


One more thing. I believe anyone who goes ROTC and serves their 4 years and comes out as an officer, their resume is very compelling to an employer. They will have the maturity and discipline that an employer wants that, to this old guy, seems to be lacking in young uns these days. (Get offa my lawn!)

In fact, there are many large corporations that specifically recruit military veterans according to my son. Obviously companies in the defense business, but also other large corporations.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 6:22 PM on February 3 [3 favorites]


The biggest difference is in the order you do it... ROTC is university -> commissioning as an officer -> tour of duty, while GI bill tends to be enlist -> tour of duty -> university. ROTC pays for school IF you get a scholarship. Needless to say, the tour of duty is a lot more comfortable as an officer.
posted by cfraenkel at 7:31 PM on February 3 [1 favorite]


Response by poster: trig, re Does he have any idea, even a vague one, of what he might want to do after college?

Definitely something related to science (most likely physical science).
posted by SageTrail at 9:40 PM on February 3


I used to work for VA processing claims for GI Bill benefits. The Post-9/11 GI Bill pays for tuition and fees, books and supplies, and a housing allowance. You have to serve 3 years or be discharged for a service-connected disability after 30 days to receive 100% of the Post-9/11 GI Bill benefit. If you serve fewer than 3 years or 36 months, you can get benefits but at a lower percentage. You must have an honorable discharge to receive benefits. If you are on active duty and are using your benefits to attend school, then you are not eligible for the housing stipend, since you should be getting a housing stipend from the military for your job.

The Post-9/11 GI Bill will pay for the maximum public university in-state tuition and fees. It will only cover a portion of private and out-of-state tuition if the charges are more than the in-state tuition and fees for that state. Eligible Veterans receive 36 months of Post-9/11 GI Bill benefits.

There are other VA Education benefits programs. There is a separate GI Bill for reservists who do not have any active duty service. This GI Bill is only a monthly stipend. There is also the Montgomery GI Bill for Active Duty Veterans that predates the Post-9/11 GI Bill, but you have to pay $1200 to be enrolled in it. If you elect to receive the Post-9/11 GI Bill, you will receive a refund for your MGIB payment. You cannot receive more than 48 months of VA education benefits combined. So, if you serve 4 years of active duty and then sign up for 6 years of reserve service, you can use 36 months of P-9/11 GI Bill benefits, and then switch and receive 12 additional months of the GI Bill for reservists. You cannot receive two benefits at once.

If you receive an ROTC scholarship and serve as a commissioned officer, your service doesn't count towards VA benefits unless you sign an additional contract after your commissioned service.

I stopped working for VA over 5 years ago (yikes!), so I'm sure there have been some changes to the specifics of the benefits program. The GI Bill website is actually pretty good. I hope this has been helpful!
posted by DEiBnL13 at 9:50 PM on February 3 [8 favorites]


Additional wrinkles. There are state-level benefits for veterans in some states. For example, the Illinois Veterans' Grant pays tuition and fees at state-supported universities and community colleges. I'm not sure how this program interacts with federal programs like the GI Bill. And there are specialized military funding programs that might be worth considering. For example, the Nuclear Propulsion Officer Candidate program pays a very large signing bonus and pays a monthly salary to students. (I seriously considered the nuclear program when I was an undergraduate engineering student. I decided against, but I'm still not sure whether I made the right choice.)
posted by Jonathan Livengood at 6:19 AM on February 4 [1 favorite]


I can speak as a ROTC graduate, though almost 2 decades ago, and still active duty in th Navy. Like mentioned before - the answer really it depends, much of it up to the university and not necessarily on the service that is providing the scholarship.

I went to Texas A&M which has the Corps of Cadets... Was a lot more intense in terms of time, but also the school had a lot of other resourcesa for scholarships associated with ROTC but not from the DOD.

The GI bill is separate and used after services (something I'm actually looking to use after my retirement). It's an amazing benefit, but I wouldn't calculate it into the math this early on.
posted by aggienfo at 6:52 AM on February 4 [2 favorites]


A few things:

*Some colleges and universities have military-specific tuition and financial aid programs that basically lower the cost of full tuition to at or below what the TA (Tuition Assistance) covers (@$250/credit). Anything above that will have to be covered independently.

*Here's a table that shows the current benefits and how they might apply.

*I've worked with lots of current- and former-military students at both the undergraduate and graduate levels. I've also known a few as colleagues. The only people I've ever known to make this work in an ideal way are career-military people, and more specifically, officers.
posted by yellowcandy at 9:21 AM on February 4 [2 favorites]


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