Can landlord require me to pay the fee for online rent payment?
October 30, 2023 11:38 AM Subscribe
Can landlord require me to pay the fee for online rent payment? In NYC.
I've rented my apartment for 6 years from a private landlord. The first few years we paid by old-school mailing in personal checks. A couple years ago he moved to an online payment system that had no fee if you did auto-pay wire transfer/direct bank transfer. He just switched to a new online platform that doesn't have a free/no-fee option if you do auto-transfer, so I'll have to pay every month for the privilege of paying him rent.
Is there any kind of New York (I'm in Brooklyn) rule about this where I can refuse to pay through the portal (ie go back to mailing in checks) or ask him to deduct the cost from my rent? Seems legally kinda shitty right? Would love to know what actual rights I have and my googling/311 calls haven't been helpful.
And no, this isn't the hill I'm going to die on, I generally have a good relationship with my landlord, I just want to be aware of what rights I do or don't have, regardless of how I decide to act on it.
Thanks!
I've rented my apartment for 6 years from a private landlord. The first few years we paid by old-school mailing in personal checks. A couple years ago he moved to an online payment system that had no fee if you did auto-pay wire transfer/direct bank transfer. He just switched to a new online platform that doesn't have a free/no-fee option if you do auto-transfer, so I'll have to pay every month for the privilege of paying him rent.
Is there any kind of New York (I'm in Brooklyn) rule about this where I can refuse to pay through the portal (ie go back to mailing in checks) or ask him to deduct the cost from my rent? Seems legally kinda shitty right? Would love to know what actual rights I have and my googling/311 calls haven't been helpful.
And no, this isn't the hill I'm going to die on, I generally have a good relationship with my landlord, I just want to be aware of what rights I do or don't have, regardless of how I decide to act on it.
Thanks!
Best answer: In New York State, a landlord cannot mandate that electronic billing is the only way to pay your rent, and neither can they charge any fee if you choose not to use the electronic system:
ยง 235-g. Electronic billing and/or payment of rent. 1. A landlord shall not require a lessee or tenant to use an electronic billing and/or payment system as the only method for the payment of rent. A landlord shall not assess any fee or other charge for a lessee or tenant that chooses not to use an electronic billing and/or payment system.
2. Any agreement by a lessee or tenant of a dwelling waiving or modifying his or her rights as set forth in this section shall be void as contrary to public policy.
***
The first rule of leasing is ... Read Your Lease.
There are all sorts of clauses in leases that are legally unenforceable because they are in direct violation of local, state and/or federal laws, so this is not a be-all and end-all solution.
posted by andrewesque at 12:10 PM on October 30, 2023 [23 favorites]
ยง 235-g. Electronic billing and/or payment of rent. 1. A landlord shall not require a lessee or tenant to use an electronic billing and/or payment system as the only method for the payment of rent. A landlord shall not assess any fee or other charge for a lessee or tenant that chooses not to use an electronic billing and/or payment system.
2. Any agreement by a lessee or tenant of a dwelling waiving or modifying his or her rights as set forth in this section shall be void as contrary to public policy.
***
The first rule of leasing is ... Read Your Lease.
There are all sorts of clauses in leases that are legally unenforceable because they are in direct violation of local, state and/or federal laws, so this is not a be-all and end-all solution.
posted by andrewesque at 12:10 PM on October 30, 2023 [23 favorites]
Apologies to ask the potentially obvious question, but has your landlord and/or lease actually indicated you can't pay by check? I've been in several circumstances where people give me a particular payment method, implying it is the only option. However, when asking them further, they provide alternate mechanisms.
New York State does not allow payment exclusively by electronic billing. However, I don't know if that means your landlord has to take a check. I'm not familiar with New York State law in general; it's possible they may only be obligated to take cash unless your lease specifically indicates payment by check.
Source
New York State does not allow payment exclusively by electronic billing. However, I don't know if that means your landlord has to take a check. I'm not familiar with New York State law in general; it's possible they may only be obligated to take cash unless your lease specifically indicates payment by check.
Source
A landlord shall not require a lessee or tenant to use an electronic billing and/or payment system as the only method for the payment of rent. A landlord shall not assess any fee or other charge for a lessee or tenant that chooses not to use an electronic billing and/or payment system.posted by saeculorum at 12:10 PM on October 30, 2023
I generally have a good relationship with my landlord
Have you asked your landlord directly about this yet? A stable, unproblematic, paying tenant is a benefit in itself and it's in their interest to work with you on low stakes stuff like this.
Send a message to your LL saying: "I would like to go back to paying my rent via paper check. Please let me know the address you would like me to send this to."
Depending on what they say, the next step is: "I'm not comfortable paying the transaction fee. I would like a reduction in rent of x $/% to accommodate the fee."
Then depending on the answer to that you take the next step. But this may be a very easy fix.
posted by phunniemee at 12:12 PM on October 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
Have you asked your landlord directly about this yet? A stable, unproblematic, paying tenant is a benefit in itself and it's in their interest to work with you on low stakes stuff like this.
Send a message to your LL saying: "I would like to go back to paying my rent via paper check. Please let me know the address you would like me to send this to."
Depending on what they say, the next step is: "I'm not comfortable paying the transaction fee. I would like a reduction in rent of x $/% to accommodate the fee."
Then depending on the answer to that you take the next step. But this may be a very easy fix.
posted by phunniemee at 12:12 PM on October 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
Best answer: For what it's worth, this site provides the unsourced statement "[t]he law says you have the right to pay rent by money order, personal check, cash, or the online system and the landlord has to accept it."
posted by saeculorum at 12:22 PM on October 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by saeculorum at 12:22 PM on October 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
No, they can't.
posted by Liquidwolf at 12:56 PM on October 30, 2023
posted by Liquidwolf at 12:56 PM on October 30, 2023
Best answer: And this site is the source. Section 235 as a whole is worth a skim, and it's all quite readable.
(saeculorum's site references the section in its template letter, so I went looking.)
posted by How much is that froggie in the window at 1:41 PM on October 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
(saeculorum's site references the section in its template letter, so I went looking.)
posted by How much is that froggie in the window at 1:41 PM on October 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
I use apartments.com to auto-pay my rent, no fee for me and I'm pretty sure no fee for my landlord. Maybe they would be open to using that...
posted by catquas at 8:11 PM on October 30, 2023
posted by catquas at 8:11 PM on October 30, 2023
lots and lots of smart good advice above. Less specific but maybe helpful: if you have a bank account that lets you write paper checks, they might also have "online bill pay" or something similar where you tell the bank "I need a check to get to RECIPIENT in the amount of $XYZ no later than the nth of every month and then...the bank just deals with it.
My bank isn't anything special but for some companies they already have electronic transfers set up, and the $XYZ just boops out of my account and into RECIPIENTs. If they don't have that infrastructure with RECIPIENT already, then they just cut their own paper check and mail it. I don't pay them for that service, and I don't pay them for the stamps, it's just a feature of the checking account. (Of course, that's why other accounts earn 4% right now and that account earns 0.01% or something....but free stamps!)
posted by adekllny at 6:08 AM on October 31, 2023
My bank isn't anything special but for some companies they already have electronic transfers set up, and the $XYZ just boops out of my account and into RECIPIENTs. If they don't have that infrastructure with RECIPIENT already, then they just cut their own paper check and mail it. I don't pay them for that service, and I don't pay them for the stamps, it's just a feature of the checking account. (Of course, that's why other accounts earn 4% right now and that account earns 0.01% or something....but free stamps!)
posted by adekllny at 6:08 AM on October 31, 2023
As others have said, NYC landlords are not allowed to require electronic payment. The bank may charge the landlord a fee for taking ACH payments, but it's not very much compared to credit card fees. No doubt the electronic rent payment companies also charge transaction fees, as this must be part of their business model. I have some question as to whether it's the landlord charging the transaction fee, or the electronic rent payment system charging the transaction fee. When you hear about transaction fees of thirty to fifty bucks someone's getting screwed, and it might be both the tenant and the landlord.
So, this raises a few questions:
Is the electronic rent payment system allowed to charge the tenant a transaction fee? Absolutely. And they can charge as much as they want, since the notional premise is that the tenant is "choosing" to do this for convenience.
Can the landlord pass along any transaction fees to the tenant? Most likely yes as well, predicated on the same premise.
Should the landlord pass along any transaction fees to the tenant? There are a lot of advantages to the landlord in taking electronic payments. Envelopes don't need to be opened and checks deposited; rent payments credit the landlord's accounts more rapidly; accounting is easier/automatic; the landlord may be able to reduce personnel costs associated with taking payments by check; etc. Considering the foregoing and other advantages to the landlord, and especially if the landlord is "strongly encouraging" or making it appear as though electronic payments are required, the landlord can but shouldn't be passing along these charges to the tenant.
Can a transaction fee charged by the landlord be higher than the landlord's costs associated with the electronic rent payment? I'm almost 100% positive the answer is no, and that a landlord could get in real trouble for doing this. Unless it's allowed under the lease, which I'm betting it isn't in your case (and might not be legal in NYC).
It sounds like the landlord in your case is passing on a minor transaction fee charged by the electronic rent payment system and/or bank. If this sticks in your craw, I would suggest contacting the landlord and saying that you're not willing to pay a transaction fee for the privilege of aiding the landlord's financial processing, and that since the law doesn't allow the landlord to require electronic rent payments you will be paying your rent by check. If the landlord really really really wants you to pay electronically and really really really doesn't want to take payment by check, you could suggest an alternative in which the electronic system charges you the amount of your rent less the transaction fee. Make sure you get this in writing at least in the form of an email so the landlord can'c claim you've been underpaying your rent.
I note that you have a good relationship with your landlord and should hasten to add that there's no reason this can't be a perfectly amiable conversation. I think you can just say some version of, "I've been happy to pay my rent online using the old no-fee system, but I'm not cool with paying a fee. So what do you suggest? I can go back to sending in a monthly check, but if there's a way to pay online without incurring an additional fee I'm happy to do that if that's what you prefer." If the landlord gives you some song and dance about how it's costing XYZ, you can politely point out that it was the landlord who requested online payment in the first place and that most of the advantages of paying online accrue to the landlord, not the tenant, which is one reason you're not comfortable paying a fee. Needless to say you'll have to decide whether you want to die on that hill.
posted by slkinsey at 9:53 AM on October 31, 2023
So, this raises a few questions:
Is the electronic rent payment system allowed to charge the tenant a transaction fee? Absolutely. And they can charge as much as they want, since the notional premise is that the tenant is "choosing" to do this for convenience.
Can the landlord pass along any transaction fees to the tenant? Most likely yes as well, predicated on the same premise.
Should the landlord pass along any transaction fees to the tenant? There are a lot of advantages to the landlord in taking electronic payments. Envelopes don't need to be opened and checks deposited; rent payments credit the landlord's accounts more rapidly; accounting is easier/automatic; the landlord may be able to reduce personnel costs associated with taking payments by check; etc. Considering the foregoing and other advantages to the landlord, and especially if the landlord is "strongly encouraging" or making it appear as though electronic payments are required, the landlord can but shouldn't be passing along these charges to the tenant.
Can a transaction fee charged by the landlord be higher than the landlord's costs associated with the electronic rent payment? I'm almost 100% positive the answer is no, and that a landlord could get in real trouble for doing this. Unless it's allowed under the lease, which I'm betting it isn't in your case (and might not be legal in NYC).
It sounds like the landlord in your case is passing on a minor transaction fee charged by the electronic rent payment system and/or bank. If this sticks in your craw, I would suggest contacting the landlord and saying that you're not willing to pay a transaction fee for the privilege of aiding the landlord's financial processing, and that since the law doesn't allow the landlord to require electronic rent payments you will be paying your rent by check. If the landlord really really really wants you to pay electronically and really really really doesn't want to take payment by check, you could suggest an alternative in which the electronic system charges you the amount of your rent less the transaction fee. Make sure you get this in writing at least in the form of an email so the landlord can'c claim you've been underpaying your rent.
I note that you have a good relationship with your landlord and should hasten to add that there's no reason this can't be a perfectly amiable conversation. I think you can just say some version of, "I've been happy to pay my rent online using the old no-fee system, but I'm not cool with paying a fee. So what do you suggest? I can go back to sending in a monthly check, but if there's a way to pay online without incurring an additional fee I'm happy to do that if that's what you prefer." If the landlord gives you some song and dance about how it's costing XYZ, you can politely point out that it was the landlord who requested online payment in the first place and that most of the advantages of paying online accrue to the landlord, not the tenant, which is one reason you're not comfortable paying a fee. Needless to say you'll have to decide whether you want to die on that hill.
posted by slkinsey at 9:53 AM on October 31, 2023
Counterpoint: the NYS law cited above says that "a landlord shall not require a lessee or tenant to use an electronic billing and/or payment system as the only method for the payment of rent." However, that law does not specifically state that the landlord must accept a personal check as payment.
Two years ago, my apartment complex's property management company changed the lease renewals to accept only the following forms of rent payment:
1. Certified bank check (fee charged by the bank)
2. Money order (fee charged by the issuer)
3. ACH auto-debit payment (electronic payment, no fee)
4. Payment through rental portal (electronic payment, fee charged by portal)
Cash and Personal Checks are explicitly not acceptable payment formats.
But, note that Cashier's Checks and Money Orders are also not "electronic payments." So my management company is likely still within the bounds of the law.
Personally, I hate paying by auto-debit because of the "background noise" worry of getting overcharged, or by accidentally having insufficient funds in that account and bouncing the rent payment. But I also hate paying extra fees to pay rent. So I sucked up my annoyance and set-up the ACH auto-debit.
Location: New York state, upstate, Albany region. NYC may differ.
posted by Ardea alba at 7:22 AM on November 1, 2023
Two years ago, my apartment complex's property management company changed the lease renewals to accept only the following forms of rent payment:
1. Certified bank check (fee charged by the bank)
2. Money order (fee charged by the issuer)
3. ACH auto-debit payment (electronic payment, no fee)
4. Payment through rental portal (electronic payment, fee charged by portal)
Cash and Personal Checks are explicitly not acceptable payment formats.
But, note that Cashier's Checks and Money Orders are also not "electronic payments." So my management company is likely still within the bounds of the law.
Personally, I hate paying by auto-debit because of the "background noise" worry of getting overcharged, or by accidentally having insufficient funds in that account and bouncing the rent payment. But I also hate paying extra fees to pay rent. So I sucked up my annoyance and set-up the ACH auto-debit.
Location: New York state, upstate, Albany region. NYC may differ.
posted by Ardea alba at 7:22 AM on November 1, 2023
Response by poster: For anyone that may be looking into this later, I approached the subject with my landlord and he granted me a one time discount on this month's rent to cover all online payment fees for the remaining duration of my lease. So success!
posted by greta simone at 2:24 PM on November 17, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by greta simone at 2:24 PM on November 17, 2023 [1 favorite]
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