How much of a fire hazard is this?
November 13, 2021 4:27 PM Subscribe
I live in a high rise apartment building with over 140 units. In the lobby, there's a mail area with a counter where people sort their mail and discard the junk. In the middle of the night, someone has been smoking in the lobby and tossing the butts in the paper recycling, which (foolishly?) sits next to electrical wires. See pictures here. It often smelled like smoke and ash. I think it's dangerous. Am I right?
During the pandemic, I got in the habit of checking for mail at odd hours in order to avoid being in the elevators with multiple people. I started noticing smoke and ash smells in the paper recycling in the middle of the night, and I made the building's management aware of it.
I had to contact management four times to get them to even look at the situation with the recycling in the lobby. Four times, over a period of weeks. Their solution was to put up a sign asking smokers not to discard their cigarettes there, but management also let me know they thought the sign was "unsightly."
Note that there are electrical wires right next to the basket for discarded junk mail, and that it's all housed in a cheap particle board cabinet which is connected to a fake wall with an electric fake fireplace and some lights.
The building already had a fire in 2018 that was caused by someone putting something not fully extinguished down the trash chute. The fire department had to put that fire out, and the building smelled like smoke for days.
The sign does appear to have stopped smokers from discarding cigarettes in the paper recycling... at least, for now... but I have questions.
1: Is a sign the proper solution?
2: Is the paper recycling next to those wires safe?
3: How much of a fire hazard was this?
4: Is it still a fire hazard?
During the pandemic, I got in the habit of checking for mail at odd hours in order to avoid being in the elevators with multiple people. I started noticing smoke and ash smells in the paper recycling in the middle of the night, and I made the building's management aware of it.
I had to contact management four times to get them to even look at the situation with the recycling in the lobby. Four times, over a period of weeks. Their solution was to put up a sign asking smokers not to discard their cigarettes there, but management also let me know they thought the sign was "unsightly."
Note that there are electrical wires right next to the basket for discarded junk mail, and that it's all housed in a cheap particle board cabinet which is connected to a fake wall with an electric fake fireplace and some lights.
The building already had a fire in 2018 that was caused by someone putting something not fully extinguished down the trash chute. The fire department had to put that fire out, and the building smelled like smoke for days.
The sign does appear to have stopped smokers from discarding cigarettes in the paper recycling... at least, for now... but I have questions.
1: Is a sign the proper solution?
2: Is the paper recycling next to those wires safe?
3: How much of a fire hazard was this?
4: Is it still a fire hazard?
There isn't any elevated hazard from the electrical pictured inside the cabinet.
posted by Mitheral at 4:49 PM on November 13, 2021
posted by Mitheral at 4:49 PM on November 13, 2021
Response by poster: "The wiring wouldn’t bother me. If it’s done correctly (which is probably a safe bet) it won’t get hot enough to set paper on fire."
I was more wondering whether it's safe to have electrical wires and such next to trash and recycling receptacles. If anything ever did catch fire there, it would instantly become an electrical fire.
posted by 2oh1 at 4:53 PM on November 13, 2021
I was more wondering whether it's safe to have electrical wires and such next to trash and recycling receptacles. If anything ever did catch fire there, it would instantly become an electrical fire.
posted by 2oh1 at 4:53 PM on November 13, 2021
maybe ask them to provide one of those sand filled ash receptacles? this one costs like $70. and yeah I do think there should be one wherever people are actually smoking. If people are smoking in the lobby then this is an easy fix.
posted by fingersandtoes at 5:07 PM on November 13, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by fingersandtoes at 5:07 PM on November 13, 2021 [2 favorites]
If anything ever did catch fire there, it would instantly become an electrical fire.
Huh? An electrical fire is a fire started by a fault in an electric circuit. What would it mean for it to "become" an electrical fire?
posted by dmd at 5:17 PM on November 13, 2021 [18 favorites]
Huh? An electrical fire is a fire started by a fault in an electric circuit. What would it mean for it to "become" an electrical fire?
posted by dmd at 5:17 PM on November 13, 2021 [18 favorites]
Is there a smoke detector in that area?
posted by trig at 5:17 PM on November 13, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by trig at 5:17 PM on November 13, 2021 [3 favorites]
What would it mean for it to "become" an electrical fire?
I suppose it could happen that the developing trash fire would damage electrical fittings such that they create circuit faults, but at that point the "electrical fire" aspect is the least of your concerns.
...but the only problem worth being concerned about here is cigarette butts being tossed into the trash OR recycling. There should be a dedicated location for cigarette disposal, or else MUCH more vigorous enforcement, because this sounds like a fire waiting to happen.
posted by aramaic at 5:23 PM on November 13, 2021 [7 favorites]
I suppose it could happen that the developing trash fire would damage electrical fittings such that they create circuit faults, but at that point the "electrical fire" aspect is the least of your concerns.
...but the only problem worth being concerned about here is cigarette butts being tossed into the trash OR recycling. There should be a dedicated location for cigarette disposal, or else MUCH more vigorous enforcement, because this sounds like a fire waiting to happen.
posted by aramaic at 5:23 PM on November 13, 2021 [7 favorites]
Response by poster: "maybe ask them to provide one of those sand filled ash receptacles?"
I should have mentioned it's a nonsmoking building.
"Is there a smoke detector in that area?"
The lobby has a VERY high ceiling (maybe close to 25 feet high?). I assume there's a smoke detector up there somewhere. But if there was a fire in the lobby in the middle of the night, nobody would hear a smoke detector. There are no apartments on the ground floor.
posted by 2oh1 at 5:27 PM on November 13, 2021
I should have mentioned it's a nonsmoking building.
"Is there a smoke detector in that area?"
The lobby has a VERY high ceiling (maybe close to 25 feet high?). I assume there's a smoke detector up there somewhere. But if there was a fire in the lobby in the middle of the night, nobody would hear a smoke detector. There are no apartments on the ground floor.
posted by 2oh1 at 5:27 PM on November 13, 2021
nobody would hear a smoke detector
For whatever consolation it may offer: in a building as large as you describe, any detectors would almost certainly be wired into a centralized alarm system, so everyone in the building would hear it (and be unable to turn off the siren until someone with the right keys arrived).
posted by aramaic at 5:32 PM on November 13, 2021 [5 favorites]
For whatever consolation it may offer: in a building as large as you describe, any detectors would almost certainly be wired into a centralized alarm system, so everyone in the building would hear it (and be unable to turn off the siren until someone with the right keys arrived).
posted by aramaic at 5:32 PM on November 13, 2021 [5 favorites]
Throwing cigarette butts into a trash can filled with paper is a fire hazard, yes. But the electrical wires are irrelevant.
An electrical fire happens when an electric spark or overheated wire catches nearby flammable materials on fire. A fire that starts from a non-electrical source isn’t an electrical fire. Electrical wires themselves aren’t inherently flammable and a fire near electrical wires isn’t inherently more dangerous than one away from electrical wires.
Potentially the components could melt in a way that clauses a short circuit, but that’s exactly what circuit breakers are for — in that case the breaker would trip and prevent a worse outcome.
posted by mekily at 6:01 PM on November 13, 2021 [6 favorites]
An electrical fire happens when an electric spark or overheated wire catches nearby flammable materials on fire. A fire that starts from a non-electrical source isn’t an electrical fire. Electrical wires themselves aren’t inherently flammable and a fire near electrical wires isn’t inherently more dangerous than one away from electrical wires.
Potentially the components could melt in a way that clauses a short circuit, but that’s exactly what circuit breakers are for — in that case the breaker would trip and prevent a worse outcome.
posted by mekily at 6:01 PM on November 13, 2021 [6 favorites]
Maybe contact your city fire department for advice. They might take an interest, especially if your building has already had a fire, and building management will probably take their compaints more seriously than complaints coming from a tenant.
posted by Umami Dearest at 6:03 PM on November 13, 2021 [23 favorites]
posted by Umami Dearest at 6:03 PM on November 13, 2021 [23 favorites]
Some people smoke outside and then extinguish the cherry by flicking it off and rolling it down but are unwilling to toss that harmless but out on the street and the trash can is the appropriate place. Still smells of smoke and ash, that's just because it's a filter full of smoke smelling things and a bit of burnt paper that still smells. You don't need a no-smoking sign beyond the normal, you need a "no-butts in can" sign to tell them to toss their smelly butts somewhere else. Most would just flick the butts out into the street instead of tossing some still burning thing into a trashcan especially in seemingly their own building where they also live. Or they're just stupid.
posted by zengargoyle at 6:53 PM on November 13, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by zengargoyle at 6:53 PM on November 13, 2021 [2 favorites]
Placing just-extinguished cigarettes in a recycling or garbage receptacle is a serious fire hazard. This kind of dangerous behavior by tenants is why landlords use surveillance cameras in common areas.
To answer your specific questions:
1. A sign is a necessary step, but not sufficient to solve this problem. The management can make a prettier sign if they want, but since it hasn't worked so far to keep smokers from depositing just-extinguished cigarettes in receptacles with paper and trash, the management will need to do more. Management will need to send a letter to every tenant telling them the management has become aware of this dangerous behavior by smokers in the building, and that smokers must immediately stop disposing of cigarettes in the trash or recycling, and must only smoke outside and dispose of cigarettes safely before entering the building.
2. The wires are fine, not a hazard, as others have explained above. Leave the wires out of any letters you write to the management, lest they discount your observations of the real hazard, cigarette smokers putting butts where they can start a fire.
3. This is huge fire hazard. In a 140 unit building, if the common ground floor area is engulfed in flame and smoke, there will be real trouble getting residents out in time. This fire hazard is so huge that if I were the manager or owner of this building, and I learned from a tenant this was happening, I would immediately write the appropriate warning letter to all tenants, place surveillance cameras in that area, and find the person who is doing this and evict them. Much cheaper and more moral than being sued when the inevitable fire happens.
4. Yes, this is still a serious fire hazard. Your building manager and owner have failed to address the fire hazard you brought to their attention four times. I suggest you write one letter to your management expressing your dismay that they have not addressed the fire hazard, but also immediately contact your local fire department and make a complaint. Ask the Fire Marshall, or fire inspector, or fire prevention worker (they have different titles in different jurisdictions), to come inspect the building and tell you if the fire alarms and sprinklers would be sufficient to stop the inevitable trash/recycling fire and allow evacuation of residents before they are injured by smoke inhalation and flames. Tell them the building has already had one trash fire within the last three years and and has ignored the likelihood of another. Ask the firefighters: "I can't get the management to address this fire hazard. Should I move out, or will the fire alarms and sprinklers be enough to save us when the careless smokers start another trash/ recycling fire?"
I am in the US. I have been a property manager or owner with tenants in three states. Fire, flood, vermin infestations, and dangerous tenants in the building are often recognized as valid reasons to break a lease. I have been in two fires as a child and and sustained one serious burn as an adult. The burn pains me every day. You don't want to live in a building with a serious risk of fire.
posted by KayQuestions at 7:17 PM on November 13, 2021 [17 favorites]
To answer your specific questions:
1. A sign is a necessary step, but not sufficient to solve this problem. The management can make a prettier sign if they want, but since it hasn't worked so far to keep smokers from depositing just-extinguished cigarettes in receptacles with paper and trash, the management will need to do more. Management will need to send a letter to every tenant telling them the management has become aware of this dangerous behavior by smokers in the building, and that smokers must immediately stop disposing of cigarettes in the trash or recycling, and must only smoke outside and dispose of cigarettes safely before entering the building.
2. The wires are fine, not a hazard, as others have explained above. Leave the wires out of any letters you write to the management, lest they discount your observations of the real hazard, cigarette smokers putting butts where they can start a fire.
3. This is huge fire hazard. In a 140 unit building, if the common ground floor area is engulfed in flame and smoke, there will be real trouble getting residents out in time. This fire hazard is so huge that if I were the manager or owner of this building, and I learned from a tenant this was happening, I would immediately write the appropriate warning letter to all tenants, place surveillance cameras in that area, and find the person who is doing this and evict them. Much cheaper and more moral than being sued when the inevitable fire happens.
4. Yes, this is still a serious fire hazard. Your building manager and owner have failed to address the fire hazard you brought to their attention four times. I suggest you write one letter to your management expressing your dismay that they have not addressed the fire hazard, but also immediately contact your local fire department and make a complaint. Ask the Fire Marshall, or fire inspector, or fire prevention worker (they have different titles in different jurisdictions), to come inspect the building and tell you if the fire alarms and sprinklers would be sufficient to stop the inevitable trash/recycling fire and allow evacuation of residents before they are injured by smoke inhalation and flames. Tell them the building has already had one trash fire within the last three years and and has ignored the likelihood of another. Ask the firefighters: "I can't get the management to address this fire hazard. Should I move out, or will the fire alarms and sprinklers be enough to save us when the careless smokers start another trash/ recycling fire?"
I am in the US. I have been a property manager or owner with tenants in three states. Fire, flood, vermin infestations, and dangerous tenants in the building are often recognized as valid reasons to break a lease. I have been in two fires as a child and and sustained one serious burn as an adult. The burn pains me every day. You don't want to live in a building with a serious risk of fire.
posted by KayQuestions at 7:17 PM on November 13, 2021 [17 favorites]
As Umami Dearest says, your local fire department needs to know. They will get things changed faster than anything you can do yourself.
Preview: KayQuestions also says to alert the fire dept. Don't wait.
posted by anadem at 7:30 PM on November 13, 2021 [4 favorites]
Preview: KayQuestions also says to alert the fire dept. Don't wait.
posted by anadem at 7:30 PM on November 13, 2021 [4 favorites]
Response by poster: "This kind of dangerous behavior by tenants is why landlords use surveillance cameras in common areas."
This is EXACTLY what I told them. There's surveillance in the lobby. I gave them the exact times to check it on multiple occasions, narrowed down to within an hour. They did nothing. They told me the video footage is complicated to go through. Unbelievable.
"A sign is a necessary step, but not sufficient to solve this problem. The management can make a prettier sign if they want, but since it hasn't worked so far to keep smokers from depositing just-extinguished cigarettes in receptacles with paper and trash, the management will need to do more."
Actually, the sign does seem to have stopped smokers from putting their butts the paper recycling. My question is whether or not hanging a sign there is enough, especially since I assume they will eventually take the sign down because they believe the sign is, and I quote, "unsightly."
posted by 2oh1 at 7:35 PM on November 13, 2021
This is EXACTLY what I told them. There's surveillance in the lobby. I gave them the exact times to check it on multiple occasions, narrowed down to within an hour. They did nothing. They told me the video footage is complicated to go through. Unbelievable.
"A sign is a necessary step, but not sufficient to solve this problem. The management can make a prettier sign if they want, but since it hasn't worked so far to keep smokers from depositing just-extinguished cigarettes in receptacles with paper and trash, the management will need to do more."
Actually, the sign does seem to have stopped smokers from putting their butts the paper recycling. My question is whether or not hanging a sign there is enough, especially since I assume they will eventually take the sign down because they believe the sign is, and I quote, "unsightly."
posted by 2oh1 at 7:35 PM on November 13, 2021
Fire hazard is one of the reasons our HOA has removed recycling and trash bins from the mail area in our 40 unit apt bldg.
Residents take their mail to their apartments to sort.
posted by artdrectr at 7:43 PM on November 13, 2021 [9 favorites]
Residents take their mail to their apartments to sort.
posted by artdrectr at 7:43 PM on November 13, 2021 [9 favorites]
That's a dandy setup, from what you've described, for burning the whole darn building down in the middle of the night, and making it VERY difficult for residents to escape. That's not just a hazard, that's a tragedy waiting for a time to happen.
Smoke alarms are nice, but the real question is, is the building new enough or have fire codes required it to be fitted with sprinkers?
It'll of course vary greatly by location, but one apartment building in our metro area is being sued for having a hazardous location for it's OUTSIDE dumpster after a fire caused by non-residents that tossed not-quite-extinguished things in it, whose combustion interfered with the very limited escape route, and to top it off, they had iffy smoke detector usage and locations.
Your local (if in the U.S., and I presume many other locations, too) will have a local fire chief or similar that you can request they investigate compliance with safety requirements. Be specific about concerns, so you can make sure they check those in addition to whatever else they might notice.
posted by stormyteal at 1:46 AM on November 14, 2021 [2 favorites]
Smoke alarms are nice, but the real question is, is the building new enough or have fire codes required it to be fitted with sprinkers?
It'll of course vary greatly by location, but one apartment building in our metro area is being sued for having a hazardous location for it's OUTSIDE dumpster after a fire caused by non-residents that tossed not-quite-extinguished things in it, whose combustion interfered with the very limited escape route, and to top it off, they had iffy smoke detector usage and locations.
Your local (if in the U.S., and I presume many other locations, too) will have a local fire chief or similar that you can request they investigate compliance with safety requirements. Be specific about concerns, so you can make sure they check those in addition to whatever else they might notice.
posted by stormyteal at 1:46 AM on November 14, 2021 [2 favorites]
I agree with everything that KayQuestions said, and along with them, Umami Dearest and anadem, I urge you to alert the Fire Department in your city.
I get that it's frustrating that you have raised a legitimate concern and, in return, your building's management is being ridiculous about the sign and is introducing obstructions to the process of reviewing surveillance footage.
But the point of bringing in the Fire Department is to elevate this beyond a dispute between one tenant and the building management. Dealing with issues like this is what government agencies are for. Undoubtedly, the Fire Department will want to get a look at the building's fire insurance policy -- especially given the previous trash chute fire -- and I imagine that the prospect of an increase in insurance premiums (not to mention government penalties and bad publicity) will convince the building management that this is an issue worth their attention.
posted by virago at 2:47 AM on November 14, 2021 [3 favorites]
I get that it's frustrating that you have raised a legitimate concern and, in return, your building's management is being ridiculous about the sign and is introducing obstructions to the process of reviewing surveillance footage.
But the point of bringing in the Fire Department is to elevate this beyond a dispute between one tenant and the building management. Dealing with issues like this is what government agencies are for. Undoubtedly, the Fire Department will want to get a look at the building's fire insurance policy -- especially given the previous trash chute fire -- and I imagine that the prospect of an increase in insurance premiums (not to mention government penalties and bad publicity) will convince the building management that this is an issue worth their attention.
posted by virago at 2:47 AM on November 14, 2021 [3 favorites]
20h1, to answer your updated question, the sign is not enough prevent the fire hazard, even if they keep it up.
Management needs to review the surveillance footage and notify the careless smoker/ fire starter in writing to stop the dangerous behavior. They need to write to all tenants explaining the fire hazard and asking for cooperation in preventing the fire hazard. They can also remove the trash and recycling from the lobby, inspect and update their fire alarm system, install or update sprinklers, and inform tenants now and annually of evacuation routes in case of fire.
Management is not taking any of these obvious steps to keep tenants safe from fire. They already had one fire caused by a careless tenant. You told them exactly what they need to do: look at the surveillance footage to identify the person and put a stop to that tenant's dangerous behavior. This has to be very frustrating for you. I know it has been for me every time I had to deal with an incompetent landlord who failed to correct a hazard. You can't be in the lobby at all times to see if the sign is actually working to stop the firebugs. Your best bet to "light a fire under" management is to ask the fire department for help.
posted by KayQuestions at 3:15 AM on November 14, 2021
Management needs to review the surveillance footage and notify the careless smoker/ fire starter in writing to stop the dangerous behavior. They need to write to all tenants explaining the fire hazard and asking for cooperation in preventing the fire hazard. They can also remove the trash and recycling from the lobby, inspect and update their fire alarm system, install or update sprinklers, and inform tenants now and annually of evacuation routes in case of fire.
Management is not taking any of these obvious steps to keep tenants safe from fire. They already had one fire caused by a careless tenant. You told them exactly what they need to do: look at the surveillance footage to identify the person and put a stop to that tenant's dangerous behavior. This has to be very frustrating for you. I know it has been for me every time I had to deal with an incompetent landlord who failed to correct a hazard. You can't be in the lobby at all times to see if the sign is actually working to stop the firebugs. Your best bet to "light a fire under" management is to ask the fire department for help.
posted by KayQuestions at 3:15 AM on November 14, 2021
Most would just flick the butts out into the street instead of tossing some still burning thing into a trashcan especially in seemingly their own building where they also live. Or they're just stupid.
Cigarette butts should be extinguished and then properly disposed of in a trashcan. They are waste full of carcinogens and nicotine, which is toxic to living things. They should not be put in the recycling because they are not recyclable. They really should not be thrown outside, where they are really bad for the environment.
posted by hydropsyche at 4:33 AM on November 14, 2021 [6 favorites]
Cigarette butts should be extinguished and then properly disposed of in a trashcan. They are waste full of carcinogens and nicotine, which is toxic to living things. They should not be put in the recycling because they are not recyclable. They really should not be thrown outside, where they are really bad for the environment.
posted by hydropsyche at 4:33 AM on November 14, 2021 [6 favorites]
Isn’t smoking in the lobby against the law where you live?
posted by slkinsey at 5:07 AM on November 14, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by slkinsey at 5:07 AM on November 14, 2021 [1 favorite]
It might be time to organize the other tenants, go door to door with a petition or something along those lines. Do you have any friends in the building? Get together with them and make a plan to put pressure on the management. There is strength in numbers!
posted by mareli at 11:17 AM on November 14, 2021
posted by mareli at 11:17 AM on November 14, 2021
Partner started a fire with incense ashes in a waste paper basket that if not caught within a minute woud have destroyed the house and as it was, ruined the room. You have a serious fire hazard there, and not just to the electrical wiring.
posted by Peach at 1:49 PM on November 14, 2021
posted by Peach at 1:49 PM on November 14, 2021
Response by poster: "You have a serious fire hazard there, and not just to the electrical wiring."
Management put up a sign asking people to not put their cigarette butts in the trash or recycling, and people stopped.
Is that enough of a solution?
I just want to make sure I'm not over-reacting. This building sees a lot of management turnover. The current management is nice on a personal level, but they don't take things seriously and they brush off issues.
posted by 2oh1 at 2:34 PM on November 14, 2021
Management put up a sign asking people to not put their cigarette butts in the trash or recycling, and people stopped.
Is that enough of a solution?
I just want to make sure I'm not over-reacting. This building sees a lot of management turnover. The current management is nice on a personal level, but they don't take things seriously and they brush off issues.
posted by 2oh1 at 2:34 PM on November 14, 2021
Is that enough of a solution?
IMO, no - it just takes one careless person, maybe arriving home at 2am after a few drinks, to accidentally start a fire. And you know there's at least one careless person in your 140-unit building because there was already a trash chute fire, and apparently multiple trash can fires. There are also an unknown number of visitors to your building, and future tenants who haven't moved in yet, who might not see the new warning sign.
But I'm no expert. There are, however, experts who will be happy to answer questions like this, and they work for your local fire department. So ask them for advice - they'll not only have an expert opinion on the dangers of placing a covered trash can in your lobby, but they'll be able to back up their opinion and make sure that any necessary changes get made.
posted by Umami Dearest at 7:55 PM on November 14, 2021
IMO, no - it just takes one careless person, maybe arriving home at 2am after a few drinks, to accidentally start a fire. And you know there's at least one careless person in your 140-unit building because there was already a trash chute fire, and apparently multiple trash can fires. There are also an unknown number of visitors to your building, and future tenants who haven't moved in yet, who might not see the new warning sign.
But I'm no expert. There are, however, experts who will be happy to answer questions like this, and they work for your local fire department. So ask them for advice - they'll not only have an expert opinion on the dangers of placing a covered trash can in your lobby, but they'll be able to back up their opinion and make sure that any necessary changes get made.
posted by Umami Dearest at 7:55 PM on November 14, 2021
Response by poster: "There are, however, experts who will be happy to answer questions like this, and they work for your local fire department. So ask them for advice"
That's what I'm going to do.
Thanks for the advice everyone!
posted by 2oh1 at 8:13 PM on November 14, 2021 [1 favorite]
That's what I'm going to do.
Thanks for the advice everyone!
posted by 2oh1 at 8:13 PM on November 14, 2021 [1 favorite]
The one time I complained to the landlord about people smoking in the public areas of the building, every tenant got a sternly worded letter within a few days stating in no uncertain terms that smoking in the lobby, stairways and halls of the building was unlawful and would not be tolerated. This seems like the very least your landlord could do.
posted by slkinsey at 7:51 AM on November 15, 2021
posted by slkinsey at 7:51 AM on November 15, 2021
Response by poster: Well, I got my answer from the Fire Marshall:
"We can only regulate items as they happen and as mandated by the Portland Fire Code. No smoking is regulated, It appears that no smoking is posted. If they remove the sign, then let us know and we can take action at that time.
There is really nothing more that the Fire Marshal’s Office can do."
I guess that's that. I hope the smokers respect the sign.
posted by 2oh1 at 3:44 PM on November 15, 2021
"We can only regulate items as they happen and as mandated by the Portland Fire Code. No smoking is regulated, It appears that no smoking is posted. If they remove the sign, then let us know and we can take action at that time.
There is really nothing more that the Fire Marshal’s Office can do."
I guess that's that. I hope the smokers respect the sign.
posted by 2oh1 at 3:44 PM on November 15, 2021
I'm sorry. That sounds really frustrating. I guess that means that you have to keep close watch on whether and/or when management removes the "unsightly" sign. So much for requiring the landlord to review surveillance footage or take any more concrete preventive steps.
One last suggestion: Would these people be of any use? (They inspect commercial buildings in your city, which includes any residential building with more than three units.)
posted by virago at 7:20 AM on December 7, 2021
One last suggestion: Would these people be of any use? (They inspect commercial buildings in your city, which includes any residential building with more than three units.)
posted by virago at 7:20 AM on December 7, 2021
This thread is closed to new comments.
The wiring wouldn’t bother me. If it’s done correctly (which is probably a safe bet) it won’t get hot enough to set paper on fire.
posted by TurnKey at 4:48 PM on November 13, 2021 [4 favorites]