Possibly leaving for Denver after half a century in my hometown.
March 19, 2019 1:07 PM Subscribe
So back in 2015, I posted that we might have to leave Jacksonville in the next five years due to Mrs. Mosley's career. Four years later, it looks like time might be up. Back then it looked like it might be Dallas, but a new and exciting career opportunity has presented itself to her in somewhere we weren't looking: Denver.
There are very exciting and very terrifying aspects to this possible move and I'm processing them at the moment. I have two basic questions.
The first is practical: Who on the Blue lives in Denver currently or very recently and can give me an idea of what its like?
The second is emotional: Anybody out there left the town they grew up in after living there for a very long time? Aside from a year in Tallahassee when I was pursuing my Masters degree, I have spent all of my 45 years in Jacksonville, Florida. Leaving all my friends and family (including both of my octogenarian parents) is tying my stomach into knots right now, and I'd love some guidance from people who've had a similar experience on how to cope. Much thanks.
There are very exciting and very terrifying aspects to this possible move and I'm processing them at the moment. I have two basic questions.
The first is practical: Who on the Blue lives in Denver currently or very recently and can give me an idea of what its like?
The second is emotional: Anybody out there left the town they grew up in after living there for a very long time? Aside from a year in Tallahassee when I was pursuing my Masters degree, I have spent all of my 45 years in Jacksonville, Florida. Leaving all my friends and family (including both of my octogenarian parents) is tying my stomach into knots right now, and I'd love some guidance from people who've had a similar experience on how to cope. Much thanks.
I have lived in Denver on and off for the past twenty years. It's a nice town, people come here for a variety of reasons, including jobs, and a great climate for outdoor sports. Our infrastructure is still catching up to the growth in Denver and the surrounding cities.
Real Estate depending on your desire for location and proximity to things (and schools) can take longer and cost more than you expect.
posted by nickggully at 1:31 PM on March 19, 2019 [2 favorites]
Real Estate depending on your desire for location and proximity to things (and schools) can take longer and cost more than you expect.
posted by nickggully at 1:31 PM on March 19, 2019 [2 favorites]
I can help with the first question! I've lived here for about 8 years now. I've never been to Florida, so I can't compare the two.
What it's like: people enjoy complaining about newcomers, traffic, and rapidly increasing rent (mine doubled in the past 6 years). It's very sunny and dry, and March is our snowiest month. Microbrews, marijuana, and outdoor recreation are a big part of culture here. My friends regularly post photos of themselves in yoga poses on the top of mountains. It feels very white to me, but that's also a reflection of the neighborhood where I live (more demographic info here).
posted by sugarbomb at 1:31 PM on March 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
What it's like: people enjoy complaining about newcomers, traffic, and rapidly increasing rent (mine doubled in the past 6 years). It's very sunny and dry, and March is our snowiest month. Microbrews, marijuana, and outdoor recreation are a big part of culture here. My friends regularly post photos of themselves in yoga poses on the top of mountains. It feels very white to me, but that's also a reflection of the neighborhood where I live (more demographic info here).
posted by sugarbomb at 1:31 PM on March 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
I lived in Jacksonville longer than I've lived anywhere else (which is to say: I don't have much experience leaving a place I've lived in a long time), and have lived in Denver for over six years now. The best thing about moving here is that so many people in Colorado aren't from Colorado. Less than half were natives at the last census, and I suspect the next one will have an even lower percentage. That makes it fairly easy to meet people.
My first suggestion for anyone considering a Denver move (or basically any other move) is to try WalkScore for finding areas to live that have reasonable walk/bike/transit distances to your workplace, grocery stores, etc. You can plug in multiple addresses to cover more than one possible commute or other trip. The actual housing listed there is all rental, but even if you're planning to buy, it'll give you some sense what neighborhoods and areas might work for you.
I'm unlikely ever to go back to Jacksonville for more than a visit. You may find the same's true for you, and in any case, it's worth a try, right? Frontier, Southwest, and United all have nonstop flights to Jacksonville, so it's not going to be that hard to stay connected. Feel free to MeMail with questions!
posted by asperity at 1:37 PM on March 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
My first suggestion for anyone considering a Denver move (or basically any other move) is to try WalkScore for finding areas to live that have reasonable walk/bike/transit distances to your workplace, grocery stores, etc. You can plug in multiple addresses to cover more than one possible commute or other trip. The actual housing listed there is all rental, but even if you're planning to buy, it'll give you some sense what neighborhoods and areas might work for you.
I'm unlikely ever to go back to Jacksonville for more than a visit. You may find the same's true for you, and in any case, it's worth a try, right? Frontier, Southwest, and United all have nonstop flights to Jacksonville, so it's not going to be that hard to stay connected. Feel free to MeMail with questions!
posted by asperity at 1:37 PM on March 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
Regarding your second question: I have changed cities many times and I have found that whenever you move it takes 1.5 to three years for it to really feel like home. It's good to know that ahead of time so that you don't kick yourself when things still feel weird at first. Also know that you'll probably make new friends in waves. There will be the first people you meet, and then the second people you meet after you've been there a while.
If you've never had to make friends as an adult: accept invitations, go to work events, join meetups that make sense for your interests. Follow-up with one-on-ones and/or low-key invites to low-structure activities. You have to hang out 5-7 times to really feel like you're friends. <>
It's hard to leave your community behind, but the good news is that there is new community out there for you to find (and/or build)! And on lonely nights, you can always boot up Skype and holla at your oldest friends.
Whatever you do: do not move your body without moving your spirit. You've gotta get yourself to buy into this adventure, or else you will find yourself inhibited, stagnate, and waiting for a (fantasy) return to what your life once was. Go forth and prosper!
posted by whimsicalnymph at 2:38 PM on March 19, 2019 [7 favorites]
If you've never had to make friends as an adult: accept invitations, go to work events, join meetups that make sense for your interests. Follow-up with one-on-ones and/or low-key invites to low-structure activities. You have to hang out 5-7 times to really feel like you're friends. <>
It's hard to leave your community behind, but the good news is that there is new community out there for you to find (and/or build)! And on lonely nights, you can always boot up Skype and holla at your oldest friends.
Whatever you do: do not move your body without moving your spirit. You've gotta get yourself to buy into this adventure, or else you will find yourself inhibited, stagnate, and waiting for a (fantasy) return to what your life once was. Go forth and prosper!
posted by whimsicalnymph at 2:38 PM on March 19, 2019 [7 favorites]
not a Denver denizen, but from past business trips: Denver in winter is about the lowest humidity I've ever experienced. I couldn't apply enough moisturizer when I worked there. It's a lovely and amazing place though.
posted by scruss at 2:50 PM on March 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by scruss at 2:50 PM on March 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
I lived in Denver for a year. It's not bad. My take-away from it was that it should have more going on than it does for the size of its population. Anecdetail: Great Ethiopian restaurants.
posted by falsedmitri at 7:27 PM on March 19, 2019 [2 favorites]
posted by falsedmitri at 7:27 PM on March 19, 2019 [2 favorites]
I moved to Denver a few years ago to be out of Manhattan and closer to my spouse’s family. I like it a lot. The city is politically center-left and moving further leftward. It’s struggling a little to deal with some of the consequences of rapid growth (increasing housing prices, strained transportation infrastructure) but is generally a really pleasant place to live. It is almost impossible to live here and not be a little bit outdoorsy, even if you don’t ski or mountain climb. It is extremely dry and the vegetation will seem kind of spare compared with Jacksonville, but the high plains have their own beauty and the mountains of course are gorgeous. Lip balm, sunscreen, and sunglasses are your friends.
posted by The Elusive Architeuthis at 9:24 PM on March 19, 2019 [3 favorites]
posted by The Elusive Architeuthis at 9:24 PM on March 19, 2019 [3 favorites]
The entire front range of Colorado is in BOOM GROWTH! mode and will be for a while. Watching some Denver traffic cams might be a thing to do for a while; and real estate is going nuts. People are buying in Colorado Springs; so as to afford a home; and commuting to Denver for their jobs. Yes.
The cold is overrated; the sun makes up for the actual temperature.
I'd like to tell you the whole area is way overrated; and just a horrible mess, and to stay away; but I'm a terrible liar so I don't even try.
Real estate is going nuts; I will say that; and yeah. It is getting crowded - something something to the West limits the cities growth; so the whole N-S stretch of the city has mirrored other cities that have limited growth to one direction; such as Austin has with the lakes and green space to the West.
Research is your friend as always.
posted by buzzman at 9:47 PM on March 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
The cold is overrated; the sun makes up for the actual temperature.
I'd like to tell you the whole area is way overrated; and just a horrible mess, and to stay away; but I'm a terrible liar so I don't even try.
Real estate is going nuts; I will say that; and yeah. It is getting crowded - something something to the West limits the cities growth; so the whole N-S stretch of the city has mirrored other cities that have limited growth to one direction; such as Austin has with the lakes and green space to the West.
Research is your friend as always.
posted by buzzman at 9:47 PM on March 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
I live in Fort Collins - about an hour north of Denver - and just moved here. There is so much to do outdoors that, as far as I can tell, you'll never run out of new things to find.
I keep meaning to start some meetups in IRL, but get distracted. It would be nice to get a group together for consistent trivia or activities. If you move here, hopefully you can keep an eye out for that!
posted by holmesian at 9:47 AM on March 20, 2019 [2 favorites]
I keep meaning to start some meetups in IRL, but get distracted. It would be nice to get a group together for consistent trivia or activities. If you move here, hopefully you can keep an eye out for that!
posted by holmesian at 9:47 AM on March 20, 2019 [2 favorites]
I moved to Denver almost a decade ago now. (Gulp.) Housing and cost of living is high (but not as high as SF/LA/NYC), the weather is mostly lovely, the outdoor opportunities are endless, lots of good restaurants. I like Denver because it is cosmopolitan without being ginormous. Feel free to MeMail me with more specific questions. When you get here, definitely organize a meet up!
posted by zeusianfog at 11:57 AM on March 20, 2019 [2 favorites]
posted by zeusianfog at 11:57 AM on March 20, 2019 [2 favorites]
I've 43 years in Colorado, but not much in Denver. I can address a few common things, though (warning: it's 3am here, so... might be a little parenthetical).
Some downsides:
At a state level, TABOR continues to prevent the government from being adequately funded. This has led to a number of painful compromises (A state government official is a distant friend. She mentioned having a discussion that went: K-12 education, higher education, transportation, or health care... which two do we not fight to fund? Higher ed lost completely, and transportation seems to have been moved to special funding initiatives)
TABOR is a direct outgrowth of a strong traditional (little l) libertarian streak in the state. Much less so in Denver, but it still exists in much of rural Colorado. It can be reflected in voting tallies on taxes and minimum wage initiatives.
As mentioned, long time residents (the minority) often feel put-upon by the growth here. For instance, a quick check of Zillow shows my parents' house at 5.5 times the amount they sold it for. I assure you, wages have not increased by a similar multiplier, and it's painful to watch that opportunity become out of reach forever. Always tempting to look for people to blame.
It's dry, drink more water. Don't be fooled: it's very close to a desert here. And more seriously, long term water supply is a real concern. Three bad years of snowfall, and we're in trouble. (We're good this year, though).
On the more mixed side:
Colorado is primarily a cultural import state (unless you like cattle). That means, you will find something familiar here, no matter where you are from. And you will find people here from all over, many in a very similar situation of having moved here recently. The downside here is that it's not a... how should I say this? While there are some nice things to do (go see the Kirkland, it's small but awesome), it's not a place you come for the culture. One of the most frequent tropes I hear from newcomers is "Well, yes, but it doesn't have *insert cultural icon here*". Correct. Please stop that, and go outside.
Public transit can be good or bad, as can schools, and snowfall and removal. Neighborhood is pretty much all-important for these.
We only get minor flooding, droughts, highly avoidable forest fires, some entertaining thunderstorms and (in Denver, very rarely) tornadoes. No hurricanes or earthquakes. About two *really* cold weeks a year, and two *really* hot weeks a year, with the rest being quite moderate. Four full seasons.
Plus sides:
I almost never take vacations elsewhere. Inside an hour (I'm in Boulder right now), I can be in places most people only get to dream about. Climbing, biking, running, hiking, even just walking outside... 3 days of clouds in a row is pretty uncommon. And guaranteed that other people are around to do it with you, if you want.
The economy is going better than it ever has. Colorado is primarily a state of small, diversified employers. It is more resistant to some kinds of downturns (IBM laying off half its staff isn't such a big deal).
Politically, we've had a few good governors in a row, and I have hopes for Polis, if he can avoid getting dragooned into state party dogmatic politics. Major infrastructure is generally good.
Despite any downside here, I am not planning on moving away.
Glad to answer any questions for outside of Denver, if you're interested.
posted by cowcowgrasstree at 3:02 AM on March 21, 2019 [4 favorites]
Some downsides:
At a state level, TABOR continues to prevent the government from being adequately funded. This has led to a number of painful compromises (A state government official is a distant friend. She mentioned having a discussion that went: K-12 education, higher education, transportation, or health care... which two do we not fight to fund? Higher ed lost completely, and transportation seems to have been moved to special funding initiatives)
TABOR is a direct outgrowth of a strong traditional (little l) libertarian streak in the state. Much less so in Denver, but it still exists in much of rural Colorado. It can be reflected in voting tallies on taxes and minimum wage initiatives.
As mentioned, long time residents (the minority) often feel put-upon by the growth here. For instance, a quick check of Zillow shows my parents' house at 5.5 times the amount they sold it for. I assure you, wages have not increased by a similar multiplier, and it's painful to watch that opportunity become out of reach forever. Always tempting to look for people to blame.
It's dry, drink more water. Don't be fooled: it's very close to a desert here. And more seriously, long term water supply is a real concern. Three bad years of snowfall, and we're in trouble. (We're good this year, though).
On the more mixed side:
Colorado is primarily a cultural import state (unless you like cattle). That means, you will find something familiar here, no matter where you are from. And you will find people here from all over, many in a very similar situation of having moved here recently. The downside here is that it's not a... how should I say this? While there are some nice things to do (go see the Kirkland, it's small but awesome), it's not a place you come for the culture. One of the most frequent tropes I hear from newcomers is "Well, yes, but it doesn't have *insert cultural icon here*". Correct. Please stop that, and go outside.
Public transit can be good or bad, as can schools, and snowfall and removal. Neighborhood is pretty much all-important for these.
We only get minor flooding, droughts, highly avoidable forest fires, some entertaining thunderstorms and (in Denver, very rarely) tornadoes. No hurricanes or earthquakes. About two *really* cold weeks a year, and two *really* hot weeks a year, with the rest being quite moderate. Four full seasons.
Plus sides:
I almost never take vacations elsewhere. Inside an hour (I'm in Boulder right now), I can be in places most people only get to dream about. Climbing, biking, running, hiking, even just walking outside... 3 days of clouds in a row is pretty uncommon. And guaranteed that other people are around to do it with you, if you want.
The economy is going better than it ever has. Colorado is primarily a state of small, diversified employers. It is more resistant to some kinds of downturns (IBM laying off half its staff isn't such a big deal).
Politically, we've had a few good governors in a row, and I have hopes for Polis, if he can avoid getting dragooned into state party dogmatic politics. Major infrastructure is generally good.
Despite any downside here, I am not planning on moving away.
Glad to answer any questions for outside of Denver, if you're interested.
posted by cowcowgrasstree at 3:02 AM on March 21, 2019 [4 favorites]
"Well, yes, but it doesn't have *insert cultural icon here*"
We don't have the Met. We've got Central City Opera, and it's better. (Opera Colorado's pretty great, too.) Whatever you're into, there's probably at least one group here that's also into it. Though I haven't found any fiber arts enthusiasts that I've really clicked with yet, and I could really use more people to crochet with.
Serious upside to the high altitude, low humidity, actual winter life compared with Jacksonville: you're not going to encounter new and exciting species of cockroach here, unless you head down to the Springs to the entomology museum. Which we should seriously organize a meetup to visit sometime, y'all.
posted by asperity at 10:44 AM on March 21, 2019 [2 favorites]
We don't have the Met. We've got Central City Opera, and it's better. (Opera Colorado's pretty great, too.) Whatever you're into, there's probably at least one group here that's also into it. Though I haven't found any fiber arts enthusiasts that I've really clicked with yet, and I could really use more people to crochet with.
Serious upside to the high altitude, low humidity, actual winter life compared with Jacksonville: you're not going to encounter new and exciting species of cockroach here, unless you head down to the Springs to the entomology museum. Which we should seriously organize a meetup to visit sometime, y'all.
posted by asperity at 10:44 AM on March 21, 2019 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Mrs. Mosley had her interview with the CFO today and decided that the gig just wasn't for her. Still, the job change (and subsequent moving to a new city) will happen at some point soon, so I am extremely grateful for the kind words and awesome advice. Thank you all!
posted by AlonzoMosleyFBI at 2:13 PM on March 22, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by AlonzoMosleyFBI at 2:13 PM on March 22, 2019 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
It was very hard to leave the city that I had spent so many formative years in. We have maintained some friendships there and built new ones here but it takes a long time to have the strong bond of long-term relationships. We also left family behind, including my in-laws. We budgeted in some travel costs to ensure we stay connected.
A big difference is that we were both very tired of the problems in our previous city and excited to give something else a try -- we both came to the decision before starting to look for jobs. It sounds like you are happy where you are, so this will be harder. It's also tough making friends in a new city as an adult. My wife did meetups and workout classes and built a network quickly -- I'm more solitary and have made friends more slowly. On the upside, the whole experience has been very bonding for our family as we held tight to each other during the transition. Hope this helps, you're welcome to PM if you have specific questions about Denver!
posted by M.C. Lo-Carb! at 1:23 PM on March 19, 2019 [1 favorite]