First time single man - what should I know?
March 30, 2015 1:52 AM Subscribe
After 13 years of a relationship, my wife and I have separated. It's a mutual decision and we're both feeling good about it. BUT... I've not been in in the dating game since I was 15 and I'm 31 now. So what should I know? Any tips, advice, "never never never"s much appreciated.
I'm guessing it works a little differently to how it did at high school... or maybe not?
Seriously, don't look for a relationship now. Maybe use Tinder for super casual dates/hookups.
My advice if you choose to go down the dating path...be brutally honest about your current situation and just don't be an asshole.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 3:08 AM on March 30, 2015 [6 favorites]
My advice if you choose to go down the dating path...be brutally honest about your current situation and just don't be an asshole.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 3:08 AM on March 30, 2015 [6 favorites]
Best answer: Yeah.
I can tell you one of the most tiresome scenarios (I'm a straight lady) in online dating is the Recently Separated Guy Getting Back Out There. Someone I could have screened out in real life as "not ready" ends up spending a coffee or dinner date leaving me feeling used for sexual validation, distraction, and, more often than not, a female ear to talk through his relationship failure with. This is not what other people (or online dating) is for. From experience, I prefer people at least a year out from an actual divorce, so I don't feel like I'm having to ride that ride with them and play weird roles around that. (Your mileage might vary with other divorced people; I've never been married.)
If you're still determined to do this, I'd be upfront immediately in your profile about how recent the separation is, and the fact that you're not yet divorced, as a polite courtesy. You may find other women in the same situation that way, with similar goals, instead of ending up with someone who can't wait to get out of there.
posted by blue suede stockings at 4:16 AM on March 30, 2015 [41 favorites]
I can tell you one of the most tiresome scenarios (I'm a straight lady) in online dating is the Recently Separated Guy Getting Back Out There. Someone I could have screened out in real life as "not ready" ends up spending a coffee or dinner date leaving me feeling used for sexual validation, distraction, and, more often than not, a female ear to talk through his relationship failure with. This is not what other people (or online dating) is for. From experience, I prefer people at least a year out from an actual divorce, so I don't feel like I'm having to ride that ride with them and play weird roles around that. (Your mileage might vary with other divorced people; I've never been married.)
If you're still determined to do this, I'd be upfront immediately in your profile about how recent the separation is, and the fact that you're not yet divorced, as a polite courtesy. You may find other women in the same situation that way, with similar goals, instead of ending up with someone who can't wait to get out of there.
posted by blue suede stockings at 4:16 AM on March 30, 2015 [41 favorites]
Enjoy the candy store phase
Do not remarry for at least three years
All will be well and with luck better
posted by Postroad at 5:51 AM on March 30, 2015 [5 favorites]
Do not remarry for at least three years
All will be well and with luck better
posted by Postroad at 5:51 AM on March 30, 2015 [5 favorites]
The women who will date you while you are separated and not divorced are not the women you need to be with.
When you are with a woman, make her feel like she is the only woman in the world for you. You may mention your mother briefly and possibly a favorite aunt but avoid even acknowledging that any other women exist in your life. This will keep you from going on and on about your future ex-wife. I've ended many first dates just because the guy kept going on and on.
Dating is not therapy. It is not the time for you to work through your feelings about your divorce. It is supposed to be fun and spontaneous. It is supposed to be at least a little bit romantic.
Never bring a date around your children or mention the date to your future ex-wife.
Always bring your own condom, even if she says she is on the pill. And don't have sex with someone who you couldn't imagine raising a mistake with.
Many men now are very weak and wait for the woman to ask so, don't be surprised if a woman asks you out. It doesn't mean she is pushy. We've been conditioned now to do this. But, if you really want to impress, step up and ask a woman out. Show up 2 minutes early to wherever you are meeting with a full tank of gas and plenty of cash. Tell her she looks lovely. Ask her questions about herself. Tell funny stories. And, when you are ready to kiss her, don't do it in a parking garage or elevator, choose a good spot, a romantic spot. Go in slow so that she knows you are coming for her, no surprise attacks. And if there isn't a spark, thank her for a lovely evening. Don't say you are going to call if you aren't going to call.
Every guy says that they want to sleep with the woman they are on the date with. Every guy says how hard he is because of her. Don't be every guy. Stand out from the crowd. You will get better results. And call instead of texting. We are sick of all the texting.
posted by myselfasme at 6:34 AM on March 30, 2015 [9 favorites]
When you are with a woman, make her feel like she is the only woman in the world for you. You may mention your mother briefly and possibly a favorite aunt but avoid even acknowledging that any other women exist in your life. This will keep you from going on and on about your future ex-wife. I've ended many first dates just because the guy kept going on and on.
Dating is not therapy. It is not the time for you to work through your feelings about your divorce. It is supposed to be fun and spontaneous. It is supposed to be at least a little bit romantic.
Never bring a date around your children or mention the date to your future ex-wife.
Always bring your own condom, even if she says she is on the pill. And don't have sex with someone who you couldn't imagine raising a mistake with.
Many men now are very weak and wait for the woman to ask so, don't be surprised if a woman asks you out. It doesn't mean she is pushy. We've been conditioned now to do this. But, if you really want to impress, step up and ask a woman out. Show up 2 minutes early to wherever you are meeting with a full tank of gas and plenty of cash. Tell her she looks lovely. Ask her questions about herself. Tell funny stories. And, when you are ready to kiss her, don't do it in a parking garage or elevator, choose a good spot, a romantic spot. Go in slow so that she knows you are coming for her, no surprise attacks. And if there isn't a spark, thank her for a lovely evening. Don't say you are going to call if you aren't going to call.
Every guy says that they want to sleep with the woman they are on the date with. Every guy says how hard he is because of her. Don't be every guy. Stand out from the crowd. You will get better results. And call instead of texting. We are sick of all the texting.
posted by myselfasme at 6:34 AM on March 30, 2015 [9 favorites]
Best answer: Please do some reading on consent! I really like Scarleteen's educational materials; ok, I know it has "teen" in the name, but that's because it's the kind of sex ed basics that IDEALLY we'd all learn as teenagers. If you're all "of course, duh, knew all this," that's great, but everyone can use a refresher.
posted by Juliet Banana at 7:08 AM on March 30, 2015 [6 favorites]
posted by Juliet Banana at 7:08 AM on March 30, 2015 [6 favorites]
As a recently (within the past 2 years) divorced woman only slightly older than you, the biggest difference with dating now versus then is technology. Not just the dating websites and apps (although yes, thats definitely a thing), but text messages. You will probably never talk to a person on the phone; everything happens via text now. And for someone who last dated 10-15 years ago, it's MADDENING. The permanence of every conversation, the crazy response time lags, the ghosting for no reason, emojiis (?!?!!). It's all weird and different, and if you are at all inclined to rumination, learning how to negotiate text messages in the context of early dating definitely has a learning curve. Aziz Ansari has a stand up special on netflix right now that goes into all the pitfalls of modern dating and it's worth a watch; theres a clip here.
The other thing I've noticed, and this might just be my age. gender experience, or geographic location (West Coast Urban, Portland specifically), but almost everyone I've met is in an open relationship and/or is not looking for anything serious. Not that I'm necessarily looking for something Serious right out of the gate, but damn, sometimes you don't even get the chance to figure out if that potential is there. I think back when I was younger we were all serial monogamists, mainly because of how difficult it was to meet people, but now it seems like everyone wants to keep their options open, and are holding out for whatever's new or better. I think it has to do with the intersection of our age and the number of options that people have now - on OKC or Tinder you have hundreds of possibilities laid out before you like a buffet Every Day. I think that makes it hard(er?) for people to pull the trigger and just commit time and energy to one person.
posted by lilnublet at 7:10 AM on March 30, 2015 [5 favorites]
The other thing I've noticed, and this might just be my age. gender experience, or geographic location (West Coast Urban, Portland specifically), but almost everyone I've met is in an open relationship and/or is not looking for anything serious. Not that I'm necessarily looking for something Serious right out of the gate, but damn, sometimes you don't even get the chance to figure out if that potential is there. I think back when I was younger we were all serial monogamists, mainly because of how difficult it was to meet people, but now it seems like everyone wants to keep their options open, and are holding out for whatever's new or better. I think it has to do with the intersection of our age and the number of options that people have now - on OKC or Tinder you have hundreds of possibilities laid out before you like a buffet Every Day. I think that makes it hard(er?) for people to pull the trigger and just commit time and energy to one person.
posted by lilnublet at 7:10 AM on March 30, 2015 [5 favorites]
Didn't date much in high school, but have dated plenty in my 30s, and I would say the biggest difference between now and 10+ years ago is time. I have less of it to spare, and am more careful about how I spend it. My friends who are dating generally agree that we just don't have time or energy for people who aren't considerate, respectful, and add something of value to our lives. (Sex can be something of value, if everyone is clear that that's what's driving the relationship and is okay with that.) "Just seeing where this goes" can still happen, but the bar for entry has been raised.
So be clear about who you are and what you're interested in. Take some time to figure that out if you need to, before you start dating. Don't take it personally if you have a lot of first and second dates that don't go anywhere, that's generally how things work. Dating etiquette has gotten a little complicated, so I say don't worry about "rules," show other people the consideration for their time and feelings that you would like to be shown.
Basically, dating works best when it's fun, so if it's not fun, do something else. There are lots of ways to meet people.
posted by EvaDestruction at 7:13 AM on March 30, 2015 [1 favorite]
So be clear about who you are and what you're interested in. Take some time to figure that out if you need to, before you start dating. Don't take it personally if you have a lot of first and second dates that don't go anywhere, that's generally how things work. Dating etiquette has gotten a little complicated, so I say don't worry about "rules," show other people the consideration for their time and feelings that you would like to be shown.
Basically, dating works best when it's fun, so if it's not fun, do something else. There are lots of ways to meet people.
posted by EvaDestruction at 7:13 AM on March 30, 2015 [1 favorite]
I don't know, it seems like there's a lot of negative stuff around here about dating recently separated guys.
I think you should take some quiet time each day to ponder some really true things about yourself, write them down if need be to be clear. Probably, right now, there won't be many things you know for sure about you. So many things were recently bound up with another person and who the two of you were together, how that person defined you, how much energy in your life was feeding someone else. If you don't have many things, work on that in the coming months.
Go on dates but don't get attached to outcomes. Don't get all forecasting and projecting way into the future. You have time and you have space. There's no rush. Don't be an asshole by not following through on the things you say you'll do or be. Work on only saying true things. I can't tell you how nice it is to meet n hang out with guys who have a bit of a clue about who they are and can reflect a bit on life.
posted by honey-barbara at 7:17 AM on March 30, 2015
I think you should take some quiet time each day to ponder some really true things about yourself, write them down if need be to be clear. Probably, right now, there won't be many things you know for sure about you. So many things were recently bound up with another person and who the two of you were together, how that person defined you, how much energy in your life was feeding someone else. If you don't have many things, work on that in the coming months.
Go on dates but don't get attached to outcomes. Don't get all forecasting and projecting way into the future. You have time and you have space. There's no rush. Don't be an asshole by not following through on the things you say you'll do or be. Work on only saying true things. I can't tell you how nice it is to meet n hang out with guys who have a bit of a clue about who they are and can reflect a bit on life.
posted by honey-barbara at 7:17 AM on March 30, 2015
Much of the advice you get here will be YMMV, of course. But here are my few cents as an Out There single woman (primarily meeting people in their 30s/40s through OKCupid, fwiw):
Get tested for STIs now, and often, and proactively bring up the conversation about what you two should know about each other in that arena (including even totally-common cold sores (frequency of outbreaks, etc.)), and what you'd do if there's an unplanned pregnancy. Your partner should be eager to share all of this information as well. If they don't want to talk about it, haven't been tested recently/at all, etc.... well, condoms are still necessary, but I'd be wary about the general level of maturity/trustworthiness of this person, how they'd deal with any Adult Stuff that may happen between you, and how it'd affect the next stages of your dating life if you contract something that is not always blocked by condoms. Keep a close eye on your own body for early signs that something might be developing. Be clear to partners that you're having sex with other people, if/when you are. For women who take their health seriously (and this absolutely includes the casual/kinky/"wild" ones!), you being the one to initiate and to be 100% forthcoming in these conversations, and to wear a condom every time (matter-of-factly), will be a HUGE huuuuuuuge positive -- and turn-on.
Do as much as possible to make what you say match what you do AND what you actually want/mean. These three things align much less often than you'd think between new potential dating partners, and it will set you far ahead no matter what kind of relationship(s) you plan to pursue.
Respect a woman's desire for extra privacy if she wants it when you're first getting to know one another (e.g., not revealing her address, her employer's name, her "real" email). Don't take it personally -- many women have just learned the hard way that a conservative approach to this is the best default strategy.
If you're meeting people online, resist the (powerful) urge to have looooong email/chat/text discussions before meeting in person. It will be very tempting to do this. Fight it. Once there's a basic mutual curiosity/connection, meet for coffee or one drink as soon as possible. Be prepared that many (most?) people you meet in person will not match what you expected of them (personality, energy, looks, priorities, mannerisms, history) -- this is no reason to be angry/bitter/rude. Enjoy finding out what makes different kinds of people tick, what they're learning from dating, what new ideas/books/jokes/hobbies/bands/etc. they might add to your life -- even during a coffee date that is "going nowhere." Offer the same.
Memorize some good conversation starters for the (inevitable) awkward silences. Ex: What was your very best travel experience? What drives you crazy about "kids today?" What's your closest brush with fame? What's the most thoughtful gift you've ever given/received? What fictional character do you wish you were most like? If you had to get a tattoo right this second, what would it be? Do you have any "stupid human tricks?"
Get friends' feedback on your online dating profile (and strangers', feel free to memail me!) as well as your hygiene/grooming/wardrobe (can't hurt, might help). Online, set your preferred age range to be exactly the same number of years above you as it is below you. Seriously!! It doesn't oblige you a BIT to communicate with anyone who's outside your primary preferences, but the cliched younger-only thing is cause for side-eye even to the women who are "in range."
Always carry a few business or personal cards with you so you can give your personal contact info to new people you happen to meet at parties, the grocery store, whatever.
Follow the campground rule.
Have FUN.
posted by argonauta at 8:32 AM on March 30, 2015 [10 favorites]
Get tested for STIs now, and often, and proactively bring up the conversation about what you two should know about each other in that arena (including even totally-common cold sores (frequency of outbreaks, etc.)), and what you'd do if there's an unplanned pregnancy. Your partner should be eager to share all of this information as well. If they don't want to talk about it, haven't been tested recently/at all, etc.... well, condoms are still necessary, but I'd be wary about the general level of maturity/trustworthiness of this person, how they'd deal with any Adult Stuff that may happen between you, and how it'd affect the next stages of your dating life if you contract something that is not always blocked by condoms. Keep a close eye on your own body for early signs that something might be developing. Be clear to partners that you're having sex with other people, if/when you are. For women who take their health seriously (and this absolutely includes the casual/kinky/"wild" ones!), you being the one to initiate and to be 100% forthcoming in these conversations, and to wear a condom every time (matter-of-factly), will be a HUGE huuuuuuuge positive -- and turn-on.
Do as much as possible to make what you say match what you do AND what you actually want/mean. These three things align much less often than you'd think between new potential dating partners, and it will set you far ahead no matter what kind of relationship(s) you plan to pursue.
Respect a woman's desire for extra privacy if she wants it when you're first getting to know one another (e.g., not revealing her address, her employer's name, her "real" email). Don't take it personally -- many women have just learned the hard way that a conservative approach to this is the best default strategy.
If you're meeting people online, resist the (powerful) urge to have looooong email/chat/text discussions before meeting in person. It will be very tempting to do this. Fight it. Once there's a basic mutual curiosity/connection, meet for coffee or one drink as soon as possible. Be prepared that many (most?) people you meet in person will not match what you expected of them (personality, energy, looks, priorities, mannerisms, history) -- this is no reason to be angry/bitter/rude. Enjoy finding out what makes different kinds of people tick, what they're learning from dating, what new ideas/books/jokes/hobbies/bands/etc. they might add to your life -- even during a coffee date that is "going nowhere." Offer the same.
Memorize some good conversation starters for the (inevitable) awkward silences. Ex: What was your very best travel experience? What drives you crazy about "kids today?" What's your closest brush with fame? What's the most thoughtful gift you've ever given/received? What fictional character do you wish you were most like? If you had to get a tattoo right this second, what would it be? Do you have any "stupid human tricks?"
Get friends' feedback on your online dating profile (and strangers', feel free to memail me!) as well as your hygiene/grooming/wardrobe (can't hurt, might help). Online, set your preferred age range to be exactly the same number of years above you as it is below you. Seriously!! It doesn't oblige you a BIT to communicate with anyone who's outside your primary preferences, but the cliched younger-only thing is cause for side-eye even to the women who are "in range."
Always carry a few business or personal cards with you so you can give your personal contact info to new people you happen to meet at parties, the grocery store, whatever.
Follow the campground rule.
Have FUN.
posted by argonauta at 8:32 AM on March 30, 2015 [10 favorites]
It's a mutual decision and we're both feeling good about it.
That's it? Like always you feel good about it? I'm 32 and I've been separated for about six months, also from my high school sweetheart and sometimes I feel good about it. And sometimes I feel terrible about it, and sometimes I feel nothing about it, and sometimes elation and despair and pity. A couple of times I've even managed to find it funny.
So I need some additional convincing that you're feeling all the feelings here and that "we're both feeling good about it" isn't just what you say in polite company. Otherwise I think the other feelings are going to leak out at inopportune times, in ways that women in this thread have told you is unpleasant.
That's not to say that you shouldn't date if you want to, but I recommend a cautious approach, and mostly working on learning to be a single person: creating a satisfying life for yourself that doesn't necessarily need another person in it in order to be fulfilling.
posted by Kwine at 8:53 AM on March 30, 2015 [1 favorite]
That's it? Like always you feel good about it? I'm 32 and I've been separated for about six months, also from my high school sweetheart and sometimes I feel good about it. And sometimes I feel terrible about it, and sometimes I feel nothing about it, and sometimes elation and despair and pity. A couple of times I've even managed to find it funny.
So I need some additional convincing that you're feeling all the feelings here and that "we're both feeling good about it" isn't just what you say in polite company. Otherwise I think the other feelings are going to leak out at inopportune times, in ways that women in this thread have told you is unpleasant.
That's not to say that you shouldn't date if you want to, but I recommend a cautious approach, and mostly working on learning to be a single person: creating a satisfying life for yourself that doesn't necessarily need another person in it in order to be fulfilling.
posted by Kwine at 8:53 AM on March 30, 2015 [1 favorite]
After 13 years of a relationship, my wife and I have separated. It's a mutual decision and we're both feeling good about it. BUT... I've not been in in the dating game since I was 15 and I'm 31 now.
I got married at age 19 to another 19 year old. We had met at age 16 and graduated high school together. We agreed to divorce in our late 30's. It was a protracted event. The divorce was amicable. Like you, most of the time, I felt very okay about the divorce.
Lots of men hit on me, of all ages and personal backgrounds. However, the ones I hit it off with tended to be men who had similarly long marriages behind them and kids similar in age to mine. Because I married so young, these men tended to be a whole lot older than me. One had gotten married when he was like age 28. His youngest child was about the same age as my oldest child. He was 16 years older than me.
Other people just seemed to have wildly different expectations from me about what a relationship was all about.
So you might pay attention to life details and figure out what kind of women have something in common with you and what common ground you need. You might consider looking for women with a similarly long marriage behind them and you might find that many of those women will be a little older than you because most people don't stay with their high school sweetheart. If that isn't a deal breaker for you (lots of men strongly prefer women who are their age or younger), that might give you a head start on working out something that works for you.
Also, the two men I spent the most time with were also in a similar grey zone to me. One had been legally separated for years but the wife still lived with him (in part because some of the kids were still young). The other wanted to get divorced and was sleeping at his office more than at home when we met. At the time, I had a verbal agreement with my husband to divorce but had not yet filed any paperwork. I filed the paperwork a few months later. The last time I talked to him, my former romantic interest still had not filed and still wanted a divorce. Obviously, we eventually parted ways.
So, yeah, other people going through a divorce who were married a long time don't need long explanations about the fact that it takes time and things are in a grey zone. Some men really gave me a lot of shit over the fact that my divorce was taking time. One man who had the hots for me and had been burned by another lady (who claimed she would leave her BF for him but then didn't) basically called me a liar and told me I wasn't actually getting divorced because it wasn't happening as rapidly as he wanted it to happen. Which, hey, I didn't even want the man. So whatever.
My point is just that a lot of people simply didn't understand that if your lives have been tangled up together a long time, then entangling it as nicely as possible takes a bit of time. Those folks often were just not good candidates for a relationship. My divorce was going to take the time it took, too bad, so sad. I wasn't getting divorced for the convenience of men out there hoping to hop my bones. If the time schedule didn't please them, the answer was they were welcome to find the door and stop bothering me.
YMMV.
posted by Michele in California at 10:02 AM on March 30, 2015 [1 favorite]
I got married at age 19 to another 19 year old. We had met at age 16 and graduated high school together. We agreed to divorce in our late 30's. It was a protracted event. The divorce was amicable. Like you, most of the time, I felt very okay about the divorce.
Lots of men hit on me, of all ages and personal backgrounds. However, the ones I hit it off with tended to be men who had similarly long marriages behind them and kids similar in age to mine. Because I married so young, these men tended to be a whole lot older than me. One had gotten married when he was like age 28. His youngest child was about the same age as my oldest child. He was 16 years older than me.
Other people just seemed to have wildly different expectations from me about what a relationship was all about.
So you might pay attention to life details and figure out what kind of women have something in common with you and what common ground you need. You might consider looking for women with a similarly long marriage behind them and you might find that many of those women will be a little older than you because most people don't stay with their high school sweetheart. If that isn't a deal breaker for you (lots of men strongly prefer women who are their age or younger), that might give you a head start on working out something that works for you.
Also, the two men I spent the most time with were also in a similar grey zone to me. One had been legally separated for years but the wife still lived with him (in part because some of the kids were still young). The other wanted to get divorced and was sleeping at his office more than at home when we met. At the time, I had a verbal agreement with my husband to divorce but had not yet filed any paperwork. I filed the paperwork a few months later. The last time I talked to him, my former romantic interest still had not filed and still wanted a divorce. Obviously, we eventually parted ways.
So, yeah, other people going through a divorce who were married a long time don't need long explanations about the fact that it takes time and things are in a grey zone. Some men really gave me a lot of shit over the fact that my divorce was taking time. One man who had the hots for me and had been burned by another lady (who claimed she would leave her BF for him but then didn't) basically called me a liar and told me I wasn't actually getting divorced because it wasn't happening as rapidly as he wanted it to happen. Which, hey, I didn't even want the man. So whatever.
My point is just that a lot of people simply didn't understand that if your lives have been tangled up together a long time, then entangling it as nicely as possible takes a bit of time. Those folks often were just not good candidates for a relationship. My divorce was going to take the time it took, too bad, so sad. I wasn't getting divorced for the convenience of men out there hoping to hop my bones. If the time schedule didn't please them, the answer was they were welcome to find the door and stop bothering me.
YMMV.
posted by Michele in California at 10:02 AM on March 30, 2015 [1 favorite]
Let's say you go to the big box store to buy a blender. You find a single one that seems exactly like what you're looking for, but it has clearly been purchased, clumsily sealed back up and returned. In theory, there is nothing wrong with this blender. But you cannot help but think that someone looking for pretty much what you are looking for has already taken this particular appliance home and found it completely unacceptable. Maybe it doesn't work. Maybe it does, but it sucks. Maybe it's missing parts. Maybe nothing is wrong with it. But without any way for you to know, as a savvy shopper, most likely, you are going to buy a different blender.
This is you right now. It's not entirely fair, but it's how it is.
In the same position, I used to refer to myself as "an ineligible bachelor." No longer truly married, not yet divorced, not even close to ready for a real relationship. Your damage is right out there. It's your defining characteristic right now. Disappointing/annoying/frustrating a string of women whose decision making is warped or damaged enough to think "Hey, let's date the recently separated guy!" is not going to help you or anyone else.
Your feelings at this point are probably complicated. Horny? Lonely? Lovelorn? Sad? Confused? The mix will vary. What a phenomenally high percentage of recently separated guys share in common is their desperate, clumsy need to find someone who can take all the feelings. It doesn't really work.
You know what does work? That weight you wanted to lose? Now is an awesome time to do that. The hobby you wanted to pursue? Now is your chance.
Instead of lobbing the tattered remains of who you were at strangers, figure out who you are going to be next. Once you become that person, dating will be much easier.
Oh, and be well. Your entire idea of what the rest of your life was going to look like has basically died. You will mourn it like a death and it will be hard. But things will look much better on the other side.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:26 AM on March 30, 2015 [2 favorites]
This is you right now. It's not entirely fair, but it's how it is.
In the same position, I used to refer to myself as "an ineligible bachelor." No longer truly married, not yet divorced, not even close to ready for a real relationship. Your damage is right out there. It's your defining characteristic right now. Disappointing/annoying/frustrating a string of women whose decision making is warped or damaged enough to think "Hey, let's date the recently separated guy!" is not going to help you or anyone else.
Your feelings at this point are probably complicated. Horny? Lonely? Lovelorn? Sad? Confused? The mix will vary. What a phenomenally high percentage of recently separated guys share in common is their desperate, clumsy need to find someone who can take all the feelings. It doesn't really work.
You know what does work? That weight you wanted to lose? Now is an awesome time to do that. The hobby you wanted to pursue? Now is your chance.
Instead of lobbing the tattered remains of who you were at strangers, figure out who you are going to be next. Once you become that person, dating will be much easier.
Oh, and be well. Your entire idea of what the rest of your life was going to look like has basically died. You will mourn it like a death and it will be hard. But things will look much better on the other side.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:26 AM on March 30, 2015 [2 favorites]
Best answer: If you haven't been single since high school, I would very highly recommend taking some time to live on your own and get to know yourself. Don't look for a relationship right away.
posted by tckma at 11:03 AM on March 30, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by tckma at 11:03 AM on March 30, 2015 [5 favorites]
Do not remarry for at least three years
Amen! So, allow me to share the tale of the least-happy divorced-and-remarried person I know: a 38-year-old guy whose ex-wife of 3 years suddenly walked out on him at age 30. A month later, via a set-up by mutual friends, he met his current wife who, by the way, looks and acts like the exact opposite of his ex-wife in pretty much every meaningful way. A month after that, she moved in with him. He told his friends that all he ever really wanted to get in the divorce were his 2 cats and his huge TV. (You see where I'm going with this.) Two months after that, he proposed. A month later, both of his beloved cats and his TV were suddenly gone because they were incompatible with his fiancee's wishes. Then they got married -- it was only two and a half years after his ex-wife left. It's been all downhill from there. THIS is exactly what folks are getting at when they give you the good advice to spend time alone and to really, really get to know yourself.
posted by hush at 7:12 PM on March 30, 2015
Amen! So, allow me to share the tale of the least-happy divorced-and-remarried person I know: a 38-year-old guy whose ex-wife of 3 years suddenly walked out on him at age 30. A month later, via a set-up by mutual friends, he met his current wife who, by the way, looks and acts like the exact opposite of his ex-wife in pretty much every meaningful way. A month after that, she moved in with him. He told his friends that all he ever really wanted to get in the divorce were his 2 cats and his huge TV. (You see where I'm going with this.) Two months after that, he proposed. A month later, both of his beloved cats and his TV were suddenly gone because they were incompatible with his fiancee's wishes. Then they got married -- it was only two and a half years after his ex-wife left. It's been all downhill from there. THIS is exactly what folks are getting at when they give you the good advice to spend time alone and to really, really get to know yourself.
posted by hush at 7:12 PM on March 30, 2015
The single guys I know in their early 30s love dating, or hate it. Doesn't seem to be much middle ground.
What do the "love dating" guys appear to do, from my early 40s, long-married perspective on it?
Dating is doing what they already enjoy, but with a woman they just met to share in it. They aren't (metaphorically) still asking their moms what a boutonniere is and praying they don't draw blood pinning it on the girl.
They have a well-considered view of how attractive they are, and to whom; and they have a clear and specific view of what's attractive to them, and both views combine to guide them.
Despite the two previous things, they take rejection without rancor or upset, and dole it out kindly but without guilt or hesitation.
posted by MattD at 10:22 PM on March 30, 2015
What do the "love dating" guys appear to do, from my early 40s, long-married perspective on it?
Dating is doing what they already enjoy, but with a woman they just met to share in it. They aren't (metaphorically) still asking their moms what a boutonniere is and praying they don't draw blood pinning it on the girl.
They have a well-considered view of how attractive they are, and to whom; and they have a clear and specific view of what's attractive to them, and both views combine to guide them.
Despite the two previous things, they take rejection without rancor or upset, and dole it out kindly but without guilt or hesitation.
posted by MattD at 10:22 PM on March 30, 2015
So what should I know?
That you're free to do anything right now, so don't go jumping right back into another relationship.
Do lots of non-relationship stuff. Learn a language. Take a trip. Get a degree. Take up a sport. Buy a motorcycle. Move to a new city. Build that thing. Join the local running/hiking/biking/sailing/boxing/archery/something club. Hit the gym. Read books. Write books.
Go out and interact as much as possible with women (and men) as people with whom you share common interests. Don't think of women as potential mates. No body contact you wouldn't also have with a man.
Take a long time off dating. You don't know anything about being you (singular).
posted by pracowity at 3:25 AM on March 31, 2015
That you're free to do anything right now, so don't go jumping right back into another relationship.
Do lots of non-relationship stuff. Learn a language. Take a trip. Get a degree. Take up a sport. Buy a motorcycle. Move to a new city. Build that thing. Join the local running/hiking/biking/sailing/boxing/archery/something club. Hit the gym. Read books. Write books.
Go out and interact as much as possible with women (and men) as people with whom you share common interests. Don't think of women as potential mates. No body contact you wouldn't also have with a man.
Take a long time off dating. You don't know anything about being you (singular).
posted by pracowity at 3:25 AM on March 31, 2015
Response by poster: So I need some additional convincing that you're feeling all the feelings here and that "we're both feeling good about it" isn't just what you say in polite company. Otherwise I think the other feelings are going to leak out at inopportune times, in ways that women in this thread have told you is unpleasant.
Well, whilst I understand your concern I'm not prepared to get into that here (which is why I didn't), but having spent most of the last year in marriage counselling, on date nights and having fixed everything we wanted to fix in our relationship (and then some), my wife and I have realised we simply don't feel that way for one another anymore. We want completely different lives and we both have had to compromise so far we find it a relief when the other person isn't around.
Compromise is necessary. Being unhappy is not.
I'm not being avoidant, I'm just not asking for comment on that part of my situation. Whether you believe it or not, we fought for a long time to make it work and have both found it a tremendous relief to mutually agree it isn't, and it won't. And that we can be friends for our kids far easier than "lovers" for them.
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Thanks everyone for all the advice :D this is precisely the kind of stuff I needed to hear. I don't want to be "that guy" either and hearing your less-than-positive experiences allows me to see this from all angles.
posted by tzb at 7:59 AM on March 31, 2015 [3 favorites]
Well, whilst I understand your concern I'm not prepared to get into that here (which is why I didn't), but having spent most of the last year in marriage counselling, on date nights and having fixed everything we wanted to fix in our relationship (and then some), my wife and I have realised we simply don't feel that way for one another anymore. We want completely different lives and we both have had to compromise so far we find it a relief when the other person isn't around.
Compromise is necessary. Being unhappy is not.
I'm not being avoidant, I'm just not asking for comment on that part of my situation. Whether you believe it or not, we fought for a long time to make it work and have both found it a tremendous relief to mutually agree it isn't, and it won't. And that we can be friends for our kids far easier than "lovers" for them.
-
Thanks everyone for all the advice :D this is precisely the kind of stuff I needed to hear. I don't want to be "that guy" either and hearing your less-than-positive experiences allows me to see this from all angles.
posted by tzb at 7:59 AM on March 31, 2015 [3 favorites]
Best answer: The fact that you're self-aware enough to ask, and listen, about this stuff bodes well for your dating future, tzb!
posted by blue suede stockings at 10:31 AM on March 31, 2015
posted by blue suede stockings at 10:31 AM on March 31, 2015
Best answer: I cannot nth blue suede stocking's comment hard enough. Seriously. Print it out and post it on your bathroom mirror.
Please, by all the gods:
-Do understand that while YOU think you're ready for a relationship, or that you'll just have some fun and see what's out there… you're not ready. You are so not ready. If you're a man with good qualities, women will fall for you and fairly quickly want a commitment to something more than the occasional casual date or sex.
-Don't wait to discover just how not ready you are, until a woman you're seeing falls for you. That's an awkward conversation. If you develop feelings for her, too, then it becomes a painful conversation. Ask me how I know!
-Don't use dates as free therapy sessions. Recently-separated That Guy™ does this chronically. Don't be him. Go find an actual therapist for this. (Yes, even though you already went through counseling with your wife. You need your own.)
-Don't use people as emotional airbags to cushion the loneliness of being alone. You probably don't intend to, and it's probably not malicious, but oh god, That Guy™ sure does it without meaning to.
-Do be very upfront about the state of your separation and eventual divorce. Put it in your profile. Put it in neon in your profile. Don't wait to spring this on a woman after a few dates. If you wait to spring it on a woman until after you've had sex (and it's not just a hookup), the ice weasels will come for you in the night.
-Don't stall or drag your feet with the divorce proceedings. It will be expensive, headache-inducing, and cause any woman you're seeing to nag you to get it done with a zeal you have never before known. If you can, stick to dating other divorced people who have been there and get that it takes longer than renewing a drivers license.
-Don't be annoyed when many women take a pass on dating you. It has absolutely no reflection on you as a person, and everything to do with the emotionally unavailable stage you're in right now. You wouldn't eagerly fling yourself into a pit trap full of poisoned bamboo spikes, would you? Neither would they.
-Do learn to spend time by yourself, live on your own, and figure out who you are if you're not married. This can take a while. Everyone's ready at different rates, but please, PLEASE consider spending time on your own before you start dating. Enjoy doing all the things your wife hated! Revel in eating whatever the hell you want to eat! Just go be you for a while. Rediscover your best self.
Best of luck!
posted by culfinglin at 4:15 PM on April 1, 2015
Please, by all the gods:
-Do understand that while YOU think you're ready for a relationship, or that you'll just have some fun and see what's out there… you're not ready. You are so not ready. If you're a man with good qualities, women will fall for you and fairly quickly want a commitment to something more than the occasional casual date or sex.
-Don't wait to discover just how not ready you are, until a woman you're seeing falls for you. That's an awkward conversation. If you develop feelings for her, too, then it becomes a painful conversation. Ask me how I know!
-Don't use dates as free therapy sessions. Recently-separated That Guy™ does this chronically. Don't be him. Go find an actual therapist for this. (Yes, even though you already went through counseling with your wife. You need your own.)
-Don't use people as emotional airbags to cushion the loneliness of being alone. You probably don't intend to, and it's probably not malicious, but oh god, That Guy™ sure does it without meaning to.
-Do be very upfront about the state of your separation and eventual divorce. Put it in your profile. Put it in neon in your profile. Don't wait to spring this on a woman after a few dates. If you wait to spring it on a woman until after you've had sex (and it's not just a hookup), the ice weasels will come for you in the night.
-Don't stall or drag your feet with the divorce proceedings. It will be expensive, headache-inducing, and cause any woman you're seeing to nag you to get it done with a zeal you have never before known. If you can, stick to dating other divorced people who have been there and get that it takes longer than renewing a drivers license.
-Don't be annoyed when many women take a pass on dating you. It has absolutely no reflection on you as a person, and everything to do with the emotionally unavailable stage you're in right now. You wouldn't eagerly fling yourself into a pit trap full of poisoned bamboo spikes, would you? Neither would they.
-Do learn to spend time by yourself, live on your own, and figure out who you are if you're not married. This can take a while. Everyone's ready at different rates, but please, PLEASE consider spending time on your own before you start dating. Enjoy doing all the things your wife hated! Revel in eating whatever the hell you want to eat! Just go be you for a while. Rediscover your best self.
Best of luck!
posted by culfinglin at 4:15 PM on April 1, 2015
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But this being AskMe and sometimes not always getting the answer you think you're looking for, I will add that instead of dating, this is an excellent time to start cultivating your own life and interests. Take classes, start a new workout routine, join a hiking group or craft beer making club; whatever new things you've wanted to try, start doing them now. Get a dog.
I suggest this for two reasons. First, you'll be a healthier and more-rounded person if you have your own world and the need to have a companion to fill up the emptier parts of your life won't be so strong. Think of those "Choose Your Own Adventure" books; here's your opportunity to create the life you want and make it as complete as you can. You need this alone time.
Secondly, recently separated people are not the greatest catches because they're living in Rebound City. They fall too hard and too fast into new relationships. They have a tendency to be kids in the candy store. Although they don't mean to, they often hurt people because they're always looking for the new shiny and they usually have some unresolved issues with their exes, no matter how much they proclaim they're over the relationship.
Take at least 6 months before you start dating again, get to a solid place where you've created a fuller life, and then go for it.
posted by kinetic at 2:56 AM on March 30, 2015 [25 favorites]