When is it too late to go to medical school?
December 4, 2014 3:41 PM Subscribe
When I was a kid, I secretly wanted to be a doctor, and was too shy to admit it or to aim for it. Now I'm 34 -- is it too late?
Help! I'm thirty-four years old, married and with a small child. I'm at a career crisis. I went to business school, and am currently working in a job I'm not crazy about -- it's very theoretical and it's hard to know whether anything I do has a direct impact. I'm looking at other jobs in the field. Still, I always secretly wanted to be a doctor, and am only now admitting this to myself and thinking it might actually be an option.
My info: I have an undergrad and graduate degrees from Ivy League universities with very high grades. BUT my fields were in the humanities, so, yup, no science in a long time. I would have a lot of catching up to do. Otherwise, I think I have a pretty impressive resume, full of academic accolades, community service, etc. BUT, again, no science, so maybe that doesn't matter.
I'm not sure if my reasons are good enough, either. I've always wanted to do it, and admired my friends who are helping people every day with direct contact. I had a powerful birthing experience that made me kind of in love with the idea of working with patients. I've always loved science, but abandoned it because I thought I wasn't any good at it. (I did well, but had to work so much harder at it than the humanities.) I know some of the nitty gritty (my mom is a doctor), so I hope I'm not romanticizing it. I would want to be a family doctor. But maybe I am romanticizing it? And how do I know if I am?
Other details: pretty financially comfortable right now, with no debt -- though I definitely would have to take some on. I also want another kid at some point, so that may kill this idea as well.
And, really, thirty-four is too old to even be thinking about doing this -- right? Right? I would have to do a post-bac year first -- at least one year, maybe two? Also, I live in the US and have most of my life, but we have been thinking of moving to the UK (I am a citizen there by birth, as is my partner.) If I did do this, where would be the best place to do it -- US or UK? What am I not thinking of?
I'd love to hear any stories about having done this, or not done this or crazy checks or advice or anything. I'm only at the very early stages of even admitting to myself that this might be something I want to do, so kindness is much appreciated :).
Help! I'm thirty-four years old, married and with a small child. I'm at a career crisis. I went to business school, and am currently working in a job I'm not crazy about -- it's very theoretical and it's hard to know whether anything I do has a direct impact. I'm looking at other jobs in the field. Still, I always secretly wanted to be a doctor, and am only now admitting this to myself and thinking it might actually be an option.
My info: I have an undergrad and graduate degrees from Ivy League universities with very high grades. BUT my fields were in the humanities, so, yup, no science in a long time. I would have a lot of catching up to do. Otherwise, I think I have a pretty impressive resume, full of academic accolades, community service, etc. BUT, again, no science, so maybe that doesn't matter.
I'm not sure if my reasons are good enough, either. I've always wanted to do it, and admired my friends who are helping people every day with direct contact. I had a powerful birthing experience that made me kind of in love with the idea of working with patients. I've always loved science, but abandoned it because I thought I wasn't any good at it. (I did well, but had to work so much harder at it than the humanities.) I know some of the nitty gritty (my mom is a doctor), so I hope I'm not romanticizing it. I would want to be a family doctor. But maybe I am romanticizing it? And how do I know if I am?
Other details: pretty financially comfortable right now, with no debt -- though I definitely would have to take some on. I also want another kid at some point, so that may kill this idea as well.
And, really, thirty-four is too old to even be thinking about doing this -- right? Right? I would have to do a post-bac year first -- at least one year, maybe two? Also, I live in the US and have most of my life, but we have been thinking of moving to the UK (I am a citizen there by birth, as is my partner.) If I did do this, where would be the best place to do it -- US or UK? What am I not thinking of?
I'd love to hear any stories about having done this, or not done this or crazy checks or advice or anything. I'm only at the very early stages of even admitting to myself that this might be something I want to do, so kindness is much appreciated :).
It's never too late. I'm a nurse who recently met a resident at the hospital where I work who started med school at 56! He is a citizen of the UK as well, and went to med school in St. Kitts. He's doing fabulously, although admits to being tired all the time. You've got 22 years on him, so go for it!
posted by fresh-rn at 4:14 PM on December 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by fresh-rn at 4:14 PM on December 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
I have a friend who did an art degree and at 38 (when his girlfriend was pregnant) decided to leave a reasonable living in art/music and train to be a doctor. He's half way through his training currently and is pleased with his life decision.
This is in the UK so while the fees and cost of living while training is still a struggle, possibly less so than in the US. Do not have much/any information on these aspects.
Your post also made me think -what about looking into being a midwife? Less years training than being an actual doctor but such a valuable and worthwhile skill.
posted by stevedawg at 4:28 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
This is in the UK so while the fees and cost of living while training is still a struggle, possibly less so than in the US. Do not have much/any information on these aspects.
Your post also made me think -what about looking into being a midwife? Less years training than being an actual doctor but such a valuable and worthwhile skill.
posted by stevedawg at 4:28 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
I'm in a post-bac program in the US right now, and we have students who are older than you. Not a lot, but they exist. Most post-bac programs for career changers are aimed at people whose academic background is in the humanities, so that would be typical.
But maybe I am romanticizing it? And how do I know if I am?
Shadow and volunteer. As much as you can. You can absolutely love medicine and hate the day-to-day activities of being a doctor. Although a personal medical experience like you've had can definitely be eye-opening, it does not give you nearly enough information to evaluate whether you'd like to be a doctor for the rest of your career.
Feel free to MeMail me.
posted by telegraph at 4:33 PM on December 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
But maybe I am romanticizing it? And how do I know if I am?
Shadow and volunteer. As much as you can. You can absolutely love medicine and hate the day-to-day activities of being a doctor. Although a personal medical experience like you've had can definitely be eye-opening, it does not give you nearly enough information to evaluate whether you'd like to be a doctor for the rest of your career.
Feel free to MeMail me.
posted by telegraph at 4:33 PM on December 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
No, I don't think it's too late. But a few things to consider:
Two years of post-bacc is probably necessary with no science background (two semesters physics, two semesters chem, two semesters bio, organic chem, two semesters calculus). Now, then you usually have a gap year, which is the year between your post-bacc (or, more typically, undergrad), and your year starting med school. This is when you apply and interview. There are however post-bacc programs that are linked to certain matching med schools, so, if you meet grade requirements and such, there are ways to avoid doing the gap year.
So you are looking at a minimum of 6 years. Which like, eh, that puts you working at 40, or maybe a couple years after, depending on residency stuff (assuming you are cool with being like a family doc and not a neurosurgeon or something with 10+ years of residency). I dunno; that still gives you like 30 years of working, assuming that none of us are going to actually retire at 65.
It will be hard with the kiddo, and your wife will have to be pretty understanding. But it is doable for sure. Might be harder for you than the 24 year olds in some ways, but also easier in others.
I'm in an AuD program right now (doctor of audiology), which is also four years long. One of the women in my cohort is 47 with two kids in their pre-teens and she is doing great.
posted by Lutoslawski at 4:34 PM on December 4, 2014
Two years of post-bacc is probably necessary with no science background (two semesters physics, two semesters chem, two semesters bio, organic chem, two semesters calculus). Now, then you usually have a gap year, which is the year between your post-bacc (or, more typically, undergrad), and your year starting med school. This is when you apply and interview. There are however post-bacc programs that are linked to certain matching med schools, so, if you meet grade requirements and such, there are ways to avoid doing the gap year.
So you are looking at a minimum of 6 years. Which like, eh, that puts you working at 40, or maybe a couple years after, depending on residency stuff (assuming you are cool with being like a family doc and not a neurosurgeon or something with 10+ years of residency). I dunno; that still gives you like 30 years of working, assuming that none of us are going to actually retire at 65.
It will be hard with the kiddo, and your wife will have to be pretty understanding. But it is doable for sure. Might be harder for you than the 24 year olds in some ways, but also easier in others.
I'm in an AuD program right now (doctor of audiology), which is also four years long. One of the women in my cohort is 47 with two kids in their pre-teens and she is doing great.
posted by Lutoslawski at 4:34 PM on December 4, 2014
Also, fwiw, and this is just a personal anecdote, but the best doctors I've had in my life have been the ones that were non-traditional and came to medicine later than most. I think there's something about having gone out and tried some stuff and deciding to return to help people and do the healing thing that tends to produce some pretty great doctors.
posted by Lutoslawski at 4:38 PM on December 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by Lutoslawski at 4:38 PM on December 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
Yes, you can do this if you want to. There were two people in my medical school class who were over 40 when we started, and they were fine. The one I'm still in touch with loves her work. The science classes are not a big deal for someone who is both smart and motivated (I also wasn't as good at science as I was a writer and had a lot of hangups around it, all of which vanished once I had a concrete reason to be in those classes other than being well-rounded). I know many people who had children during medical school, which is a much better time than residency to do it.
You may be romanticizing a little bit. I am a primary care doctor, and I love what I do, but most of my work doesn't have obvious short-term benefits. Most of my work is around chronic disease management and disease prevention, so I spend a lot of time tweaking people's blood pressure and diabetes medication, encouraging people to stop smoking and lose some weight, sympathizing about the arthritis in their backs and gently suggesting that they give physical therapy another try, etc. Once in a while there's an exciting diagnosis or a big save or someone really takes my advice to heart and comes in to their next visit 20 lbs lighter, but it's definitely the exception rather than the rule. I have good and affectionate long-term relationships with my patients that I treasure, but if you're going in to medicine thinking that every day is going to be a powerful and moving experience, it is not. Those moments will happen, and likely more frequently than if you were an accounts receivable clerk, but being a doctor is a job. An unusually interesting and complicated one, probably, but a job nonetheless.
One thing that you should do is figure out what you need to make your application say "I have always dreamed of being a doctor and this is why I am only now getting to it" versus "I am having a midlife crisis and I have latched onto medicine as a way to fill the void". So do try to spend some time around actual health care as a volunteer or something and make sure you're really interested in health care and also able to explain how an interest in medicine fits into your life.
UK vs US--I don't know that much about the UK training system, but I would strongly suggest that if possible you do your medical training in the place where you would like to live permanently. It is hard for physicians who do medical school outside the US to get residency positions in the US and likely will get more difficult in the future as US medical schools expand enrollment, and I think the reverse is true also. The forums at studentdoctor.net have some dedicated areas for international grads, and you should look very carefully at the relative pros and cons for US vs UK. UK is likely to be substantially less expensive, I think, although being over 30 actually may be advantageous to you in the US from a financial-aid perspective.
Good luck!
posted by The Elusive Architeuthis at 4:40 PM on December 4, 2014 [10 favorites]
You may be romanticizing a little bit. I am a primary care doctor, and I love what I do, but most of my work doesn't have obvious short-term benefits. Most of my work is around chronic disease management and disease prevention, so I spend a lot of time tweaking people's blood pressure and diabetes medication, encouraging people to stop smoking and lose some weight, sympathizing about the arthritis in their backs and gently suggesting that they give physical therapy another try, etc. Once in a while there's an exciting diagnosis or a big save or someone really takes my advice to heart and comes in to their next visit 20 lbs lighter, but it's definitely the exception rather than the rule. I have good and affectionate long-term relationships with my patients that I treasure, but if you're going in to medicine thinking that every day is going to be a powerful and moving experience, it is not. Those moments will happen, and likely more frequently than if you were an accounts receivable clerk, but being a doctor is a job. An unusually interesting and complicated one, probably, but a job nonetheless.
One thing that you should do is figure out what you need to make your application say "I have always dreamed of being a doctor and this is why I am only now getting to it" versus "I am having a midlife crisis and I have latched onto medicine as a way to fill the void". So do try to spend some time around actual health care as a volunteer or something and make sure you're really interested in health care and also able to explain how an interest in medicine fits into your life.
UK vs US--I don't know that much about the UK training system, but I would strongly suggest that if possible you do your medical training in the place where you would like to live permanently. It is hard for physicians who do medical school outside the US to get residency positions in the US and likely will get more difficult in the future as US medical schools expand enrollment, and I think the reverse is true also. The forums at studentdoctor.net have some dedicated areas for international grads, and you should look very carefully at the relative pros and cons for US vs UK. UK is likely to be substantially less expensive, I think, although being over 30 actually may be advantageous to you in the US from a financial-aid perspective.
Good luck!
posted by The Elusive Architeuthis at 4:40 PM on December 4, 2014 [10 favorites]
Dear Abby had a letter like this years and years ago and said, "How old will you be in 8 years if you don't go back to school?"
I do know some very happy career-changers who have become physicians assistants rather than doctors; it's a slightly shorter educational path, and in specialties like family medicine you may actually get MORE patient contact than doctors in the same practice. Nurse Practitioners and Certified Nurse Midwives, similarly. But if you wanna be A DOCTOR, you go be a doctor!
You may be able to start knocking off some of your post-bacc courses at a local community college, at pretty low cost, while remaining employed. Why not take a physics course or something next semester while you consider your options?
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 4:48 PM on December 4, 2014 [4 favorites]
I do know some very happy career-changers who have become physicians assistants rather than doctors; it's a slightly shorter educational path, and in specialties like family medicine you may actually get MORE patient contact than doctors in the same practice. Nurse Practitioners and Certified Nurse Midwives, similarly. But if you wanna be A DOCTOR, you go be a doctor!
You may be able to start knocking off some of your post-bacc courses at a local community college, at pretty low cost, while remaining employed. Why not take a physics course or something next semester while you consider your options?
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 4:48 PM on December 4, 2014 [4 favorites]
Dude, I'm 33 and planning on entering PA school in a few years... and possibly MD school a decade or so down the line. It's not too late! It's harder to wedge school in as you get older, but you're also usually a more conscientious and motivated student.
posted by julthumbscrew at 4:58 PM on December 4, 2014
posted by julthumbscrew at 4:58 PM on December 4, 2014
I'm 28 and in year 1 of a 3-year post-bacc Masters in Nursing program (and loving it so far). I started with a BA in English lit and nothing special on my resume. Other students in my program have a variety of backgrounds, and include folks up to your age. For me, with 0 science and 0 math since high school, I did one prerequisite at a time for about 2 years. I could have prepared in 1 year if I had stopped working.
I would just suggest that you consider a broad variety of healthcare jobs. Personally I've never wanted to be a doctor, but originally was thinking midwifery; I reoriented to nursing partly because it's more internationally portable, partly because it's more flexible in terms of range of jobs available, and partly because I could get it done in 3 years flat (or less--US programs tend to be 2 years). If something non-MD would satisfy your urge to be working with, and doing good things for, people... nursing or another allied health profession could put you on the ground and running much faster than medicine.
posted by snorkmaiden at 5:25 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
I would just suggest that you consider a broad variety of healthcare jobs. Personally I've never wanted to be a doctor, but originally was thinking midwifery; I reoriented to nursing partly because it's more internationally portable, partly because it's more flexible in terms of range of jobs available, and partly because I could get it done in 3 years flat (or less--US programs tend to be 2 years). If something non-MD would satisfy your urge to be working with, and doing good things for, people... nursing or another allied health profession could put you on the ground and running much faster than medicine.
posted by snorkmaiden at 5:25 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
An ex of mine started med school at about that age, after having a career as a professional ballet dancer. He didn't seem to have any issues because of his age (although, admittedly, he was already used to a grueling schedule). Another friend's mom started med school when my friend was a toddler, and that also worked out. So sure, it's possible. BUT it's also completely possible to use a business degree for good- I'm surrounded by people doing exactly that, including many focused on healthcare innovations. There are so many opportunities to find meaningful work that don't involve significant debt and nearly a decade of your life....
posted by three_red_balloons at 5:31 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by three_red_balloons at 5:31 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
Shadow and volunteer. As much as you can.
Yes, this exactly. It's a very common expectation (if not an actual requirement) for building a viable application to med school, it'll give you a gauge for if/how much you're romanticizing the idea, and if you wind up deciding not to pursue medicine, you'll be out less time and money than if you jump into a post-bacc straightaway.
I think even if you dip a toe in and volunteer for a few months and then decide "this is not what I want", you'll still have done something very valuable for yourself. If you don't, you'll still be wondering if you should've in another 10 years.
posted by kagredon at 5:42 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
Yes, this exactly. It's a very common expectation (if not an actual requirement) for building a viable application to med school, it'll give you a gauge for if/how much you're romanticizing the idea, and if you wind up deciding not to pursue medicine, you'll be out less time and money than if you jump into a post-bacc straightaway.
I think even if you dip a toe in and volunteer for a few months and then decide "this is not what I want", you'll still have done something very valuable for yourself. If you don't, you'll still be wondering if you should've in another 10 years.
posted by kagredon at 5:42 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
Nope, you're not too old to go to medical school. There were a handful of folks in my class, and much more than a handful at my school, who were older than that. One fellow was in his 50s, had a successful career as a lawyer, and decided to become an MD. Pizacake.
Coming from a non-traditional background doesn't necessarily hurt your chances, and may even help. And help not in the grander sense of being a "better person" or a more well-rounded physician, but in actually getting in, though I'd argue the former is pretty damn valuable. I studied English in undergrad and got in. I did, of course, also have a strong science background.
Getting into med school these days is tough. Really tough. It seems that many people I've met lately, including undergrads applying and medical students, have applied to med school more than once. The MCAT is tough. Really tough. I'd like to attribute my difficulty in answering MCAT questions now with being out of the undergrad science loop, but the questions seem ridiculously difficult these days.
See this link for some sobering numbers. There's a link to a PDF on the right with a more detailed breakdown and numbers.
Once you're in med school, you've got near-yearly Big Tests. You're basically going to be studying like crazy all the damn time until you pass your boards at the end of or just after residency. Nevermind the folks who claim that the USMLE just gets easier: it might, but you're going to be studying just as hard.
In addition, the cost of med school has gone up. This, in the face of higher interest rates for student loans. Early in the 2000s, it was possible to consolidate student loans at rates lower than the inflation rate (in the 1-3% range). Now people are completing their training with loans surpassing 8%! Sure, there are long-term repayment plans, but paying back a >100k loan at 8% over 30 years is... crazy expensive. With a fixed payment, that's 700 bucks a month, with 151k in interest paid!
Not including the time required to fulfill prerequisites, you're looking at a minimum of seven years of training: four years of med school plus a minimum of three years for the primary care residencies (internal medicine, family practice, pediatrics). Add a couple more years for general surgery. Add three years for cardiology or gastroenterology.
Finally, understand that it's not just time and money. Med school and residency can be soul-sucking. Truly. There are work hour restrictions that make things a little more sane these days, but it's tough. It's seven years of your life where all you're going to be doing is basically eat, sleep, wake, and study. No vacation. No real trips. The people who claim med school is fun, and that there's time to do stuff like go out and have fun and raise kids and stuff? Delusional. Anyone who's anyone who's done anything but go straight from high school to college to med school will realize that med students are, basically, losers.
It's seven years of your life where you really won't remember a lot of anything of what's going on with the world at large, or the world outside the microcosm that is medicine, apart from the most terrible or fantastic: I was talking with some folks about how med school and residency was all a blur: that while I remember a lot of specific things about medicine, I don't remember a lot of what was going on in the world apart from huge, terrible things, like the Matrix movies, 9/11, and Smash Mouth.
All that being said, 34 is not too old. No way. If none of the above deters you, go for it. It's ridiculously fun (some days), very rewarding (many days), and extremely humbling (all the time). Sure, there's a lot that's frustrating about what the job entails on a day-to-day basis, but it's a blast. Until you've gotta take your recertification exam. Balls.
posted by herrdoktor at 7:08 PM on December 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
Coming from a non-traditional background doesn't necessarily hurt your chances, and may even help. And help not in the grander sense of being a "better person" or a more well-rounded physician, but in actually getting in, though I'd argue the former is pretty damn valuable. I studied English in undergrad and got in. I did, of course, also have a strong science background.
Getting into med school these days is tough. Really tough. It seems that many people I've met lately, including undergrads applying and medical students, have applied to med school more than once. The MCAT is tough. Really tough. I'd like to attribute my difficulty in answering MCAT questions now with being out of the undergrad science loop, but the questions seem ridiculously difficult these days.
See this link for some sobering numbers. There's a link to a PDF on the right with a more detailed breakdown and numbers.
Once you're in med school, you've got near-yearly Big Tests. You're basically going to be studying like crazy all the damn time until you pass your boards at the end of or just after residency. Nevermind the folks who claim that the USMLE just gets easier: it might, but you're going to be studying just as hard.
In addition, the cost of med school has gone up. This, in the face of higher interest rates for student loans. Early in the 2000s, it was possible to consolidate student loans at rates lower than the inflation rate (in the 1-3% range). Now people are completing their training with loans surpassing 8%! Sure, there are long-term repayment plans, but paying back a >100k loan at 8% over 30 years is... crazy expensive. With a fixed payment, that's 700 bucks a month, with 151k in interest paid!
Not including the time required to fulfill prerequisites, you're looking at a minimum of seven years of training: four years of med school plus a minimum of three years for the primary care residencies (internal medicine, family practice, pediatrics). Add a couple more years for general surgery. Add three years for cardiology or gastroenterology.
Finally, understand that it's not just time and money. Med school and residency can be soul-sucking. Truly. There are work hour restrictions that make things a little more sane these days, but it's tough. It's seven years of your life where all you're going to be doing is basically eat, sleep, wake, and study. No vacation. No real trips. The people who claim med school is fun, and that there's time to do stuff like go out and have fun and raise kids and stuff? Delusional. Anyone who's anyone who's done anything but go straight from high school to college to med school will realize that med students are, basically, losers.
It's seven years of your life where you really won't remember a lot of anything of what's going on with the world at large, or the world outside the microcosm that is medicine, apart from the most terrible or fantastic: I was talking with some folks about how med school and residency was all a blur: that while I remember a lot of specific things about medicine, I don't remember a lot of what was going on in the world apart from huge, terrible things, like the Matrix movies, 9/11, and Smash Mouth.
All that being said, 34 is not too old. No way. If none of the above deters you, go for it. It's ridiculously fun (some days), very rewarding (many days), and extremely humbling (all the time). Sure, there's a lot that's frustrating about what the job entails on a day-to-day basis, but it's a blast. Until you've gotta take your recertification exam. Balls.
posted by herrdoktor at 7:08 PM on December 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
For what it's worth - my wife was 28 when she started med school. One of her classmates was 40.
I think probably your life experience will cancel out the lesser energy of your age. If being a doctor is really what you want to do, do it!
posted by Chrysostom at 8:22 PM on December 4, 2014
I think probably your life experience will cancel out the lesser energy of your age. If being a doctor is really what you want to do, do it!
posted by Chrysostom at 8:22 PM on December 4, 2014
Current resident here (worked for a few years before medicine although not nearly as much you)...In your 30s, you would be one of the oldest people in an American med school class, but there are a lot of older residents (foreign doctors who move here have to redo everything), so you're not *too* old. But I would think hard, not about whether you would enjoy being a family doctor, but about whether you would enjoy the 10 year journey (3 years post-bac, 4 years med school, 3 year family medicine residency) it would take to get there.
Advantages to being older: more life experience/time to build coping skills to deal with the stress of training; knowing how to interact with people that aren't 22 helps a lot when you start seeing patients; being married provides an escape from all the craziness.
Disadvantages: the hours during training are bad (I average 65-70 hours/week and I'm in a middle of the road specialty in terms of workload. Surgical specialties are much worse. Family is a little better but not as much as you would expect). Also, medical training is very, very hierarchical due to the huge amount you learn every year. It is also filled with people who think that being an expert in their field makes them an expert on everything else. What this means is that although your prior career will probably make you a better doctor in the long run, none of your attendings or residents will care, and if it does come up, you will be subjected to lectures about the subject by people who know far less than you do. (Think man-splaining times 1000). This has been one of the most frustrating things for me.
I still love it and would do it again. But it's a big sacrifice and one that gets bigger once you've built a life outside medicine. Like others have said, nursing and mid-level programs (PA, NP) might provide a lot of what you've looking for with less pain. Other options to consider: occupational therapy, genetic counseling, social work...there are a lot of other fields where you can work at a hospital, have autonomy, help people that require less science and less time investment before getting a job.
posted by ellebeejay at 8:49 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
Advantages to being older: more life experience/time to build coping skills to deal with the stress of training; knowing how to interact with people that aren't 22 helps a lot when you start seeing patients; being married provides an escape from all the craziness.
Disadvantages: the hours during training are bad (I average 65-70 hours/week and I'm in a middle of the road specialty in terms of workload. Surgical specialties are much worse. Family is a little better but not as much as you would expect). Also, medical training is very, very hierarchical due to the huge amount you learn every year. It is also filled with people who think that being an expert in their field makes them an expert on everything else. What this means is that although your prior career will probably make you a better doctor in the long run, none of your attendings or residents will care, and if it does come up, you will be subjected to lectures about the subject by people who know far less than you do. (Think man-splaining times 1000). This has been one of the most frustrating things for me.
I still love it and would do it again. But it's a big sacrifice and one that gets bigger once you've built a life outside medicine. Like others have said, nursing and mid-level programs (PA, NP) might provide a lot of what you've looking for with less pain. Other options to consider: occupational therapy, genetic counseling, social work...there are a lot of other fields where you can work at a hospital, have autonomy, help people that require less science and less time investment before getting a job.
posted by ellebeejay at 8:49 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I don't know what med school costs and time demands are like in the UK, but if you did it in the US I would think long and hard about whether you and your family want to undertake the time and financial commitment. You're looking at a decade of crazy work hours, so when you sign up, your partner will be signing up to put everything on the backburner to be the primary caretaker of your kid. You're also taking a massive pay cut (i.e. not getting paid at all until residency) while likely racking up over $150K in loans at the end, if not more. Med school costs in the US are also such that once you're started you are pretty much committed because a specialty doctor's salary is the only thing that's going to be able to pay off the massive loans in any amount of time.
If I were you I would do some shadowing, and also think long and hard about other ways to find a meaningful career in a way that utilizes your current skills. Perhaps in a non-profit geared towards providing healthcare access, where your business school experience might come in handy?
posted by Anonymous at 9:03 PM on December 4, 2014
If I were you I would do some shadowing, and also think long and hard about other ways to find a meaningful career in a way that utilizes your current skills. Perhaps in a non-profit geared towards providing healthcare access, where your business school experience might come in handy?
posted by Anonymous at 9:03 PM on December 4, 2014
I am 37 and just started at an oldness-friendly MD program. It's great, but I am really feeling that 15-year age gap. I say this having made real friends in their early 20s during premed years. I can still relate to my colleagues as younger contemporaries, but I have to look deep inside myself to do it. Every day. What makes it OK for me is a really strong sense of mission.
If you decide to do it, cough up for the fastest possible postbac. You *will* be in the long tail. Try not to give too much weight to the crazy outlier stories. What does it matter if ONE classmate is over 45?
Good luck!
posted by 8603 at 11:10 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
If you decide to do it, cough up for the fastest possible postbac. You *will* be in the long tail. Try not to give too much weight to the crazy outlier stories. What does it matter if ONE classmate is over 45?
Good luck!
posted by 8603 at 11:10 PM on December 4, 2014 [1 favorite]
In the UK, the graduate entry medical schools require students to have home status, so to have been resident in the UK for the past 3 years, but they are funded like undergraduate first degrees (i.e. by the student loans company). Entry is competitive (I didn't get in), but deliberately open to all. Most don't have science prerequisites apart from the aptitude tests (UKCAT and GAMSAT depending on the course), and there's 4 years of study before 2 Foundation Years where you work in general rotation (on a c.£25k wage) and then 4+ years of specialist training.
posted by ambrosen at 12:35 AM on December 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by ambrosen at 12:35 AM on December 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
I'd aim for PA or Nurse Practitioner. You'd be doing the same type of work, but without the significant commitment in time and money. You know that you not only will be going into debt for this dream, but also giving up significant amounts of money in lost opportunity costs.
Is it worth a million dollars to you to pursue this? Does it even make sense for you? What does your partner think about it?
You're not too old, but there may be considerable practical issues that you need to assess.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 5:05 AM on December 5, 2014
Is it worth a million dollars to you to pursue this? Does it even make sense for you? What does your partner think about it?
You're not too old, but there may be considerable practical issues that you need to assess.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 5:05 AM on December 5, 2014
I agree with the other commenters that you are not too old to get started on this path. I would, however, advise you to take a step back and think about what the path to being a doctor would actually look like. You'll be bringing in negative income for a minimum of the first 6 years - 2 of post-bacc, 4 of medical school, and not bringing in a ton for your time in residency. You'll also have to start paying back those loans, so it's worth thinking about if you would be happy raising 2 kids with your salary minus loans and insurance.
You'll be able to spend a decent amount of time with your kids during your post-bacc and first 2 years of medical school (which have a time commitment more like a 40 hour week) but your training after that is much more intense, and you should think critically about how much time you'd actually like to see your kids. This could literally mean not being home during your kid's waking hours for extended periods. Also, there aren't many part-time positions for doctors, and even if you could find one, you might not be able to take it and keep up with loan payments.
Since your interest is in being a family doctor, I'd look into training to be a PA or NP, which would accomplish many of your same goals while remaining flexible. I'd also consider that if you reflexively recoil at the thought of being an PA/NP, you might be romanticizing the glamor of being a doctor rather than thinking about what a family doctor does all day.
posted by fermezporte at 5:13 AM on December 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
You'll be able to spend a decent amount of time with your kids during your post-bacc and first 2 years of medical school (which have a time commitment more like a 40 hour week) but your training after that is much more intense, and you should think critically about how much time you'd actually like to see your kids. This could literally mean not being home during your kid's waking hours for extended periods. Also, there aren't many part-time positions for doctors, and even if you could find one, you might not be able to take it and keep up with loan payments.
Since your interest is in being a family doctor, I'd look into training to be a PA or NP, which would accomplish many of your same goals while remaining flexible. I'd also consider that if you reflexively recoil at the thought of being an PA/NP, you might be romanticizing the glamor of being a doctor rather than thinking about what a family doctor does all day.
posted by fermezporte at 5:13 AM on December 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
My sister, who had a masters in marine biology and had worked for years as a researcher at a major university, started medical school at 41, back in the mid 1990s. Even with her background she was turned down by most medical schools. I'd like to hope things have changed since then.
She was waitlisted at Duke- which is near her home-, did her first two years elsewhere and then transferred to Duke. She made the difficult decision to go far away for those first two years and leave her husband with the sole responsibility for two children who were ages 1 and 8. She flew home once a month.
When she graduated she was turned down for all the residencies she'd applied for, in spite of her graduation with excellent grades from Duke, a highly-ranked university. Duke created a slot for her in Family Medicine and it all worked out in the end. She would have loved to apply for other specializations but knew her chances of getting into such residencies were nil.
My brother-in-law contributed greatly to her success. He'd always done all the cooking, he had a stable job with a decent income and no work to bring home; they used some of her student loan monies to pay for someone to clean the house, do the yard, and other such things. They'd already been together for twenty years when she started med school and their marriage was stable and solid.
Seriously look into Physician Assistant programs which will take a lot less time to complete. A friend makes enough doing that to support a wife and two kids in NYC, so I guess it pays pretty well.
posted by mareli at 5:55 AM on December 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
She was waitlisted at Duke- which is near her home-, did her first two years elsewhere and then transferred to Duke. She made the difficult decision to go far away for those first two years and leave her husband with the sole responsibility for two children who were ages 1 and 8. She flew home once a month.
When she graduated she was turned down for all the residencies she'd applied for, in spite of her graduation with excellent grades from Duke, a highly-ranked university. Duke created a slot for her in Family Medicine and it all worked out in the end. She would have loved to apply for other specializations but knew her chances of getting into such residencies were nil.
My brother-in-law contributed greatly to her success. He'd always done all the cooking, he had a stable job with a decent income and no work to bring home; they used some of her student loan monies to pay for someone to clean the house, do the yard, and other such things. They'd already been together for twenty years when she started med school and their marriage was stable and solid.
Seriously look into Physician Assistant programs which will take a lot less time to complete. A friend makes enough doing that to support a wife and two kids in NYC, so I guess it pays pretty well.
posted by mareli at 5:55 AM on December 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
I'll add a non-PC postscript. There are gradations of raw talent even in med school. There are "average" 22-year-olds who will probably do fine. There are "average" 30somethings who are notably having trouble and repeating years, even though as people they clearly bring a lot to medicine. I am betting on my historical moneymaker, so make SURE you can, too.
posted by 8603 at 11:39 AM on December 5, 2014
posted by 8603 at 11:39 AM on December 5, 2014
This thread is closed to new comments.
Obviously I can't say how it has worked out for her as she has just started, but I do know that she is INCREDIBLY happy about it, and that she was able to eventually get in, despite her age and non-science background.
posted by lollusc at 3:57 PM on December 4, 2014