Scooter safety
November 16, 2013 8:49 PM Subscribe
What should I be aware of in terms of safely riding a small scooter (150cc) in the dark on icy city roads, with extra baggage?
I'm interested in attaching a trailer of some sort so I can transport various things-- books, food, possibly even pets or children. I'm thinking this will be my main mode of transportation, but I want to make sure I know the ins and outs. Is it a crazy idea? My car is just too expensive. Suggestions please!
I'm interested in attaching a trailer of some sort so I can transport various things-- books, food, possibly even pets or children. I'm thinking this will be my main mode of transportation, but I want to make sure I know the ins and outs. Is it a crazy idea? My car is just too expensive. Suggestions please!
You are seriously considering driving a scooter, on dark and icy city roads, hauling a trailer, with children in the trailer, just to save a few bucks? Children? In a trailer? Think about this for about five seconds and see all the ways this is a very bad and thoughtless idea.
posted by Sternmeyer at 8:59 PM on November 16, 2013 [16 favorites]
posted by Sternmeyer at 8:59 PM on November 16, 2013 [16 favorites]
I have seen a lot of people do a lot of crazy things with two wheeled vehicles. Double decker motorcycles, crossing the country on homebuild motorcycles with no suspension on dirt roads are two that come to mind.
They all consider ice racing (riding on ice with studded tires (traction!) on closed courses) to be utterly crazy.
I have ridden on icy roads due to poor planning. I hope to NEVER EVER EVER experience that EVER again. I very nearly fell down the side of a mountain, and I am a very skilled and experienced rider.
I would walk or take the bus before I considered what you're considering. Tiny scooter tires are much less safe than larger motorcycle tires, as well.
This plan is made of craziness. And I say that as a motorcyclist who rides every day, rain or shine, and transports large amounts of cargo on her motorcycle.
And if you do this and put children in that trailer, I hope you get arrested for child endangerment.
posted by mollymayhem at 9:11 PM on November 16, 2013 [6 favorites]
They all consider ice racing (riding on ice with studded tires (traction!) on closed courses) to be utterly crazy.
I have ridden on icy roads due to poor planning. I hope to NEVER EVER EVER experience that EVER again. I very nearly fell down the side of a mountain, and I am a very skilled and experienced rider.
I would walk or take the bus before I considered what you're considering. Tiny scooter tires are much less safe than larger motorcycle tires, as well.
This plan is made of craziness. And I say that as a motorcyclist who rides every day, rain or shine, and transports large amounts of cargo on her motorcycle.
And if you do this and put children in that trailer, I hope you get arrested for child endangerment.
posted by mollymayhem at 9:11 PM on November 16, 2013 [6 favorites]
If you hit a patch of ice, you are going to go down. If you have a trailer, it's going to crash.
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 9:22 PM on November 16, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 9:22 PM on November 16, 2013 [2 favorites]
There are so many thihgs wrong with this idea, but first, do not take your kids! It's dangerous enough riding in the city, in the dark, and you have absolutely no control with 2 wheels on ice.
The biggest danger, besides, the ice is other traffic. Most people either don't see or don't care about scooters or motorcyles. I've been riding 40+ years, I know. Please, please don't take your children. You don't sound experienced enough yet. Don't take offense, it's just a bad idea, just my opinion.
posted by cliffster99 at 9:44 PM on November 16, 2013
The biggest danger, besides, the ice is other traffic. Most people either don't see or don't care about scooters or motorcyles. I've been riding 40+ years, I know. Please, please don't take your children. You don't sound experienced enough yet. Don't take offense, it's just a bad idea, just my opinion.
posted by cliffster99 at 9:44 PM on November 16, 2013
It is a crazy idea.
posted by trip and a half at 10:33 PM on November 16, 2013
posted by trip and a half at 10:33 PM on November 16, 2013
What should I be aware of in terms of safely riding a small scooter (150cc) in the dark on icy city roads, with extra baggage?
You should be aware that you and your children and your pets will be maimed or killed.
A few years ago, my husband and I were riding his very large, very loud Harley and were hit by the only other car on the damned road - in the middle of the day, in the middle of summer. I was out with a broken leg for five months and my husband still has neck pain. And we were lucky.
Is it a crazy idea?
Yes.
Suggestions please!
Don't do this. Buy a bus pass. Find another way to pay for the gas. Find another job. Bum a ride from a friend. Sell your car and buy something more fuel efficient.
Also, my husband says if you are a reasonable-sized adult, 150cc will be maxed out hauling you with nothing left over for even an empty trailer.
posted by Beti at 10:35 PM on November 16, 2013
You should be aware that you and your children and your pets will be maimed or killed.
A few years ago, my husband and I were riding his very large, very loud Harley and were hit by the only other car on the damned road - in the middle of the day, in the middle of summer. I was out with a broken leg for five months and my husband still has neck pain. And we were lucky.
Is it a crazy idea?
Yes.
Suggestions please!
Don't do this. Buy a bus pass. Find another way to pay for the gas. Find another job. Bum a ride from a friend. Sell your car and buy something more fuel efficient.
Also, my husband says if you are a reasonable-sized adult, 150cc will be maxed out hauling you with nothing left over for even an empty trailer.
posted by Beti at 10:35 PM on November 16, 2013
My son rides a 100cc scooter to commute on a daily basis (we live in a very car-centric city). And this makes me very nervous.
This, despite the fact that he only rides during the day in a city with a very warm climate, with full protection (helmet, goggles, boots, gloves, proper pants, full jacket). And, this despite the fact that his commute is entirely on 25 mph and 35 mph roads with wide lanes and no big twists or turns.
I will be more blunt than sternmeyer. Riding a scooter at night in cold, icy conditions with children or pets in a trailer is one of the most idiotic things I have heard. I have never even seen a trailer for a scooter before, anyway, to be honest with you. And even in perfect weather, putting kids in a trailer behind a scooter is horribly risky and a terrible idea.
Scooters are dangerous enough in the US or Canada given how car-centric our countries are, much less in dangerous driving conditions. If you get one, it can be really economical and enjoyable, but just realize how risky it can be, even in fantastic driving conditions.
posted by Old Man McKay at 10:46 PM on November 16, 2013 [1 favorite]
This, despite the fact that he only rides during the day in a city with a very warm climate, with full protection (helmet, goggles, boots, gloves, proper pants, full jacket). And, this despite the fact that his commute is entirely on 25 mph and 35 mph roads with wide lanes and no big twists or turns.
I will be more blunt than sternmeyer. Riding a scooter at night in cold, icy conditions with children or pets in a trailer is one of the most idiotic things I have heard. I have never even seen a trailer for a scooter before, anyway, to be honest with you. And even in perfect weather, putting kids in a trailer behind a scooter is horribly risky and a terrible idea.
Scooters are dangerous enough in the US or Canada given how car-centric our countries are, much less in dangerous driving conditions. If you get one, it can be really economical and enjoyable, but just realize how risky it can be, even in fantastic driving conditions.
posted by Old Man McKay at 10:46 PM on November 16, 2013 [1 favorite]
Perhaps you are not familiar with riding motor scooters as yet. First of all, it is much, much chillier. A fall day that feels just warm enough to walk without a jacket will require gloves and a windbreaker on a 'bike. A day in winter will be bone-achingly cold with wind chill.
Regarding ice, I don't know where you live but where I lived, after a snowstorm in the winter the plowed streets were bone dry after a sunny day (unless it'd been a real blizzard). Sidewalks remain dangerously icy all winter but dammit, the streets are clear. You have the width of the lane, you're not sharing it with a vehicle like a bicyclist or a moped. But you do have to watch out for potholes with those tiny wheels.
I've never seen a scooter towing a trailer. For carrying stuff, a scooter might have a compartment under the seat, or a basket/milk crate behind the seat, a hook on the steering column to hold bags, or panniers. Or if the foot well is flat, holding a bag between your legs. How much stuff to you think you need to carry? Towing kids, well, it's like those bicyclists that you see towing their kids in a little trailer; just doesn't seem safe to me.
Another aspect to consider is: how common are scooters in your city? If they are rarely seen, then motorists will not be accustomed to dealing with them. They will literally not see you even with your headlights on.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 11:00 PM on November 16, 2013 [1 favorite]
Regarding ice, I don't know where you live but where I lived, after a snowstorm in the winter the plowed streets were bone dry after a sunny day (unless it'd been a real blizzard). Sidewalks remain dangerously icy all winter but dammit, the streets are clear. You have the width of the lane, you're not sharing it with a vehicle like a bicyclist or a moped. But you do have to watch out for potholes with those tiny wheels.
I've never seen a scooter towing a trailer. For carrying stuff, a scooter might have a compartment under the seat, or a basket/milk crate behind the seat, a hook on the steering column to hold bags, or panniers. Or if the foot well is flat, holding a bag between your legs. How much stuff to you think you need to carry? Towing kids, well, it's like those bicyclists that you see towing their kids in a little trailer; just doesn't seem safe to me.
Another aspect to consider is: how common are scooters in your city? If they are rarely seen, then motorists will not be accustomed to dealing with them. They will literally not see you even with your headlights on.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 11:00 PM on November 16, 2013 [1 favorite]
Just in case everyone else saying that this is an absolutely crazy idea didn't clue you in, let's talk physics. Normal cars have stability because they have 4 wheels on the ground at all times, no matter how fast they're going. They have fatter tires with more contact on the road, so they can grip better. They (often) have ABS brakes to improve stopping distance in slippery conditions by ensuring the wheels don't lock up. And even with all of these things going for it, driving a car in icy conditions can still be quite dangerous, and doubly so when towing something.
You, on the other hand, are considering taking a two-wheeled vehicle that requires a certain amount of speed to stay upright, has 2 skinny tires, has no ABS breaks, and for that matter has pretty much no protection against crashes whatsoever onto dark, icy roads? And you're basically invisible to cars? And then you want to add the unpredictability of towing something behind you to the mix?
No, I'm sorry, but I don't see a way to do that "safely". Look into getting a bus pass if you want to save money on gas.
posted by Aleyn at 12:03 AM on November 17, 2013 [2 favorites]
You, on the other hand, are considering taking a two-wheeled vehicle that requires a certain amount of speed to stay upright, has 2 skinny tires, has no ABS breaks, and for that matter has pretty much no protection against crashes whatsoever onto dark, icy roads? And you're basically invisible to cars? And then you want to add the unpredictability of towing something behind you to the mix?
No, I'm sorry, but I don't see a way to do that "safely". Look into getting a bus pass if you want to save money on gas.
posted by Aleyn at 12:03 AM on November 17, 2013 [2 favorites]
Hello, I'm a biker. I have a dirtbike, which means large wheels, which means extra stability.
I'm not a novice: I've been a biker for 20 years and I have literally ridden this bike around the Sahara and the Mediterranean sea. I live in a climate where we get snow and ice in winter, so I'm also no stranger to that.
I ride in the sun, the rain, the fog, the snow and the frost.
I do not ride when I know roads will be icy. That should tell you something.
(Also, transporting people in a trailer is likely to be against the law.)
posted by Too-Ticky at 1:04 AM on November 17, 2013 [3 favorites]
I'm not a novice: I've been a biker for 20 years and I have literally ridden this bike around the Sahara and the Mediterranean sea. I live in a climate where we get snow and ice in winter, so I'm also no stranger to that.
I ride in the sun, the rain, the fog, the snow and the frost.
I do not ride when I know roads will be icy. That should tell you something.
(Also, transporting people in a trailer is likely to be against the law.)
posted by Too-Ticky at 1:04 AM on November 17, 2013 [3 favorites]
Even if you don't fall and crash, hauling children in a trailer like that has a different problem: if something happens to the kids (being hit by a flying rock?), there's no way for them to tell you (driving the scooter) to stop.
This is an exceedingly bad idea.
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 1:05 AM on November 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
This is an exceedingly bad idea.
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 1:05 AM on November 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
No. No no no no no no no.
I'm lucky to be alive after once sliding a 125 scooter in only marginally icy conditions. The car behind stopped about a foot from my head. My helmet wouldn't have helped. Never went out in those conditions again.
This is a crazy idea that could end up with someone, possibly children, getting killed.
Don't.
posted by dowcrag at 2:27 AM on November 17, 2013
I'm lucky to be alive after once sliding a 125 scooter in only marginally icy conditions. The car behind stopped about a foot from my head. My helmet wouldn't have helped. Never went out in those conditions again.
This is a crazy idea that could end up with someone, possibly children, getting killed.
Don't.
posted by dowcrag at 2:27 AM on November 17, 2013
Best answer: From this car-driver's perspective, scooters are some of the most dangerous things out there --- their speeds are way lower than cars or motorcycles (closer to bikes); but they are often driven on roads *as if* they were cars' equal, in terms of which roads they're taken onto, lane changing, all the rest. Bicyclists know and understand that they are slower and more vulnerable than anybody else on the road, and ride accordingly; scooter drivers (from my perspective!) seem to think they are EQUAL to cars --- and they most certainly aren't.
Scooters seem to have uniformly poor tail-lights, not much different from what you see on bikes, which means they're pretty hard for other drivers to see; when you add in how slow scooters are, and how fast most traffic is going, unless that scooter stays ONLY on side streets with speed limits no higher than 25-35mph, you're talking a constant danger of rear-ending. Now add your proposed trailer and block that already-weak taillight even more.... that danger of rear-ending just went up exponentially. And that's when the road is CLEAR, not dark & icy.
As Too-Ticky says above, intelligent *motorcycle* riders won't ride on ice, even with their bigger tires and heavier machines: their experience tells them that no matter how much skill they have or how powerful their machine is, riding on ice is a bad idea. You may dislike driving a car, but having 4 wheels instead of 2 means that even when (WHEN, not IF) you skid on that ice, you've got way better chances of getting out of it okay.
And here's another: when you do skid and loose traction, even if you somehow magically manage to keep the scooter upright for the moment (unlikely), that trailer will jack-knife, spilling your cargo (YOUR KIDS!!!) all over the road, into the path of oncoming traffic.... and that jack-knife will, in the end, pull the scooter over after it.
So..... you want to put your kids into a hard-to-see trailer, where winter winds/snow/ice will be blasting them in the face (pneumonia, anyone?), and take the whole contraption out on dark, iced-over roads the scooter itself shouldn't be on in the first place.
To make it unanimous: Don't Do This.
posted by easily confused at 3:06 AM on November 17, 2013 [2 favorites]
Scooters seem to have uniformly poor tail-lights, not much different from what you see on bikes, which means they're pretty hard for other drivers to see; when you add in how slow scooters are, and how fast most traffic is going, unless that scooter stays ONLY on side streets with speed limits no higher than 25-35mph, you're talking a constant danger of rear-ending. Now add your proposed trailer and block that already-weak taillight even more.... that danger of rear-ending just went up exponentially. And that's when the road is CLEAR, not dark & icy.
As Too-Ticky says above, intelligent *motorcycle* riders won't ride on ice, even with their bigger tires and heavier machines: their experience tells them that no matter how much skill they have or how powerful their machine is, riding on ice is a bad idea. You may dislike driving a car, but having 4 wheels instead of 2 means that even when (WHEN, not IF) you skid on that ice, you've got way better chances of getting out of it okay.
And here's another: when you do skid and loose traction, even if you somehow magically manage to keep the scooter upright for the moment (unlikely), that trailer will jack-knife, spilling your cargo (YOUR KIDS!!!) all over the road, into the path of oncoming traffic.... and that jack-knife will, in the end, pull the scooter over after it.
So..... you want to put your kids into a hard-to-see trailer, where winter winds/snow/ice will be blasting them in the face (pneumonia, anyone?), and take the whole contraption out on dark, iced-over roads the scooter itself shouldn't be on in the first place.
To make it unanimous: Don't Do This.
posted by easily confused at 3:06 AM on November 17, 2013 [2 favorites]
Even if you could legally haul children in a trailer, and even if you didn't crash, they would be riding in the wake of your exhaust. Just another among countless reasons to not do it.
posted by The Deej at 3:14 AM on November 17, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by The Deej at 3:14 AM on November 17, 2013 [2 favorites]
It's true, you know, about the trailer jack-knifing and pulling the bike down. I have a motorbike with a trailer, and that is a thing that happens.
I was lucky, I only sprained my ankle... but I was lying in the road in the path of oncoming traffic, and things could quite easily have ended up a lot worse.
posted by Too-Ticky at 3:36 AM on November 17, 2013
I was lucky, I only sprained my ankle... but I was lying in the road in the path of oncoming traffic, and things could quite easily have ended up a lot worse.
posted by Too-Ticky at 3:36 AM on November 17, 2013
I love scooters and bikes. I wouldn't ride either in icy conditions. If you hit ice with two wheels and lose traction you're going down.
150cc is at the more powerful end of an average scooter (although you do get big cc models like the Burgman) but you would want both more power and weight if you were planning to tow than 150cc. On top of that, 150cc scooters are generally designed for low speed manoeuvrability rather than high speed stability. I say this as someone who's done 70mph on a 125cc scooter, which is not a pleasant experience. Above 45mph and being passed by traffic is also deeply unpleasant.
In short: icy roads: bad idea; towing with a scooter: bad idea; towing children: lunatic idea; combining all three is an epically bad idea.
posted by MuffinMan at 5:07 AM on November 17, 2013
150cc is at the more powerful end of an average scooter (although you do get big cc models like the Burgman) but you would want both more power and weight if you were planning to tow than 150cc. On top of that, 150cc scooters are generally designed for low speed manoeuvrability rather than high speed stability. I say this as someone who's done 70mph on a 125cc scooter, which is not a pleasant experience. Above 45mph and being passed by traffic is also deeply unpleasant.
In short: icy roads: bad idea; towing with a scooter: bad idea; towing children: lunatic idea; combining all three is an epically bad idea.
posted by MuffinMan at 5:07 AM on November 17, 2013
It's sounding pretty unanimous, but yes: bad idea. Scooters are fun, but aren't engineered to safely pull a trailer; adding kids and ice to the equation is where you cross over from "interesting idea" to "no fucking way."
The other issue is that you are unlikely to actually save any money. 150cc scooters get ok gas mileage (not as good as 50cc bikes but still decent) but that will seriously drop with a trailer, probably below an efficient car. And add in the cost of the trailer, helmets... You will be lucky to start saving money by year five, which is when that poor overworked scooter will have died a sad death.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:07 AM on November 17, 2013
The other issue is that you are unlikely to actually save any money. 150cc scooters get ok gas mileage (not as good as 50cc bikes but still decent) but that will seriously drop with a trailer, probably below an efficient car. And add in the cost of the trailer, helmets... You will be lucky to start saving money by year five, which is when that poor overworked scooter will have died a sad death.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:07 AM on November 17, 2013
Scooters are great, if you are in a developing part of the world such as in SE Asia, where it never gets cold or icy and everybody drives a scooter and car traffic is minimal and people don't drive like goddamn lunatics. I've seen some, um, interesting passenger and/or freight configurations on scooters there.
In the U.S., not so much.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 6:12 AM on November 17, 2013
In the U.S., not so much.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 6:12 AM on November 17, 2013
Best answer: What should I be aware of in terms of safely riding a small scooter (150cc) in the dark on icy city roads, with extra baggage?
You should be aware that safely riding a small scooter in the dark on icy roads with extra baggage is impossible.
posted by Sys Rq at 10:00 AM on November 17, 2013
You should be aware that safely riding a small scooter in the dark on icy roads with extra baggage is impossible.
posted by Sys Rq at 10:00 AM on November 17, 2013
I use a 125cc motorcycle to get to and around London.
Very few people go for motorbike trailers - they stop you filtering through traffic, they're hard to park, and not many bikes have the right attachments. You should consider under-seat storage, panniers, a top box, or a backpack. I have no problem getting a week's worth of food into a backpack.
I don't transport anyone who isn't adult enough to give informed consent to the risks involved in motorcycling.
If there's ice on the roads I switch to public transport, walk, bicycle, taxi, ask a friend with a car or get it delivered (this is fairly rare in my climate and plenty offset by the savings the rest of the year). If it's near freezing temperatures I avoid long journeys as I don't have heated grips.
posted by Mike1024 at 10:51 AM on November 17, 2013
Very few people go for motorbike trailers - they stop you filtering through traffic, they're hard to park, and not many bikes have the right attachments. You should consider under-seat storage, panniers, a top box, or a backpack. I have no problem getting a week's worth of food into a backpack.
I don't transport anyone who isn't adult enough to give informed consent to the risks involved in motorcycling.
If there's ice on the roads I switch to public transport, walk, bicycle, taxi, ask a friend with a car or get it delivered (this is fairly rare in my climate and plenty offset by the savings the rest of the year). If it's near freezing temperatures I avoid long journeys as I don't have heated grips.
posted by Mike1024 at 10:51 AM on November 17, 2013
As someone with extensive experience riding a motorcycles on ice and snowpack, I have to disagree with everyone who said it's impossible to stay upright, I've ridden in freezing rain on roads so slippery that it was impossible to walk - motorcycles are shockingly stable. That said, 1) you won't find a trailer hitch for a scooter 2) you won't find a trailer that can haul people 3) it is illegal in most states to ride in a trailer (even camper trailers behind trucks) 4) the gas mileage will drop from 70-80 mpg to 45-55 mpg with a large load 5) I never recommend a motorcycle to anyone who is not a perfect driver and who can drive in a supremely defensive manner. Incidents that are mildly annoying in a car = amputation or death on a motorcycle.
A ten year old Saturn will get 35+ mpg and cost less than a scooter reliable enough commute with (plus trailer). An old tdi Volkswagen or other small diesel (shamefully hard to find in the US) will be in the 40-50 range. You can also look for a natural gas powered car (cng), most of these are former government or fleet vehicles.
posted by 445supermag at 12:57 PM on November 17, 2013
A ten year old Saturn will get 35+ mpg and cost less than a scooter reliable enough commute with (plus trailer). An old tdi Volkswagen or other small diesel (shamefully hard to find in the US) will be in the 40-50 range. You can also look for a natural gas powered car (cng), most of these are former government or fleet vehicles.
posted by 445supermag at 12:57 PM on November 17, 2013
Best answer: If someone offered me $1000 to ride a scooter around on the ice that wasn't mine, and i had no liability for damaging, and i was wearing nice full gear head to toe i would tell them to keep their money. The bruises i would get would be really annoying after the first couple times i beefed it, and getting my ankle jammed under the thing when it fell over and i tried to foot-skate and keep it upright(or my shoulder extra slammed from trying to just "go with it" and not get my leg jammed while i lowsided it)
I've owned a moped in the <1>
The trailer thing is freaking loony and has already gotten slagged on enough. I just wanted to address how bonkers this would be even if it was just you on a scooter by yourself with this plan, hauling nothing. There would be a lot of learning curve in which you would be falling over repeatedly. Likely in traffic, in front of and around cars driven by people who are freaking morons and go too fast in the ice and then can't stop and skid right in to you and fuck you to pieces.
And even if you were the only person out on the road where you were, you'd still be falling over and over and landing on ice covered otherwise pretty much bare pavement. This is like getting punched by mike tyson, over and over. All your leather jacket and shit is going to do is provide a nice surface for that to punch against. But hey, at least your skin isn't getting ripped up right?
The shittiest part would be when you think you've really kinda got it down. How to balance it, how fast you should be going, what to look for and avoid. Then you'll be driving through a normal looking area with your guard kinda down and LOL BLACK ICE JUST KIDDING NOW YOU'RE LAYING ON YOUR SIDE LIKE A WIMPERING PUPPY.
As a closing note, besides the PTSD flashbacks you gave me of almost being sucked under a 30,000LB+ skidding bus on my 24in dj/mountain bike with shocks that i was riding with half deflated tires(more surface area, more comforming to terrain = more traction!) in the snow, i'll leave you with this:
One of the most skilled, calm, collected brilliant drivers i know is my dad. He was a VP, landscape architect and worksite supervisor for a big landscaping company from the 70s until just a few years ago. All he did all day was drive from big jobsite to jobsite. His little truck, his eventual bigger truck, dump trucks, any kind of loader/equipment, he could drive it all and was totally experienced and used to it. He knew every backroad, shortcut, and what route to take what time of the day and in what conditions for the entire county. He had probably put in millions upon million of miles in those years. I watched a tire explode and start smoking at 70mph and he parked the truck so smoothly you couldn't even feel it had happened and just shrugged as he got out to change it. Nothing phases him, and if he reacts it's AFTER he's dealt with the situation.
He has an AWD subaru that is properly equipped to drive in these sorts of conditions. You know what he does?
He puts on some boots and walks.
He has no qualms about operating his vehicle, and is sure that it's capable and nothing could really cause problems for him. It's everyone else that he's scared shitless of. If i asked him this question he would go "it depends, is there one of those gopro camera things strapped on there so i can watch it later?"
posted by emptythought at 4:37 PM on November 17, 2013
I've owned a moped in the <1>
The trailer thing is freaking loony and has already gotten slagged on enough. I just wanted to address how bonkers this would be even if it was just you on a scooter by yourself with this plan, hauling nothing. There would be a lot of learning curve in which you would be falling over repeatedly. Likely in traffic, in front of and around cars driven by people who are freaking morons and go too fast in the ice and then can't stop and skid right in to you and fuck you to pieces.
And even if you were the only person out on the road where you were, you'd still be falling over and over and landing on ice covered otherwise pretty much bare pavement. This is like getting punched by mike tyson, over and over. All your leather jacket and shit is going to do is provide a nice surface for that to punch against. But hey, at least your skin isn't getting ripped up right?
The shittiest part would be when you think you've really kinda got it down. How to balance it, how fast you should be going, what to look for and avoid. Then you'll be driving through a normal looking area with your guard kinda down and LOL BLACK ICE JUST KIDDING NOW YOU'RE LAYING ON YOUR SIDE LIKE A WIMPERING PUPPY.
As a closing note, besides the PTSD flashbacks you gave me of almost being sucked under a 30,000LB+ skidding bus on my 24in dj/mountain bike with shocks that i was riding with half deflated tires(more surface area, more comforming to terrain = more traction!) in the snow, i'll leave you with this:
One of the most skilled, calm, collected brilliant drivers i know is my dad. He was a VP, landscape architect and worksite supervisor for a big landscaping company from the 70s until just a few years ago. All he did all day was drive from big jobsite to jobsite. His little truck, his eventual bigger truck, dump trucks, any kind of loader/equipment, he could drive it all and was totally experienced and used to it. He knew every backroad, shortcut, and what route to take what time of the day and in what conditions for the entire county. He had probably put in millions upon million of miles in those years. I watched a tire explode and start smoking at 70mph and he parked the truck so smoothly you couldn't even feel it had happened and just shrugged as he got out to change it. Nothing phases him, and if he reacts it's AFTER he's dealt with the situation.
He has an AWD subaru that is properly equipped to drive in these sorts of conditions. You know what he does?
He puts on some boots and walks.
He has no qualms about operating his vehicle, and is sure that it's capable and nothing could really cause problems for him. It's everyone else that he's scared shitless of. If i asked him this question he would go "it depends, is there one of those gopro camera things strapped on there so i can watch it later?"
posted by emptythought at 4:37 PM on November 17, 2013
If you're planning to use a motorcycle or scooter for regular transportation of any sort, please take an on-street motorcycle handling class--something like this.
posted by flug at 8:37 PM on November 17, 2013
posted by flug at 8:37 PM on November 17, 2013
I own a 150cc Vespa. I ride several thousand miles every year, and belong to a local scooter club. Most of our members have years and years of experience, and several of them do not own any other mode of transportation. Some of us have sidecars that accommodate passengers and/or pets. With proper equipment, we will ride in cold, wet conditions but outfitting cost is high and it's really not much fun. We live in the sunny Deep South (Memphis) and do ride quite a bit in cold weather, but anything under freezing temps is very difficult unless you are traveling very short distances. And none of us would ever ride on ice. Wet pavement on two wheels is very scary. Wet leaves are dangerous. Wet manhole covers and streetcar/trolley tracks have sent several of us to the emergency room. Ice would be impossible. Find your local scooter club and go have a beer with them before you do anything. They will be an invaluable source of information.
posted by raisingsand at 9:09 PM on November 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by raisingsand at 9:09 PM on November 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
Wear a helmet.
posted by ethnomethodologist at 8:52 PM on November 16, 2013