What can I do about harmful and untrue gossip?

September 8, 2013 3:15 PM

How can I deal with a person who is spreading harmful lies about me? These lies have direct negative consequences for me at work and in my private life.

I work in a small office. The director has a friend (Jane) who briefly worked part-time in the office.. Jane is also the wife of a close family friend. Jane has had many issues for being a gossip in the past and most people tolerate her because her husband is a really nice person.

In the last few years, Jane has gone to my parents to tell them totally untrue things about me (very bizarre lies about how I overeat in the office, for example).

With time these lies have started to become more serious, like about me doing irresponsible things at work, or how someone has been hired to replace me in the office. I recently took time off to visit relatives, and she has started the rumor that I lied in order to get time off.

Like I said, these things are 100% lies, and my parents are thankfully on my side. What worries me is that this could be the tip of the iceberg. I don't know what she is saying to my director. Jane is really close to her and I have noticed a change in how my director treats me lately. I am not sure about how to deal with this. Whether I should address the issue with Jane, with my director, or if I should go to a lawyer (could I even?)

Thank you for your advice!

posted by anonymous to Human Relations (19 answers total)

You can consult a lawyer for any reason you like. Most attorneys will offer you a free consultation. I'm not in any way saying that you have a legal case, or that the legal route is the best way to go. The only way to find that out is to ask. But at the very least, it makes sense to find out what the implications of these lies are, both in terms of reputational harm you've already suffered and in terms of potential future issues, such as if you were to be fired because of one of these lies. You can also ask what the best way is to go about documenting these incidents and setting the record straight with your bosses.
posted by decathecting at 3:36 PM on September 8, 2013

I'm going to say I wouldn't worry about it until it actually becomes a problem that you have to deal with.

I know the failings of y close friends. Chances are Jane's friends do as well. We all have people in our lives that are incapable of telling it like it is. Sometimes we tolerate this for various reasons, other times we call them big fat liars and move on.

If you have established credibility I'd worry about this about as much as I worry about a comet destroying Earth. Sure, it's something I think about on occasion, but it doesn't keep me up at nights.
posted by cjorgensen at 3:44 PM on September 8, 2013 [2 favorites]

I think a nice combination of the first two answers on this thread have it.

But I am betting that everyone knows that this woman is Liar mcLiarson.
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 4:03 PM on September 8, 2013 [4 favorites]

I don't think you should worry about this. Most people know not to trust the Office Gossip.
posted by SkylitDrawl at 4:33 PM on September 8, 2013 [1 favorite]

I do think it is worth worrying about. You have good reason to think this woman has told lies about you to your boss who is now treating you differently! I'd bring it up directly with your boss. Awkward conversation, but, better than letting her think whatever.....
posted by bq at 5:05 PM on September 8, 2013 [8 favorites]

It sounds like Jane is going out of her way to cause you trouble. In your shoes I'd want to know why. Is she jealous of you? Does she feel she has been wronged by you?

I would want to challenge Jane directly, clarify her beef with me, make sure it isn't based on some misunderstanding or problem that could be rectified.
posted by zadcat at 5:18 PM on September 8, 2013 [5 favorites]

If you sense a change in attitude towards you from your director, I think this is something you have to deal with, as it IS affecting you directly. I would ask your boss for a few minutes of her time and address it. You should be very sincere, quietly concerned, very puzzled, and show some slight level of concern for Jane. Start like this:

"I have a problem that I don't quite know how to handle, and I need your advice. I've recently learned that Jane has said some really puzzling things about me to my parents concerning, among other things, my work situation. For instance, she seems to think that I lied about taking that time off to visit relatives. I'm not sure how to handle it, I've never had to deal with something like this. And I'm really, really concerned that what she's saying might affect your opinion of me and my work. I don't understand it at all. What should I be doing differently?"

And then later, when you hear yet another rumor that Jane has spread about work, just a casual conversation to touch base with your director would at least ease your own mind.

"Ummm, rumor has it that I (blah,blah,blah). Haha, you know that one's not true either, right?"

BUT, keep the conversation at work ABOUT work. Don't bring in any of the personal stuff, not one little bit.
posted by raisingsand at 5:24 PM on September 8, 2013 [31 favorites]

Oh, the Janes of the world. For whatever reason these types of people need to be cutting someone else down to feel taller.

She's going to gossip about someone. Make sure you're not a soft target. I would LOVE for someone to gossip to my mother about me. Mom would serve tea graciously then eviscerate that person with the correct knife and fork. Hopefully your parents did the same.

Don't roll over and be Jane's target. Whenever you see her call her out. If the family friend is indeed close, then Mom or Dad should call him with fair warning and explain what Jane is doing. Don't backstab; don't gossip back. Just go at her head-on the way you do with any bully. Take your boss aside and say that you heard a bunch of untrue gossip. Just say what the lies are - don't say you heard Jane said them. Your boss knows who the gossip is. You highroad it on out of there, by not naming Jane.

Once she knows she's caught, she'll move on to someone else.
posted by 26.2 at 5:54 PM on September 8, 2013 [7 favorites]

I think this woman has a bigger problem than just being a crap human being. The repeated tattlings to your parents suggest she believes she's a participating member of your family...and also that she believes these things are true. In her mind, she's not telling lies, she's providing your parents with valuable information she expects them to act on.

Also, how does she know when you took time off and what you said it was for? Would there be any other way for her to know that besides from someone in your office? Like...her buddy the director?

So: sit down with the boss. Tell her that someone has been going to your parents with false and increasingly bizarre stories of bad work behavior - itemize the lies you know about, so she knows you know. So, obviously, you and your parents are very concerned about that situation in general, and also you're worried because it's likely these things are getting back to the office, so you wanted to open a line of communication with her just to make sure they get nipped in the bud as quickly as possible.

And if it is likely that she heard about why you went out of town from her or someone else there, ask if she could help you make sure the staff aren't sharing details of employees' leave and travel plans, or personal details in general, with people outside the office, as obviously that's unsafe.

Then, go back to your desk and email a recap of that conversation to her, so she understands you are not fucking around.

I think the director is at least listening to shit-talking behind your back, if not engaging in it. It's entirely possible she's acting different because she realizes it could very well bite her in the ass. She probably wasn't expecting Jane to go back to your parents with it.

Your parents need to start documenting past and any future incidents, and you need to do so as well. You could talk to a lawyer, I'm sure one would meet with you to discuss, but without better documentation I don't know that you'll get very far or be very protected if Jane escalates.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:35 PM on September 8, 2013 [7 favorites]

These types of people have a way of turning things against you. If you confront her, she will be coy, deny that she does these things, and promise that she has nothing but the best intentions for you. If you confront her in front of the director, she might make you look like you're making things up and that you're unnecessarily doubtful, which might corroborate what she is (probably) saying to the director.

My advice?

Professionally: Like the answers before me, I'll say that you should always document everything you do. Don't leave any doubt there is as to what you do and how you do it. Archive your e-mails, especially e-mail conversations with her.

Socially: If what you're saying is 100% accurate, then she is obviously getting back at you for something you've (unsuspectingly) done to her. That's why she is trying to tarnish your image in front of those who love/respect you. The best thing you can do is to ignore her. As for the director, I suggest you play it smart and spend time with her and periodically update her about you've done with your work so far, so that she knows what you're really all about.

If I were you, I would have my parents try and find out what she thinks her relationship to you is all about. From there they might discover some kind of past incident that pissed her off or if it's a general demeanor thing on your part that's grinding her gears. No matter what you do, never ever sever your ties with her (because it's easier for you to be cautious if you can always keep an eye on her) and never lose your temper or let her drag you into her game because you will definitely lose. Who knows, she might change someday if she notices how nice you always are. Nobody knows how these things turn out at the end.
posted by omar.a at 9:07 PM on September 8, 2013 [3 favorites]

Unless you have iron clad proof that she is lying, tread lightly. She is in the position to be able to argue from a logical high ground: if you get into a dispute, she can say "prove I'm lying". Which will be pretty much impossible for you. Surprise! You've lost credibility, she wins.

The times I've had these oddball situations, the only thing that worked is to disconnect and make a simple, direct statement to anyone affected along the lines of "I don't know what her problem is, but if what I've heard is true, the things she is saying about me are not true. It's up to you to figure out who you believe, and if you think she is telling the truth, ask her to prove just one of her stories. Beyond that, I've got nothing else to say. She doesn't like me for some reason, and I'm not going to get drawn into her web of insanity."

Believe this and live it. As far as you are concerned, she is nuts and you aren't going to let her get under your skin or indulge her machinations. Do your job the best you can, and be the bigger person.

Also, don't engage or defend yourself. Always diffuse and redirect. If she accuses you of lying about time off, don't try to prove you were telling the truth. Just blow it off with something like "it is none of anyone's business why I take my time off." She is the bad guy for getting in your business, so redirect her BS back toward what she is doing wrong. If she makes reports about your eating, turn it around: "why are you paying attention to what I'm eating? Mind your own business."

The goal is to make her gossip ineffective, whatever her motivation is. She is acting like a child, so treat her like one.
posted by gjc at 9:23 PM on September 8, 2013 [3 favorites]

Mod note: From the OP:

Thanks for your replies. There are a couple of complicating factors to the situation.

First, Jane and my boss are friends from church, and Jane routinely helps our non-profit office with a huge amount of donations and volunteer work. As far as I know, she likes to gossip about people in her personal circle, not with anyone in the office except me. I am not even sure if my boss will believe that her own friend is nuts.

The other problem is that Jane seems to feel no regret about the lies. When found out, she continues to visit my parents and after a while starts with the lies like she was never found out before. I am honestly scared of how she will escalate things if I confront her, call her out on her gossip, or address this issue in any way. For about 4 years I have been ignoring her, but since it's getting worse I guess ignoring is not an option either. It sounds dramatic but she is shamelessly lying and the shameless part is what freaks me out!

Thank you again

posted by taz (staff) at 3:43 AM on September 9, 2013

"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."

George Bernard Shaw nails it, I think. Do not engage Jane directly unless you want to get into pig wrestling territory and debate the merit of every lie she has told about you.

Compulsive liars do what they do for a variety of reasons, but ultimately they come unstuck because the lies have to get bigger, and the logic and internal fabric of the lies frays. They burn through friends, social groups and employers because eventually they need new territory to sow once they've polluted the one they're in. This will probably happen. I doubt people close to her are entirely unaware she is a ruthless gossip. Leaving things entirely be is an option if you think Jane is close to blowing up.

Alternatively, if you work in a small office that is part of a larger organisation, I'd go and have a consultation with your HR department and raise your issues in a "what is the form for dealing with this?" way. If you work in a smaller organisation and the only route of dealing directly is you going to your boss and testing her friendship with Jane then I'd resist engaging until you have proof that Jane is telling lies about you in a work mileu. I'd keep a note of what you discover, with times and dates. Your aim is to show that her behaviour is compulsive, irrational, targeted at you and damaging. But you do not want to have this discussion with Jane, even if it is mediated by a third party. Be clear on this. Do not let this be characterised as a two way fallout between people.

I'd try and be very, very dispassionate about discussing it if and when the time comes. Get into the mindset that this is happening to someone else and you are documenting it on their behalf. For better or worse, defensiveness often gets read as "no smoke without a fire." A former work colleague used to have a winning strategy: he cast his arguments as the voice of rationality and stayed calm under any and every provocation. He would often then discuss things he didn't agree with as "emotional arguments." And he was right - once someone starts to lose it and go all high pitched, regardless of whether they are right, they look like they are grasping. So if you really care about this, do not, DO NOT, rise to it. Stick to why it is damaging in a work scenario.

I think it's also worth working out why Jane is targeting you. I don't mean it's your fault. But understanding why she has selected you might give some insight into how the lies are positioned to others and for what possible gain.

Don't expect regret or shame. She tells a lot of lies. She doesn't have room to regret each one and has long since passed the point of justifying her behaviour to herself. She isn't you, so don't expect her to react like you.

Also: why are your parents still friends if they understand what she is doing?
posted by MuffinMan at 4:33 AM on September 9, 2013 [6 favorites]

This is one of the things I hate about the non-profit world.

That said, go to your director with raisingsand's script. If you don't get a warm fuzzy from it, start looking for another job.

The problem with insidious stuff like this is that because of the incestuous relationships in the organization, there is no-one who is impartial or disinterested.

Jane is fully insulated from her bullshit. And she continues with impunity.

The passive-aggressive way of dealing with it is to bring it all out into the the light and make fun of Jane.

"OMG, you won't believe what Jane told my PARENTS!"

"Jane Munchousen is at it again, you know what she's been saying about me now?"

Loud, often and with an attitude that says, "this is so obviously false that it's laughable, which is why I'm laughing."

But really, find a new job. The fact that this broad knows your parents, visits them and tells them lies about you means that your professional and personal lives are too intertwined.

That shit is just sick.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 5:59 AM on September 9, 2013 [2 favorites]

Could you ask advice from Jane's church leader? Perhaps they could think of something, or could pull her aside after a service and remind her of the whole "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour" thing.
posted by blueberry at 6:38 AM on September 9, 2013

If your boss is not willing to believe that Jane is lying, then I think you need to find a new job. This is way too serious not to address. I would not bother confronting Jane, but whenever you hear about a claim related to your job, you need to tell your boss.
posted by yarly at 7:07 AM on September 9, 2013

Mod note: This is a followup from the asker.

Hi again!

I just spoke to my supervisor and did indeed get a warm fuzzy. I used the script given by raisinsand (thank you!) and she thanked me for letting her know, and was totally bewildered by her behavior. She said it was totally made up that they had hired a replacement for me.

The reason my parents still see Jane is that they are very close friends with her husband, but they (and many others in that circle) have made it very clear that they do not want to have a friendship with Jane. Besides the gossiping Jane tends to be quite proselytizing, and most of the people in this circle are atheist and don’t like how insistent she can get.
My parents are going to speak to her husband today, since out of good manners they haven't brought this subject up to him before. They will ask him to please speak to his wife. We don’t want to confront her directly because well, she is nuts and could say we attacked her or something.

I cannot really think of anything I have done to her, except one of the first times I was freaked out by her was because she asked me what year I was born and got angry at me because she thought I was lying and I was actually born a decade earlier. I thought it was such a bizarre thing to get mad about, but with time I realized she is very sensitive about her age.

There may be something else that bothered her about me but frankly, I have no idea. We live in different worlds (she is a very religious homemaker, married with several teenage children, while I am an atheist, have no children and work full time, and whether she likes it or not she is 15 years older than me so we are in different stages in life). I have never judged her or her choices, and I have probably spoken to her fewer than ten times.

Anyway, thank you so much for your advice, I am happy at least my supervisor is aware, but I am still kind of concerned about what she will do when she finds out I am finally reacting to her lies.

posted by cortex (staff) at 7:15 AM on September 9, 2013 [4 favorites]

Her religious leader needs to know. Because it sounds to me like this woman has a serious mental or personality disorder, and needs help. But I would have your parents suggest that to the husband and let him talk to the pastor, if possible.
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 12:13 PM on September 9, 2013 [2 favorites]

she asked me what year I was born and got angry at me because she thought I was lying and I was actually born a decade earlier

FWIW people are the their own reference point for normal. She believes that habitual lying is normal - that you are like her.
posted by anonymisc at 4:07 PM on September 9, 2013 [1 favorite]