Effective way to get restaurant to change the name of a menu item.

April 5, 2013 1:30 AM

What is the most effective way to get a new locally owned restaurant to change the name of an item on their menu? [item name possibly NSFW so will be inside]

Description of item from menu -
"SWEET POONTANG BBQ: This is our mildest sauce. Sweet poontang has a smoky tangy flavor."

There are a couple other menu items that have suggestive names but nothing like that bbq sauce name. How do I go about getting the name of the item changed without coming off like an asshole (which I will do if it's necessary) and WITHOUT causing a ton of publicity on social media?

posted by fluffy battle kitten to Food & Drink (36 answers total)

Write a Yelp review, saying something like, it's a nice place, but too bad you could never take your family or a date there because they gave some of the dishes some pretty vulgar names.

I doubt one Yelp review would touch off a ton of social media publicity. And, business owners can get crazy about bad reviews. I remember once I posted a bad review purely just to warn other people away from one place. It didn't even occur to me that anything might come of it, but they contacted me through the site and I actually got a few hundred dollars refunded. Pretty shocking.
posted by cairdeas at 1:43 AM on April 5, 2013 [9 favorites]

Have you tried contacting the management directly? You don't have to be a jerk about it, just let them know that the menu item bothered you and that you think it could be bad for business. You could do this in person or through email if you can find one. If they're unresponsive, then I agree that Yelp is a good platform. I work for a small, local restaurant and we take Yelp reviews very seriously. But personally I wouldn't complain publicly without first approaching the management in private - give them a chance to respond, especially since it's a new place.
posted by rabbitbookworm at 2:02 AM on April 5, 2013 [7 favorites]

I would email them to let them know that you enjoyed what you had at their restaurant. Be specific if possible, mention why you liked it. Then, point out that you were a little taken aback by the language on their menu, and that, while you definitely would like to go back, you wouldn't feel comfortable bringing friends or recommending the place so as not to offend or embarrass those friends.

There is every chance that won't work. They might have it in their minds that they are being 'edgy' with their choices, and that they can afford to do without customers like yourself. If they are that full of themselves/mistaken, well, there's not much more you can do. If childish humor is more important to them than customers and their money, that's their choice.
posted by Ghidorah at 2:18 AM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

Is this place a family restaurant, or are they trying to be a Hooters-wannabe? It'll probably make a difference in their reaction: a family-oriented place is more likely to agree to change the menu names, whereas a Hooters-wannabe is going to be happy those names are getting attention: 'look how cool and hip and edgy we are!' (as opposed to 'look at what sexist racist jerks we are!').

I'd start with talking to the manager, but if that doesn't work move up to the Yelp reviews. But whatever route you go, Yelp reviews or talking directly to the manager or whatever, mention ALL of the offensive and suggestive names, so it's clear this is a pattern and not just one single (possibly accidently-named) menu item.
posted by easily confused at 2:50 AM on April 5, 2013 [3 favorites]

Personally, I don't see what the problem is. You can mount a public campaign against them, but that may well have the opposite effect of drawing more attention to the matter.

There's always going to be things in the world that you don't like or agree with. That is what the marketplace is for. You may not like pornography, but the reality is that there is a huge market for pornography. You may not like this sense of humour, but if it works for the restaurant – if there is a market for it – I do not see why they would change it.

Thus, the best solution is to vote with your feet – and by your feet I mean your wallet. Don't patron the establishment. Write management a letter letting them know why you are not spending money at the establishment. Find a restaurant with a menu that doesn't offend you and spend your money there.
posted by nickrussell at 3:44 AM on April 5, 2013 [26 favorites]

Googling for "Sweet Poontag BBQ" gets you the name of a place, which is in the same location as the OP. It's clearly a labor of love by the owner. Since they're a food truck, not an actual restaurant, they don't seem to have a Yelp review, just a testimonial page on their website, along with a Twitter feed.

You could shoot him a private Tweet or testimonial or use the contact form on his website. You could go up and talk to him personally. Since the guy is taking obvious pride in his handcrafted BBQ, talking to him work best. Don't make a big deal out of it, just mention that it bothers you and it makes you hesitant to recommend the place to other people.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:57 AM on April 5, 2013 [2 favorites]

Sweet Poontang BBQ is a dog whistle in bro-speak. If that marketing works for this place's target audience then I don't think you are going to get them to change it. Negative publicity at this point would be good publicity, because even in the unlikely event the masses gathered their pitchforks and converged on its physical or online site, they could just change the name and be the good guys.

Your best bet, IMHO, is to work out if there is a [female, probably] market for this place that is potentially put off by the bro-speak. If there is, and you can make the case, then you can write or speak directly to them about the commercial impact of their marketing. Put simply, they are alienating an audience of x size. They would have to agree that the real missed audience existed, and that it outweighed the group of people for whom the Poontang name is part the appeal.

I don't think you're going to succeed here, but if you want to give it a shot then I'd lay it out in commercial terms, politely, and add how much you and people like you would like to patronise their restaurant.
posted by MuffinMan at 4:13 AM on April 5, 2013 [4 favorites]

and add how much you and people like you would like to patronise their restaurant.

This is key. Have you actually tried their food, liked it, yet don't want to patronize the place again or recommend it? If you haven't tried the food, he's probably not going to listen to you.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:19 AM on April 5, 2013

There's always going to be things in the world that you don't like or agree with

Perhaps you missed the part where the restaurant compares its sauce to a vagina. For consumption.

Barbecue is a particularly male world. The menu is making a joke 'hehehe we said pussy! On our menu! Pussies are delicious!'

And you know what? In the right circumstances, they are. But not as a comparison to barbecue sauce. They are delicious in their own right and only to be enjoyed by those invited to partake.

The offensiveness is not removed just because it's not a super super common term.

Now. To actually answer the question. Yes, send an email to the owner of the restaurant. There is a small chance the name was suggested, maybe by the pit master or sauce guy. It's remotely possible the the owner doesn't know the meaning of the word. Give him the benefit of the doubt. Then onto social media.
posted by bilabial at 4:19 AM on April 5, 2013 [17 favorites]

they're a food truck, not an actual restaurant

Looking at the Twitter feed, it looks like there was a restaurant opened four days ago. Menu.

There's a 'kids' menu' component to the menu so... So yeah, maybe the guy running it actually does have no idea. I thought you had a lost cause when I saw the logo for the truck, but I imagine you would find a lot of support for what you want to do here given that 'kids' menu' section; they are apparently trying to run a family restaurant. Ask nicely, and then proceed along to the city section of your local newspaper if need be.
posted by kmennie at 4:29 AM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

I think it's amusing. Amusing and gross. Would I eat it? Probably. (I really like BBQ.)

It's a schtick, and it's this guy's prerogative what he calls the things that he makes. If he were selling the BBQ at a school or something, that'd be one thing. But as it is, he can name his BBQ anything he wants. The recourse you have is to not eat there.

If I were you, and totally upset by this, I would write him a letter as others have suggested, explaining that you like the food but find the names disgusting, and that you won't be eating there unless it's changed.

I think it'd also be fine to say the same thing on Facebook or twitter or whatever, but I think that would probably just get him publicity. (As this mefi post has done.)
posted by phunniemee at 4:34 AM on April 5, 2013 [3 favorites]

If it was the name of one menu item in a list of less objectionable names, you'd have a fighting chance. But the name of the establishment? Family Guy Fieri's here to stay.

People who say/write/advertise deliberately provocative things tend to respond to "this is offensive!" with "good, it works!" Instead I'd approach it from "this is crass and dumb and no one I know would willingly order something called 'Sweet Poontang,' so if you ever want to expand your clientele beyond crass dudebros, you should probably think about rebranding."

If the restaurant's in a location with a bunch of other small businesses, especially family-friendly ones, you might want to talk to some of the owners. They may be worried about losing business from families who don't feel like explaining to their kids what the hot pants sign across the street means.

If you have local friends who are similarly disgusted by the name, you could encourage them all to email the owner or leave short reviews on Yelp saying as much. Not to the extent of spamming, but it's harder to disregard five complaints than one.

None of this may work. I think it's a stupid name (and the sauce probably doesn't even taste like vagina, the liars), but there's not much chance you can get them to actually change.
posted by Metroid Baby at 5:16 AM on April 5, 2013

There is no effective way to do this without having a social media campaign behind it. It is one of his signature sauces, so I imagine he wanted to call it something cheeky. I mean, considering his logo, I imagine he sees himself as connected spiritually to Hooters.

The best you can do is write him a letter or speak to him in person and tell him why it offended you and that you really can't see bringing children in to eat his Poontang sauce so you can't come back.

Then stick to your guns.
posted by inturnaround at 5:34 AM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

The photos on their Facebook page feature of picture of the owner's young daughter, standing in front of the food truck menu board with her head (conveniently? ironically?) blocking out the offending word. Their urbanspoon page classifies the new brick-and-mortar joint as "kid friendly" and the whole vibe (aside from the sauce name and the daisy dukes in the logo for the sauce-and-rubs side of the business) seems to be more family-friendly/backyard barbecue than Hooters. The angle I would take would be to write to the owner and describe the awkward scenario of taking your favorite little (fictional if necessary) niece "who's just about your daughter's age" out to enjoy that great "family friendly" barbecue and facing the question: "what's a poontang, Aunt Maggie?"
posted by drlith at 5:37 AM on April 5, 2013 [9 favorites]

Kid friendly should include non-offensive names of the food, for crying out loud. Just calmly contact the manager/owner and express how much you like tye food but find the name offensive. Don't get mad, just tell them flatly how you feel.
posted by agregoli at 6:03 AM on April 5, 2013 [4 favorites]

Am I misreading the Google results, or is "Sweet Poontang" actually the name given to the sauce by the sauce manufacturer (http://www.bdgrilling.com/sauces.html), rather than a name hung on it by the individual restaurants? (I don't want to hotlink it.) I think the restaurants are just straightforwardly saying it's BBQ made with that brand of sauce.
posted by tyllwin at 6:19 AM on April 5, 2013 [9 favorites]

tyllwin is 100% right.

OP, your rage is directed at the wrong party. You need to pursue the manufacturer. Protesting is never as easy as you may think.
posted by Kruger5 at 6:22 AM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

Mod note: Don't argue with other commenters, please, and answer the question. If you don't have an answer for the question, you don't need to answer; this isn't an opinion poll.
posted by taz (staff) at 6:23 AM on April 5, 2013

Seconding MuffinMan that's a dog whistle. Though I think it goes beyond brospeak, as that phrase is most likely a reference to a Ted Nugent song. And if they're referencing Ted Nugent, that's a dog whistle for a very particular kind of big, dumb dog and odds are, they don't give two shits whether they're being sexist. They may even take a perverse pride in it which you would only inflame by voicing your objection.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:28 AM on April 5, 2013

If that is the manufacturer's brand name for the sauce, it is likely in the restaurant's best interest to advertise it as named. It may even be a part of their agreement with the supplier. If so, I suppose you are free to ask them to find a new supplier, although it appears that Big Dad's is a related entity. Out of curiosity, I checked the trademark office and while this phrase is not trademarked, there are several trademarks that do contain the word "poontang".

To answer your question more directly, I think that you are limited to voicing your complaint to the owner/manager of the restaurant. You are free not to eat there and recommend that your friends not eat there. In turn, the restaurant is free to ignore you and that is probably what will happen. That is the extent of your options if you are not interested in creating drama on social media.
posted by Tanizaki at 7:09 AM on April 5, 2013

The only way you're going to change their mind (about titling the entree with the trade name of the sauce) is if they don't know what it means. Which is possible; and in which case, it could be useful to call to the owner to say that you enjoyed the food but were embarrassed the whole time and can't bring your family back there because he's got a word that means "female genitals" on his menu.

But if he knows already, it means he thinks it's edgy and clever and appealing to his target market and he's not going to change it just because you said so. And in this case a social media campaign is going to backfire, I think -- you're likely to be caricatured, and any brouhaha you can drum up will be free publicity for the restaurant.

(To be clear, I am with you on this, aesthetically: I am a pottymouth myself, and I still find this sauce name gag-inducingly disgusting and wouldn't eat at a place that had it on the menu; nor would I expose my little girls to it. Barf!)
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:27 AM on April 5, 2013

I agree that this probably shouldn't be on a menu, but I don't necessarily agree that it is meant to be sexist or a dog-whistle to the bro-douche crowd. At least as far as the restaurant owner is concerned. I can see where someone could mean that name in a perfectly sincere (but yes, tongue in cheek) attempt at describing the experience of that particular sauce in a non-food patois. I mean, I think I know exactly what that sauce tastes like just by that description, and I'd probably find it delicious. It's not the first time I've heard the use of female body parts used to describe a delicious food. But I can equally see how someone would NOT see it that way and find the description disgusting and not complimentary toward women, despite the owner's intent. And that overrides any sincerity and non malicious ignorance on the owner's behalf.

I think the best thing to do is just voice your concerns in a pleasant and non-accusatory way. Something along the lines of "not everyone finds the evocation of oral sex and vaginal secretions to be appetizing. You might mean well by it, but you might consider changing the name to something less vivid. Would you feel hungry if a sausage and onion sandwich was called 'Tangy Jockstrap'?"
posted by gjc at 8:19 AM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

Best answer: I'm with the folks advising a short, polite message to the owner. I see he has responded to critical comments on their Facebook page with grace. It may or may not work. Count me among the potty-mouthed who would never in a hundred years order sweet poontang on my ribs.

Honestly, the whole thing kind of bums me out. My kid (10 year old girl) and I (woman) love BBQ. We're enthusiastic carnivores--I think cheeseburgers are God's own food-- and we're totally the target market for his restaurant. But this is the kind of thing that would make me go somewhere else, because the message is so... men eat BBQ, women are BBQ. Ugh.

The link in tyllwin's post is the web site for a company that runs a food truck, a newly opened burger joint and sells its sauces and rubs on the side. It's the owner's own BBQ sauce, not something from a separate manufacturer.
posted by looli at 9:14 AM on April 5, 2013 [11 favorites]

Oh. The "Between the Bun" restaurant and "Big Dad's Nappy-Q" (itself a cringe-inducing name) are the same guy? I hadn't spotted that, but you're right -- same twitter account. So, it's all one guy to complain to at least.
posted by tyllwin at 9:34 AM on April 5, 2013

Let the market chastise him. Or not.

Folks who find the name of this item objectionable probably won't go back. If you don't have stock in the food wagon, why make it your problem?
posted by mule98J at 9:59 AM on April 5, 2013 [3 favorites]

Agree, polite note or comment, and move on. But just one other point:
"They would have to agree that the real missed audience existed, and that it outweighed the group of people for whom the Poontang name is part the appeal."

Not quite, because that treats the bro audiences as all-or-nothing. If the guy were to quietly change his menu, I doubt he'd lose them all. "Hey, BD's not advertising poontang -- I'm outta here!" Actually there are plenty of BBQ places that don't use obscenties and do fine, including with that audience.
posted by LonnieK at 12:04 PM on April 5, 2013

The day after 9-11, the printing company the church I pastored at the time used put something abhorrent on their sign. I mean just terrible. I called the manager, had a conversation about it, where we both realized that what he actually wanted to communicate was something much different, something practically everyone could agree upon. He changed the sign that day without argument, and we kept doing business. I learned from this that people are often more reasonable and understanding than we fear they are.
posted by 4ster at 12:33 PM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

Privately: "Hey, what do you think about a different name for that sauce? I know what you're going for but there's a better way. It means a lot to me so I'll pay for new menus."
posted by michaelh at 1:00 PM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

Are you sure this isn't part of their branding strategy? Maybe they're trying to be "edgy" and signal that they are a hip and happening food truck appealing to trendy young people rather than a generic BBQ stand or a more family-friendly establishment.

I mean, I think it's dumb, would never order that, and would probably not go back in an eye-rolling "these people are trying way too hard" sort of way. But there are a lot of other people who would specifically bring all their friends there and giggle while ordering it and think it was the best thing in the world.

I think I would send an email or leave a Yelp review if it was a mistake (a typo on the menu that results in "shots" being referred to as "shits", for example) or if you were concerned that they might not know the provenance of the term. But "poontang sauce" seems both deliberate and unmistakeable.

Maybe you're just not their target market?

(See also Hooters, Pink Taco, Calexico Taco's "crack sauce" -- which is not NSFW but can't be a former addict's favorite thing to order -- and all those stupid bikini barista places.)
posted by Sara C. at 1:04 PM on April 5, 2013 [2 favorites]

For those who consider the word 'poontang' common brospeak, please note that it's more like the outright-offensive term 'cunt' than, say, 'broads' or something else mildly sexist and merely annoying. I'm not sure of its origin, but I do know it goes back to at least the Korean War, if not further, and originated with the disrespectful way white soldiers would refer to women in Asian countries.
posted by easily confused at 4:08 PM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

For clarification, I was under the impression poontang was more or less equivalent to pussy. Not exactly classy, but by no means the American version of cunt. I've also really only heard it used to refer to genitals (male and female), rather than to a woman or a negative description of a woman.

So that's why I can easily understand how it might be a relatively innocent (if ignorant) usage. If there are people who hear "cunt" when they hear "poontang", that's probably why there is such disagreement here- I think those people are a minority of the population.
posted by gjc at 7:31 PM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

It is analogous to "pussy" in that it's often used in a demeaning way, and also is something I probably wouldn't say in front of my grandmother or a small child.

I don't find it deeply upsetting and offensive, as a word -- though it does have extremely ugly roots -- just crass and disrespectful and not something I'm proud to have poking around in the language I speak.

It's analogous to them having a soy glaze on the menu called "gook sauce". Not UNSPEAKABLE HORROR, but definitely awful. I would be disturbed to see it on the menu, would absolutely by no means order it, would never eat there again (potentially even walking out if I noticed it before placing an order), and would insist to friends that we not go there -- probably even saying, "Oh, is that the place with racial slurs on the menu? Nope."

Though, as I said, I'm also aware that there's a whole demographic of crass assholes out there who are proud to patronize such restaurants.

This isn't a case of "but people might not know it has offensive roots" a la "gyp" or "welsh on a bet". It's a legitimately bothersome term that everybody would at least consider not fit for polite conversation, if not outright offensive.
posted by Sara C. at 7:45 PM on April 5, 2013 [2 favorites]

Response by poster: Thanks, everyone. I'm going to go talk to the owner on Monday (that's as soon as my schedule will allow.)
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 10:20 PM on April 5, 2013 [1 favorite]

If I wanted to name menu items, I'd own a restaurant. Otherwise, I'd either not patronize it, or ignore the issue.

Sooner or later, if the owner doesn't know already, he or she will determine whether the name you consider offensive is good for business, or bad for business, and adjust things accordingly, or not.

Man, I hate sounding like a free market libertarian, but that's how I see this.
posted by imjustsaying at 3:29 AM on April 6, 2013 [1 favorite]

Response by poster: Communicated with the owner today. It basically came down to him saying that the restaurant would call their products whatever they wanted and market it however they wanted. Which is fine. I don't disagree about him being able to name the product how he wants. I just wanted him to consider the context of having the product on a menu at a kid-friendly place. I don't actually think he thought about the context one little bit but that's up to him and I just won't go to the place. I'm not going to turn it into some kind of hate-filled fight or anything.

(In the meantime, over the weekend somebody (not me) complained about the same issue on urbanspoon.)

This bums me out because I really do like supporting local businesses.

Thanks to everyone again for your answers. I think I was mostly wanting to get myself away from having a loud knee-jerk reaction.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 8:45 PM on April 8, 2013 [6 favorites]

You are awesome. I just want to chime in here to say that I think being ok with any outcome, and coming at the conversation from a calm and cool place is really admirable.

Thanks for the update!
posted by bilabial at 7:49 AM on April 10, 2013 [1 favorite]