Guesswork
May 17, 2012 8:55 PM Subscribe
My friend-with-benefits rarely texts me or asks to see me. So I think he's probably not that into it. But then he spends hours fixing things around the house for me. What would explain this?
I've been friends with a guy for a couple of years. We are both in our 30s. Initially he seemed romantically interested, and there was always attraction between us. But there were a couple of times I got really peeved that he took a joke too far, and we settled into being friends.
Last year we became friends-with-benefits at my initiation. After we started being physical, I realized that I might want to date him, but I wasn't sure. So I wanted to spend more time together to figure out how I felt. I texted him little cute messages frequently, but he ignored many of them. I also initiated seeing each other more often than he did. I eventually got annoyed at his lack of responsiveness and blew him off for a few months.
He asked me to hang out a few times recently, and we started up the friends-with-benefits again. Now I am infatuated again. He has been coming over every couple of weeks and spending hours fixing things in my apartment, assembling furniture, installing electronics.
I've been initiating almost all of the times we've seen each other in the past couple of months. For a while, I texted him every day or two, and pestered him if he didn't reply within a few hours. Then I stopped, to see how often he contacts me. He let many days go by without talking to me at all.
I want to figure out whether he likes me or not. He seems sweet and nervous when we are together in person, and spends several hours each time helping me around the house. But then he rarely texts me or asks me to hang out.
I'm scared to just come out and ask, in case it is blindingly obvious with many glaring clues that he's not that into it. If that's the case, I'd rather just let it fade quietly back into friendship.
Any advice?
I've been friends with a guy for a couple of years. We are both in our 30s. Initially he seemed romantically interested, and there was always attraction between us. But there were a couple of times I got really peeved that he took a joke too far, and we settled into being friends.
Last year we became friends-with-benefits at my initiation. After we started being physical, I realized that I might want to date him, but I wasn't sure. So I wanted to spend more time together to figure out how I felt. I texted him little cute messages frequently, but he ignored many of them. I also initiated seeing each other more often than he did. I eventually got annoyed at his lack of responsiveness and blew him off for a few months.
He asked me to hang out a few times recently, and we started up the friends-with-benefits again. Now I am infatuated again. He has been coming over every couple of weeks and spending hours fixing things in my apartment, assembling furniture, installing electronics.
I've been initiating almost all of the times we've seen each other in the past couple of months. For a while, I texted him every day or two, and pestered him if he didn't reply within a few hours. Then I stopped, to see how often he contacts me. He let many days go by without talking to me at all.
I want to figure out whether he likes me or not. He seems sweet and nervous when we are together in person, and spends several hours each time helping me around the house. But then he rarely texts me or asks me to hang out.
I'm scared to just come out and ask, in case it is blindingly obvious with many glaring clues that he's not that into it. If that's the case, I'd rather just let it fade quietly back into friendship.
Any advice?
Maybe he likes to fix things? Maybe he fixes things for his friends? But if he's not making an effort to see you, and he ignores your attempts to create greater intimacy, my diagnosis would be that he enjoys being friends with benefits, but is not interested in a romantic relationship. The only way to know for sure, however, is to ask him.
posted by decathecting at 9:01 PM on May 17, 2012 [6 favorites]
posted by decathecting at 9:01 PM on May 17, 2012 [6 favorites]
People have different love languages. His may be acts of service; your preferred method may be constant communication.
Ultimately, I think it's better to know, because it moves you closer to the people who want you unconditionally. Ask him. YMMV.
posted by These Birds of a Feather at 9:01 PM on May 17, 2012 [35 favorites]
Ultimately, I think it's better to know, because it moves you closer to the people who want you unconditionally. Ask him. YMMV.
posted by These Birds of a Feather at 9:01 PM on May 17, 2012 [35 favorites]
It sounds like you are his placeholder. He enjoys your company but is hoping to meet someone else.
posted by myselfasme at 9:02 PM on May 17, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by myselfasme at 9:02 PM on May 17, 2012 [3 favorites]
There are a couple possible explanations for his behavior. One, you have defined your relationship as a friends with benefits relationship, and that is how he is acting because that is the option he was presented with. Two, all he wants is to be friends with benefits.
Actually, there may be a million more possible explanations. Humans are complicated. But, none of that matters.
Look, you obviously can't handle being friends with benefits with this guy. You want a relationship. So ask if he likes you and find out where you stand. If he's not romantically interested, then you go back to being platonic friends.
posted by J. Wilson at 9:03 PM on May 17, 2012 [3 favorites]
Actually, there may be a million more possible explanations. Humans are complicated. But, none of that matters.
Look, you obviously can't handle being friends with benefits with this guy. You want a relationship. So ask if he likes you and find out where you stand. If he's not romantically interested, then you go back to being platonic friends.
posted by J. Wilson at 9:03 PM on May 17, 2012 [3 favorites]
I'd say it's hard knowing without asking.
posted by feistycakes at 9:03 PM on May 17, 2012 [10 favorites]
posted by feistycakes at 9:03 PM on May 17, 2012 [10 favorites]
Sometimes people are inattentive or inconsistent, especially in a friends-with-benefits situation, when they have other responsibilities tugging at them that take precedence, such work or family. Honestly, though, the only way you will know for sure is to take the leap and ask. That could be tomorrow or a month from now, but I suspect if you just let it "fade quietly," a part of you will always wonder "what if." Best of luck!
posted by katemcd at 9:04 PM on May 17, 2012
posted by katemcd at 9:04 PM on May 17, 2012
There's no way you will find out without coming out and asking him directly.
posted by karlos at 9:04 PM on May 17, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by karlos at 9:04 PM on May 17, 2012 [4 favorites]
I should add -- if you're genuinely as ambivalent as you say (which I question), then that's a pretty good sign that you don't really want to be with him and you should listen to it.
posted by J. Wilson at 9:04 PM on May 17, 2012
posted by J. Wilson at 9:04 PM on May 17, 2012
There are literally thousands of perfectly rational reasons he acts the way he does.
The only way to suss out which among those applies is to ask him.
He might lie. He might not know himself. He might have conflicting ideas. He might never have put too much thought into it. Asking him is fraught with peril.
But it is the only way to know what is in his head; we can only guess.
posted by Pogo_Fuzzybutt at 9:19 PM on May 17, 2012 [1 favorite]
The only way to suss out which among those applies is to ask him.
He might lie. He might not know himself. He might have conflicting ideas. He might never have put too much thought into it. Asking him is fraught with peril.
But it is the only way to know what is in his head; we can only guess.
posted by Pogo_Fuzzybutt at 9:19 PM on May 17, 2012 [1 favorite]
He fixes things for you because you're his friend and he likes you. He doesn't call so often because he's your fuckbuddy, not your boyfriend, and he doesn't want to give you the impression that he wants to be your boyfriend.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:20 PM on May 17, 2012 [20 favorites]
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:20 PM on May 17, 2012 [20 favorites]
Yeah, this is well within the norms of F/W/B "relationships." It's casual, there is no pressure to spend time together or be particularly specific about what's going on between you or what it all means. Those aspects are sort of the point of engaging in that kind of relationship; whether that's a feature or a bug depends on what you want out of it.
If you are OK with continuing roughly in the current pattern you guys have established, then roll with it and don't overthink it. If you want something more / different, you have to ask, and you run the risk of losing the friendship and/or the benefits.
I don't really think there's more to it than that.
posted by Joey Buttafoucault at 9:26 PM on May 17, 2012 [3 favorites]
If you are OK with continuing roughly in the current pattern you guys have established, then roll with it and don't overthink it. If you want something more / different, you have to ask, and you run the risk of losing the friendship and/or the benefits.
I don't really think there's more to it than that.
posted by Joey Buttafoucault at 9:26 PM on May 17, 2012 [3 favorites]
He doesn't want to be your boyfriend. Sometimes he wants to stop by and have sex, and sometimes he wants to stop by and help you out with carpentry or whatever, but I assure you that if he wanted to be your boyfriend, he'd call you and you wouldn't have to "pester" him to come over and have sex.
I'm sorry this didn't turn out the way you wanted it to.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:32 PM on May 17, 2012 [8 favorites]
I'm sorry this didn't turn out the way you wanted it to.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:32 PM on May 17, 2012 [8 favorites]
There is no such thing as mixed signals, ESPECIALLY in your 30s when people are generally done being scared of their potential romantic partners. Since he's giving you some signals that he doesn't want to be your boyfriend, that means that he doesn't want to be your boyfriend. The signals that appear to counter this are meaningless.
posted by Kololo at 9:33 PM on May 17, 2012 [10 favorites]
posted by Kololo at 9:33 PM on May 17, 2012 [10 favorites]
I'm surprised so many people think they know why he's acting like this (ie, he just doesn't care), but I'm also surprised at the idea that there's no way of knowing unless you ask. The latter is partly true, but mostly because you gave so little info about his personality. People's personalities (which help determine their 'love language' and other behavior patterns) is what you'd use to determine why they act the way they do. That is also the only way to know outside asking; asking sometimes doesn't help as much 'cause often enough people aren't fully cognizant of the whys of their behavior or of their true desires.
Anyway, in no way is it true that attraction = calling and asking someone out (given you're in an ambiguous sexual relationship). Is he a dominant macho guy or a sweet, shy guy who isn't sure where he stands, exactly? If the latter, you'd be ill advised to expect him to act like the former. Many people (generally introverts) don't respond well to frequent contact-- by 'well' I mean 'how the extravert expects'. That is, introverts are often socially 'passive' and tend to avoid contact over-stimulation and put off responding 'cause it's overwhelming to be bugged so often. I don't care who you are, for instance-- I need my space. If contacted too often, I will put off replying and keep up my own pace. My own pace involves going days without talking to people in general. This means nothing in regards to how much I like you or not, one way or the other. Of course, this is neither here nor there if he's not introverted, which is why I said personality matters.
In any case, frequency of contact is a particularly bad way to gauge the interest of many people, unless you can compare it to the degree of contact a person has with other people in their life. Fixing things is a big step, even in friendship-- people aren't that altruistic. If they keep doing things for you, it's 'cause they're fond of you, not 'cause they're fond of work. It's a typically 'non-verbal male' mode of attention, as well-- many guys who're not super-expressive will 'do stuff' with their hands to express themselves (this includes both sex and carpentry). You have to observe his reactions to your communications-- like, try being cute in person and see what expression he has. Don't expect him to respond in kind. If he smiles a little, it's a good sign. However, regardless of his interest, it seems he's not the kind of guy who'll reciprocate in the way you want, so decide if you really would be okay with his behavior given that he also likes you, because it's likely to be tied to his personality rather than level of interest. Plenty of guys exist who would either play 'the game' to hook you (if they wanted sex) or ignore you utterly (if they didn't). Since he still pays you attention and does stuff for you, this rules him out as one of 'those guys'. However, it also means he's not about to say cutesy stuff or match your pace.
posted by reenka at 9:51 PM on May 17, 2012 [11 favorites]
Anyway, in no way is it true that attraction = calling and asking someone out (given you're in an ambiguous sexual relationship). Is he a dominant macho guy or a sweet, shy guy who isn't sure where he stands, exactly? If the latter, you'd be ill advised to expect him to act like the former. Many people (generally introverts) don't respond well to frequent contact-- by 'well' I mean 'how the extravert expects'. That is, introverts are often socially 'passive' and tend to avoid contact over-stimulation and put off responding 'cause it's overwhelming to be bugged so often. I don't care who you are, for instance-- I need my space. If contacted too often, I will put off replying and keep up my own pace. My own pace involves going days without talking to people in general. This means nothing in regards to how much I like you or not, one way or the other. Of course, this is neither here nor there if he's not introverted, which is why I said personality matters.
In any case, frequency of contact is a particularly bad way to gauge the interest of many people, unless you can compare it to the degree of contact a person has with other people in their life. Fixing things is a big step, even in friendship-- people aren't that altruistic. If they keep doing things for you, it's 'cause they're fond of you, not 'cause they're fond of work. It's a typically 'non-verbal male' mode of attention, as well-- many guys who're not super-expressive will 'do stuff' with their hands to express themselves (this includes both sex and carpentry). You have to observe his reactions to your communications-- like, try being cute in person and see what expression he has. Don't expect him to respond in kind. If he smiles a little, it's a good sign. However, regardless of his interest, it seems he's not the kind of guy who'll reciprocate in the way you want, so decide if you really would be okay with his behavior given that he also likes you, because it's likely to be tied to his personality rather than level of interest. Plenty of guys exist who would either play 'the game' to hook you (if they wanted sex) or ignore you utterly (if they didn't). Since he still pays you attention and does stuff for you, this rules him out as one of 'those guys'. However, it also means he's not about to say cutesy stuff or match your pace.
posted by reenka at 9:51 PM on May 17, 2012 [11 favorites]
He asked me to hang out a few times recently, and we started up the friends-with-benefits again. Now I am infatuated again. He has been coming over every couple of weeks and spending hours fixing things in my apartment, assembling furniture, installing electronics.
What's not to like here? You can end it if you wish, but what business has anyone else telling you to end it?
People are constantly living in the past, predicting the future, or comparing your life to theirs. Enjoy it for what it is. Let it be. Let it grow.
posted by weapons-grade pandemonium at 10:00 PM on May 17, 2012 [4 favorites]
What's not to like here? You can end it if you wish, but what business has anyone else telling you to end it?
People are constantly living in the past, predicting the future, or comparing your life to theirs. Enjoy it for what it is. Let it be. Let it grow.
posted by weapons-grade pandemonium at 10:00 PM on May 17, 2012 [4 favorites]
Maybe he doesn't like texting as a form of communication.
posted by desuetude at 10:13 PM on May 17, 2012 [9 favorites]
posted by desuetude at 10:13 PM on May 17, 2012 [9 favorites]
totally 100% agree with These Birds of A Feather. people have different ways of communicating their love and affection. i guarantee you that your fellow doesn't spend hours upon hours being Mr. Fix It for other folks. there aren't enough hours in the day, right?
he's probably not so good or just really uncomfortable verbalizing his love, or believes that some truths are self-evident.
a few myers-briggs personality types spring to mind here: INTPs, INTJs...
i agree with folks who are saying he may not want anything beyond a FWB relationship. but he obviously cares about you. fixing up your house = making your home even homier, which in turns = guardianship. he's being protective of you.
he is not just using you for sex. give this guy some credit.
posted by chyeahokay at 10:16 PM on May 17, 2012 [3 favorites]
he's probably not so good or just really uncomfortable verbalizing his love, or believes that some truths are self-evident.
a few myers-briggs personality types spring to mind here: INTPs, INTJs...
i agree with folks who are saying he may not want anything beyond a FWB relationship. but he obviously cares about you. fixing up your house = making your home even homier, which in turns = guardianship. he's being protective of you.
he is not just using you for sex. give this guy some credit.
posted by chyeahokay at 10:16 PM on May 17, 2012 [3 favorites]
What is his other dating and relationship history?
You keep initiating things, but as far as I read you two have never been on an actual date. But, he follows your leads.
He likes you. He keeps helping around the house to spend time with you and 'pay you back'. He doesn't know what to do.
You do. Do it. Good luck.
posted by caclwmr4 at 10:43 PM on May 17, 2012
You keep initiating things, but as far as I read you two have never been on an actual date. But, he follows your leads.
He likes you. He keeps helping around the house to spend time with you and 'pay you back'. He doesn't know what to do.
You do. Do it. Good luck.
posted by caclwmr4 at 10:43 PM on May 17, 2012
One thing that no one has pointed out yet is that many guys in FWB situations feel like they "owe" the woman for the sex. I guess it probably has to do with society's notion that men have to earn sex, while women aren't supposed to enjoy sex for its own sake and instead hold it over men's heads.
Regardless, I've had several FBs who felt the need to "repay" me for my services, as it were. Usually it was just an insistence in taking me out for dinner/lunch first or what have you, but I had one guy continually give me gifts, and another who kept doing shit to my car when I came over (oil changes, filling the gas tank, etc). I didn't turn them down since it obviously made them feel better about the arrangement (and hey, free shit), but it was common enough to be a trend.
So yeah, this guy could very well like you and not be expressive about it. But he could also just feel like he owes you for the sex and attention. Your best bet is to ask him right out, I think, but if you are emotionally involved, it's really not a good FWB for you. You should either see if he wants to make the jump to relationship status, or dial it back to "just friends". Otherwise the emotional wringer just won't be worth it.
posted by internet!Hannah at 11:20 PM on May 17, 2012 [18 favorites]
Regardless, I've had several FBs who felt the need to "repay" me for my services, as it were. Usually it was just an insistence in taking me out for dinner/lunch first or what have you, but I had one guy continually give me gifts, and another who kept doing shit to my car when I came over (oil changes, filling the gas tank, etc). I didn't turn them down since it obviously made them feel better about the arrangement (and hey, free shit), but it was common enough to be a trend.
So yeah, this guy could very well like you and not be expressive about it. But he could also just feel like he owes you for the sex and attention. Your best bet is to ask him right out, I think, but if you are emotionally involved, it's really not a good FWB for you. You should either see if he wants to make the jump to relationship status, or dial it back to "just friends". Otherwise the emotional wringer just won't be worth it.
posted by internet!Hannah at 11:20 PM on May 17, 2012 [18 favorites]
Just ask. I've known women to fall into patterns of literal YEARS of this not-quite-relationship nonsense in order to avoid rocking the boat, telling themselves all kinds of speculative lies about what XYZ gesture could maybe mean, only to then find themselves devastated when the guy in question meets someone he wants to commit to and takes off.
Interpreting his behavior rather than just asking him what he wants from your interaction could be misleading and heartbreaking. (Seriously, I have had many conversations with guy friends who do everything they can to keep a nice-enough girl around without expressly admitting they don't see her as being a "relationship." Not saying that is your guy, fixing things could in fact be his love language. It could also be him trying not to feel like a creep for just enjoying the arrangement, staying in your good graces, without actually using official commitment words, so he can have an out later.) Or it could be his love language and he could be really relieved you brought it up, because he wasn't sure you were interested in more.
How much time do you have? Can you live with the possibility of him admitting he doesn't want a relationship? If not, is the time with him you can buy by not rocking the boat worth whatever pain you may feel if you keep falling for him, then he finds someone he wants to be in a relationship with? Weigh those things out. Proceed accordingly.
posted by OompaLoompa at 11:48 PM on May 17, 2012 [7 favorites]
Interpreting his behavior rather than just asking him what he wants from your interaction could be misleading and heartbreaking. (Seriously, I have had many conversations with guy friends who do everything they can to keep a nice-enough girl around without expressly admitting they don't see her as being a "relationship." Not saying that is your guy, fixing things could in fact be his love language. It could also be him trying not to feel like a creep for just enjoying the arrangement, staying in your good graces, without actually using official commitment words, so he can have an out later.) Or it could be his love language and he could be really relieved you brought it up, because he wasn't sure you were interested in more.
How much time do you have? Can you live with the possibility of him admitting he doesn't want a relationship? If not, is the time with him you can buy by not rocking the boat worth whatever pain you may feel if you keep falling for him, then he finds someone he wants to be in a relationship with? Weigh those things out. Proceed accordingly.
posted by OompaLoompa at 11:48 PM on May 17, 2012 [7 favorites]
I want to figure out whether he likes me or not.
Perhaps you should ask him?
Lots of guys have huge trouble expressing themselves. he might be crazy about you.
posted by LarryC at 1:08 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
Perhaps you should ask him?
Lots of guys have huge trouble expressing themselves. he might be crazy about you.
posted by LarryC at 1:08 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
some men, especially men who like to fix things with their hands, tend to extremely dislike pointless communication through texting and/or telephone calls with no point. I am like this.
I like fixing things.
I hate texting.
I don't "chat" on the phone ... I use the phone to convey a message.
posted by jannw at 3:01 AM on May 18, 2012 [9 favorites]
I like fixing things.
I hate texting.
I don't "chat" on the phone ... I use the phone to convey a message.
posted by jannw at 3:01 AM on May 18, 2012 [9 favorites]
My friends know that the easiest way to get their flatpack furniture put together is to just tell me that it is there and needs to be put together. I really enjoy assembling it and will rush over (assuming I am not busy) and put it together. I mean it is like a jigsaw puzzle but instead of at the end getting to look at a picture before you just break it up again you get a desk, or a table, or a bookshelf. I'm not romantically involved with these friends and have even put things together for male friends because I actually enjoy doing it. The electronic fiddling I don't enjoy as much, but again it is the cost of being a geek and being able to do things for yourself.
posted by koolkat at 3:39 AM on May 18, 2012
posted by koolkat at 3:39 AM on May 18, 2012
Maybe he just doesn't like to text. Maybe he doesn't love constant contact. Maybe he likes his short time with you but then needs to be away from you. Maybe you hurt him and he doesn't want to be hurt. Maybe he just likes the FWB situation. Maybe maybe maybe. Just ask. It may not give you the answer you want, but then at least you will know.
posted by Yellow at 5:20 AM on May 18, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by Yellow at 5:20 AM on May 18, 2012 [2 favorites]
I've been initiating almost all of the times we've seen each other in the past couple of months. For a while, I texted him every day or two, and pestered him if he didn't reply within a few hours. Then I stopped, to see how often he contacts me. He let many days go by without talking to me at all.
You two are playing hard to get with one another.
posted by Ironmouth at 6:13 AM on May 18, 2012 [3 favorites]
You two are playing hard to get with one another.
posted by Ironmouth at 6:13 AM on May 18, 2012 [3 favorites]
Once you accept the concept of friends with benefits, meaning (1) you're friends, (2) you have sex, but (3) you aren't dating or planning on dating, I'm not sure how anything you're describing isn't completely consistent with that.
That somebody hooks up your electronics and helps you around the house certainly indicates he's your pal, as mentioned above, but it's perfectly consistent with being fond of you as a friend. There's nothing in your description that makes it sound to me like he has any romantic interest at all, other than the fact that you're having sex, and if that makes it romantic as opposed to FWB, then what's FWB?
I mean, if your question were, "Does he just want to have sex with me, or does he like me as a person?", I think I'd say, "He seems to like you as a person enough to want to hang out and help you out as friends do." But if your question is whether his fondness is romantic or platonic, unless you believe the sex makes it romantic (in which case FWB doesn't exist), why would you think it's romantic? You're talking about somebody who comes over to help you out around the house every couple of weeks? And rarely initiates contact?
I do think he's your friend. But I don't think he wants to be your boyfriend. If you're going to continue to want that, I'd end the sex, which seems to be confusing you a little (understandably).
posted by Linda_Holmes at 6:24 AM on May 18, 2012 [5 favorites]
That somebody hooks up your electronics and helps you around the house certainly indicates he's your pal, as mentioned above, but it's perfectly consistent with being fond of you as a friend. There's nothing in your description that makes it sound to me like he has any romantic interest at all, other than the fact that you're having sex, and if that makes it romantic as opposed to FWB, then what's FWB?
I mean, if your question were, "Does he just want to have sex with me, or does he like me as a person?", I think I'd say, "He seems to like you as a person enough to want to hang out and help you out as friends do." But if your question is whether his fondness is romantic or platonic, unless you believe the sex makes it romantic (in which case FWB doesn't exist), why would you think it's romantic? You're talking about somebody who comes over to help you out around the house every couple of weeks? And rarely initiates contact?
I do think he's your friend. But I don't think he wants to be your boyfriend. If you're going to continue to want that, I'd end the sex, which seems to be confusing you a little (understandably).
posted by Linda_Holmes at 6:24 AM on May 18, 2012 [5 favorites]
Male here, totally agreeing with Sidhedevil. He likes you as a friend. He enjoys hanging out with you. He enjoys fixing stuff. He doesn't like texting or talking on the phone much. He's OK with the benefits part, but isn't all that into it.
This pattern of talking once a week or so, and getting together every few weeks, frequently organized around doing some kind of project, is perfectly normal behavior in male-male friendships. He's treating you almost exactly like he would a male friend, plus benefits.
You can talk to him about this. One thing I want to emphasize is explain how you feel about this, and see how he responds and what he thinks and feels about it. (And you probably should, because reenka's interpretation might be right, even though I'm skeptical.) If your feelings aren't reciprocated, you probably should go back to just being friends.
posted by nangar at 6:43 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
This pattern of talking once a week or so, and getting together every few weeks, frequently organized around doing some kind of project, is perfectly normal behavior in male-male friendships. He's treating you almost exactly like he would a male friend, plus benefits.
You can talk to him about this. One thing I want to emphasize is explain how you feel about this, and see how he responds and what he thinks and feels about it. (And you probably should, because reenka's interpretation might be right, even though I'm skeptical.) If your feelings aren't reciprocated, you probably should go back to just being friends.
posted by nangar at 6:43 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
Just for a point of reference (and to maybe dissuade you from believing what the majority here seem to think, that this man is totally happy with the current situation): As others have mentioned, people show affection in all sorts of ways. My sister's boyfriend, when I tell the story, sounds like your dude. He seems aloof to her texts. He doesn't initiate contact. If she decided to blow him off it would most likely take a month before he got up the balls to call her. And this dude is in his 40s. The point is, they speak two opposite languages of love. She needs to be TOLD that he loves her and shown that with hugs and kisses and texts. He seems to be physically incapable of those sorts of things. Plus, he's been shit on in the past (as your man may very well have been also) and those sorts of things, verbalizing his feelings for her, make him incredibly nervous. So much so that even though he feels it and should be doing it, he just can't. It's not in him.
What is in him, however, is the ability to show his love for her with acts of service, as mentioned above. He'll fix her sink (and mine, when I asked). He'll start and warm up her car in the mornings in the winter. He'll change her lightbulbs unprompted and check the batteries in her smoke detectors so she's safe. He'll move her out of her house into a new one without a complaint. THIS is how he shows he cares for her. This is not her language so at times, they're trying to muddle through a situation in which she feels unloved but really, he loves her immensely, it's just that he shows her differently.
Look, I'm not a dude. I don't know what penises think. But as a female, I can say this. My last boyfriend was all about the words, telling me he loved me every 8 seconds, but when it came down to "Hey babe, I've got this tv stand, can you help me?" he was out the door. It's far easier to SAY something about your affection for someone than it is to ACT it out. I mean, I ain't rushing over to help my fuck buddies put together stuff (I might be a dick, though).
tl;dr: Just ask the man what he thinks about a relationship. And make sure that you'll be okay with the answer, yes or no, before you ask. But I'm leaning on the side that his acts of service to you mean that he does care for you...
posted by youandiandaflame at 6:50 AM on May 18, 2012
What is in him, however, is the ability to show his love for her with acts of service, as mentioned above. He'll fix her sink (and mine, when I asked). He'll start and warm up her car in the mornings in the winter. He'll change her lightbulbs unprompted and check the batteries in her smoke detectors so she's safe. He'll move her out of her house into a new one without a complaint. THIS is how he shows he cares for her. This is not her language so at times, they're trying to muddle through a situation in which she feels unloved but really, he loves her immensely, it's just that he shows her differently.
Look, I'm not a dude. I don't know what penises think. But as a female, I can say this. My last boyfriend was all about the words, telling me he loved me every 8 seconds, but when it came down to "Hey babe, I've got this tv stand, can you help me?" he was out the door. It's far easier to SAY something about your affection for someone than it is to ACT it out. I mean, I ain't rushing over to help my fuck buddies put together stuff (I might be a dick, though).
tl;dr: Just ask the man what he thinks about a relationship. And make sure that you'll be okay with the answer, yes or no, before you ask. But I'm leaning on the side that his acts of service to you mean that he does care for you...
posted by youandiandaflame at 6:50 AM on May 18, 2012
You started this as a no-strings situation and now you're wondering why he isn't showing any "strings"?
He's probably finding you just as confusing. Say what you want. Stop expecting him to read your mind.
posted by spaltavian at 7:07 AM on May 18, 2012 [2 favorites]
He's probably finding you just as confusing. Say what you want. Stop expecting him to read your mind.
posted by spaltavian at 7:07 AM on May 18, 2012 [2 favorites]
I guess I should clarify a little bit. I totally agree with other commenters that helping with stuff is an expression of affection. The thing is, this is frequently how heterosexual guys express affection for each other. It's not necessarily an indication of romantic interest; it doesn't rule it out either.
So, yeah, talk to him.
posted by nangar at 7:20 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
So, yeah, talk to him.
posted by nangar at 7:20 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
If you are not dating other people, you are wasting your time. You're not 21, you're in your 30s. If you ultimately want a relationship with someone, you're past the "fucking around" age. Look for someone who can give you want you want, or you'll be 40 and single, and frankly the older a woman gets, the harder it is to find a mate. It shouldn't be that way, but it's a brutal truth.
This guy does not want to date you or he would ask you. My husband jumped at the chance to hook up my mom's wireless router and fix her car. I am 100% certain that he's not romantically interested in my mother. He just likes being helpful.
posted by desjardins at 8:18 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
This guy does not want to date you or he would ask you. My husband jumped at the chance to hook up my mom's wireless router and fix her car. I am 100% certain that he's not romantically interested in my mother. He just likes being helpful.
posted by desjardins at 8:18 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
People aren't smoke signals. They don't need to be decoded.
That's the problem with playing games, with having buckets of unstated expectations. It treats other people like they're mysteries, ignoring the fact that we have this wonderful tool--language!--which can help you get to the truth of this very matter.
The reason, I think, that people are reluctant to ask because it means facing rejection. As long as you don't ask, you can pretend that you don't really want a relationship. Which would be fine, I guess, if it were true. But the way you're judging this guy's actions reveals that it's not really the case. You're analyzing everything from text frequently to furniture assembly through the lens that it might mean he wants to be with you.
Eventually, if you keep going down this road, you'll put yourself in a situation where you're devising a series of little tests that are almost impossible for him to pass, because they're rooted in insecurity (yours) and he doesn't even know that he's being tested. This is the problem with He's Not That Into You rhetoric. It's not just that it's kind of sexist (though I like the emphasis on a woman's individual needs--really, it's okay to want a relationship!). It's that most reasonable people, male or female, don't know that you're evaluating them by a million teeny tiny standards and you'll be excluding good partners based on totally reasonable early relationship behaviors.
So, talk to him. We can't tell you what any of this means, and yes, it's scary, and yes, it means that you need to decide whether you're really willing to hang around if he just wants to keep it casual. But he's not an animal, and he's not a secret code that only a few Anasazi-speaking mefites can crack. He's a person, and the bet way to know what's in his heart is to ask.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 8:26 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
That's the problem with playing games, with having buckets of unstated expectations. It treats other people like they're mysteries, ignoring the fact that we have this wonderful tool--language!--which can help you get to the truth of this very matter.
The reason, I think, that people are reluctant to ask because it means facing rejection. As long as you don't ask, you can pretend that you don't really want a relationship. Which would be fine, I guess, if it were true. But the way you're judging this guy's actions reveals that it's not really the case. You're analyzing everything from text frequently to furniture assembly through the lens that it might mean he wants to be with you.
Eventually, if you keep going down this road, you'll put yourself in a situation where you're devising a series of little tests that are almost impossible for him to pass, because they're rooted in insecurity (yours) and he doesn't even know that he's being tested. This is the problem with He's Not That Into You rhetoric. It's not just that it's kind of sexist (though I like the emphasis on a woman's individual needs--really, it's okay to want a relationship!). It's that most reasonable people, male or female, don't know that you're evaluating them by a million teeny tiny standards and you'll be excluding good partners based on totally reasonable early relationship behaviors.
So, talk to him. We can't tell you what any of this means, and yes, it's scary, and yes, it means that you need to decide whether you're really willing to hang around if he just wants to keep it casual. But he's not an animal, and he's not a secret code that only a few Anasazi-speaking mefites can crack. He's a person, and the bet way to know what's in his heart is to ask.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 8:26 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
You have a friend with benefits. You want a boyfriend. He doesn't seem to want a girlfriend, but maybe he's shy/not the go-getter type/unsure about how you feel. If you really want to know, just ask. But be aware that even if he's interested, you're going to be doing a lot of the heavy-lifting/second guessing yourself here, because (for whatever reason) his personality type does not respond to your game-playing nor reciprocate your intensity.
posted by sm1tten at 8:43 AM on May 18, 2012
posted by sm1tten at 8:43 AM on May 18, 2012
My take based on the evidence you gave is he obviously cares about you, every guy I've ever met that liked doing DIY stuff that did it for someone cared for them. Is he "in love" with you or just cares for you as a friend that's harder to say. You don't have to ask him outright, though I suggest it's the easiest and best option. Maybe ask him out on a date in a casual manner, not a do you want to grab a bite to eat kind of thing, use the word date in the sentence. If he says yes and the date goes well then maybe bring up the whole .. oops I was wrong I think I'd like to try working toward the whole boyfriend/girlfriend thing if you're up for it.
posted by wwax at 9:12 AM on May 18, 2012
posted by wwax at 9:12 AM on May 18, 2012
I assume when you talked about having FWB situation, you made it clear to him that it was FWB (emphasize on the friend part)?
*YOU* have issues telling if he has feelings for you or not. Now put yourself in his shoes: men in general are oblivious (I repeat OBLIVIOUS) to little signals plus the fact that presumably you had hammered it in him that it was an FWB. If he's anything like me, any feelings he has are being buried so deep inside in order not to make himself look like a jackass.
There are multiple reasons why he's doing what he's doing. It's useless to speculate. As this post has shown: there are myriads of reasons. If you really want to know and would like to pursue this a little further, bite the bullet and ask.
posted by 7life at 9:20 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
*YOU* have issues telling if he has feelings for you or not. Now put yourself in his shoes: men in general are oblivious (I repeat OBLIVIOUS) to little signals plus the fact that presumably you had hammered it in him that it was an FWB. If he's anything like me, any feelings he has are being buried so deep inside in order not to make himself look like a jackass.
There are multiple reasons why he's doing what he's doing. It's useless to speculate. As this post has shown: there are myriads of reasons. If you really want to know and would like to pursue this a little further, bite the bullet and ask.
posted by 7life at 9:20 AM on May 18, 2012 [1 favorite]
I'm going to scroll pass some of the answers because I was in your situation for 3 1/2 years.
Your FWB wants to be your FWB ... and he doesn't want to be too much of an asshole about it.
MY FWB was this way. He was great with bringing wine/dinner over each time he stopped by. He always got me a Christmas gift, Valentine's Day gift and birthday gift. He'd ocassionally email me with funny Youtube videos.
He did NOT, however, want to be my boyfriend and he made that perfectly clear. We didn't call/text/email that often. We didn't go out.
He left the country each year for about two months each summer to travel and he kept his distance when he was in town. But we had a lot of grown up fun together when he was around. If he was over and something heavy needed carrying, he'd certainly do that. He wanted to be my lover but he didn't want to be a jerk. Your guy sounds similar. If you want something more from him (and I think you do), you should end this relationship now.
posted by nubianinthedesert at 9:54 AM on May 18, 2012 [2 favorites]
Your FWB wants to be your FWB ... and he doesn't want to be too much of an asshole about it.
MY FWB was this way. He was great with bringing wine/dinner over each time he stopped by. He always got me a Christmas gift, Valentine's Day gift and birthday gift. He'd ocassionally email me with funny Youtube videos.
He did NOT, however, want to be my boyfriend and he made that perfectly clear. We didn't call/text/email that often. We didn't go out.
He left the country each year for about two months each summer to travel and he kept his distance when he was in town. But we had a lot of grown up fun together when he was around. If he was over and something heavy needed carrying, he'd certainly do that. He wanted to be my lover but he didn't want to be a jerk. Your guy sounds similar. If you want something more from him (and I think you do), you should end this relationship now.
posted by nubianinthedesert at 9:54 AM on May 18, 2012 [2 favorites]
He's an enginerd, of sorts-- it bothers him that things are broken, especially when he's experiencing external anxiety, i.e. proximity to you. That is why he fixes things, probably just a little compuslively. His anxiety towards you may not be your fault; maybe he doesn't know where he stands with you, or maybe he doesn't know how he feels about the current setup.
My own FWB setup bothered me; the benefits were awesome (by definition, really, but even with experience I can tell you this was great), but I felt I was either missing out or dropping the ball by not dating this person. So I was anxious (at a heightened background level) when I was around this woman, who was nominally a good friend around whom I should be comfortable.
That's my guess-by-experience-and-analogy, and good luck.
posted by Sunburnt at 11:35 AM on May 18, 2012
My own FWB setup bothered me; the benefits were awesome (by definition, really, but even with experience I can tell you this was great), but I felt I was either missing out or dropping the ball by not dating this person. So I was anxious (at a heightened background level) when I was around this woman, who was nominally a good friend around whom I should be comfortable.
That's my guess-by-experience-and-analogy, and good luck.
posted by Sunburnt at 11:35 AM on May 18, 2012
So, do you want him to be interested? Start flirting more. If you get nowhere, then ask him. Not all guys deal with directness comfortably.
posted by theora55 at 8:37 AM on May 19, 2012
posted by theora55 at 8:37 AM on May 19, 2012
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by wolfdreams01 at 9:00 PM on May 17, 2012 [7 favorites]