A non-Catholic but still recognized wedding?
September 7, 2011 1:25 PM Subscribe
Help us try to reconcile our desires for having an outdoor wedding with my the wishes of my fiancée's family / the rules of the Catholic Church. We're in Houston, TX and trying to figure this out. It's making our wedding planning very stressful!
So, a few weeks ago we got engaged. Hooray! We live in the Houston, TX metro area and have been looking for ceremony/reception venues over the past few weeks. Our dream wedding would be something outdoors, < 60 people, on a ranch in the Hill Country with a combined ceremony/reception location. After speaking with my future in-laws, however, we've run into a few snags. They don't care if the wedding is Catholic, but they do seem to be attached to the idea of having a wedding in a holy building (church). Additionally, we're concerned about my fiancée being excluded from future church activities/sacraments if our wedding is not officially recognized. Specifically, she has been selected to be the godmother of her nephew - will this cause an issue that could prevent her from becoming a godparent now/in the future? I know that we could not have a Roman Catholic priest perform the wedding outside of a church, but what are our other options? Perhaps some of you have experienced similar circumstances?
The option that we're currently considering are:
1) Having a non-Roman Catholic wedding and then getting it recognized after the fact.
2) Having a small RC wedding beforehand (the morning of the reception, or the day before) and then having a separate, non-Catholic ceremony at our choice of venue later.
3) If all else fails, just having a Roman Catholic ceremony to appease family and ensure that we aren't precluded from any Church activities in the future.
I guess we are mostly concerned with my future wife being turned away from the church; would having a non-church ceremony ruin our relationship with the Catholic Church?
If it helps/to give some context, I was brought up Lutheran and am currently non-practicing.
Thank you very much for your help/insight.
So, a few weeks ago we got engaged. Hooray! We live in the Houston, TX metro area and have been looking for ceremony/reception venues over the past few weeks. Our dream wedding would be something outdoors, < 60 people, on a ranch in the Hill Country with a combined ceremony/reception location. After speaking with my future in-laws, however, we've run into a few snags. They don't care if the wedding is Catholic, but they do seem to be attached to the idea of having a wedding in a holy building (church). Additionally, we're concerned about my fiancée being excluded from future church activities/sacraments if our wedding is not officially recognized. Specifically, she has been selected to be the godmother of her nephew - will this cause an issue that could prevent her from becoming a godparent now/in the future? I know that we could not have a Roman Catholic priest perform the wedding outside of a church, but what are our other options? Perhaps some of you have experienced similar circumstances?
The option that we're currently considering are:
1) Having a non-Roman Catholic wedding and then getting it recognized after the fact.
2) Having a small RC wedding beforehand (the morning of the reception, or the day before) and then having a separate, non-Catholic ceremony at our choice of venue later.
3) If all else fails, just having a Roman Catholic ceremony to appease family and ensure that we aren't precluded from any Church activities in the future.
I guess we are mostly concerned with my future wife being turned away from the church; would having a non-church ceremony ruin our relationship with the Catholic Church?
If it helps/to give some context, I was brought up Lutheran and am currently non-practicing.
Thank you very much for your help/insight.
"would having a non-church ceremony ruin our relationship with the Catholic Church?"
No. While obviously they'd generally prefer you do marriage their way, any legally-contracted marriage (well, opposite-sex marriage, anyway) in the U.S. "counts" for the Catholic Church. If you want to get on their bad side, you're going to have to go for divorce.
Among your options include getting permission to have an outdoor ceremony (willingness to do this varies by diocese); having a blessing ceremony after the fact (used to be super-common); or just, you know, getting married however and letting whatever parish you join later know you've done so.
Best bet is to call your wife's priest, or your diocesan office that handles these things, and ask how they do things and what your options are. It varies an awful lot by diocese. But no, as long as you're married, it "counts." My grandparents were married in a civil ceremony back in the 40s because she wasn't Catholic and he was; when she later converted they had a short ceremony to "sacramentalize" the marriage but it "counted" for all those years and all those kids and all that church participation they did up until that point. Anyway, ask the diocese. Possibly there's a form you can fill out. I can say when we moved parishes it's not like anybody asked about our Catholic OR civil marriage certificates; I just put our names on the parish registry form and we got on with bein' Catholic and baptizin' children. The level of "not caring" for all practical purposes is pretty high.
As for the inlaws, have you mentioned to them that all God's creation is holy and you're just picking a particularly pretty part of it? :)
("Specifically, she has been selected to be the godmother of her nephew - will this cause an issue that could prevent her from becoming a godparent now/in the future?" -- absolutely not. I've just picked godparents twice recently. One of them was even Jewish. Which means she was technically not a "godparent" but an "unofficial sponsor" but whatever. Anyway, we were asked if the Catholic godparents in question could produce baptismal and confirmation certificates as well as evidence of membership in a parish. We said, "Uh, probably?" There was no follow up.)
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 1:50 PM on September 7, 2011 [1 favorite]
No. While obviously they'd generally prefer you do marriage their way, any legally-contracted marriage (well, opposite-sex marriage, anyway) in the U.S. "counts" for the Catholic Church. If you want to get on their bad side, you're going to have to go for divorce.
Among your options include getting permission to have an outdoor ceremony (willingness to do this varies by diocese); having a blessing ceremony after the fact (used to be super-common); or just, you know, getting married however and letting whatever parish you join later know you've done so.
Best bet is to call your wife's priest, or your diocesan office that handles these things, and ask how they do things and what your options are. It varies an awful lot by diocese. But no, as long as you're married, it "counts." My grandparents were married in a civil ceremony back in the 40s because she wasn't Catholic and he was; when she later converted they had a short ceremony to "sacramentalize" the marriage but it "counted" for all those years and all those kids and all that church participation they did up until that point. Anyway, ask the diocese. Possibly there's a form you can fill out. I can say when we moved parishes it's not like anybody asked about our Catholic OR civil marriage certificates; I just put our names on the parish registry form and we got on with bein' Catholic and baptizin' children. The level of "not caring" for all practical purposes is pretty high.
As for the inlaws, have you mentioned to them that all God's creation is holy and you're just picking a particularly pretty part of it? :)
("Specifically, she has been selected to be the godmother of her nephew - will this cause an issue that could prevent her from becoming a godparent now/in the future?" -- absolutely not. I've just picked godparents twice recently. One of them was even Jewish. Which means she was technically not a "godparent" but an "unofficial sponsor" but whatever. Anyway, we were asked if the Catholic godparents in question could produce baptismal and confirmation certificates as well as evidence of membership in a parish. We said, "Uh, probably?" There was no follow up.)
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 1:50 PM on September 7, 2011 [1 favorite]
I know that we could not have a Roman Catholic priest perform the wedding outside of a church, but what are our other options?
How sure are you about this? I would ask the priest directly to make sure, because it will likely vary from parish to parish. I am a non-Catholic and I just had a Catholic ceremony. There were some rules that were written down but never enforced, such as having one of our witnesses be Catholic. The church we married in had a lovely labyrinth on the grounds and would have made for an awesome ceremony site as well.
Another option would be to look into non-denominational facilities, like chapels on college campuses. It wouldn't surprise me if some more liberal priests were willing/got permission to perform a marriage in one of these.
posted by soelo at 1:52 PM on September 7, 2011
How sure are you about this? I would ask the priest directly to make sure, because it will likely vary from parish to parish. I am a non-Catholic and I just had a Catholic ceremony. There were some rules that were written down but never enforced, such as having one of our witnesses be Catholic. The church we married in had a lovely labyrinth on the grounds and would have made for an awesome ceremony site as well.
Another option would be to look into non-denominational facilities, like chapels on college campuses. It wouldn't surprise me if some more liberal priests were willing/got permission to perform a marriage in one of these.
posted by soelo at 1:52 PM on September 7, 2011
I would absolutely do a small RC wedding and then have your outdoor special event.
The Catholic church approved my daughter's godparent who only had baptism so his marital status was not an issue.
For other, on-going issues like whether you want your children educated in Catholic schools (here in the UK they are considered better than other state schools) it can be useful to have your marraige "lines" issued by the Church.
Even though I am not religious I do appreciate the cultural context of my Catholic education, (obviously I'm one of the majority who was not abused by Irish Catholic agents!)
posted by Wilder at 1:53 PM on September 7, 2011
The Catholic church approved my daughter's godparent who only had baptism so his marital status was not an issue.
For other, on-going issues like whether you want your children educated in Catholic schools (here in the UK they are considered better than other state schools) it can be useful to have your marraige "lines" issued by the Church.
Even though I am not religious I do appreciate the cultural context of my Catholic education, (obviously I'm one of the majority who was not abused by Irish Catholic agents!)
posted by Wilder at 1:53 PM on September 7, 2011
Response by poster: > As for the inlaws, have you mentioned to them that all God's creation is holy and you're just picking a particularly pretty part of it? :)
@Eyebrows - Thanks for that. It made me laugh a bit as this is exactly how we both feel :)
posted by swhitt at 1:54 PM on September 7, 2011
@Eyebrows - Thanks for that. It made me laugh a bit as this is exactly how we both feel :)
posted by swhitt at 1:54 PM on September 7, 2011
Congratulations! I'd recommend #2 or #3, but not necessarily because they maximize familial harmony (not that that's not a worthy objective). It's because even as a guest, I find outdoor weddings to be stressful and/or awkward, even in the best of circumstances... and as dreamy as the idea sounds in concept, most couples that I know who've done it (other than those who have had TINY TINY weddings) have voiced real regrets about it in retrospect because the fantasy of their "dream wedding" outdoors was hard to jibe with the realities of event planning.
With an outdoor wedding, *everyone* is obsessed with wondering what the weather will be like, and how to react to varying weather scenarios, for weeks leading up to and especially on the day of the event. The Plan B venue in case of rain (or 100+ degree heat) usually feels like a big step down because it is typically just what's nearby to the Plan A location, not something that's pleasing or special for the couple unto itself, and worse still because the plans for staging it (decorations, music, what have you) either don't exist or don't really apply.
In my experience, it's been incredibly hard to hear the officiant, readers or the bridal couple when you're outside. The wind is often a big pain in the neck, especially when a veil is involved. Outdoor weddings are murder on female guest's shoes (and the bride's), and generally make the hem of the bride's gown look filthy before the reception even starts. No one looks or feels their best when they're sweating. Etc. YMMV, of course, but that's my take as a veteran of too-many-weddings-to-count.
Is it possible to find a venue for the reception that is lovely that ALSO has a nice outdoor space (like a patio) where guests can mingle, weather permitting, but that is not the centerpiece of the event?
posted by argonauta at 1:59 PM on September 7, 2011 [2 favorites]
With an outdoor wedding, *everyone* is obsessed with wondering what the weather will be like, and how to react to varying weather scenarios, for weeks leading up to and especially on the day of the event. The Plan B venue in case of rain (or 100+ degree heat) usually feels like a big step down because it is typically just what's nearby to the Plan A location, not something that's pleasing or special for the couple unto itself, and worse still because the plans for staging it (decorations, music, what have you) either don't exist or don't really apply.
In my experience, it's been incredibly hard to hear the officiant, readers or the bridal couple when you're outside. The wind is often a big pain in the neck, especially when a veil is involved. Outdoor weddings are murder on female guest's shoes (and the bride's), and generally make the hem of the bride's gown look filthy before the reception even starts. No one looks or feels their best when they're sweating. Etc. YMMV, of course, but that's my take as a veteran of too-many-weddings-to-count.
Is it possible to find a venue for the reception that is lovely that ALSO has a nice outdoor space (like a patio) where guests can mingle, weather permitting, but that is not the centerpiece of the event?
posted by argonauta at 1:59 PM on September 7, 2011 [2 favorites]
Hmm. I've been to plenty of RC weddings outside. I think maybe "in the church" is being misinterpreted here - it doesn't have to be in the building, it just has to follow the rules and tenets of the Church to be considered "in the church." Anyway, talk to your priest! And then if he's on board have him talk to the parents. (Or you could do what I did and become effectively Episcopalian)
posted by zomg at 2:00 PM on September 7, 2011
posted by zomg at 2:00 PM on September 7, 2011
Congrats on being engaged.
If you get married outside the Catholic Church (i.e., by a judge, protestant, whatever), you have to get your marriage "blessed." Don't go this route. This is more complicated than, say, you commit a sin and then go to confession, tell a priest, he says 'no bigs' and all's forgiven. This process usually requires paperwork and a marriage tribunal. (Plus your spouse cannot receive Holy Communion until this is done. And she probably can, but shouldn't, be the sponsor or godparent of baptized kids if she goes that route.) Back when we were ignorant of sacramental marriage, my wife and I almost did this because we wanted to be married like, yesterday already and our priest was very busy and couldn't set a date.
Catholics can totally have outdoor weddings. If you want a Catholic, sacramental marriage, talk to the priest who'll end up marrying you. He'll lay out the parameters of what's what.
Don't ever worry about being "turned away" from a church. We aren't Donatists, man. Unless you march in spouting 'ordain women now!' or 'say the Mass in Latin!' during Mass, you're pretty much okay. Everyone's got issues.
And relax! If you or your fiancee are only thinking about the rules, you're doing it wrong.
Talk to your priest.
posted by resurrexit at 2:13 PM on September 7, 2011
If you get married outside the Catholic Church (i.e., by a judge, protestant, whatever), you have to get your marriage "blessed." Don't go this route. This is more complicated than, say, you commit a sin and then go to confession, tell a priest, he says 'no bigs' and all's forgiven. This process usually requires paperwork and a marriage tribunal. (Plus your spouse cannot receive Holy Communion until this is done. And she probably can, but shouldn't, be the sponsor or godparent of baptized kids if she goes that route.) Back when we were ignorant of sacramental marriage, my wife and I almost did this because we wanted to be married like, yesterday already and our priest was very busy and couldn't set a date.
Catholics can totally have outdoor weddings. If you want a Catholic, sacramental marriage, talk to the priest who'll end up marrying you. He'll lay out the parameters of what's what.
Don't ever worry about being "turned away" from a church. We aren't Donatists, man. Unless you march in spouting 'ordain women now!' or 'say the Mass in Latin!' during Mass, you're pretty much okay. Everyone's got issues.
And relax! If you or your fiancee are only thinking about the rules, you're doing it wrong.
Talk to your priest.
posted by resurrexit at 2:13 PM on September 7, 2011
I heard about a couple getting around some technicality by putting up an arch or pagoda over/around the place the priest and couple stands. No idea if that applies.
posted by meepmeow at 2:41 PM on September 7, 2011
posted by meepmeow at 2:41 PM on September 7, 2011
Father Rob says this is the most asked question on his site.
Looks like you have to get a special dispensation. But it isn't forbidden.
posted by Ironmouth at 2:53 PM on September 7, 2011
Looks like you have to get a special dispensation. But it isn't forbidden.
posted by Ironmouth at 2:53 PM on September 7, 2011
3) If all else fails, just having a Roman Catholic ceremony to appease family and ensure that we aren't precluded from any Church activities in the future.
Don't do this. Don't do your wedding just to appease outsiders. The Church will get over it.
posted by notsnot at 3:05 PM on September 7, 2011 [1 favorite]
Don't do this. Don't do your wedding just to appease outsiders. The Church will get over it.
posted by notsnot at 3:05 PM on September 7, 2011 [1 favorite]
Specifically, she has been selected to be the godmother of her nephew - will this cause an issue that could prevent her from becoming a godparent now/in the future?
No, she'll be fine. As long as she's Catholic in the eyes of the Catholic church, ie. baptized, she's good.
I think if I were you, I'd go for option #1. You get the wedding you want, the parents are appeased eventually, all sacraments covered -- and hey, two weddings! You could enjoy both in different ways.
posted by pised at 3:08 PM on September 7, 2011
No, she'll be fine. As long as she's Catholic in the eyes of the Catholic church, ie. baptized, she's good.
I think if I were you, I'd go for option #1. You get the wedding you want, the parents are appeased eventually, all sacraments covered -- and hey, two weddings! You could enjoy both in different ways.
posted by pised at 3:08 PM on September 7, 2011
I went with route #1, though my wedding was indoors, and we had the marriage blessed maybe ~6 months after our wedding. It wasn't all that hard to do, with the caveat that the priest at my dad's parish, who did the ceremony to bless our marriage, is one of the most laid-back priests I've ever met in my life. First, though, I'd ask a priest at a parish your fiancee or her family has a relationship with, and see if they'll find a way to officiate the wedding at your choice of venue. It's sometimes doable. (FWIW, there is no reason she wouldn't be able to be a godmother even if you ended up not doing things the Catholic way.)
Also, having attended and officiated (shh! don't tell the Church!) outdoor weddings, I agree with some of argonauta's points - stressing about weather, and dealing with wind and people being able to hear an outdoor ceremony can be a pain in the ass. I went to one where we couldn't hear anything that the officiant or couple were saying, despite a PA system, because of wind interference. In that case, option #3 might work better, and you can have the reception outside.
posted by bedhead at 3:58 PM on September 7, 2011
Also, having attended and officiated (shh! don't tell the Church!) outdoor weddings, I agree with some of argonauta's points - stressing about weather, and dealing with wind and people being able to hear an outdoor ceremony can be a pain in the ass. I went to one where we couldn't hear anything that the officiant or couple were saying, despite a PA system, because of wind interference. In that case, option #3 might work better, and you can have the reception outside.
posted by bedhead at 3:58 PM on September 7, 2011
I think the Bishop hands out the dispensation, and I gather that these are hard to come by these days.
My cousin went with a pretty creative loophole that you might consider replicating. He and his wife wanted to have the wedding outside somewhere in rural New York. The place had a sentimentality about it for them, and it was beautiful and idyllic. The grounds also facilitated a weekend-long family party with camping and so forth for guests.
The hitch was, they wanted a Catholic wedding.
Their solution was to have the actual sacrament take place nearby in the chapel of a convent. (This need not take very long.) Parents attended. Then, already married, they walked over to the grounds where the "wedding" was set up under a canopy, and simply re-enacted the whole thing, but with a longer and more elaborate ceremony. I'd imagine most guests were none the wiser, aside from those who find obscure Catholic matrimonial loopholes interesting.
You may be able to do a version of this at your parish, or you might be able to get the family priest to agree to doing it in some sort of non-parish Catholic chapel closer to the place where you want the ceremony and reception to take place.
posted by kensington314 at 4:10 PM on September 7, 2011 [1 favorite]
My cousin went with a pretty creative loophole that you might consider replicating. He and his wife wanted to have the wedding outside somewhere in rural New York. The place had a sentimentality about it for them, and it was beautiful and idyllic. The grounds also facilitated a weekend-long family party with camping and so forth for guests.
The hitch was, they wanted a Catholic wedding.
Their solution was to have the actual sacrament take place nearby in the chapel of a convent. (This need not take very long.) Parents attended. Then, already married, they walked over to the grounds where the "wedding" was set up under a canopy, and simply re-enacted the whole thing, but with a longer and more elaborate ceremony. I'd imagine most guests were none the wiser, aside from those who find obscure Catholic matrimonial loopholes interesting.
You may be able to do a version of this at your parish, or you might be able to get the family priest to agree to doing it in some sort of non-parish Catholic chapel closer to the place where you want the ceremony and reception to take place.
posted by kensington314 at 4:10 PM on September 7, 2011 [1 favorite]
My family does a certain amount of Don't ask, Don't Tell. We didn't tell the priest at the baptism that the godfather is not a practicing Catholic. I read at Mom's funeral, and didn't mention my atheism to the priest. I did write the blessings, discarding the priest's which had a disturbing focus on Mom being washed in the blood of the lamb. Some priests are sticklers, so don't say more than is needed. My Mom liked to do an emergency spit baptism on grandchildren before they left the hospital. The parish priest initially declined to do a baptism, saying it had been done. He gave in; Mom was relentless.
posted by theora55 at 5:05 PM on September 7, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by theora55 at 5:05 PM on September 7, 2011 [1 favorite]
"I think the Bishop hands out the dispensation, and I gather that these are hard to come by these days."
It depends a great deal on the diocese -- I had friends getting married somewhere in Oregon or Washington who couldn't get a dispensation for love or money, and other bishops are like "whatever, whatever, whatever" and just sign off on everything.
"Mom liked to do an emergency spit baptism on grandchildren before they left the hospital. The parish priest initially declined to do a baptism, saying it had been done. He gave in; Mom was relentless."
Irregular but valid; there's actually a liturgical variant for baptisms that have PROBABLY already been performed ... "if thou hast not been baptized, I baptize thee in the name of ..." There's also a variant for things you aren't sure are human: "If thou art a man, I baptize thee ..." My master's thesis totally covered this topic. Extensively.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 6:48 PM on September 7, 2011 [2 favorites]
It depends a great deal on the diocese -- I had friends getting married somewhere in Oregon or Washington who couldn't get a dispensation for love or money, and other bishops are like "whatever, whatever, whatever" and just sign off on everything.
"Mom liked to do an emergency spit baptism on grandchildren before they left the hospital. The parish priest initially declined to do a baptism, saying it had been done. He gave in; Mom was relentless."
Irregular but valid; there's actually a liturgical variant for baptisms that have PROBABLY already been performed ... "if thou hast not been baptized, I baptize thee in the name of ..." There's also a variant for things you aren't sure are human: "If thou art a man, I baptize thee ..." My master's thesis totally covered this topic. Extensively.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 6:48 PM on September 7, 2011 [2 favorites]
Talk to a priest at your fiancée's parish or your future in-laws' parish. Not matter which solution you decide upon, you'll need to go through marriage prep and get all the paperwork in place -- starting with getting a dispensation to marry a non-Catholic Christian. Any other dispensations you'll need will be identified and addressed. Start with this marriage prep guide from at the Archdiocese of Galveston-Houston Family Life Ministry Office
A Catholic doesn't have to have to have their marriage officiated by a Catholic clergyman inside a Catholic Church in order for the marriage to be sacramental as long as the intent for a sacramental marriage exists AND all the needed dispensations have been granted. Get that taken care of and there will be no problem with your fiancée's being a godparent (she has been confirmed, right?).
posted by Ranucci at 10:11 PM on September 7, 2011
A Catholic doesn't have to have to have their marriage officiated by a Catholic clergyman inside a Catholic Church in order for the marriage to be sacramental as long as the intent for a sacramental marriage exists AND all the needed dispensations have been granted. Get that taken care of and there will be no problem with your fiancée's being a godparent (she has been confirmed, right?).
posted by Ranucci at 10:11 PM on September 7, 2011
Get that taken care of and there will be no problem with your fiancée's being a godparent (she has been confirmed, right?).
I just want to point out that in my personal experience, Ranucci is bringing up a good non-marriage related god-parenting point. It might not be true in all parishes, but in ours, if a god parent was Catholic they had to have been confirmed.
posted by drezdn at 4:50 AM on September 8, 2011
I just want to point out that in my personal experience, Ranucci is bringing up a good non-marriage related god-parenting point. It might not be true in all parishes, but in ours, if a god parent was Catholic they had to have been confirmed.
posted by drezdn at 4:50 AM on September 8, 2011
starting with getting a dispensation to marry a non-Catholic Christian
My husband did not need a dispensation to marry me, but the priest did meet with both of us and asked us about our personal religious history. In fact, at one point he had to promise to respect my non-Catholicism. We also did not have to swear to have our children baptized/raised in the Catholic church, but only that we would see to their religious education. I had to provide proof of my Protestant baptism, as well.
Really, it all depends on the church and officiant you choose as to what requirements you will need to fulfill. In that way, the Catholic church is not that different than Protestant churches (or, I would guess, any other place you could get married, religious or not).
posted by soelo at 5:54 AM on September 8, 2011
My husband did not need a dispensation to marry me, but the priest did meet with both of us and asked us about our personal religious history. In fact, at one point he had to promise to respect my non-Catholicism. We also did not have to swear to have our children baptized/raised in the Catholic church, but only that we would see to their religious education. I had to provide proof of my Protestant baptism, as well.
Really, it all depends on the church and officiant you choose as to what requirements you will need to fulfill. In that way, the Catholic church is not that different than Protestant churches (or, I would guess, any other place you could get married, religious or not).
posted by soelo at 5:54 AM on September 8, 2011
A Catholic doesn't have to have to have their marriage officiated by a Catholic clergyman inside a Catholic Church in order for the marriage to be sacramental as long as the intent for a sacramental marriage exists AND all the needed dispensations have been granted. Get that taken care of and there will be no problem with your fiancée's being a godparent (she has been confirmed, right?).
Technically incorrect in that it conflates validity of the sacrament with liceity of the sacrament. A baptized Catholic may validly marry outside the Catholic Church, but such a marriage (if it is valid--and you have to prove this, which is why I say don't do it) is still illicit.
posted by resurrexit at 7:13 AM on September 8, 2011
Technically incorrect in that it conflates validity of the sacrament with liceity of the sacrament. A baptized Catholic may validly marry outside the Catholic Church, but such a marriage (if it is valid--and you have to prove this, which is why I say don't do it) is still illicit.
posted by resurrexit at 7:13 AM on September 8, 2011
It's going to be much easier to sort out any potential problems before you get married than trying to go back and get your marriage convalidated or radically sanated (healed from the root). You're probably going to have to go through the local Church marriage preparation program, even if you approach the Church after you are civilly married, which would be awkward!
While enforcement varies from place to place, it is not sufficient according to the law to be baptized to be a godparent (baptismal sponsor):
No, that's actually correct when "all the needed dispensations have been granted" the wedding is licit.
If you got married in a Catholic ceremony, you didn't need a dispensation, but permission for a mixed marriage (which is, technically, different). It is at this point so routinely issued in the United States that you almost certainly had it. The priest may not have even thought it worth mentioning. (If you got married in a non-Catholic ceremony, then you'd need a dispensation from the Catholic form of marriage, yet another kind of permission.)
Hmm. I've been to plenty of RC weddings outside. I think maybe "in the church" is being misinterpreted here - it doesn't have to be in the building, it just has to follow the rules and tenets of the Church to be considered "in the church."
I can't find any specific policy online for the Archdiocese of Galveston-Houston, but many dioceses for instance the policy of the Diocese of Mobile, AL here forbid any outdoor weddings, even refusing to give permission for non-Catholic ceremonies involving Catholics if the wedding is to be held outdoors. But it's also possible that they'll give permission. The pastor of your local parish will likely know what the G-H policy is. I'd talk to him and then go from there.
posted by Jahaza at 8:19 AM on September 8, 2011
Specifically, she has been selected to be the godmother of her nephew - will this cause an issue that could prevent her from becoming a godparent now/in the future?No, she'll be fine. As long as she's Catholic in the eyes of the Catholic church, ie. baptized, she's good.
While enforcement varies from place to place, it is not sufficient according to the law to be baptized to be a godparent (baptismal sponsor):
Can. 874 §1. To be permitted to take on the function of sponsor a person must:Many priests won't investigate, but others will and will rule that someone who has married outside the Church without the proper dispensation is not someone "who leads a life of faith in keeping with the function to be taken on."
1/ be designated by the one to be baptized, by the parents or the person who takes their place, or in their absence by the pastor or minister and have the aptitude and intention of fulfilling this function;
2/ have completed the sixteenth year of age, unless the diocesan bishop has established another age, or the pastor or minister has granted an exception for a just cause;
3/ be a Catholic who has been confirmed and has already received the most holy sacrament of the Eucharist and who leads a life of faith in keeping with the function to be taken on;
4/ not be bound by any canonical penalty legitimately imposed or declared;
5/ not be the father or mother of the one to be baptized.
A Catholic doesn't have to have to have their marriage officiated by a Catholic clergyman inside a Catholic Church in order for the marriage to be sacramental as long as the intent for a sacramental marriage exists AND all the needed dispensations have been granted. Get that taken care of and there will be no problem with your fiancée's being a godparent (she has been confirmed, right?).Technically incorrect in that it conflates validity of the sacrament with liceity of the sacrament. A baptized Catholic may validly marry outside the Catholic Church, but such a marriage (if it is valid--and you have to prove this, which is why I say don't do it) is still illicit.
No, that's actually correct when "all the needed dispensations have been granted" the wedding is licit.
starting with getting a dispensation to marry a non-Catholic ChristianMy husband did not need a dispensation to marry me...
If you got married in a Catholic ceremony, you didn't need a dispensation, but permission for a mixed marriage (which is, technically, different). It is at this point so routinely issued in the United States that you almost certainly had it. The priest may not have even thought it worth mentioning. (If you got married in a non-Catholic ceremony, then you'd need a dispensation from the Catholic form of marriage, yet another kind of permission.)
Hmm. I've been to plenty of RC weddings outside. I think maybe "in the church" is being misinterpreted here - it doesn't have to be in the building, it just has to follow the rules and tenets of the Church to be considered "in the church."
I can't find any specific policy online for the Archdiocese of Galveston-Houston, but many dioceses for instance the policy of the Diocese of Mobile, AL here forbid any outdoor weddings, even refusing to give permission for non-Catholic ceremonies involving Catholics if the wedding is to be held outdoors. But it's also possible that they'll give permission. The pastor of your local parish will likely know what the G-H policy is. I'd talk to him and then go from there.
posted by Jahaza at 8:19 AM on September 8, 2011
No, that's actually correct when "all the needed dispensations have been granted" the wedding is licit.
Thanks, I need to read more closely!
posted by resurrexit at 3:28 PM on September 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
Thanks, I need to read more closely!
posted by resurrexit at 3:28 PM on September 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
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posted by Nightman at 1:36 PM on September 7, 2011