Help me not be a dbag in the dating world
July 24, 2011 8:32 AM Subscribe
I'm always impressed by the abilities of the hivemind to craft clear and concise messages. I come to you, today, to request your help. What's the best way to tell someone you would really like to be friends with them, after having gone on a few dates? Not "lets be friends" as an easy let down, but "wow, you're really cool, and I want to hang out, I just don't want to have anything romantic with you."
I have a mild tendency to over-think and then talk too much, coming across like a total d-bag. I'd prefer to not do that in this instance...
I'm new to online dating. I put up a profile, met someone, and we had a good first date. Nothing intimate happened, just drinks and conversations at night in a poorly-lit bar where it was tough to really get a good impression beyond personality and basics. Had a 2nd date during the day time. We had a ton of fun hanging out, but again nothing intimate. I've realized after date #2 that I'm just not physically attracted to her. Nothing grotesque, just not my type and it took me a few hours after the date to realize it.
Date #2 was on Thursday, and work has been crazy busy since then. I'll finally have time today to call her, and I think it's respectful to do so and let her know that I'm not interested.
I'm thinking of saying "Hi, I've really had fun hanging out with you. For whatever reason I'm just not drawn to you romantically. That said, I really think we could be good friends if you're up for it. What do you think?"
If she says no, then I'll completely respect that.
1.) Is what I'm planning on saying ok, or just cringeworthy?
2.) Give me your alternative things to say, please!
3.) If you think I should just tell her "Sorry, this isn't going to work" and leave it at that instead, let me know.
Thank you very much!
I have a mild tendency to over-think and then talk too much, coming across like a total d-bag. I'd prefer to not do that in this instance...
I'm new to online dating. I put up a profile, met someone, and we had a good first date. Nothing intimate happened, just drinks and conversations at night in a poorly-lit bar where it was tough to really get a good impression beyond personality and basics. Had a 2nd date during the day time. We had a ton of fun hanging out, but again nothing intimate. I've realized after date #2 that I'm just not physically attracted to her. Nothing grotesque, just not my type and it took me a few hours after the date to realize it.
Date #2 was on Thursday, and work has been crazy busy since then. I'll finally have time today to call her, and I think it's respectful to do so and let her know that I'm not interested.
I'm thinking of saying "Hi, I've really had fun hanging out with you. For whatever reason I'm just not drawn to you romantically. That said, I really think we could be good friends if you're up for it. What do you think?"
If she says no, then I'll completely respect that.
1.) Is what I'm planning on saying ok, or just cringeworthy?
2.) Give me your alternative things to say, please!
3.) If you think I should just tell her "Sorry, this isn't going to work" and leave it at that instead, let me know.
Thank you very much!
There is nothing inherently problematic with the way you worded it. I'd be fine being on the receiving end of that. Just steer well clear of anything that suggests you don't find her physically attractive. No one wants to hear that and no good can come of admitting it.
For all you know she's not feeling it that much either. It's entirely up to her, the internet can't help you predict if she's going to be okay with it.
posted by slow graffiti at 8:46 AM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
For all you know she's not feeling it that much either. It's entirely up to her, the internet can't help you predict if she's going to be okay with it.
posted by slow graffiti at 8:46 AM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
What you want to say is fine. I also like the "you're really cool and I want to hang out with you" above.
I don't like the phone call, though. If I were her, I wouldn't want to be put on the spot like that. It's not like you owe her a break up call after two dates, and an email would give her more time to think it over and decide whether she wants to be friends with you.
posted by J. Wilson at 8:48 AM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
I don't like the phone call, though. If I were her, I wouldn't want to be put on the spot like that. It's not like you owe her a break up call after two dates, and an email would give her more time to think it over and decide whether she wants to be friends with you.
posted by J. Wilson at 8:48 AM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
Your wording sounds good, but I'd actually do it in person while you're out having fun just to show you do mean it. If you say it just as you're parting ways you can give her a chance to think it over. Doing it on date #3 is pretty good timing.
Towards the end of my dating career (I'm married now), I learned that early in the dating process things don't automatically lead to seriousness, and it's important to just enjoy and appreciate each moment as it comes, so getting a friend out of the process is nice plus versus them developing an aversion to you.
posted by waterandrock at 8:53 AM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
Towards the end of my dating career (I'm married now), I learned that early in the dating process things don't automatically lead to seriousness, and it's important to just enjoy and appreciate each moment as it comes, so getting a friend out of the process is nice plus versus them developing an aversion to you.
posted by waterandrock at 8:53 AM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
And something further- it would add some heft to what you said to give a specific reason you want to hang out in the future, instead of the hollow-sounding "let's be friends." If someone said to me, "hey I'm not feeling it but I had fun talking underwater basketweaving with you and I could use a buddy for my basketweaving class, what do you say?" that would be even better. Helps let them know specifically what you find interesting about them, sets a boundary and some expectations about how you will interact in the future.
posted by slow graffiti at 8:54 AM on July 24, 2011 [15 favorites]
posted by slow graffiti at 8:54 AM on July 24, 2011 [15 favorites]
I agree with J. Wilson that doing this via email is a better idea (for both of you).
I think this can only work if both people really feel the same way. If you sense that she is really into you, then please don't try the friends thing. She might say "sure" in the hopes that something romantic could happen later, and then you'll be inadvertently stringing her along.
posted by pourtant at 8:56 AM on July 24, 2011 [4 favorites]
I think this can only work if both people really feel the same way. If you sense that she is really into you, then please don't try the friends thing. She might say "sure" in the hopes that something romantic could happen later, and then you'll be inadvertently stringing her along.
posted by pourtant at 8:56 AM on July 24, 2011 [4 favorites]
I would really suggest not doing it on Date #3. If she is into you romantically, setting up a third date and then saying "Hey, I'm not really into you, but let's be friends!" would be massively unkind. (If you weren't sure, that'd be fine. But you are sure. So no.)
Personally I'd prefer that kind of message via email, so I could collect my thoughts before responding. On the phone would be a bit too on the spot, even if I weren't romantically interested.
Good luck! I know my female friends have had this problem too, so it here's hoping it works out for you both!
posted by pie ninja at 8:59 AM on July 24, 2011 [9 favorites]
Personally I'd prefer that kind of message via email, so I could collect my thoughts before responding. On the phone would be a bit too on the spot, even if I weren't romantically interested.
Good luck! I know my female friends have had this problem too, so it here's hoping it works out for you both!
posted by pie ninja at 8:59 AM on July 24, 2011 [9 favorites]
I agree that via email is the best way to convey this message, then by phone, and dead last by going on a third date.
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with this plan in theory. It’s always nice to have more friends; good friends can be more rare than lovers.
However, there will be several snags in the delivery that might trip you up- the biggest is that she probably won’t believe you actually want to be friends. It’s so common a brush-off that you’ll have to work hard to convey that you aren’t just being polite. To that end I think it’s better if you are specific and go on a little bit more, explaining what common interests you have and that you like her personality. “It’s good to have someone to discuss politics with” or “Maybe we can help each other find dates and tell dating horror stories” or “we like the same bands and that’s so rare for me to find” – just something more genuine and detailed like that.
The other thing is that you have to be sort of blunt with your rejection or she might think if she gives it time you’ll change your mind. It's really tempting to show off in front of people you know are attracted to you, to boost your ego, but also really dickish. Restrain yourself from doing that and giving her mixed signals.
You will also have to be the person who invites her out as friends for at least the first time and maybe longer, because she probably won’t initiate. Inviting her to more group-type activities or outings is probably better than one-on-one pseudo-romantic stuff.
posted by Nixy at 9:26 AM on July 24, 2011 [2 favorites]
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with this plan in theory. It’s always nice to have more friends; good friends can be more rare than lovers.
However, there will be several snags in the delivery that might trip you up- the biggest is that she probably won’t believe you actually want to be friends. It’s so common a brush-off that you’ll have to work hard to convey that you aren’t just being polite. To that end I think it’s better if you are specific and go on a little bit more, explaining what common interests you have and that you like her personality. “It’s good to have someone to discuss politics with” or “Maybe we can help each other find dates and tell dating horror stories” or “we like the same bands and that’s so rare for me to find” – just something more genuine and detailed like that.
The other thing is that you have to be sort of blunt with your rejection or she might think if she gives it time you’ll change your mind. It's really tempting to show off in front of people you know are attracted to you, to boost your ego, but also really dickish. Restrain yourself from doing that and giving her mixed signals.
You will also have to be the person who invites her out as friends for at least the first time and maybe longer, because she probably won’t initiate. Inviting her to more group-type activities or outings is probably better than one-on-one pseudo-romantic stuff.
posted by Nixy at 9:26 AM on July 24, 2011 [2 favorites]
If this is in email instead of verbal (which I do think makes sense), the "for whatever reason" reads a little weirder than it sounds, to me, and it kind of implies that you assume she IS drawn to you romantically. You also left out the "wow, you're really cool" you told us, which would make just about any message go down better. So, maybe instead, a version like:
Hi, I've really had fun hanging out with you. You are incredibly cool, and I'm so glad we met. It feels like we're not a romantic match, but I really believe we could be good friends, and I'm psyched about doing underwater basketweaving with you next week if you're up for it. What do you think?
posted by mauvest at 9:35 AM on July 24, 2011 [4 favorites]
Hi, I've really had fun hanging out with you. You are incredibly cool, and I'm so glad we met. It feels like we're not a romantic match, but I really believe we could be good friends, and I'm psyched about doing underwater basketweaving with you next week if you're up for it. What do you think?
posted by mauvest at 9:35 AM on July 24, 2011 [4 favorites]
The message will sound way more sincere if it's accompanied by a request to actually go and do something specific, a la the appendix: "If you feel this way too, and if you're available, I was wondering if you'd like to check out such-and-such event with me next week."
posted by hermitosis at 9:41 AM on July 24, 2011 [4 favorites]
posted by hermitosis at 9:41 AM on July 24, 2011 [4 favorites]
"Not drawn to you romantically" IS cringeworthy to me because it implies she doesn't have magnetism. Put it on the both of you -- "not sure there was romantic chemistry" or something.
posted by GaelFC at 9:55 AM on July 24, 2011 [14 favorites]
posted by GaelFC at 9:55 AM on July 24, 2011 [14 favorites]
Phrase it in terms of "not feeling chemistry" instead of "not romantically drawn to you". They mean the same thing, but one feels less like a personal rejection.
I've done this once, with a guy I met through a personal ad — I realized immediately upon meeting him that I wasn't interested in him romantically or sexually, but he was smart and interesting and we had things in common. We wound up being pretty good friends for a number of years, until he moved farther away, and now stay in touch intermittently online. (And, incidentally, as time goes by my initial feeling has only been confirmed: we make okay friends, but would be a very short-lived failure as a romantic couple.)
posted by Lexica at 10:35 AM on July 24, 2011 [2 favorites]
I've done this once, with a guy I met through a personal ad — I realized immediately upon meeting him that I wasn't interested in him romantically or sexually, but he was smart and interesting and we had things in common. We wound up being pretty good friends for a number of years, until he moved farther away, and now stay in touch intermittently online. (And, incidentally, as time goes by my initial feeling has only been confirmed: we make okay friends, but would be a very short-lived failure as a romantic couple.)
posted by Lexica at 10:35 AM on July 24, 2011 [2 favorites]
I thnk it's fine, but agree to go with no chemistry instead.
However, there is 90% likelihood she'll be very nice, say you two should of course stay friends, and you'll never hear from her again and get a polite brush off if you try to initiate hanging out just as friends.
posted by whoaali at 11:08 AM on July 24, 2011
However, there is 90% likelihood she'll be very nice, say you two should of course stay friends, and you'll never hear from her again and get a polite brush off if you try to initiate hanging out just as friends.
posted by whoaali at 11:08 AM on July 24, 2011
"Not drawn to you romantically" IS cringeworthy to me because it implies she doesn't have magnetism.
I agree. Don't say "not drawn to you." That emphasizes how you're rejecting her, when actually, she might be feeling exactly the same way about you (that's what you hope is the case). Make it more of a commentary on the overall situation: "I have to say, I don't see things working out romantically with us." Other than that, I agree that your wording is pretty good and this would be better done electronically (email or IM) so she has the option of taking time to process this if she needs to, rather than needing to react on the spot.
posted by John Cohen at 11:12 AM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
I agree. Don't say "not drawn to you." That emphasizes how you're rejecting her, when actually, she might be feeling exactly the same way about you (that's what you hope is the case). Make it more of a commentary on the overall situation: "I have to say, I don't see things working out romantically with us." Other than that, I agree that your wording is pretty good and this would be better done electronically (email or IM) so she has the option of taking time to process this if she needs to, rather than needing to react on the spot.
posted by John Cohen at 11:12 AM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
2nd using "not feeling chemistry" -- this happened to me once too. And I totally agreed, I liked him in a friend way but wasn't feeling a spark. And you two are only going to be friends if she ALSO doesn't feel romantic chemistry with you.
"for whatever reason, I'm not romantically drawn to you" would make me think there actually WAS a reason (like... I'm too fat?) but he was trying to be nice by not saying it.
Good luck!
posted by pupstocks at 11:13 AM on July 24, 2011
"for whatever reason, I'm not romantically drawn to you" would make me think there actually WAS a reason (like... I'm too fat?) but he was trying to be nice by not saying it.
Good luck!
posted by pupstocks at 11:13 AM on July 24, 2011
Ehhh....I really, really would discourage you from doing this.
I am placing myself in the woman's shoes and feeling pretty awful being on the receiving end of such a message, even if I wasn't too keen on the guy. Saying you just want to be her friend is like saying "I don't find you physically attractive" which is a pretty brushing blow. Nobody wants to be friend-zoned, especially after starting things out on a romantic foot.
Of course maybe she's totally different from me and would brush it off, but I think my reaction is plausible enough that it's not worth hurting her.
I'd just tell her you're not feeling the chemistry and let her go.
posted by timsneezed at 1:00 PM on July 24, 2011
I am placing myself in the woman's shoes and feeling pretty awful being on the receiving end of such a message, even if I wasn't too keen on the guy. Saying you just want to be her friend is like saying "I don't find you physically attractive" which is a pretty brushing blow. Nobody wants to be friend-zoned, especially after starting things out on a romantic foot.
Of course maybe she's totally different from me and would brush it off, but I think my reaction is plausible enough that it's not worth hurting her.
I'd just tell her you're not feeling the chemistry and let her go.
posted by timsneezed at 1:00 PM on July 24, 2011
*crushing
posted by timsneezed at 1:00 PM on July 24, 2011
posted by timsneezed at 1:00 PM on July 24, 2011
What timsneezed said. I had a guy who, after only one date, told me he didn't feel any chemistry. But he kept on talking to me for several days... I asked him what was up, was he changing his mind, and he was like "well most women want to remain friends." It was all about him... we went on ONE date and he thought I would still just want to be hanging out with him and stuff.
posted by IndigoRain at 1:10 PM on July 24, 2011
posted by IndigoRain at 1:10 PM on July 24, 2011
Nthing email, "don't see us working out romantically," and making a specific suggestion.
On that last point, the part that didn't quite work for me in your message were the words "really" and "good" here: "I really think we could be good friends if you're up for it." It seems either disingenuous or like rushing into something. I'd think "well I don't know you that well yet, I don't know if I want to, and how do you know?" So something like "move towards a friendship" or a specific suggestion (like being buddies for a basket weaving class) would be better.
posted by salvia at 1:29 PM on July 24, 2011 [2 favorites]
On that last point, the part that didn't quite work for me in your message were the words "really" and "good" here: "I really think we could be good friends if you're up for it." It seems either disingenuous or like rushing into something. I'd think "well I don't know you that well yet, I don't know if I want to, and how do you know?" So something like "move towards a friendship" or a specific suggestion (like being buddies for a basket weaving class) would be better.
posted by salvia at 1:29 PM on July 24, 2011 [2 favorites]
having done a sh*tload of internet dating, its perfectly within the norm to do this in an email. you're saving her some embarassment if she feels differently. rejection is rejection and its always got at least a little bit to do with a lack of physical attraction, and she may have experienced this before (one or many times). let her go with dignity, do it over email and say you enjoyed your two times out together and are interested in pursuing a friendship, rather than romantic relationship and leave it at that. if you want to be super nice let her know you're interested in chatting some time or doing x shared activity and let her be the one to initiate any further contact.
posted by dmbfan93 at 1:54 PM on July 24, 2011
posted by dmbfan93 at 1:54 PM on July 24, 2011
Saying "We don't seem to be working out romantically" as suggested upthread seems like a good idea, maybe followed by something like "I don't know about you, but I really loved us doing specific thing/talking about specific thing, and I really enjoyed hanging out with you. So... if you too would like to, what about meeting for coffee specific date and time/doing specific thing on specific date time".
Like some people said upstream, I think it would be a good idea to say what specifically makes you want to befriend her after two meetings (with no chemistry materialising, romantically speaking). This would also a. suggest, or remind her that you got a good vibe from her in terms of getting along, b. make it clear that you are serious about befriending her, c. the "I don't know about you" makes you vulnerable too in regard to her, so, if she was hurt by the lack of romantic chemistry, your opening yourself to rejection might appease her, and, finally, d. actually give her the option to turn you down. If she choses to do that, you will feel slightly worse, but she will feel quite a bit better. If she takes you up on it ... well, then I hope you both win a friend.
posted by miorita at 2:02 PM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
Like some people said upstream, I think it would be a good idea to say what specifically makes you want to befriend her after two meetings (with no chemistry materialising, romantically speaking). This would also a. suggest, or remind her that you got a good vibe from her in terms of getting along, b. make it clear that you are serious about befriending her, c. the "I don't know about you" makes you vulnerable too in regard to her, so, if she was hurt by the lack of romantic chemistry, your opening yourself to rejection might appease her, and, finally, d. actually give her the option to turn you down. If she choses to do that, you will feel slightly worse, but she will feel quite a bit better. If she takes you up on it ... well, then I hope you both win a friend.
posted by miorita at 2:02 PM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
Can I just add that someone who's really fun & interesting, who is a potential really good friend, is the sort of person who makes a great life partner. Sexual attraction can grow; compatibility? I'm not sure.
posted by theora55 at 4:16 PM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by theora55 at 4:16 PM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
How about getting together one more time and asking her how she feels?!
She might be thinking the exact same thing you are, especially if there hasn't been any physical flirting (hugs, puppy dog eyes, etc.)
I didn't meet one of my best male friends via online dating, but I did have a crush on him at one point. He was pretty straightforward that he didn't like me like that. 5 years later, still besties. I'm married now, and his girlfriend just moved in with him.
It can work!
posted by jbenben at 5:07 PM on July 24, 2011
She might be thinking the exact same thing you are, especially if there hasn't been any physical flirting (hugs, puppy dog eyes, etc.)
I didn't meet one of my best male friends via online dating, but I did have a crush on him at one point. He was pretty straightforward that he didn't like me like that. 5 years later, still besties. I'm married now, and his girlfriend just moved in with him.
It can work!
posted by jbenben at 5:07 PM on July 24, 2011
Saying you just want to be her friend is like saying "I don't find you physically attractive" which is a pretty brushing blow.
Only if she considers her physical attractiveness to be her defining quality. And while there are many people for whom this is true, I hardly think that they are a class whom should be protected from either honesty or friendship.
posted by hermitosis at 7:01 PM on July 24, 2011
Only if she considers her physical attractiveness to be her defining quality. And while there are many people for whom this is true, I hardly think that they are a class whom should be protected from either honesty or friendship.
posted by hermitosis at 7:01 PM on July 24, 2011
Keep in mind that no matter how nicely you say it, this woman is under NO obligation to be your friend. You are renegotiating the boundaries of your interaction/relationship and she has to consent to that before moving ahead. She might have absolutely no interest in friendship with you and no phrasing is going to change that.
That said, "I don't I see this working out romantically" is much better than what you stated as it shifts the blame from her ("I am not romantically drawn to you") to be a blameless statement. Also throw in an invite to a follow up event/activity and then leave her alone; let her come back and confirm if she wants to do that.
posted by buteo at 7:45 PM on July 24, 2011
That said, "I don't I see this working out romantically" is much better than what you stated as it shifts the blame from her ("I am not romantically drawn to you") to be a blameless statement. Also throw in an invite to a follow up event/activity and then leave her alone; let her come back and confirm if she wants to do that.
posted by buteo at 7:45 PM on July 24, 2011
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by smorange at 8:42 AM on July 24, 2011 [1 favorite]