I'm convinced the Viennese re-po men are coming to get me
March 22, 2011 9:40 AM Subscribe
So I think I'm getting ripped off. Or, at the very least, the victim of an international company's careless mistake.
I purchased $192 worth of camera film (Polaroid) over a year ago in October 2009 from an Austrian photography company. Apparently, I was never charged for it and a representative claiming to be from the company emailed me last month (around mid Feb.) informing me of this open payment and that I need to pay this amount. I have no recollection of this order, seeing as I'm a fairly routine customer and this was placed over a year ago. I ignored the first email back in February and they've now sent me another email requesting the $192 payment or threatening to take this to a debt collection agency. I don't think I even have $192 to my name - what should I do??
There is a lot of information missing here. Don't you have a record of what has gone out from your bank account? Check your statements and if there is no record of a $192 payment, you owe them the money. Presumably you received the goods?
posted by altolinguistic at 9:45 AM on March 22, 2011
posted by altolinguistic at 9:45 AM on March 22, 2011
This is a pretty easy one.
• Did you actually receive the film? If so, then the question is simply whether you paid for it in Oct 2009. They need to send you documentation showing how and when you were invoiced, how and when the material was shipped, and then you need to go back to your credit card company or bank and look for a corresponding charge to determine whether you've already paid for this once.
• If you haven't already paid for a product you did receive and which is in your possession, then whether you have $192 to your name is moot, and you owe it to them.
Possession of the film aside, did you actually order it or not? I can't really tell from your post... you both declare "I purchased $192 worth of camera film" but then state "I have no recollection of this order".
I'm not sure what an international creditor can do to your credit history; someone who knows more about that can likely fill in.
But it really shouldn't be that tricky to ascertain whether they are correctly or incorrectly trying to collect on you.
posted by pineapple at 9:46 AM on March 22, 2011 [1 favorite]
• Did you actually receive the film? If so, then the question is simply whether you paid for it in Oct 2009. They need to send you documentation showing how and when you were invoiced, how and when the material was shipped, and then you need to go back to your credit card company or bank and look for a corresponding charge to determine whether you've already paid for this once.
• If you haven't already paid for a product you did receive and which is in your possession, then whether you have $192 to your name is moot, and you owe it to them.
Possession of the film aside, did you actually order it or not? I can't really tell from your post... you both declare "I purchased $192 worth of camera film" but then state "I have no recollection of this order".
I'm not sure what an international creditor can do to your credit history; someone who knows more about that can likely fill in.
But it really shouldn't be that tricky to ascertain whether they are correctly or incorrectly trying to collect on you.
posted by pineapple at 9:46 AM on March 22, 2011 [1 favorite]
What, exactly, makes you think you're being ripped off?
posted by altolinguistic at 9:48 AM on March 22, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by altolinguistic at 9:48 AM on March 22, 2011 [2 favorites]
I'm confused as to where you got ripped off. If the company got paid a year ago and they are trying to claim payment now, that is being ripped off. But you didn't pay the company. But how can you be sure if you don't remember the order?
Just boiling down to your last sentence, if you do owe them money and you do not have the $192 at this time, I would contact the company and ask to work out a payment plan.
And companies make mistakes. Shit happens. Victim is too strong a word to be used in this situation.
posted by spec80 at 9:51 AM on March 22, 2011
Just boiling down to your last sentence, if you do owe them money and you do not have the $192 at this time, I would contact the company and ask to work out a payment plan.
And companies make mistakes. Shit happens. Victim is too strong a word to be used in this situation.
posted by spec80 at 9:51 AM on March 22, 2011
Response by poster: I guess I'm just sketched out because I'm not sure why they would send me this package without charging my card until a year and a half later. Also, I'm a bit wary of the fact that this was an email I received with no further documentation attached. I'll write them back requesting the additional invoice. As for whether or not I received the product, I can't remember simply because I ordered so much of the same film that year that it's difficult for me to tell which pack was from what order.
posted by atoastedheart at 9:54 AM on March 22, 2011
posted by atoastedheart at 9:54 AM on March 22, 2011
I admit that a company waiting 1.5 years to send you a first invoice hints at a scam, but only if it's the first invoice.
However, even if it really is the first invoice, if you received the product (i.e., weren't scammed), you're on the hook, morally and legally, regardless of laziness on anyone else's part.
Please figure out whether you actually received the product, then get back to us.
posted by astrochimp at 9:58 AM on March 22, 2011
However, even if it really is the first invoice, if you received the product (i.e., weren't scammed), you're on the hook, morally and legally, regardless of laziness on anyone else's part.
Please figure out whether you actually received the product, then get back to us.
posted by astrochimp at 9:58 AM on March 22, 2011
I don't know what you expect us to suggest. If you're a regular customer, as you suggest, you will have previous orders from this company. Were they all the same amount? Is there some reason why you can't check your bank/credit card statements to see what payments you've made, and whether they tally with your order record?
posted by altolinguistic at 10:00 AM on March 22, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by altolinguistic at 10:00 AM on March 22, 2011 [1 favorite]
Okay, that's a clearer question.
I'm not sure why they would send me this package without charging my card until a year and a half later.
*shrug* It happens sometimes. Especially if it's a small office. A friend of mine was caught up in a small town's traffic violations bureau -- he got a speeding ticket in this small town upstate, and was a couple days' late mailing in the fine -- two years ago. The town was so small that the guy who processed that sort of paperwork was only in twice a month, and the paperwork for the traffic violations just piled way up -- and then a month ago the guy finally just buckled down and got through it all, and even though they'd already received my friend's fine by then, the guy processed the paperwork to pull his license anyway, and he got his license revoked until he could pay the late fee. He said that the town hall in question had a line out the door from a ton of othre people who'd been inconvenienced in this way.
The point is -- maybe the guy who processed these invoices was out sick for a year or something. It happens.
I'm a bit wary of the fact that this was an email I received with no further documentation attached. I'll write them back requesting the additional invoice. As for whether or not I received the product, I can't remember simply because I ordered so much of the same film that year that it's difficult for me to tell which pack was from what order.
That sounds like a plan -- asking for some kind of documentation proving that a) you ordered it, because you don't recall ordering specifically from them, and b) that they shipped it to you. They must have some kind of paperwork backing it up. If it does look like you did order from them, and didn't pay yet, then ask about a payment plan.
In short -- I don't see anything "illegal" going on, more "disorganized bookkeeper."
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:05 AM on March 22, 2011
I'm not sure why they would send me this package without charging my card until a year and a half later.
*shrug* It happens sometimes. Especially if it's a small office. A friend of mine was caught up in a small town's traffic violations bureau -- he got a speeding ticket in this small town upstate, and was a couple days' late mailing in the fine -- two years ago. The town was so small that the guy who processed that sort of paperwork was only in twice a month, and the paperwork for the traffic violations just piled way up -- and then a month ago the guy finally just buckled down and got through it all, and even though they'd already received my friend's fine by then, the guy processed the paperwork to pull his license anyway, and he got his license revoked until he could pay the late fee. He said that the town hall in question had a line out the door from a ton of othre people who'd been inconvenienced in this way.
The point is -- maybe the guy who processed these invoices was out sick for a year or something. It happens.
I'm a bit wary of the fact that this was an email I received with no further documentation attached. I'll write them back requesting the additional invoice. As for whether or not I received the product, I can't remember simply because I ordered so much of the same film that year that it's difficult for me to tell which pack was from what order.
That sounds like a plan -- asking for some kind of documentation proving that a) you ordered it, because you don't recall ordering specifically from them, and b) that they shipped it to you. They must have some kind of paperwork backing it up. If it does look like you did order from them, and didn't pay yet, then ask about a payment plan.
In short -- I don't see anything "illegal" going on, more "disorganized bookkeeper."
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:05 AM on March 22, 2011
If you are worried this is a phishing scam, contact the company directly - don't reply to the e-mail you received. Do you have an account rep you can speak to since you are a regular customer?
posted by spec80 at 10:06 AM on March 22, 2011 [4 favorites]
posted by spec80 at 10:06 AM on March 22, 2011 [4 favorites]
Try to figure out whether you received the order. If you can't, talk to someone at the company and tell them that you order from them regularly and you can't verify that you actually received that shipment. If you're a regular customer you may be able to talk your way out of it, or negotiate a reduced bill or a payment plan. Most businesses don't want to drive away a regular customer over a billing mistake.
It's possible they had trouble with their bookkeeper and are sending out a huge backlog of bills trying to recoup some of the money they're owed.
posted by electroboy at 10:09 AM on March 22, 2011
It's possible they had trouble with their bookkeeper and are sending out a huge backlog of bills trying to recoup some of the money they're owed.
posted by electroboy at 10:09 AM on March 22, 2011
If you are worried this is a phishing scam, contact the company directly - don't reply to the e-mail you received.
That right there is what I was going to suggest. Forward the email to the company's contact information (via printed certified mail) or email and as for proof that the product was ordered by me and sent to me, and that you were also sent a bill. then you can take fairly logical steps from there.
posted by zombieApoc at 10:10 AM on March 22, 2011
Just chiming in that it does happen -- I got an invoice from a company who shipped a product to me a few months ago. The invoice stated that my purchases failed to go through on my credit card, which seemed odd, but in checking my bank statements I was never charged. I did in fact receive the product so I made payment and carried on.
Sure it seems odd that a company would ship something without you paying for it first but... things happen.
posted by countrymod at 10:22 AM on March 22, 2011
Sure it seems odd that a company would ship something without you paying for it first but... things happen.
posted by countrymod at 10:22 AM on March 22, 2011
Response by poster: UPDATE: thanks for the advice guys. i don't seriously consider myself a victim here, i was just exaggerating so more people could read this post and give me some advice. i've called both their US office as well as their Vienna office, but to no avail. i've also emailed their main customer service contact that is listed on their website. i talked to my credit card company and they don't seem to see any charge for $192 from october to december 2009 (the CC company was bought out in the past year, hence no history of purchases prior to august 2010 are listed in my online account). i also checked my account via the company's website and am able to view the original invoice and payment. this might be a stupid question, but my credit information is listed on the original invoice and the card has neither expired nor is it maxed out - so why didn't/don't they just charge the card on file for this purchase? anyway, hopefully they'll respond to my email soon and i can just close this case once and for all - a year and a half later.
posted by atoastedheart at 10:46 AM on March 22, 2011
posted by atoastedheart at 10:46 AM on March 22, 2011
why didn't/don't they just charge the card on file for this purchase
Most likely so they don't get a bunch of chargebacks from people disputing payments silently appearing on their credit cards for long-forgotten unpaid invoices. If they notify you ahead of time, as they did, you'll at least know where the charge came from and why; if they just silently billed you you'd be likely to dispute the charge with the credit card company which would cause them all sorts of hassles.
Aside from that, many companies don't keep credit card numbers on file, especially for long periods of time, because they're a security risk. Depending on how they handle transactions it's possible they've never seen your credit card number, it may go directly to the CC processor instead.
In any case, they have a record of the invoice and shipment, which you've seen on their site. You have credit card records that show you never paid for the shipment. It's pretty clear you owe them $192; I don't know what you expect to hear from their customer service department that would change that.
i was just exaggerating so more people could read this post and give me some advice
Don't do that.
posted by ook at 11:19 AM on March 22, 2011 [4 favorites]
Most likely so they don't get a bunch of chargebacks from people disputing payments silently appearing on their credit cards for long-forgotten unpaid invoices. If they notify you ahead of time, as they did, you'll at least know where the charge came from and why; if they just silently billed you you'd be likely to dispute the charge with the credit card company which would cause them all sorts of hassles.
Aside from that, many companies don't keep credit card numbers on file, especially for long periods of time, because they're a security risk. Depending on how they handle transactions it's possible they've never seen your credit card number, it may go directly to the CC processor instead.
In any case, they have a record of the invoice and shipment, which you've seen on their site. You have credit card records that show you never paid for the shipment. It's pretty clear you owe them $192; I don't know what you expect to hear from their customer service department that would change that.
i was just exaggerating so more people could read this post and give me some advice
Don't do that.
posted by ook at 11:19 AM on March 22, 2011 [4 favorites]
i don't seriously consider myself a victim here, i was just exaggerating so more people could read this post and give me some advice.
OP: do not do this again. Others: please take it to MeTa and not here.
posted by jessamyn at 1:09 PM on March 22, 2011 [3 favorites]
OP: do not do this again. Others: please take it to MeTa and not here.
posted by jessamyn at 1:09 PM on March 22, 2011 [3 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
If you did buy the film, but were not charged, you need to pay for it. If you did not order the film, you don't need to pay for it. That's fairly simple, and I'm not sure why that part's a question.
Assuming you did buy the film, but weren't charged for it, and don't have the money for it, contact them and ask for some kind of a payment plan. But if you didn't receive film from them, try just telling them that -- asking them to prove that you received it, with a shipping order or something.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:45 AM on March 22, 2011 [5 favorites]